Slashdot Mirror
Adrian Lamo Pleads Guilty
darth dickinson writes "InfoWorld reports that Adrian Lamo, the so-called 'homeless hacker,' pleaded guilty on Thursday to charges that he broke into the internal computer network of The New York Times. The 22-year-old could face up to five years in prison and a $250,000 fine at a sentencing hearing in April." From the sound of things, he just wants to pay his debt to society and put this behind him. It'll be interesting to see if the judge sticks to the suggested sentence or not.
no pun intended.
reminds me of the movie. he is a true cyber punk if i ever saw one,
why is he called homeless hacker?
Sorry I don't get it.
Go to Freelamo.com, a non-profit website DEDICATED to supporting Adrian Lamo.
ALL profits from donations and or merchandise purchases are donated to the Adrian Lamo Defense Fund.
We HAVE to help this guy out. Jail is not right -- what he did was mere curiosity mixed with the desire to HELP these companies fix their network.
He did nothing of REAL financial damage. Please help him today (imagine if you were in HIS shoes!).
Thank you for reading this, friends. We, as a large tech community, have to get behind this guy and show others that mere EXPLORING is not to be looked down upon. What if we didn't explore Mars/Moon?
Reply or e-mail; don't vaguely moderate. Ex-O'Reilly/MIT employee, now a full-time Google employee.
That the hacker is represented by a man named "Hecker"? Only in America...
..about some ordinary criminal?
Well, at least he won't be homeless for 5 years.
Sounds like the guy is getting what he deserves.
Next.
SIG:Slashdot: indymedia for nerds.
His "exploring" involved the access of "home telephone numbers and Social Security numbers for more than 3,000 contributors to the Times' Op-Ed page." And use of the LexisNexis service without paying for it. He also "set up five fictitious user identification names and passwords inside the Times' system to use to access LexisNexis and then used them to make more than 3,000 searches in February 2002."
While you can quibble about the definition of damage, I feel that what he did is the analogue of theft and trespassing on a massive (albeit electronic) scale. He is remorseful for his actions, and I agree that he certainly should be held accountable for his actions.
This from the CNN article.
I'm sorry man, but the moon wasn't anybody's private property and equipment.
Why didn't he do something useful, like get rid of that obnoxious registration system?
He is a charasmatic hacker. He explains to companies their weaknesses. When he hacked WorldCom in 2001, WorldCom praised him for his efforts.
Apparantly it seems Times doesn't share the same affinity. Now FBI has him as a public menace and threat. I wonder what the talk would be if he was Islamic?
I'm beginning to think that all the FBI does these days is find martyrs, symbolic arrests to illustrate points of model citizen behavior. This is opposed to actually arresting people who do do a lot of damage. Another example, Sherman Austin from Raise the Fist.com, was subject to police raid, extended arrest, and jail sentencing because he posted information in a protest guide (that he didn't author) which contained a small link about explosives.
Too many martyrs. We need a calendar, the martyr-a-day celendar, to list the date when all the different people were arrested. Otherwise we'll lose track and just start accepting this.
The Custom Mary
bah.. I bet he just got tired of soup-kitchen handouts and drinking thunderbird at nights. No wonder he plead guilty for a square meal a day and a long-lease bed
"Apparantly it seems Times doesn't share the same affinity"
Would you be like WorldCom or like the Times if a stranger broke into your house "just to test how easy it was"?
OK, mind if we make a hero out of burglar who breaks into your house?
After all, there is nothing wrong if he "EXPLORES" your medicine cabinet and sock drawer, right?
As long as he doesn't do anything of "REAL financial damage" ?
Grapes of Wrath or The Fisher King?
I guess he'll have plenty of time now to write Kevin some stories. Might even collect some dough for the legal fund.
Are you people morons? He broke the law. He hacked into computer networks without permission. He broke the law. This is no different then some terrorist doing the samething. He SHOULD be put away.
What if I broke into your house, browsed through your underwear drawer, took some of your food, and then told you how I got in and how you can fix it? You would still want me put away, as you should. This is the exact samething.
Slashdot readers need to wise up, or maybe I'm expecting too much from this crowd.
Id sentance him to a year working at MS.. that'll teach him! ;P
moo
Would you ask that question of the punk tagging your property with spray paint? Or the kids who smash pumpkins on your front porch? Or the Visigoths driving around shooting out windows with a bb gun or busting up mailboxes with bats?
