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Novell Linux Desktop Released
KingDaveRa writes "Novell have just released Novell Linux Desktop. Its based on SuSE Linux, but is cut down quite a bit to just include essential apps - perfect for a corporate environment. Novell claim to not be going directly after Windows, but rather pushing this as legacy Unix users. The Register has a take on this too."
Hmm... Nicely timed with Chris Stone leaving...
*tinfoil beanie on*
I've got a system at home that I installed with the SuSE personal ISO image, and then upgraded by downloading SuSE professional RPMs to have all the useful stuff.
Is this going to be the same? Or have they stopped you from doing this?
Luis Villa's blog has some more interesting information and links as well. (He's a Novell, former Ximian guy).
You can download an "eval" copy, after some registration, it's 3 ISO files, but is the full version according to Luis.
Novell has also released the source.
Unfortunately, it's still Gnome 2.6 and some updated KDE stuff, but one of the most interesting things built in is Novell's new iFolder, an interesting way to share folders remotely, including over different OS's.
It's based on Suse 9.1, but it will be interesting to see what changes the Ximian guys have added to it. The timing seems a bit weird though as Suse 9.2 just came out. Novell's strategy will be something to watch, to see how they position Suse Server, Suse 9.2 and Novell Linux between homes and offices.
I certaninly hope this exceeds my expectations! Is this "enterprise" ready? Does it have a consistent look & feel? .. or is it just crap-in-a-box? Let's all try the "eval".
Girls are strange. They don't come with a man page.
-- Michael Mattsson
There should be more versions of the kernels and so on, with almost no packages to download of all the *nixes, those large ISOs are a big turn off.
I think this is a much bigger step than what it is being given credit for at first glance. It looks like the default desktop environment is Gnome instead of KDE. I, for one, am extremely happy to see that.
It may not be. One problem plaguing distro's is that they throw so much into the distro that QA is sacrificed. This is true for SuSE as well. I've been using SuSE for about a year now and see many of the same issue I saw with RHat. There are menuitems that don't work, configurations that won't take, and clutter. A slimmer desktop might be in order. I've said for years that a distro company would do well to have a group sit down and actually test each feature and app that they include on a distro but evidently few do. Maybe someone has with Novell Linux and this is the result. We can hope!
Why do you say that? I see nothing in Novell's documentation that suggests you need a "Novell network" (by which I presume you mean a NetWare server) to take advantage of this.
... freshly installed evaluation copy of Novell Linux Desktop 9. Well, nice startup screen, nice Ns everywhere.
Uhm, and Firefox came with Slashdot already bookmarked.
Yes, it costs money. $59 USD. There IS an evaluation version available for free. From their site:
NOTE: The only limitation of this evaluation software is the duration you will have free access update.novell.com. Should you choose to license Novell Linux Desktop, you will be provided with a new registration code, which you can easily update in your desktop in order to re-enable access to update.novell.com for product patches and updates.
click on the firefox section of the features. what do you see? Main sponsors:
GOOGLE..
Yeah, from the screenshots, it looks an awfully lot like a hybrid between Windows, MacOS, and MacOSX.
I wonder what that means to those folks who claimed that "Novell is placing their bets on Gnome! KDE is going down!". Open mouth, insert foot, eh?
Well, the people who made those claims seemed quite often to be connected to Ximian... Either they were astroturfing/spreading FUD, or they didn't know what their company was doing.
Lesbian Nazi Hookers Abducted by UFOs and Forced Into Weight Loss Programs - -all next week on Town Talk.
not the consumer version. This version is for use in big business by general knowledge workers. It's features are maintainability and stability of pachages, not end-user featuritis. In other words, it's for corporate desktop drones. It's designed to work best in a corporate environment, of course complementing Novell's upcoming Open Enterprise Server. It's timed to match the upcoming release of that product.
SUSE Linux 9.2 Pro is the geek version, for home and mobile users mostly.
The last version of SuSE had a "personal" edition, which was 1 CD including source. Very cut down. Had OO.org, Firefox + Thunderbird, KDE but no GNOME, very limited dev tools, but adequate for web browsing & basic office work, which is what I assume this is aimed at.
so novell is a pretty big name to have teamed up with suse, and already very reputible distro. id like to know, what about this distro makes it any different from the rest, and if so, why should i swtich from mandrake?
spend money here
Perhaps Novell can help in providing more legitimacy toward linux desktops to the Corporate World. It's not that linux desktops geared toward corporations haven't been around, but more the lack of a Name Brand company to trust purchasing it from. I'm being hopeful, but any amount this release can cut into Microsoft's market share is good for us all.
Steal This Sig
Unless I'm overlooking something that's a very attractive package. Anxious to see how it sells. If this takes off it's going to hit MSFT's pricing model fairly hard.
