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Free Software as a Public Good

acone asks: "Have any national governments taken measures to subsidize open source projects? I'm aware that many have endorsed Linux in particular, and free software in general, but I was wondering about actual funding. I ask because the notion of a good built and maintained by the community almost inevitably suggests that such be treated as a public good. Many of the public goods we now take for granted--such as police, public libraries, and public fire departments--were historically provided either by private enterprises or by loosely-organized volunteers, neither of which have proven nearly as effectively for the common goods as their current government-run equivalents. An excellent example is the organization of the police force, libraries and fire department in colonial Philadelphia, in which these services became established in a very grassroots manner, then gradually gained acceptance as something that the state should provide. This pattern looks temptingly applicable to free software. In addition to the current, community-based mechanisms in which free software is developed, wouldn't it be beneficial to have dedicated groups of professional free software developers, paid by national governments to serve the overall interests of society? Seems to me like such would be a Good Thing."

77 of 445 comments (clear)

  1. SkoleLinux (School Linux) by nordicfrost · · Score: 5, Interesting

    School Linux has recieved a grand from the Norwegian educational ministery. The grant was for USD 27,673.81 and funded a fundamental research into the feasibility of Linux in schools.

    1. Re:SkoleLinux (School Linux) by nordicfrost · · Score: 4, Informative

      A link could be useful... Sorry!

  2. There won't be some "Office of Open Source" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Interesting

    But you will see various governments writing or commissioning code for their own needs. The important thing is to get that code licensed appropriately (BSD or GPL or whatever your particular views are) so that the populace can use it freely.

    1. Re:There won't be some "Office of Open Source" by agentZ · · Score: 3, Informative

      This isn't a worry in the United States. According to 17 USC 105, works of the US Government are not eligible for copyright protection.

      Thus, all of the code written by government employees for government business, if released to the public, is public domain.

      For example, check out my computer forensic tools: md5deep and foremost. Your tax dollars at work!

  3. KDE and Germany by Nick+of+NSTime · · Score: 3, Informative

    I remember reading something a year or so ago about the German government subsidizing KDE development. I may be wrong on that.

    1. Re:KDE and Germany by cabalamat2 · · Score: 4, Informative

      The German government is funding open source email encryption software under project Aegypten. Some of this is KDE software, for example work on the kmail mail client.

      See Project Aegypten Home Page for details.

    2. Re:KDE and Germany by phoenix_rizzen · · Score: 3, Informative

      Yeppers, that would be for the Kroupware project, which includes the Kolab server, Kolab client (KMail + KDEPIM integrated together), and other related projects. The funding was to create an Exchange Server replacement.

  4. Someone's been reading Lessig... by madMingusMax · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Haven't they? And for good reason, this is basically what a good portion of his book "The Future of Ideas" is about....that is, a commons for everyone which enriches society, and how corporations are taking it over to the detriment of society in general. Read this book.

    --
    Don't be a zoa (zealous overbearing ass), be happy!
  5. One of these things is not like the other.... by DerekLyons · · Score: 2, Insightful

    It seems to me that the very idea of paying someone to write free software is the very antithesis of what free software is all about. (Not to mention the practical problems of managing the stable of programmers, ensuring that work actually gets done etc...)

    Far better would be something like the Ford Foundation giving grants to folks after they have a track record.

    1. Re:One of these things is not like the other.... by proj_2501 · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Not so!

      The FSF got its start by selling tapes of the Emacs source code and precompiled binaries! You could also get GCC+binutils+stuff tapes and X11R4 stuff.

      They were $150+ a pop for a while.

  6. Government Subsidy by Egonis · · Score: 2, Informative

    I am in the process of obtaining a government subsidy for the development of a Client Management System for Youth Shelters in Ontario... things are looking good, very good.

    So yes, if you present your plan to the Canadian Government, anyway, in good terms, showing that it will benefit all; it is easy to obtain a subsidy.

  7. Government funding by KillerHamster · · Score: 4, Interesting

    I'd be happy to take their money, it's their influence I don't want. As I see it, part of the freedom associated with free software is freedom from corporate or government bureaucracy deciding what goes into the software. I doubt most governments would agree to sponsor something if they could not exercise tight control over it.

    1. Re:Government funding by eggnet · · Score: 2, Insightful

      And the difference between that and private funding is?

      Everyone has an agenda.

    2. Re:Government funding by drfireman · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Government influence over software isn't likely to work by government heavies leaning on you to make your software do this or that. It's much more likely to work by the government deciding to fund the people who do what they want, and not to fund others. If what you want to do isn't in line with what the government wants, you probably weren't going to get funded anyway. If it is, it's hard to imagine the government investing heavily in micro-managing your project.

    3. Re:Government funding by Traxman · · Score: 3, Insightful

      I agree that the development process would be tainted by the influence of goverment money. However, if the software is truly open sourced, how much influence could they have over it? True, those that took the money could be influenced, but anyone could contribute.

      I would go so far as to argue that the freedom from corporate and goverment influence is one of the most essential notions surrounding the development of free software. Although, if a government is willing to concede that open code is of higher quality and more secure than its closed source counterpart, then they really couldn't exert much influence on the development. The inefficiencies that would result from their meddling would be out in public for all to see.

      Its an interesting concept, which definately deserves more attention.

      Traxman

    4. Re:Government funding by El+Cubano · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I doubt most governments would agree to sponsor something if they could not exercise tight control over it.

      Aparently you've never heard of DARPA and this little thing called the internet. Yes, the government usually funds things that are in its best interest. However, agencies like DARPA have historically funded very long range visionary and exploratory research.

      It is difficult for the government to have tight control over something like that.

  8. Maybe... by r00zky · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Have any national governments taken measures to subsidize open source projects?

    China?
    Don't know for sure, but it would be a clear candidate to subsidize

    Another case is Germany paying for that KDE project... how was it kalled? Kroupware? But that's not subsidizing...

    --
    I'm a chainsmokin' alcoholic sociopath, so-ci-o-path
  9. DARPA by Megaslow · · Score: 2, Informative

    Was funding OpenBSD and OpenSSL, for a little while until they changed their minds

  10. Business by Quill_28 · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Yes, software companies love to pay taxes and then the money used to create software to drive them out of business.

    On the other hand, I do think it can be used for to help society in general.
    But I feel it should be written under BSD-like(public domain) license, putting under a GPL-like license is just wrong for this situation.

  11. America's Army game? by Thinkit3 · · Score: 2, Informative

    That's what America's Army game essentially does now. Try it out, it's a great example of government making software that is freely copyable (read the license).

    --
    -Libertarian secular transhumanist
  12. G-Men and OSS by luzrek · · Score: 2, Interesting
    I'm wondering what the mechanism would be for government support. About the only thing that I can think of would be something equivalent to the way the government funds art. AKA small grants to private individuals.

    Basically I would worry that if a burocracy was added to the development process, it would end up mucking the development process up.

    However, I'm pretty sure that some OSS softwares are directly descended from various government projects that were developed under the GPL or made open source after completion. (can someone help me with examples, or tell me I'm wrong).

