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Online Consoles Marginalizing PC Gaming?

Posted by michael on from the gaming-unplugged dept.

MattW writes "The gist of this AP/Miami Herald article seems to be that consoles going online will mutate the MMORPG space. Already, there is word that PC game development is withering, even though as a preferential PC gamer I see the best games ever. Is the console destined for superiority, or will the ubiquitous need and superior user input of the PC keep it as a viable game platform?"

48 of 603 comments (clear)

  1. Console vs. PC by BWJones · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Well, there is always going to be the camp that would prefer to play games on their "PC" simply because they do not want a separate game box or they just don't play many games at all except for the occasional exceptional title. For instance, my work takes up most of my time (80-90 hours/week) so I really don't have much time or interest in playing games, but when Halo came out for OS X..... :-) Well, lets say productivity dropped a bit on the weekends, but I really don't have much interest in purchasing a game console.

    I suppose however that the console market may eventually become the place for the pre-eminent titles especially given the kind of hardware that will be going into the next generation systems (G5s in the next Xbox?) and that PC titles will become ports. Of course we did see this approach with Halo, but only because MS screwed it up for us by purchasing Bungie, thus delaying the launch of Halo for Mac/Win and killing it all together for Linux.

    --
    Visit Jonesblog and say hello.
    1. Re:Console vs. PC by deathazre · · Score: 5, Interesting

      I'd personally rather play on my PC because of the extra control that having a keyboard and mouse gives you. There's only so many buttons you can put on a controller, and a mouse gives you an accuracy in just about anything that involves aiming that a joystick cannot and will never be able to match.

      --
      Karma: Negative (Mostly affected by dorm trolling)
    2. Re:Console vs. PC by ferralis · · Score: 5, Interesting
      Absolutely, the PC will be around for a long time due to its extreme flexibility if nothing else.

      However, I believe that we'll see many more games that work on the console and work incredibly well on the PC as well... kind of a "yes, the 'rabble' can play, too" in a way, although I have a feeling the consoles will be catered to more and more over time. After all, one must follow the money.

      Still, I believe that as long as PC's are appreciably faster and featureful (and of course they will be- it takes more effort to stay ahead of the curve, and greater flexibility) all will be well.

      My vision is that long-term OS game engines supporting multiple platforms including consoles will take over the world, and that those of us with PC's will be able to "run games" much like MUDS of the 90's and today but with rich 3d and eventually VR-like capabilities.

      Who knows, with Maya et al, maybe that day will be sooner than I had thought. :)

      --
      Any generalization is a stupid one.
    3. Re:Console vs. PC by Mateito · · Score: 5, Funny

      > There's only so many buttons you can put on a
      > controller

      You just aint trying hard enough.

      --
      Norman Cook's Ode to Sl
    4. Re:Console vs. PC by Maestro4k · · Score: 5, Interesting
      • I'd personally rather play on my PC because of the extra control that having a keyboard and mouse gives you. There's only so many buttons you can put on a controller, and a mouse gives you an accuracy in just about anything that involves aiming that a joystick cannot and will never be able to match.
      This of course depends on what type of game you're playing. From what you say, I'm guessing you have FPS games in mind, and all of that is very true. However, when it comes to playing a RPG like FFX, the difference is minimal. I personally find it easier to control the game on a console than on the PC. YMMV of course. Not to mention that many developers use far too many keyboard commands and the interface gets so complicated the game's a bear to play. There is something to be said for simpler designs on user interfaces to games.

      I think the thing is that there are quite a bit of games out there designed with the console controller in mind and they do a fine job making the controls work great. Then they port it to the PC and the game's annoying as hell to play without a gamepad. In that case I'd rather just stick to the console.

      One thing no one ever mentions when the whole console vs. PC gaming debate comes up is whether or not you can actually get any gaming done on your PC. I know myself that I have a tendency to want to check my E-mail, oh and then there's a website I need to read, and I need to burn this CD, etc. until all of a sudden it's too late to do any gaming. If I go to the living room the PC's not there and I can actually forget about it and play games on my PS2 for hours on end. I actually game more since I bought the PS2 than I did before on my PC, even back when I was in college and had more free time. I really doubt I'm the only person out there who has found this to be true. Thanks to discovering this I'm pretty much just a console gamer, at least I'll actually play games and relax that way, and I'm on the PC at work all day anyway, not like I really miss being on it another 4-6 hours in the evening. :)

      Of course it probably helps that I have never liked FPS games, and have found I prefer the cinematic-style RPGs on the consoles (like Xenosaga, with 22 hours or so of cinematics).

