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Apple Buys Emagic
sapporo writes "Apple has apparently bought Emagic, developers of Audio Logic, music production software used by 200,000 people worldwide. Emagic will operate as a wholly
owned division of Apple, and the Windows versions of their software will be discontinued on September 30, 2002. Whoa!"
This is not only good news, but great news. Pardon me for feeling gleeful that Windows users will now feel the way some of us Mac users have felt in the past. It's about time that the Windows world lost a piece of software which is important to them. Although there are still options for them such as Digidesign'sProTools and Motu's Digital Performer, at least I can bask in the schadenfreude I have knowing they've lost a fantastic application like Logic Audio.
On to something more serious now, will this acquisition be good for Apple ? Certainly they've got the majority of Logic users, but can they improve upon this product to the degree that it will cause the Windows users to switch? I'm not sure whether they can. Getting someone to switch platforms when there are other solutions available is obviously not easy. But some of these audio applications take a lot of experience to master, and it may be cheaper in the long run for someone to buy a PowerMac instead of having to learn one of the other available applications for PC.
I do hope that everyone benefits from this, and that the small audio guy who only has a PC isn't left completely out in the cold, I do realize not everyone can afford a Mac. Hopefully the existing user base will not be immediately left out in the cold when they drop PC support. There should be some modicum of respect for the users who helped make Emagic as popular as it is today.
While I don't exactly approve of this "buy software and then kill the Windows branch" stragety, it's interesting to see it happening. As a shareholder, I'm curious to see if all these purchases are truly being made to improve Apple software, or just to limit Windows users access to such software.
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Apple hardware still too expensive for you? How about a raffle ticket?
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Let "them" know you're not a terrorist!
Come to the University of Mars! Classes starting soon!
Digital Performer overview can be found here.
As a Mac user I love this kind of news. I do hope, however, that any ensuing product from Apple using Logic software isn't just "pro" stuff. In other words, I want an audio "iMovie" not just an audio "Final Cut Pro."
A free-with-purchase-of-a-Mac audio application... what would it look like? 8 channel recording, mixing, auido cd burning right from the app...what else? And what about microphone/midi input? I just bought Deck LE 3.0 (waiting for the 3.5 update for OS X!)... perhaps it would be a bit like that?
You like your Macintosh better than me, don't you Dave? Dave? Can you hear me Dave?
1.Good strategy for Apple to ensure that it can't be killed no matter what.
2.A bit of Job's vengeance for Billg screwing him over all those years?
3.A bad idea to discontinue the Windows versions as this will surely encourage Billg to retaliate (no OfficeX updates?)
4.A good idea to get the market to sit up and notice those fancy Apple samba footwork moves?
5.An omen of more to come?
Well now that apple does control the home/semi-pro video market (they still need to kill premiere), they're going after a second "niche" market : audio.
.....
They already have iTunes/iPod, they Get Emagic, now who's NeXT ? Steinberg ?
When apple will hold the Audio market, they'll just need to push a little more their switch capaing.
The funiest about this this is that 10/15 years ago apple had to sign some contract with Apple records (no URL to give) the record compagny that did the beattles, in order to keep their name : to keep their name they had to limit the Sound capabilities of all apple Hardware
none Yet.
off the windows version is fine with me, but when it is 35% (inferred from statement that macintosh is 65%) of revenues sounds rather stupid.
not to be a troll, but it is stupid business decisions like this that hampers the growth of apple. steve jobs is good for some things, but i don't think long range planning is one of them (he is great for revitalizing the 'look and feel' of things though).
i wonder if stuff like this is filed into the memory of bill gates when he negotiates with apple? it could be on a list of reasons to discontinue ms office, or IE (no great loss that one).
As a registered user of Logic Audio Platinum for Windows, I'm very dissapointed with this. I've spent hundreds of dollars over the years buying and upgrading this software, only to have it discontinued right out from under me.
