Slashdot Mirror
Apple's Present: iTunes Supports Ogg Files
curious.corn writes "I may be a fool (and a happy Christmas Mac OS X newbie ;-) but it seems that this morning's software update brought a really cool cadeau to Mac OS X. How 'bout Ogg file integration in iTunes? Yesterday evening I could only play them in QuickTime (after downloading a component somewhere) this morning I updated iTunes and am enjoying my old Linux playlists. Buon Natale a tutti voi Edo."
So, like, um, i clicked, and the computer was like, beep, and then it was like, playing my .oggs!
--Ellen Feiss
it's that codec you downloaded. It also hooked itself into iTunes. Apple has made it clear they won't support Ogg, at least in the forseeable future.
I think I could already do this with the same component. It just plays them as quicktime files. The downer is that they still have to be ripped to mp3 to goto the iPod. Now the real Christmas present would be if Apple would release an OGG iPod update. That would be really cool.
Tommy
...but only if it supports Ogg- oh, wait, never mind...
Alcohol and Calculus don't mix. Don't drink and derive.
Apple does it's best to get users to switch.
Since Many Linux users also have a commercial OS: So Ogg supoort will certainly convince Linux users to get OS X instead of Windows as their commercial system.
Now when will they add support for WMV files?
No it doesn't. And I can't find this update that the person is talking about. I think he may be mistaken, because the component that he was talking about has always allowed you to play .OGG files in iTunes. Maybe he's just never tried it. Can we get a URL for the update?
i seem to remember seeing a friend play ogg files from itunes before. but, i don't ever recall them working on the ipod. i couldn't see any mention of this on the apple website.
answers on a postcard please...
/usr/bin/awake/too/long
See freshmeat. This isn't from Apple, though ...
This is somewhat offtopic, but this reminds me of my irritating RealOne player problem. I can't get the auto update to run through our firewall. This means I can't get the codec I need to watch about 30% of the South Park episodes on my harddrive. It's starting to tick me off...
...but this is hardly anything revolutionary. Sure, OGG is a nice format, and it is supposedly patent free. Until somebody actually discovers that they have a patent for something that it is using, that is. :)
:) And 99.99% of Mac and Linux user won't ever notice. :)
The big issue is always a question of "does it work today"? And today, there are free software to decode and encode both mp3 and ogg files, and that means that they are equivalent from that standpoint. A small number of people will preferr ogg out of purely moral reasons, but for the vast majority this only means that there is yet another file format out of loads of fileformats that is supported by Apple. Which is nice, but on the whole rather uninteresting.
Apple did hardly implement this to make a point. They probably implemented it because it was easy.
this guy is on crack. iTunes already did Ogg. There is no update.
(And my new damn iPod won't charge!)
This
What happens when you remove the .ogg codec for Quicktime? Does the iTunes .ogg suport disappear?
Do your iTunes visualizations respond to the .ogg files?
Please, we need more info.
try resetting the ipod by holding down the menu and play/pause button simultaneously for about 10 seconds. that fixed my charging problem.
what i really want is an ogg encoder in itunes, not just a player.
But don't fret! You can run .ogg files in iTunes; in fact, I'm doing so right now! While it may not have been posted on Christmas, and it may not be from Apple, consider it a christmas present anyways. Here it is. Merry Christmas! =)
So I couldn't this one out. And googling didn't help much either.
The babelfish tells me that cadeau means gift in french. But it couldn't translate "Buon Natale a tutti voi Edo" into English. Translating from Italian, and the fish tells me it means: "Good NATO them to all you Edo", which evidently is a suggestion that we bring the Japanese into NATO. Which is interesting, as just yesterday I heard a report that with the North Korean situation and everything, the Japanese are once again considering their needs for their own defense.
But what does that have to do with Ogg?
And, worldwide, irony calculation machines simultaneously burst into flames.
-
Inventor of the term 'pardon my French'.
Do you think it is a slow news day when a story about some guy installing a codec in os x to get ogg working makes it to the front page of slashdot?
.ogg plays you
and o yeah in Soviet Russia
man
No manual entry for
Is a nice simple mp3 to ogg converter for windows.
