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The Cult of Mac

cgjherr (Jack Herrington) writes "The Cult of Mac, a new book by Leander Kahney, is a love letter to the Macintosh community. The book seeks to simultaneously define and evangelize the Apple cultural phenomenon. With 25 million users (in the author's estimation) there is a lot of culture to go around. The tattoos. The modified machines. The pilgrimage to MacWorld. The sub-cult of iPod. It's all here." Read on for the rest of Herrington's review. The Cult of Mac author Leander Kahney pages 268 publisher No Starch rating Excellent reviewer Jack Herrington ISBN 1886411832 summary A love letter to the Mac community

The form and structure of the book is a cross between a Wired magazine (for which Kahney has long written on Apple) and a coffee table book. There are great pictures of people, machines and art to appeal to the eye. Some pages are all pictures, while others are primarily text -- most are a combination of the two. The layout is always attractive. If this were a book from Apple, the style would be cleaner and there would be less emphasis on the past; this book is from and for the fans, though, so the style is more edgy and chaotic.

The book is divided into five large sections. The first covers the Macintosh itself, its users, its evangelists, and a little of its history. Including, to my amusement, but not surprise, its connection with pot, which occupies three pages. Wozniak is covered lovingly, and Jobs is painted with the same awe, love and hate brush that the community uses. Leander even covers the TV and movie Macintosh spotting, where the good guys always use Macs and the bad guys always use PCs.

Section two takes us into the MacWorld phenomenon. The secrecy, the crazy crowds, the keynote -- the whole shebang. We also get a look into the Mac phenomenon in Japan.

The final three sections are the most interesting to the hardware lovers. Section four covers modifying the Macintosh, futuristic designs, and the variety of things that have been built from dead Macs. The fourth section is about collecting Macintoshes; there is an excellent image here of a reception desk built entirely of old Mac Classics. Some attention is also paid to the devotees of Apple tsotchkes -- the shirts, the pins, the shoes, and other logo-branded novelties.

The final section is all about what comes next. Here Leander covers the iPod and its subculture, as well as the ongoing cultural battle between Microsoft users and the Mac world. The author even goes so far as to associate the construction of the swivel head iMac to that of a newborn baby to justify our attachment to it. And that makes my Powerbook a what?

There is a lot of great material in this book just to flip through, or to sit down for an enjoyable read. For the technically minded, there is nothing here to help you write better code or get more out of the operating system. This is a book about a culture, its icons, its people, and its ideology.

I can't recommend this book for a PC person, Unless he's interested in learning about the phenomenon or becoming part of it, I doubt there is much he'd interesting in this book. A PC user uses his machine to perform a task and thinks little of the machine itself. A Mac, on the other hand, is a key component of an integrated lifestyle. If you don't live the lifestyle and you care to know more about it, then check out the book. Otherwise, you might as well skip it.

As a Mac enthusiast myself I really enjoy this book. I started programming on the Macintosh with the first 128K machine, took a hiatus on Windows for a couple of years, and switched back with OS X. I've been to a MacWorld and seen some of the phenomenon first-hand. But it's nice to see it catalogued here in such an attractive, nicely constructed, well-written book.

In the early days of Apple versus Microsoft we had a real culture war, command line versus GUI. Windows won. Which is bad because Mac is, IMHO, better. But the Windows victory does allow us in the Mac camp to revel in our own individuality. This book is a fun way for new and old Mac fans alike to share in the common insanity which is our somewhat unrealistic love for this computer and it's company.

I'm certainly glad this book came out before Christmas. Now I know what I am going to give a couple of my fellow Macaddicts.

Reviewer Jack Herrington authored Code Generation in Action, and edits the Code Generation Network. You can purchase The Cult of Mac from bn.com. Slashdot welcomes readers' book reviews -- to see your own review here, carefully read the book review guidelines, then visit the submission page.

79 of 374 comments (clear)

  1. apple tattoos by Coneasfast · · Score: 4, Interesting

    ok, i've never heard of this, but the first google search came up with this page

    --
    Marge, get me your address book, 4 beers, and my conversation hat.
    1. Re:apple tattoos by YetAnotherName · · Score: 4, Funny

      That page tells me two things:

      1. Some really ugly guys like Macs.

      2. Some really lovely women like Macs.

      Hummanah, hummanah!

    2. Re:apple tattoos by micromoog · · Score: 2, Funny
      2. Some really lovely women like Macs.

      Uh-oh, is Apple picking up on BSD's schtick?

    3. Re:apple tattoos by gordgekko · · Score: 2, Funny

      That's why female Mac users sleep with male Wintel users. Why have a beautiful Mac and settle for an ugly man?

      --
      You want to know who isn't running Firefox 2.x? They spell it "definately" and "rediculous".
    4. Re:apple tattoos by Daniel+Dvorkin · · Score: 3, Insightful

      No shit. There are several products (Macs, Toyotas, Badger Blades) that inspire in me a strong degree of brand loyalty, but I simply cannot envision being so devoted to any product that I'd get a tattoo representing it. My brand loyalty is based on experience -- I prize products that do the job, consistently and well, and hold up under hard use -- rather than any sense of mystical connection.

      Then again, I can't imagine getting a tattoo representing a sports team, a band, a movie, a drink, or a drug, either, and I've seen all of them. [shrug] Seems to me that anything you're going to put on your body forever should represent a core part of your identity -- if someone else's manufacture product has that kind of significance to you, I guess that's your problem ...

      --
      The correlation between ignorance of statistics and using "correlation is not causation" as an argument is close to 1.
    5. Re:apple tattoos by Ohreally_factor · · Score: 4, Funny

      If you and your missus really thought different, you would have brought her home.

      Oh well. There's always tiger.

      --
      It's not offtopic, dumbass. It's orthogonal.
  2. Propoganda! by Kazrath · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Mac's need to stick to serving burgers!!!! It's actually surprising what some of the technology Apple has been pushing out the door in the last few years. Apple seems to be more geared to specific aspects of computing and do it very well. I have a hard-core Linux co-worked who is seriously thinking of purchasing a MAC for a media PC. Either the marketing is getting better or the options are. Good job Apple.

    1. Re:Propoganda! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Interesting

      I agree Mac is doing a good job these days. I was a die hard PC person for the past 20 years and I admit i hated Mac and it's entire user base, but I couldnt' explain why. Years later I just think I hated Mac/users because they were different and it didn't make sense.

      Now Apple embraces open standards such as Unix / BSD and throws their beautiful GUI on top of it. I personally enjoy using the Mac whereas when I used my PC I didn't enjoy it, I just used it. Plus after using PC's for so many years you come to release everything keeps repeating itself (better 3d cards, more RAM, faster CPU's, etc) however in the Mac world things do get quicker like PC's however they veer off into the 64-bit RISC world which most PC fans only dream of.

      You people can make fun of me, but it comes down to you get what you pay for. You spend $50 grand on a Porsche and you get high quality, and you don't have to question "do i like this". Same goes for PC's. People have their hobbies and like to invest in what they believe in. Nothing wrong with enjoying Macs for their raw performance, logical architecture, and open source standards.

      I dig Mac in a big way and anybody who disagrees, go and try using a Mac for a bit if you can. You will find you enjoy computing again.