This kid is an immature, sociopathic vandal. He may have reasons. He may grow out of it. He may generate some sympathy. Attach the word 'hacker to someone around here, and you're elevated to the status of sainthood. Why does this guy get so much credit because the press has attached the word 'hacker' to this loser?
This is the same as putting up a big sign on your home that says "We Have Pay Per View Movies In Here!", then, some kids walk up to your huge picture window and look through the glass and watch your Pay Per View Movies.
Would you use my analogy? I hope not. So stop using the "Break In" one.
Yes, I know. IHBT. Whatever.
I would [sic] what happens to hackers in prison.
He's young, in prison for (probably) the first time, in for a non-violent offense, obviously not affiliated with any gangs...
You get the picture.
From the sound of things, Adrian didn't want to take the chance of having to spend five years in Danbury or Allenwood.
He didn't create the vulnerabilities in the Times' network, he merely exposed them in the same way he's been doing for years. Adrian hurt no one and owes nothing to society.
According to TechTV's "The Screen Savers" (computer help and trends show, for those not familiar), who have interviewed Lamo several times, he has struck a deal with the Feds to server six months in Federal prison. He was asking for six months of home detention, but he still ended up a heck of a lot better than five years!
"I'm not, like, that smart. I, like, forget stuff all the time." -- Paris Hilton
This is total bullshit.
A guy tries to help a fellow computer enthusiast, and the Slashdot community just blows him off? What happened to the spirit of giving and all that? Did you all lose the Holiday spirit so soon?
Mod Professor Vallon's post up.
And who was your advisor? Bill The Butcher?
The irony of going to jail for using a legal service begars description. In the future, when we have real networking and everyone takes access to case law for granted as a public right, the punishment our hacker faces today will look barbaric. "Were not public trails public property, recorded at the public expense?" they will ask, "How was it that you had to pay a private firm for reasonable access to the law?" What information, I wonder, did the New York Times have about their op-ed contributors that is not available from public phone books and the paper itself down at the local library. This case casts great shame on the New York Times and society in general.
Yet you, gantrep, say, "I feel that what he did is the analogue of theft and trespassing on a massive (albeit electronic) scale." Think about it some more. To me, what he got at was information that should be publically accessible without tresspass.
Friends don't help friends install M$ junk.
Yes, that would be fine. I have nothing to hide.
...
Now, if I had hemoroid cream in the cabinet and pornography in the drawer, I -would- be upset and I would sue him just like the NY Times is doing.
Kinda makes you wonder what the NY Times has to hide, doesn't it?
They are hiding what you, me, and everyone is: Personal data. Social security number, credit card numbers, mailing addresses, whatever.
Mind telling me where you live so I can take a look around?
More like a building inspector who found a door wide open to your house, and when he found a termite infestation, he let you know you needed to fix it immediately. So what if he grabbed a soda and sat on the couch? It's all virtual any way. The important thing is that his intentions weren't malicious. And he wasn't trying to extort money from NYT nor was he trying to steal CC numbers.
It's a criminal act without criminal intent. Adrian Lamo came forward to NYT with the imformation. (The NYT didn't know about the security hole.) And he turned himself in to the FBI when he heard he was wanted. A criminal would not have been so honest. And the prosecution should lighten up.
This guy didn't do anything wrong. He got access to legal information. Big deal. He did not have criminal intent, and that's all that matters.
Let him off. Support his defense. He didn't try to hide and run away like most computer wimps would have, he went straight to the Times and the FBI and told them about his accident.
It was an accident. A mistake. And I'm sure you've made mistakes before.
Gee, what a great brother/father/uncle/cousin you must be. Ahh, you're a joke-maker. You make fun of people when they're vulnerable. How big of you. Too bad people don't realize it's a cover-up for your own lack of confidence and low self-esteem.
Guys like you are jerks, just like the guys who picked on me in junior high and throughout graduation. I hate you.
I thought he was the "homeless hacker"?
Oh, wait... *grin*
He goes where the father of the grandfather post was at, only with more detail. We need to support Lamo regardless of how you stand on this issue. What's funny, though, is that the NY Times' case is entirely bu**shit, and yet even the Slashdotters don't understand how wrong it is for this guy to be treated this way.