Anyone got any ideas?
It's Christmas everyday with BitTorrent.
Ok, I am confused, what is OGG? Silly question, I realize.
Is this real or not real? I am a windows user with a mac Ipod (I don't have the cash to trade up) and I want to be able to use .ogg so badly on my ipod. If this is infact true than I would bet that very soon there is going to be a firmware update for the Ipod supporting the .ogg format. This means 4000 songs in my pocket (on the 10gb model) which makes me a very happy panda.
If this isn't true than may I sugest firebombing whomever posted this story?
Time to download "Rock and Roll Volume 2" to celebrate!
Brilliant! Is there a p2p prog that is made for sharing OGG, or what is a good way to begin finding them? Thanks for the help! (Doesnt something like this mess up plans of Pallidum, and other various ways of ensuring copyright compliance?)
There is no iTunes update that adds OGG support. This is why the original reporter things there is: 1. He installed an open source OGG component for QuickTime. iTunes uses QuickTime for playback. 2. He installed the iTunes 3.0.1 update, which keeps reappearing in the Software Update panel on non-U.S. localizations. 3. He thought the new (=old) iTunes update added OGG support when it was actually the QT component that did it; and the iTunes update didn't actually do anything, since it is an old update that the update server is pushing as a new one.
--You think you've found my weakness, but I have more.--
You have never seen a Star Wars movie?!?! I am sorry this is off topic, but please, do yourself a favor and give yourself, or at least your kids a great christmas present and check out the pentology.
--Joey
Though it was a week before I installed Linux on my iBook.
Unlike winshit however, OS X and 9 still have places on my hard disk. For Warcraft 3 and Quake 3 respectively.
You can't judge a book by the way it wears its hair.
About the Mac OS X 10.2.3 Update mentions some enhancements to iTunes (and lots of other stuff) but doesn't specifically mention Ogg.
Lets all thank timothy for posting something he thought was cool but had no earthly idea if it was true or not. Come on, not even a url? At least correct the headline or something. Weaksauce.
is that someone at apple might just read this and see that there is a demand for ogg support and release an update.
if you want ogg support for the ipod say so here, why you want it, if you'd be prepared to pay for it and what advantages it could give to apple (such as royalty free codecs, etc.)
apple are currently touting an mpeg based quicktime to the world and dog, for which they need to pay a royalty per copy. so stand up and be counted. if you really want it, should it from the rooftops (or alternatively, type it on your keyboard and click on submit).
/usr/bin/awake/too/long
1. open up submit story.
2. mention macs, mentioning that you're a new convert is a good way of doing this.
3. mention ogg.
4. mention 'new update', don't bother to mention WHERE you did get this 'update' or what you were smoking.
5. PRO.. err. dunno, slash fame. put some pron on your journal, maybe somebody reads it.
slashdot xmas math: ogg + mac + update - sense = INTRESTING.
world was created 5 seconds before this post as it is.
This article is a bit mistaken. The most recent software update offered by Apple is the the OS X 10.2.3 Update on 2002-12-19. This is information directly from the Apple website.
.mpg, .mov, .wav, even .avi and .ogg files with the proper codec will play back in iTunes if they are added to a playlist. I have a couple movie trailers thrown into my playlist...they play back just like audio only tracks. This post is the case of someone feeling clever for discovering a feature in his software.
What the poster discovered is that iTunes uses quicktime to decode MP3s. That's no secret. iTunes can actually play back anything that quicktime can read, so
What would be news is if the iPod's more hardware based decoding gained support for more formats. That is the one that Apple has announced no development for.
My Karma is so good, I'm the Dalai Lama...or something.
You're right! Whoever says that "The Last Supper" is a masterpiece or that Leonardo da Vinci was a giant in the history of art is a RACIST!
Although it sounds like this acticle as actually bunk, if iPod supported ogg, they'd pick me up as a customer pretty damn fast.
-- Note: If you don't agree with me, don't bother replying. I won't read it.
