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Review of the Roku HD1000 Media Player
Animaether writes "Digital Producer magazine are running a review of the Roku HD1000 HD media player hardware. Between 'The unit crashed so much while I was testing it, I practically beat a path through the carpet to the unit's location on the shelf...' and 'Roku HD1000 misses by such a wide margin, it isn't worth buying', the review paints a pretty grim picture of this unit, and appears to put part of the blame on its Linux-based OS and software. The Roku HD1000 was previously covered here in December 2003."
Simon.
Physicists get Hadrons!
Take care!
Erick
http://www.busyweather.com/
A negative review and front-page linkage on /.? Good luck recovering from this one, Roku!
This is my United States of whatever.
There are just too many electronic gadgets on the market that are poorly designed and frustrating to use.
Engineers have a lot of great ideas and can even make them happen but there are a lot of angles they don't see or even think of. Many of the engineers aren't even the target users and don't really understand how something gets used.
This is one place I will give props to the military. They require Quality Assurance and testing by the user before they will sign off on something.
Evolution or ID?
It seems clear from the review that the application stack in the Roku is not ready for prime time, but that is not really the fault of Linux.
Other embedded-Linux applications have successfully made boot-time a non-issue.
Unfortunately, in an embedded application, the presentation is monolithic -- it either works or it doesn't. So, this is going to seriously adversely affect the image of Linux in Set-top-box applications.
How does the Slashdot Effect happen given that no slashdotters ever RTFA?
Yes, it can do these things, but because of its awkward Linux-based operating system and sluggish response, the thing acts like it doesn't want to.
My guess is that the reviewer is talking about the "operating system" of the Roku in a broad sense, and not in the sense that computer geeks do. He probably means "interface", and should not have included "Linux" in that sentence; after all, he does go on to praise the Tivo, which is also Linux based (as he himself says). Just bad writing, if you ask me.
Does it strike you as odd that a consumer product should require that one "know what they were doing" when they purchased it? Shouldn't the product be easy to install and use?
I'm not sure you RTFA, but your response sounds like a knee-jerk to me. If I buy a Tivo, I don't want to have to spend hours and hours getting it to work. I also shouldn't need any programming or configuration expertise.
If you're producing a device like this for the general public, you'd better not make it hard to use or install. So that would be a problem with the product.
What I like about this article is not that is blasts Linux, but Roku's implementation of it. I had considered getting one of these instead of modifying an Xbox to play media files (and yes, I've heard of the "Windows Media Center" machines, and I'm too damned cheap for that - I've decided to modify an Xbox myself and save the $).
;) ).
Anyway, the reviewer takes pains to note that the Tivo, which is also Linux based, is fast, responsive, and doesn't crash all of the time. Maybe this was a beta unit the reviewer recieved, but it seems as though the company hasn't tightened down the Roku's implementation and gone through a good QA session.
Too bad, really. I wouldn't mind finding a box that I could plug into the TV and stream my (personally, using Handbrake for OS X) XviD videos to my TV (to save wear and tear on my DVD's and keep my kids from getting thier fingerprints all over them) over my 802.11 connection.
Looks like I might as well get ready to order that Xbox and mod chip to "do it myself", since nobody in the industry seems to have a solution that does what I want yet. (Note: I know the Tivo can evidently tie into iTunes and iPhoto, but I haven't of it being able to read through a AFP or SMB share of movies and just play them. I'm willing to bet I'll see 10 responses regarding Myth or some such, so advise away - I'm holding off on the soldiering kit as long as I can
52 Weeks, 52 Religions with John Hummel
I agree with you, but I think (hope) he meant the people at Roku who set up the box didn't do a very good job of customizing it for what they were using the system for before they shipped it.
The real question here is: How are we going to blame this on Microsoft?
Linux doesn't crash! Seriously, if this company has that much of a problem with designing their interface to be stable, perhaps they shouldn't be in the consumer electronics game.
Since the consumer isn't the one setting up Linux on the box I'm pretty sure he was refering to the manufacturer. It's not a Linux problem, it's a poor implementation by the manufacturer.