    5. Re:Console vs. PC by LarsWestergren · · Score: 3, Interesting

      One thing no one ever mentions when the whole console vs. PC gaming debate comes up is whether or not you can actually get any gaming done on your PC. I know myself that I have a tendency to want to check my E-mail, oh and then there's a website I need to read, and I need to burn this CD, etc. until all of a sudden it's too late to do any gaming.

      Um, so your problem is that you get distracted from your gaming productivity by things? My problem tends to be the reverse. I sit down by my computer intending to write that important essay or whatever thing I have been putting off, but somehow my mouse slips and I start (Baldur's Gate 2, UT2004, Halo, whatever).

      "No! Bad computer! Oh what the hell, just a little bit then.... Ooops, is it midnight already?"

      --

      Being bitter is drinking poison and hoping someone else will die

    6. Re:Console vs. PC by acidrain69 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I happen to play lots of games on a duron 900 and GF2mx. Where are you getting your $900 figure from. Your first mistake was buying a more expensive, less capable Celeron. AMD rules the low end chips. I just went to an Athlon XP 2000+ for about $70 (cheaper if you buy online, I bought local).

      Yeah, it's a gf2mx, so I can't play it with all the pretty effects, but that doesn't mean I can't be competitive and have some fun with a decent game.

      So lets break it down. $200 to play a console that ONLY does console, or $500 to use a machine that I can modify to my liking, use for work and play, has better graphics (TV is still stuck at NTSC unless you're willing to shell out $$$ for HDTV, and that TOTALLY shifts things back in favor of the PC), and can play mods, which are arguably a better value than the game itself.

      --
      -- Having a Creationist Museum is like having an Atheist place of worship
    7. Re:Console vs. PC by LarsWestergren · · Score: 3, Insightful

      I should add that one thing I have done which has greatly helped with this is double booting with Linux. Default OS at startup is always Linux, and there I have all my important files, programming and productivity tools. I can still get distracted by web surfing (like now...evil evil Slashdot...), but I can't start playing games until I reboot the system and start into my toy OS... you know the one. :-)

      --

      Being bitter is drinking poison and hoping someone else will die

    8. Re:Console vs. PC by toasted_calamari · · Score: 4, Interesting

      I guess my problem with consoles is the low resolution. My TV has ~640x480 resolution (I don't remember what NTSC actually is) My computer, no the other hand, goes up to 1600x1200.

      even if the PS3 has a 9800pro with 256 MB memory, that doesn't change the fact that it has a very low maximum resolution.

      I could buy an HDTV, but have you checked the prices of HDTVs lately? far far more expensive than the cheap monitor that comes with a dell.

      also, I already have a computer, I can upgrade that computer when new tech comes out, I can browse slashdot, and do whatever I want on that computer. I cannot, however, upgrade a console, I just have to buy a new one, and I am limited to gaming.

      I think i'll go with the PC.

      --
      Let's make a difference
    9. Re:Console vs. PC by TXG1112 · · Score: 5, Insightful

      While there are keyboards and mice available for consoles, no one ever seems to talk about the ergonomics of using them with a console.

      I play a mix of RTS, RPG and FPS games, and when I play, I want to be sitting comforably at my desk, with my monitor a sharp 1280 x 1024, not on my couch hunched over my coffee table squinting at my low rez tv.

      Using a mouse and keyboard in my living room would be an excercise in frustration and back pain.

      --
      I will not be pushed, filed, stamped, indexed, briefed, debriefed, or numbered. My life is my own.
  2. Nethack or Dungeon Crawl ain't on the console by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Funny

    Sorry... but I just don't see a PS3 version of Nethack coming out. PC games will never die. :)

  3. Ask Rev. Lovejoy by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Funny

    Flanders: Is the console destined for superiority, or will the ubiquitous need and superior user input of the PC keep it as a viable game platform?"

    Lovejoy: ooh, Ned. Short answer no with a but, long answer yes with an if.

  4. Games: Topics Beat To Death by 0x0d0a · · Score: 4, Insightful

    This topic has been absolutely done to death.

    It's pretty clear that neither form of gaming is going to "die".

