Cut-Rate Windows 'XP Starter Edition' in Thailand

zlel writes "Microsoft has decided on an official name - 'Windows XP Starter Edition' - for the stripped-down, cut-rate version of Windows that it first began offering in Thailand last summer."

Comments

Analogy?

[Anonymous Coward]

Is this the software equivalent of those first cigarettes behind the toilet block? You know, the ones that get you hooked for life?

Re:Analogy?

[Aero Leviathan]

I've already seen a few posts like this in this thread, and I have to say... the mentality around here confuses me sometimes. If Microsoft products aren't any good, as is repeatedly said around here, then how could people get hooked on them...?

I'm not saying they are good or aren't good, I'm just saying... y'all don't make any sense :)

Re:Analogy?

[FuzzyDaddy]

You get hooked when your data and files start accumulating in a proprietary format which may be difficult to translate over.

Re:Analogy?

[Anonymous Coward]

So by your argument, cigarettes must be a good product, as people continue to smoke them? Don't by any chance work for a cigarette PR firm, with thinking like that?

You've missed the point. Just as people on drugs are addicted and don't see any alternative, so people on MS products get stuck with proprietory data formats and incompatibility and don't see any easy way out of their prison, even if they want to leave. The quality of the product has nothing to do with continued use.

Re:Analogy?

[Nasarius]

And your infrastructure. It's not trivial to switch a network with thousands of users from Exchange to a Unix/Linux product.

Re:Analogy?

[Aero Leviathan]

People generally start smoking because they like cigarettes, to my knowledge. I didn't say they weren't hazardous to your health, nor did I say Microsoft products were 'good for you' (although I'd be surprised if you made an argument they were actually unhealthy... although I suppose on Slashdot, anything goes...)

Also, MS Word can save as RTF and a variety of other formats, you know... it's up to you.

I guess IHBT, IHL, etc. I will HAND :P

Re:Analogy?

[netdudeuk]

No, Microsoft users are not stuck with incompatability ! Actually, while they stay with Microsoft they enjoy more compatability, not less, and that's why some users choose not to move.

Also, the quality of a product has much to do with continued use. This applies equally to Microsoft or Linux products. Isn't that why Linux users like Linux - because they see high quality ?

Re:Analogy?

[Anonymous Coward]

Isn't that why Linux users like Linux - because they see high quality ?

It's a factor, but for some people it is not the reason. Speaking for myself, I also see freedom. If the quality wasn't there, I would still persevere (and try to improve the quality) in the name of freedom.

Nice to be having a reasonably sane (and flame free) conversation.

Re:Analogy?

[Anonymous Coward]

> People generally start smoking because they like cigarettes, to my knowledge.

Your knowledge is faulty.

People generally start smoking because they're young and see "everyone else doing it", so they do so to fit in, coughing and hacking until their lungs get used to it - and until the nicotine has had a chance to make itself known, so the hacking and coughing doesn't seem so bad anymore.

The pleasure of smoking is from the drug nicotine, not from smoking per se. Inhaling smoke is an unnatural act that mammals will try to avoid.

Re:Analogy?

[finkployd]

IMAP makes a nice replacement for the mail portion of exchange. Plus as an added bonus it scales nicely. Last I heard MS ran some 200-400 exchange servers for their company which is insignificant compared to the university I work at with 130,000+ users and 4-5 million emails a day. We tend to laugh at them when they try to tell us Exchange would be the way to go without actually realizing out infrastructure is larger than anything they know how to support effectivly.

Re:Analogy?

[Anonymous Coward]

RTF was designed by one of Microsoft/Corel as a least common denominator format for word processors. It doesn't have any page formatting features (yes it does) , no tables (yes it does) , no embedded images (yes it does) , nothing. The only application it might be useful for is email, but it doesn't even do hyperlinks. (yes it does)

wow. did you even try it out before you posted your stupid diatribe?

Re:Analogy?

[finkployd]

You are right, I was thinking of Outlook (which is required to use Exchange, at least as Exchange was intended, I know it can do pop and webmail also). So yeah the server itself doesn't have bugs and security holes, but it forces the user to deal with arguably the worst email client in history.

Finkployd

Re:Analogy?

[Via_Patrino]

They're already addicted. First phase was piracy tolerance, now they want to charge...

I believe they are doing what they should have done before, adjusting their prices to the reality of the local population.

