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Mesa 5.0 Released
Eugenia writes "Mesa 5.0 has been released. It implements the OpenGL 1.4 specification." There's more information as to what's been fixed/added/changed on their SF.net project page.
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I heard that a lot of GNOME code went into the Mesa repository not long ago.
When will Mesa 5.0 be incorporated into Debian stable?
So that's all it takes, eh?
<grin>
---
the pen is mightier than the sword, the sword is mightier than the court, the court is mightier than the pen.
It'd be interresting to know how this release compares to other OpenGL implementations on Windows. Anyone looked into this?
Why Windows? It's always interresting to see how any open software solutions stack up versus their proprietary cousins on a proprietary system.
.: Max Romantschuk
But the new mesa seems to have intelligent workload distribution between the cpu and the gpu, i e
:). Server gaming woohoo!
glxgears running in a small window - 200 fps, average 2% cpu load(with Mesa 4.1 it was 800 fps 100% load),
running maximized in 1600x1200 - 80 fps, 100% load(exactly as with Mesa 4.1).
And all the games and etc run at exactly the same speeds with less cpu load.
All I can say is this is great - nobody needs insane fps numbers above 100 and it saves cpu for my poor apache running in the background
Join the elite! Post at score:2! Ghostwheel is online.
1: Write underware-Gnomes post, linking the joke to current topic. 2: ? 3: Karma!
Too bad they never got off their fat, zealotted unshaven unwashed asses and fixed the bug in voodoo5 support (fucking motherfucker crashes when in i686 SMP mode switching from OpenGL mode to any other mode -- text or a different OpenGL mode). I reported this bug a looong time ago but obviously nobody gives a rats ass.
P.S. I bought the voodoo 5500 because of 3dfx's support of the Linux community. Then RIGHT AFTER THAT they get bought out by those proprietary whores at NVidia. FUCK!
This sounds like some incredible performance updates. I'm no developer and i know OpenGL only from the client-side but there's a question now: what's missing from this release in comparison with the NVidia-drivers (performance-wise i mean, i know mesa works for _all_ cards) ? Are the NVidia drivers still needed/preferred ? If so, why ? Can this be changed ?
Shouldn't that be FP/S for first posts per second?
No, what sucks is that all the ppl that wrote d3d might have just contributed to Mesa. MS wouldn't have had to pay royalties or anything.
As a matter of fact why are MS users even on the internet? We all would have better off if MS made a proprietary internet protocol for their users, then they could charge AOL royalties too.
Hey, OpenGL is at least standardized, something you can build on for years. Nobody can guarantee you that the next version of DirectX will be compatible with the current version.
In fact, there are only two 3D APIs that are standardized and (more or less) widely used: OpenGL and OpenInventor.
A monkey is doing the real work for me.
I used to use Mesa years ago as a software-only OpenGL-like API, on a system for which there was no OpenGL implementation, but I was writing code to run on a system that did have it (these were MacOS 7.x and an Indy, if memory serves). But if you have an OpenGL driver, what does Mesa do? Surely the libraries that come with the driver implement the API? Or does it just let you write 1.4 code with a card/driver that only supports up to 1.2 in the hardware, and do the new 1.4 features in software?
1: read underwear-gnomes joke post at work 2:??? 3:whinge!
A good game generally needs a good budget to back it.
A flashy game with a lot of graphics may need a big budget. But those games are not necessarily good, nor do good games necessarily need flashy graphics. For example, many of the movie-tie-in 3D games are financed heavily and anywhere from mediocre to horrible. On the other hand, excellent games like chess or go are of utmost graphical simplicity, and they have been refined over centuries and millenia in a process akin to open source. Furthermore, there are quite a few excellent open source games with minimal graphics and excellent gameplay.
Closed source, heavily financed games satisfy a yearning for novelty. They spend a lot of money on eye candy and pushing technology to the limit. But really good game design is a long-term, open process. For computer games, that has barely begun. I suspect that in another few years, you are going to see open source games whose graphics is simpler than Doom but whose gameplay beats anything commercially available. And closed source games won't be able to compete with that because they simply can't have thousands of game players contributing directly to the evolution of the game.
Open source is slow--but eventually, it gets there, and it usually ends up doing a better job.
Licensing fees for DirectX? If that were true, i'm surprised we're not seeing more OpenGL-development under Win32 (although there's a lot going on already, there's still far more DX-development) ..