    --
    May we never see th
    1. Re:Games: Topics Beat To Death by Zocalo · · Score: 4, Interesting
      Maybe not "die", but the stereotypical console game has small claustrophobic levels, quite unlike the spawling open areas of PC equivalents. Similarly PC based games are often seen as being more intellectually challenging as well, rather than just something to pass the time while the latest "reality" shows are on the box. I think the real point of the article is what is going to happen to MMORGs once the console crowd gets involved in a scene they have not yet really impacted on.

      For an example, take a look at Deus Ex and its sequel, Invisible War, which epitomises the sterotypes above. DX was originally written for the PC and had what often seemed huge levels, even if this was entirely down to effective design; the Hong Kong levels in particular were very impressive at this. There was quite sophisticated AI for the time and many situations could be handled a whole lot easier if you thought about what you were doing and didn't go in guns blazing.

      Segue to DX:IW, designed from the ground up to accomodate the console market and much of the magic is gone. The levels are smaller; so much smaller that you seem to spend as much time loading levels as you do actually playing them because you have to move back and forth so much. As for the "universal" ammunition for projectile and energy weapons which smacks of "four control button consolitis"; puhleeze! No more rueing using your last sniper round on the minion to save time and now having to face his boss up close and personal with a melee weapon in DX:IW!

      So, "Die"? No, almost certainly not, but getting hamstrung to the lowest common denominator of each aspect of the targetted platforms seems equally inevitable. All those PC game genres that take advantage of PC hardware, even trivial stuff such as having a proper keyboard, are really going to suffer if the trend continues...

      --
      UNIX? They're not even circumcised! Savages!
  5. Old School by Analogy+Man · · Score: 5, Interesting

    I may be an old fart about this, but I think many of the slower more thoughtful strategy games are more fun than the twitchers. These games will always be on the PC side. I can see the migration where FPS's will tend toward the console.

    --
    When the people fear their government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.
    1. Re:Old School by spellraiser · · Score: 3, Interesting

      I may be an old fart about this, but I think many of the slower more thoughtful strategy games are more fun than the twitchers. These games will always be on the PC side. I can see the migration where FPS's will tend toward the console.

      I think you are right about the strategy games; the 'serious' gamers who play a lot of slower games don't usually buy consoles; and I'm not sure that there's a big incentive for the console developers to push into that market; except perhaps in Japan, where there seems to be a market for everything.

      FPS's might and might not gravitate towards consoles; that will, however, only happen with better controls for the consoles - playing FPS's on anything other than a keyboard/mouse is an exercise in frustration and futility. Consoles will either need provide these, or come up with something better - if that's even possible ...

      --
      I hear there's rumors on the Slashdots
  6. Are there MMOGs that allow consoles AND PCs? by jjsaul · · Score: 4, Interesting

    I love to be able to play against my console-loving nephews with a mouse-keyboard setup. Maybe I'd finally stop giving them the boundless amusement of slapping around Uncle Jim!

    1. Re:Are there MMOGs that allow consoles AND PCs? by Maestro4k · · Score: 3, Informative
      • I love to be able to play against my console-loving nephews with a mouse-keyboard setup. Maybe I'd finally stop giving them the boundless amusement of slapping around Uncle Jim!
      Once FF XI is released here for the PS2 it's one that is playable by both PS2 and PC games. Currently it's only available for the PC since Sony is delaying the PS2 hard drive launch (required by FF XI) for some reason. The hard drive's been out in Japan for at least a year now, so I'm not sure what the issues are.
    2. Re:Are there MMOGs that allow consoles AND PCs? by Jaguar777 · · Score: 5, Interesting

      I love to be able to play against my console-loving nephews with a mouse-keyboard setup. Maybe I'd finally stop giving them the boundless amusement of slapping around Uncle Jim!

      No thanks. I would rather keep the console and PC platform seperate when it comes to online play. I pay for Xbox Live for three reasons.
      1) It is extremely hard to cheat using the Xbox + Xbox Live system.
      2) High speed connections are required (read: No shooting at a 56K players lagging all over the place)
      3) Level playing field (everybody plays with the same graphic settings / options. HDTV being the exception)

      If gaming networks mixed PC players with console players I would cancel Xbox Live because I can get the same service for free elsewhere. I'm pretty sure the majority of subscribers feel that way too.
      Don't get me wrong. I don't think Live is "better" than plain internet multiplayer. I still play that way too. I just enjoy the clean sandbox benefits that Live brings to the table.

