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Pre-Election Discussion

With the US Presidential Election getting started tomorrow, this story is your official chance to discuss the issues of the election with other Slashdot readers. And no matter what you decide, if you can, just get out and vote tomorrow.

97 of 2,549 comments (clear)

  1. Remember! by Leroy_Brown242 · · Score: 5, Funny

    Vote early! Vote Often!

  2. An Honest Question by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Interesting

    I want an honest option, I am really thinking about a 3rd party, the ____________ party, I like what _____________ has to say about the issues I care about. I disagree with him on a few issues, but they are not a matter that have been strong enough to destroy thinking about him. But on the other hand I live in a swing state. I am leaning towards the lesser of 2 evils, but then when I think of that, I get something inside my head saying "for to go against conscience is neither right nor safe."* I would like some honest thoughts, and please no "if you vote third party you are throwing away your vote" or "a vote for a third party is really a vote for (insert one of the 2 major party candidates here)" because I just don't believe that. Also I am posting anonymously so you can not find out who I am think about or that so it can not influence your response.

    *2 points for any one that can name who that quote is from.

    Also moderators please save your mod points for the respondents of this question, instead of this question it self, besides there is no point in moding up or down an AC.

    1. Re:An Honest Question by eln · · Score: 5, Insightful

      The best way to build up your party is to vote for them in local elections where they are more likely to be noticed, and maybe even win the election. You can also support them by championing their ideas in newspaper letters to the editor, op-eds, protests, and other such things. If the goal is really to push an agenda rather than to put a certain group of people in power, your best bet may be to try to influence one of the major parties to listen to your point of view, and maybe get them to adopt one of your pet issues as part of their platform.

      Remember that in the end, all politics are local. You may have a better chance of your party's platform actually influencing your day to day life if you can manage to get them elected to a state or local office. If your party manages to gain control of a locality, and the quality of life in that locality improves, that will be a far more valuable PR tool then voting for them in a national election where they are only likely to get .01% of the vote anyway.

    2. Re:An Honest Question by SnakeJG · · Score: 4, Interesting

      One possiblity you can consider is vote trading.

      IANAL, and I am sure that this is against some laws, but if you want the lesser of two evils, but feel you should vote for your canidate of choice, perhaps you can ask a friend in a non-swing state who has no interest in a third party canidate (but agrees with you on the lesser of two evils) to agree to vote for your third party canidate, and in exchange you can vote for the lesser of two evils. This way, the third party canidate still gets a vote, and you don't get attacked by a rabid mob for throwing away your vote in a swing state.

      I would just like to finish this post by saying: IANAL and this is in no way advice that I feel anyone should follow, merely hypothetical ponderings on my part, which I am sharing with the slashdot community as I believe is my first amendment right.

    3. Re:An Honest Question by dave-tx · · Score: 4, Insightful
      Quite simply, your vote is based on your evaluation of the situation. Are you willing to accept another 4 years of the current administration in order to make a statement for your third party candidate? If so, then you should vote for your third party candidate.

      If not, then consider placing your third party vote another time. This may not be the best time to make a statement.

      --

      >> "What would the robut do? Frame someone!"

    4. Re:An Honest Question by HarveyBirdman · · Score: 4, Insightful
      please no "if you vote third party you are throwing away your vote"

      I never understood that either. How is voting for someone I don't want *not* throwing my vote away?

      --
      --- Ban humanity.
    5. Re:An Honest Question by op51n · · Score: 4, Interesting

      The best way to build up your party is to vote for them in local elections where they are more likely to be noticed, and maybe even win the election.

      Exactly. I just read someone on a forum I post on saying this exact thing. Vote Kerry, then vote third party locally, where they can make a difference to your life.
      I am circumspect about Kerry, but I know for sure that we need rid of Bush more than anything else, and I am not even American. I live in the UK, but it is so clear now that the outcome of this election is going to play such a large role in politics in the UK (thanks Blair, you fucking asshat) and the rest of the world!

    6. Re:An Honest Question by micromoog · · Score: 5, Insightful
      Look at the issue in more than a black & white sense. Many people have the following two goals, in order of priority:
      1. Get _____ 3rd party candidate elected.
      2. Get Bush out of office.
      In reality, voting for the 3rd party candidate contributes to the failure of both goals (goal 1 is already at 100% failure). Voting for Kerry leaves goal 1 at its predetermined failure state, but actually does something towards goal 2.

      If you really don't care whether Bush or Kerry wins (keep in mind, one of the two is definitely going to), then this doesn't apply to you. But if you have any preference at all, it arguably makes sense to vote along that preference.

    7. Re:An Honest Question by famebait · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Well, here's how my logic would go in this particular election, if I were eligible:

      THE most important thing about democracy, even more important that any real or perceived influende on actual policy, is that you get to hold the people in power accountable.

      Kerry may be a wild card, but you KNOW that Bush LIED to you. To ALL of you, and not just about his private life, or even shady business practices, but about important political decisions with direct bearing on the security of your country and the rest of the world. He LIED to you in order to go get accceptance for going to war on a sovreign nation who was no threat. He LIED to you about the reasons you should or should not support risking the death and suffering of thousands of american soldiers and innocent civilians alike. Even if you would have supported it anyway, there is NO excuse for misleading the public in such a blatant way on such a serious matter. NOONE should get away with that, EVER.

      If you don't kick him out now, you're basically telling politicians (all of them), that they can get away with pretty much anything and enjoy continued support, as long as they dangle some sort of enemy in front of you.

      Even if you believe Kerry will be worse (I fail to comprehend how that is even remotely likely, but I know you are out there), how much worse could he be, and wouldn't it still be worth it just to send a clear message that you will be held accountable if you fuck up?

      --
      sudo ergo sum
  3. Longest Election Season Ever by eln · · Score: 4, Funny

    I'll just be glad when this whole stupid thing is over. I'm so sick of all of the election coverage.

    I look forward to seeing who won the election sometime in late December.

  4. Ob. by mcmonkey · · Score: 5, Funny

    Don't blame me, I voted for Kodos.

  5. Voting for Badnarik by Liselle · · Score: 5, Interesting

    I live in Massachusetts, where the outcome is more or less predetermined (we are sort of a wacky state that's solidly Democratic, and has a history of electing Republican governors. Don't let that fool you, though, Kerry will landslide here). So I've decided to vote Libertarian. While I don't agree with everything Badnarik stands for (free market can't solve everything), I am using my vote to try to put a spotlight on election reform. Anyone else in the same boat?

    --
    Auto-reply to ACs: "Truly, you have a dizzying intellect."
    1. Re:Voting for Badnarik by crow · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Yup, I'm also in Massachusetts. I'm usually a Republican voter, and I can't support Kerry, but I also can't support Bush for a number of reasons. Voting for Badnarik seems like the best way to send a message that I'm a disgruntled Republican.

      Not that I agree with the Libertarians, but I would like to see their ideas get more consideration.

    2. Re:Voting for Badnarik by I'm+Spartacus! · · Score: 4, Interesting

      I'm in Arizona, and we will certainly go Red*. As such, I'm voting for Badnarik with the hope that the Libertarian vote will be dramatically higher than it was in 2000.

      Baby steps...

      * If the decision was in doubt, I'd certainly vote Kerry as Bush has proven to be the most hostile to the rights of U.S. citizens as any administration since Lincoln's.

      --
      "War is God's way of teaching Americans geography." -- Ambrose Bierce
    3. Re:Voting for Badnarik by LMCBoy · · Score: 5, Insightful

      If the decision was in doubt, I'd certainly vote Kerry

      You should vote Kerry then, because AZ is in play. I'm in AZ too; voter turnout can make the difference here.

      --
      Liberal (adj.): Free from bigotry; open to progress; tolerant of others.
  6. Here goes. by captnitro · · Score: 4, Funny

    Let's do some unscientific polling.

    Introducing 'Geek Code Election 2004'.