Wake up and smell the burnt toast. Lamo is being cod-praddled, and it's not right. Donate to his fund. Mod pro-Lamo posts up. Help people.
That's what life is about, helping people in their time of need.
Who else are all the 2600 morons gonna try to save? They need something... because we all know they're not actually hacking anything.
Home detention? He's not a fucking minor! Time to grow up and accept your punishment. Mommy isn't here to help you!
Let's all be nice and send him a present. Something he could really use.
Stuff like a good waterproof lubricant, anti-asspain spray, a soft pillow to sit on and some soap that can't drop to the floor.
i read this before it was posted on /. and
... why?
... ...
...
...).
...
it got me steaming. this was in the morning
now it's evening and another useless
going-around-in-circles day has ended and i don't
feel so upset about the whole story anymore.
anyway looking from a distance having a 22 year
old guy that is living on couches or at his
parents house convicted to one year in jail just
got me mighty big goose bumps
well consider this scenario:
a 38 year old hacker in a appartment with several
computers and major bandwidth working for the mob
for on-line extortion, gambling and smuggeling
they'll never nab him
so security was lax at the new york times
(registration required) and other big companies
(i think former worldcom was mentioned).
so he was bored and got creative.
i mean no data was alterned or destroyed.
he wanted to go somewhere and used his superior
analytic skills to get there. now he is being
bullied by less intelligent people who might have
the law on their side (law on paper). this is just
another facet of our society that preaches
integraty, honesty and sustanability but it sounds
more like farce
we are definetly living in strange times where
intelligent people don't get support.
bottom line? society has grown stupid and is being
governed by stupid people. it is high time for
some elite to step in and resticted this "make
believe fairy tale society."
"i for one would welcome some new nazi overlord"
honestly!
back to worldcom: has anyone might thought of
the possiblity that their huge deficit might
have been due to a clever hacker(s) that broke
into their SQL database to siphone of all those
millions? (never got caught
so you can be a society approved CEO (spelled
E-N-R-O-N and W-O-R-L-D-C-O-M) and LOSS
billions of dollars and walk away? hey you!
bllions of dollars! not some electrons in a
N.Y. times mainframe!
no wonder this doesn't upset you! you have a full
thummy everyday and are just concerned about a
hacker exposing your porno surfing habits.
you wouldn't care less if enron or worldcom or
whoever sells gasoline at too high a price and is
in the government too cheats out hard US dollars.
dollars are just paper eh? electrons and logical
gates are what really matters. riiiight!
ever tried handing an employe at Mac donalds
a 286 processor for a big mac meal?
come on people
anyway if adrian should go to prison do send him
a iPOD filled with some nice mp3 will ya?
We HAVE to help this guy out. Jail is not right -- what he did was mere curiosity mixed with the desire to HELP these companies fix their network.
He did nothing of REAL financial damage. Please help him today (imagine if you were in HIS shoes!).
Thank you for reading this, friends. We, as a large tech community, have to get behind this guy and show others that mere EXPLORING is not to be looked down upon. What if we didn't explore Mars/Moon?
Pardon my frankness, but you are full of shit. If you came home and found this asshole sitting in your livingroom watching pay-per-view TV after having gone through all of your cabinets and drawers, would you say:
"Oh, no problem. What you did wasn't wrong. You were just being *curious* about what was in my house. You were just *exploring* when you went through my desk drawers and read all of my personal documents. You were just trying to *help* me by pointing out security vulnerabilities in my patio door and alarm system. Thanks so much!"
NO! You wouldn't. You'd call the cops after chasing the guy out of your house.
This isn't about exporing Mars. This is breaking and entering, pure and simple. It's time that people like this stop thinking the whole goddam world is here just to satisfy their personal "curiosity". To be perfectly blunt, you can take your Adrian Lamo Defense Fund and cram it up your ass. I want to see this guy do the maximum stretch as a lesson to other "curious" fellows.
I've been noticing the use of the phrase "so-called" everywhere lately, and it has me curious. So-called weapons of mass destruction, so-called mad-cow disease, so-called homeless hacker, etc. Quite often it seems to precede terms that are generally accepted rather than something obscure, which confuses me even further. Is there some sort of butt-covering here, like when news agencies go out of their way to refer to the guy seen on video tape committing a crime as an "alleged suspect"? Does it have some specific purpose? Is it just slang? My so-called mind wants to know.