I'm kind of in shock right now - this just sucks! Good move for Apple, though - Emagic makes great software and is a well-run company.
"Moderate drinking can help prevent amputated limbs" -- Abigail Zuger, NYTimes, 12/31/02
Apple has purchased 2 companies with compositing software and now a company with audio software.
Where are they getting all this money???
And from what I understand, in all cases they are looking at discontinuing Windows support and posibly Linux as well.
I am all for Apple having strong authoring tools, but to buy out software that people rely on to do work and then drop support for their platform is pretty shadey. It is forcing us to move to a Mac or to find some other software, and in some cases, all the other software is a few generations behind.
I may not mind getting a Mac, but please don't force me into it.
-Tim
-I just work here... how am I supposed to know?
http://biz.yahoo.com/p/a/aapl.html
cash: $12.17/share
shares outstanding: 355.7 million
total cash on hand: $4,328,869,000
As of their most recent earnings statement (http://www.apple.com/pr/library/2002/apr/17earnin gs.html), Apple says they have $4.3 billion in cash on hand. I don't think where the money comes from is a problem for them right now...
Only the Germans would have such a great word.
Word of the Day for Wednesday May 10, 2000:
schadenfreude \SHAHD-n-froy-duh\, noun:
A malicious satisfaction in the misfortunes of others.
The historian Peter Gay -- who felt Schadenfreude as a Jewish child in Nazi-era Berlin, watching the Germans lose coveted gold medals in the 1936 Olympics -- has said that it "can be one of the great joys of life."
--Edward Rothstein, "Missing the Fun of a Minor Sin." New York Times, February 5, 2000
Often the people Pi met in Mendocino wanted to hear these terrible stories, the personal disasters, or they quoted them back to her from what they'd read, with a certain glitter in their eyes -- giving Pi the chance to wonder again as she once had in a Wittgenstein seminar why there wasn't a word in English for Schadenfreude, that very human pleasure taken in other people's misery.
--Sylvia Brownrigg, The Metaphysical Touch
If self-replicating e-commerce baby tycoons get on your nerves, it's schadenfreude time. It's true that the Nasdaq rebounded after its staggering loss Tuesday. Nonetheless, what AP described as "the most volatile day ever for U.S. stocks" left a distinctly bearish aftertaste.
--"Market Motion Sickness." The Industry Standard's Media Grok, April 5, 2000
I hope this will be an eye-opener for many users of commercial software. This is what may happen to any such software. The only guarantee is to do like the electronics industry does, and prefer stuff that has more than one provider. In software the only way to do this is to go with Open Source. That always leaves open the possibility of hiring someone to continue to support the stuff, no matter what companies get sold, close down, or change strategy.
In Murphy We Turst
If you are worried about portability, keep an eye on GNUStep which used to be very compatible with NEXTStep and aims to remerge with Aqua/OS X Cocoa. In 5-8 years Mac OS X applications are likely to be cross platform whether they like it or not.
xserve
I want 2D games back.
Maybe you should have bought a Mac from the start?
Lars T.
To the guy who modded me down from perfect to terrible Karma - Apple haters still suck
As has been pointed out here, buying up software companies and killing their Windoze versions is a good way to annoy users, unless there is a process by which they can be encouraged to make the transition to Macs as painlessly as possible.
The whole SWITCH campaign may be part of this, but I'd hope they're going to do much more. With these companies come their lists of registered users. I would not be surprised if Apple didn't offer favourable deals on hardware purchase to help users of these packages move from Windows to Mac. This is one way to reduce the bad PR that comes from such, frankly, Microsoft-like actions, and it could even be turned into good PR given the right spin.
But are they going to do this?
This is big news, for two reasons:
1. Logic Audio is quickly becoming one of the most used pro audio sequencers. I'm not sure where it stands next to Cubase and Protools (the other two big names), but it has gained a lot of market share lately.
