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THG Linux Migration, Part Two
LqqkOut writes "Tom's Hardware Guide has posted part 2 of their Windows->Linux migration article. This time around, we're presented with some nifty divx screen caps that make life look oh, so easy. The Tom's crew packed a lot into this article, but did they sacrifice some essentials like 'RTFM' and other sage advice? This follows up their first article where users were shown how to choose and download a distro, back up some important data, and check for HW compatibility."
Do they walk you through setting up a slashdot ID?
You are not the customer.
I love how they demonstrate video players by showing Steve Ballmer's sweaty-pitted Developers video on Xine.
Perhaps I missed something in the article... but why are the installation screenshots RedHat and the desktop screenshots SuSe?
-- If you can read this, you are too close to my signature.
I thought TFA said it was using RedHat9, but the screen shot of a fully installed system is SuSE.
The only reason we have the rights we have is that people just like us died to gain those rights. -- Cheerio Boy
1. Move from MS Office to OpenOffice.org (cost: 2 weeks to settle down, 1 month to adapt fully)
2. Move from MSIE to Mozilla (cost: 2 hours to settle down)
3. Move from Outlook to Mozilla Mail (cost: 1 week to settle down)
4. Switch the OS when no-one's looking (cost: $40 for Xandros, 1 hour per PC).
Seriously: the key to migrating is to start with the applications.
Ceci n'est pas une signature
Don't you just hate that phrase? The whole "RTFM" thing is quite funny if you ask me. I know of NOBODY that has RTFMed everything they touch.
If I RTFM before I did anything, I wouldn't ever get anything done, as I would still be RTFM.
I hardly ever RTFM, and when I do, it is in reference to a singular problem. As in, "how do I do ______", and RTFM section on that.
Actually, if one could write a FM, they ought to be able to SCRIPT it and put it in a GUI, don't ya think?
Here is a trick that nobody has thought of, how about a CLI command builder. You know a GUI interface to utilities and programs that doesn't actually do anything but create the CL necissary to execute a command you need done.
That way, a person could use the GUI to improve their CLI skills.
Agent K: A *person* is smart. People are dumb, stupid, panicky animals, and you know it.
I just recentally installed Fedora with out a problem. Every thing works great except my 3d card. I have installed WineX and am able to install games but they run slow due to the fact my card doesn't seem to be supported. I have had a good linux experience so far and hope to never have to use Windows again. I wish this guide would have been around before I got started to answer some of my questions. Escpecially on installing applications.
As a person who mainly cut his teeth on Windows and DOS-based PCs, this series of articles helps out a bit. Sure, it's fun to figure things out yourself, but I'm not always in the mood to have to reference Google every time I try something new and exciting. Now only if they had something that would remember all those console commands so my stupid brain doesn't keep filling up. =P
...this Divx video will be split up into 50 page views of 5 second video clips.
Dance, monkey boy ("Woohoo! I love this company!") (3MB)
and last but not least...
The 3-minute Developers music video (9.5MB)
-- If you can read this, you are too close to my signature.
I'm not just piping in on this topic, I have had to deal with dependency BS just like the rest of anyone who hasn't had some obscure perl module.
Thank microsoft's installapp creator (visual studio) for alleviating this problem on the Win32 side of things. Linux is left to flounder without, since there's no real way to baseline the needed dependencies and install them with the application across multiple Distros/versions easily.
Automation is what makes computers useful, big round buttons make them usable by the avg.
Linux and Porn are such a good combination!! Using wget I can make simple scripts to download sequences of images or videos. Mplayer handles almost every format. No pop-up overflows. No spywares.
I know this was geared towards newbies, but I was hoping for a little more about the software. I never had a problem with linux, but I still think the software I use in windows is better than that available in linux. Yeah there's more choice, but all those options never seem to cut it for me. Actually, I think the only things holding me up are photoshop and windows media player and lack of printer support. Oh well, maybe next year...
People don't want to "see under the hood" or "download the GTK+ development library."
They just want it to work, hence the use of Internet Explorer. Many OSS advocates simply don't get it. The obsession with "choice" and "freedom" has produced difficult-to-use software that gets reinvented by about 20 other competing clones, all doing things differently. Somehow this is supposed to be good.
If you don't have any questions, then no one will tell you to RTFM.
If you have a question, then you RTFM.
If your question is NOT answered in TFM, then you ask it.
Actually, lots of people have thought of using a GUI to put together a command line statement. Lots of people have even thought of using a GUI to import/export text based config files.
They missed out hardware, i think its important for them to mention that most hardware manufacturers are bitches when it comes to supporting, or even being in support of linux or any other OS than Windows, If you're switching to linux make sure your hardware is fully supported, its not enough that there are 'drivers availiable' you have to be ruthless and only buy the most popular and known to be supported stuff, make sure you search the forums and dont waste your time on anything thats not used by less than 30% of the linux community or anything that people complain about because its going to cause you grief.
let me just add to the list:
-Sagem f@st 800 ADSL USB Modem and PPPoA, just hassle
-ATI All-In-Wonder Pro dual screened with a 9200SE - if you get this working ill grovel down to you.
-Diamond S90 (vortex) sound card - shove it up your ass, you'll get better performance
and unrelated - IBM Deskstar harddrives - if you hear that grinding noise your screwed.
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My first reaction when watching the videos was duh, but then I realized what a great job he had done. We are a culture that flat out doesn't like to read instructions, having it done in a visual manner was a smart move. Also seeing something done right before your eyes is a much bigger confidence builder then just reading a quick howto on the internet. Look at the Outlook migration video. How nice is it to just say "download the video on it" and know that they probably won't need much assitance beyond that. People and companies especially pay big bucks for videos like this which train users how to install or use a product. While they are not the most comprehensive Linux video training out there and I have a few minor nitpciks, its Free so how can you knock it? Tom's has done a real service to the community with these articles and videos and they deserve our thanks.