      --
      Maybe you should educate the morons of tomorrow so they'll stop believing the leaders of tomorrow. - Dogbert
  7. What about the workplace? by Bander · · Score: 4, Funny

    If games stop coming out computers, how will we play them at work? My boss isn't going to be okay with me bringing in a PS2, but he doesn't mind if I play a round of Crimsonland to blow off a little stress now and then.

    Bander

    --
    What we need more of is science!
  8. I think it will stand here by Guardian+of+Terra · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Because, show me game console equivalents of: Civilization Warcraft III ADOM :) Games of these genres does not exist on consoles, afaik. And i really need them, not something else. (I have never heard there are good FPS for consoles, while i don't know - not interested in) Consoles have their game-to-kill-weekend games market, but serious gamers will always like more intellegent devices.

  9. It will eventually take over... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Were are moving out of the era of the generalized computing device and into the era of the specific computing device. The are cheap enough now to make them to do specific things. PDA's, Cell Phones, PVR's, Game Consoles, Web Terminals... These are where Linux will win, because it will run on any of these things with minor modification, no need to wait for the "software vendor" to expand to the platform.

  10. Mod'ing games, eh? by superhoe · · Score: 5, Insightful
    Mod'ing games is an aspect most hit games utilize to the maxx. And it rocks.

    Unless the consoles can make mod'ing (especially on advanced level like on Operation Flashpoint, mmm I love that stuff) as easy as on PC, PC definitely won't die.

    --

    -el

  11. PC by blogboy · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Me, I have to take the PS2 out of the media cabinet and hook it up to play. With the PC I can take a break from work and crank up UT2004, or even get my gaming fix from a quick game of Columns. Since I'll always have a PC, I'll just keep that hardware current, piece at a time, to support the latest games, rather than saving up for PS3. The PC is functional *and* fun.

  12. Better screens? by Talence · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I'd say that PC gaming offers various advantages including better screens, more flexibility in terms of choice of hardware, more flexibility in application (not just gaming, but also e.g. word processing), storage of games (harddisk), etc.

    One could argue that consoles could be gearing towards the above-mentioned advantages too, but wouldn't they inherently be turning into PCs then?

    --
    I plan to plan / Dutch course in The Hague
  13. Without PC games by tepples · · Score: 3, Insightful

    The difference between PCs and consoles is not the input but rather that PCs don't need a modchip in order to run user-written code (even though unsigned code and signed code run in separate but equal sandboxes in newer restrictions-management-enabled operating systems). Only PCs allow programmers to make games without getting a license from the hardware manufacturer, and console makers tend to grant licenses only to established publishers, reinforcing the oligopoly. Without PC games, how is anybody supposed to begin to learn to develop games?

  14. Depends on what you play by Hekatchu · · Score: 3, Insightful

    To me Its a matter of the game, simple, FPS-type and jumping and bouncing like a mad rabbit type of games are absolutely best when there is console with decent gear involved. Then again, complex RPG:s (or did they already die 10 years ago?) and games where you are allowed to think before you act are in my mind always going to be better with real computer environment. But its only my opinion :)

  15. Re:Desktop Computer Are Becoming Less Relevant by rhiorg · · Score: 3, Insightful

    ...unless of course you're into the whole "getting work done" thing.

  16. Two words: LAN party by bliSSter138 · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I host a local LAN event and even if/when I've seen consoles at said events, there was only one. No one that I know wants to lug a 32"+ television around. 17" LCD, oh yeah. Shuttle (or comparable mini-) PC - you bet. I can appreciate where console gaming is headed - it's needed to step up to the level of the PC experience for a while. At the same time, console gaming still, INHO, pales in comparison to gaming on a personal computer.

    The types of games that I, and most of our LAN attendees, play on a PC are dramatically different than a comparable console title. The Battlefield and UT2k series are beautiful examples. I have friends with Xboxes that hated UT Championship and I can't even fathom trying to play BF on a game pad. These games still harbor mass followings on the PC platform. At the same time, Splinter Cell is amazing on a console, and marginal at best on my PC.