    VOTE
    (Bu)ush
    (Ke)erry
    (Bk)dnarik
    (Na)der
    (P e)routka

    PARTY AFFILIATION
    (R)epublican
    (D)emocrat
    (G)reen
    (B )rown
    (C)onstitution
    (L)ibertarian
    (W)hig
    (J)e di

    You work it out, I don't know.

    CONFIDENCE

    ++ Like candidate a lot
    + Like candidate
    X Neutral about candidate
    - Don't like candidate, but voting for them
    -- Really don't like candidate, but voting for them
    # Better than incumbent.

    and state. Group multiple elements in parens.

    I'm a Ke(X#)DVA.

    REMEMBER TO YANNO, VOTE TOMORROW ALSO, SLASHDOT DOESN'T COUNT

    1. Re:Here goes. by TheFlyingGoat · · Score: 4, Funny

      Bu++RWI

      Hmm... Bu++ looks like Butt. :(

      --
      You have enemies? Good. That means you've stood up for something, sometime in your life. --Winston Churchill
  7. Bush and I'm not afraid to admit it. by winkydink · · Score: 4, Funny

    Even while in France last week.

    --

    "I'd rather be a lightning rod than a seismometer." -Ken Kesey

    1. Re:Bush and I'm not afraid to admit it. by Catbeller · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Bush IS demonstrably an idiot. It's not reflexive to say so. He is just so remarkably wrong, uninformed, stubborn, not-bright, and incorrect. He thought Sweden was neutral and had no army. MY GOD. He won't drop his notions even after they are shown to be dead wrong. WMD, Saddam=OBL, taxcuts make us rich, over and over ....

    2. Re:Bush and I'm not afraid to admit it. by MSBob · · Score: 4, Insightful
      Well George had his four years and most people did not like what they saw (war mongering, dogma based policy bordering on theocracy, junk science, militarization, shady deals for office friends (Halliburton first and foremost), terrible environmental record, tax breaks for SUV owners, massive deficit and the list goes on.

      Sure enough, Kerry is pretty much the unknown in this equation, but honest to goodness could his record be any WORSE than Dubya's? Is the status quo really WORTH preserving here?

      --
      Your pizza just the way you ought to have it.
  8. A Thought by TheMeuge · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Those who cast the votes decide nothing.
    Those who count the votes decide everything.
    ------------------(Joseph Stalin)

  9. Please.... by Solder+Fumes · · Score: 5, Insightful

    If you have no clue of the issues, if you're basing your decision solely on superficial reasons, or if you're just voting because someone told you to, please don't vote.

    Don't drown out the voices of actual concerned citizens who have invested a good amount of effort looking at all the issues and reviewing the histories and promises of the various candidates.

    1. Re:Please.... by I'm+Spartacus! · · Score: 5, Funny

      if you're just voting because someone told you to, please don't vote.

      Unless they told you to vote against Bush. Then it's OK!

      --
      "War is God's way of teaching Americans geography." -- Ambrose Bierce
    2. Re:Please.... by Luciq · · Score: 5, Insightful

      I agree. This is essentially letting others get multiple votes through you, which is obviously unfair when phrased as such. My sister, for example, is wholly clueless when it comes to politics "I don't even pay attention to that stuff..."

      But is she voting? Yes!

      For who? Bush!

      And why??? "I just vote for whoever Dad tells me to vote for."


      Sweet succulent Jesus save us all...

    3. Re:Please.... by the_rev_matt · · Score: 4, Interesting

      I've often been criticised by fellow liberals when I espouse the idea that you should have to take a test before being allowed to vote. A simple fact based test e.g.

      Amendment x will do which of the following:
      a - change the wording of the state constitution regarding property tax
      b - require me to sign over my firstborn child
      c - change the wording of the state constitution regarding employment rules

      If they can't get that right, they don't get to vote on that issue, move on to the next one.

      --
      this is getting old and so are you

      blog

  10. Wrong candidates by supun · · Score: 5, Funny

    Can I vote for the judges who will decide this election instead?

    --
    :w!
    1. Re:Wrong candidates by glitchvern · · Score: 4, Insightful
      Can I vote for the judges who will decide this election instead?

      No, this vote is for three or four of the judges who will decide the next election ... amongst other things.
  11. Daily Show says it best... by ntxb229 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Even though the daily show is "fake" news and is supposed to be comedy, I think the title of their election coverage tomorrow is all too revealing: "Prelude Recount" Let the lawsuits begin!

  12. Re:Who does OBL want in power? by WhatAmIDoingHere · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Why does it matter?

    There are really more important things than terrorists. Such as education, jobs, the economy..

    There's not much we can do to keep another attack from happening. But there are things we can, and are doing, that will provoke another attack.

    We should try not being the Global Police for a few years, try to make buddies with our allies that we've pissed off.. and just focus on the home front.

    --
    Not a Twitter sockpuppet... but I wish I was.
  13. Re:This "story" is click bait by Rei · · Score: 5, Funny

    Don't worry. All of these stories will go away after the election and subsequent four-week recount and 2 month healing period. :P

    --
    POTUS Witch Hunt tracker: 75 charges filed against 19 witches, 4 witches cooperating and 5 witches have pled guilty.
  14. Should you vote? by chill · · Score: 5, Insightful

    And no matter what you decide, if you can, just get out and vote tomorrow.

    The creators of that "Team America" movies (same guys behind South Park) got hammered because they said, basically, that if you're clueless don't bother to vote.

    What say you /.? Do those that truely have no idea or opinion really need to get out and vote? Does having some (more) randomness thrown in really help? Or is it all just a ploy to boost the "voter turnout" numbers, so when countries like Chile get a 98% turnout, we don't look like doofuses?

    --
    Learning HOW to think is more important than learning WHAT to think.
    1. Re:Should you vote? by Qzukk · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Do those that truely have no idea or opinion really need to get out and vote?

      Maybe you don't know the difference between blue and red. Maybe you have no clue who your US Representative is. But you probably do know if you want to have a cap on your property tax, and if there should be a .25 cent/gallon local gas tax to pay for road upkeep.

      Go vote, even if you don't care what the president does. Even if you think your vote for president doesn't count, you've got state and local issues on the ballot where you will have your voice heard.

      --
      If I have been able to see further than others, it is because I bought a pair of binoculars.
    2. Re:Should you vote? by White+Roses · · Score: 4, Insightful
      Somewhere along the line, "a duty to be an informed citizen able to vote intelligently" became "a duty to vote". I'm not really quoting anyone here. Just paraphrasing what I was taught in elementary civics compared to what I hear on ABCNNBCBS, a division of News Corp.

      So, I agree that if someone doesn't know anything, he or she should stay home. It's not that she or he has failed in his or her duty to vote, he or she has failed in his or her duty to be an informed voter.

      If you know the issues, are well informed, and still don't vote? Fine by me, you're an informed voter who abstained for informed reasons. But that's less likely to happen. Most people have an opinion on something. If an issue matches your opinion topics, vote. But you still need to be informed to do that.

      --
      Do not touch -Willie
  15. Re:This "story" is click bait by Frymaster · · Score: 5, Insightful
    it's a shame you can't just go and create your own website that meets your demanding personal requirements...

    oh wait, you can.

  16. Re:This "story" is click bait by byolinux · · Score: 4, Funny

    You can see the ads on Slashdot? You must be new here.

  17. Re:Be patient... by slungsolow · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Great point. WHY WHY WHY would you say that this is the most important election of our lifetime? Just to get people out to the polls? Jesus, the democratic process doesn't allow for "the most important election", it allows for "ELECTIONS" in general. All of them are equally important.

    Don't be one and done. Vote now, vote later, vote all the time. Whatever you do, don't just vote once (except during each election, voting multiple times is bad).

  18. Re:Be patient... by shelleymonster · · Score: 4, Interesting

    why is this the most important election of our lifetime(s)?

    because the next president will appoint 3, possibly 4, supreme court justices. now, the court is pretty balanced with a good mix of conservative and liberal judges. the next president will have the power to either keep and disrupt the balance.

    --

    got biv?
  19. That's business by NitsujTPU · · Score: 5, Informative

    Yeah, I'm sad to see the direction that /. has taken on many fronts.

