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Low Profile Satellite TV Antennas for Vehicles
Brian Mattis writes "CNN is reporting a new antenna system that allows SUV's, minivans and cars to receive DirecTV video and audio programming on the road. Future plans call for internet access as well. This could be a nail in the coffin of Sirius and XM radio."
In-Car-Internet + 802.11b = mobile open wifi ap's
Think of all the (commercial free) streaming audio channels that you could listen to instead of the crappy radio stations that exist right now.
So, in addition to cell phones, people will also be watching 'Sex In the City' while driving? Yike.
Yes!! I can now live in my car!!
Internet, TV, Sleep
Please no. Cell phones are bad enough. All we need is some blonde in an SUV causing a 200 car pile up on I5 because she was watching Martha Stewart Living and talking on her cell phone while doing her make up at 80mph.
From the article: "KVH's system will be marketed to current DirecTV subscribers, and sold through consumer electronics retailers. The antenna system will cost roughly $2,000 to $2,500, and the satellite programming will be less than $10 a month."
I can't see this as being an XM/Sirius Radio killer until the price for the gear lowers quite a bit. Folks in the market for digital radio aren't the same as digital TV+Radio+DirectTV subscription.
This reminds me of Jetblue - the airliner that has inflight DirecTV in every seat. Anyone else see DirecTV having a monopoly?
[sig]www.masterslate.org[/sig]
Now if they just add in car black boxes and a two way feature, you can have the local news programs doing up to the moment reports on drives who crash while watching the local news programs on drivers who crash while watching the local news programs on drivers who.....
Those ludites may have had a point.
I can just see the freeway pileup that would happen when the administrator of the first ever movile webserver gets slashdotted.
This is nothing new, tracking dishes are available at any RV dealer. They only work on the interstate, when the turns and the position change are gradual. Go around a 90 degree turn and the dish can't track fast enough. They suck.
Got Sirius, not interested.
As far as what I want to listen to while I drive, Sirius has it all, except the Yankees.
2 NPR stations, BBC, World Radio Network, Public Radio International, C-SPAN (which carries the network's sunday morning talk shows), CNBC, CNN, Bloomberg, and more.
When I want to hear music there are 60 commercial free stations. Then there are about 20 entertainment channels. And TechTV is coming!!
I couldn't be happier with it.
Um, how? I was under the impression that satellite radio offered audio-only programming.
First of all, most people who have TVs in vehicles have them for either a DVD player or a VCR. Sticking a movie in is going to keep the kids quiet for at least 90 minutes. Getting satellite TV only going to keep them quiet for 30 minutes at a time and encourage channel-surfing, which will drive the parents nuts.
Satellite radio offers the same audio channels and programming coast-to-coast; fewer (or zero) commercials, and entertainment you can enjoy without having to take your eyes off the road.
Don't get me wrong - I think satellite radio will crash and burn, but DirecTV for vehicles certainly won't be the death of it...
There is no sig, there is only Zuul.
"This could be a nail in the coffin of Sirius and XM radio"
Just like car-mounted UHF/VHF antennae drove the final nail in the coffin of FM radio?
Apples and oranges.
.. real time traffic reports.
Live web cams
It sounds bad, in that it might cause accidents, but it may in effect encourage carpooling. If folks had a wide array of entertainment options on their trips, this may actually encourage more responsible commuting.
---
When you come to a fork in the road, take it! --Yogi Berra--
In california, I commute via Light Rail (Train). Now if you put one of these on train, and make it data enabled, everyone will be able to connect to the internet.
That could a good for the environment, as more people will like to travel on trains with internet connectivity.....
Consensus is good, but informed dictatorship is better
This could be a nail in the coffin of Sirius and XM radio.
Except that XM Radio has a nice thing in their music that DirectTV lacks in theirs.....really good programming. The stations and variety on XM are amazing. Fred and Ethel RULE. Throw in a little jazz, blues, all the classical, comedy and the 80s channels and you have a stunning group of stations. I traveled cross country in my truck with it 2 months ago and didn't hear the same song twice nor did I listen to a single CD.
BTW, Heidi Selexa, one of the DJs from the 80s channel is great!