That's our life, the big wheel of shit. - The Fat Man, Blue Tango Salvage
does novell linux have YaST and if so can I install packages from SuSE ftp sites?
If Mandrake is working for you, why switch?
Meh.
I thought Suse was supposed to be a KDE distro. The swf animations shows a Gnome desktop.
GETPKG - Package Management for Slackware
Does anyone have a mirror or a bittorrent tracker? The site was sort of okay before 12:00 GMT+1 but now it's rather dead...
When you do things right, people won't be sure if you've done anything at all.
And it looks like Novell had to choose Gnome. When will people realize how dialog boxes are supposed to look?
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| OK | | Cancel |
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Celebrate the finer things in life
Looks like they're going to support GAIM. With the 'Corporate' backing of the project is it likely that the vendors (AIM, YAHOO, etc) will work with Novell/GAIM on modules? I see this becomming another X type setup where the modules are closed source but the client open. Mixed feelings on that one. On the one hand there's the "Everything Needs To Be Open" camp, but to some extent a little give in some areas can help drive adoption (i.e. a closed Linux solution is better than no Linux solution) in some areas.
I guess I'm all for it. I've used GAIM in Windows at work, where for a while having a Yahoo account was a business need. (Soon replaced by a closed system by everyones favorite 'inovator') The biggest issue I had in pushing the solution was the fact that the protocol kept 'breaking' (which is not a big selling point) I put up with it, switching back to the ad-ridden version for the times GAIM was out, but something as simple as a closed source driver and I could have sold the solution (pushing the non-adware/privacy aspect) When we got the order from on high to switch to an internal solution, if everyone was already sold on GAIM as a client, moving something like an internal Jabber server would have been an easy sell. (No need to retrain users).
I guess it's kind of the Zen approch to Open Source adoption. Sometimes you need to give up some control to later gain it.
A trim desktop for the corporate drone is exactly what the market needs. Sun is sort of trying to do it with JDS, but they're selling it as one desktop for every kind of corporate user. The lean desktop with only necessary packages that's easily maintainable is what a lot of companies need if they're going to slowly switch away from Microsoft. It eases headaches and drastically cuts administrative costs. I hope Novell is very smart in the way they market it.
Developers: We can use your help.
Anyone who has used Novell much has noticed how Novell has had to remake every Windows version to even work as a network enabled desktop should. Because Windows is so not network enabled it isnt well suited to be in a network period. The amount of work they have had to put into Windows just to get it to log into a Novell server is staggering for anyone who has used pam_auth_ncpfs on linux. A linux desktop is ready today for Novell, all its lacking is zenworks like features with centrally managed menus and common login scripts. The profiles bit is really easy on linux and just needs some simple glue to work seamless.
Linux gives Novell what it wanted back in 95 when it instead got the steaming pile of sh*t called Windows 95. I really hope they get it toghether and working perfectly real soon because of the breathing room given by MS eternal vapourware called Longhorn.
I run all my linux servers against Novell for user managment and it works perfect today, this gives the same advantage to the non techies.
HTTP/1.1 400
The corporate world started way back when with Windows PCs and Microsoft Office. Any Unix desktops are specialized applications, such as Graphics Design and Virtual Simulations (Unigraphics, HP-UX, SGI, IBM AIX.) They pay for these systems (in the 10 thousands each) because they are good at what they do and there is a company that stands behind them. If it weren't for these systems, everything would be running MS Windows. And it would be safe to say, any company running Macs will not migrate to Linux, because Macs are now more affordable (as compared to their Unix counterparts,) Unix based, and are already in niche markets.
So I would say, if they are going after corporate desktops, they are going after MS Windows, because this is where the PC is. Linux will also allow better integration with existing and vested Unix and Mac systems.
No, they are going after MS Windows. Their "not-going-after-Windows" statement is for investors and people who manage tech, but not into tech and understanding tech from the ground level, so as not to still certains waters that Microsoft is monitoring.
Yeah, it is Monday.
I meant to say "stir certain waters"
So, will there be an upgrade for those of us using Ximian Desktop 2? Not sure if I want to install yet another distro.
Actually, it looks like currently, there is little support for NetWare at all in it. No client for instance to connect natively to NetWare servers.
having OO.O in there is too much as well. 99.997 % of the time the distro's version is old compared to what is available online.
/etc just as long as EVERY distro has them in the exact same location.
I prefer no office apps ONE browser or better yet wget links on the admin desktop to snag those apps for me as soon as I desire to.
Linux still is a PITA because of the filesystem fiasco. I just wish someone had the balls to force ALL linux distros to use one filesystem layout in order to call themselves linux. I do not car if config files are in
same for apps. one set of install locations, one set of lib applications.
and a simple wrapper to force a make/install to put the files in the right locations (cince developers are too damned lazy to do it correctly themselves.