It's kinda like the witch scene in The Holy Grail...she weighs more than a duck...so therefore...............A WITCH! A WITCH! A WITCH! A WITCH!
cat
Take the OGG listening challenge and come back later with an opinion.
Revolutions are never about freedom or justice. They're about who's going to be top dog. -- Kilgore Trout
funny that you choose the analogy "That's like switching from a BMW or a Mercedes to a horse-drawn cart without the horse. " considering that free software IS the horse for OS X.
It really depends on the bitrate. I am an audiophile, and I think I have quite sensitive ears, I beleive. However, at mid-level and beyond bitrates (i.e, 192-256 for mp3), I can't hear a difference between ogg's and LAME or new Fraunhofer-ripped mp3s.
Also, most times, I get comparable filesizes between OGG and mp3-vbr encoding. mp3-cbr is pretty much a waste of time (read some of r3mix's articles).
However, the main advantage to ogg's is that they have no patents attached.
This works, it's true. If the file isn't an mp3 or an AIFF or some other format that it recognizes itself, it falls through and relies on Quicktime to play the file. It's a bit of a hack.. There are of course a couple caveats. First, understand that you can't encode into OGG format from iTunes. Secondly, the sound data isn't analyzed and passed onto the visual plugins, so your visuals won't work in Quicktime mode. You probably don't care about that though...
> Edo is short for Edoardo (Edward)
:)
Actually, my name is just "Edo". Short for er... nothing.
Sentimentality is merely the Bank Holiday of cynicism.
- Oscar Wilde
...and it sounds better than itunes to boot. ogg files work just fine in audion out of the box and visualizations actually work.
couple that with the fact that you can create a playlist with folders and you've got yourself an itunes killer.
www.panic.com/audion
Sorry folks as someone cleverly put it... I'm on crack (or should I say christmas food overdose ;-) /. hordes! ;-)...
I'm quite ashamed of myself, apparently Macs induce an automatic mental regression in whoever uses them. So, here's how it goes: this morning the updater boasts a new download for iTunes (3.0.1) and having done the 10.2.3 just yesterday I expected it to be a new one (it isn't, after two shots it's still there the darn thing... a bug) Then I proceeded to my heap of *.ogg files taken from my linux box hoping for some way to batch process them back to mp3 and the thing worked! Ha, bitten by the old temporal sequentialityvs. caulaity brain hack, I've made a glorious fool of myself before the
Actually I did post an email begging to trash the post but nobody did anything about it (after all it's cristmas... peaople do have a family
Bye, bye... karma
Mi domando chi à il mandante di tutte le cazzate che faccio - Altan
Your point is right, but your reason is wrong. Gist for the parent poster? Get a life! Sorry, but it's true.
"Ogg" is worse than the clap, but the clap is better than "The GIMP."
People in a position to adopt free software can be classified by their response to a supposed Photoshop-killer called The GIMP: Older ones, who say "So this software, it walks with a severe limp?" and younger ones who think of Pulp Fiction and giggle.
Does anyone have a list compiled of what MP3 players do support *.ogg? If so, that would be a very informative list.
*cough*
:-)
The Empire Strikes Back was good. A New Hope was okay. Return of the Jedi was at least watchable. Alas, the new ones are truly awful - your time would be better spent the time better watching Blake's 7 reruns
Pretend that something especially witty is here. Thanks.
mac is true command line.....mac os x that is....so learn before you comment
Ogg support would mean out-of-the-box import and export support in Ogg format. And that is still missing from iTunes as far as I can tell.
Yeah, 'cause Steve Jobs thinks it's too confusing to have a three-fingered salute. (Read: People are too stupid.)
(For the record, every Mac I own has at least a three button + wheel mouse. I wouldn't have it any other way.)
My English teacher once told me that two positives don't make a negative. Two words for her: Yeah, right.
Apple does not support the Ogg Vorbis format in iTunes. There is a QuickTime component available that will enable you to play Vorbis files in iTunes, but due to it being a QuickTime hack (as opposed to format support within the application itself), certain things do not work as expected, and OS X will not properly associate Ogg Vorbis files as 'iTunes-compatible.'