    P.S. - Halo PC ran SO horribly on my system (Athlon 2500+, 1GB ram, 256MB Radeon Pro video), that I invoked MS' 30-day money-back guarantee. They were prompt with the refund so, apparently they are good for something. :-P

    --
    the only difference between a rut and a grave, are the dimensions
  17. Well by GFLPraxis · · Score: 3, Insightful

    It seems to me that FPS games play better on the computer, while the majority of other action games play better on the console. I generally buy games for console first, UNLESS the game supports Internet play, in which case I buy it for PC so I can play online. I have Zelda: Ocarina of Time for N64 and I downloaded the ROM of it to see how it'd play on the PC, and slamming keys on the keyboard is vastly inferior to using a controller. On the other hand, I could never stand playing a game like Jedi Knight 2 and Jedi Academy on a console with dual joysticks- I WANT A MOUSE. A game like Zelda: The Wind Waker is better on a console, and a game like Jedi Knight 2 is better on the PC.

  18. If other OSes gain popularity... by MolecularBear · · Score: 4, Interesting

    If other OSes (i.e. Linux) gain popularity in the desktop market, then I would expect even more games to move to a console market. Let's imagine that Linux becomes so popular that it shares the desktop realm with Windows 50/50. Now a game developer must make the game cross-platform. Instead of dealing with issues with one OS, they now have to deal with two. At that point, it seems like it would be much easier to simply develop for a console where both hardware and software are known constants. Anyone else have ideas/opinions about this?

    --

    Magnatune: Quality (DRM-free) MP3/FLAC/
  19. multiple factors by Lust · · Score: 4, Interesting

    I'm very concerned about this. With the console market so strong (and why not, with the cost of a PS2/Xbox system less than just an average-quality video card), I don't see any way a game company can afford NOT to develop for a console. And so will we see the end of games like Starcraft that really can't work as effectively without better UI?

    I really hope not, but we've already seen posts about Deus Ex II having a crappy interface that parallels that required for a console.

    I had an opportunity to play Metroid Prime recently, given all its hype. I was very impressed with the game from graphics to story, but I got too frustrated by the controls. I couldn't stop thinking how easy these things I was TRYING to do were on a keyboard/mouse combo, but were complicated on the console by trying to press three buttons at once while moving one or another stick. So I scrapped it for Tony Hawk, which is totally suited to a joystick/controller.

    Please tell me that PC gaming will live forever :)

  20. Different Demographics by RailGunner · · Score: 5, Insightful
    The PC as a gaming platform isn't going anywhere any time soon - and one of the reasons is that the PC Games market is different from the console market. Sure, there's some overlap like there is in any good Venn Diagram, but for the most part it's two distinct segments of the gaming community. For example: A friend of mine will only play PC games. Sure, he's a bit of an elitist, but he's not touching any "inferior console". He plays Call of Duty, Medal Of Honor, Warcraft 3, GTA3 / GTA3 Vice City, etc... My brother-in-law is a fireman, he owns a PS2 and plays Madden 2004, NHL 2004, NCAA Football 2004, SSX2, Tony Hawk's Underground, and has no intention of upgrading his PC to play games on it. There are those of us in the middle, who play both PC and (in my case PS2).

    In the end, it's all about the games, not the console. Some games, even the multi-platform port releases, just seem to play better on one platform over the other. Madden 2004? I'd rather play it or any other sports games on my PS2. Unreal Tournament 2004 or any other FPS? PC. Warcraft 3 or any other RTS? PC. Button Mashing Fighting Game (Soul Caliber, Tekken) - PS2.

    The PC as a gaming platform is far from dead - there's just too many of them in homes for game developers to ignore. Also, most of the biggest console games (GTA3 / Vice City) get ported to the OC, and in the case of GTA3, the graphics are FAR superior on the PC.

  21. Room at The Top by RetiefUnwound · · Score: 3, Insightful

    A lot of pundits on the topic of console vs. PC seem to keep ignoring a subset of PC gamers - the Power Gamer (we know who we are).

    The top echelon of PC hardware will ALWAYS offer better performance than the latest console - and a lot of software houses (Lionhead comes to mind) are constantly seeking to push the envelope - not just graphically but in terms of AI and interactivity.

    Consoles are great - but no substitute for the power of a screamin' PC box. Sure, PCs can be a pain in the ass to code for because of the mishmash of hardware on the market - but a lot of gamers will build new PCs to experience the best a new title has to offer. Knowing that this audience exists will keep software houses producing for the PC until there are no more games to be played. Nuff said.