Well I have been waiting for this news for a while now. I know Adrian much more as a person then a hacker. It saddens me to see him plead guilty and possibly go to jail but I knew he wouldnt fight if they charged him with actions that he did do.
One thing though that is hard to convay exspecially in text is his increadible sence of moral ethics. When we look at a name attached to the word hacker we have a certain mindset an image of all the hacker refrences we have at our disposal and apply that to Adrian. In this case that image is way off base. While I could list why I think he is an activly good person instead of the passive good/passive neutral people that make up the bulk of our society it still would not do him justice.
If you ever have the chance to talk to him for a good 20 minutes take the oppertunity, sit down and buy him a drink. By the end of the conversation you will walk away feeling that in his case he really shouldnt get the maximum sentance.
Never could figure out why my girl liked my bitch tits, then I found out she was a lesbian.
W1LL 0WNZ UR NETW0RK 4 F00D?
Lawrence Person (lawrencepersonh@gmailh.com (remove all "h"s to mail)
http://www.lawrenceperson.com/
Christ that's funny!
He committed a crime.
He got incarcerated.
QED...
This sig no verb.
Hmm, i wonder if the Toad creator from quest ever got mentioned for the 'rape' charges of his 16 yr old daughter.... hmmm
but the law is the law. He thought he was helping out those companies, but he didn't get those compny's permissions to check security and probe their networks.
He used a lot of Lexis/Nexis time on "borrowed" accounts, and got into a lot of personal information on corporate networks.
I see him as repenting and pleading guilty and asking for forgiveness. There could be a book deal here, but he has to serve his time first.
Remember, Slashdot does not have a -1 disagree moderation, and no, troll, flamebait, and overrated are not substitutes.
The important thing is that his intentions weren't malicious.
What makes you think that? Just because that's what he said? Hah!
Dinivin
Adrian knew that electronic tresspassing is illegal. SO DID YOU. If you still go do it, fine with me, but don't cry foul when you get charged for it. He abused a FOR PROFIT research system for personal use. He should have to pay restitution. However, since they don't know how much OTHER stuff he may have done, despite what he may say, they should also spend a good bit of time and energy looking through what he touched to see if it's secure.
That said, I think the EXISTING LAWS are too stiff, since I could physically break into the Times building and likely face less time. (no pun... aww fuck it)
So... the moral of this story, you outraged script-kiddies, is that if you break the law, you stand a fair chance of getting caught and punished. IF YOU DO NOT LIKE OUR EXISTING LAWS, EITHER LOBBY TO CHANGE THEM, OR RUN FOR PUBLIC OFFICE. Quit whining about people who get arrested for breaking our laws.
And yes, I know Adrian and I think he's a good guy. I also know that I've gone to jail in the past and it may do him some good. Homeless and blackhat-hacking doesn't seem like a very productive way to run your life. Get a grip. If you want to help Adrian, encourage him to do something socially acceptible, rather than calling down the wrath of all the largest transnational corporations every year or so.
It is publically accessable without tresspass. But it isnt archived, indexed, cross referenced and made easily searchable, and that costs money.
The gratification you and others get from punishing this "hacker" is small minded and cruel. It's bassed on a needless scarcity and private profiteering at the public expense. You will see that the larger crime is being commited by Lexis-Nexis.
Think, Dick, think, the answer has been demonstrated and the implications are clear. The lack of organization sounds a lot like the internet to me. Too bad states don't just put the electronic infromation they create on the web in raw form for anyone to ogranize as they see fit. It's comming and you will think of well organize and useful access to the law as a right.
People getting in the way of that availabilty are criminals. People who listen to them are just dicks.
Friends don't help friends install M$ junk.
It would have been interesting if he had made a defence on "Due Care". Hacks like this are leaveraging sloppy systems configuration and design. Which is likely why we do not see more prosecutions for hacking.
This is not to say intrusion into other systems should be legal, it should not be. But if a operator on the Internet does not take due care and no real damage is done the sentence should be a light sentence.
i hope you don't work for intel or any other
chip company or god help us all!
*HELP! HELP! IDIOTS AT WORK*
"Re:If a guy breaks into your house, make him a her"
Read the title for once.