    I moved over to K5 a few years ago, and the same thing happened, only quicker.

    Then I started reading /. again, because at least it hadn't gone as far as K5 had.

    That said, the reason for all of this is the expanded readership of /. The only reason that politics is such a popular topic here is because the demographic changed. /. didn't change their ideals so much (any site that becomes a business is there to make money guys), the readership changed and obviously wants these stories.

    By modifying your preferences, however, you can remove all of the politics stories from your front page. Think about it, by having a politics section, /. gets to make their cash, and you get a nifty flag to supress this garbage.

    1. Re:That's business by stromthurman · · Score: 5, Informative

      And after just double checking to make sure the preference still didn't work, I discovered, it now does. So kindly disregard this message.

      And to the mods, if you want to mod something informative, mod this post so people know the option is again available. My parent post is completely wrong now. (Except for getting cheap thrills from twisted panties)

      --
      I have discovered a truly remarkable sig which this margin is too small to contain.
  20. Get out and vote and ask for paper over plastic by AaronW · · Score: 4, Interesting

    I look forward to voting tomorrow. One thing I am thankful for is that I can demand a paper ballot instead of the standard electronic (Diebold) one. I urge everyone who votes tomorrow to ask for a paper ballot, even if they are not available just to make a statement.

    Even if you live in a state that is clearly going to one candidate or another, your voice will help add to how strong your state's voice is.

    Also don't forget all the local items, where your voice typically is much louder.

    And finally, remember that you're not just voting for a candidate, but for all their support staff. For example, a vote for Bush is also a vote for Michael Powell, John Ashcroft, Dick Cheney, Carl Rove and all the other people that come along for the ride. Not to mention that the next president will likely select one or more supreme court justices.

    --
    This post is encrypted twice with ROT-13. Documenting or attempting to crack this encryption is illegal.
  21. I agree with *some* of the Libertarian ideas... by Senjutsu · · Score: 4, Interesting

    But Badnarik is a bloody nutcase.

    Blowing up the UN within a week of taking office? How does that work with the strong property rights stance of the Libertarian party? "We're all for the government respecting your property, unless we don't like you, then we'll confiscate it and blow it up?" His plan isn't legal, let alone practical or within his authority as President

    The Federal Income Tax is illegal? Strapping prisoners to their beds for a month so that their muscles atrophy? Has he read the constitution? Does he understand that the President doesn't wield this kind of power?

    Based on his tendancy to advocate this kind of crap, my only conclusion is that Badnarik has even less respect for the whole of the constitution than the two major party's candidates.

  22. Politics of Slashdot by slumpy · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I agree, I've never seen a fruitful discussion on the politics section either. I think most people don't ever read any comments either. I understand there's big issues this year and I understand a polictics section sounded like a good idea, but it hasn't seemed to translate as well as I, or others thought. Something needs to be done....maybe only white male landowners or something can comment....I'm only kidding so don't mod me down for that.

    I just hate to read the politics section because I learn nothing, and gain no insight. I love the rest of /. though.

    --
    http://www.commaecho.com
    1. Re:Politics of Slashdot by lifes+a+cluster · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Well, the total lack of a fruitful discussion about politics goes much further than just slashdot. You have your right wing / left wing nutbags (depending on which side of the fence you sit on) who will use any forum possible to bash the other side without admitting the faults of their own side. It's crazy, really.

      I've had to pretty much stop watching the network news channels as of late, because it would seem that every time I turn to them, there's a liberal and conservative trying to talk over each other. It's just a nuisance!

      I for one just can't wait for this election to be over. Of course I feel this way during every election. It seems that the politicians here just make the entire elections process a complete pain in the ass for the average American - just the entire thing of having to listen to others spout off at the mouth - often not even having a clue about what they're saying - is enough to make a normal person want to puke!

      I say vote if you have conviction. Don't vote just because some moron media whore tells you to. Vote because YOU think you're doing the right thing.

      Voting for the lesser of the two evils is a standard here in the US - I think that's due to the inherent evilness in the political system. Maybe if we were to get smart and have a voting system which allows us to rank candidates, something like:

      1 - Yeah!!!
      2 - I guess so
      3 - ok
      4 - damn.. better than nothing
      5 - I'd rather eat the oppositions solid waste

      that would make things a little better. Then you cast your ballot ranking the rank candidates in the order in which they least make you want to puke. Hell, maybe a third party candidate would have a chance this way. Who knows.

    2. Re:Politics of Slashdot by EvilTwinSkippy · · Score: 4, Funny
      Or just join my Engineering party. We are only concerned about what works in production, and we aren't particularly squemish about how it all operates. If a huge federal program works in one case, we're for it. If a deregulated business environment works better in another, we're for it.

      What we don't believe in is pandering to a special interest. Unless of course that special interest produces results.

      We will also distinguish ourselves from other parties in deliberately NOT taking a stand. We have no axe to grind about this or that issue. We are really only concerned with providing you, the taxpayer, with a quality product.

      --
      "Learning is not compulsory... neither is survival."
      --Dr.W.Edwards Deming
    3. Re:Politics of Slashdot by ahrenritter · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I'm going to watch this thread to see how you get modded and if you get flamed by the party goers.

      I dipped into this story's comments because I wanted to comment on the "And no matter what you decide, if you can, just get out and vote tomorrow." tag line on the article. Contrary to your request that people only vote if they feel they are doing the right thing, I am actually 90% sure I'm going to go out and vote for the first time in my 30 years tomorrow. It makes me feel dirty though. I don't have faith in either of the two parties and I don't have faith in the electoral system either. I have never complained about any of the decisions of elected officials because I did not vote for or against them. When I vote tomorrow, I will vote independent even though I do not even fully agree with the only other person on the ballot. I've been told that "A vote for Nader is a vote for Bush" and this too makes me sad because I truly do know that whether or not it is a "vote for Bush", it is a wasted useless vote. Someone might argue that my vote will add a grain of sand to the "people who want something different" side, but honestly, even if every single person with views remotely similar to mine voted independent, I don't think it would faze the two parties in the slightest.

      I am so sick of the mud slinging. When I decided to vote this year, I attempted to do research on the local candidates, and all I could find was page after page (in print and online) of slur and "shocking truth about the lies and corruption and ineptitude". Digging through all this garbage to try to find out even the simplest answer of how a candidate even *states* they feel on an issue was reinforcement to the reason I have never voted before.

      I logically understand why we are a republic. I understand that the lack of desire on the masses part to become informed on individual matters combined with the improbable logistics of accurately and quickly collecting votes from all our citizens on each individual issue make a true democracy a near impossibility. Logically understanding it doesn't make me content about it though.

      I'm sure I'll be flamed to one end and back again for this. People will spout the age old adage spouted against people who are dissatisfied with the system (Love it or leave it you commie!). I do love America. I'm a tech loving geek and I aspire to become rich and live even more comfortably than I do now, and I hope that things in our country get better rather than worse. I am just a bit dispirited when I think about the (supposed) fact that my voting tomorrow will not help or hinder those things I'm hoping for.

      --

      All I wanted was a rock to wind a piece of string around, and I ended up with the biggest ball of twine in Minnesota
    4. Re:Politics of Slashdot by astar · · Score: 4, Funny

      I sometimes advocate that all laws be written in COBOL, not lisp. Think of the benefits. More tech jobs for old techies. Machine executable. And with development cycles what they are, less laws. Maybe we could also retire some of the worse politicians, since they cannot say anything that would make sense to a computer. Might eliminate some lawyers from office too. But maybe lisp would be better.

  23. Re:This "story" is click bait by FooGoo · · Score: 4, Funny

    I agree. I would mod you up but I am only voting once this week.