    --

    Galium Arsenide is the material of the future, and always will be.

  13. Who funded BSD? TCP/IP? by brentlaminack · · Score: 5, Informative

    Check your history. Guess who funded most of the BSD development? Right. The US Government. Who funded development of TCP/IP? Right again. Are these open source? Yes. Were they funded by Government for the Common Good? Yes. This is nothing new. This has been going on for a couple of decades now.

    1. Re:Who funded BSD? TCP/IP? by Jungle+guy · · Score: 4, Interesting
      Very good point. It is also intersting to note that BSD and TCP/IP can be used by private companies any way they want (like, putting it on free software or on a proprietary software). An interesting point would be: shuold government fund GPL-licensed software? Only OSS software companies may benefit from it. Microsoft oposes it strongly, but professor Lessig thinks this kind of funding is OK, as governmenta also funds proprietary software and software patents, that can't be used on OOS.

      One day, though, governments might find interesting to fund software that are essential to the internet (like, servers and clients for DNS, http, e-mail, etc).

    2. Re:Who funded BSD? TCP/IP? by Mr.+McGibby · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Government funded projects should use BSD style licenses. All of them. Everything the government creates should be available to everyone, regardless of what they want to do with it. "Everyone" paid for it, so "everyone" should be able to use it however they want.

      Sometimes, I don't see why folks complain that MS used some government source code in a product. If they want it to become a standard, then everyone needs to be able to freely integrate it into their systems, including commercial interests.

      --
      Mad Software: Rantings on Developing So
    3. Re:Who funded BSD? TCP/IP? by Strudelkugel · · Score: 2, Informative

      Not sure about which Dept. funded BSD, But TCP was derived from DARPA funding. ICs where driven by the Apollo space program. Browsers, as everyone knows, evolved from efforts at CERN. Like most whiz-bang tech, gov. funding is often at the root.

      BUT, that doesn't mean gov is interested in disseminating tech for commercial purposes. It's highly unlikely NASA and DARPA would have been interested in funding consumer email systems and web browsing, let alone something like AOL or GPUs for gaming.

      OSS discussions have become quite interesting from the perspective of sociology and economics. The role of a fire dept, police dept, etc, are well defined and relatively immutable. This certainly isn't true for software applications! Would the gov have funded DOOM? (Imagine all of the Congressional testimony from the morality types...) Obviously not, but w/o games, I doubt the industry would have invested much money in GPU development.

      Maybe it just been a while since the fall of the Berlin Wall or something, but there is a not-insignificant minority of posters who seem to subscribe to the notion of a socialist Utopia created by OSS. To those who have such views, I offer my opinion that GNU/Linux never would have made it out of Torvalds' and Stallman's minds had it not been for the all of private investment/VC (as in venture Capital, i.e. for profit) money put into the likes of Amazon, Apple, AOL, eBay, Google, IBM, Intel, Microsoft, Red Hat, Sun, TI, Yahoo, etc, which provided the environment in which OSS could get to the point it is today. To lose sight of this is to ignore the lessons of economic history.

      --
      Imagine how much harder physics would be if electrons had feelings! -Feynman, maybe
    4. Re:Who funded BSD? TCP/IP? by Zachary+Kessin · · Score: 2, Interesting

      I think we are going to see more targeted development, so if the government of a country wants all the gnome tools (or KDE or whatever) to work in the local language they will pay someone to do it. Or if some department needs something for some specific need they may pay for it. I think if we want the government (whichever one you are talking about) to fund software the best bet is form a company and compete for their software contracts. If you could convice say the DOJ to use Linux/Gnome on the desktop vs Windows that would very effectivly fund a lot of development. Some of it would be specific to whatever DOJ wanted but most of it would be good for everyone.

      --
      Erlang Developer and podcaster
    5. Re:Who funded BSD? TCP/IP? by k12linux · · Score: 2, Insightful
      Government funded projects should use BSD style licenses. All of them. Everything the government creates should be available to everyone, regardless of what they want to do with it.

      I have to disagree. First, licenses like GPL do not prevent ANYBODY from using the software. They might not be able to take publicly funded GPL software and build it into a product with 900% profit margin, but why exactly do we have to gaurantee them that right. They can choose not to use it because it might require them to GPL their software, but that is their right and thier choice.

      Also, the government builds roads, but that doesn't mean you are allowed to use them to deliver a bomb. Or to drive 95 in a 65 speed zone. Many public goods produced/maintained by the government have restrictions.

      The point of the restrictions is to make sure the use of these things is in the best interest of a majority of the public. Aiding the production of software that is sold to the public at 900% markup doesn't really seem to be in the interest of anyone but the single company selling it.

      I'm certainly not saying all software should be free or that nobody should be able to profit from government funded software. At the same time I fail to see how it is appropriate for software all taxpayers shared the cost of to be sold back to them as part of another product.

  14. Scary thought... Commissioner Bill... by Cephas+Aurelius · · Score: 2, Interesting

    If you examine the parallel to its logical conclusion this is kind of scary. Do you really want to allow political action groups (such as all officers of the Microsoft corporation) the opportunity to affect the election of the Open Source Commissioner? Part of the state-sponsored common good is to put it under the control and regulation of elected officials. This is not a win to my mind...

  15. Code is International... by Popsikle · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Police Forces are national.

    There are some United Forces (UN) but they really arent a major say in what goes on (US war on "Terrorists").
    If governments have thier say, they will think what they choose to write is the right way. Governments of different nations dont always agree (AKA WAR).

    Whats to stop the US government to hire more professional coders to get more of what they want to see in OSS

    Yes OSS has the branches and someone has the overall say in what makes it in and what does not but when was the last time you heard someone disagreeing with the government and not getting some sort of herassment for it (raisethefist.com) ?

    Do you really want to add that much more politics into OSS?
    Do you really want to wait for the government to finish coding something that you need to use (we all know how governement deadlines work!!!) ?
    Just my .02

  16. Re:in short, no by Simon+(S2) · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Public goods need to benefit EVERYONE, not EVERYONE uses linux or open software.

    and not everyone is driving his car on that road, but the gov payed for it. and not everyone is going to the public library, but the gov payed for it, and so on.

    oss is just like a library: free information for everyone.

    --
    I just don't trust anything that bleeds for five days and doesn't die.
  17. the united states by drfireman · · Score: 3, Informative

    The US, through the NIH (Dept. HHS), funds software development projects, some of which are free (GPLed) software projects. NIH funding comes to researchers through a variety of mechanisms, including specific requests for proposals, and often through programs devoted to particular public health related goals. Fundees are often at Universities and sometimes have the freedom to release their software under whatever licenses they choose.

    I don't want to Slashdot the particular office that funds my work, but if you poke around on the NIH web site (www.nih.gov) for informatics-related programs, you can find some good examples of programs that fund software development. If you poke further, you'll find that some of those projects develop GPLed software.

    I don't know that this is the ultimate expression of a government supporting free software as a public good, but it's certainly an area in which you'll find examples of government-funded free software that's designed to promote public health and/or basic science.