Don't blame Durga. I voted for Centauri.
What makes you think that? Just because that's what he said? Hah!
Did you not read the rest of the paragraph of the post you replied to??
Pretty much every company on the earth takes a publically accessable resource, adds its own value added addition to it, and sells it on. The wood that makes your tables came from a public forest, cut down by a company who gained the forestry rights, who sold the wood to another company who put hard work into making it into something someone would buy. This happens because not everyone has a week to spare to go cut down a tree themselves, and fashion the wood into a table.
In this case, LexisNexis took publically available records and indexed, cross referenced and published the records in a easily accessable and searchable medium. They added some value to getting the information from them rather than researching it yourself.
You need to gain some intelligence someplace, and stop branding random companies as criminal for providing a service. If you want to argue your corner, why not ask "Why isnt the Government doing what LexisNexis provides, but for free?". You state that its coming, why hasnt the government already provided it? Oh, maybe you are bitching because the Government hasnt already provided the sort of service that LexisNexis has spent time and money providing? Or maybe its because you value your time doing something other than cross referencing legal cases, and thus want it provided for free.
LexisNexis is usefull to some people, and in no way obstructs the availability of the raw records to the people who do not wish to pay them for it. Go fuck yourself.
If someone walked into my home or jimmied the door to gain access, and stood in my living room to say "by the way, your door sucks", he's guilty of trespassing at the very least. This guy is no different. There is nothing that gives him or any other hacker a special "permit" to go where they do not belong just because they claim to do it "for the greater good". He deserves some kind of punishment.
*Fortitudo, aequitas, fidelitas.*
You must have been a great piece of ass too.
He is a moronic theif and trespasser who is too lazy to get a real job. Put Lamo in jail where he belongs, where all hackers like him belong.
Wasting your breath, amigo. This guy is so far out of whack, L. Ron Hubbard and that ralien guy are trying to offer him a membership to their club.
It's not the fact that Adrian violated laws. It's the fact that he is a "freedom fighter." That's what twitter is saying. Unfortunately, he's a fucking idiot and doesn't understand that one mans freedom is anothers prison. Not always the case, but he's a FSF zealot beyond what is healthy.
I study case law all the time without LexisNexis and I don't have any issues at all. Many states have cases indexed and Google does the indexing quite well. Granted, LexisNexis is "the best" -- but, that is why you pay for it!
Everything should be free! Anything that costs money is obviously evil, and anybody trying to get that for free is a saint.
Dacels Jewelers can't be trusted.
Now that it is the New Year, I started talking to my CPA about my taxes. Can you believe the bastard wants to charge me for doing them? I mean, I gave him all the info! He has a program to do the forms! Christ, why the hell do I have to pay him for that?
I'm going to see if I can hack into his system so that I can use the program myself. People who won't do my taxes for free for me are criminals.
You can't argue with that.
As was pointed out in posts about Kevin Metnik - the glory days of cracking systems past quite a few years ago.
Back then people sent passwords in plain text, there were no firewalls, nfs was as vulnerable as eggs laid on a freeway. Practically nobody paid any attention to security issues.
And this illustrates exactly why the crackers have done all of us a service.
There are enemies in this world... but they are not people like Adrian Lamo.
Without the crackers our systems would still be as vulnerable as they were 15 and 20 years ago. People would still take risks that any normal person would consider insane. In fact, a lot of people, perhaps the majority, still have a lot to learn.
So again I say - thank Gawd for the crakers and guys - keep up the good work. Keep pounding home the point that people must pay attention to proper security. Without consequences for lax security it is clear they won't do a damn thing.
Of course I read that. It doesn't change the fact that we have no idea if his intentions were malicious.
You people really are gullible.
Dinivin
n/t
Not so homeless anymore, is he? ;p
This may have been the point all along. This way, he has free room and board, three squares a day and free cable at the taxpayer's expense. Here in America, criminals have a cushy life while the rest of you slave away only to end up broke in the end.
This guy got excessively promoted and praised by SecurityFocus editor Kevin Poulsen (former well-unknown haxor who got busted for his computer activities;). One could find this an extremely suspicious and a coincidental matter. I'm in a serious doubt Lamo lacks the technical skills required to be recognized as a famous cracker. In fact, I've never seen a well-documented case, describing any of his actions on paper. Anxious to do so, though.