    --
    People who bite the hand that feeds them usually lick the boot that kicks them
  24. Re:Who does OBL want in power? by wizbit · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Okay, I'll bite:

    I can think of at least a few reasons Osama would like Bush to get re-elected:

    - He's still alive
    - He's still able to plan and carry out attacks
    - Recruitment is probably at an all-time high thanks to the Iraq war
    - His captured/killed deputies have been replaced (this "75 percent" figure is apparently directly from George Bush's ass)
    - Al-Qaeda is probably operating in MORE countries and is hence more decentralized than before 9/11

    These are all known, with maybe the exception of the last one, which anyone who believes Richard Clarke might know what he's talking about will also be inclined to believe is true.

    What the GOP argument seems to be is, "Kerry will be a pussy and will pull out of Iraq, stop hunting terrorists," etc. Which is completely unknown and, I would argue, unreasonable, but you're all entitled to your opinions. I think the Republicans basically try to reason this out because they think they know what Kerry will do. I'm saying we already know what Bush and Bin Laden have done. Bang-up job in Iraq and Afghanistan (omg but tehre holding elections now wtf lol) but we still haven't caught the guy, and the fact that he's distributing video and has any ability to speak, let alone taunt Americans, is hideous.

    So the proposed GOP solution - vote for Bush, he'll keep us safe. Okay. Here's what Cheney said about a week ago on Mr. BL:

    "We haven't seen much of him. You'll notice there haven't been any Bin Laden tapes running on the air where he's out broadcasting messages, frankly, because we think he's probably in a deep hole someplace, in hiding."

    So as you can see, I'm completely on board with that one.

  25. Re:This "story" is click bait by avandesande · · Score: 4, Funny

    the reason they added a politics section is so you could add it to your filter list

    --
    love is just extroverted narcissism
  26. Re:This "story" is click bait by Jucius+Maximus · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Or perhaps political and technical issues are so intertwined that political discussion is valid on this site. Wiretapping. Copyright. DMCA. P2P. VoIP. Fair use. WiFi Security. Anti-spam/spyware laws. I think that debating and discussing the strengths and weaknesses of each choice is important in the process of democracy. Geeks are as much subject to the US Government as anyone else.

    - Not an American

  27. Re:Bush all the way... by xutopia · · Score: 5, Informative
    you should read the omissions made by CNN and Al Jahzeera in the transcripts! :)

    I can't vote (not a US citizen) but basing your idea solely on the purported "fact" that Bin Laden supports Kerry you may shoot yourself in the foot.

  28. Not all intelligent discourse needs to be civil by LordZardoz · · Score: 5, Insightful

    It helps, but it need not be.

    Politics falls under "Stuff that Matters". And Politics tends to invade every thread that refers to lawmaking. Politics is filthy, nasty, and tedius business that is of critical importance, and that people feel strongly about.

    It is important to have a good forum where inteligent people can discuss and debate their views. But no one can promise that any discussion about any of the big 5 offensive topics (Politics, Religion, Abortion, Capitol Punishment, and Same Sex relationships) will remain inteligent. This thread is sort of like a designated area for otherwise inteligent slashdotters to act just as retarded as other people about everyday things (as opposed to acting retarded about Linux vs Microsoft, or whatever).

    Besides, I am Canadian, and I find the whole thing to be quite entertaining in a scary sort of way.

    END COMMUNICATION

    1. Re:Not all intelligent discourse needs to be civil by scotch · · Score: 4, Insightful
      There are really just 2 taboo topics:

      • Abortion = politics + religion
      • Capital Punishment = politics + religion
      • Same Sex Relationships = politics + religion
      • Religion = religion
      • Politics = poltics (but for some people, poltics = religion)
      HTH
      --
      XML causes global warming.
    2. Re:Not all intelligent discourse needs to be civil by Hentai · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Really, they're both subsets of the same topic, which is "Reasons why I think other people should change to suit me".

      Politics is just the practical side of that, while religion is the abstract side.

      --
      -Hentai [in vita non pacem est]
    3. Re:Not all intelligent discourse needs to be civil by prell · · Score: 4, Insightful

      There are no religious issues inherent to the debate over abortion rights. Abortion is the consideration of the rights of the unborn person versus the right of the parent over their body. If you were to ask me, as soon as conception occurs, the right of the parent over their body is separate from the rights of the child, and terminating that child is murder. If it can be reasonably determined that the life of the parent is put in danger by the life of the child, then aboriton is the decision of the parent. However, other problems and burdens that occur as a result of the pregnancy are responsibilities taken on upon pregnancy, and are not risks to be mitigated. The government should not be relied on as arbiter of responsibility.

      Deadly corporeal punishment could be argued to be beneficial to society when the convicted has shown that they constitute a clear danger to others through their actions. "If there is one town that the world would be better without, it's Dogville." -- Lars von Trier

      Marriage is not the business of the government; it is the business of citizens alone and as a law it is not only unnecessary, it is dangerous and alienating. It constitutes a violation of the right to privacy. Government-sanctioned marriage has also established an economy that, if it doesn't today, it certainly will require its participants to be married to be able to sustain their existence. Government-sponsored marriage drags the private lives of individuals into public spotlight unwillingly, and essentially crates a caste system whereby the existence of one individual is validated by the government, and the existence of another is not.

      In the prevalent religions existing in the United States today, a person surrenders their ability to evaluate experience to a nebulous power which is in actuality just another person in a uniform. In a representative democracy, the desires of individuals are met in a confluence several times until they eventually turn into votes in Congress; hopefully, the government ends up being a compromise of what many people fervently believe is right. Religion and our government don't mix, and they shouldn't mix. George Washington, Thomas Jefferson, Ben Franklin and Thomas Paine knew this, and incidentally, they were deists.

    4. Re:Not all intelligent discourse needs to be civil by scotch · · Score: 4, Interesting
      You have not provided an argument that "unborn person" is an uncontested notion. The state of an object is not affected by the so-called inevitability of future states. The distincness in time and definition of those states argues against you. What justification do you have for discarding the effects of chance when discussing inevitability, anyhow? Also, by allowing you to elminate elective abortion in order to define the inevitable outcome, you have assumed your conclusion.

      Thought experiment. A device for the artificial insemination of an egg has been set up. This device has been setup to perform its function in one hour. The effectiveness of the device is complete: allowing the device to run unhindered will bring about the inevitable result that a human egg is fertilized and embryo is created. Using the bizarro rules of logic that infect your reality, what is the status of the device as its timer ticks towards zero? Is it an "unborn person"? Does the inevitability constructed result in personhood of any form? What are the moral implications of a person stopping the device before the timer expires?

      What have you to say about your "abortion == murder" argument?

      --
      XML causes global warming.
  29. For those of you "plagued" by pro-Bush Christians by michaelmalak · · Score: 4, Interesting
    I don't expect too many Slashdot readers fit this category, but if you know of someone who is voting for Bush for his stance on abortion and life issues, please direct them to my blog article that shows how Bush works behind the scenes to ensure the continuation of abortion in the U.S., while merely spouting pro-life rhetoric to snag those votes.

    Recommend the link if you would like (or don't mind) votes transferred from Bush to Peroutka (Constitution Party).

  30. Discussion Summary by clinko · · Score: 4, Funny

    I'm right. You're Wrong.

  31. Re:Be patient... by the+morgawr · · Score: 5, Interesting
    The election is important because Supreme Court Nominations come in batches. So whoever is president is going to get to appoint a batch of new justices which will impact the legal system and our basic rights for years to come. This issue is more likely to affect life then anything about health care, socicial security, or the war on terrorism.

    Unfortunately, because the reporters on TV can't ask good questions, all I know about this issue is that Kerry won't appoint anyone who says they are pro-life and Bush doesn't have a yes/no test but tries to pick Justices who interpret the Constitution strictly.

    So basically, we don't know anything useful about what's almost definately the most important issue long term. Anyone have any useful links they can post?

    --
    The policy of the United States is worse than bad---it is insane. -- Ludwig von Mises, Economic Policy(1959)
  32. Re:Be patient... by RazzleFrog · · Score: 5, Insightful

    It is an important election for several reasons:

    1) We are at war.
    2) World opinion of the US is at an all time low.
    3) At least one Supreme Court justice will be replaced in the next 4 years.
    4) The world is watching these elections.

