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Industrial Design Excellence Awards 2004
burgburgburg writes "The IDEA 2004 awards (Industrial Design Excellence Awards) have been announced. Apple won 2 Gold (for the iPod Mini and the G5), a Silver (for the iSight) and a Bronze (for the Apple Wireless Keyboard). Some comments: 'Like a modern touchstone the iPod Mini is a product people will love to hold. The designers skillfully integrated the satin aluminum case with flush controls and a simple touchpad interface to create a jewel-like piece of technology.' - Monty Montague, IDSA, Design Principal, BOLT. 'The G5 is impressive with visually lithe qualities and a host of thoughtful and innovative user features wrapped in aluminum. Its well-engineered technical features, such as its cooling system and internal component mounts, are honestly and elegantly executed. The G5's aesthetic is a pure and graceful expression of Apple's philosophical precept of leaving no detail un-designed. This is what results when engineering and design play nice with each other.' - Christopher Alviar, IDSA, Principal, CG/A"
no you're not and between the new river everyone says looks like crap and the ipod/mini ipod, I know which one I like the look of a lot more.
I thought they werent that great either, but once you actually hold one, you see what they were talkking about. i wouldn't trade my 40 gig ipod for the world, but the mini is a pretty well designed music player.
I never realized that you could photoshop a physical object.
I generally don't pay attention to marketing pictures, and they really are nothing special in the pictures, but hold one in your hand.
This, of course, is not surprising news to most of us. What's confusing to me is the complete inability of other PC manufacturors to produce intelligently-designed computers. I mean, c'mon ... most PCs nowadays still require you to remove a handful of screws to get inside the case. And once you're inside, it doens't get any prettier. I have yet to see any other computer maker come close to Apple's design.
-- n
I was just talking about the aesthetics.
but still only room for one optical drive.
you assume that everyone that holds one will like it which won't always be the case.
Is the Apple Wireless Keyboard a standards abiding Bluetooth device? Is there any reason I couldn't use one on a PC running Linux? I just wasn't sure that Apple had used the standard keyboard profile (or whatever it is called in the Bluetooth spec) or if they had 'improved' it in some way that would keep me from using it with another OS.
I wish there was some way to modify the categories you want to follow. Some way. Even if it required me to log on and customize my preferences. Some kind of dynamic front page, I think its doable. And some kind of moderation of comments, maybe based on mod points? To MOD DOWN stupid comments.
An mp3 player, a webcam, a computer case and a keyboard would of got such praise from many people?
Jonathanjk.com
Going thew the site I have found some real good ones (Non Computer related) Like a Hammer I find it amazing that after millions of years of humans making hammers that they can still improve on it. It really gives me great faith in the advancement of science that we can improve anything for years to come. Also I found it odd that the best interface was for Mohawk Paper Mills While it is nice and all I didn't find the interface a wow that is so much more intuitive to use then any other site. But still I find it is nice that it won because I drive by the mill every day to get to work (With its huge smoke stacks billowing out tons of steam).
If something is so important that you feel the need to post it on the internet... It probably isn't that important.
Well, the Apple-is-pretty (and Google-is-blessed, and SCO-is-evil) articles do serve one useful purpose: they remind us that the success of the personal computer and related techno-gizmos has brought powerful forces to bear on the nerdly world. It no longer matters how clean the code is; it matters how nifty the case is. It's no longer just enough to come up with a good idea; it must be marketed. And it's no longer as easy as creating something useful and sharing it with the world; now there are lawyers involved.
Am I part of the core demographic for Swedish Fish?
Since lots of design focused people may read this.
Build cell phones with the number pad at the top and the screen at the bottom. this makes using the keys on a small phone easy for western hands that are often bigger.
Charles Puffer
Actually in the past year or two -
Apple designs have been very lackluster in my opinion.
The G5 is nice looking but was a BIG step backwards. Removal of one PCI slot and removal of a second 5.25" expansion bay.
The keyboard that won here doesn't match - the white does not match the Pro line like the silver and black Pro input devices did.
The only real update to the iMac line in the last year has been a 20" screen - which is nice but that design one it's awards 2 years ago.
If the rumors are true about the new 20 23 & 30 inch displays coming - they too will be a step backward from the current design.
Apple should be winning kudos for software lately. Hardware, I'm not so sure
The iPod has admittedly gotten better.
Yell & scream & rant & rave... it's no use... you need a shaaaave ~ Bugs Bunny
I have friends who never even WANT to open their computer, and they happen to have Macs. Want to add storage? Buy an external, supported FW drive. Network? Built in.