    --
    "Nothing is so important that you cannot make fun of it." -Clarke
  22. Price of console vs. price of graphics card by G4from128k · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Its interesting that the price of a new console (PS2, XBox, etc.) is less than the price of a highest-end graphics card for a PC. Given that most people have old PCs, buying a console is the cheapest way to get into gaming. Add to that the comfort of a couch and big-screen TV vs. a desktop, I can see why many go for consoles.

    --
    Two wrongs don't make a right, but three lefts do.
  23. It's simple, really by Perdition · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I have played PC games before, although I am absolutely not a "power gamer" by any measure. The problems I saw were ones of investment, maintenance, and learning curve.
    For instance, I remember loading a relatively simple game on what was once considered an OK laptop. I came to find out that in order to truly have the game running at anything near a fun speed, I had to add RAM, and quite a bit of it. Now the game no longer costed the original $25, but potentially hundreds more. I didn't like it that much. Plus, most PC games I have seen install scads of undesirable adware, spyware, etc. (I'm sure that things have improved on this front, however), and the unending act of cleaning up menus and doing uninstalls of old games I no longer enjoyed (if the uninstalls went smoothly, which often they did not), just got tiresome.
    Another, much more minor gripe: keyboard/mouse/joystick setup. I admired some PC games for their flexibility with all the added buttons that a keyboard brings, but having a dozen keyboard overlays and remembering what alt-shift-A does from one game to another seems a bit much to me.
    Once again, if you're a PC demigod with a passionately deep understanding for how to clear up these problems, you probably just think I'm dull-witted. However, I'd rather keep my PC as a productivity tool, and buy the occasional console instead of installing card upon card (among other bits that others could more effectively list here) to play similar (if superior) games. As consoles more successfully go online and increase their power and playability, the role of the PC as gaming machine seems more and more to be that of hard-core hobbyists, and not just people who want to play games.

    --
    Windows XP SP2 told me to install third-party software that prevents viruses and protects stability... I chose Ubuntu
  24. Superior user input on the PC? by Zetta+Matrix · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Don't give your computer too much credit, now.

    It's more about fitness for a particular purpose. Console controllers are very good for certain kinds of games - platformers, sports games, shooters, etc. I agree that if your universe only consists of FPS, then I think the mouse and keyboard will beat a console's controller (imo). Computers are also well suited for strategy games that involve clicking on units such (both real-time and turn-based).

    There's a reason that strategy flourishes on PC and platformers and shooters flourish on consoles.

  25. No Killer PC Apps Lately by pezpunk · · Score: 4, Interesting

    nahhhh. it's simple. there just haven't been any world-shaking titles for PC lately. When the next Starcraft or The Sims or Doom comes out, you'll see articles again speculating about the death of the console.

    just wait till World of Warcraft and Doom 3 come out.

    --
    i could live a little longer in this prison
  26. Re:Thank goodness for Microsoft, then... by mr.capaneus · · Score: 3, Interesting

    I think that will do more to destroy PC gaming than anything else. If I see another half-assed PC/Xbox/PS2/GC game I am going to puke. Rather than being an exceptional game on one platform, they are mediocre on all of them. I really enjoyed playing KOTOR but I think it could have been a much better game if developed solely for the PC. When I compare it to a game like Baldur's Gate 2, it is shallow and the controls are lame. The more PC game publishers that get lured over to the Xbox, the worse PC gaming is going to get.

  27. It's ALL about the controls by xylix · · Score: 5, Interesting

    I had actually been thinking about getting a PS II recently. Then I went to a friend's house last weekend and actually PLAYED a PS II for the first time ever. (Yeah, I live under a rock. Shoot me.) A few months back we played Unreal Tournament (PC) via the internet and I ran circles around him. We fired up Unreal Tournament 2003 (PS II)... and I got absolutely slaughtered!

    I know it was my first time playing a FPS with a game pad but I can't imagine actually prefering that input over a keyboard and mouse for a FPS. After that experience I am having second thoughts about getting a console, and thinking about just building a good PC gaming system instead.

    Playing the Lord of the Rings game was a better experience with the game pad ... but that isn't my kind of game anyway. Simpsons was another game where I didn't mind the game pad, and actually might prefer it after some practice.