Exactly. I saw a interview with Adrian on Screensavers right around the time he turned himself in. It was clear that his parents never instilled the concept of "not yours, don't touch".
He's the same kind of kid that would borrow his friends' bicycle without asking, and when confronted protest "well you weren't using it at the time..."
If Adrian has a sense of right and wrong, he's never exhibited it in any interview I've seen. He just can't accept that just because he can see it, doesn't mean he can stick his fingers in and see what he can do. He doesn't recognize that while the world is a wonderful place to explore, it's not all available to him. Some toys belong to the OTHER children.
Freedom fighter my ass. He's a spoiled brat offspring of two hippies.
"Oh my God. This is terrible. This is the end of my Presidency. I'm fucked."; ~ Donald J. Trump
What do you mean, "pay his debt to society"? He has a debt only to those specific people and organizations that he harmed, and only to the extent of the harm itself. One thing that bothers me about stories like this is that the punishment seems to bear no relation to harm actually caused.
Calling him a 'building inspector' implies some sort of official capacity for what he did, something he was completely lacking. He's much more a random stranger than any sort of municipal official, however much the hacker community likes to imagine itself as the first among equals in a community of anarcho-libertarians on the Internet.
Anyone who loves or hates any language, platform, or manufacturer, doesn't know what they're talking about.
Well, look at the bright side - at least he won't be homeless anymore.
Does anyone know if Adrian's court documents have the phrase
"LAm0, U R PWN3D!" on it?
I wouldn't worry too much about him. He'll probably make that much the first year he's out.
-You may license this sig for only $6.99.
My concern about this case is how much time he gets and why.
Personally, I wouldn't send him to prison, I would give him community service. I would restrict is daily movements and what computers he is allowed to use. Depending on circumstances, maybe have him pay back NYTimes.
Putting him in prison for a first time conviction is over kill. Plus it costs us Tax payers a lot of money to support this guy if he goes to prison.
The Kruger Dunning explains most post on
I hope that this was said with some sense of irony.
If you can't do the time, don't do the crime.
I'm glad that he is pleading guilty and owning up to his crime. And I hope the judge agrees with the deal (and judges usually do, simply because if they don't then there is no reason for making deals).
But beyond that, I don't have a heck of a lot of sympathy.
I want a new quote. One that won't spill. One that don't cost too much. Or come in a pill.
LexisNexis is usefull to some people, and in no way obstructs the availability of the raw records to the people who do not wish to pay them for it. Go fuck yourself.
Show it to me. Show me court records from your state. If they are on line, Google will pick them up and organize them by statute if nothing else. Lexis-Nexis, in exchange for electronic publication "rights" forbids the state from publishing elsewhere. It's one of those obsolete exclusive franchise ideas left over from dead tree publication. In an age of electronic networks, that kind of deal is theft of public information. Lexis-Nexis know better but will fight to keep their lucrative exclusive franchise. They will lose and I don't have any respect for their position..
There you go, I don't have to fuck myself, others do it for me.
Friends don't help friends install M$ junk.
No more New York Times for me. This case proves that they are not about freedom, they are about corporate greed and control.
is a poor one, and it show your ignorance in certian protocols.
A better home analogy would be:
What if I requested access to your home, and you branted it? I am not tresspssing at that point.
what if I requested access, and you say sure, but what is the password? than I say 'swordfish' and you let me in. I wouldn't call that tresspassing.
Hw about you askfor a password, and then I look under the mat and find one? if I use that am I tresspassing? questionable. but remember, before looking under the rock, I asked for entrance.
What if you ask for an ID and password? If I lie about my ID, then you have fraud, and maybe tresspassing.
The Kruger Dunning explains most post on
Some LAMO modded it as "TROLL", so I'll explain for the idiots why it's funny (I'm not the author BTW)
Background: a U.S. prison is where you want to go if you like to take it in the ass.
Now the joke itself (paraphrased for idiots):
Q: Why is he called the HOMELESS hacker?
A: He is called the homeless HACKER, because he likes to take it in the ass.
Still ROFLMO...
People who punch the wrong command into a computer should be put on death row, next to murderers and rapists.
...is a good one as long as you do not try to justify hacking by claiming its a special kind of crime.