Today, MSFT charges the same for Microsoft Windows in any part of the world, either in Europe on in a developing country.

In my country (Brazil) 200U$ is the average salary and MS Windows costs about 130U$.

You may say with that salary people can't buy computers but a lot of them can, financing in one or two years or buying an used one. Although they're not willing to pay the high Microsoft's Tax.

Reducing the cost of the OS, MSFT is trying to reduce piracy. Adjusting the prices to local standards the same way music and movie industries have been doing for years.

Although they don't want the possibility of losing their current revenue. Those, mostly companies, that already buy their expensive product.

So, to keep those companies paying high prices, they remove some (considered) essential features.

The same essential like not clicking on a "blue E" to browse the internet, but on a "M". Whatever, some minimal changes, but enough to make the workers notice and complain to their boss (since aren't they who is paying for their intelectual inertia).

So companies keep paying the high prices, and the population now can afford to buy their "little dose" :)

LOL

[polyp2000]

I think that's rather amusing. Its almost as if they have given it a crap name so that people will go the extra mile and pay for the addition of the extra parts.

What about Windows XP Binner Edition ?

Starter Edition.

[jb.hl.com]

Is anybody else making the connection between "starter" and "free first rock of crack", but the next is $x"?

And the difference is?

[rms_nz]

Good to see good journalism is going out the door - it would be nice for it to mention what makes it "cut-down".

I know it says "As part of the deal, Microsoft also stripped out some unspecified features from both products" but surely there must be more details available than that?

Re:And the difference is?

[E_elven]

What I don't get is that they had to do a lot of rewriting to make this version, as a complete afterthought. So they do more development and yet they charge less than the original.

Cut-rate?

[Anonymous Coward]

Still not as cheap as *nix :) I'd like to see what the "unspecified" features they chopped out were.

The Microsoft mentality

[jdkane]

We don't want to provide a version of XP without Media Player to the EU. That would be catastrophic to our business.

However Thailand can have this nice stripped down version of XP.

Re:The Microsoft mentality

[rsmith-mac]

That's free trade for you; Microsoft is free to decide who they want to sell to, what they want to sell, and how they want to sell it, all to maximize their profit margin(their goal as a business). You can't have control over Microsoft, and that kind of free trade at the same time.

Re:The Microsoft mentality

[Anonymous Coward]

sure however free trade would mean that anyone could re-import this started editon anywhere

Re:The Microsoft mentality

[bigsteve@dstc]

Ummm ...

No matter what the article says, I'd bet that there will be some fine print in the "starter edition" EULA that is intended to stop this sort of thing.

No Product Activation

[Anita Coney]

I've read several stories about this stripped version of Windows, and what they all fail to mention is that it also lacks Product Activation. Sure, Product Activation in Asia is like duct taping your BMW's door shut in Detroit, but it's still significant.

People in Thailand can share their copies with their friends and family. But those of us in the rest of the world cannot. It just makes NO sense. We pay MORE for restrictions!!!

Re:No Product Activation

[Anonymous Coward]

It lends credence to the preceeding comparisons with addictive drugs and their methods of distribution and later exploitation.

Maybe it is no coinidence that Thailand is near the "Golden Triangle"?

Re:No Product Activation

[Feztaa]

People in Thailand can share their copies with their friends and family. But those of us in the rest of the world cannot. It just makes NO sense. We pay MORE for restrictions!!!

It makes perfect sense. The market determines the price; people are willing to pay $300 for a box of windows, so MS charges $300. Other countries can't afford that much, so they reduce the price to help move the product.

The fact that you pay more for more restrictions is just funny; you have alternatives.

Re:No Product Activation

[_Sprocket_]

I've read several stories about this stripped version of Windows, and what they all fail to mention is that it also lacks Product Activation.

I suspect that Product Activation and other recent anti-copy measures have little to do with protecting sales. It is actually an attempt to derail a dangerous perception.

First, consider that "piracy" does not harm Microsoft. In the past decade or so, Microsoft's products have been widely pirated. Yet Microsoft's sales have still been impressive. And even an illegal copy of a product will work within Microsoft's lock-in business strategy.

So why all the recent activity with licensing? Microsoft must show that their products cost something. They must avoid looking like their software is free. If they fail to do this, they simply reenforce a major threat to their business; commodity software. Or, more specifically, the commodity operating system.