  18. Re:Government needs software, too by JordanH · · Score: 2, Insightful
    If the Government develops software, it's public domain since the Government is not allowed to hold copyrights. Sometimes the Government holds software as a state secret, but still cannot hold the copyright.

    This points out a problem with this. The GPL is based on Copyright Law, your right to copy the software is granted under the GPL only if you follow the provisions of the GPL. Since the Government can't hold copyrights, how could the Government fund copyrighted development?

    Now that I type this, I realize the Government CAN fund copyrighted development. They do it all the time. Government contractors often copyright their works and license it to the Government. The Government could let contracts for software requiring that the software be licensed exclusively under the GPL.

  19. Re:in short, no by aducore · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Look at the FAA: They are funded with tax dollars, but a lot of people don't feel safe flying (even before 9/11), and choose not to. That doesn't mean that the FAA should be privatized, it just means that it isn't necessarily going to benefit everybody who pays taxes.

  20. Who Does this Benifit? by jetkust · · Score: 2, Interesting

    So who will benifit from the funding other than open source developers? This will not provide any new software to the public. The same software will be availiable, only more developers will get paid for it.

  21. Re:Good idea but. by TheIzzy · · Score: 2, Insightful
    There actually is organization. Linus has the kernel, developers have the applications, and distributors act as the "editors." Appropriate subdivisions exist in each of these catagories.

    I personally don't see this going anywhere though because it really is a community effort. Almost like voting in a way. If you want a feature, simply "vote" it into an implementation. That can be done by actually programming it or requesting the developers to add it.

    Government employees could work out specific algorithims/implementations (the best example being SE Linux), but the heart of open source is the community, and I don't see that shifting to the government anytime soon. There will always be more community developers than government ones. Small time additions to the open source world is all I see from government institutions. I doubt anything bigger than the SE Linux kernel would happen, especially as the Department of Free Software Production or something.

    Besides, would any government really want to help create the infrastructure of another government for them (e.g. "terrorist" nation uses the USALinux distro)? There's a reason for export restrictions on certain cryptographic algorithms in the US. Or would those nations really trust foreign governments to do this? Might make an electronic war pretty easy if you wrote all the software.

  22. Careful with the term 'public good' by madro · · Score: 4, Interesting
    There are goods and services provided by the government and there are public goods. There's some overlap between the two, but in terms of market-based economics, there's a limited definition of a public good (from http://www.bized.ac.uk/stafsup/exams/revec_mfail.h tm)
    A pure public good is a good or service which is consumed by everyone and from which no-one can be excluded, defence is a good example. It has two characteristics, non-rivalry i.e. one person's consumption of the good does not reduce the amount available for someone else and non-excludability i.e. no-one can be excluded from consumption of the good.

    This brings in the problem of free riders, which is someone who consumes a good or service without paying for it. This problem arises with public goods because why should one person pay when everybody else will contribute to the cost. If everyone took this attitude the good would not be provided hence the need for government intervention.

    Software certainly meets the non-rivalry requirement, but non-excludability is not met given the current legal atmosphere concerning the concept of intellectual property.

    That said, there are cases where introducing excludability means that what used to be public goods can now be provided through market mechanisms: toll roads are not public goods, but universally accessible roads are. Government intervention is required to provide the latter, but (ideally) not the former. The same can be said for private security forces as a replacement for police. You could even slap gates around libraries so that only those who pay can gain access. The debate then turns to what resources *should* have non-excludability -- what goods and services should any person be able to expect from their government?

    Outside that debate, you cannot eliminate non-excludability from certain items: national defense and global climate quality come to mind.
    1. Re:Careful with the term 'public good' by renzop · · Score: 2, Insightful


      it is hard to believe that people in this day and age still cite economics definitions like these as if they were laws of physics. don't believe everything you learn in college. economic laws, unlike physics laws are made by men for men, and above definition is completely arbitrary. you can make laws to restrict or unrestrict non-rivalry and non-excludability, or you can chose not to make such laws. the point is, if there is POLITICAL WILL to say some good such as software SHOULD be non-excludable, then you pass the law and bang, free software is the norm. there is nothing inherent here. it is a CHOICE to exclude something, or NOT to exclude something.

      and by the way, not even physics laws are a give. everyone knows that. its a million times more true for economics.

  23. Public AND Private Funding are both Appropriate by FreeUser · · Score: 5, Insightful

    It seems to me that the very idea of paying someone to write free software is the very antithesis of what free software is all about. (Not to mention the practical problems of managing the stable of programmers, ensuring that work actually gets done etc...)

    Then you don't know much about free software. Free software is about freedom, not price. GNU and the FSF have sold free software since the 1980s, on magnetic tape and later CD ROM. Some of their products were quite pricy (and available for gratis download besides), but they still made some money selling the media, as the convinience was worth it to some.

    Government funded public works is a Good Thing(tm), whether it is highways, the last mile of connectivity (which alas, is privately owned by local monopoly barons in most, but not all, of the US), or basic software infrastructure used to hold and manipulate public data.

    We would never tolerate our highway system being held hostage by a single company. Why on earth would we tolerate such a thing with our public information?

    As for private funding, that is all well and good, but private funding has limitations (such as the profit motive, which works sometimes but, contrary to right-wing myth, does not always work or yeild the best results). Public funding has its limitations as well, but pulling projects that are serving the public interest because of no immediate exploitable profit generally isn't one of them.

    Indeed, the best public goods are those which include both private and public funding, where the limitations of one are generally countered by the strengths of the other. Examples include, but are not limited to, academia and university research.

    --
    The Future of Human Evolution: Autonomy
    1. Re:Public AND Private Funding are both Appropriate by OECD · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Government funded public works is a Good Thing(tm)...

      Government funding is like crack--it's nice at first, but eventually you end up prostituting yourself.

      The Free (beer/freedom) model has worked well so far. Would you really feel better if the government had a bigger hand in it?

      --
      One man's -1 Flamebait is another man's +5 Funny.
    2. Re:Public AND Private Funding are both Appropriate by DerekLyons · · Score: 2, Insightful
      Then you don't know much about free software. Free software is about freedom, not price.
      And where exactly is the freedom on a goverment funded project? Or do you think they will pay for just any ol' program for any purpose?
      We would never tolerate our highway system being held hostage by a single company.
      We tolerate it every day. The company frequently uses it's influence to withold money because the company doesn't like how local folks are behaving. The company also curries favor by building highways and creating jobs where the influence it gains is highest.

      Public funding is a good thing. Pork is not. Neither is using public funding as a carrot to modify behavior.
    3. Re:Public AND Private Funding are both Appropriate by Alsee · · Score: 2

      Because the highway system is essential to interstate commerce

      Software infrastructure can be an enabler of interstate commerce just like interstate roads were. More and more business is being done over the internet. And much internet foundation code was created under the direction of the government. It started out as a DARPA project.