So, there's the straight dope. I'm sorry if people are confused and irritated about this; We didn't submit this story.
If you do need help playing Vorbis files, please drop in on #vorbis on irc.xiph.org; Our crack team of off-topic ranters and audio illuminati are standing by 24/7, even during this busy holiday season. :)
As a side note, we're hacking like crazy this week! Want to help out? Stop by the IRC server and join #xiphtech for a quick run-down. Thanks!
Emmett Plant
CEO, Xiph.org Foundation
The reason being - as someone stated earlier - who knows about this thing really being patent free - sorta like the whole .gif thing with IBM/Unisys........im not saying its not - but who knows and apple probably isnt willing to do all the legal work just to find out that it could be held accountable for something so they just wasted money having their lawyers do the leg work not only that - it is probably not what apple wants - another buzz word for "normal people" not to understand. I do wonder where the ogg quicktime componet came from tho'
7. Profit!
...we get quicktime codecs for Windows Media player!
If Google really cared they would fix Android Chrome to reflow text, instead of discriminating
What crack have you been smoking lately? XMMS is GPL'd and ogg vorbis is BSD'd, they are compatible and ogg vorbis support is directly included in XMMS (I have version 1.2.7 here). Old versions of xmms needed a plugin (iirc) but that was long ago while ogg vorbis was still in alpha or beta.
I don't know how a player can be unable to play Ogg-Vorbis due to license problems if the libraries are BSD'd.
A quick look at their contact page at http://www.apple.com/contact suggests a few possibilities, such as their Apple.com feedback page or sending email to their Quicktime Feedback address, quicktime@apple.com. Or both. Perhaps there's a better way, hopefully someone here will post it.
Whining would be worthless. Polite letters asking Apple to please support Ogg Vorbis across their product line (especially product A, B, and C) would probably be read. If you currently use their product (and would pay for an upgrade that supported Ogg Vorbis), or have decided to NOT buy one of their products because it doesn't support Ogg Vorbis, say so - that will be more likely to get their attention.
I've already let Apple know. If you want Apple to support Ogg Vorbis, you should too.
- David A. Wheeler (see my Secure Programming HOWTO)
I've seen this question raised a number of times. Why do you want to do this? As stated in other posts, you can't increase the quality by doing this (It's the "you can't get blood from a rock" principle). Is it because you prefer a certain player that doesn't support MP3?
Personally I had the opposite problem. I enjoy using MPG321 as a jukebox, and had 90% mp3s in my collection, 10% ogg. Naturally I wanted a single interface to the whole collection, so I hacked mpg321 to play (and randomize) ogg as well as MP3. Finding (or hacking) a player that treats both formats equally gives you the advantages the conversion you propose without the quality loss.
Just take one of the many LAME mp3 scripts for iTunes and edit it to use the OGG encoder instead! It launches the terminal, but I like the LAME codec more than the Fraunhoffer one, so I deal.
please forgive me if i mumble this incorrectly or something, but doesnt ogg/vorbis playback require a processor that supports floating point calculations? something that most mp3 players don't have...unless the ipod has one :/ not sure...
:) i would love to see more formats supported by the ipod
something to shoot for tho
i read through the comments and came up with this on one of the previous comments...looks like ogg/vorbis acutally can be supported on non-floating point processors - http://www.xiph.org/ogg/vorbis/hardware.html
:)
and it also says frontierlabs possibly will implement that into their mp3 players...which i own
That really wasn't the question though, was it? Pointing out that most ogg players also handle mp3 doesn't help someone looking to play ogg rather than mp3. Now, if your contention was that there weren't very many mp3 players that don't also play ogg it might have been considered helpful information.
--
As a matter of fact, I am a lawyer. But I play an actor on TV.
One day I happened to plug the iPod into the actual charger, rather than my G4. Ever since, the battery has been working flawlessly. I have no idea if the charger really works differently or not, but it certainly seemed to.
Don't know if it's what the poster was originally talking about, but this went past the pages of freshmeat's new OS X section mentioned on /. a few days ago.
--
erm...sorry
what WAS i smoking?