PC owners are a different breed. They LIKE opening the case. They LIKE planning their next upgrade. They LIKE replacing heatsinks and then benchmarking the performance improvements.
This being said, the vast majority of people really should buy Macs.
But don't pretend that PCs and Macs are the same, just with a different OS and mouse - they're different concepts.
I want to delete my account but Slashdot doesn't allow it.
The reason Apple make good designs is that rather than trying to fit as much as they can onto everything, they try to take as much off, so that there isn't anything unneccesary.
;)
Take the iPod Mini for instance, they only have one control, but they have all the functions that you could do with 6 buttons (left, right, buttons 1-4).
However, The most important lesson is that we should all make everything out of Aluminium. take a look at Lian Li cases, which are also very attractive
Well Slashdot could be like some other sites and just put out news of all the cool stuff and awards that Microsoft produced and won. Apple products are often ahead of its time in a lot of details. So viewing apple products is like seeing what will be available in the future. Besides there is a lot of stuff that Slashdot doesn't display on the site that is apple related. Checkout out macslash and many of the apple related sites it will make slashdot seem calm in comparison. Basically now that OSX is unix based it has became Geek Friendly.
If something is so important that you feel the need to post it on the internet... It probably isn't that important.
I love apple products. They're beautiful. And I'm just hoping I won't get modded down for what I'm about to say, given that this is the apple section.
However, of all the things there, I really think this one is the coolest. I want one of those!
And there's a cameo appearance by apple as well.
Be a PATRIOT--because the only thing we have to fear is the lack thereof.
1. You could write to your local congressman asking him or her to pass a law that compels the owners of internet sites like Slashdot to make provision for editorial control for story selection to be vested in the hands of the users (specifically, you).
Or 2. you could just scroll down to the next story.
...iSight got the same award as an angle grinder, and the iPod mini took the same award as a heavy duty thickness planer... and a salad bowl.
To be honest, looking at all the winners in the different categories, the Apple ones aren't anything special. Looking at Computer Equipment category, I see Samsung, HP and Logitech alongside Apple's G5 - all worthy of equal praise IMO.
If you're interested in Apple's corporate design, there's an excellent book called Apple Design: The Work of the Apple Industrial Design Group--
8 88 001259/103-7823380-3150263?v=glance
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/1
I found it while ago at a bookstore and it's quite good.
Learn how to use the filter, Stanley!
I hate Grammar Nazi's
It's a pity that they only awarded consumer interfaces to computer-related products. I would have loved to to see an award for the best designed server rackmountcase for example. That would also bring the attention to the fact that there is something to be designed inside these things. Something which some of the manufacturers themselves don't seem to know.
And don't tell the X-serve would win this.
I just got a G5 this week (my first Mac in years since a 6100) and I was blown away when I took it out of the box. I can't remember when I last saw a piece of computer hardware that made me just want to inspect its every nook and cranny. The CPU is such a beautiful example of form, function and fit. Simply gorgeous. Now if Apple would only rethink their keyboard and mouse designs - mine immediately went back in the box to be replaced w/ Logitech wireless hardware.
As for OS X - lots of good human factors engineering at work there as well. There are a few aspects of window management that I dearly miss from my Linux boxen though like middle mouse button paste and the window-embedded menu bars. The latter is a real pain on multi-display machines that force you to mouse to the other end of the desktop just to access a non-hotkeyed menu option. I've gotta spend some time surfing, because I have to believe someone's made a hack for the middle mouse button paste at the very least.
Like a modern touchstone the iPod Mini is a product people will love to hold
Hah. Chance would be a fine thing.
If you notice, everything that won an award, is, no matter how complex, relatively simple.
None of the winning products had useless features or sails hanging off the side. These products had what they needed, and only that, to fulfill their purpose. take the winning website design, it is one of the most basic and simple designs for a site you can probably find, its simple to navigate, and is quite fast.
What is hard to understand is that why more compaines - mainly pc hardware companies don't take note. There weren't any tower PCs on the list, or websites filled with pop-up and banner ads. I think we can all learn alot if we just pay attention.
Can anyone here comment on the responsiveness of Apple's bluetooth keyboard? I certain reviews their is complaint about lag and I was wondering if it was true. Also , what about the security of the bluetooth connection?
And with that attitude, you thereby insure they remain average users who don't know what they are doing.
Do you mean CPU in the PC sense, or CPU in the 'I like my computer because it's shiny and I think the CPU is the big boxy thing' sense?