      -

      --
      - - You can't take something off the Internet! That's like trying to take pee out of a swimming pool.
    4. Re:Public AND Private Funding are both Appropriate by urbazewski · · Score: 5, Informative
      Public funding is nearly ALWAYS a bad thing. It distorts the market place and a distorted market place means inefficiently allocated recourses. That's economic 101. It's a BAD THING.

      What's missing from this discussion is a definition of what a public good is:

      ...a public good is essentially a good that is difficult to exclude someone from using, and that one person's use does not deny someone else the use of that good. A public park or clean air are typical examples of public goods. (read this article for typical incorrect definitions of public goods provided by econ 101 students)
      Free software is indeed a public good because by definitoin it is difficult to exclude other people from using it and other than the cost of bandwidth to make the code available my using doesn't prevent anyone else using it. The problem with public goods is that most people want them, but no one has much of an incentive to provide them individually --- which is why public goods are typically provided by the government. Public funding of public goods does not "distort the market" because the non-excludability of public goods means there's not much of a market for them in the first place.

      Anything that can be copied digitally becomes more and more like a public good everyday...

      --
      foldplay your photos won't know what hit them.
  24. If You Think The Private Sector Is Dilbertized... by Tackhead · · Score: 2, Interesting
    If you think working a "day job" at an "big dumb stupid corporation" is oppressive...

    If you think having to fill out forms to requisition a 256M stick of RAM from the IT Department is oppressive...

    If you think having to fill out more forms and get them signed by your manager, the IT manager, and the Purchasing Department's manager, and then wait two days for Purchasing to order the RAM is unproductive and oppressive...

    If you think having to fill out even more forms the next week when you find that the fuckup in Purchasing bought two sticks 256M of PC133 SDRAM (or worse, one stick of 512M DDR instead of two sticks of 256M DDR for your dual-channel workstation), because "You wanted memory, and we found that PC133 was cheaper"... is assinine, counterproductive, and oppressive...

    ...then you, yes, you, have the adventure of a lifetime when it comes to filling out the forms and signing the declarations and attestations associated with applying for a government grant to develop a web browser, e-mail client, spam filter, office suite, regular expression parser, scripting language, or even /bin/true!

    NOTICE: As a condition of receiving a grant under the Patriots' Freedom Software Allowance Act, I affirm, under penalty of perjury that Software developed under the Patriots' Freedom License will in no way be used to transfer data by Specially Designated Nationals, nor any data in violation of the PATRIOT Act, nor will it be used by any third party to facilitate violations of the Communications Decency Act. Software will not be made available to Migrant Employees of any Railroad as per the Railroad Workers' Protection Act of 1966, except such Migrant Employees of Railroads covered under the Railroad Pensioners' Guarantee Act of 1968 (amended 1972), and will comply with all other ordinances and conditions of local, state, and Federal law, subject to amendment.

    Friday Afternoon Paradox: Free Software is a Public Good, but the instant it becomes a Public Goods, it ceases to be Free Software.

  25. Re:in short, no by molarmass192 · · Score: 2, Insightful

    There's a flaw in your argument. You can purchase private security other than your local police department. That doesn't make your local police any less of a public good. Likewise, you could choose not to run free software.

    My personal take on it is that the government should cut back on purchasing proprietary software and use free software whenever possible. Those savings could then be used to cut taxes and give taxpayers back more of their paycheck. I don't like the idea of the government handing cash to free software developers any more than to proprietary software developers. If the government does contribute to free software it should be though man-hours that advance features the government itself requires.

    --

    Good people do not need laws to tell them to act responsibly, while bad people will find a way around the laws-Plato
  26. Sure, as long as the license is right by Knife_Edge · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I have no problem with the government sponsoring free software development, but if they do so, they should use a license that allows anyone and everyone to benefit from the software. That means a BSD style license versus a GPL license.

    The GPL is probably the reason that the government would be unable to just take the reigns of free software funding, like they took over the operation of libraries. Simply because it is counterproductive for the government, which has effectively unlimited resources, to compete with commercial entities. Nobody wins in that situation, not the gov't, not the companies, and not the consumer. GPL code cannot be used commercially in a conventional sense, and if the government were to put serious efforts behind it, they could wind up destroying a lot of commercial enterprises, not to mention wasting taxpayer dollars for a while as they duplicate a service which is already being provided to the public. Eventually, once commercial developers go under, they would just be providing the same service more expensively (government is generally less efficient than private enterprise).

    Developers who use the GPL have already decided that their software should not be a public good in the sense that libraries are (in that anyone could go to a library, read books on a subject, and then resell what they learned for money). Even though the knowledge to understand GPL code might be expensive to get, and difficult to package in a useful way, they insist that anyone should be able to redistribute such an effort, for free, in exchange only for recognition for the developer. This effectively makes knowledge easy to exchange, but at a cost of making it worthless, unsellable.

    A BSD license on goverment developed code might not be much better initially, as what could result would be the government doing work for commercial companies for free (from their point of view), while they continue to charge comparable prices for their work of packaging the software. Eventually, though, prices would be driven down, as the software itself became a commodity, and the knowledge of how to package it was the only way companies could compete. This would be software as a public good, in a general sense. Companies like the initial consequence of this scenario, and fear the second, so they want to make sure that things stay in the first stage, where the government is doing a certain amount of work for them, without eating their lunch.

    I think if the government were to step in and make certain kinds of software (starting with the most often used pieces of code, the OS) a commodity, it could have very positive results for society. On the other hand, open source developement is already going on, so maybe they don't need to be involved, except for preserving the legal conditions that allows this to happen.

  27. Answer: No by isa-kuruption · · Score: 3, Insightful
    In addition to the current, community-based mechanisms in which free software is developed, wouldn't it be beneficial to have dedicated groups of professional free software developers, paid by national governments to serve the overall interests of society?

    The "mechanisms" you mention are "services" (libraries, police, and fire). The government provides these for the good of all people

    What you want is a "product" and not a "service". What you're asking for is for the government to provide free every product which does "good for the public". This would include, soap, laundry detergent, deoderant (heh), cars, bikes, clothes, scissors, pens, pencils, paper, toilet paper, paper clips, computers, books, magazines (aka toilet paper), etc etc (you get my point).

    So what you're asking for is the government to determine what "product" is for the public good, subsidize it to limit business opprotunities to provide individuals who are looking to earn a living and profit from their work. Not to mention stock holders who make money on the profits made by companies who sell these products.

    Doing this would not only affect the general moral of workers who provide such services, but will put thousands of people out of work while at the same time increasing our taxes to figures that I don't even want to imagine.

    Generally, bad idea. Period. Besides, this "public good" is only to be for the public good of about 1/4 the US population.

    Oh and by the way, most towns in the U.S. still have volunteer services where very little money is provided by the town.

  28. China by overshoot · · Score: 2, Interesting
    Taiwan and the ROC have entered into a joint development of software libre, notably Chinese-localized Linux software.

    Me, I think Bill Gates should get the Nobel Peace Prize for bringing them together.