If you wanna get rich, you know that payback is a bitch
This bothered me too, but maybe that's because I've been using Debian for so long. Seriously, do Linux users really work like this? Hunting after the right RPM's and such? I mean... I remember doing that in 1999 (and it was a solved problem even then) on Mandrake, but they had already begun work on urpmi or something similar at the time. Honestly, I haven't dealt with a real dependency issue in half a decade and I haven't had to compile an app that I didn't write in years (unless I wanted to package it myself for some reason). I thought this was long solved for all distros now.
Do you guys really live like this? If so... why?
"I may not have morals, but I have standards."
Evryone made this whole Migrating from windows to linux thing such a big deal i dont know why...anyone who ever installed windows all the way...i mean setup for a blank hd then drivers then updates then some tweaking like turning off services and disabling and enabling some stuff can install any redhatish distro without a problem...but most people belive it or not can't do that with windows...i see many people who cant right click the right way ....those people need service with anything and i think more than half of computer users are like that that ive seen...migration is hard because its not in the OS...OS dosent even matter...if i put anyone with windows experiance in front of my Gentoo box they would not have a problem with my KDE they chat and browse just like on windows....but what if somoene needs some app thats not there for linux...I use Autocad for exaple to do work and i need it...same gouse for ALPHACAM and Cabined Vision and those are not avalable for linux ...now until they i have to work with windows cuz there are no viable alternatives for those apps....but for the basics like office stuff and browser multimedia OS or migration is a no issue...just choose whatever u like best and go for it.
And of course tons more run with Wine[X] including those Direct3D only ones.
Lets not forget the GREAT Linux games too...
NO reason not to use linux for games!
You are on the spot with the key issue; to start somewhere and start in smaller scale with the apps.
:)
There are several apps that can live side-by side with MS products without major harm done; Mozilla, Mozilla Mail, OOo as examples.
But before the migration is complete:
1. Don't underestimate the power of MS Office macros, VBA-scripts and specially the users that made them. They can be hard-necked.
2. Don't forget about the ActiveX components and other "MS standards", XML parsers etc. too often with connections to business apps that needs to be rewritten. (Of course they should have been industry standards from the start, but most corp. environments aren't.)
3. The PIM's from PocketPC's that people are used too synch with Outlook is also an issue. Yes, there are FOSS alternatives for synching, but you have to take that into the equation aswell, adding complexity (and cost!) to the migration.
4. I like the idea of guerilla migration when no-one's looking
All in all, the business case, with a clear budget for migration costs including and all the marketing, education (end-user, sys.mgr.) and communication efforts needed, must to be committed to be able to migrate successfully.
The more you know, the less you need. [Admin added: from me.]
Did anyone notice the statement that xmms was a great program for playing mp3s? On RedHat? Without mentioning that you have to download and install mp3 libraries, due to the proprietary nature of the mp3 codec...
Oops!
Haven't looked at the video, but the first (and only) RPM I have to find after installing Red Hat, is:
APT!
Just go to rpmfind.net, look up apt, and select the correct version matching the version of Red Hat you have installed. Download it, and install it:
rpm -Uvh apt...
Congratulations, that's probably the last time you'll have to search for an RPM! After that, keeping Red Hat up-to-date, and finding and installing most programs, is:
apt-get update
apt-get -u upgrade
(and occasionally "apt-get -u dist-upgrade", for when a bunch of stuff changes)
or, to find and install some package:
apt-cache search program
(review available versions)
apt-get -u install program-version
Done! All except for blowing away Red Hat, and installing Debian instead. Then, you can access the rest of APT's powerful features, and really pick and chose between what Debian release you want to run (stable, testing, unstable, experimental).
-- -pjk Perry Kundert perry@kundert.ca http://kundert.2y.net
In fact, [a particular program] is used in many some big movie studios such as ILM, Sony and DreamWorks. If it's good enough for them, it should be good enough for you.
Quotes like this make me cringe on so many levels.
1. What do they use the software for? Perhaps they only use it because some intern set up a script to automate a file renaming process. That doesn't make it good enough for me
2. What makes you think my needs are completely met by something that meets someone else's needs? This argument has no value. "Kibbles and bits - if it's good enough for lassie, it's good enough for your half a bee, Eric."
3. ???
"I'm not a real Linux user, but I advocate Linux on my hardware site. Testing hardware is tough, but when my working evironment consists soley of Windows machines, at the end of the day I like to go home and relax at the command line of my RedSuseBian. There's nothing like a good scripting session to clear the head and soothe my tender muscles. Try it! You'll like it - I gaurantee."
Bleah. Leave the PR quotes to real PR people, and just give us the facts.
-Adam
I have said it once, and I will keep repeating it. Linux will not get any more popular until the Apps are as easy to load and setup as in Windows. RPM's are a nice step forward, but Linux is not there yet.
I have just one App that is keeping me in XP, it is Autocad 2004, soon to be 2005. Sure, I could run it under wine, but I need it to work 100% of the time, with all of its functions. I don't have time to deal with Wine in it current form.
I think this guide is too much lacking in specific details to be any use to some one who's migrating, for instance some advice about apt-get and where to find rpms would be useful.
I have just switched myself. One of the most fustrating part of it is installing apps, not because of the dependancy problems that's easy to solve. The real problems occured for me because you need to use two user accounts, one to install and one to run the app. Windows users aren't used to this, so get it all mixed up and end up with half the configuration settings in the root directory and half in their regular home directory.