This story should be here, but why is it about Apple?
The first thing when you go to the site: "The 130 winners of the 2004 Industrial Design Excellence Award (IDEA) won are listed in the categories listed below."
130 winners!!? And Apple won a whole 4 awards! Well, I guess this story should be filed under 'Apple' and not 'computer stuff' or 'inventions' or 'design' or whatever. There are 12 categories and each one seems to have 3-6 gold awards in it, so there are about 30-40 gold awards, let alone silver and bronze.
A great many people here like Apple, respect Apple, but do not think the light shines out of the lower orifices of Apple. There is really no reason to classify this as an 'Apple' story. It would make a great story about modern design aesthetics, but instead some Apple fan decides to post it as an Apple-centric piece of news. Nokia, IBM, and Samsung seem to have done quite well too - but this would never be posted under 'IBM roxx your world' or 'Samsung recognised as world's greatest computer designer' or whatever. So why antagonise the non-Apple-fanboy majority by needlessly politicising this story?
Read Pynchon.
Why should we miss out on a story about innovative designs of all kinds just because we are sick of hundreds of boring pro-Apple stories? The issue is partly categorisation, not just the high numbers of Apple stories.
Read Pynchon.
I worked with someone who has that hammer. I said "Wow, that's a fancy hammer. How is it?"
He nodded his head approvingly and said, "It's good.". I took that to mean it was good.
Have you seen the Creative Labs Zen Touch? It looks so similar to the iPod and also has a touch-sensitive scrolling interface navigation method. Even the screen looks nearly identical. It seems Creative Labs has done just what you said.
It no longer matters how clean the code is; it matters how nifty the case is.
Completely untrue, both in the case of Apple and Google.
For Apple, the software they write is tight, powerful, well designed, and elegant. You can reach common functions easily, and the consistency between applications means you don't ever have to do such things as guessing whether "Preferences" is under "File" or "Window".
OS X, iLife, and other Apple software are examples of what well-designed software should be. As a software architect, I am consistently impressed at the dedication Apple has for putting out not only beautiful but rock-solid pieces of software.
Yeah, yeah, I know the rules, but the moderation of the parent is pathetic. A hell of a lot of people do agree - we are sick of Apple stories, especially those as tenuously about Apple as this one. Yet it is moderator-censored into oblivion before the thought crimes can be seen by the children.
Criticising Apple is not a 'troll.' Criticising those who blindly love and follow Apple is not a 'troll.'
On the other hand, rampantly posting any piece of crap story that has the word Apple in it is a form of meta-trolling that pisses a lot of people off. Coming soon on slashdot... farmers predict 5% rise in apple harvest... Steve Jobs reported to be pleased.
If you think something like 'built in networking' is an Apple-only feature, maybe you should look at the way the PC market has evolved over the last 2 years. Most motherboards now come standard with:
- network
- USB 1 + 2
- firewire
- sound, usually Dolby Digital 5.1 with optical output (my Mac friends with older models still can't believe this is 'standard' given they have to shell out over $100 for this honour)
- RAID and SATA
Basically, the only things that are replaceable are those that are likely to BE replaced/upgradeable within one motherboard generation, i.e. CPU, RAM, HDD etc. Even these things are less and less daunting - most motherboards will automatically detect a SATA hard disk and CPU settings without user intervention, for example.
And frankly, I would rather have my computer components like my organs - INternal.
Read Pynchon.
1. Make technically average product
2. Put the picture of a flat paer on in
3. ???
4. Profit!!
Fuckwads
My PC case has excellent airflow, and I don't actually need a screwdriver to open it. I just turn the thumb-screws and off it slides. Many newer PC cases also open with simple clips, rather than screws.
Out of interest - what aspect of a case is 'ergonomic'? I mean, Apples have handles, is that what you mean? Other than that, I try to avoid physical interaction with my case...
Read Pynchon.
Parent is flame
ergo
Grandparent is flamebait, not parent
Cool
Webmaster of Infoweb
Ergonomic is the wrong word, maybe convenient is the best description. My ideal case would require no screwdriver. Ideally opening with a latch, or maybe a thumb screw. Though any screws should not be seperable from the case. I don't want to have to keep track of screws removed from the case.
Drives and expansion cards (and ideally, motherboard as well) should be held in place by latches that lock into place. The internals of the case should also be rounded so they don't cut you while working inside.
As for handles, those are nice as well. I don't move my PC around often, but when I do it would be nice to have something to grab on to.