    --
    Lacking <sarcasm> tags, /. substitutes moderation as "Troll."
    1. Re:China by jratcliffe · · Score: 2, Informative

      Ummm...Taiwan IS the ROC (Republic of China). Mainland China is the PRC (People's Republic of China). If you're referring to this story, then there's no int'l cooperation involved, it's purely an effort of Taiwan (aka the ROC) - the PRC has nothing to do with it.

  29. Be careful what you wish for... by ai2097 · · Score: 2, Insightful

    First off: The government should subsidize Free Software not open source software as a whole, if it subsidizes anything.

    Second: I don't think that the governemt should have any direct control over Free Software or the manufacture therof. Police and fire departments, as well as schools and other public institutions, are completely government controlled. I don't want the government to be able to make arbitrary rules for the code that I want to write as Free Software, which could feasibly happen if the government subsidized Free Software in the same way as the aforementioned institutes are.

    Another thing to remember: Free Software is Free Speech, not Free Beer. Programmers can (and do) make money off of thier Free Software. Should the government subsidize commercial entities? I don't particularly agree with airline bailouts or other corporate gimmes that the government spends my tax money on; I would disagree just as much if the government was giving me money to write and sell Free Software as a subsidation (if I were selling it for profit as well.)

    Now, I do agree that it would be nice to set up something like a grant system for Free Software programmers. I could write the government with a proposal for such-and-such program, get a government endorsement and some grant money, and write the code up. It would also be great if there were government coding standards that participants would have to keep to (think GNU coding standards.) This would garuntee that the taxpayer's money is going to a good quality product.

    But I trust the government as far as I can throw it. The implementation I described would be ideal, but I'm sure that if the government got into software, it would just make a mess. The government is already creating enough of a problem as far as intellectual "property" laws and software patents. I don't think I want it meddling with my development plans any more.

    Oh well. Just my 2c.

  30. Re:in short, no by Anonymous+Canard · · Score: 4, Insightful
    Public goods need to benefit EVERYONE...

    First of all public goods only need to benefit enough people to enjoy a majority support. Does the military benefit everyone? How about the people who disagree with how the military is being used? Does the bus system benefit everyone? Does welfare benefit everyone?

    Arguably all of these do support everyone; that is, everyone benefits by living in a country where the destitute don't have to resort to theft to avoid starvation, everyone benefits from living in a society which is well protected from foreign aggressors, and society as a whole benefits from having people who are incapable of passing a driving test, or unable to afford a car, never the less able to hold a job and be productive so that they won't have to live on welfare.

    Likewise open software benefits everyone -- if not directly then indirectly -- in lower prices for services, in greater productivity, resulting in greater general prosperity, in better and cheaper communication technologies, and greater efficiency for those areas that open software is able to cover.

    Where would we be without open software. Let's see. No email, no Internet (no DNS), no TCP/IP, no world wide web, no interoperable software. Novell, Microsoft, MacOS, and the mainframes would all still be separate islands.

    Yeah, I guess that doesn't add up to squat.

    --

    --
    BitTorrent in C -- LibBT
    http://www.sf.net/projects/libbt
  31. Re:Good idea but. by TheIzzy · · Score: 2, Informative
    Essentially anyone can do anything in the linux community...

    Hence the free-as-in-speech. We WANT anyone to be able to do anything with the open source projects. Linus, however, maintains the official "untainted" kernel tree. You use his when you want the raw kernel, and apply patches such as openmosix (http://openmosix.sf.net) when you require extra functionality. The infrastructure is there, but it's also circumventable if it doesn't meet your needs.

  32. Software as a Public Service by Dr.+Transparent · · Score: 5, Funny
    New! Public Service Software (PSS)

    The Government of the United States of America would like to announce that it has established a Department of Software (DoS). The DoS will work to develop software for the people. What will this mean for you, the American people? Here are some highlights:

    • Software Developers provided with unlimited supply of non-fat snacks and low-sodium Soda Pop at no cost to Developers
    • All software to be developed on new Government Operating system: GLOSS (Government Licensed Open Software System). Because GLOSS is still in development, no software can be developed at this time. Estimated time of development is 10 years. Cost: only $100M per development month! What a bargain!
    • All development will take place at new DoS headquarters in DC. Headquarters building is now beneath the washington monument, which has been wired with 802.11g antenna to provide free internet access for all of DC.
    • All development will take place using the new Free United Development (FUD) language. This language combines all languages into one. A true celebration of language diversity. It's procedural, modal, object-oriented, iterative, and recursive all at the same time!
    • To protect the environment the DoS developers will use new state-of-the-art environmentally friendly computers. The keyboards are a bamboo-syrup composite, and the processors are made entirely of nitrogen, cooled to a solid. To further protect the environment no upgrades will be allowed until environmental impact studies can take place
    • New development at DoS will use the new ISO standard Government Unlimited Model (GUM). The GUM incorporates the opinions and psychological evaluations of each developer to create a project that everyone will enjoy working on, but will not be offended by. Because of their controversial nature, the following areas will be considered "off limits" to DoS programmers: any development for the military, any development for organizations who sell, lease, rent, or offer for free any object that might possibly contain a religious quote or a quote by any founding father of America, anything that can "play mp3s".
    • Also, the DoS will be instituing a strict policy of comment appropriateness. All developer comments will be checked for offensive words or slogans. The following are strictly off-limits:
      • Rush Limbaugh
      • Pro life
      • Christian
      • Fox News
      • Matt Drudge
      • Republican
      • Free Enterprise
      • Corporation
      • Opportunity
      • Liberty
      • Justice
      • Conservative
    • Finally, the DoS will adhere to strict OSHA standards: only 500 words may be typed before a mandatory 5 minute break must be taken. Any more typing that this may require a pay raise and/or paid leave.
    • The Government is exicted to be your new provider of public software! If you have a piece of software you want written, contact a local lobbiest or special interest group. Others need not submit applications.

    1. Re:Software as a Public Service by curunir · · Score: 3, Funny

      In response to the announcement of the creation of the Dept of Software (DoS), Microsoft announced that it would start a new program to sell it's software at half of normal price to better compete with the free software the DoS would be offering.

      Microsoft believes "Operation Half-Priced Software" (OS/2, for short) will make its software more competitively priced. CEO Steve Ballmer was quoted as saying, "We belive that OS/2 software is superior to DoS software and we think users will be willing to pay a premium for it."

      /me *ducks* (and appologizes profusely :-)

      --
      "Don't blame me, I voted for Kodos!"
  33. No, bad idea by frovingslosh · · Score: 3, Insightful
    Clearly government meddling and red tape and additional taxes to support it all isn't needed and for the most part isn't even wanted. The open source community would be greatly hurt by this. I know many people would simply stop contributing, either because they didn't want to play with the bureaucrats and all the red tape, or just because the were disgusted by the new system.

    --
    I'm an American. I love this country and the freedoms that we used to have.
    1. Re:No, bad idea by frovingslosh · · Score: 2, Insightful
      I still think it would be the lesser of two evils if I had to pick this or WindozeRG ;-)

      Grow up. The day you have your government paying money for open source development is the day that Bill Gates will show up to take that money, and have your taxes pay him for the work he has his people do to that open source software, making sure that it does what he want's it to do, not you.