.. they may change it completly and scrap backwards compability or they may just leave it like it is (btw, backwards compability has in fact, been maintaned quite good when it comes to DX. You may write code in DX8 that worked on DX3 etc).
The "problem" with DX from a developers point is that you can't be sure about what MS decides to do with the API in the next revision
I've spent time developing for both APIs and my personal favourite is still OpenGL, mostly because i can use the same code on different platforms.
i agree. OpenGL lost the lead a long time ago.
So? Who cares? I'd much rather use an open API than some snazzy, proprietary thing.
Wait for 2.0 to come out. MS is going to lock Linux out of 2.0 as some of the api's are based on dx9
Again, who cares? If MS has the power to lock Linux out of OpenGL 2.0 (through patents?), then open source will just not use it and instead evolve OpenGL 1.* in a different direction.
lightyears behind the "competition"...
Your just saying that because you are: A) Stuck on a window machine B) You don't know how to use linux. Guess what, you still have to pay for a game even if its on an open source platform. If the game is good people will pay it, the reason that there are less users is because there aren't enough games on Linux, I'm stuck dual booting between Windows and Linux because of this. Why do you think that there are so many Linux game servers. Elite Force for an example is one, it would be dead today if it wasn't for Linux. Linux's Golden Age will come and I'm sure your going to :)
A) Have to use linux because Microsoft went bankrupt.
B) Figure out how to use Linux. :)
Who said anything about games? No one did. Non windows users understand that computers are often used for things OTHER than games. OpenGL is used for many scientific and engineering applications, not to mention the visual effects industry. While you're playing Deer Hunter 27, some of us are actual getting work done.
I didn't have a use for this vacuous comment, yet you posted it anyway.
In a way this troolhoor is right. I was using Mesa on Sun and Linux machines years ago, when SGI was about the only place you could find OpenGL professionally. It wasn't OpenGL that cost anything, it was those damn SGI boxes and high-end video cards! Mesa was also the first to provide OpenGL for the 3fx Voodoo, the first consumer-level 3d video card. The really funny thing is, if you've ever done anything 3d in Linux, you've almost certainly used Mesa before, but I'm taking this troll too seriously.
Now mod this and the parent post into oblivion.
tell that to the fag linux zealots here who still use windows cough cmdr taco cough because that's what all the good games come out on.
OpenGL20 (twenty)
The reason there are so many Linux game servers is because so many people have Linux running on a server apart from their main machine.
I think he's talking about the licensing fees for windows (you need windows to use the latest DirectX). The DirectX SDK (like all Windows SDKs) is free.
This is not correct. Future versions of DirectX are always guaranteed to provide the prior COM interfaces. For example, you can have an old DirectX 3 program running just fine under DirectX 8.1.
As for OpenGL being standartized, if you want to support newer features like pixel (fragment) shaders or vertices in AGP memory, you NEED to use vendor extensions, which means separate code for nVidia and ATI.
You're still depending on the good will of Microsoft. DirectX is still proprietary, and Microsoft can do with it whatever they want.
A monkey is doing the real work for me.
Mesa is very tightly bound to XFree86. Are there instructions out there for how to replace the Mesa that ships with XFree86 4.x with this new version? Does anyone know when XFree86 4.3 is due out and which Mesa version it will have?
I'd like to try this out and see if I can finally get some decent FPS on my Radeon 7000, but I don't want to sacrifice stability by messing with Mesa if I don't know what I'm doing.
-- Craig Howard
Microsoft will have the good will to support those prior interfaces - do Age of Empires or Age of Kings ring a bell? They will not stop supporting their prior games in the foreseeable future.
The question about the proprietary vendor extension in OpenGL still stands though. For example - want to use AGP memory for vertices - hmmm nVidia VARs or ATI VAO?
Face it, nowadays for games, Direct3D is the bleeding edge and OpenGL is lagging. OpenGL 2.0 addresses those issues, but it is still at a planning stage, while DirectX 9 will be out pretty soon.
so.. which is better vaporware.. properiaty vaporware or open vaporware..
dx doesn't come on straight on backwards compatibility btw. try playing master of orion 2 on win2k.. it either works or doesnt, most probably you'll lose your cursor.
moo2 is dx2 btw..(the win32 vers).
world was created 5 seconds before this post as it is.
None of this changes the fact that DX is proprietary and thus subject to the whims of Microsoft which is officially a criminal monopolist.