I'm a Skylife satellite subscriber, here in South Korea, and the company has recently offered their service [site not in English] for those that wish to receive TV and music programming in the cars/vans, etc. Costs/fees work out to approx. US$500.00 per year.
I've seen the installs, and while I'd like to have one myself, the external receiver unit is rather large at this time, and I'll wait for something less bulky. With the amount of time spent sitting in traffic here, this would be a welcome break. It's about the size of a 12" tire/wheel, and looks a bit out of place sitting on the roof or trunk of the average car.
for 10$ a month getting tv programming to thier cars, when it costs 100$+ a month for that same tv programming to thier house.
i know the equipment for the car has to factor into that lower rate, but still... i would feel cheated if i was a customer paying for thier service to my house.
It's not uncommon for U.S. Navy ships to use these. The crew chips in and buys the dish and subscription. They scrounge up a junked tracking system from some obsolete system that's been thrown away Put them together and they have T.V. at sea. A big moral builder. Particularly during the play-offs.
...allows SUV's, minivans and cars to receive DirecTV...
Am I the only one who found this enumeration a bit odd? I mean, why not just say "vehicle"?
autopr0n is like, down and stuff.
Has anyone posting about the death of satellite radio actually listened to it? As a subscriber of XM, and a very happy one at that, I thought I'd chime in.
Advantages of satellite radio over DirecTV (and/or Dish Network) radio stations.
- Satellite radio can afford more bandwidth just to the music than DirecTV, resulting in a better reception.
- Satellite radio doesn't use a directional dish. I'm in an office building and pick up XM at work just fine.
- XM has DJs. You can call in and request stuff. It's personalized, and they actually know music. It's not a playlist of 200 songs on random.
- Audio stations on satellite TV are provided by a third party. They're generic, just a rotating plyalist.
I'm not convinced those that knock satellite radio have ever heard the depth of the musical library that is available to the listeners. No way is satellite TV going to put in the time or effort to develop that kind of library or personalize it for those that are listening.
DirecTV in the car isn't going to kill satellite radio. Anyone who has listened to stations on XM and the music stations on DirecTV or Dish Network will tell you that.
For a good example of the musical depth on XM, go to fred.xmradio.com and checkout the 2002 Fred Essentials. Listeners voted on the 2002 top classic alternative songs of all-time. They're "playlist" is over 5000 thanks too all of the listener input.
I've had XM since November of 2001.
So, depending on the size of this wonder, and any power requirements, I might actually be able to realize a unit that I can take with me in places other than my car.
I like to have a handheld TV at sports events to watch replays and analysis as it's broadcast, especially since I often get stuck with crappy endzone seating (no, I won't pay for better). So once the price on this comes down a bit, it shouldn't be too hard to wire it up some of my existing gear and make a unit.
All that's needed are my Sony Glasstrons, my DirecTV boards (repackaged in slim form), this antenna, and a power supply that can last 3 hours. I can't wait! Don't worry, once I build the thing I'll blog it up and submit it, and CmdrTaco won't post it. But you'll get to see it eventually.
Friends help you move. Real friends help you move bodies.
Where do I send the cheque??? It promises to "put an end to back-seat bickering among grumpy siblings during long family car trips". I don't care how it works or how much it costs I want it...
The man in black fled across the desert, and the gunslinger followed (SK)
Am I the only one who found this enumeration a bit odd? I mean, why not just say "vehicle"?
Vans: Vans are probably close enough to minivans that the submitter didn't think it necessary to bother mentioning them.
Trucks: It may be harder to mount such an antenna on top of a pickup truck.
Buses: Buses are commercial vehicles and need a "public performance" license for the copyrighted shows.
Mopeds: Don't even think about it.
Will I retire or break 10K?
(same rant, circa 1940)
0 1 - just my two bits
doesn't need to come from this. they have over 320k subscribers and continue to bleed cash. 12 months to live, i'm willing to bet.
that will decrease auto related fatalities. /sarcasm
...this is really cool except for the price! 2500 clams?!? say WHUT? huh?