I like the G5 case because Apple has managed to do most of those things and made it look good at the same time.
Apple has been ignoring unix users for 14 years (to the day) in their keyboard design.
Their laptops are effectively unusable for unix users.
I am a long-time Unix user. That means I need to have the Ctrl key to the left of the A key. This is a genuine need, not merely a want; it is based upon ergonomics. The Ctrl key is heavily used in unix, and it must be easily accessable. It cannot be off in the lower left corner of the keyboard where it is difficult to get at, and where it distorts the position of your left hand such that you can't easily type other keys while holding the Ctrl key down.
Apple desktop keyboards are now all USB. They are all OK. The CapsLock key can be re-mapped into a Ctrl key.
Unfortunately, even in this modern age, all Apple laptops have built-in ADB keyboards. The ADB keyboard is broken-by-design. It is, in general, not possible to remap the CapsLock key into a Ctrl key.
There are some exceptions, but they are horrible kludges. They are horrible kludges because the original design of the ADB keyboard was a horrible kludge. The correct solution would be for Apple to re-design their laptop motherboards to use built-in USB keyboards. This hasn't happened yet. If you run Linux, use Debian's solution. For Mac OS X users, uControl works. There are no solutions (that I know of) for either NetBSD or OpenBSD. Please note once again that the "solutions" above are in fact kludges, because of the original bad design of the ADB keyboard.
Apple provides a technical note on how to remap the keyboard, but provides no solution to the hardware problems caused by the design of the ADB keyboard. This tech note helps foreign language users, but does nothing for the CapsLock/Ctrl problem.
Apple is (currently) ignoring Unix users! This is not merely speculation on my part. In an on-going email exchange I am having with an Apple employee (whom I won't name) in their marketing department, the Apple marketing person directly stated to me that Apple was catering to their historic Mac customers, and is purposely ignoring the Unix market. He also claimed that Apple would soon start paying more attention to the Unix market. I won't hold my breath. Apple has been ignoring Unix users for more than 14 years (14 years to the day as I post this). I expect that trend to continue. (Also note that my Apple contact indicated that Macs would never ship with a 3-button mouse, even though Apple intended to port almost all X-window software and deliver it either on a CD/DVD or installed directly on each Mac's hard drive. How Unix friendly is a 1-button mouse with X programs that often require 3 buttons?)
Apple has now lost two opportunities to sell me hardware. I really wanted an Apple laptop for their superior battery life, and for the PowerPC with Altivec CPU. (The Altivec is vastly superior to the x86 line for DSP.) Because I can't live with the broken-by-design built-in ADB keyboard in all Apple laptops, Sony and IBM sold me laptops instead. If Ap
the current case on my pc have jsut that, all card are held in place by latches, the difrrent drives with a similar feature, one thumbscrew and 2 simple latches that fits nicely into the overall design of the case. there is even a crarrying handle for when i want to bring it to a lanparty:)
http://www.suntekgroup.com/stk6551.htm
could use a new powersupply tho as the current one makes a bit of noice (got it cheap)...
comment first, facts later. http://chem.tufts.edu/AnswersInScience/RelativityofWrong.htm
Subject says it all
Unless I'm missing something, most ergonomics experts recommend that your keyboard is in a position that keeps your wrists from bending; i.e. without the back of the keyboard elevated.
I made the original post. My intention is not to troll. If anything, I hope to motivate Apple to fix this long-standing problem, and warn unix users.
I could broaden my post to include all input devices. Consider the hockey puck mouse for example. But I didn't.
I specifically want to movitate Apple to fix this problem, and to inform unix users of potential problems with Apple laptops .
Apple dont make shit themselves, they buy it from Alphatop and the rest of the Taiwan companies who also make it Dell et al, you really think Apple has fabrication plants and LCD factories ? heh reality distortion is strong
think of Apple as an expensive Dell with a custom jacket, other peoples stuff re-branded
If Apple keeps losing 0.5% marketshare or so a year, in less than a decade it'll be history. That's sad when you consider just how impressive OS X is in comparison with Windows. It's sad when you consider that, unlike Microsoft, Apple really is innovative. It's sad when you realize that Macs really are far more hassle-free.
Apple's problem is that it's too obsessed with winning design awards like these--awards that are likely translate into maybe 1000 additional sales a year. That's a tiny drop in the great ocean of desktop computer sales and a recipe for disaster.