    2. Re:Propoganda! by ocelotbob · · Score: 2, Interesting
      Now Apple embraces open standards such as Unix / BSD and throws their beautiful GUI on top of it. I personally enjoy using the Mac whereas when I used my PC I didn't enjoy it, I just used it. Plus after using PC's for so many years you come to release everything keeps repeating itself (better 3d cards, more RAM, faster CPU's, etc)
      So, basically, you're bemoaning the fact that the PC has a faster upgrade cycle. You just have to choose not to upgrade. However, that competition brings better products.
      however in the Mac world things do get quicker like PC's however they veer off into the 64-bit RISC world which most PC fans only dream of.
      Um, ever heard about AMD's X86-64s? 64 bits, much more sane than standard x86, and more prevalent than the mac.
      I dig Mac in a big way and anybody who disagrees, go and try using a Mac for a bit if you can. You will find you enjoy computing again.
      I tried. It sucked. It tried to force me to do things its way instead of letting me choose my own workflow. Plus, the interface was a hell of a lot uglier than a well tuned KDE install.
      --

      Marxism is the opiate of dumbasses

  3. Uhhh No by JavaLord · · Score: 3, Insightful

    A PC user uses his machine to perform a task and thinks little of the machine itself. A Mac, on the other hand, is a key component of an integrated lifestyle. If you don't live the lifestyle and you care to know more about it, then check out the book. Otherwise, you might as well skip it.

    Being someone who spends equal time all day on a PC and Mac (G4 and G5), I can tell you that a Mac in no way is a "key component of an integrated lifestyle". It's a computer that happens to run an alternate OS and have a good marketing department, which is nice if you don't like windows or you are a drone consumer who cares about what is 'cool'.

    1. Re:Uhhh No by Kenja · · Score: 4, Funny
      I can tell you that a Mac in no way is a "key component of an integrated lifestyle". It's a computer that happens to run an alternate OS...

      Then you are not a Mac User, your just happen to use a Mac.

      --

      "Have you ever thought about just turning off the TV, sitting down with your kids, and hitting them?"
    2. Re:Uhhh No by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Funny

      In Soviet Russia, the Macs use you.

    3. Re:Uhhh No by gordgekko · · Score: 3, Funny

      People who fetishize an object need to develop outside interests. As in go outside and do something interesting...

      --
      You want to know who isn't running Firefox 2.x? They spell it "definately" and "rediculous".
    4. Re:Uhhh No by hackstraw · · Score: 5, Interesting

      It's a computer that happens to run an alternate OS and have a good marketing department, which is nice if you don't like windows or you are a drone consumer who cares about what is 'cool'.

      Maybe I'm just in the minority of Mac users, but I don't consider OS X an "alternate" operating system. Alternate to what? Linux, Solaris, Windows, or FeeBSD, or insert OS here?

      I use a Mac because it is a great computer in terms of its hardware and software. Its not perfect, but there is no other computer that I could buy at any price that I would want on my lap right now. I'm a computer professional, and have spent years working with a number of operating systems and hardware platforms in development and administration, and its refreshing to have a personal machine "that just works" so I can do my work.

      I require an OS that has a nice windowing system and a functional command line interface. My Mac with OS X, in my opinion, is the only system that even comes close to my expectations. The screen is high quality. The keys are backlit. USB and Firewire peripherals work fine with it. Multiple displays work good. Safari is an excellent web browser, and with PithHelmet I don't see any web ads, no popups, or any of the stuff that was common years ago. The Terminal appication is the best of its kind that I have ever used. Expose is a very uniqe and useful feature. I can dump anything to a PDF file. I can use the same dotfiles from my cvs repository that I use on Linux and Solaris. I can take my laptop and easily drop it into my many environments in terms of networking and printers with no problem, and putting it into a new network is simple. Installing and uninstalling software is excellent either from the GUI or from the commandline via fink or even from source for many standard OSS packages. I still find new things that I like about my Mac. I rarely find things that I don't like, and I'm picky. I could go on, but its not some laundry list of features, its simply a pleasant computing experience. I could not imagine having to settle for anything less at this time. Maybe another vendor will surpass what Apple has achieved at this time, but right now, I simply believe that its the best thing that I have ever used in my lifetime, and from what I see its only going to get better.

    5. Re:Uhhh No by RoofPig · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Waaaaait a minute. What about those car analogies you Mac people love to go on about? Like how you have your cool Ferraris and everyone else has their Ford Taurus or whatever. As often as not, people think their stuff is cool precisely because they think it makes them somehow edgy and unique. Don't even try to play dumb with me, mister. "Us Mac users do not think our computers are cool!" Yeah.

    6. Re:Uhhh No by psifishdot · · Score: 4, Funny

      A PC user uses his machine to perform a task and thinks little of the machine itself. A Mac, on the other hand, is a key component of an integrated lifestyle.

      I wish someone had told me this BEFORE i bought my iBook last week... If I had known that it would require a lifestyle change, I'd have gotten another thinkpad.

      Integrated Lifestyle=
      /
      | lifestyle dMac
      /

      --

      Long live Schrodinger's cat...
  4. Excuse me? by mr.henry · · Score: 5, Insightful
    A PC user uses his machine to perform a task and thinks little of the machine itself.

    WTF? Certainly PC users don't care about the machine.

    Fucking Mac snobs.

    1. Re:Excuse me? by WilliamGeorge · · Score: 2, Interesting

      I agree! I frikin BUILT my PC from SCRATCH!!!! Its much closer to a "baby" to me because of that than a MAC could ever be. And I am constantly adding to it, giving it better parts, tweaking it to run faster... in fact, thats the very thing that turns me off so much about MACs - the lack of being able to "build my own". /rant off

      --
      William George
    2. Re:Excuse me? by dreadfire · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Macs are hot. Hands down, they are designed for multimedia power and design. All of those cases you should didn't have the style of a mac. Macs are hot.

    3. Re:Excuse me? by wandazulu · · Score: 2, Interesting

      I think a proper comparison would be a Porsche to a Ford. There are some beautiful Fords. There are Fords that are a work of art. It's not denegrating to Ford, it's just that Porsche's have that certain look and appeal. It's not for everyone, but those who are "into" Porsche's are *really* into them. I think it's safe to say that with Porsche and Mac, there is very little middle ground. Sure, to some Porsche owners it's "just a car", but on the other hand, they still are concious of the fact that it's a Porsche, even when driving it to the store.

    4. Re:Excuse me? by misleb · · Score: 5, Insightful

      That isn't the same thing. Also, those links are exceptions to the rule. Mac users, as a rule, really appreciate their machines in a way that most PC users just wouldn't understand. Macs are hightly integrated and are presented to the user as a whole package rather than having, for example, a Dell computer running Microsoft Windows XP.

      FWIW, I'm a PC (but not Windows) user, but my wife is a long time Mac user.

      -matthew

      --
      "THERE IS NO JUSTICE, THERE IS ONLY ME." -Death
    5. Re:Excuse me? by Jeff+DeMaagd · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I'd say those users think little of their PCs. They look more like riced computers than anything else. :)

      Before you flame, I'm not a Mac user or owner. But seriously, IMO, usually the thing that happens when people individualize their PC make it uglier or more contrived. Same goes for cars too, most of the time.

    6. Re:Excuse me? by nine-times · · Score: 3, Insightful
      A PC user uses his machine to perform a task and thinks little of the machine itself.

      Yeah, sounds like BS to me, too. A lot of people on a lot of different platforms appreciate their machines for different reasons. Some people get their biggest kicks out of the latest and greatest, some from an old Amiga/NeXT/Commodore64. Some love a big honkin' box with all sorts of fans... they like to feel like their machine has enough power to get you from NY to LA in 3 hours, if you just put wings on it. Some dig those tiny little devices that can only be operated by Japanese midgets.