You seem to be under the the impression that Direct X 9 is vaporware. Interesting then, where did I get that beta that is sitting on my Win2K machine?
As for MoO2, have you tried installing the compatibility pack, which addresses issues with old games on Win2k? Also DX2 is a very ancient and rare version and all DX3 programs that I've seen run just fine (the original Diablo, for example).
appearantly youve never been introduced to Gentoo Linux.My Quake3 runs so much faster than on any windows.Could be that an O.S. compiled and fitted to your machine will be the fastest running for games.hey, my two cents.
*Repent!Quit Your Job!Slack Off!The World Ends Tomorrow and You May Die!
Microsoft will have the good will to support those prior interfaces - do Age of Empires or Age of Kings ring a bell? They will not stop supporting their prior games in the foreseeable future.
Good, 'cos I'm having some problems trying to run GORILLAS.BAS on WinXP.
Still, I agree, MS is not going to shoot themselves in the foot
by breaking backward compatibility if they don't have to.
Yes, OpenGL is open, but do you think anyone cares?
The computer games industry is like any other business, it is run by economics.
The kids want games with bleeding-edge 3d, and unless you're name is John Carmack, the industry is not going to support anything else than DirectX.
Now OpenGL 2.0 has the chance to turn the tables;
If GL2 can equal DirectX,
the game industry will use it,
if not for other reasons than economic reasons. Why? One word: Portability.
Porting to the Mac (and maybe even linux) is no problem with OpenGL, but if your code depends on DirectX: forget about it.
Now which game developer would knowingly limit themselves to the MS platform, if they had an equal alternative?
Which game producer would not want to be able to release a Mac or Linux port, at little extra cost?
And here is the link where you can evaluate your "propriety vaporware".l easeid=45160
http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/release.asp?re
Where can I download OpenGL 2.0, again?
Last time i checked, the Driver Development Kit is no longer free. It's not expensive (relatively... just shipping), but you can't download it anymore.
http://www.microsoft.com/ddk/
Why did they do that? Beats me.
silic
Not all "Real Gamers" are fixed on the PC. Many of them use the PC to emulate their favourite system. The reason why I use Linux (some of the emulators use mesa) for emulation is that i dont want to spend my day with a system from which i dont know what it realy does.
After reading comments I want to write just one thing: Mesa is not hardware accelerated. There is no point to compare it with nVidia or ATI closed source drivers, there is no point to compare speed of Mesa and Win OpenGL implementation. You can't play any new game with Mesa, because you will get 1-2fps.
I am not sure why non-developer should download Mesa, probably only if he/she need to run OpenGL application (like Blender for example) and hardware accelerated driver works bad or not exist.
Direct3D STILL sucks for scientific visualisation (still favours texture pushing over high-poly-count), and is STILL Windoze-only (Wine excepted). OpenGL sucks less, and is not bound to C++ (Well, o.k. DirectX is theoretically COM, but I defy you to program it seriously in anything other than MS-bastardised C++)
Scientists tend to use grown-up OSes (i.e. no Windoze) and code in Fortran 95 or HPF, pure C or occasionally Lisp - all languages with OpenGL bindings.
You can learn OpenGL+SDL basics in an afternoon, and have flocks of teapots flying across your screen the following morning. Just beginning to learn DirectX and Direct3D means taking on board all the bizarro-world Microsoftian "C++" and COM cruft.
OpenGL's going to be around for some time.
Now, it is inappropriate for hardware raytracing cards, but us people in the scientific graphics community (and movie-making-community) are only getting to play with them now, don't expect them to trickle down to the gaming market for a while yet.
pssshht, they'd be free if I could actually download the damn things. Some sort of funky javascripted activeX control that errors out on all the breeds of IE I've tried (IE 5.55, 6 on 2k and XP). *glare microsoft*
I hope you realize OpenGL is used for a lot more than just games. Even if there weren't good games for linux (which there are), there would still be a need for an OpenGL implementation.
Quite frankly, it doesn't matter if Mesa supported 1.4 or 2.0 or 9.99. It's all software implementation, has no 3D acceleration, so your $500 uber-ATI card runs just as slow as my on-board dell video. How do you code "sucker" ?
"Me-sa like it. Me-sa good!"
and should you say otherwise, you're flamebaiting.
simple?