    But at the end of the day, I can easily get a game pad to work with a PC, if I prefer that input for some games, but AFAIK you can't use a mouse + keyboard with a console.

    I agree with a poster above - it is all about what you play. With certain genres of games (FPS, RTS...) PC input is better.

  28. Hardware Issues by maddogdelta · · Score: 3, Insightful
    One point I haven't seen made yet is about hardware issues. One of the problems with game development on a PC is what hardware is in use? I know that as a consumer, I can purchace the best hardware available, but that doesn't mean that the programs will be written to take advantage of it.

    Case in point, remember 3DFX? Great hardware, great software interface, great linux support. Lousy longevity. They are gone, swallowed up by Nvidia. So all of the games that worked great on my voodoo 3 card now absolutely stink with an equivalently priced Nvidia card (maybe if I buy a newer card)

    My point is not to bash nvidia, but to emphasize that the games that worked great with voodoo were specifically coded to take advantage of that card, and because of that, would almost have to make other cards look bad. If I had purchaced games that were coded for nvidia, then i would have seen the exact opposite effect.

    Now what is the development team to do? Re code software so that every single video card is supported? Rotsa ruck. As soon as it goes gole, there will be 30 more cards that aren't in the package that will require the patch to be downloaded.

    Contrast this to ANY console. Sure, I can purchase much better hardware for a PC, but every console developer knows exactly what hardware he/she is coding for, and doesn't have to waste 6 man-years coding for multiple cards. Everything works. Performance is squeezed out of those machines to the nth degree.

    I don't think that this will mean either platform will 'die' but until video card developers come up with a 'consensus' set of api's that developers can code for, then it will always seem that the user will need a custom pc to for each game to get the best performance out of that particular title.

    --
    -- There are 10 kinds of people in the world, those who understand binary and those who don't.
  29. How can anyone afford a gaming PC? by wwwrun · · Score: 4, Interesting
    It astonishes me (as something of a non-gamer*) that the PC games market can survive. How can anything like enough people be prepared to fork out $1000 for the PC they need to play the latest games, compared to the market for a $100-$200 console? Especially given the games are roughly the same price. The spec you need to play recent games bears little resemblance to the kind of machine you need for almost any other task, so it must be less and less the case that PC gamers are making use of PCs they'd own anyway.

    I understand the modding scene is fantastic, but can anyone offer an insight into how PC games find a market worth developing for?

    (*)I take it nethack doesn't count?

  30. Not to call out the trolls, but... by Dragoon412 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    ...PC games are on their way out.

    The PC's viability as a gaming rig, as best as I can tell, rests on two traits: superior display technology (via hi-resolution displays), and superior control in some games, via a mouse/keybaord setup.

    Think about that... the PC's viability rests upon a rapidly-closing gap in display technology (see: HDTV), and $10 peripheral (and even at that, I think if half the people shrieking about the loss of control with dual analog would actually give it a fair shot, they're see that's not the case; I mean, how long did it take to get good with a kb/mouse in the first place?).

    So, what we'll have in a few years are:

    PCs:
    Pros:
    +Multi-function
    +Large back catalog of games that may or may not actually work
    Cons:
    -Hideously expensive in terms of upkeep (hardware)
    -Game-breaking driver and hardware-related problems
    -Expensive OS required in addition to expensive hardware
    -Notorious for buggy releases with players essentially paying money to do QA work for publishers, and devs with a "we might fix problems later" mentality.

    Consoles:
    Pros:
    +Comparitively inexpensive
    +Works with already-ubiquitous displays
    +Little to no hassle to play games; consoles just work (for the most part... Ubi can't seem to get it right)
    +Excellent performance due to standardized hardware
    Cons:
    -Can't play games based around bleeding edge hardware.

    So what's left? Online play? Xbox Live blows away anything the PC's ever seen. Give it another generation to clean up the UI and make a few other minor improvements, and online gaming via PC will feel downright archaic.

    The point is, considering the cost and issues inherent in PC gaming, and the console market rather swiftly nullifying the PC's few advantages, what possible reason could there be for the continuation of the PC as a gaming platform?

  31. PC gaming will be around as long as the PC by Ochobee · · Score: 3, Interesting

    I don't think that PC gaming will ever die out for one simple reason:

    Everyone will own the platform.