Apple needs to realize that Windows (and soon Linux) have improved visually to the point where most untutored buyers can't see a difference. They're buying a computer to do something other than make a fashion statement, and by that standard Macs simply don't measure up.
I've own Macs for almost 15 years. But when I consider replacing my seven-year-old beige G3 I balk. Apple's dismal desktop sales reflect the unpleasant fact that, unlike their laptops, their desktops are grossly uncompetitive. In the PC world, I could find a dozen and more models that have a blend of features and price I like. With Apple I find nothing making the hassle of an upgrade worthwhile.
In desktops, Apple has the same mindset that almost sent Henry Ford into bankruptcy. Ford's problem was a "any color you want as long as it is black" mindset. He paid no attention to the market and let General Motors steal away his customers. Apple's 'don't listen to the market' mindset is identical to Ford's. I've got two perfectly good monitors. I don't want to pay more for an eMac or iMac to get a computer that forces a monitor on me and leaves me no option to add a second. I want what the PC world provides in abundance--a box that lets me mix & match to get the features I want at a reasonable price. I don't want optical audio out or a WiFi card built in. I don't want a low-end machine that probably cost Apple more to make because they deliberately crippled it in comparison with pricer models.
Apple is, unfortunately, still mired in the Eighties, when it was different enough to maintain market share despite the fact that it didn't deliver what the market was really wanting. But now isn't then. If if doesn't want its computers to become mere appendages to iPods, it needs to look at the sort of computers people are buying, and build models just like them. It needs to copy as well as innovate. Wise people know how to do both.
In short, Apple needs to listen more to us and less to a bunch of elitist, stuck-on-themselves artists and designers. A computer is a tool. It isn't an object to be placed in an art museum to be "ouuud" and "ahhhhd" over.
--Mike Perry, Inkling blog , Seattle
Proper keyswitches register well before the end of their stroke, and provide gradually increasing resistance the rest of the way down. Rubber-sheet keyboard register at the end of their squishy stroke, so you have no choice but to bash your fingers against the bottom all day long.
Apple used to make decent keyboards - the Apple Extended Keyboard is wonderful (once modified to put the control key in the right place). The Extended II is almost as good. The smaller M0116 and the compact Apple ADB Keyboard - the obvious inspiration for the physical form of their latest abomination - are good too.
If you plan to keep using your fingers, get one of those old Apple keyboards and an ADB-to-USB converter. Or get one of these. Or, for that matter, get an AT-to-USB converter and an IBM Model M, a Fujitsu FKB4700 (OEM, many labels), or that skinny one with the fold-over function key templates.
I'm not so sure about that... For starters, why would the new displays be a step backwards from current models? It looks to me like they're making them in aluminum enclosures to better match the G5 and aluminum Powerbooks, so that just makes good sense from a design standpoint. Also, the decision to change them back to an industry-standard DVI video connection allows them to work with Windows PCs as well as Macs. That means more potential sales for Apple, but also means those of us who own a G5 but a Windows laptop can easily share the display with either machine, without buying an expensive add-on product to convert display connectors.
I'd also argue that the Aluminum Powerbook deserves an award for its design. They've got the only keyboard with backlighting that actually lights up the characters on the keycaps, instead of just the spaces between the keys. There are no exposed doors or hinges to break off. The 17" version is still the lightest weight and thinnest laptop available with that screen size, period. If I had to find anything they did wrong with it, my only change would have been incorporating a numeric keypad on the 17" model - rather than wasting all that horizontal space to the left and right of the keyboard. (But then, that would add complexity for Apple, since they couldn't interchange keyboards with the 15" and 17" models.)
As for complaints about the keyboard not matching the G5, that's true to an extent, but traditionally, I thought black and white were considered "neutral colors" that matched anything. I find that since I added a Kensington Studio mouse to my G5 setup, it acts as a transition between the G5 and the keyboard. (The Kensington mouse is partly white plastic, just like the Apple keyboard, but also silver/metallic on the top.) They could have released an aluminum desktop keyboard I guess.... but the current arrangement isn't too bad, IMHO.
And I'm sure loads of others would agree with me that we're not tired. Not everyone likes the same articles; if you don't like it, don't read it.
your english is good but you are misled about carpel tunnel syndrome and RSI... certain people are just prone to it - no matter WHAT keyboard, fretboard, mouse, pointer, pencil etc.. they use, they would develop it. truthfully, most get it because they way the approach their mouse or keyboard. they are usually way uptight about grabbing the mouse with way to much force, or pound keys to hard, or sit in bad positions, hold their guitar wrong, etc... and of course there is that little something called personal preference - just because you dont like doesn't mean its bad design - clearly you are the very small minority here... and that's ok too... you just dont like it - so what - keep it to your self instead of wasting valuable /. time for us! ;-)
... Like a modern touchstone the iPod Mini is a product people will love to hold ...