      Very few, however, have such a rediculous pseudo-religious attachment to their computers as Mac users. Except maybe Gentoo users.

      I happen to be both, but not because I can then "appreciate" and "think of" the machine. I like them specifically because, once set up properly, they both work reliably (for what I do) and don't require thought. When I go to check my e-mail, I don't have to worry about viruses. When I go to look at a web page, I don't have to think about spyware. The machines go about happily doing what they're supposed to do with little in the way of maintenance.

      What I like about MacOSX (over gentoo) is really only the ease with which I can get it to the point of "set up properly". (well, and I do like some eye-candy here and there. And photoshop/dreamweaver without jumping through hoops)

      So, not all people who use Macs are whacked out fanatics. Some of us enjoy thinking little of the machine itself. But saying Macintosh users are unique in their appreciation of their computers sounds about the same as if someone had claimed only Porche drivers like their cars, and everyone else just thinks of their cars as a means to get to and from work.

    7. Re:Excuse me? by NeoSkandranon · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Because if the group doing the integrating decides you dont need it, you dont get it.

      --
      If you can't see the value in jet powered ants you should turn in your nerd card. - Dunbal (464142)
    8. Re:Excuse me? by jazman_777 · · Score: 3, Funny

      Slashdot. News for Nerds, Stuff that Matters, Failed Car Analogies.

      --
      Slashdot: Failed Car Analogies. Amateur Lawyering. Anecdote Battles.
    9. Re:Excuse me? by luna69 · · Score: 2, Interesting
      > I think a proper comparison would be a Porsche
      > to a Ford

      Well, having driven a Carrera 4 *and* a Taurus, I can see the point of the analogy. But having driven a Cobra (427, original) and a 914, I think it doesn't hold up all that well.


      Ultimately, I'd prefer to have a PC (read: no proprietary junk, commodity components, tweakable, moddable) that has AT MOST a couple features of the Mac (uhh...I'm trying, hold on...uhh...).


      I don't WANT to "live the Mac lifestyle" - I have my OWN damn lifestyle, which works very well, thank you very much. And the very fact that Mac snobs constantly prattle on about their "Mac lifestyle" only makes me want to gag harder. I've sat in cafes in SF and LA, NYC and in Europe, listening to silly Mac people talk about their own superiority as if THEY were superior humans for having the grace to own a f^&%ing powerbook. Imagine my loathing and bile-spitting disdain...except that I don't voice my own sense of superiority to these powerbook-toting, vw-driving Steve Jobs fanboys, while they eagerly rattle off the virtues of their nonsensical operating systems (which they often know nothing about aside from the sales litersture, which is read like Playboys used to be in bathroom stalls).

      And that gets me to the OS. Why in the world would anyone choose, willingly, to use an OS that refused to maximize a window when told to? Or that insisted on being "cute" at every opportunity, even when being so is distracting, unnecessary and reeks of an out of control case of eyecandyitis? Christ, at least when I tell a window under pretty much ANY other OS to maximize, it DOES. And let's not even get started on the stubborn, Bush-like insistence on staying with the failed policy of single-button mice.

      Now, I can hear some of you saying "well, uh...but we have a commandline! And it's *nix!" Well, yes sonny, you DO have a commandline. But I'd rather have my Linux commandline anyday, unencumbered by OS X's ridiculously overblown, unintuitive, overwrought GUI.

      --
      No gods, no demons, and no masters. Secular Humanism!
    10. Re:Excuse me? by Moofie · · Score: 2, Informative

      I've built my own PCs for ten years, and I've never found one that is as well designed as a stock Macintosh.

      There simply isn't a PC case that's as well-engineered and designed as the G5 case (Or the G4 case. Or the new iMac.) There doesn't exist a cooling system that's as well designed and elegant as the current Apple state-of-the-art. You can't find an operating system that works as well, as elegantly, as flexibly as Apple's.

      There are a lot of reasons not to own a Mac. Quality of the user experience (from end to end) isn't among them.

      --
      Why yes, I AM a rocket scientist!
    11. Re:Excuse me? by misleb · · Score: 3, Insightful
      Yeah, I'm sure that is why people buy Windows. :-P

      I think people tend to feel like their choice in computers is mostly made for them. Want all the apps and games? Windows. Want to be compatable with your coworkers? Windows. Windows is the default. Buying Apple is a choice. Deciding to give Linux a try is a choice. This is why you get so much fanaticism either of these alternatives... because it is a choice rather than just something you get because you want a computer.

      -matthew

      --
      "THERE IS NO JUSTICE, THERE IS ONLY ME." -Death
    12. Re:Excuse me? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      There simply isn't a PC case that's as well-engineered and designed as the G5 case (Or the G4 case. Or the new iMac.) There doesn't exist a cooling system that's as well designed and elegant as the current Apple state-of-the-art. You can't find an operating system that works as well, as elegantly, as flexibly as Apple's.

      I have a HP computer. It's got air ducts which the air can flow through, and the whole system is run by a low speed fan in the power supply. There are rubber pads that hold the harddrive in. The side of the case is the same way. The thing is almost totally silent. The whole thing snaps together too, I can install a PCI card in literally 30 seconds. So who says PC manufacturers can't do the same thing a Apple? (true, it's really difficult to pull something off like this if you build it yourself though).

      Apple's cases don't seem that special. The G4's were loud and kind of ugly. Big case and little room to expand. The iMac has no room to expand. And it's expensive (why would I get an iMac over an iBook/Powerbook?) The G5 is a pretty nice set up though, that they did a decent job on.

  5. Sub culture of the IPod? by Barlo_Mung_42 · · Score: 3, Insightful

    It doesn't get much more main stream as far as Apple products go.

    1. Re:Sub culture of the IPod? by Trurl's+Machine · · Score: 2, Interesting

      It doesn't get much more main stream as far as Apple products go.

      I'm not that sure. First, it's easy to use (at least once the songs are loaded; I do this service for my relatives) and a non-techie person can use one right away. I bought one for my father and another one for my significant other. Second, if one could say that the clubbing scene is a sort of main stream for urban young people, then the iPod has already won the battle - at least in London. There are many interestung cultural phenomena related to iPod - such as the habit of offering someone opportunity to "jack-in" to your iPod to share musical tastes. Plus, partially thanks to clever product placement, partially just for virtue of the gagdet itself, it's actually ubiquitous in pop culture nowadays. It's the first product made by Apple - since the original Apple II computer - that managed to break out of the ghetto and get popular in the simplest meaning of the word.

  6. Re:Pilgrimage... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

    I got the joke, but I thought it was rather stupid. :p

  7. Newton by elid · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Let's not forget the Apple Newton fan club.

    1. Re:Newton by PriceIke · · Score: 2, Informative
      --
      It's not a lie. It's the truth with lossy compression.
  8. Reminds me of Saturn by zymurgy_cat · · Score: 4, Interesting

    This reminds me of Saturn (at least when they first came on to the scene). Here was a company that did things differently, even in an off-beat way, and was rewarded with the type of customer loyalty that gives Harvard MBAs wet dreams.

    Such companies define the "niche" market that everyone seems to talk about these days. It's the narrow market that captures the imagination and excitement of its customers.

    Of course, one cannot manufacture this. I think its formation is a rare combination of vision, guts, luck, and a willingness to task risk. Unfortunately, the vast majority of companies today have none of this, valuing things like "vision statements" or "world class (insert skill)" over creativity and audacity.