2. We've been waiting for the OS X version of Logic for over a year now. This damn well better mean that it come out really soon, otherwise Apple owns a company that only creates MacOS 9 software!
And I don't believe they ever had a version of it for Windows.
First, Apple is, and always has been a large successful company with a very large warchest. The years when they were loosing money weren't nearly as bad as they were made out to be by the press- cause the press are idiots who think any company that looses 700Million one year is going under, but a company with $7billion in liquid assets can handlea couple down years.
And buy lots of these really tiny companies.
Secondly, of course they are discontinuing Windows support and Linux support. There is no reason to continue unprofitable and secondary platform support.
If you want to work with digital media, the Mac is where its at and it has been since Apple invented the market by releasing Quicktime in 1991.
There's nothing shady about what they are doing. If you don't like the Logic product, switch to a competitor. Soemehow, though, I doubt you've ever used logic and are just complaining.
As to force, this is a silly thing to complain about- you aren't forced to do anything. ITs not force when you freely choose to use the better project.
OH, Apple! You made the Mac SO GOOD I was *FORCED* into buying one! How dare you!
Come on, its obvious you're looking for an excuse to dislike Apple. People have been grasping at these straws since 1984. Its unfortunate that our society hates intellectualism so much that it bashes companies that put out great products and praises companies that use anti-competitive measures to succeed. Microsoft is a half assed operation all around, while Apple is first class...
I think there's a connection between this and the pro-football anti-education attitude of our school system.
Yeah, and you guys panned the ipod too: http://apple.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=01/10/23
I'm not flaming you for repeating this statistic-- its been repeated so much that when Apple says "if we get another %5 we double our market share!" its a joke! (Yet many people don't realize it.)
I don't think Apple has ever had only %5 of the market. And I'm certain the way this is calcuated- counting new machines sold from only *some* sources- is wrong. For instance, the way the %5 market share figure is calculated, ALL apple sales made thru the Apple store and thru local Apple dealers are ignored. Ising' that a huge chunk of apples sales?
Furthermroe, "Marketshare" is the number of machines that are in use-- that people can sell software into." That is not the same as the "number of machines sold". And its certainly not the same for "consumer" or "business" machines.
If you're making a video editing program, say, you don't assume that every business machine sold is a potential candidate-- cause a large percentage of those machines are servers, not client machines.
At one point Apple had %25 of the market. This was 1997 or so. And this was based on a scientific evaluation of the maket.
I think Apple's market share has slipped and is only %15 of the market now.
There are a lot of factos that people forget-- most PCs are discarded within 2 years, while a Mac's useful life is about 4 years. A large number of PCs end up essentially DOA because they die within the first year and are replaced, etc. And on top of that, most Apple sales are not counted by the Microsoft paid "Analysts" who say they have %5 of the market.
That %5 figure is due to the fact that hey can't say "zero %" and microsoft wants them to be enough to be competition but not enough to look like a threat.
Its essentially, a completely fabricated figure.
Yeah, and you guys panned the ipod too: http://apple.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=01/10/23
This is on topic because we're talking about software CHOICE- and whether Apple's pruchase of Emagic reduces it or not.
The FSF is right out of orwell-- they're NON-FREE software is "free" and those who use other software are "slaves".
First off, "free" software will never be the best. The draconian terms of the GPL mean that most professional developers will support BSD or free licenses, ratehr than the GPL. This means the GNU software gets less mindshare.
Secondly, you are not enslaved by non-gnu software. In fact, you are more free, as you can ship a product and actually sell it along with supporting the (truely) free software.
The communists in Russia claimed they were going to make everyone free, while they were actually acting to enslave everyone. FSF advocates this same party line-- you don't have the right to the output of your labor (if its software) it belongs to anyone who "needs" it.
Open Source (not "free") is a good idea-- and it will succeed where it does give people extra choices and provide good quality. Linux is a good example of this, and OpenBSD and its projects are another good example.