    And the comment about "of our lifetime" is typically meant as retroactively only. When I say that this was the best day of my life I mean my life to this point. Hard to say what things will be like in the future.

  33. Re:Be patient... by PostScience · · Score: 5, Insightful
    why is this the most important election of our lifetime(s)?

    Of course we don't know what will happen in the future, but this election is important because:

    • One candidate is a radical, whereas in past elections, both candidates were more or less moderate. (In 2000, most people thought Bush was a moderate)
    • The winner will likely decide the composition of the Supreme Court for the next 20+ years.
    • If Bush wins, Republicans will likely control all 3 branches of goverment, allowing for the most extreme changes since FDR.
    • Military commitments made during the next 4 years could easily last decades.

    Just my $0.02

  34. Re:This "story" is click bait by KilobyteKnight · · Score: 5, Funny
    I agree. I would mod you up but I am only voting once this week.

    Only once? You obviosuly aren't up on current voting techniques.
    --
    When will Windows be ready for the desktop?
  35. Re:Be patient... by el_gordo101 · · Score: 5, Informative

    Not for Supreme Court Justices, we can't. They are appointed for life. 3 (or 4) appointements could mean 20-30 years worth of left or right leaning influence in the highest court, depending on the winner of this election.

    --
    TODO: Insert witty sig
  36. Election Counting by yintercept · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I suspect that people will be a lot more attentive to the technology of counting votes than they were in the past. Sadly, few people seem to realize the value of an electoral college (which was state of the art vote counting technology in the 1780s.) Even today, I think recent events warrant this technology. The idea is that you determine population in an area every ten years and use this data to separate the population into buckets, you then count the vote in each bucket then determine the winner of the election by counting the buckets.

    The bucket counting process does give small states a boost in the process. The main thing it does is that it evens out wierd fluctuations in the data. For example, there might be higher voter turn out in states with a hotly contested senate seat.

    The Electoral College was state of the art too. IF something went wrong, you would have a body that could deliberate and select the leader. Sadly, the courts seem to have usurped this authority.

    The biggest problem with the bucket counting system is that the US is not expanding the number of buckets with the population.

    Of course, if you believe that the "will of the people" is real and that it is determined mathematically by the vote, then the vote counting technology is just plain wrong.

  37. And while you're out there by meganthom · · Score: 5, Informative

    You might want to follow these tips outlined by electoral-vote:

    Find out today where your polling place is by calling your county clerk or checking mypollingplace.com

    Alternatively, call 1-866-MYVOTE1 to find your polling place.

    Check the hours the polls are open with your city or county clerk.

    Print the League of Women Voters' card in English or Spanish and put it in your wallet or purse.

    Bring a government-issued picture ID like a driver's license or passport when you vote. Some states require it but if there are problems, you will certainly need it. If you have a cell phone, take it to call for help if need be.

    As you enter the polls, note if there is an Election Protection person outside the polling place.

    If you are not listed as a registered voter, try to register on the spot. Some states allow that. Otherwise, talk to the Election Protection person if there is one or call 1-866-OUR-VOTE for instructions. If neither of these helps, ask for a provisional ballot, but you will need a picture ID to get one.

    According to Democracy Now, voting tricks abound in states like Florida and Ohio, so try to arm yourself (against both sides) if you live in one of these states.

    --
    Live free or die
  38. Investing for the future by in.johnnyd · · Score: 4, Insightful

    If your 3rd party vote total exceeds the difference between the two "evils," you're sending a message that the loser needs to look at pretty seriously. He might have won had he embraced some of your politics. Your return on this vote investment may be 4 years down the road (or never), but a vote for one of the "evils" will be interpreted as a mandate for his platform. I'd say it's even more important in a close race to vote for your 3rd party.

    1. Re:Investing for the future by dtfinch · · Score: 4, Insightful

      He might have won had he embraced some of your politics.

      I don't think it works out like that.

      If a candidate were to move towards a third party, they would lose middle votes to the opposing candidate. They seek the position that maximizes their votes. If some of a third party's supporters move completely out of reach, it may actually force their nearest two party candidate to move the other way to make up the gap by stealing his opponent's votes.

      Look at what Kerry is doing. He's described as one of the most liberal liberals in Congress, yet he's taking a position that nearly matches Bush's. The last election, 3rd party votes gave Bush 4 years to "reeducate" the most gullible, pulling many middle voters in his direction. Kerry's only choice is to try to steal those voters back, and hope that the 3rd party voters have learned a lesson. I believe Kerry is a lot greener than he'll admit during his campaign. He's a big liar, but has little choice in the matter because of the damage that's been done.

      Possibly the best way to pull the parties in your direction is to educate the opposing party in a non-threatening manner. Plus, by joining a major party you have the ability to influence its direction in the primaries. If you join a third party, your opinion does not affect who wins the two party primaries. I'm a registered Democrat but online surveys tell me David Cobb is my hero.

  39. Re:My Endorsements (kind of) by plaiddragon · · Score: 4, Insightful

    While Bush has made mistakes (Iraq), there is no reason to suspect that he will repeat them.

    I've heard similar statements to this several times. I simply don't understand it. There is every reason to think that he will repeat his mistakes. He is the same person elected four years ago, and I haven't seen any indication that he would do things any differently given the same situation.

    --
    * * * --they cant all be your best, that would be confusing
  40. Some advice to undecideds... by l4m3z0r · · Score: 4, Insightful
    Alot of people here at /. would have you think that tossing your vote to a 3rd party candidate would effect some change and make a statement. This is true, but for the presidential election it actually does little to nothing. If you want more 3rd party candidates toss your local election votes to them, help a green be your mayor, or on your city council. The more greens or whatever 3rd party people that elected to these positions the larger there support base gets and positions them better for future national elections. This presidential election however will not be affected so much by your vote for a 3rd party candidate.

    With this in mind it is obvious you want some change since you are undecided and would like to see more/better candidates. Your best bet to do this is to vote against the incumbent at every election. For each position on your ballot find the incumbent and vote against him/her. Failing to get re-elected sends a huge message to the party. If bush gets re-elected for instance his ideas become the parties main platform and ideas if he fails however they will seek to change themselves in order to correct Bush's mistake. This is the same for all local chapters of these parties as well.

    So clearly and simply, vote against all incumbents no matter what. In local elections vote for 3rd party candidates at random if your too lazy to learn what they stand for. But for presidential elections your best bet is to just vote for Kerry and bitch about him when he fucks up.

  41. Well said by TopShelf · · Score: 5, Insightful

    It frustrates me greatly when someone says "oh, we shouldn't talk about politics...". For those of us in the US, why the hell shouldn't we talk politics?

    Our grandfathers didn't fight and die in the European and Pacific theaters so we could sit around together and avoid controversy by talking about the weather instead of who should be President.

    Over 1,000 of our troops have died in the last three years in part to bring free and open elections to Iraq and Afghanistan, and yet we shouldn't talk about politics?

    It's amazing to me, especially in light of our recent efforts in the Middle East, that some people look at politics merely as a source of personal conflict that should be avoided at all costs. Of course, the black-and-white conflict-driven political discussions portrayed in the popular media (talking heads yelling over each other on MSNBC, conservative talk radio, etc.) don't help things at all. But as a nation, we've grown relatively fat and happy over the last several decades and are only now starting to pay a price for that.

    My hope is that this election brings out a larger share of the vote and people start taking things a little more seriously. A few huge upsets that discredit the predictive power of polling wouldn't hurt, either. I think many people don't bother voting simply because they don't believe their vote matters...

    --
    Stop by my site where I write about ERP systems & more
    1. Re:Well said by EvilTwinSkippy · · Score: 4, Funny
      Reminds me of the Monty Python sketch wherein Eric Idle looks for an argument, but only gets contradiction instead...

      No he didn't.

      --
      "Learning is not compulsory... neither is survival."
      --Dr.W.Edwards Deming
    2. Re:Well said by Slime-dogg · · Score: 5, Interesting

      It is important to have a good forum where inteligent people can discuss and debate their views.