I've had TV in my vehicles (all vans or RV's) since the early 80's, it's cool. Think I'll pass on phased array tv until it doesn't phase my wallet as much. I have a crank up and crank down swivel antenna now on our RV, works ok. If over the air don't work, pop in a tape. If that don't work, I got 4 other radios to choose from, 3 of them transceivers. If that don't work for "entertainments" I'll park and chase the ole lady around.
heh
A company named Winegard already makes products like this. Check out their mobile dish units.
cheers
Intercarve Networks, LLC
First I have to deal with idiots dialing their cell phone, no someone watching the playboy channel?
Tracking sattelite dishes have been very popular on boats. The only problem is the expense -- lately, they're down to about $3000, but until the last couple of years they cost several times that. Maybe this will pave the way for cheap marine units, and cheap internet access for boats.
There's nothing like programming from a quiet cove in British Columbia -- but I still have to go into a marina to pick up my email.
What I want is a low-profile radio telescope for my car, so I can search for signs of intelligent life while commuting to work. (God knows it's tough to find intelligent life on the freeway ....)
-kgj
Approx. US$#500.00 will get you equipment, installed, and service, for one year. Available now. I use Skylife at home now, and when they include Internet, I'm down w/the mobile receiver.
As usual in the US, the [communications] consumer is being taken for a ride.
YOUR PHONE CALLS YOU WHEN DRIVING. No really.
Since last year one is only allowed to make phone calls when driving if one has a handsfree set installed.
I hate it, but it makes sense. Yet they have to stop al those @#$%^&'s from calling when cycling around town on their their bikes:
'Wait a minute, gotta switch to my right hand. What? Yeah... Yep. I'm turning left, wha'
C R A S H!!!
giel.y contains 2 shift/reduce conflicts
ClearChannel, Fox, Premier, and every other major radio distribution channel on speed dial. Heck maybe even Pacifica. If this goes down, I could see syndicated radio programs (I wont mention any by name because it will just turn into a dumn flame war, it always does) making their way onto DirecTV audio channels. Perhaps even in a way that they are only available to "mobile" subscribers who pay a premium for that service.
Actually... TechTV on Sirius is kinda aborted...
What Sirius wanted TechTV for TechLive, it's 9-hour all day tech news and tech stock coverage program. Well, one market crash later that idea didn't look so smart, and TechLive is now the name of a 30-minute primetime magazine show.
With the dramatic shift in programming diet, and the fact that TechTV doesn't own the radio rights to content it doesn't produce, I think all you can really expect is to find the audio half of Call for Help and The Screen Savers on a talk station eventually.
...those of us who don't have a back seat.
Bloody discrimination!
Eloi, Eloi, lema sabachtani?
www.fogbound.net
aside from the channels randomly going in and out, the ones that come through are most all thoroughly boring, unless your thing is sports ... several channels of sports.
... showing a bunch of network TV with the aspect ratio wrong, since they've stretched it sideways to fill those screens. At least the sound's not on.
Jet Blue is so TV-identified that they have a bunch of large flatscreens above the checkin counters in their JFK terminal
At least when we run out of oil we can park our jets and SUVs and watch TV. In Germany after midnight there's a channel with nothing but the view from the front of a car driving; another channel with the same from a train. Somebody better sign up the American rights.
"with their freedom lost all virtue lose" - Milton
Maybe I'm missing something here, but from advertisements I've seen I was led to believe that Direct TV now requires the user to hook up every box to a land line telephone line. My guess was that they were doing this to thwart the .001% of people who might locate a second box at a second location (like a relative's house) on a different dish and share the connection. So if I have a nice flat K-band dish for my car and receiver, what the hell good does it do me if I have to have the receiver hooked up to a landline?
I'm an American. I love this country and the freedoms that we used to have.
OK, so let's see. DirecTV costs approximately $30 a month for a package that will get you the 36 (or so) audio channels that they have. Not counting any hardware costs. XM costs $10 a month for 101 audio channels, with a much better variety than DirecTV or Dish's package, as far as I've seen.
XM has numerous pieces of hardware out on the market, both headunits and addon receivers. XM's hardware is already included in many vehicles from the factory. DirecTV has nothing in the way of dedicated audio hardware for vehicles, and very little in the way of selection or integration for their video hardware.