I also recently got the downloadable personal ISO of SuSE just to see what a "polished" commercial distribution looked like. For the most part, I was very impressed. However, I have been seeing some of the issues you mention. The Kmenu editor wasn't quite working right, but downloading some fresh kde libraries seems to have fixed that. I also can't set passwordless login for my children (you know, the "no password required for" checkboxes under the convenience tab). As it stands right now, I've just deleted thier passwords in /etc/shadow - which is a real bad solution, but's the only thing I've gotten to work (my children are 2 1/2 and almost 4).
I'm tempted to get some old laptop and install Slackware just to tinker with it in the hopes that it will enhance my understanding of Linux in general.
Maybe, as you say, Novell is on the right track.
A goal is a dream with a deadline
"If [Windows] is working for you, why switch?"
Why indeed?
I am a true Gnome lover, and of course hope that Novell will go for Gnome in the long run.
BUT, Gnome and KDE need each other in order to improve, just like Linux need MacOSX and Windows.
Gnome and KDE steal idea from each other, and often improve them in someway.
Think if we only had Mozilla and IE. Oprea invented tabbed browsing, and the idea to have search bar in the toolbar among MANY other neat features, that FireFox now have.
Somehow I just don't think the world needs another Linux distro...
Maybe when we can get 1 that works good, and becomes a standard then we'll see desktop linux take off.
Do you opine?
http://www.opine-it.com
They just got $530+ million from Microsoft.
" The corporate world started way back when with Windows PCs and Microsoft Office. "
Only for those new to history.
Try remembering Visicalc...on the Apple.
And that's just for the Personal Computing market.
For mainframes there was VMS (predating Unix).
And last Unix desktops (running CDE) did have productivity apps (they just weren't Microsoft).
I am just curious...Can anybody post the link of the screen shots? and shots of the boot screen? The above posted link to blogs doesnt have screenshots.
thanks,
I would agree that this would be much more convenient. I think you have two camps on that subject: Those who think the flexibility is what makes Linux Linux and those who feel consistency would move the platform forward faster. SuSE was a learning curve for me, coming from RHat. They represent two totally different executions of the same basic thing. I think more consistency across distro's would definitely help Linux as an entity, but perhaps they feel it would negate many of the differences and render them unnecessary. Perhaps.
Can I install the NLD on top of Debian? Where do I point my sources.list?
--
make install -not war
-nt-
/. has this silly character limitation.
Except that
Karma: Chameleon (mostly due to the fact that you come and go).
What KDE bashing? Looks to me like you're the one spreading FUD.
I cant believe more distros dont do this. Ubuntu do it quite well. Its a one CD install which is the way it should be, not download 3 or 4 to get a piece here and a piece there. Ubuntu gives you a nicely polished install with enough to satisfy most people and almost everything works out of the box.
As Ubuntu is Debian based, you can say the same for Debian. I always just download the netinstall ISO to do a base install, and fetch the rest of the stuff - I need - online via APT.
zWhat would an EWOULDBLOCK block, if an EWOULDBLOCK could block would? -- me
I hope Novell is very smart in the way they market it.
Yup, they are -- if not marketing, at least sales.
We're probably going to switch to it at my workplace -- we're certainly going Novell's SLES9 on the servers we ship, as soon as I finish handling the technical headaches involved with getting off of RHEL3. (For the workstations, they're currently a very aging, heavily customized RH9 environment -- no longer supported, so we're moving them over too).
And why? Besides the price point, and the goodies SLES9 comes with that RHEL3 doesn't, there's one huge advantage Novell has:
Their "sales staff" has technical people too, and they're helpful and available. We were feeding money into Red Hat, and getting practically nothing back by way of support. Novell, on the other hand, is giving us all kinds of support (and access to goodies like the NLD beta) -- and we haven't even paid them yet!
I have no doubt that Red Hat would do the same thing for a big enough shop -- but right now we're a small, cash-impacted startup. The level of support they've given us already shows an impressive level of dedication. We're impressed, anyhow.
(The first time they visited us, they brought along one employee who was formerly Ximian, one who was formerly SuSE, and one who was a Noveller all along. I took that as Good Tidings as to their directional change, as well).
gee... i agree.
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I was very excited about Ubuntu, and I installed it on my new-distro-of-the-month laptop, a LAC Linux made machine that originally came with Debian. Anyway, Ubuntu is good looking and installs well. The big problem is that it kept hanging when I would log off X, and various other apps were crashing etc.
Not sure what the deal was, but the Gentoo install I had on it earler worked great, and I installed Mepis right after, and it worked wonderfully. I'm sold on Mepis and would recommnend it in lieu of Ubuntu, although they still use XFree86 - I assume they'll be switching next release.
>It looks like the default desktop environment
>is Gnome instead of KDE.
No, it isn't. During the installation you can choose what you want, and neither of them is selected by default.