      It frustrates me greatly when someone says "oh, we shouldn't talk about politics...". For those of us in the US, why the hell shouldn't we talk politics?

      I don't believe that the first quote really could ever mean "don't talk about politics." You missed the point, totally. The parent poster said that it's important that you don't get stupid when you talk about politics.

      Your blustering is a good example of stupid political discussion. Everyone knows why we should talk politics, but everyone should know that it should be discussed intelligently. There should be acceptance of all viewpoints. There should not be the mud slinging that occurs in the media. The discussion should revolve around actual political concepts, not news postings, he-said-she-said stuff, people dying, or any of that, since that only serves to raise an emotional and typically irrational response.

      Instead of talking about 1,000 troops dying in the middle east and asia, the discussion should be foriegn policy. Instead of homosexual marriage / union, there should be a discussion of civil rights and separation of church and state. It's more important that we resolve what we want to happen, then finding a way to make that happen. This can really only be approached on a conceptual basis, not by hollow posturing on how much a certain detail sucks, or by yelling and screaming about how more brain-dead one candidate is over the other.

      Here are a few suggestions for good conversation:

      • Should the US take an isolationist foriegn policy? What defines isolationist? Should it be that way, or exclusionist, or completely open?
      • Where is the line between governmental power and the rights of the citizen? What should it be?
      • What is the responsibility that every man has to everyone else? Why should it be this way? Should the government have any responsibility for taking care of it's citizens? How would the proposed answer be possible, and why?
      • What is the individual's responsibility to the environment? Is it something individuals should be concerned with, or is it something that only the government should deal with?

      There's a whole lot more topics to talk about, but those are general enough to get something started. They also manage to fall outside the bounds of partisan thinking, which should invite intelligent thought instead of red-faced finger waving.


      That's just my $.02

      --
      You need to restart your computer. Hold down the Power button for several seconds or press the Restart button.
  42. vote for lesser evil, but get your guy a vote too. by TamMan2000 · · Score: 4, Informative

    www.votepair.org

    (depending on who you think is less evil...)

    --
    "I'll have a Guinness, no wait, make that a Coors Light" -Grad student I work with, who shall remain anonymous...
  43. Like FDR and Japanese Americans by kuwan · · Score: 4, Informative

    Bush has done more to roll back our constitutional rights than any president in history.

    It might pay to know a little bit of history before you spout off your ignorant blather. Anything that Bush has supposedly done pales in comparison to what Franklin D. Roosevelt (FDR) actually did during WWII. Look up United States Executive Order 9066 and read about the over 112,000 American Citizens that were detained during the Japanese American Internment.

  44. Re:Be patient... by benhocking · · Score: 4, Interesting
    the next president will appoint 3, possibly 4, supreme court justices. now, the court is pretty balanced with a good mix of conservative and liberal judges. the next president will have the power to either keep and disrupt the balance

    Call me cynical, but if the next president appoints 3-4 supreme court justices, I don't think either one will attempt to "keep" the balance. Of course, if Kerry is elected, and the Republicans maintain control of the House and Senate, he will have a much harder time getting his ideal candidates on the bench. In fact, I suspect that future nominations will make the Bork and Thomas nominations look tame.

    --
    Ben Hocking
    Need a professional organizer?
  45. Analysis of discussion so far by HarveyBirdman · · Score: 5, Funny
    Instances:

    - Mindless slogans: 93,451
    - Ideological smog: 878,102
    - Lies: 200,289
    - Conspiracy theories: 1,623,933
    - Trying to reduce the mind-numbing complexity of the modern world into a two step process for global utopia: 890,105
    - Urban myths: 115,936
    - Party line mantras: 278,102
    - Thoughtful content: 3
    - Snotty instance analysis: 1

    Here's a better way to vote. Those of you supporting Kerry slit your wrists. Those of you supporting Bush shoot yourselves in the head. We'll count the classify the corpses accurately. Honestly. We will. Really.

    Reason magazine had the best cover. It showed a picture of Bush and one of Kerry. The cover said, "Good news. One of these guys is going to lose. Bad news. One of these guys is going to win."

    Keep drinking the Kool-aid, folks. Hopefully the ELE asteroid is coming soon to put an end to all this.

    Go ahead. Mod me flamebait while marking the "BushKerry is a poopiehead who wants to eat my baby/kitten/grandma" posts as +99 Insightful.

    --
    --- Ban humanity.
  46. Voting for the "Lesser of 2 Evils" by Hooptie · · Score: 5, Insightful
    is voting for evil!

    Regardless of how you try to justify your vote, a vote for a major candidate is a statement that you:

    • Approve of that candidate
    • Endorse that candidate's position(s)
    • Want that candidate to be the next President of the United States!

    If these three items are not true, you can either abstain from voting, or vote for a third party candidate. Please note that it is not possible, in the US, to vote against a candidate. The most you can do is vote for one of the competetion

    As for myself, I will be voting for Michael Badnarik for President. What's that? I hear cries of:
    "But, he doesnt have a chance to win!"
    "This election is too important to risk electing the wrong person!"
    These are both true statements, however I refuse to "waste my vote", or "throw my vote away" by voting for a candidate that I disagree with.

    Hooptie

    --
    "Heavens, it appears that my weewee has been stricken with rigor mortis!" -- Stewie Griffin
    1. Re:Voting for the "Lesser of 2 Evils" by epiphani · · Score: 4, Insightful

      To quote one of the great canadian political satirists and ranters, Rick Mercer once said (slightly paraphrased):

      "Some people say that they arent going to vote because its like trying to choose between the lesser of two evils. Now listen to me very carefully here - when it comes to running a country, it is very important to choose the lesser of two evils."

      --
      .
    2. Re:Voting for the "Lesser of 2 Evils" by wass · · Score: 4, Insightful
      There's a big difference between being an idealist and being a pragmatist. No candidate will ideally represent all your viewpoints, there will always be differences. So really every person in the USA should vote for themselves, according to your logic.

      The big question is to ask yourself "How important is this election? How many issues are at stake that I will regret helping re-elect Bush by voting 3rd party?.

      It's way too close to the election for any significant momentum to build up for any 3rd-party candidate. Like someone else said, the best chance to get them elected is to vote for local positions. For example, at my house we have a sign for the green party candidate for Baltimore City Council on our front lawn, and he's gotten alot of exposure lately. We also have Kerry-Edwards signs on our lawn too, because

      But definitely realize that nationally if you vote 3rd party you're taking a vote away from Kerry. Yeah, we can argue all day till the cows come home about whether it's a wasted vote or not if you vote for who you really want. But practically and realistically you should realize you are 100% helping re-elect Bush again by doing so. If you don't mind re-electing Bush in order to vote for your ideal candidate, then go ahead and do so.

      As for myself, I voted Nader in 2000 because my state is heavily democratic and I despise the 2 party system. Bush has been way way WAY too radically conservative IMHO, and the USA and the World will be significantly better off by pushing him out of office. Most liberals I know, including many local green-party enthusiasts, are voting Kerry in this election. (Actually, the only exception I personally know of who is voting Green is the aforementioned Green Party candidate for city council). Even though my state is not a swing state, by voting Kerry I am helping to legitimize his election through the popular vote as well.

      So basically, if you don't mind Bush getting re-elected this time around then vote 3rd party. In the past republicans haven't been as evil as Bush, and I'd agree with you about going 3rd party to help usher in change. But this time around there's too much at stake for my risking any Bush re-election. Things at stake include : draft, more war, appointing between 1-4 Supreme Court judges, amendment to ban gay marriage, tie Christianity closer to the US government, etc etc.

      --

      make world, not war

  47. Re:Ahem, not exactly by Senjutsu · · Score: 4, Interesting

    I wouldn't say the tax itself is illegal, but some of the methods the IRS has used in its collection definitely are.