XM has land based repeaters, so that you can get a signal when your LOS to the satellite is blocked (for instance, within most cities). DirecTV has nothing of the sort.
And most importantly, GM owns Hughes, which owns DirecTV, and has a huge stake in XM. I really don't think DirecTV is going to go after XM's business.
-Todd
"The details of my life are quite inconsequential..."
--what you want(more or less) exists, check the freqs and specs out
c r3 main.html
http://www.icomamerica.com/receivers/handheld/i
if you are rich and buy two, please send me one....
right now all I got like this is an old b/w watchman I picked up for 8$ used. works OK, but this icom unit, well, you get what ya pay for
XM has had most of its nails in from the beginning. Many companies have been succesful in monopolizing on something they could easily be the only to give away. But, XM fails to realize two things.
1) The majority of customers don't see enough worth in the difference between their product and regular AM/FM radio to be a good option.
2) Building off a public network like radio doesn't work all that well when the current model has been carved into our brains.
Once internet access is more common in vehicals, its only a matter of time before internet transmitted radio with location specific spliced advertisements is the norm. I welcome the change.
Question
http://www.ironfroggy.com/
A few thousand dollars vs a few hundred...who's going to win that battle?
I just bought an XM radio system...the Delphi SKYFi system with the portable boombox dock. I must say, it is the best $129.99 + $99.99 I have ever spent. $9.99/month is not much to ask for all the channels you get...especially because I'm a techno/dance freak and the hick town I live in has barely seen a paved road since the days of Henry Ford, let alone music that can be made with something other than a jaw harp and a banjo.
What kind of monthly charges are going to be incurred by someone with one of these new in-car dish systems? I spend enough money on my service at home, let alone pay more to have it in my car. Hell, an extra receiver in your home costs about $10.00 more a month.
Furthermore, if you are in your vehicle so long that you need the entertainment of television over radio, you probably have no business being distracted that much in the first place while on the road...everyone knows lengthy driving is one of the most mentally exhausting things a person can do...you honestly want to make it worse by watching TV at the same time? And don't tell me that you will just be "listening" to it...that's a flat out lie. If that's all you really wanted to do, you'd stick with a radio.
What happened to the days of practical inventions...these days we just seem to be getting off-the-wall, frivolous money-wasters that are worth less than the paper some talentless hack looking to make a dollar scrawls them out on.
In conclusion, this idea seems about as constructive for the modern driver as the drive up liquor store...and will probably be just as dangerous.
END OF RANT
A lot of people have mentioned that DVD-players come with a display-kill setup which will kill the video when driving (although it's easy to disable). Another thing that might be worth mentioning is that a lot of the screens I've seen for DVD, TV, etc in a vehicle are ceiling-mounted and tilted so that only the back and passenger seats can see it properly. There might still be a peripheral-vision distraction though, but it looked like the driver could not at least directly view the screen.
My 2nd box only costs me $4.99 a month, how is this different?
Putting moderation advice in your
This thing is gonna be a godsend for truckers.
When I started working for the company I work for, 8 years ago, a person approached me, and mentioned "I work for a company that designed a DirecTV dish that automatically tracks the satellite while you're moving. You mount it on your RV or camper, and it just follows along."
At that point, the price was $3k.
Old News.
"Champagne for my real friends - and real pain for my sham friends!" http://ericblade.postalboard.com/
Stuff like this will put alot more nails in alot more coffins then 2 satilite radio companies. When people are driving, they need to be DRIVING, With their eyes on the road, not watching the damned TV. And people will, and people will die because of it. The thing with Cellphones is that they only take your mind and an ear to use, but do not require you to stop watching the road less your dialing and don't know where the hell the numbers on the keypad are. What is going to happen here is the same damned thing that happenes at home. Some people will be watching the TV, and something really interesting will come on, and you will be not watching it and doing something else, and everyone will start laughing or something and you Look Over. The only difference is here, your in control of something moving very fast. That's not the problem though, if the fucking idiot who had a TV put in that they could see dies and so does their family, that's not a problem, there are too many people out there anyways. The problem is when he does this surrounded by other people and OTHER people suffer from that fuckers mistake.