Same way with the author's comments. He's not dissin' Linux. He acknowledges it's Linux based and that Tivo is also Linux based and then he contrasts the two in that Tivo is a dream to work with compared to the nightmare that this product provides. Again, it's an implementation problem, not a Linux problem. Maybe it could have been worded better, but when you take it in the context of the full article (or the full thread) it's not that difficult to see.
--
As a matter of fact, I am a lawyer. But I play an actor on TV.
He does harp on the fact that it runs Linux pretty often, even when it's insignificant-- like the OS has something to do with a poor user interface.
'The unit crashed so much while I was testing it, I practically beat a path through the carpet to the unit's location on the shelf...' and 'Roku HD1000 misses by such a wide margin, it isn't worth buying', the review paints a pretty grim picture of this unit
Yes, yes, but can it run linux?
and appears to put part of the blame on its Linux-based OS and software
Oh.
Do not taunt Happy Fun Ball(TM)
I don't believe that the instability of this unit is because of the Linux-based software it runs. There's many other stable Linux-based media devices out there, such as Sigma Designs EM8500 DVD players, the Dreambox DM7000S DVB Satellite Receiver, Hauppauge Media MVP, and more. Bravo manufactures Linux-based standalone DVD players using the Sigma Designs chipset, as one LKML message points out, for example. I myself put the instability onus squarely on the shoulders of Roku's product engineering, having seen myself some very successful applications of embedded uClinux technologies.
You think the squeezebox is ugly? Really? I have one and I think it's pretty cute (as does the SO). It's very small and nicely rounded, with a sexy rubber coating. I agree that the Roku looks better (I considered getting one of those but it kept being delayed) but the SB is far from ugly. I wouldn't put it in my hifi stack (too small), but that's what the HTPC is for. I have it in the bedroom on a side table so we can have access to the entire music collection from there as well. It's hooked up into a discreet set of 2.1 PC speakers hidden away behind the lamps. All in all a fantastic solution.
---- Den ene knappen er powerknapp, den andre er Bender voice knapp "Bite My Shiny Metal Ass"
If this unit was Microsoft made, the OS would be blamed left and right.
Ahh, at least I'm not the only one here who sees the double standard.
* Anything Linux Based Product: Good!
* Any Linux Bug: Unskilled and/or incompetent Users
* Anything Window Based Product: Bad!
* Any Windows Bug: Unskilled and/or incompetent coders
Help Brendan pay off his student loans
"These people like makers of Roku, in my opinion, lacks a business minded person on their board of directors, at least one very good example of this kind. Idea is good but marketing it half-baked is not going to do this company any favor."
It should be noted that the founders of Roku created the ReplayTV. You know, Replay. The DVR unit that has bankrupted two former holding companies of the technology and despite being on the market as long as TiVo, has only secured 100,000 + users.
"Right now, somewhere in this world, Scott Baio is plowing a woman he doesn't love," - Peter Griffin, *Family Guy*
"That's what they get for not using a production ready operating system. Why would anyone choose Linux when they can use Windows CE?"
The NSA uses Linux. It is more than production ready. I've never modified my Xbox, but it does crash from time to time. My TiVo has not. And let us not forget that Microsoft has used its OS in a PVR before, their very own UltimateTV, which failed in the face of TiVo.
"Right now, somewhere in this world, Scott Baio is plowing a woman he doesn't love," - Peter Griffin, *Family Guy*
Yes, I'll agree it isn't perfect but it is interesting. It will pick up smb shares without a hitch from browsing your network. There is info available for doing NFS as well. I've got the weather plugin working perfectly. It's also nice viewing all my photos on a 42" HD Plasma. Most "media PC" type machines don't offer component out especially with support for 1080i which is what I run. If you buy one be sure to grab the latest firmware and also install the copy/delete programs so you can easily delete some of the built in stuff. You can also do all that through telnet too. I would like to know if it's possible to overclock the CPU. I'd willingly put a larger heatsink on mine if it'd help performance. Video support still needs more work too. All in all, I do like it.
The reviewer seems to stress the fact over and over again, with a much redundnacy, and many repeats, simply restating the idea that the unit locked up a lot. Maybe *gasp* he had a defective unit...