    --
    -- Fugacity: Confusing chemists since 1908
  9. PC users should read this... by l4m3z0r · · Score: 5, Insightful
    The PC users that constantly come on here with dell quotes talking about how you can get a "Better" machine for cheaper should be forced to read this book. Maybe then they will understand that price is not the end all be all factor in why someone would want a Mac. I know that the culture is probably the number one reason I own a Mac. I pay the extra price because I am proud of this high quality product. Furthermore by paying "more" i find I'm supporting a company and a group of people that are doing an excellent job. Even at 1/2 the price I wouldn't feel the same way about buying a PC or MS software. I just don't feel like they earned my money but Apple on the otherhand has.

    This is where the culture comes in bringing in a sense of loyalty to the product you use. I don't feel like PC users have that same phenomenon and maybe if they understood it they wouldn't rant and piss and flame on here about price differences and single mouse buttons.

    1. Re:PC users should read this... by Trurl's+Machine · · Score: 4, Insightful

      The PC users that constantly come on here with dell quotes talking about how you can get a "Better" machine for cheaper should be forced to read this book. Maybe then they will understand that price is not the end all be all factor in why someone would want a Mac. I know that the culture is probably the number one reason I own a Mac. I pay the extra price because I am proud of this high quality product.

      I am typing these very words on an iBook and actually price WAS an important factor when choosing a portable (somehow all x86 alternatives are either bigger and heavier or stripped down of some important functions like combo-drive... or pricey as hell). I am really happy with my machine but I don't think of it as of a "high quality product". It's just a notebook, dammit. Quoting the Russian astronaut from "Armageddon", "Russian computers, American computers, they are all made in Taiwan". The same relates to notebook computers - "Apple notebooks, Dell notebooks, they are all made by subcontractors in Taiwan". You don't get "higher quality product" when choosing Apple instead of Dell, they are both made by the same company (usually Quanta). My advice: be a member of Mac community. Be a member of Mac user group. Be a member of Mac developers society. But don't be a member of Mac culture, because it's nothing but marketing tool for a corporation like any other.

    2. Re:PC users should read this... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Maybe then they will understand that price is not the end all be all factor in why someone would want a Mac

      Offer me a loaded Mac G5 or a loaded PC desktop from Dell, Alienware or Falcon NW - I'll take the PC thanks. Because I can actually use it for high-end graphical apps, playing games - and have a chance in hell of being able to reuse some of the components in 5 years when the machine is nearing the end of it's useful life.

      I pay the extra price because I am proud of this high quality product.

      Absolute bullshit. You pay extra because they are a tiny fraction of the market and have "exclusive" small market prices.

      My Powerbook, running Mac OS X - locks up more frequently than my bolted-together-from-spare-parts Windows machine does (I use Windows for games, I use my Mac for email). And when the Mac goes down - as it invariably does - I have to TAKE THE BATTERY OUT to get the fucking thing to shut off.

      Then there were the numerous Powerbook / iPod battery problems, failing Powerbook screens, failing mainboards that needed to be replaced. Apple spells "Quality" with a "K", I tell ya. Too much emphassis on flash and shiny cases - not enough substance (performance, value, industry standards and upgradability).

      This is where the culture comes in bringing in a sense of loyalty to the product you use. I don't feel like PC users have that same phenomenon and maybe if they understood it they wouldn't rant and piss and flame

      "Understood it"? Excuse me? Apple machines have faults - just as Windows machines do. But the difference is that Windows users complain when something doesn't go right. Apple users seem to go "oh well, it must have fucked up because I'm retarded and don't know anything about computers" and ignore it. Guess what - they are retarded - not for the reasons they think, but for repeatedly putting up with it.

      single mouse buttons

      ARE FUCKING STUPID. Half the Mac OS X apps require you to hold down the control key, then click in order to emulate a 2nd mouse button (or you can hold the 1st button down for 5 seconds and go make a sandwich and take a nap before the system realises what you're trying to do and pretends to click the 2nd mouse button for you). What should be simple mousing ends up being retarded keyboard chording. Which wouldn't annoy me too much as I can use an external mouse - except when I'm using my Powerbook on the road and don't want the bulk with me.

      My kingdom for a hard power switch and a 2nd mouse button on my Powerbook. Don't get me wrong, I do actually like my Powerbook. But Apple computers are't the Silver Bricks From God that some Apple fanatics would have everyone think. They're not superior - they're just different. All products have flaws (Windows, Mac, Linux, FreeBSD, whatever).

    3. Re:PC users should read this... by the_2nd_coming · · Score: 2, Insightful

      umm, they are made by the same subcontractors, but what Dell considers ok as far as QA, and what Apple considers OK as far as QA is what makes the difference is quality. not to mention the Engineering that went into the design of the system itself.

      --



      I am the Alpha and the Omega-3
  10. CULT-ture of Mac by YetAnotherName · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Sounds like a good read; I enjoy studying the social aspects of our industry.

    Having touched my first Unix system back when I was 9 years old (actually it was a Silent 700 terminal, built-in acoustic coupler modem, dialing into System III) I've been fanatical about the command-line, anc always views Macs as a curiousity more than anything else. Worthy of derision most of the time, and of a nod now and then.

    I then got stuck on the Windows platform for the longest period of time, and it was partially my own choice. I was doing Java development at the time, and the JVM from Sun was better than the early JVMs for Linux. That, and the fact that I kept getting more and more Micro$oft-based attachments that when edited with the early Star Office would be mangled beyond hope when I sent them back.

    One day last year my wife let me play with her PowerBook running OS X. It had a really nice JVM that ran Java apps with blazing speed. (Yes, "Java" and "blazing" in the same sentence!) It ran Micro$oft Office programs, and in most cases, with more reliability than their Windows counterparts. It was infinitely more usable than Windows' best user interfaces. And best of all, you could fire up a shell and run vi on your .bashrc file.

    I went head over heels.

    Now, I still have Linux systems (and even a FreeBSD system) in my server room, but my desktop and my laptop are all Mac OS X, and I've never needed to look back to Windows again. Am I a "fanboy"? Probably. (I even got an iPod.) But I'm a fanboy because of what's under the hood now, not because of the path Apple took to get here.

    1. Re:CULT-ture of Mac by crazyphilman · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I know what you mean.

      Up a couple of years ago, I didn't have much use for macs. I thought they were pretty machines, but they just didn't feel all that useful to me. Since '95, I've generally leant heavily towards Linux systems, built from parts. I bought a blueberry iBook as an experiment, but I didn't think it was suitable for my purposes. I ended up giving it to my parents, who never touched it. I ended up selling it on Ebay.

      But when they came out with OS/X, things changed. I got an iBook, and it was perfect for me. I really liked it. I ended up getting my folks an eMac, which solved their virus/trojan problem instantly. And, I found that just about anything I might want to do was there.

      OS/X was the turning point for the company, I think. Their older OSes were pretty limited, but this one is great, top notch. And, my iBook rules, I use it as my main computer at home. Nothing else is as smooth to use, as refined. I really dig it.

      But like you said, I like it because of what it is NOW. I didn't like their older stuff.

      --
      Farewell! It's been a fine buncha years!
  11. Re:A cult? Puhleeze by l4m3z0r · · Score: 2, Interesting
    I'd have to say that without its "cult" following which definitely exists Apple would have died as predicted. However, there are those fanatics that are at the base of the Mac culture and as such alot of the fringe Mac users are driven towards loyalty to fit in with the core crowd of Mac users.

    A good comparison would be against VW, which has a very similiar cult following in its own right and as such even casual VW drivers are somewhat more fanatic than say your average ford driver.