    That's nice, but we're not here to discuss you're beliefs on the Federal Income Tax. It is Badnarik's position that the constitution does not provide sufficient basis for a Federal Income Tax, which stands in stark defiance of the constitution as written and the intended ability of the Supreme Court as ultimate interpreter of it. It's one thing to run on a platform of repealing the 16th ammendmant as a means of scrapping the income tax, but I don't see how running on a platform of "The parts of the constitution I don't agree with I will ignore" is any better than the crap we're getting right now from the major parties.

    Would you prefer the current policy of strapping them to electrical wires?

    I'd prefer a President who was capable of respecting the constitution.

    Are you kidding me? That's one of the primary themes of his campaign, the fact that politicians today (the President in particular) wield far more power than they should.

    I fail to see why that justifies Badnarik's (apparent) belief that the executive should weild even more power than it does now, let alone why libertarians everywhere should flock to vote for a man whose platform contradicts not only basic libertarian ideals, but also the constitution itself.

  48. 2 Questions (1 for Bush & 1 for Kerry) by Tangential · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Question for Bush supporters:

    What are the chances of 2 Texas oilmen (financially supported by many more oilmen) giving us a coherent national energy policy which frees us from dependency on oil and the Middle East?

    Question for Kerry supporters:

    What are the chances that 2 trial lawyers (who's biggest contributors are the trial lawyers associations) giving us the litigation reforms so crucial to getting escalating health care and pharm costs under control for the long term viability of our economy?

    --
    Suppose you were an idiot. And suppose you were a member of congress. But then I repeat myself. -- Mark Twain
  49. Re:This "story" is click bait by torstenvl · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Since when are law and politics not geek subjects? The Geek code includes a code for Jurisprudence. In addition, many political things have a lot to do with technology, par exemple, DMCA and Check 21, not to mention export laws that would basically outlaw Pentium 4s outside the U.S. without a specific munitions export license.

  50. what do we do after the election? by keithmoore · · Score: 4, Interesting
    I have severa; fears about this election:
    1. Bush wins, and progressives give up in disgust and frustration
    2. Kerry wins, and progressives stop working for change
    3. Bush wins (or is chosen) and in response to massive demonstrated opposition creates a police state, which in turn results in violent clashes between Bush's government and the resistance freedom fighters
    4. Kerry wins, and pro-Bush factions attempt to aid terrorist efforts against the government to prove that Kerry is weak on terrorism

    (yes, I really do believe that a sufficient number of people in this country are fanatical enough to do those things)

    the point is this - no matter who wins (or appears to win, or is chosen), the country is still in a mess. our economy is a disaster with massive government deficits that drastically increase our effective tax rate (because so much of our taxes are spend on interest on the debt) and huge growing trade deficits. we're fighting an expensive, unwinnable war that has killed over a hundred thousand people so far, with no end in sight. by doing so we've turned most of the world against us, which will surely have repercussions in trade and other areas eventually. if we back out of this war the result could be a civil war in Iraq which might spread to other countries in the region.

    during this election, a huge portion of our own citizens have demonstrated a startling inability to evaluate input and reason intelligently about it. we are a nation of addicts - to consumption of consumer goods, to petroleum, to carbohydrates, to meaningless stimulation of various kinds, to alcohol and drugs, to the idea that we're superior to other people. our mainstream press has become essentially useless at informing our choices as voters and citizens. our elected officials are almost universally corrupt - sacrificing our interests to those of wealthy benefactors, and our processes for electing them are highly vulnerable to manipulation through various means.

    what, if anything, can we do about these problems?
  51. George Bush ignores the way of Christ by Larthallor · · Score: 5, Insightful

    The Bible teaches, I believe, that God the Father sent down to Earth his only son, Jesus Christ, to live as man among men. The Lord said, "I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me." God sent Jesus to be the example of how a man should live his life on Earth. Only by following the way, the truth, the life of Jesus, shall we come to know the Father. This is where the modern saying, "What would Jesus do?", comes from and makes it so much more than a simple statement of admiration. "What would Jesus do", in my understanding of the phrase, is the guideline of righteous living.

    And so, in order to see what Christians should focus on when looking for leadership in their time on this Earth, they should look at what Jesus focused on while he was here, living the life of the righteous man.

    How often did Jesus talk about homosexuality, abortion, or assisted suicide? Were these sins the focus of his ministry? Or did he focus on healing the sick and feeding the poor?

    Did he beseech us to increase the wealth of the moneylenders, so that there would be more crumbs for the poor? Or did he believe that we should help the poor by ... helping the poor?

    Did Jesus limit his healing to those that could afford the money to pay him? Or did he reach out and touch all in need?

    Did he focus on destroying enemies or loving them? Did he advocate war or peace?

    I understand and admire evangelicals' conviction to vote their conscience and follow the Word, not just in church, but everywhere, every day. But, despite the Republicans throwing those that have strength of faith some Old Testament bones, it is the God-fearing liberal Democrats like John Kerry that best exemplify the self-sacrifice and social compassion Jesus had.

    Can you really look at how George Bush reacts to the world and see him asking "What would Jesus do?" I cannot. I certainly can see him consulting the Bible and finding passages to console him. I certainly see that he believes God approves of his actions. What believer doesn't? But, try as I might, I cannot see in him a man doing as Jesus would do. Read Matthew 5:38-48 and tell me if you can hear the voice of George Bush.

    Agree or disagree with the policies of George Bush and other Republicans on the merits as you will, but please don't make the mistake of thinking that George W. Bush is following the way, the truth, the life.

    1. Re:George Bush ignores the way of Christ by WndrBr3d · · Score: 4, Interesting

      After reading your reply, I'm reminded of a Fake Campaign ad where they parody what the Bush Administration would say about Jesus if he were running for president against G.W. Bush:

      link

      I think it covers what you said in your reply almost word for word.

      And kudos for you for standing up for what YOU believe in, not what they tell you to.

    2. Re:George Bush ignores the way of Christ by 808140 · · Score: 4, Informative

      Hi. Quoting Leviticus is stupid. Leviticus also includes such gems as "If you shave your beard you will be killed", "If you disobey your father you will be killed", and a whole host of dietary laws that are universally ignored by Christians of pretty much all denominations.

      Catholics, who believe in the authority of the Pope, have a leg to stand on when they quote certain passages as being meaningful and discard others, because the Vicar of Christ has the authority in their Church to reinterpret the word of God. If you're protestant, you'll simply have to take it all or leave it all, or you're being hypocritical.

      Anyway, didn't Jesus say that the new covenant replaces the old?

      So, if you're going to use your faith -- a faith that preaches love, acceptance of others, and general tolerance (did Jesus shun the lepers?) -- to validate your own biggotry, at least quote the new testament. I'll even help you. Romans 1:26 has a passage which could be interpreted as anti-homosexual.

      But as the parent said, WWJD? Did he shun the lepers or the whores? No, he didn't. He loved. You should do the same.

      Why don't you actually read the bible sometime, instead of just parroting Jerry Falwell's talking points? There's holiness there, you know, but unless your mind is open you won't have the depth required to understand it.

  52. Re:Be patient... by YrWrstNtmr · · Score: 5, Informative
    How many "wartime elections" do you honestly think you'll be alive to participate in?

    Sadly, for the last 60 years, most of them.

    2004 - Iraq
    2000 -
    1996 - Kuwait/Iraq/Bosnia
    1992 - Desert Storm
    1988 - Panama & Iran/Iraq
    1984 - Grenada
    1980 - Iran hostages
    1976 -
    1972 - Vietnam
    1968 - Vietnam
    1964 - Vietnam
    1960 - Cuban takeover by Castro
    1956 - Suez
    1952 - Korea
    1948 - Berlin airlift and WWII aftermath
    1944 - WWII

    Not all on the scale of the one we have now, but all significant military actions quite near the election.

  53. Re:This "story" is click bait by jdray · · Score: 4, Insightful

    You know, I figure those ads keep Slashdot going, so I let them through. If it was widely known that 95% of ads on Slashdot didn't make it to the screens of their intended audience, then advertisers wouldn't send their dollars here, ultimately making it really, really difficult for you to RTFA.