The reason for this is simple: iPod is pure Bar of Soap.
The "Bar of Soap" design methodology simply states: the most initimate 'implement' most people use these days, is the bar of soap. A bar of soap goes where no other implement goes. It is held and used in loving trust.
Design any consumer device to match the parameters of a bar of soap, and it will be loved...
; -- the corruption of government starts with its secrets. a truly free people keep no secrets. --
It's a DESIGN award, not a technology award.
The whole point is that things that look nice win; if someone had a beautiful box with a 286 in it that served some function, it would be considered.
---
Mod me down, you fucking twits. Go ahead. I dare you.
(I read with sigs off.)
I was at a friend's house the other day and saw a CRT iMac on her desk. I hadn't seen one in a while, it's kind of amazing how dated it looked-- and how the millions of them sold all seemed to completely disappear. Even the slate-and-blue G4's and titanium Powerbooks are starting to look dated-- and it's only been, what, a year and a half or two years since they went out of production?
Apple's smart, consistently re-designing their computers in radical ways... Especially considering how many of their customers are in design fields and must have the latest and greatest, if not for their own egos then to prove to clients, etc. that they're current with the times. It's funny that Apples are built to last years longer than the average PC box, but the case will make them feel obssolete long before the Appleecare warranty's up.
If you didn't notice, /. accepts articles from users to be submitted for review, and I know that, if the article is /. worthy, it will probably end up getting posted. If you see something important in regards to tech that you like, you might want to write up an article on it, and submit it. That's what the "contribute story" link at the bottom of the page is for.
By reading this you acknowledge that you have read it.
Uhm, I can use it without looking at it at all. You memorize the positional relationship of the 4 buttons - back, menu, playpause, forward. The scroll wheel is just that. Since they're indented into the case, you can feel their locations. Someone who's blind wouldn't have any trouble using the buttons.
The bigger problem for a blind person is one I don't believe any MP3 player has solved - they all rely on an LCD. How do you navigate when you can't *see* the navigation interface?
---
Mod me down, you fucking twits. Go ahead. I dare you.
(I read with sigs off.)
What would Apple be without the "elegant" design of the hardware?
:)
To me it would be an overpriced computer system...
You really have to think hard.... is ease of use worth sacrificing features (is full screen view in the free Quicktime player YET? and... 2 mouse buttons anyone???) and software availability (Linux & Windows--- Max Payne & Photoshop on the same computer.. imagine that).
Why pay $500-$1000 more for a computer and get less...
Maybe once the Mac easy and simple world merges with the PC do everything cheaply world then I will be sold... but right now Apple MACs are just pretty boxes to me. (And I LOVE pretty boxes... don't get me wrong
I hope this doesn't sound too anti-Apple but I think we have a long way to go with "personal computing" and that is beyond Apple's proprietary realm.
They've never offered a bargain-basement computer because they want their brand to be associated with quality hardware. While sometimes their products suffer defects, in general I have found their hardware to be far above the industry average in longevity and ease of use.
According to your comment, the G5 has speed you might have to pay half as much to get in a PC. This is one of those price comparisons that is of course impossible to refute. Sure, there's a PC out there that runs as fast as a G5 and costs half as much. But the problem with such comparisons is that you can use whatever PC you want to represent the price point. Are all PCs truly created equal? Of course not. If you want to compare price based solely on processor speed, you're simply ruling out all of the other factors that go into selecting a computer.
For example, you take Apple to task because you don't want to buy and eMac or iMac, and you want something that the PC world provides in abundance - a box that lets me mix & match to get the features I want at a reasonable price. You're comparing the entire PC market against one company. Does Dell offer every single variation you'd like? Does Gateway? Does HP?
You also mention that Macs really are far more hassle-free.. I assume you're referring to the operating system. So even the top-end PCs suffer from more hassles. How do those hassles translate in terms of overall cost? That's tough to estimate, but consider that Mac users have truly insignificant security and malware problems when compared to Windows users.
Your comment about Jobs being overly concerned about the G5's noise is a bit odd. If he hadn't insisted on making a nice quiet new G5, would you have gotten on him for not fixing it? Apple doesn't always succeed in making the best overall user experience, but it's truly at the core of how they see themselves in the market. Of course they're going to try hard to make a quieter machine.