But you will never get innovation out of open source and certainly not out of free software. This is because innovation is really expensive, and there is no profitable business model yet for making back those costs with open or free software.
This is why proprietary software will continue to rule when it comes to innovative categories-- but commodity software, such as operating systems, will become open source.... because when its a commodity, the improvements you get are more valuable than the lost income. When its innovative, there are less people who can improve it and the expense is too high-- you have to recoup it.
Media software is the most innovative group right now-- therefore, Apple buying these media companies is giving it a lock on innovation. In 10 years, this will all be commodity software and the best software will be open sourced-- but only because the createor chose to give it away.
Certainly not because FSF crated it-- I waited a decade for GNU, and their failure to deliver the OS was for exactly these reasons... and that's why its called Linux.
There's a connection there.
Yeah, and you guys panned the ipod too: http://apple.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=01/10/23
I honestly don't think that the post was meant to demean anyone in that way, but face it, a high end mac can cost you over 3k, when you can put together a really good PC for under 1k.
Yeah, execpt that a low end mac that you can buy for $1K is superior to that "really good PC" you buought for the same price in every way-
faster, better software, better quality hardware.
People who compalain about being too poor to buy a mac are usually that way because they WASTED their money on a PC that cost too mcuh and delivered too little.
If you can't afford to upgrade *your* mac, don't be fooled by those cheap PCs. Hell, you could get an XBOX PC for only $200, with a killer pentium processor and a killer graphics card.
If you think they are the same as a mac, you're mistaken.
I bought a PowerMac 9600 from Boeing surplus for $75, managed to get OS X running on it, and now it works as a fileserver on my home network.
I don't know of any PCs from that era that could do the same thing using Windows software. Maybe Linux, sure, but not twith the quality of the aqua UI.
If you really are po and want to work at the low end, buy that elcheapo PC, but then you can't afford Logic anyway, right? Sheesh.
Any fair comparison finds that Macs are cheaper than PCs. The fact that you can get an XBOX for $200 does not make PCs cheaper. (And marginally better things for $400, etc.)
Yeah, and you guys panned the ipod too: http://apple.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=01/10/23
Yeah, you should switch to a MAc. you get better hardware, at cheaper prices than a comperable PC.
You shouldn't whine that now you have the opportunity to upgrade to a superior platform. And you don't have to do it right away, keep using your current software and upgrade when you're ready to upgrade your machine.
BTW- your statements about slow RAM et. al. express ignorance about how PCs work. The performance is based on many factors. For instance, if you have two ram busses at 2/3 the speed of a machine with only one ram buss, you'll have a faster machine because ram bandwidth is cummulative.
Macs are faster than PCs in the same price category... and it takes a lot of misrepresentation to sustain the illusion that this isn't true-- but then, there are a lot of PC people who don't want to feel like idiots for wasting their money and therefore suspend disbelief.
Yeah, and you guys panned the ipod too: http://apple.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=01/10/23
> PC version consumed 70% of their development and support costs
That seems unlikely
No, I would expect that to be the case. Usually it is that way when you release a product on both platforms. I know this, I've done it.
Your costs on the PC side are much higher-- both in initial development, and in support. This is due to the poor quality of the development environment for Windows and the poor quality of the machines people buy- bad power supplies cause memory corruption, causes your program to crash and the computer illiterate mother isn't going to think that maybe she shouldn't have bought a computer from some fly by night company for $400-- she's going to wonder why your software doens't work.
Developing software for Windows is also more expensive because in order to get a unit of sales you have to spend more money to reach the customers-- there's a lot more competition. Whereas on the Mac side, getting the same unit of sales is a lot cheaper because theirs less competition for it.
The reason companies support windows at all (given this situation) is that marketing guys are idiots and not businessmen-- they never take into account the costs of development and costs of sales, they decide based on the size of the market. And non-marketing CEOs believe them.
There's a great opportunity for Mac software developers... but so few have taken it, that apple has started doing it itself.