Direct3D ... still favours texture pushing over high-poly-count
This is wrong. In fact, Direct3D supports hardware acceleration (AGP memory, etc.) for high-res models natively through vertex buffers, while with OpenGL 1.* you need to use vendor extensions - nVidia VAR, ATI VAO, etc. Which, believe me, you can't learn in an afternoon.
You can learn OpenGL+SDL basics in an afternoon, and have flocks of teapots flying across your screen the following morning. Just beginning to learn DirectX and Direct3D means taking on board all the bizarro-world Microsoftian "C++" and COM cruft.
For fsck's sake, the stuff that JC wrote about OpenGL vs. DirectX is extremely outdated. Today, using OpenGL's easy-to-learn, flock-of-teapots immediate mode (i.e. glBegin(), glEnd()), will give you a really measly fps for scientific visualization. You have to use vertex buffers if you want performance. So you might just as well do it for exactly the same amount of time with Direct3D 8.1. Also, stop the FUD about Direct3D being "Microsoftian C++" only, you can use it just as fine with C, and *gosh* even under MinGW.
Let me point readers to the Mesa FAQ:
***
1.2 Does Mesa support/use graphics hardware?
Yes. Specifically, Mesa serves as the OpenGL core for the XFree86/DRI OpenGL drivers.
***
Now, Mesa does *include* a software rendering engine...
This could be what you meant, but this is the first post along the "Mesa is nothing more than a software renderer" lines, and there are a *lot* on here, some of which are definitely wrong.
May we never see th
you can evaluate the process that will make opengl to be what it is.
it's vapor until it's final, packed, and shipping, and supported.
world was created 5 seconds before this post as it is.
Actually, I have 2 linux servers which I've been maintaining for years. Works great as a server, but the desktop environment is poor. So of course I'm on a windows machine; the linux desktop sucks.
I'm not a gamer. I don't even have an AGP video card. I use onboard because I don't need 3D hardware to render my 2D desktop. Without all these gamers (losers) companies like nvidia wouldn't be making $$$ and investing so much into the advancement of 3D technology. 3D games might be a sad and pathetic reason to invest billions into, but it is driving the market.
why-oh-why is this a troll?
My guess is that some moderator thought that asking on the availability of a package is automatically an insult. To all moderators; if they aren't explicitly being insulting, then it's probably a genuine question! It's pretty sad when our hides get so thick that our immediate answer to a request for help is to try and ignore them.
To answer the original question, my guess is that it'll probably go into the latest unstable, which is Sid. (If it isn't in there already.) My guess is that it's probably not going to be around long enough to make the testing release, Sarge, before Sarge gets bumped to stable. From what I understand, to make Sarge, it'd need to be in for 3 months. If they bump Sarge to stable in less than 3 months, it won't make the next stable release. I could be wrong, here, though.
I don't personally run Debian anymore (Windows), so.. maybe someone from Debian could offer some insight here, on just how much work needs to be done to get this hooked in with the latest X, and what it would take for it to make it into Sarge.
you are a fucking sexless fat puke then. no self respecting male would fuck that whore.
The NVIDIA drivers accelerate OpenGL on NVIDIA hardware. Mesa, unless it has a mini-driver for your card, is a software implementation of OpenGL. There is no Mesa driver for NVIDIA cards, so the NVIDIA driver is still preferred.
A deep unwavering belief is a sure sign you're missing something...
you mean "what my pork with the greek."
that fat pork eating fucking gyros bitch cucumber sauce coming out her pussy gives a BAD NAME to the people who burnt troy to the ground. man, if i was Agamemnon and I had to come home to whores like this I would banish them to the Isle of Lesbos. Fat pig bitch.
Who cares about games? Soon, we'll be using OpenGL to draw our desktops. Just check out evas_test (from E17) and let your jaw drop. MacOS X ain't got nothing on EVAS! At that point, OpenGL becomes a whole lot more important.
A deep unwavering belief is a sure sign you're missing something...
Do you think the industry is going to let Microsoft lock in OpenGL 2.0? Sun and SGI depend on OpenGL for their visualization business. Linux is becoming more popular with graphics shops every day. I doubt even Microsoft can go against that kind of industry opposition. Microsoft has a lot of money, but if you attack something like OpenGL, which is central to the businesses of a whole lot of companies, then the money on the other side because rather significant.
A deep unwavering belief is a sure sign you're missing something...
Whoa, hold on a second! I wasn't talking about your mom!