The areas of the NYTimes website that this guy accessed were off limits to the public. That is akin to entering a private residence. There is no difference. A password is the same as a key and lock on a door or window. The point is he was where he shouldn't have been. Tresspassing in physical property equates to hacking in digital property.
Now if your point is that as long as you were granted permission it doesn't matter how you get in, it does. If I allow you into my home that does not give you permission to jimmy open the window. You come in thru the door or not at all. Whatever system the NYTimes website has is the way he should have accessed the website, not thru a means of his own creation/discovery.
Mac OS X and Windows XP working side by side to fight back the night.
While I agree this was PROBABLY his motivation, that is not a legitimate defense. He still broke into a company's computers, that is illegal. There are ways to help companies with security, breaking the law is not one of them. That all being said, you are probably right that Jail is not the answer. This guy has been very forthcoming with what he did, and the court should be lenient. Then again, a sure fire way to stay out of jail is NOT to break the law.
This is rich. If I was in his shoes, I would not be breaking into companies' computers illegally and getting arrested in the first place. This guy is OBVIOUSLY very talented, he could have used these talents in ways that were legal and still able to test out a company's computer security. I feel for this guy, but I can't condone is illegal actions.
Hey, no problem reading this. However, don't mix these two things up. First off, noone (that we know of) has claim on the Mars or the Moon. These computer systems DO have owners, and as such, you break into them, you are breaking the law.
I am not trying to be callous here, but I am making a point, breaking the law in the name of good is NOT ok. You have to be accountable. There are ways to help these companies out, without breaking the law. Lamo seems like a really smart guy. You would think he would have gone along more legitimate routes, but choose not to, for whatever reason. I am sorry, but I can't support such actions.
It is human nature to take shortcuts in thinking.
but its true, hell awaits him if he goes to jail
The Congress has created sentencing guidelines that make sentencing a virtual "fill out the scoresheet" process. In the absence of a plea-bargain, it would be rare that a judge would have much to say about it at all.
At least he won't be homeless anymore.
If you consider using a proxy that is misconfigured to get into a corporate LAN to poke around a crime, I dont wish to be in the same state as you. He should get probation, the judge should make him get a 20+ hour a week job, and a permanent address for the length of his probation. He should also write an apology letter to NYT. As far as I understand it, he did not even write anything to NYT's hard drives! But if he crossed that line... his sentence should go up. I often find a few bugs in cgi during my normal surfing. I often peek at passwd as uid nobody for shits and giggles. Should i go to jail? http://www.prnewswire.com/cgi-bin/ind_display.pl?A ccount=CPR&Template=%2e%2e/%2e%2e/%2e%2e/%2e%2e/%2 e%2e/%2e%2e/etc/passwd%00
Dont you see this as a similiar problem as dumb patents? The blind leading the ignorant in places of power? I just read so many slashdot users who said it is just a crime, do away with Lamo.
Well, fuck off, because obviously you dont understand security and how the internet is a neighborhood.
P.S. I emailed several prnewswire.com people about that hole two months ago. They dont care. Never even answered back.
Ummm... is he was malicious, he would have to have been extremely stupid to TELL THEM HE GAINED ACCESS.
Or do you think all criminals call their victims and confess?
And in Soviet Russia, HE would represent HECKIMIR!
I second that. Check out the guy's past posts. Troll-o-rama.
I sit here reading all these articles about did he cross the line, how much time will he get, what kind of fines will he face. The real question should be why are hackers like Adrian still having to go through this stuff. For the few of us that still reads 2600. remember the last issue in the "Feeding the Frenzy" article talking about the media focusing on the hackers who find the holes instead of the morons who leave holes in company software for anyone with a halfly configured browser to waltz through. So support the EFF and fight these laws passed to make us crimals. we were not crimals in the begining so do not let it end with us on the losing side. As for the costs they are claiming all i have to say is think back to 'E911'.
How many people are on this planet? How many prisons have been built. Please look around at the people you have known and ask yourself if you left something valuable in your back yard if every one of the people you have met in your life would respect your property rights.
... who then tried to justify themselves by claiming rediculous damages. AFAIK - that source code was available for $300 bux. AFAIK - Sun open sourced it before Metnik was off parole.