Yeah, and you guys panned the ipod too: http://apple.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=01/10/23
They don't charge, strictly speaking, for this stuff. Only the people who have older machines that want it have to pay for it. If you have a new machine, it comes pre-loaded. This is a lack of revenue. The pay $$ for something, and then get very little return.
That's funny. Final Cut is $1000. So is Cinema tools. Shake and Rayz sell for tens of thousands of dollars right now, I doubt they will be coming "pre loaded" on machines.
Sure, Apple took final cut and made an iMovie version, and that is free, but that just causes lots of final cut sales. final cut has been a HUGE success-- pretty much taking over the low to mid- range video and film editing industry.
But then, I don't think you really know what you're talking about so you wouldn't have known that.
Not a good idea for Jobs to piss off Gates over something insignificant, to lose something of value. Gates has shown he is willing to lose $$ in the short term, on hopes of banking in the long term
Yeah, you really don't know what your'e talking about. Office is on the MAc because its extreemely profitable for Microsoft. I know this for a fact. If MS wanted to withhold it, they would be in trouble because Apple has a contractual obligation from them for it-- (and I'm not talking about the agreement that expired.) MS can't withdraw OFfice for the MAc, and they won't because even MS likes the couple billion in revenue it generates each year.
ANd hardware is not the market to make money, otherwise it would be Intel telling Microsoft what to do, not vice versa
I don't know of any evidence that Microsoft tells intel what to do. Intel tunes its microcode to support windows because it knows windows is a large customer. But Intel is not beholden to Microsoft.
Since "hardware isn't the place to make money" do you think Sony is stupid and should go into the software business?
Do you think Apple doesn't make money from software?
Interesting.
Yeah, and you guys panned the ipod too: http://apple.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=01/10/23
See, since ugly old trolls like you never buy Macs or come to the AUG meetings, only the good looking boys in pink show up!
It sure makes for some fun meetings, but then, you wouldn't enjoy it so, we're glad you stay away!
Yeah, and you guys panned the ipod too: http://apple.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=01/10/23
Why? Apple is not forcing anyone to use Logic. And I seriously doubt they will bundle it as an "iApp." Steinberg just started taking preorders for Cubase SX for OS X.
I'm a musician of about 35 years, and a Mac user since 1994, and I use Cubase.
Apple wants to be like SGI back when you had to buy one to run SoftImage and Flame...
-- if it was so, it might be; and if it were so, it would be; but as it isn't, it ain't. That's logic - Lewis Carrol
There's currently a discussion on this very topic on MacSlash, but a few /. people may be interested in some Apple ramblings too:
.bomb bubble burst.
Strategy: Buy Low, Sell High.
How low can the stock values of companies go? Since last fall, many in the tech sector have certainly been trying to find out. This is a great time to buy companies or technologies and lately Apple has been wisely acting when opportunities arise. Even if Emagic GmbH, Spruce Technologies, Nothing Real, and Zayante in the last year had all been privately held, they would have still been sold at a favourable price compared to buying them before the
Strategy: Niche Market Growth.
It's clear that Apple wants to defend the Macintosh strength as a music & audio creation tool in the long term. Since pro audio software has been lagging on the march to MacOS X, Apple is at least applying heat to developers if not exactly lighting a fire under them. Logic and associated software & hardware on the Mac will mean that Digidesign, Twelve Tone Systems(Cakewalk), MOTU and Steinberg will have to take the market segment more seriously (although MOTU & Digidesign have historically been great friends of the Mac already). The way it's looking is that a larger majority of pro audio will be done on the Mac. Can Steinberg, Twelve Tone et al. risk being caught with their pants around their ankles if this happens?
Strategy: Technology Cross-Pollination.