-- Jim
You are fat, sexless, ugly, stupid, probably a Mac using god damn mother fuck. you cant afford real equipment and probably use IDE, you are living in your parents basement a subsidized loser. you are a fucking poor, fat, adult friend finder online dater mail a bride ass fucking pig.
you NORTON, are a cunt casket mother fucking shit faced bastard anus licking bitch.
I'd love to see your scrawny puke ass in a bar and watch the ladies pass you up, and you would go home to your saran wrapped keyboard and your shrine to Sarah Michelle Gellar and rub one off in her honor.
Now, take your fat ass cheeks, drape the side of your toilet bowl, and shit your fucking brains out you god damn fuckhead.
No shit we aren't talking about my ma, you fucking ass fuck. We aren't talking about my mom, and speaking of yours, you don't have one! You have 2 dads and chemistry set you slimy fucking slimy product of a genetic quagmire made of detritus, baby batter and ass juice. We are talking about the object of your lust, fat Eugenia pig. You mother fucking cunt. Your shit ass replies and garbage rhetoric serves as a testament to your zealous fuck obsession. You invertebrate mother fucking cretin. You fucking son of a Petri dish piece of shit.
You are fat, sexless, ugly, stupid, probably a Mac using god damn mother fuck. you cant afford real equipment and probably use IDE, you are living in your parents basement a subsidized loser. you are a fucking poor, fat, adult friend finder online dater mail a bride ass fucking pig.
You NORTON, are a cunt casket mother fucking shit faced bastard anus licking bitch.
I'd love to see your scrawny puke ass in a bar and watch the ladies pass you up, and you would go home to your saran wrapped keyboard and your shrine to Sarah Michelle Gellar and rub one off in her honor.
Now, take your fat ass cheeks, drape the side of your toilet bowl, and shit your fucking brains out you god damn fuckhead.
Phear... you really made my day......... KUDOS to you!
You are my hero. Not only do you create 2 original replies (har har) to my message, but you're proficient at ASCII art too! You even reply to your own messages congratulating yourself!
PS. Goatse.cx? Are you a regular? Judging by your intelligent response, you sound like you might be the owner!
-- Jim
Is this a press release from JarJar Binx?
Look at Mister Big Man Jim Norton, posturing and gallivanting, beating his manly chest, look at him! Look at how he is trying to be facetious and use snarky ironic taunts that crumble like loosely bound dirt at my shield of intellect - I hope you realize you took the bait, and this is cathartic, you are now a source of my amusement. You insinuate that I am self congratulatory, you try and indicate that there is some sort of failure or evidence thereof in my posting. Stylistically, it's original. There are some borrowed elements, such as the stretched anus art. This art serves to best illustrate your mouth. Your flapping, babbling orifice; your sphincter-esque cake hole shitting forth the verbiage of a sub creature. This is how the Goatse art serves the vanguards of what it right best. The art allows me to depict your shit encrusted rhetoric being strewn onto Commander Asshole's cheap ass IDE disks that hold the pathetic content that is Slashdot. Its is a gaping maw, a huge foul orifices normally used for eliminating waste. Your mouth is just that, it eliminates waste, and subjects others to this waste. The stretched nature of this art shows you stretching the true form, that you are in fact a sad, fat sexless subsidized complete loser masquerading as something else vicariously through your online existence. No one is fooled. What we see come out of your mouth is shit, and what your mouth looks like, metaphorically speaking, is a stretched anus depositing the aforementioned shit at an unnatural rate.
I have only a few more thoughts percolating in my mind, but I should say something before taking my leave of ridiculing your pathetic, childish ass. Quite simply it is this, Fuck You.
Yeah, Direct3D runs real well on my Linux/x86 cluster. And it really smokes on my SGI Irix workstation.
Why the HELL would I learn a whole new platform (even paths are different syntax on windoze, and there's no proper fork()...) when I can just use OpenGL on Unix???
And I've tried to use Direct3D in C. It sucks. You must be confusing C++ with C.
Apart from anything else, Direct3D's coordinate system is exactly the wrong way round. Now, I know this was done for incompatiblity with OpenGL(and thus lock-in) - but anyone who has more than high-school mathematics habitually uses OpenGL-style coordinate systems.
Not in the gaming market for a while yet?
Don't be so sure
The real question is, will Enlightenment become a whole lot more important? *ducks*
Hahahahahahahahahaha this is so entertaining. The best stuff i've read for soooo fucking long.