(Score:0, Interesting)
I know the very basics of a phased-array antenna: you've got a bunch of little antennas, and you combine their signals by matching the phase delay from the feed line for each one.
But how do you aim them in the case of a mobile unit like this? The only other phased-array DBS antenna I've seen requires you to point the whole thing.
Also, DirecWay uses linear polarization (vs. circular polarization for DBS). How is that handled? (ie, you've got to deal with not only azimuth and elevation, but also skew angle.)
How many people are going to pay $2500? How many want to watch TV in their cars?? How many people want only 50 DirecTV muzak stations without DJ's and dedicated stuff that XM and Sirius provide???
Jumping the gun a bit, nostradamus.
If you don't want to pay the monthly fees, why not get an MP3 player? The CDR MP3 players aren't much more expensive than a good CD head unit, and you can fit 10 hours of 128K MP3s (which sound just as good as a CD in a moving car, and much better than FM) on a CD-R. A few CDs would tide you over for even the longest road trip. And whenever you get bored with your current selections, just hit KaZaa^W^W err...legally purchase more music and make some new ones. The only think you might not like is the lack of talk radio, but personally, I consider that a huge plus. (Have you ever tried to find a radio station that plays music 24/7 in Central FL? There must be some sort of state law that says radio stations can only play idiotic blathering "talk shows" between 8AM and noon, and those lame "My Sex Life Sucks So I'll Call The Radio Station And Whine About It" shows after midnight. ;-D )
My JVC was the best $300 I ever spent. I haven't had to listen to an annoying radio ad or loudmouthed DJ for months.
DennyK
They make a DataScope which is a monocular witha digital range finder and compass built in. Its sort of like the device luke was using when he got hit over the head. I've wanted one to help line of the pringles cans
In a few years, I can hack from my limo (babes in the back), using encrypted links, no one can find me, no one can stop me, I can get in anywhere...
BWHAHAHAHAHAHAH....
Oh, wait...
Sorry, thought I was posting to Phrack...
Richard Steven Hack - This sig is TOO GODDAMN SHORT TO DO ANYTHING USEFUL WITH! MORONS!
I first saw this some 15 years ago in a NASA TechBriefs article. It's been 15 years in the making before someone could propose making a commercially viable product.
After a brief conversation with a Radio Guru in my workplace it was concluded that this is going to be very expensive and with the existing infrastructure of cellular and land-line already inplace, not likely to be adapted as a general use product.
It might be useful for streaming data one way, but it won't do well with two way communications because of the economics of having all your users in dense areas. Even with one way data streaming it's a bit pricey. A better cellular network would kill this in a heartbeat
Christ, enough with the incompetent moderating. Please, let's take the points away from these uptight, trigger-happy douchebags already.
So long, michael. Don't let the door hit you...
Once again, JPawloski plagiarizes a post. The parent post is a copy of this post. Note that the linked post was made about two hours before the parent.
If you want to moderate the comment, please mod the parent post down and the original post up.
Pardon my lack of knowledge of phased-array antenna technology, but does such a system now eliminate the requirement of a clear-facing southern view to get DirecTV access?
There are lots of people I know in lots of places (i.e. apartments) where they'd _love_ to get DirecTV and dump the cable monopoly, but simply can't because either their apartment faces the wrong direction, the landlord won't let them put a dish on the room, the building has a contract with another cable company, etc, etc.
I'm lucky because my apartment faces south-west, so I'm the envy among my TV-watching friends in that I can actually get DirecTV in Manhattan, but there are plenty of folks who aren't so lucky.
So does this mean more access to DirecTV?
nlh
Ferrari and other exotic car rentals in New York
...or rather, for apartment use. When you live in a "community" that has rules restricting your ability to mount anything on the walls or roof, and you don't want to put anything down at ground level because someone might walk by and steal it, it's rather hard to get set up for satellite tv, unless you want to do the sackcrete-box-and-pole route, which isn't always sturdy, can still be a pain to set up, etc.
An omnidirectional flat antenna wouldn't attract nearly as much attention, is easier to place, and I suspect that you could probably stick it in a window if you didn't have a balcony or anything outside with line-of-sight to the satellites.
Get off my launchpad!