It seems to me that you're frustrated most of all with Apple's philosophy. Apple doesn't want to make low-cost, commodity boxes, because they know that in the long run that's an extremely dangerous game. Look at all of the "cheapest" PC companies that have come and gone over the years. Macs will never dominate the computer market, but Apple has never been in better shape and is continuing to innovate and expand into new markets. Just look at their forays into digital hub software, niche professional software, online music retailing, portable music players, server systems, and supercomputer projects.
They are very much a design-driven company. To them, and to a lot of their customers, a computer isn't just a tool. This is in Apple's DNA, just like sacrificing all to achieve marketshare is in Microsoft's DNA.
If you're willing to pay a bit less in order to get the PC configuration you want, you're forgoing ease of use, hardware longevity, far fewer malware and security problems, an extremely stable OS, all of the iApps, peripheral ease of use, and better overall design. That's your choice. But don't blame Apple because you can't get all of the benefits of a Mac at the super low-low price of $299. R&D costs money, and the bargain-basement PC vendor isn't spending any money on R&D or design.
I'm not an elist stuck on myself artist, and I'm not a designer. But I really prefer using a machine that works for me instead of against me and saves me time and money over the long haul.
As for Apple dying inside a decade, just remember what these other fine prognosticators said in their day:
"Stick a fork in 'em - this Apple is cooked."
Robert Thomson, Financial Post, 2/20/2003
"The iPod, with its backward-looking feature set and dramatica
Read the EFF's Fair Use FAQ
my logitech mouse came with a nice preference pane that allows pretty much unlimited mapping of all its controls. it's a mouseman dual optical, and i *highly* recommend its ergonomic *right-handed* design. the double-precision (and very stable) mousing is secondary to the good design. it actually fits my hand - my hand is not tiny, nor is it symmetrical, and i can't figure out why so many mice are.
but yes, i just checked, and you can have middle button paste if you want. just do it with a key combo.
How hard would it be to screw up on making a good hammer?
Apple products are, by and large, nice designs. Apple makes some bad blunders, but they pay more attention to design than many companies. But you also pay for that. Other companies make good designs in that they manage to do good tradeoffs: the device may not be as sleek, but it's cheaper, for example, or has a more reasonable battery life.
But I frankly doubt these "designers" even considered such products because they didn't even think of them as "designer" products.
My ugly laptop, for example, is more convenient than my sleek Ti Powerbook. My ugly MP3 player is a lot more useful than the iPod. Etc. Unlike Apple products, those may not be designer products, but the no-name Asian companies that designed them did a great job with limited resources. And that's what good design is really all about.
The Blue-and-white G3 with the faulty IDE controller that corrupts a second hard drive, the short-lived battery on the iPod, the faulty headphone jack. Great machine (I started off with one myself), but too many problems associated with it. Besides, nothing you can do on a Mac that can't be done on a PeeCee for a fraction of the price. I recall a joke award given to apple (NYT or somethin')"Designed-Like-a-Picasso-and-Priced-Like -One"
While I always find these awards interesting, success often doesn't translate into sales.
The Vadem Clio, for example, had an outstanding design (even if it did run a sorry early version of Windows CE).
It was a Gold winner, as I recall.
But it was a complete flop in terms of sales.
I still have my Clio; I still love it. But the product stalled early, got sold and repackaged, and then died a miserable, pitiful death.
Do most people really care about good design? I don't think so anymore...
Have to to agree - I'm totally underwhelmed by the feel of my G4's keyboard. I'm surprised that more people haven't complained about it.
So it is a technology award.
Industrial design has more to do with the visual appeal than with the things under the core. My 286 example might have been a bit hyperbolic, but you don't see any Opteron systems on their list of design awards, do you?
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Mod me down, you fucking twits. Go ahead. I dare you.
(I read with sigs off.)
Silicon Graphics has had the best case/system designs in the Industry. I think the O2 is the greatest desktop system ever built. Too bad it represents a dead end.
Yes Apple has historically been unusually aesthetically-focussed for an IT company. But it seems to me that the partial switch to becoming a free software company has allowed them to concentrate more on their core business: cool devices. At the very least their tentative embrace of free software has not cost them anything; and arguably they have better software to run on their award-winning (and staggeringly popular and profitiable) hardware than if they developed a wholly proprietary OS in-house.
Hopefully they will soon see they have nothing to lose by freeing the rest of their proprietary code.