      --
      I'm an American. I love this country and the freedoms that we used to have.
    2. Re:No, bad idea by RancidBeef · · Score: 3, Insightful

      That's right! The bureaucrats who actually dole out the money would ultimately control the spending.

      What is the obsession with everyone wanting the government to pay for everything? Has no one figured out that all government money comes from (is extorted from) the taxpayer? Why not have the government provide everyone with a house? a car? food? clothing? Those are all important! Entertainment is important, too, so "free" movie passes for everyone! Free vacations! Why, fiber-optic 10GB broadband to every home is a basic human right!

      So you want to become a official Sponsored Software Developer? Describe the proposed project on form FSDF-11/a (in triplicate). Show us a copy of your software development license. Be ready for your quarterly code inspection. Do you have the proper number of minorities working on that project?

      -Sigh- I so wish Socialism had died with the Soviet Union...

    3. Re:No, bad idea by frovingslosh · · Score: 3, Insightful
      There's no valid reason that the government should make me pay taxes and then take that money and give it to people who are now quite willing to do the work for free. And I sure don't want the government deciding and telling us what the public wants, and I'm not even sure I want the public telling us what the public wants. The developers should code what they want to code, if there is a need the system has shown that it gets filled under the current modes of open source development pretty well.

      And who do you suggest gets that special funding for what the "public wants"? Once you pay some 14 year old kid who just happens to be the child of a Chicago democrat party official, how do you avoid paying every open source developer out there, particularly those of core key components? Or do you just thumb your nose at them and tell them you expect them to keep contributing their efforts for free while their taxes are being given to projects that they don't consider worthy of effort?

      --
      I'm an American. I love this country and the freedoms that we used to have.
    4. Re:No, bad idea by Xabraxas · · Score: 2, Interesting
      While I don't necessarily believe that Open Source is true communism I do agree with most of everything else the parent poster said. The anti-linux zealots love to use the word commmunism because people in the US have been socialized to believe communism is evil, which is rediculous. It is an economic system not a type of government. Like the parent post mentioned, different systems may work better in different situations. Local phone service and cable are not capitalistic systems yet no one cries traitor about them.

      Another great point the parent poster mentions is the fact that software can be reproduced as much as needed without actually taking away from anyone else. This is important because it is commonly overlooked by the anti-linux zealots. They love to call the open source crowd "thieves" because of the SCO lawsuit but even if there is SCO code in the kernel, no user would be a theif. Besides the fact that code is copyrighted (which is meant to protect copying of published works, which is not the case with propietary software), the end user did not know about the code, and more importantly no person is deprived of that "stolen" code.

      Back to the topic at hand...

      Should free software be subsidized? No. Not yet at least. Obviously some people are not ready for it. If free software becomes dominant and acceptable by the masses in the future then I believe it might be a good idea, as long as government is not as crooked as it is now and that's a big "if".

      Personally I believe that Microsoft fanboys have finally lost any ground to attack linux on technical merits so now they have to attack open source as anti-american. I haven't really heard the "communist/socialist" FUD until more recently. It at least wasn't as prevalent as it is now until the 2.4 kernel. The 2.4 kernel and the advancement of individual distros in this time awoke a fear amongst people with blind allegiances to other operating systems. They'll attempt to kill it in anyway they can to help save Bill's criminal monopoly.

      --
      Time makes more converts than reason
    5. Re:No, bad idea by MSTCrow5429 · · Score: 2, Insightful
      "10mil/yr is not exactly the most expensive government program out there."

      Yes, but all those little 10 million a year pork projects do add up. Government waste, whether small or large, is a problem. One cannot justify program "X" simply because it is a little amount of waste. Why doesn't it occur to some people that we'd have a smaller amount of waste if we didn't start spending in the first place?

      --
      Slashdot: Playing Favorites Since 1997
    6. Re:No, bad idea by wastaz · · Score: 3, Insightful

      As someone who lives in a socialist democratic country, I cant see how the parent post got modded as "+5 insightful" instead of "-1 flamebait or -1 troll"

      Taxes, here in Sweden, are high as hell. From what I've heard, we've got like the highest taxes in the world, end of discussion. However, we have a very high social standard. Those taxes do good. The hospitals are all owned by the state and provide a great service to the people who needs it for a much cheaper service than it would be provided otherwise. From what I've heard of USA hospitals, you dont want to get sick or hurt since they all rip you off and take every last penny. In sweden we can get sick and hurt and we STILL will be able to live a normal life economically speaking. Why is this? Our taxes.

      The infrastructure has great use of our, the taxpayers money, as has the police departments, the social services departments, the schools, universities.
      Socialism is good. The thought of everyone pitching in and helping those who cant for one reason or another help themselves is a good thought. As long as it is done in a democratic manner. We have a good chance of influencing the politicians which we vote for, and unlike other countries the people who gets the most votes actually do win an election. (Take that Bush!)

      I wouldnt mind raising my taxes with a couple of dollars in order to help out the OpenSource evolution. Not to mention, to make it implemented more in the public services. The costs that we could do away with (licenses and MS shit) by making sure that OSS did away with windows and such in our infrastructure could be diverted to the OSS community instead and as thus help everyone out. We probably wouldnt even need a large taxraise.

      I so wish that I'm able to metamoderate the parent post.

  34. Its called socialism. by HanzoSan · · Score: 4, Insightful



    Yes socialism seems to be the answer for dealing with the digital world, its not the answer for the physical world but definately for the digital world.

    --
    If you use Linux, please help development of Autopac
  35. Yes by sql*kitten · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Have any national governments taken measures to subsidize open source projects?

    Yes, who do you think paid for the earliest work on Linux? The Finnish government, of course! Like in many European countries, the taxpayer gives grants to students, and that's most likely what Linus lived on.

  36. Free Software and the German government by greppling · · Score: 2, Informative
    The German "Innenministerium" directly funded the development of gnupg. However, after seeing the small success of the project (in terms of adoption rate), and maybe other reasons, the ministery finally decided to stop direct funding of OSS development, and instead relying on other means to support OSS.

    The other high-profile project funded by the German government is Kollaborate. This was done by the "BSI" (Federal Agency for IT security), which is known to be very Linux-friendly (and equally MS-unfriendly).

  37. sure by erikdotla · · Score: 2, Insightful

    If I can quit my job, work on free software, and go down to the local welfare office and fill out "free software developer" and get a fat check, then our society will have made some progress.

    Seriously though, such a program would require a careful balance between funding OSS and not killing our technology economy. We live in a capitalist society, and if our government takes action that hurts businesses that are considered to be doing an "OK" job (MS) then it seems a little contradictory to capitalism.

    Funding and providing Fire Departments is different because not only are these Public Good, they determined that they are necessary for healthy living (not dying.) Software is nowhere near this level of importance to most people. The government has no motivation to stop software businesses from doing what they do. If the government needs something (like TCP/IP) then they commission it and it gets made.