    Some people may by an Xbox, some may buy a PS2 and some may buy a Gamecube. When future generations of consoles are released, there will be people who buy them as well.

    But nearly everyone is going to have a PC (or a Mac) because they use it for other things as well. Not everyone will stay on the cutting edge of PC gaming, but they will continue to use the PC for years to come.

    --
    Good people do not need laws to tell them to act responsibly, while bad people will find a way around the laws. -Plato
  32. Re:Disposable Income? by ajs · · Score: 3, Informative

    Recessions are classically a gold-mine for entertainment. Just look at the boom in hollywood during the great depression.

  33. Credit Cards are Evil by Chibi · · Score: 3, Insightful
    In a supposedly down economy, where people are losing jobs left and right, how do we come up with the cash and time to buy both PC games and consoles?


    As another poster pointed out, one fact is that while unemployment is high, there are still a good number of people with jobs.

    The other thing to factor in, though, is that in the US, most people aren't as financially responsible as they should be. We love using our credit cards to spend money we don't have. It almost seems as if we think there's something wrong with saving money in this country. And our federal government is leading the charge.... Last time I heard numbers, the reports indicated that over 50% of households live paycheck-to-paycheck. Now, there are probably some people who are spending their money on essentials, but I imagine there are more than a few people spending beyond their means on leisure items, such as a video games.

    --
    If all you have are silver bullets, everything looks like a werewolf.
  34. Re:Why I love my PS2 by EulerX07 · · Score: 3, Interesting

    The PS2 costs about as much as the graphics card I would have to buy to get comperable performance out of my PC

    That's a bit of an exageration, altough a common one. In canada, the base PS2 (not the online pack) is 200$. For less than that price I can get a GeForceFX 5600 or a Radeon 9600 pro based card that will totally wipe the floor with the PS2 as far as frame rate/eye candy/resolution goes. Actually I can even get a TNT2 for 19$, and it might have a chance of beating the PS2 at the same resolution that the PS2 operates in.

    Not that your point is invalid, a PS2 is the cheapest alternative. The quoted statement was just a bit much. The reasons the top PC card cost so much is that they're built to run games with WAY more details than PS2 games at 1600X1200 with 60+ frames per second.

  35. Tactical Mistakes By Games Companies by pandrijeczko · · Score: 4, Insightful
    I have no doubt in my mind that PC game development is slowing as games companies move more and more over to consoles. There's several reasons for this:

    1. Sheer number of titles / emulation: it's probably a safe assumption to make that the kids & young adults generally go for the consoles while the parents & older ones use PCs for gaming. Therefore, it's probably safe to assume that the older lot (myself included) enjoy the emulation scene and reloading up old games - in turn, we have less free time for new games and buy less of them. Therefore there's less and less profit for the games companies in PC Games.

    2. Game modding: great for the general public to extend the life of favourite games by downloading free mods for Half-Life, Quake, etc. but ultimately a tactical mistake by the games companies. After all, I'm still playing various Half-Life mods several years after its original release meaning, again, I've bought and played very few new games.

    3. Game quality: console releases seem to be much better thought out than PC game releases. Console games tend to be more formulaic - beat-em-ups, sports & racing games, etc - but also seem to be of a consistently better quality. In my experience, maybe 10% of all the PC game releases are of a reasonable standard while only a handful each year are classifiable as "classics". The games companies have only themselves to blame for this - magazine and Internet review sites mean the general public can be a lot more selective with their purchases.

    4. Network gaming: modding aside, it's possible to buy a first-person shooter on the PC and finish it in about a day's worth of play to be ready for the next game. Network gaming, although great for us players, extends the usable life of titles to be much longer meaning that, again, we buy less new games. This is why the gaming companies are obviously moving to a model of server subscriptions to keep the money coming in. But ultimately it'll result in less, longer-life titles being released.

    From a personal perspective, I'm getting older and getting slightly bored with the modern games scene anyway - I'm now really only looking forward to Doom3 and Half-Life.

    And while I'm pretty comfortable on the "disposable income" front, I'm simply tired of with the endless cycle of hardware upgrades that seem to be a requirement every 6 months or so in the PC gaming scene.

    I really miss the 8-bit and 16-bit days when games developers were forced to push the hardware further and further to create better and better games rather than simply expecting us to upgrade all of the time.

    The classic days of gaming are long dead...

    --
    Gentoo Linux - another day, another USE flag.