And you think i'm a source of your amusement...
Childish? Talk about the pot calling the kettle black.
Judging by your 'eloquent' response, it seems you are the source of your own amusement.
The only thing I can agree with you on is this - it's over. You can go back to AOL now, playing The Sims: Hot Date and fantasizing about your virtual girlfriends. Does your 'shield of intellect' give you a hard on?
Stylistically, you're a putz.
-- Jim
I'm not a current Debian contributor, but I am a Debian user (love it), but afaik if its submitted to unstable (sid), and there are no bugs filed against it in the first fortnight then its into testing (sarge). Coming up to a release there is a freeze on new packages in unstable transferring to testing automatically in a bid to get a bug-free (hah! relatively of course) release version
People who mock the stable release for the out-of-datedness of its packages just don't get the whole Debian idea - Stable is for rock-solid dependability - i.e. servers or any other machine remote to you - its a dream to keep up to date security and patch-wise, and it makes it easier to sleep at night!!
If you want more up to date then use testing, or if you want bleeding edge (you will bleed ocasionally) use testing. Better still use stable/testing underneath, and the packages that you're interested in compile from sf/cvs. This way you can manage the pieces you're interested in the way you want, and debian's apt-get will look after the updates/security on the pieces you don't have time to look after.
It doesn't take care of all the security problems, but security is a contributary process.
My 2 cent
Daniel
Childish? Talk about the pot calling the kettle black.
While you might be willing to concede being childish, as the idiomatic expression you just used indicates, the other party may not. YHBT YHL HAND.
"Trolls are recognizable by the fact that they have no real interest in learning about the topic at hand - they simply want to utter flame bait. Like the ugly creatures they are named after, they exhibit no redeeming characteristics, and as such, they are recognized as a lower form of life on the net"
/. which you probably do anyway) ... you are boils on the asses of life, your only purpose here is seemingly to demonstrate how fucking retarded you are.
In other words - KMA.
In all seriousness - why don't you idiots get off the fucking board (no, that means leave... I don't literally mean get off on while reading
So like, fuck off or something.
-- Jim
Topic at hand: A fucking updated API for Open GL was released. Is this fucking hard to get? Does this need to be "reported?" Trolls are strong, they regenerate as well. You might judge a book by its cover, you shallow fool, but charisma does not save one's neck in a battle of wit. As clearly shown by your complete trash and vendetta to complete this game
You are a complete idiot. I have other accounts with which I am "insightful" and "interesting." I have said good things that maybe deserve that. I have said things that deserve a +1 and get a +5. I have said things that were funny but no one got. I have said valuable things that got moderated down. If you can't see that the moderation system here is deeply flawed and feel good at being able to post +2 which is easy to whore, and you think that you yourself are not a troll to some, you are a delusional idiotic, foolish naïve asshole.
Once again, your drivel serves only to illustrate that you think of yourself as important, you value appearance and charisma over correctness, you label and deprecate and self aggrandize based on a non-meritocratic rating system and you laughably try to uphold your deeply flawed arguments crumbling pillars.
You are the retard, the loser, the boil on the ass of life, the poster child for why abortion should be legal and birth defects, you are a fetal alcohol syndrome baby, you are the retard, and you sounds like a valley girl saying "like fuck off or something." You are poor at being snarky, you think ugly women are attractive, you feel valued when you are not value nor wanted, your presence is generally worthless, unfunny and technically, you are full of conjecture. I gave a cursory inspection to your past posts. You are clearly a Winderz kiddie, you talk of PC architecture often, giving away you never work with real iron, you speculate without fact, you don't know any HTML nor give any links. You are a spineless, full of conjecture Windows Brat, probably in undergrad College or below, spewing your crap here. And you are similarly named with Peter Norton, and him , like your, are advocates of shit software. Unlike you, Peter has money. You can only afford crappy PC's with second rate parts. You are not technically or programmatically inclined, you have no professional certifications, you are a poor computer user, Mister Norton.
I take my leave of you, a soured pathetic knavish brat, to wallow in your own mediocrity. You have to live in that skin of yours. I feel bad for you - well, I take that back, I feel bad for your mother, unless she did actually purposely drop you when you were the little toddler you still act like.
Haha ... dude, I have a technical certification, dumbass (CNE 4.11/5, BTW) and I have an IT job at a large company. What's that about judging books by their covers?