And it doesn't seem he has anything against Linux besides a poor word choice. He even sort of commends Linux on the TiVo.
LilMikey.com... I'll stop doing it when you sto
Ahh, at least I'm not the only one here who sees the double standard.
Yeah, 'cause for a second there I thought you were the only one with that observation, luckily after all these years on slashdot someone had the guts to post what the grandparent posted! All of those Apple and Linux threads we've seen, and nobody has pointed out the double standard that exists among all slashdot users (even you, deep inside your heart)
I am surprised that the review was this bad. I don't own one of these, but I have been following some discussions about them on avsforum.com, thinking I may soon buy one.
On avsforum, there are certainly complaints, and people asking for more features, but nothing as bad as this guy's review.
Also, I think the review may have been a bit aggressive. The advertised features of the Roku are for display of digital images and audio - in an HDTV environment. The other things this guy reviewed are not part of the advertised features, they are third party applications and extensions. These extensions are encouraged by Roku.. they talk quite a bit about their open Linux platform. But, you can't really condemn Roku because of bad third party apps.
He also says that the third party apps had a distinct beta feel. Well, that's because they are beta apps.. or even alpha. If Roku provided the apps, they made a tactical error. If the guy downloaded them himself, he didn't read the descriptions very thoroughly.
Based on what I have read from Roku users, my feel for the product is this: The core feature set of HD display of images via flash or network connections works well. As does playback of MP3/AAC audio files over the network. The third party apps - to stream HDTV captures or DVD VOB files is in its infancy. They work for some people, but are not mature or reliable enough for common use. I am waiting for HDTV streaming and control before I buy one. I would like to use the Roku for playback of HD files captured with a MyHD PCI card - the combination giving something close to PVR functionality (record one program, while watching another).
Home Theater Spot gave the unit a favorable review here . Based on their reveiw, the unit looks pretty nice.
I have been running a Sqeezebox for a month now, and I really like it. I went through and cleaned up my MP3 tags, now browsing artists/albums/genres is a breeze. Yeah, it does not stack with the other components, but it works so well, I don't care.
Does anybody now if the Squeezebox is running an OS at all?
The review is by Charlie White.
Now, it may well be that the thing is not ready for prime time, although some other reviewers seem to think it is.
It's just that, I've read Good Old Charlie's stuff before, reviewing things I'm intimately familiar with.
His experiences, conclusions, and pretty much everything else conflicted with mine so much that I now simply trash anything with his byline without reading it at all (I didn't notice his byline on this article until the bottom of page 2; in other words, the end. I wish I'd noticed it earlier, coulda saved some time).
Bullshit. It's got nothing to do with the fact that it's Linux, and not Windows. It has to do with the fact that the Tivo, which is Linux-based, is apparently well designed (I don't know...I haven't seen one personally), whereas this Roku thing (doesn't that sound like someone off LOTR?), which is also Linux-based, apparently sucks.
Notice:
Tivo - Linux - Good.
Roku - Linux - Bad.
Windows never entered the equation at all, until you brought it in yourself.
Of course, if it ran Windows, and it got a virus/worm/spyware/trojan infestation, then it would be totally the OS's fault.
"City hall" in German is "Rathaus" Kinda explains a few things......
"the review paints a pretty grim picture of this unit, and appears to put part of the blame on its Linux-based OS and software."
And for this, fellow Slashdotters, he MUST BE PUNISHED!!! ARRRGHHHH! MAN THE STOCKADE!
I wonder how hackable this thing is. If it's possible to install a *different* version of Linux on it (or even Win98SE for the mostly non-Linux literate folks like me)and how fast its processor is and what amount of RAM it has. and I wonder if the extra cost would be worth all the component outputs, or if an Xbox would be better for that sort of thing... It would probably cost more and be harder to hack, but might you get better performance? Or would you be better off building your own sub-$300 PC with decent specs or even getting an Xbox for the performance/cost tradeoff?
Hard work pays off tomorrow, but procrastination pays off NOW!
Yeah, but Roku basically ripped off an old version of the Slim Devices software. They say it uses SlimServer, but you can forget about using any of the zillions of SlimServer plugins with a SoundBridge since Roku used an ancient version.