    --
    # Erik
  38. Separation of Church and state by BierGuzzl · · Score: 2, Insightful

    The idea that free software be provided by or developed by national governments is one that makes me wary of what amount of control the government can excercise. He who pays the piper calls the tune -- and free software is much more than just adhering to a software license. Things like publicly available bug databases seem to be the first thing to disappear when large dollar figures become involved.

    Much like the church is best off separated from the state, so the free software "movement", as a philosophy, cannot survive if institutionalized as a part of government. Free software organizations already get government and corporate grants, support and development through educational institutions, and widespread acceptance from the technical community, all without having a "Department of Public Software"

  39. Funding = wrong way to go by theMightyE · · Score: 3, Insightful
    I'm not so sure this would be a good idea as stated. One of the things that makes open source work as well as it does is that it is started by someone who has the proverbial 'itch' that needs to be scratched, meaning that they wish they had a particular bit of software and so head out to create it themselves. If enough other folks share the same 'itch' they start helping out with testing, adding new features, documentation, etc. The people who have the commitment and skill to make the biggest difference rise to the top and good software is made.

    Now imagine a scenario where there is governmnet funding. Out of work programmers, people who took a semester of pascal in highschool and are now looking for cash, etc., will go looking for projects to do to get in on the funding chuckwagon rather than responding to an existing need. Other hangers-on will attempt to join, not because they know the subject well or feel the same need to create a particular bit of software, but because they want in on the $$$. Arguments over which code to include would be biased by the author's desire to prove to the funding source that they had added the most lines of code, and not on technical merrit. Overall, it would become the opposite of what a good open source project should be.

  40. Re:in short, no by RALE007 · · Score: 2, Insightful
    "...Public goods need to benefit EVERYONE, not EVERYONE uses linux or open software..."

    Well, by that rational there should be no Coast Guard since a significant amount of the population is landlocked. There should be no federal funding for the INS to increase patrols on the Mexico-U.S. border since that isn't much of a problem to the citizens in Minnesota. Heck, there shouldn't be federal funding for higher educational institutions because they do not benefit every citizen directly.

    A typical response may be "Well, the Coast Guard, INS, and higher educational institutions benefit many directly, and benefit most indirectly, so they are still for the public good." Well that's exactly what OSS does.

    Although not "EVERYONE" uses Linux or open source, "EVERYONE" does benefit from its use. Unless you live in a hole, you benefit from it directly on a daily basis, whether you realize it or not. Even those who do not benefit from it directly, benefit from it indirectly. Since further adoption benefits most if not all people, I think the author of the article suggesting further adoption and additional governmental support under the pretense of "the public good" is an insightful valid suggestion.

    The thought that something for the public good means "an item or service that must benefit every individual directly" as is implied in your comment is completely ridiculous, a flawed presumption, and I feel you are careless for stating it as fact.

    --
    Beware blue cats moving at .99c
  41. It Depends by istartedi · · Score: 2

    First, it depends on whether or not *all* the taxpayers get to use the software. That means Public Domain or BSD, not GPL. As much as you might love the GPL, you can't deny it's unfair for those who follow the software ownership business model to be forced to pay taxes so that their business can be undermined. A PD or BSD release puts both GPL'd and proprietary projects on an even footing.

    Second, it depends on whether or not the market is already providing the service. For example, a new government *NIX-based OS is hardly needed, what with all the companies producing such things in a seemingly endless variety. This applies for anything, not just software. The government should only provide a service when the market fails to provide the service, and the services is deemed necessary to the public good.

    That said, the question is moot anyway. The government already sponsors free software. Google around and you'll see that grants specify that copyrighted material produced by grant recipients is "retained by the grantee, but must be published in a manner that allows others to benefit from the research" or something to that effect.

    In the past, people slapped "academic use only" clauses on their software. Lately, they've been GPL'ing is a step in the right direction, but not quite all the way to PD/BSD.

    It's understandable that researchers want to retain their rights, but when it comes to selling licenses under something other than GPL or academic use, there is a culture of $call pricing which really sucks.

    You know $call pricing. That's where the cost of licensing is to call the researcher and negotiate some horrendous deal. Typicly, only corporations are invited into such a deal. A price schedule is never published. It's like dealing with embedded board manufacturers. Yuck.

    I can understand why they want grantees to retain rights, but they should require the publication of a price schedule for non-GPL usage.

    Now, if grantees had to PD or BSD their work, what would happen? There might be fewer grant applicants, which could be perceived as a good or bad thing depending on how you look at it. It's good if you're swinging the budget axe, and bad if you think there should be lots of research. However, with fewer grantees you could pay more to each grantee to offset the fact that they have less control over their work.

    It would be interesting to see how many grantees are actually selling their work anyway. I bet a lot of stuff is just sitting there at Universities, getting stale, because it was easier for people to roll their own than deal with $call pricing. Either that, or the researchers left academe and went to work for industry. That's a waste, and obviously not a public good.

    So. Is Free Software a Public Good? It depends.

    --
    For all intensive purposes, "whom" is no longer a word. That begs the question, "who cares"?
  42. Re:Answer: No by Moeses · · Score: 2, Insightful

    A problem with your argument is that software is not a physical product like soap or any of the others you list as examples.

    That aside, I think that the government competing with private enterprise example you gave could happen, in fact it already does, as the government DOES fund software, both open and closed. It hasn't really put anyone out of a job, in fact, since they are paying people to develope software they are creating jobs.

    It's more likely that a programmer would get a *different* programming job than loose a job due to an increase in government funding of software projects, whether open or closed.

  43. I wonder if they asked for USD 27,670... by WoTG · · Score: 2, Funny

    Man, if my governments would stop rounding up grants to the nearest dollar, imagine how much money it would save...

    =)

  44. Re:Answer: No by TheFrood · · Score: 2, Insightful

    What you want is a "product" and not a "service". What you're asking for is for the government to provide free every product which does "good for the public". This would include, soap, laundry detergent, deoderant (heh), cars, bikes, clothes, scissors, pens, pencils, paper, toilet paper, paper clips, computers, books, magazines (aka toilet paper), etc etc (you get my point).

    No, the question is asking whether the government should fund the development of software that's freely available for the public good. There's a big difference between providing copy-able bits and providing physical products. You're drawing an unwarranted parallel between a single government program and full-scale socialism.

    So what you're asking for is the government to determine what "product" is for the public good, subsidize it to limit business opprotunities to provide individuals who are looking to earn a living and profit from their work. Not to mention stock holders who make money on the profits made by companies who sell these products.

    So? Libraries limit business opportunities for bookstores. Public fire departments limit business opportunities for private firefighting companies. Police departments limit business opportunities for private security firms and private investigators. Any government service detracts from private business opportunities. The question to be asked is whether society benefits from the tradeoff.

    Doing this would not only affect the general moral of workers who provide such services, but will put thousands of people out of work while at the same time increasing our taxes to figures that I don't even want to imagine.

    I can't tell here whether you're referring to a government program to sponsor open-source development or to your straw-man target socialist government. If you're talking only about government funding of software development, I can't see how that would raise taxes to the enormous levels you seem to think it would.