This new product reflects this strategy. Microsoft hasn't been especially concerned with the wide-spread illegal distribution of their products in Asia in the past. However, when the Thai government starts looking at Linux, Microsoft suddenly takes special steps.

The Good and the Bad....

[CommanderData]

A stripped down version of Windows XP and Office XP could be infinitely better than the full versions in the USA if the right features were removed- remove active scripting and VBA from these products, take out a good percentage of the obscure features of Office that no one uses, and presto- a less bloated, more secure computing environment that just happens to have the MS logo on it.

Hell, for 38 bucks I would give it a try if they rolled it out here. Of course they won't do that, because this whole tactic is about training the next generation of PC owners (developing nations) to become dependant upon MS crack.

How do you strip down XP anyway?

[Slayk]

It comes with like two useful applications. Pretty soon it'll be down to the shell and a handful of .dll files.

Re:How do you strip down XP anyway?

[name773]

use the tool for the job:
apple for graphics
*nix for servers
windows for solitare

Re:Features left:

[MrMojado]

those features have been left out of every other version as well!

So crime does pay then?

[grolschie]

The reward for ripping off software, is price reductions and less bloated software? What message is Microsoft giving here?

Another way to look at it

[howman]

Although there has been a lot of talk about how open source is safer and better in many ways than m$, pehaps m$ does have one thing *nix doesn't... As closed source there is no need for developers to learn english to create packages that work in their languages or for their needs.
Now don't get me wrong, I think M$ is evil... but, even though a non-native english speaker can run *nix in their own language, any programming they want to do is predominantly restricted to English.
I work in Japan and we do a fair amount of programming in C as well as other languages, and funny enough, although the english abilities of my co-workers are nominal at best, a few verbs and the odd noun, if I speak to them in code they understand me compleatly... It is truely weird... The other day I was trying to tell one of the programmers that the coffee machine was out of sugar, the standard english phrase "The coffee machine is out of sugar' had no effect, as soon as I said 'if led = 1 then sato(sugar) = 0' I was understood...
So back to my origional statement, although I think open source is much better for the computer industry, the lack of having to learn english in order to get something to work for your business is a definate plus to the managers who decide to implement something purely on the basis of cost.

Re:Another way to look at it

[Anonymous Coward]

So... Exactly how many versions of C do you want? Do you want a katakana programming language, shi?

But seriously, english is the de facto language of the Net, and probably that is good since students in almost every country learn their own language... and english.

It is impossible to have international collaboration without a common language. Linus Torvalds is a native swedish speaker who grew up in Finland and learned operating systems from Andrew Tannenbaum's book. Tannenbaum lives in the Netherlands, so I presume his native language is dutch. Tannenbaum's book was written in english. The comp.os.minix forum was conducted in english. Linux would not have been possible if it had been restricted only to swedish speakers.

It might be a historical accident that it's english. It might as well be swedish, dutch, japanese, or klingon. But, it is essential to have a common language. This language may exclude some potential members of the community, but without it, there will be dozens of fragmented and almost non-intersecting communities. Likely none of them would become big enough to gain critical mass, and if one does, it stands a good chance of becoming the de facto language of the communities in general.

Like english is.

This might be a good idea elsewhere in the world

[Avoid_F8]

...If the features they left out were integrated IE, Outlook Express, and media player, I'd pay $38 for it in a split second!

Re:So crime does pay then?

[baywulf]

No the message given out there is "Competition (from Linux for example) brings price reductions."

And so it begins...

[Garwulf]

Actually, I'm not surprised something like this has happened.

Microsoft is starting to see Linux as honest competition for the desktop market, and acting accordingly to become competitive again. I think you'll see something similar happen here - it wouldn't surprise me if the asking price for Microsoft software is cut dramatically in the next twenty-four months, and it also wouldn't surprise me if the quality starts to improve again.

All in all, this is a good thing, not a bad thing. The end users can only benefit from this.

More M$ lies

[Oriumpor]

I love it. Just as they "CANNOT" remove IE from windows... But for some reason I can... I call Bullshit (WARNING:EXPERIMENTAL, Shameless self promotion..) Please comment if you see gaping failures in the procedure.

The whole thing stinks... Microsoft gets away with lying in court outright. Releasing a stripped down version of XP for the Xbox without IE, and implimenting a newly stripped down (non-english) version of XP that apparently works well enough to sell...