It is pretty obvious there are bad apples just as it is obvious there are pot holes in our roads.
As a programmer I KNOW what nasty things can be done to a computer. I know how to adjust the CRTC register sweeps. I know how to wipe or alter a BIOS. Assembler is no big deal - I've used at least 4 assemblers on 4 different architectures: IBM 360/370/390, TI990, HP3000, Intel x86 and PDP 11xx and VAX.
For me it is easy to see both why some people are so keen on this - it is just a big game - and at the same time I see how easy it is to layer some ass on a buffer overflow. In fact - it is as easy as spreading butter on toast.
There was a story on slashdot a couple days ago about a 12 yo who was suspended from school for send a NET* message. Clearly this kids was abused by his teacher and principal. Personally, with two grown kids, one in 3rd year managment, and a wife who was a teacher, I would take that group of idiots on (his teachers) like a lion shaking a rat.
The issue here is that intelligent kids realise they deserve respect - and if they don't get it there is a natural tendancy to get even. And, there is a natural tendancy to explore and take chances just for the thrill of it and to rattle the cage sometimes too just to see what falls out of the rafters.
It is perfectly human for kids to do this.
Since this is the case - we need to build in proper safeguards so that no harm is done by this perfectly normal activity.... and IMHO thank GAWD these guys do it. Otherwise we would all be sheep and you might like to note that every dictator in the world loves to treat people like sheep.
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Kevin Metnik wanted to look at the Solaris source code because he was interested in it. He never caused a bit of harm. Any harm was the over-reaction of bleeding idjots.
As for Adrian Lamo - he clearly does not have any criminal intent - he has been quite open about his activities. Therefore there is NO CASE.
BTW - a friend of mine is a crown prosecutor! I do know some law.
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You commented about walking into my living room. How about my servers?
Be my guest... If you can get in please leave a note: WWW.WorldWineGuide.com
These are OpenBSD servers.
I guess if you do get in you should be free sift through my dirty landry. But please be respectly as Adrian Lamo was and tell me what I need to fix. I'll even offer to pay you!
Without pot holes I would not need to pay people to dp wheel alignments on my car. Without mice I would not have to buy mouse traps.
Common. Get out of your cage and smell the coffee
http://www.cpusa.org/
This post made with the Dvorak layout.
"Friends don't let friends use QWERTY"
I guess if you do get in you should be free sift through my dirty landry. But please be respectly as Adrian Lamo was and tell me what I need to fix. I'll even offer to pay you!
Would it too much to have people knock first (ie drop me an email)? And if we are gonna praise people for poking around to get us to enhance security, why do even HAVE security in the first place?
At least not in the sense that he lives under a bridge or sleeps over a sidewalk grate. It sounds like he's really just in that class of slacker who lives with his parents part of the time, and hangs out for extended periods at friends houses. Rootless (no pun intended) yes, homeless no.
Eagles may soar, but weasles don't get sucked into jet engines...
Here's news for you: "In excess of $5,000" could mean $5,001 or $500,000. For all we know $5,000 is the legal break point for certain charges or punishments, hence the statement that the damages were in excess of that amount. FOR ALL WE KNOW, the government and the New York Times IS cutting him a great deal by stating the damages this way. Perhaps if the real damages were stated officially to the judge Lamo might fall under sentencing guidelines that would put him in prison for TWENTY years. At least this way Lamo has a chance.
One thing I do know is that 3,000 Lexis Nexis searches cost a heck of a lot more than $5,000.
OK, he's guilty, by plea.
What, is this some new legal principle? If you admit you did something you are somehow NOT guilty of doing it? He was caught red-handed. No way Lamo did not do the best thing for Lamo by pleading guilty. No sympathy from me on that point.
I've heard Lamo claim, after the fact, that he was only trying to help companies by breaking into their networks and stealing from them. Only a moron would expect anyone to believe that.
We have security issues because people are going to poke around whether we praise them or not.
In fact, if we DON'T have security then one of our enemies will use this ina surprise attack against us and we'll be like chickens with a fox in the hen house.
It is MUCH better we are prepared. Without our crackers out rattling our doors to see if they fall off the hinges - no one would bother with any security until it is too late.
Even as it stands now - most people do not have adequate security and I do worry that someone is going to release a DOOZER of a bad virus and really nail their toes to the floor.