    Generally, bad idea. Period. Besides, this "public good" is only to be for the public good of about 1/4 the US population.

    Not true. Software is fundamentally important to the economy. If publically funded software development were to make software more widely and cheaply available, the efficiency of the economy as a whole would improve, to everyone's benefit, even those who never sit in front of a monitor.

    Oh and by the way, most towns in the U.S. still have volunteer services where very little money is provided by the town.

    Unless I'm very much mistaken, any town with a fire department has to spend a significant amount of money on equipment and physical infrastructure, regardless of whether the actual labor is paid or free.

    TheFrood

    --
    If you say "I'll probably get modded down for this..." then I will mod you down.
  45. Actually... by qtp · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Everyone does use Free Software, even if they are not aware of it.

    Much of the web is run on Free Software, and most (if not all) packets will cross routers, firewalls or bridges that are running Free Software at some point during thier journey.

    In fact, thier own computers may be using code that was directly derived from Free Software, such as the improved network stack in Windows (from BSD, IIRC).

    The world of propietary, closed source software has benefitted greatly from Free Software development, and this has benefitted EVERYONE, even if they know nothing about it.

    Including you.

    Also, there is no precident to a "benefit EVERYONE" requirement for government funding (at least in the U.S.).

    One example of government funding for a select few persons would be the funding of natural disater insurance programs for persons who choose to build thier houses on flood plains and on beaches. Government funded flood plain insurance enables people to live along rivers and the same coverage allowed the wealthier americans to ensure that most of us could not afford to live near the beach. (Before natural disaster relief plans covered beachfront property, it was quite inexpensive to have a house on or near the beach, but most chose not to because of the possibility of storm damage or erosion.)

    Another would be farming subsidies for tobbacco farmers. I fail to see how one could conscrue such funding as "beneficial to EVERYONE".

    --
    Read, L
  46. ok, so how do i get some cash? by Jah+Shaka · · Score: 2, Funny

    I have been developing jahshaka for over 1 1/2 years now and would like to find out how i can get some cash to help move the project ahead...

    I figure while i 'm at it i could use some of the cash to get a new mercedes to help move myself ahead as well

    Think my criminal record will get in the way?

    Sounds like we are selling out the revolution... the government doesnt give you anything for free...

  47. Software, like information, is a public good by The+Revolutionary · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Computer software, for the purposes of determining whether or not it is a public good, is like information.

    Many publicly funded institutions and agencies provide information at little -- and usually, no -- direct cost. The providing of this information is widely considered to be a public good.The particular purpose and sort of this information varies:
    - Some of this information is the sort of information which enables private citizens and land owners -- private citizens granted temporary, revocable, and limited authority over some portion of our natural resources -- to steward our nation's -- and our world's -- shared resources in a responsible way, consistent with the duties they as such have to each and every one of us.
    - Some of this information enables private citizens to do with these resources over which they have this temporary, revocable, and limited authority, that which they have a legitimate expectation to do.
    - Some of this information enables citizens to evaluate the risks they face by engaging in certain behaviors, or by living in certain ways or in certain environments.
    - Some of this information enables private citizens enables citizens to carry out tasks and to obtain certain other goods which they as people in these modern times have a legitimate expectation be able to do or to have access to, regardless of their social, political, or economic status, situation, and circumstance.

    One example of this type of information is that provided through "extension services":
    Many counties, states, as well as public universities, provide publicly funded information services. This often includes providing information about agriculture, livestock, landscaping, land care, building, wildlife, codes, and drainage systems.

    Another example of this information is personal health care related:
    We provide information to expecting mothers, to those citizens -- and non citizens within our borders -- who face an increased health risk due to their behavior, life choices, or environment,. We provide to everyone information about their bodies and life changes, to the extent that they as people in these modern times have a legitimate expectation to know about their bodies and life changes regardless of their education or their ability to pay for it.

    Computer software as a public good is similar in many ways to information as a public good:
    - Computer software, like information, once obtained, is an unlimited resource. Distributing one copy of it does not limit or otherwise affect our ability to distribute another identical copy, and this distribution may be done at very little to no cost.
    - Computer software, like information, requires both an initial investment to organize, verify, and to be put into an accessible form, as well as continuing costs to maintain the accuracy and relevance of.
    - Computer software, like information, provides the groundwork which enables private citizens to be good stewards of that portion of our resources over which they have some temporary, revocable, and limited authority.
    - Computer software, like information, provides the groundwork which enable private citizens to carry out the tasks and to obtain the additional goods which they in virtue of being citizens have a legitimate expectation to carry out and to obtain.

    One example of this is access to electronic communication:
    Increasingly, modern people have a legitimate expectation to be able to communicate with friends, family members, their representatives, and appointed government officials, electronically, and from the privacy of their own homes. Software provides the groundwork which enables these citizens to realize these legitimate expectations. It is unacceptable for the realization of private citizens' legitimate expectation to use secure, reliable, and comprehensible, and usable, electronic communication in the privacy of their own homes to be dependent upon their acceptance of a draconian set of terms of use and limitation of rights such as m

  48. In the end, why should they? by forgoil · · Score: 2, Insightful

    The smart goverments will look upon the dumb goverments spending money on free software, and then just use it. Thank you very much. Why spend money on software which your competitors can use with 0 research and development cost?

    Think about it.

  49. proprietary software sucks by MegaFur · · Score: 2, Insightful

    (Warning: the following post is very glib (but not really funny). It doesn't take itself too seriously so you shouldn't either.)

    Proprietary software sucks. Don't take my word for it. Just read the article.

    I mean, after all--if the proprietary software is already buggy, if the companies charge for the tech support as well, then what is the company really providing for the user? Clever marketing? Ease of aquisition of software (can be downloaded or purchased from a store)? Easy installation?

    Okay, that's it guys. If the proprietary software really does suck that much, then all the Open Source community needs to do is (somehow) run a huge marketing campain and make the auto-installers work better. The tech support might suck, and the software might be full of bugs, but that's not any different from commercial software. (at least according to that one, rather short, CNN article) The only remaining barriers are lack of knowelge from the general public and difficulties with installation.

    --
    Furry cows moo and decompress.
  50. German Government by kris · · Score: 2, Informative

    The German government has paid for a number of applications that have been implemented as GPLed software products. In particular, there have been several high profile projects such as Sphinx (gpg and kmail integration) and kroupware (now transforming into kolab and kontact).

    But there is a lot of OSS activity at lower levels, for example the Java Anon Proxy (JAP) project as a joint venture between Dresden University and the privacy commissioner of Land Schleswig-Holstein, several School Linux Projects, a large scale Linux deployment for schools around the city of Moers (serving 250.000 users), and many more projects at a similar level.

    In studies on Open Source Development, many European countries come out "on top", that is the number of developers from European countries is higher than it should be according to their proportional headcount. Such Government subsidized OSS projects and deployments are a strong factor, creating a climate where OSS can flourish and produce many good projects and products.