Now that Apple has a substantial video-production, streaming, compression, audio & other technologies, they may consider adding many good features from one to another and developing truly feature-rich packages. It dosen't take a dreamer to see the possibilities, from unheard-of professional solutions to trickle-down pro capabilities in new iSoftware (eg. look how technologies purchased from Marcromedia were crafted into Final Cut Pro & iMovie). This is one area that users, down the road, can really cash out with if Apple encourages the flow of technologies between it's new divisions.
Strategy: Sorry, Mac-Only.
One thing that is a bit sad about this, ironically enough, is the immediate cancellation of the Windows versions of some software (notably Shake & Logic) with this strategy. While perhaps more upfront than an MS-style purchase and feature-deprivation in non-Windows versions, Apple still isn't making any friends (and perhaps losing potentially loyal customers & money) by doing this. Still, one cannot say that it's not what happened to Mac users through the late 1990s (even now - look at Bungie) but it would be better karma to be more merciful once the shoe is on the other foot. Apple would be smart to mitigate the anger of Windows users by offering discounts on upgrades to the next Mac version.
Next Strategy: More Vertical Markets.
The Macintosh still has a real chance at gaining significant market share if it can be a strong alternative in enough vertical market segments. Apple is rightly building on it's strenghts, but should diversify enough so that the Macintosh is not pegged as only good for those niches (remember what happened to the Amiga? Games machine!)
A Holy Grail almost as worthy as dominating the business market for Apple is the scientific & engineering markets, often with high software margins all around. A purchase or substantial investment in Autodesk à la the MS $150M in Apple would make Apple a huge player in the professional engineering, architecture, and manufacturing industries overnight. Considering Autodesk is not the most expensive stock right now, with a market cap of approximately USD$1.4B, Apple could conceivably purchase the entire operations in cash and still have about $2B in the bank. Autodesk's Design Segment develops AutoCAD, Autodesk Inventor, Mechanical Desktop, Autodesk Architectural Desktop, Architectural Studio, Autodesk Map, Lightscape, and Autodesk Land Desktop, to name a few (most industry-standard in their fields) and the Discreet Segment develops 3D Studio MAX, Animator Studio, flame, inferno, smoke, combustion, cinestream, plasma, cleaner, MPEG supercharger, Topper, and many others.
With a stable of industry-dominating software products as great as this, such a purchase (or even investment ensuring MacOS X compatibility) would send massive shockwaves across the engineering & architectural markets, and ripples in the scientific & pro graphics markets who are by now used to this. No immediate cancellation of the Windows version would be posible here, rather a years-long strategy to ensure first Mac versions and then Mac feature-parity. A purchase like this too rich for Apple's blood? Try something smaller like privatley-held ESRI (makers of ArcINFO, ArcView, ArcGIS & associated imaging systems), or continue to add strength in the crucial areas of coming scientific importance such as biotech and bioinformatics, in which Macs already have a growing following as you can see.
That would only work if the apps were recompiled to x86. Unless the app is open source, each manufacturer will have to do this themselves to make their app cross platform. Many manufacturers may do this, but Apple sure as hell won't.
...do it yourself. Apple's probably getting sweaty palms that the major audio apps are dragging their feet porting to OSX.
It's been over a year now and NONE of the big players have ported, preferring to point the finger at Apple. There's a major hole in OSX software and it's music/audio composition, good on you Apple for filling it.
Cubase has been slowly but surely becoming more windows focused, like the wait for vst32 and now SX.
POKE 36879,8
Linux PPC on a Briq or other such device would work fine without recompilation. Also Darwin running GNUStep would be an alternate method. A McKinley emulating a G4 in software might be a third scenario and a PPC compatibility layer for Transmeta devices would be a fourth set of devices that didn't require binary recompilation.
PPCs are lower in heat and tend to have a smaller size. At a certain point of lost marketshare, Intel is going to sink to price parity and then become the more expensive solution. At that point, the el-cheapo whitebox solution will have a PPC chip in it, not an x86. 5-8 years is a lifetime in the hardware chip wars.