On top of which I'm nearly positive someone could write a registry import that would be able to remove any Windows feature entirely including the self healing. But Microsoft refuses to do any such thing in the markets it currently holds the monopoly in, claiming it would cause windows to no longer function.

WTF, like IE is going to mess with the win32 api... As if the fact that they can do it in taiwanese, or for the xbox should confuse the fact that they can't do it in english, or for a PC.

Re:Faux Pas!

[WhatAmIDoingHere]

You haven't used XP, have you? Both XP and 2k were great about restarting. And not needing to when you install things.

Some things require reboots (Like Direct X), but that's because they modify files currently in use.

Oh wait, this is /. where blind attacks against the "Evil" Microsoft gets you rewarded.

Re:A summary

[Enlarge Your Penis]

And most people don't care. Most people aren't geeks. As long as they can get their German shit porn, check their emails and maybe play games the internals are irrelevant to them

Just how stripped down?

[dtfinch]

Windows XP Home is pretty stripped down as it is. If they intend for this to compete with Linux, why strip it down at all? Linux is still free, and is usually distributed with 90% of the software you'll ever need.

This is one of Microsoft's big problems. You ask how much for a FULL, unrestricted version of Windows to put on a single DESKTOP system, and the answer is in the thousands of dollars, because they only expect enterprise users to need such functionality, and only on dedicated servers. If you buy XP home or professional, and install 3rd party server software to handle a peak of over 10 users (5 for home), you are violating the EULA.

Linux and similar operating systems give you the freedom to do whatever you damn well please with your system, something that Microsoft is incapable of offering without cutting deeply into their profits, because of their high market share.

Nearly exact analogy ...

[quarkscat]

to a drug dealer passing out crack cocaine
laced marijuana cigarettes to the kiddies
for free. Where else is the next generation
of Micro$oft clients going to come from?

Re:Faux Pas!

[bgeer]

I use 2K/XP nearly every day unfortunately, and virtually every time I install something it asks me to reboot. Whether it's InstallShield's problem or Windows's problem is irrelevant.

Also, your argument about DirectX is laughable. You don't even have to restart Linux to upgrade LIBC! ***LIBC***! Even the package manager that is actually upgrading libc is using libc! And it works just fine. This has been true since ELF was introduced way back in what '96 or so?

The whole reason behind the rebooting problem is the registry, and if MS gets rid of it I'll gladly stop making fun of it. Until then you and the rest of the MS-defender crowd will just have to keep stretching your credibility trying to defend it.

So they really could make a stripped down version

[foniksonik]

I was under the impression that MS wasn't able to make a version of Windows without all the bells and whistels... I guess it's okay now that all of their lawsuits have been settled. So they are guilty of anti-trust and they are liars, this isn't news.

When will the US see a version of Windows that is JUST an Operating System? I wouldn't even mind it if they included a separate disk with 'bundled' but optional software, like a music player, a photo album tool, and maybe some video editing software... heck for the good PCs they could even include some sort of DVD authoring tool. ;-p

Re:Free...

[aichpvee]

What part of "A well regulated militia" do you not understand, moron? The point is that you can have guns to protect the country from threats internal and external, not so you could run around with a 9mm you're more likely to accidently shoot your child with than ever fire in self defence.

You might also take note of the "well regulated" part. That means you don't get to own any gun you like whenever you feel like it.

Constitution, read it sometime instead of taking the out of context quotes from the NRA website:

Amendment II

A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed.

So now you get even less...

[slasher999]

...than any off the shelf Linux distro gives you, plus you still get to pay for it! Where do I get in line?

Re:Faux Pas!

[Anonymous Coward]

Fool - ***LIBC*** is a static library.
The package manager which is upgrading libc, has
a copy of the libc object files it needs inside
it's binary. It's not using the installed
***LIBC***.

Wrong. libc can be both dynamic and static, and upgrading libc does not affect either dynamically-linked or statically-linked applications. Under GNU/Linux, dynamic libraries can be upgraded while being used, for the same reason that files can be removed while open: the filesystem does not remove the old file until its reference count is zero, and references include both hardlinks and programs with the file open.

Re:So crime does pay then?

[mrchaotica]

Oh really? Then why, despite the rampant piracy that's been going on for YEARS , do they only do this NOW that the Thai government has started pushing Linux?!