    --
    The Spoon
    Updated 6/28/2011
  54. Re:This "story" is click bait by LSD-OBS · · Score: 5, Funny

    Actually, I checked up on Foo Goo (id #98336) and he actually died 6 years ago

    --
    Today's weirdness is tomorrow's reason why. -- Hunter S. Thompson
  55. If everyone votes, republicans lose by LMCBoy · · Score: 4, Insightful
    It's pretty interesting (in an wretch-inducing way) that a core Republican strategy is to keep people from voting. The lengths to which they apparently will go to achieve this end makes one wonder how they can sleep at night...

    • Wisconsin: Flyers distributed in poor neighborhoods, falsely warning people that they cannot vote if they have unpaid parking tickets, unpaid rent, any relatives in jail, etc, etc.
    • Wisconsin: Republicans claim that 37,000 democratic registrations are invalid, because the voters did not return registered mail sent by repub. party (same happened in Ohio).
    • Ohio: Republican attempts to intimidate and delay voters at the polls have thankfully been outlawed by a federal judge (though I am not holding my breath that they will fully comply, and what about other states?)
    • Ohio: Democrats were sent letters falsely informing them that their voter registration is invalid, and they are ineligible to vote.
    • West Virginia: Democrats were phoned by Repub HQ, falsely told they are ineligible to vote.
    • Ohio: Democratic party phone banking station had its phone line intentionally cut.
    • Wisconsin: College republicans distributed flyers in UW dorms, falsely telling students they could vote in any precinct they chose (similar misinformation ocurring at U.Arizona dorms).
    • Michigan: Republicans calling democrats, urging them to "stand up for gay marriage" by voting for Kerry, who will "legalize gay marriage", a right "that we all want". And don't vote for Bush who will "outlaw gay marriage".
    • Alabama: Taking a page from "The Onion", flyers distributed in poor neighborhoods, encouraging voters to go to the polls on November 3rd.

    and on and on and on...

    What contempt they have for the American people and the democratic process. It's sickening.

    --
    Liberal (adj.): Free from bigotry; open to progress; tolerant of others.
  56. Re:This "story" is click bait by flibuste · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Out of curiosity, how does one go about doing that and supporting it without some sort of ad revenue coming in?

    Faith about your skills and will to do things you require, young jedi. Do not let the dark side of profit descend upon you!
  57. Re:This "story" is click bait by aled · · Score: 4, Funny

    You don't even have an user ID!!! you must be a terrorist!

    --

    "I think this line is mostly filler"
  58. Arizona by HopeOS · · Score: 4, Interesting

    I'm a Republican in Arizona. All the Republicans in my office, my family, and immediate friends are voting against Bush. I don't anticipate Arizona going Blue this election, but I am very curious to see how the numbers come out.

    For the record, I work in financial software, and most of our employees are software engineers or have advanced degrees in Economics. The office was universally for Bush in 2000 and against in 2004.

    It's the economy. There is no issue more pressing.

    As someone commented earlier around the watercooler, we'll have plenty of time to discuss gay-marriage and stem-cell research when we're a third-world nation.


    -Hope

  59. Re:This "story" is click bait by achacha · · Score: 4, Informative

    I bet Ballmer lives in the most expensive van by the river.

    Now on related news, people should go out and vote, but not for a president, that part we are isolated by the electoral college, if you live in a prodimnantly republican state, your vote for a president does not matter.

    However, you should vote on state and local issues, this is where your vote counts.

    Also, remember that up to 4 supreme court justices are expected to retire in the next 4 years, which gives the next president a lot of clout over legal issues handled by the supreme court for the next 10-15 years (depending on justices that will be assigned by the president). At this point the supreme court is split with 1 judge leaning them towards more liberal views. With republicans you can expect conservative right wing nominations that will challange civil liberties and keep science down in favor of religion. Democrats will leans towards liberal judges that will allow stem cell research, medicinal marijuana, and such. The choice is yours as to which direction you want the country to go, but if we fall behind in scientific research, another country can take the lead and that tends to have a domino effect that affects our economy.

    Think and vote.

  60. This is for my undecided friends.... by $criptah · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I really hope that all you who are reading this post do know your candidates. However, I will publish my points of view for those ones who are undecided. Here is why I vote for Kerry:

    Kerry does not want to increase the power of the federal goverment. As he stated, he would like the states to decided on several particular policies. This is as "American" as it gets. Bush, on the other hand, wants to increase the amount of control that fed. gov't has over the states.

    Kerry does not want to embed discrimination into our Constitution. I am not gay, but I believe in equality and justice for all. How can one expect a fair treatment while the others are being denied civil liberties? Think about it, would straight men beat their wives if the concept of heterosexual marriage was perfect? If you want to protect marriage, do me a favor: push for women's rights and stand against family violence.

    Kerry does not shove the Bible up my ass. Whether you are religious or not, you should remember that religion and state are separate in this country. Just because you believe in god, it does not mean that your beliefs should become a part of my life. I have nothing about personal religious traditions, but I think that citing the Bible when it comes to creating laws is pushing it. When is the next round of witch trials, Mr. Bush?

    Kerry is for cooperation with international entities and other countries. Remember, we did not win WWII without help from numerous states. Despite personal feelings we cannot spit at the French and tell the Germans to shut the fuck up and eat that kraut. A world is a big pile of shit and all of us are in it equally.

    I support women's right to choose.

    During the debates Mr. Bush did not have enough guts to admit three things that he screwed. Let me help him out: "No Child Left Behind," Iraq, tax cuts for the rich.

    If you think that Kerry is a "flip-flopper," think how many times YOU changed your mind and why you did it; did it make you a bad person? Although this may not be a populate saying in the United States -- it's French -- but "only idiots do not change their minds." Would you rather vote for a person who can adjust his/her decisions based on feedback (just like the spiral model of software engineering) or you would you prefer a blind follower of some sort of ideology?

    Kerry is intelligent, Bush is not. Do me a favor, compare Kerry and Bush rallies, speeches, etc. You will see a difference. Our current president speaks like a fucking second grader with "internets," "budget men" and "group of folks."

    48 Nobel prize winners support Kerry.

    Kerry promises pro-environmental policies.

    This is a strech, but compare the economies and educational systems of "blue" vs. "red" states. It will give you a rough idea who is voting for Mr. Bush. Also, take a look at rallies and the supporters of both candidates. I have nothing against Republicans because I tend to vote for the principals, not the party. However, it is not the case during these elections...

    Well, I believe this is enough for starters. Ideally, I would like to see a president who is conservative when it comes to spending and liberal with social policies. However, this is never going to happen. There is too much bigotry in this world.

  61. Re:This "story" is click bait by Lord_Raptor · · Score: 4, Informative

    It's documented in many places that this administration & his Gang-o-thugs have wanted to go into Iraq for quite some time.

    For example, just recently:
    Info from Bush Ghost Writer (misleader.org)
    Other articles to look at:

    in 2000, Bush wanted to invade Iraq if elected
    Neoconservative plan for global dominance
    US Dollar vs the Euro: Another reason for the invasion of Iraq
    US Rejected Peace offerings from Iraq and Afghanistan
    Report Proves Bush Knew He Was Lying About Iraq

    There are more, you just have to go look, and look beyond the distortion of facts that gets in the media and in the ads. (Neither party seems to care about real facts this election).

  62. Re:This "story" is click bait by An+Onerous+Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

    The only way you can believe that only liberal judges "legislate from the bench" is if you only call it legislating when a ruling goes against your political agenda.

    Conservative judges don't have a lock on "strict constructionism." Rather, they simply have a different idea of which areas the government should be butting its nose into.

    It wasn't the liberals in the Department of Justice who eroded states rights by deciding that California couldn't have its own medical marijuana laws. It's not liberal judges who are blithely ignoring the spirit and letter of the Constitution by allowing the administration to detain prisoners without bringing them to trial. It wasn't a liberal Supreme Court which stepped in and stopped the Florida recounts.

    As far as I'm concerned, when a Republican starts griping about "activist judges," they mean "judges whose rulings come down on the liberal side of the aisle."

    --

    You want the truthiness? You can't handle the truthiness!