It may be too much to hope that a competitor of Apple's, whose name I dare not breathe in polite company, will abandon their losing battle against software freedom and follow Apple's lead. I don't see that happening anytime soon. I'm just glad I don't have a vested interest in the future of that company, because it may not have one for much longer.
As a long time UNIX/Linux/BSD (and now OS X) user who spends most of his waking time getting intimate with *nix boxes, I take great issue with your insinuation that I don't know how to use different keyboard layouts.
How do you cope with the re-arranged keys on normal laptop keyboards? Most of them have double-mapped keys which serve the function of more than one key at a time.
>it matters how nifty the case is
Funny you should mention that. Apple's first computer didn't even have a case.
>It's no longer just enough to come up with a good idea; it must be marketed.
When was having a great idea and not telling anybody about it enough? "Build a better mousetrap..." is just a saying.
Cleanliness of code has never been a critical success factor. Ask IBM, or Microsoft, or Apple (especially Woz - the Apple II was full of impressive hacks, but they were hacks).
There's nothing about a Lian Li case that is either unique or attractive. All they did was take a PC case design, and make it out of aluminum.
Apple did not exactly forge new territory with their thermal zone concept- one need only look at a Sun Ultra to see the CPU's air intake is ducted, for example. Digital also used some interesting arrangements with the Alphas, in part because they -had- to thanks to enormous power consumption.
Still, Apple did a great job of executing it, and like the Blue and White G3 case, it was fresh, new, innovative, and a drastic step up from both the old mac cases(which were a BITCH to get apart, the 8500 being a prime example, requiring TOTAL disassembly to get to the memory) and PC cases. Cables are hidden away, the finish of materials are perfect, and so on. Lian Li cases are just welded aluminum cases with all the panels having the same boring finish...only recently have they done something different, and the best they can manage is to imitate the G5- look at the website you linked to, that case was clearly designed to imitate the G5...rather poorly, too.
Please help metamoderate.
LOL! Certain he's got it all figured out, the poster expects his point of view to be flattered by posts reflecting it. Ironically, he wants you to Think Different, as long as you don't think differently.
I own two Apples. They're nice machines: my iBook is a writer's dream, and the iMac is a beautiful and functionally adequate system for running a small business.
But I own a homebrewed PC, too, for bleeding edge gaming. It reflects my precise hardware choices; it's for someone who doesn't need hand-holding from a corporation, indeed wants the control a corporate-approved box can't offer.
Different boxes for different needs. One size doesn't fit all.
That I won't trust the Windoze box to do anything more than run the latest games is a measure of what I think of Microsoft OS's. That I won't expect the iMac to be able to handle anything in the bleeding edge in gaming is a measure of reality: Apple's low and mid-range offerings can't compete on those terms, though it has made a better-than-fledgling effort at doing so. Still, good luck running Half Life 2 and Doom 3 on anything less than a PowerMac.
An Apple can't be all things to everyone. And it doesn't have to be.
and in the realm of iPod clones, those are not positives.
Someday, hopefully they'll be able to pack enough power into these things to do speech synthesis. After all, you've already got earphones in your ears, so how hard could it be for a nice voice to read the menus, albums, artists, and songs to you as you slowly scroll over each? Sure it would be slower than visual, as you'd have to pause to 'hear' each item, but it would be livable.
I'm not blind, but I'd still like that feature.
"That naive cube! How long must I suffer this!" --Sheldon J. Plankton
Me, I don't much like keyboards that sound like machine guns.
But that's just me.
Now, my Apple Extended Keyboard II is very, very nice. But it's not substantially nicer than my Logitech Wireless Keyboard.
Anyhow...good luck finding one that works for you.
Why yes, I AM a rocket scientist!
Actually, I want that feature too, but for a totally different reason: I want to do artificial books on tape. I want to load a text file into the iPod and have it read it to me.
It really shouldn't be that hard to pack a text-to-speech engine into a chip; I'd even have paid a little bit extra for that feature to be included in my iPod.
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Mod me down, you fucking twits. Go ahead. I dare you.
(I read with sigs off.)
You can use iSpeak It in the meantime.
I live ze unknown. I love ze unknown. I am ze unknown.
So am I, and I custom-ordered my previous Sun keyboard to get the ctrl key where I want it, under the shift key. I didn't have to do that with my current Sun keyboard, because it came that way. It's that way on my PC, too, and my PC laptop. I find it *harder* to use a ctrl key that's above the shift, the angle is just weird.