  12. and a slightly more cynical view... by SuperBanana · · Score: 5, Insightful
    ...has been in my sig for months. It's not mine, but it's hysterical.

    As a mac user, btw, I'd like to say that there are so many stereotypes that are simply not true about many Mac users.

    • Not all of us are rabid evangelists(I grew out of that when I was 16)
    • Not all of us think a computer is some life-changing gee-golly piece of technology. It's my computer. I do stuff on it. That's it. Buying a mac doesn't change your life, or more accurately, it -shouldn't- change your life.
    • Not all of us think it's "Mac or nothing". I use the best tool for the job. My powerbook is my system; I serve stuff using Linux. I have a PC in the corner for games other than the really big stuff that gets ported to the Mac.
    • Not all of us think Steve's the greatest.

    I'm constantly amazed by how many stereotypes there are of Macintosh users, and it's actually quite offensive sometimes. "Oh, you're a MAC GUY, I see....our PCs aren't GOOD ENOUGH for you" is what invariably follows. Most of the time, I politely side-step platform-preference questions now, because of the assumptions and image people place on me when they learn I'm a mac user are just so goddamn tiresome.

    1. Re:and a slightly more cynical view... by dswensen · · Score: 5, Insightful

      A hearty amen to that. I work at an ISP where generally everyone uses Windows machines. I bought a Powerbook a while back (I use it as a writing tool), and after I brought it to work, I instantly became the "Mac guy."

      Not only was I expected to know everything about Macs going back to System 7.5 (I hate anything before OS X), but people would come up to me and make all sorts of political comments about how stupid Mac users were, how much Macs sucked, etc. as if they expected me to get offended and evangelistic about it.

      I even had a couple people say things like "Ugh, you're a Mac user? Don't let it touch me!" and "EWW!" and the like. Which just amazed me -- perfectly mature adults (for the most part) acting in this outlandish manner. I still own a Windows PC, and have plenty of experience in the platform, but suddenly ownership of a Mac makes me The Enemy.

      For all the reputation that Mac users have for being elitist and snobbish, I've seen way more snobbish, rude behavior from Windows people. Of course, what's funny, is they have an equal amount of hatred for "their" operating system. No Mac user I know talks about how much OS X sucks... yet, with Windows, it happens all the time. It makes me wonder if there's not more than a little defensiveness going on.

      My Powerbook does exactly what I want it to very well, and i find OS X a great computing environment to work in. I despise the politics that go with owning a machine, and like you, I just try to ignore it.

    2. Re:and a slightly more cynical view... by dswensen · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Pleased to meet you. I own a mac powerbook, and I'd like to tell you how much OS X sucks. Why?

      These are some interesting points you make. I'd like to offer my input on them.

      - Only one mouse button. Thats really debilitating. Sure, you can get a USB mouse for a desktop system, but on a laptop you are stuck having to hit the keyboard and the mouse button every time you want to right click. Not that there are ever any usefull funcitons in the drop down menus anyway - Mac applications are designed for people who can't use computers very well to be able to use. Those of us who want more functionality from their applications are stuck.

      I'm using a $25 wireless USB mouse on my Powerbook right now and it works great. I hate track-pads on ANY laptop. I find hitting ctrl-and the trackpad button is a little counterintuitive at first, but eventually I just got used to it.

      As for the contextual menu being useless by default, I rather agree... FruitMenu is a neat little app that makes the contextual menu completely customizable, and Menu Master does the same for drop-downs. Yeah, they're payware, but pretty inexpensive.

      The phrase "Mac applications are designed for people who can't use computers very well to be able to use" makes me wonder if IHBT, but I'm going to continue on anyway.

      - Window management is rediculous. You can't maximize a window without jumping through hoops. And those pretty eye-candy window control buttons in the tilte bar are way to small and easy to miss.

      OS X is skinnable, so you can find a skin that makes those buttons bigger. Maximizing is different than Windows, and I agree can be a bit counterintuitive, but it's not a big deal in my opinion. Just click and drag the window to its maximum size... the Finder should remember it next time.

      - The Finder is lame. Windows Explorer is crap too, but you can get a lot more functionality out of it if you know where to look.

      I barely use the Finder anymore, as I use Quicksilver to launch all my apps and find things. Much easier that way. I actually find the opposite to be true now; the Finder's search function works seamlessly and quickly, while searching in Windows explorer takes too many steps for my taste. For an out and out Finder replacement, Pathfinder looks good, though I haven't worked with it enough yet to know if it's worth the money.

      - Crashes just as often as my windows PC. I bought the thing for stability and have been very dissapointed.

      I hate to be one of those guys that says "my Mac never crashes," but it never does. I had maybe three or four lockups back during 10.2 and none since. My uptime regularly runs into the months, until I need to reboot for security updates. And it's not like I don't try out a lot of new applications, either. It really should not be crashing that much, or at all, if it's running right. You might try doing some maintenance.

      - Safari is way better than Internet Explorer on Windows, but far, far the inferior of Firefox

      I find Firefox way too slow on OS X -- which is sad, because I like Firefox, but it's just too much of a hog on my Powerbook. I've gotten really used to working with Safari, and have very few complaints with it, even compared to Firefox (which I like a lot).

      Don't get me wrong, I think Windows sucks too, and I do appreciate the OS X command line. But OS X's much ballyhooed GUI interface runs a far second behind windows in terms of actual utility.

      So to anyone who is considering the switch, I say, dont. Take the extra money you would blow on a powerbook and buy yourself a nice Sony laptop.


      I would have to respectfully disagree -- I think OS X takes

  13. I haven't read the book, but by Bill_Royle · · Score: 4, Interesting

    I met Leander about a year ago down at TechTV for Mitnick's "back online" show and was impressed with how down-to-earth he was. While other media folks were working to impress each other with accomplishments, he did his job quietly and turned out a good article afterwards.

    While some people might see this as cheerleading for Apple, the same can be said for some Windows-favoring and Linux-favoring journalists. The difference I found with him was how *normal* he seemed, compared to other journalists that I have met.

  14. Speaking of our benevolent cult by Nerd+Cooties · · Score: 2, Funny

    Apple is having a special get together in Jonestown, Guyana. They are even giving away Koolaid! Hope you can attend

    --
    I support the 2nd Amendment, the right to keep and arm bears!
  15. a new slashdotting by the_twisted_pair · · Score: 3, Funny

    X _ X
    \

    0F0064

  16. Cube fishtank by wankledot · · Score: 3, Funny

    I'm curious if there is a picture of my cube fishtank (http://home.comcast.net/~jleblanc77/cube/) in the book. The author and I exchanged some emails about it. Has anyone seen the book yet, and know if it's in there?

    --
    My sig is blank, I typed this by hand.
  17. Everyone uses a mac today by Teese · · Score: 3, Insightful
    Says the reviewer:
    In the early days of Apple versus Microsoft we had a real culture war, command line versus GUI. Windows won.
    Actually, the Mac won. Its just that nobody used a mac, they just waited for another company to make a good enough implementation at an acceptable price before switching (notice I didn't say a cheap second-rate rip-off, I'm getting better! honestly!). Pretty much the entire industry uses the GUI way, not the command line way.

    (Arguments that its Xerox's GUI, some people use a command-line, There's a command-line in Mac OS X now aside.)

    --
    "I'm a Genius!"*


    *Not an actual Genius
  18. Mac's Cult is Small.... by Dante+Shamest · · Score: 3, Funny

    Compared to Grand High Emperor Linus and his Linux empire! He's aided by Arch Supreme Bishop Stallman and his army of F/OSS programmers!!