A Windoze brat... running Debian Linux 3. Yeah, ok. You're "insightful" Have fun with your regular accounts. You're still a Troll, thus by definition "a lower form of life" and guilty of most of the things you've said about me already.
-- Jim
You lie. You are not intelligent enough to have a CNE. I know and appreciate Novell, NDS, and its extensibility and manageability and notion of the world root. I can tell from your past here that you lie. You know nothing of it. Sure you are running Debian. Sure. As if that's a badge of honor, even if you were. If you were trying to impress you might say FreeBSD, or something other OS that gets used in real iron, maybe Solaris, HPUX, but instead you talk of a child's toy, a distribution used nowhere other than on cheesy second hand computers bought by poverty people such as yourself. Debian, built by Ian Murdoch and made into an acronym for him and his fat ugly wife Deborah.
"IT". The acronym that is the mark of the loser. This is a sure sign you are far less than you say you are, you are bluffing, you are living vicariously online as something far greater than you really are. Certainly you hold a position that isn't even close to what could be referred to as a "senior", programmer, engineer, manager, information or operational officer. "IT. " You take calls, don't you? - zit brat... A large company? Like what, large like Enron, Nortel, Lucent, Worldcom? Real prestige being a tiny little rat bitch in a big pond. You are a mailroom employee in my estimation, a Stanley the Mop Man.
HAHAHAHAHAHA. I laugh, "large company," mister big bad company is here to show the little plebeians on Slashdot how the big boys do it. HAHAHHAHAHAHA. Oh, man, you are a high-on-self complete and total loser. Brandishing credentials. Talking of things he knows nothing about.
Now I like Novell, but it's generally used almost exclusively with Windows and the Novell Client. You probably don't know how to get Console One running on your workstation, and you spend your day fielding calls about printer queues and password and login and Exchange or GroupWise tutelage for Outlook users. You works in a Windows laden environment and you whip out your Debian elite ness as if it is a silver bullet, that staves off the werewolf who thirsts for the blood of complete and total Windows support idiots such as yourself.
Not about being a troll, not in my estimation. You are probably now more of a troll than you ever hoped I would be.
Refrain from calling me dude. While this may be common speak amongst your and your bleating MCSE idols, I am not a "Dude." In fact, the DUDE, is best applied to Jeff Bridges. While being a fat, unemployed pothead in a movie is funny and entertaining to watch, Jim, for Christ's sake, its not a model to live by.
Your ability to conclude that the moniker of troll is applicable using your dodgy evasive defensive and flawed discourse is only lending credence to the fact that your are a moron, a Slashbotting simpleton who escapes the sexless misery of his fat poverty stricken slave existence to pretend he is a big hairy chested man that means something and has some semblance of control over his life. The pretend party is over, this isn't Wayne's World, you aren't funny, and you aren't talented. Count your blessings, you are not square with the house, the world should take back whatever you have because you are undeserving of it and a waste of our resources. You are deprecated, Windows brat. Show me some of those GNU moves you learned [within the past week] hahahahahahahahahahaha. HAHAHAHHAHAHA. BWAHAHAHAHA.
fuckin' n00b, your flopping around at the bottom of the boat.
like fore sure, WHATEVERrrrrrr.
That was ... perhaps the most unintelligible thing i've read in a while.
I'm sure you'll write another novel in response, but you became predictable about 3 posts ago and this is getting really really old.
-- Jim
That was ... perhaps the most unintelligible thing i've read in a while.
Well, I'm sorry if you were only partially or improperly educated. It was quite easy to read, spelled properly and more or less grammatically correct. English is evolving so I take liberties that experts may horrified by. Your literacy is not my concern. I take comfort in that fact that you now side step and try to change the nature of this thread now, in this later hour, after I have peeled away the layers and have reached the core, as sad and insignificant as it is. This is when you become evasive and try to deflect the conversation away from your mediocrity, of which you are deeply ashamed. Give my sympathies to those who are proximal to you.
But, all in all, this thread and your comment history is the firmament by which I deconstruct you. You are pathetic. You are a sad, unaccomplished pathetic entity.
as a random passer by, JIMMAY (said like timmay, the handicap on South Park), i must say in a cartman voice, "my mom says you arent any good, so, take that, nah nah nah a boo boo stick your head in doo doo. my dad can beat up your dad"
you are awful at arguing! i must say this has been an amusing thread. damn teenager.
Hi there you gay felching choad swallowing fucking fag. Fuckhead.