  19. The cult of Apple by JonKatzIsAnIdiot · · Score: 2, Insightful
    • Putting on a shirt and tie and carrying a briefcase won't make you smart
    • Wearing black leather and driving a Harley won't make you tough
    • Listening an indie band that no-one else has heard of doesn't make you an 'individual'
    • Swearing undying fealty to Apple ( or Sony or IBM ...) doesn't make you 'hip' or 'cool'.

    But these things will make you into a trend-humping fashion lemming.

    Apple's core product isn't computers or electronics. It's elitism.
    1. Re:The cult of Apple by dswensen · · Score: 4, Interesting

      I can't speak for anyone else, but I didn't buy a Powerbook to be cool. Believe me, using a Mac you have to develop a thick skin very quickly, as everyone who sees you using one will accuse you of being a crazy evangelist or snobby elitist. (Case in point.)

      I bought it because I like the way the OS works, and the software is perfect for what I want to use a computer for. And this is after 10+ years of using Windows PCs, not to mention giving Linux a try.

      The only trend-humping lemming behavior I ever see is from people who make knee-jerk assumptions that anyone who uses a Mac must be part of the Steve Jobs "cult."

  20. I wonder if in 100 years.. by Tracer_Bullet82 · · Score: 2, Funny

    poeple will talk about "The cult of the mac" vs "the drones of MS" vs "zealots of Linux".

    Sort of like Moonism vs Mormons vs Scientology.

    But steve got the best dibs on a prophet name and story..err "myth".

    Think about it, JOB.

    Founded the religion, got "crucified" by "betrayors"; only to later "resurrect" in the religion dying throes.And "protelyzing" it to new hights :)

    Oh yeah, BSD is heathen*run away*

    --


    Timang tinggi tinggi
    parang sudah asah
    alang alang mandi
    biar sampai basah
  21. Re:Is like a cult... by Rude+Turnip · · Score: 2, Informative

    A Powermac is not an entry-level system; it is a workstation system for people who really need the power. An entry-level system is what you buy a kid or grandparent, such as an eMac ($800) or iMac ($1,300).

    Similarly:
    Dell Dimension desktop: entry level
    Dell Precision workstation: professional

  22. Re:A cult? Puhleeze by LihTox · · Score: 5, Insightful
    So to that minority of Apple zealots, get a damn life.

    Ah, the classic "get a life" business. What kind of life do you have in mind? Passions are what make life interesting. Some people obsess over sports, some over Macs, some over Star Trek, some over toy trains-- they have lives. People who obsess over other people have lives too. People who go around criticizing any show of exuberance as juvenile...well, I'm not sure about them.

    Planning on making a trip to Boston this weekend, to tell everyone here how they should "get a damn life, it's only a baseball team, they're not a church or anything"?

  23. Maybe by abb3w · · Score: 2, Insightful
    Then you are not a Mac User, your just happen to use a Mac.

    I think the term you are looking for isn't "User" but rather Bigot . I use a Mac at work. I even like it. I even didn't mind adding Mac troubleshooting skills to my Windows and Linux skills-- it wasn't that different. I would even go so far as to say that I prefer doing 90% of my Real Work at a Mac. (Games are another story.) But I while I think the iPod is kinda cool, I'm not planning on replacing my Archos Jukebox 20 until it keels over dead... which, incidentally, won't be due to the batteries. I have better ways to waste my money than donating to the Church of Steve.

    I'd also disagree slightly with the assessment of the review. Based on what's said, there may be some interest in the material to anthropologists (amateur and professional) who study computer nerds. If I see the book at Barnes & Noble, I might sit down and leaf through it for an hour or two. I might check it out if it hits the local library. I wouldn't spend real money on it, though.

    --
    //Information does not want to be free; it wants to breed.
  24. Re:A cult? Puhleeze by PriceIke · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Brilliant post .. would mod you up (Insightful) if I could. I too wonder why certain interests (obsessions) are societally acceptible while others are not. Football = ok, Star Trek = FREAK!!!!! Oprah Winfrey = ok, computers = GEEK!!!!! What makes liking football "better" than liking Star Trek?

    --
    It's not a lie. It's the truth with lossy compression.
  25. Have to disagree with this by Reality+Master+101 · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Not to start a flamewar, but....

    In the early days of Apple versus Microsoft we had a real culture war, command line versus GUI. Windows won. Which is bad because Mac is, IMHO, better.

    The Mac may or may not be better; that's certaintly debatable. What's not debatable is that it's much, much, MUCH better that Microsoft won. If Apple had won, how long would we have been saddled with proprietary hardware with proprietary software? A LONG-ASS time, and Macs would have been far more expensive. The only reason that a Mac is "only" 50%-2x the price of a PC is because PCs are so cheap. Without PCs, we would be totally at Apple's mercy, and they don't exactly have a good track record of not gouging their customers.

    Microsoft may have its flaws, and they may charge too much for their software (although, I could argue that you get a lot of technology for a measly $129 retail), but at least they never tried to come out with a "Microsoft PC" with proprietary hardware.

    What's amazing is that Apple is still too stupid to realize that the money is in the software, not the hardware. It's really mindblowing when you think about it. If Apple had won, then they WOULD have been a petal-to-the-metal monopoly that would have had to be broken up.

    --
    Sometimes it's best to just let stupid people be stupid.
    1. Re:Have to disagree with this by Daniel+Dvorkin · · Score: 2, Interesting

      The Mac may or may not be better; that's certaintly debatable. What's not debatable is that it's much, much, MUCH better that Microsoft won. If Apple had won, how long would we have been saddled with proprietary hardware with proprietary software? A LONG-ASS time, and Macs would have been far more expensive.

      Or maybe -- and this seems far more likely -- we would have had a world of competing platforms (hardware, software, and assorted combinations thereof) some better, some worse, and none with Wintel Inc.'s innovation-crushing market dominance. It was only a matter of the merest luck that the Mac survived where pretty much all the other alternative platforms (the Amiga being the best known; I'd also mention OS/2) were crushed out of existence. Remember how in the Eighties you could go into an electronics store and see several different types -- not just brands -- of computer on sale, each with its own capabilities, and make a meaningful choice? Wouldn't it be nice to have that kind of choice with modern computing power?

      Now that "Wintel" is no longer quite as meaningful a term, thanks largely to the success of AMD and Linux, I'm hopeful that we're finally moving into a truly competitive PC market. But it's long overdue, and without Microsoft on the scene, it might well have happened a lot sooner.

      --
      The correlation between ignorance of statistics and using "correlation is not causation" as an argument is close to 1.
  26. Mac users ain't no cult. Haha.. by sudog · · Score: 5, Informative

    However cult-ish you think Mac users are, or ever were, the Amiga users were zealots for their machines on a scale you probably will never truly comprehend unless you were there, a part of it.

    Oh sure, Mac users love their machines.

    Amiga users went beyond love. They worshipped their computers, fought for them, spent money they didn't have to keep the companies who sold Amigas and Amiga-related soft- and hardware in business. You wanna talk hardcore, you look at the former Amiga communities. THAT will forever define the meaning of the term hardcore for me, and nothing I've seen yet comes close.

    Even now, a decade after the platform basically folded up, there are large groups of people who want to revive the spirit of the Amiga.

    Mac users may think they're a cult, but they're just a pale shadow compared to Amiga users.

    Ha ha ha.. too funny.

  27. Define change by SuperKendall · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Not all of us think a computer is some life-changing gee-golly piece of technology. It's my computer. I do stuff on it. That's it. Buying a mac doesn't change your life, or more accurately, it -shouldn't- change your life.

    What level of change though? Aren't computers supposed to be able to help you do things you couldn't otherwise - is that not a example of change?

    I'm pretty happy using a Mac desktop at home because I don't have to constantly clean the system or upgrade things all the time like I used to with the Windows system. That is a change, and it's damn positive.

    Another change that's possibly even better is having family members (like my mom) have Macs. That means almost no support work at all. That too is a lifestyle change, as it frees me to spend more times with them as family and less as tech-support guy.

    All computers change your life. Not earth-shattering changes to be sure - but change nonetheless. A computer allows you access to the internet, to play more games, or what have you and those are all examples of things that do change your life in subtle ways.

    I'm not Mac or nothing either. I use LINUX and Sun servers. I use a PC at work. I am in agreemnet that Mac users are far too typically sterotyped, even though I probably fall closer to that sterotype than most.

    --
    "There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
  28. Inconsistant by SuperKendall · · Score: 2, Interesting

    I know you can get cheaper Macs[...]but one does have to wonder if the outrageous prices reflect the target audience

    How can you complain about outragious prices on one hand, and admit they have cheaper models on the other?

    Should PC's be lambasted as crazy expernsive just because you can buy a $7000 Alienware?

    Macs have products in a good range of prices at this point. I don't think you can really call the prices outragous anymore.

    --
    "There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
  29. That explains PC gamers then by SuperKendall · · Score: 4, Insightful

    No PC user on this earth is more rabid than the devoted PC gamer. Rabid in many good ways, to be sure. But part of that then is probably the huge expense they sink into systems, like $600 video cards.

    Paying a little bit more for a Mac over a PC does not look nearly so extreme compared to that.

    --
    "There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
  30. The cult of Apple haters by SuperKendall · · Score: 2, Insightful

    I personally think there is a far deeper cult around people who hate Apple, and hate Apple users. These are people that seem unable to acknowledge very real benefits from the Apple systems like ease of access, good ergonomic design, and thoughtful OS design.

    For many Apple users the computer is not aboult style, but about ability. Apple haters cannot see beyond this however, and have an overly simplified equation for life where functionality decreasing in direct proportion to looks. So which is more cultish, the group of people that like well designed products or the people that fanatically dismiss anything that is produced by the company as "Trendy" and "Elitist"?

    Look past the glitz and take another look.

    --
    "There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
  31. Mac users are a freaking cult by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

    Mac users are a cult. I propose that they're actually more like sheep than Windows users. They're the stupid kids that get a peircing 'cause it's "Rebelious" only to eventually realize everyone's got a piercing. Idiots.

    My company distributes a product that is not compatible with Macs. Not our fault, we tried to work with Apple to get them to raise their standards in some specific areas, but they're not interested right now. No big deal. Since Mac users can't use our stuff, we don't want them hounding our sales people about it, so we don't let them on our website.

    I've been collecting some of my favorite responses to this policy....

    Wed Sep 08 17:00:52 GMT 2004
    An anonymous user provided the following Customer Feedback :
    support mac you idiots!

    Wed Sep 08 18:18:54 GMT 2004
    An anonymous user provided the following Customer Feedback :
    Support Macs, you assholes. you suck.

    Wed Sep 08 20:24:38 GMT 2004
    An anonymous user provided the following Customer Feedback :
    Thanks for being lazy dick heads for not supporting Mac. Please Die.

    Wed Sep 08 21:55:34 GMT 2004
    An anonymous user provided the following Customer Feedback :
    Support Mac OS X you bitches

    Thu Sep 09 00:10:53 GMT 2004
    An anonymous user provided the following Customer Feedback :
    Eat shit you miserable pricks.

    Thu Sep 09 02:31:32 GMT 2004
    An anonymous user provided the following Customer Feedback :
    Fuck you if you don't support Mac.

    Thu Sep 09 03:19:32 GMT 2004
    An anonymous user provided the following Customer Feedback :
    Support mac u dix
    Yours truly

    Thu Sep 09 10:57:56 GMT 2004
    An anonymous user provided the following Customer Feedback :
    As a Mac user, you suck!!!!!

    Fri Sep 10 00:37:38 GMT 2004
    An anonymous user provided the following Customer Feedback :
    You people just fucking suck. Write your site to some damn standards and don't lock out a sizeable percentage of internet usage. Fuckers.

    Fri Sep 10 05:36:46 GMT 2004
    An anonymous user provided the following Customer Feedback :
    PS: Fuck you for not supporting other systems. Maybe I said that before. I'll say it again. Fuck you.

    Fri Sep 10 16:39:28 GMT 2004
    An anonymous user provided the following Customer Feedback :
    why not support mac? afraid that life might get simpler? lazy bones!

    Fri Sep 10 21:03:53 GMT 2004
    An anonymous user provided the following Customer Feedback :
    You guys are real smart to ignore Mac users, afterall it's only 30% of the market. Keep up the good work!
    Idiots!

    Mon Sep 13 19:19:54 GMT 2004
    An anonymous user provided the following Customer Feedback :
    Screw you for not supporting Mac. I hope you fail.

    Tue Sep 14 23:20:52 GMT 2004
    An anonymous user provided the following Customer Feedback :
    support Mac you assholes!
    Your missing out on millions of users

    Wed Sep 15 02:35:39 GMT 2004
    An anonymous user provided the following Customer Feedback :
    Fuck you for not supporting the mac.

    Thu Sep 16 19:07:21 GMT 2004
    An anonymous user provided the following Customer Feedback :
    fuck you for not supporting macs

    1. Re:Mac users are a freaking cult by mehgul · · Score: 2, Interesting

      How about being intelligent about it and putting a page explaining the situation to Mac users ? Do you really think they can't understand ?

    2. Re:Mac users are a freaking cult by zpok · · Score: 3, Insightful

      "My company distributes a product that is not compatible with Macs. Not our fault, we tried to work with Apple to get them to raise their standards in some specific areas, but they're not interested right now. No big deal. Since Mac users can't use our stuff, we don't want them hounding our sales people about it, so we don't let them on our website."

      This reminds me of the joke about the bad salesman who goes "For the last time, we don't have this in stock!" when the hundredth customer comes in to ask for the same thing.

      You go on feeling superior because Apple doesn't go down on all fours to fix your problem, that makes beautiful business sense. Given your attitude, I'm sure they're very motivated to do so.

      Afterthought: how do you treat Windows users who for some reason can't use your product? Like shit, or like customers?

      Really, your generalisations and "people skills" are just the thing that gives COMPUTER users a bad name (not that I care, I don't try to sell them things).

      --
      I think, therefore I am...I think.
  32. What's the diff? by Rimbo · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Then you are not a Mac User, your just happen to use a Mac.

    If a Mac user is not someone who uses a Mac, then what is one?

    I use an iBook for both my work stuff and my home stuff. I have an iPod. I got the free subscription to MacWorld. I have all of the accoutrements of the Mac User subculture.

    I got the iBook because it does what I need it to do. Because it runs on top of BSD and GNU, I can get it to do a lot of other things. I got it because it revolves around my life. My life does not revolve around it.

    In fact, it is that very thing that caused me to "switch." With my Windows box, I had to diligently upgrade it, monitor the many hardware components to make sure they were working together... I spent more time getting it to work than I spent working on it. My life revolved around the PC.

    I dedicate as little time as possible to maintaining my Mac, and the question in my mind is always: What have you done for me lately? The day it stops serving me, I will drop it. This is not a lifestyle choice. This is merely: Do what I need done efficiently, or I'll find something else that can.

    The Mac has been a better experience than the PC for me, but that has more to do with having the proper drivers and a pre-assembled machine than anything "Mac"-y about it. I might have had an equal experience buying an Inspiron or a Vaio if I used the OS as installed by the manufacturer.

  33. Re:A cult? Puhleeze by mooreBS · · Score: 4, Funny

    I've got a life. An iLife.

  34. Reasons for not recomending it to PC-Users by cocoa+moe · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Most of the comments seem to center around the Question wheter Macs are good at all, wheter the community is acceptable/credible or even if it is good to be a fan.

    Well, of course I have an oppinion on those questions too, but I'd like to make a comment about the book. About a month ago I browsed through some pages of a book with the same subject, at first I thought it might be this one, but I cant remember enough details to really make sure.

    The book I was browsing seemed rather unsatisfactory to me. The author was seemingly fascinated about some of the Mac-users he interviewed. Unfortunately the way they are presented distorts to a carricature.

    While it is true that Mac-users love to talk about Macs and their benefits (maybe due to the ignorance of their peers), they are not funny in general.

    The book I was browsing didn't care about that and It didn't provide too much background about the company.

    There is no "Cult of Mac". There is a community, much like the Linux-community or the C# enthusiasts. Of course the image is different. It's a strange topic to write a book about, but if you enjoyed a book about bikers and Harley-Davidson-clubs, you may like it, no matter if you hack DOS or push rectangles all the time.

  35. Ugh by DaveCBio · · Score: 2, Informative

    Kahney is a religious zealot when it comes to the Mac. In fact when I wrote him once to ask him about an obvious bias in a Mac article he wrote for Wired he told me he likes posting stories with a twist that pisses off PC users even if the story doesn't need to.

  36. Mac or PC? Who cares they both run Debian by dantum_sh · · Score: 2, Insightful

    This is one of those slashdot posts that gets crazy people from MAC vs Windows (NOT PC) camps out of bed and all wet.

    As one of the posters said, hardware is the same. This is a neverending battle between people who like one thing and people who like another. You can't argue about peoples tastes adn choices, they are always going to be different. What is better for one is bad for another, some Mac users don't like pcs cause they don't look as good as macs. PC users don't like Macs cause the advertising is too annoying or they don't run new game.

    I think you use what you like and what you need. I like to think that most people use a certain type of machine/software because that is what suits their needs and not because it looks cool.

    "is this thing on?"

  37. Well Put by bill_mcgonigle · · Score: 2, Insightful

    I can't speak for anyone else, but I didn't buy a Powerbook to be cool. Believe me, using a Mac you have to develop a thick skin very quickly, as everyone who sees you using one will accuse you of being a crazy evangelist or snobby elitist. (Case in point.)

    If mac users tend to congretate it's for the protection that a herd offers. There are two factors at work here. First is the need to enforce conformity that so many humans feel. The kids who beat the shit out of the kid with glasses because he has glasses. When they see a Mac user they feel the need to berate him for being different.

    Second is the insecurity that many PC users feel. At some level they know that Windows 95+ is a Mac rip-off that's been historically crash-prone and reboot-happy and if they're paying attention they've heard that their Windows systems are insecure and Macs aren't. Some of them also know they're supporting a convicted monopolist. So, they have to excuse this irrational/unwise behavior. The easy answer is that Mac users are weird, cultists, and like ethnic food. They feel justified in not being that way so they therefore justify their continuing use of Windows.

    Then there are the introspective, enlightened lot. We call them "switchers".

    Interestingly enough, I don't see these behaviors from people who use their computers for an essential Windows-only app. They tend to treat their computer as an appliance and not get emotionally entangled with it.

    --
    My God, it's Full of Source!
    OUTSIDE_IP=$(dig +short my.ip @outsideip.net)
  38. Not all Mac users are like this by JeffTL · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Some of us just don't like Windows much -- though I personally use Mac and Windows both...as well as Linux, though due to reliability issues and the presence of a good version of Word I use the Mac for all my school stuff.

    Though I will confess that I do tell others to get a Mac -- though mainly when they complain about their Windows PCs. Then they'll shut up about Windows, I have enough trouble with Windows on my Windows boxes at home, but also have a geek reputation and therefore have to take up some of the aspects of the Rabid Mac Zealot (but not the tattoos!) in order to sort of get people not wanting me to fix their Windows machines. I'll still help them to the best of my ability, just mention the Mac while I do it -- and that position may change if and when Longhorn starts turning up, because I'm probably not going to be getting too familiar with it. Plus, I like my friends to not have as many computer problems -- the actual emotion at the heart of the much-touted "evangelism." Yeah, you heard it here; plain old altruism for your friends' nerves, spouses, and pocketbooks, of the sort that has existed since time immemorial, is the reason some people tell others to get a Macintosh.

    The actual Mac lifestyle, if there is one, is actually the lifestyle of there not being a Mac lifestyle, but rather just a state of not having to worry so much about whether the computer will work (unless it's particularly old, of course). As has been said in this thread, there's actually a bigger problem with the need for a Windows lifestyle...and has been recounted, the Windows zealots who will treat those who choose to use a Mac as pariah.

    There are those who go to conferences to see Steve Jobs and stuff, and if it were convenient for me to see Jobs I'd probably do it for much the same reason I'd go see Clinton -- an interesting speaker discoursing on an interesting topic, worth attending for the sheer oratorical value of it. Cicero and Clay are dead, someone's gotta fill their shoes.

    But you know, I think I've just wasted a lot of time yammering -- let me check MacRumors ;)

    1. Re:Not all Mac users are like this by JeffTL · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I never tell people to immediately sell their Windows box, but to consider something different at their next purchasing time. As I said, I help them, but on the other hand I might suggest they look down another path.

      If the mechanic is a paid employee of the Chevy garage, I can see your analogy, but if the mechanic is someone who is just fixing the van for a favor, I can see mentioning Volvo (or as a better analogy, Ford or Chrysler). If you never hear that you may have not made the wisest purchasing decision they're bound to repeat it -- and not consider any alternatives. People should be aware of the alternatives when making any decision; it's simple informed buying. Basically the same thing as using Linux rather than Windows for just reading your e-mail and Slashdot -- cheaper and more reliable.

  39. Integrated != Closed by MattHaffner · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Because if the group doing the integrating decides you dont need it, you dont get it.

    Unless the group doing the integrating decides, on a lark, to join, embrace, and even contribute to the open standard/software movement. 'Cause then you might be able to still decide what you want or need.

    But that couldn't possibly come from some over priced, consumer-electronic excuse for a computer, now could it? No way.

    Just keep doing yer thing, man...

  40. Mac Cultists by johnnywheeze · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Now, I own three macs, they're great machines, but they are just that.

    Mac Cultists really creep me out. I remember one past NAB tradeshow, watching this group of 5-7 mac people walking together. From behind, you could see that all of them were wearing IDENTICAL jackets with "Think Different" across the back. Ironic? or just creepy?

    At any rate, everyone knows that there is only one computer that is worthy of religious devotion, and that is the Amiga.

    Thank you,

    The Wheeze

  41. I've got a Newton OS tattoo by type40 · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Its that Picassoish light bulb. People ask me what it is and I tell them its a symbol for good ideas that no one knows what to do with.

    --
    "You can see I know very little about pimp policy." George McGovern.