A company called "Cool Solutions" has a site that has a lot more info on the NLD.
Everything from techinical overviews to tips on how to use various Linux programs.
I'm am highly hopeful that Novell will incorporate Netware's "SALVAGE" feature into their linux release. I have worked at several companies where this was the sole reason for not switching to linux. They literally lived and died by the ability to salvage any version of a file that had been erased or overwritten. Just my 2 coppers on that.
I tried Xandros Open Circulation on the weekend and this distro is the closest to what a home user would expect from a "windowed" OS.
The install was FLAWLESS. Truly. Network setup a breeze and it even found my Windows shares and an OLD SoundBlaster 16 ISA sound card. I haven't had any problems with it since installing it.
I've tried many of the other distros and they are just not ready for the home or small business market. Its like the Linux community can't bring itself to simplify the environment in case they be compared to oh no... Windows.
Xandros is my new preferred distro and I'll certainly give NLD a try.
I can just imagine the fit Ballmar must be throwing about now in Redmond. I can just see his fat sweating body jiggling down the hall screaming at the top of his lungs while spitting on all those poor, developers, developers, developers.
Redmond's response should be VERY interesting indeed!
It's really encouraging to see industry heavyweights starting to give Windows some competition. Not only will it enrich the user's set of choices, it should also result in a better Windows for those who do choose to use that system.
My bet is that the death gong for Windows will sound when Google releases a Linux desktop.
been using SuSE for about a year now and see many of the same issue I saw with RHat. There are menu items that don't work, configurations that won't take, and clutter.
God, you took the words right out of my mouth! I used to use RedHat but gave up because there would always be menu items that when clicked either didn't do anything or would act like they were trying to start but then just "time out." Also the configuration problem is something that I have experienced, I'll configure something but then on reboot it gets switched back to the way it was and similar problems. And, yeah, the clutter. Whenever I install SUSE I end up taking a whole night to just clean up the desktop and get rid of the clutter. Never mind the clutter that you find when you start digging into the system files.
I have tryed installing the minimum necessary items and then building the system up from that, but that ends up presenting its own problems also with missing librarys and dependency hell... I wish that there was a distro that Just Worked. I haven't found it yet but I am still searching. If they were not so overpriced I would consider getting a Mac but right now my budget can only afford $200.00 x86 boxen running downloaded Linux ISO's.
One reason SuSE config files revert bat to previous settings is by design. There are some preservation files that will reset perms on config files that get saved. Look for permissions.x files. That really rattled me until I found out what they were. Again, that's a learning curve and while I might agree with the concept, I think implementations like this can often turn people off rather than on.
> I've said for years that a distro company would do well to have a group sit down and actually test each feature and app that they include on a distro but evidently few do.
;-)
Nah, they shouldn't - "the community" already did all that!
= 9J =
XFS scores bether in most tests..
Reiserfs is fast on very small files. XFS is more general.
There is a lot of tests for this.
Gentoo is for amateurs. It's just that it's not for those who don't want to learn.
Compare to becoming a chef. Gentoo is like a very detailed recipe for Saucisse Minuit (the delicacy which Nero Wolfe is willing to leave his house to obtain) written for someone who has never cooked previously. Other distros (Red Hat, Suse, Linspire, etc.) are more like TV dinners. You don't become more of a chef by using them, but you won't be hungry (in need of an OS) afterwards.
Woah woah woah, step back. That wasn't flaming Novell. I happen to use SuSE 9.1 Pro, and I love it. I was stating what it looked like. I was reinforcing the fact that they're not going directly after Windows, but instead are going for a user who likes Windows and MacOS/X.
They're not really screenshots, they're part of the flash "intro" which is linked to from the article link.
GNOME or KDE, had a quick scan but could not find out. SUSE was always KDE, but now its Novell who bought Ximian I'm guessings its mostly GNOME (if not all). Has anyone gleaned the answer, It says it uses (Novell) Evolution however this does not mean its a GNOME desktop as it's pretty popular in the KDE camp too.
Tis the season to be jolly, Fa la la la la, la la, la, la Linux releases from places like Raleigh, (and Utah) Fa la la la la, la la, la, la Novell Linux, and Fedora, Fa la la, la la la, la, la, la SuSE Pro, plus Ma-a-andrake Fa la la la la, la la, la la.
Every time you post an article on Slashdot, I kill a server. Think of the servers!
Sure this is a little late in the thread, but there are some issues that should I should at least attempt to make public regarding this distro: After installing Novell Linux Desktop on three seperate machines here in my office, I can honestly say the end result is a clean and very office-worthy Gnome desktop. The KDE installation balks at updates and has no access to either Evolution or RedCarpet to get the RPMs that fail during the installation. Speaking of which, each installation attempt (even after redownloading the ISO's) failed on installing Perl, kdeartwork, and OpenSSH leaving me to skip those RPMs until after the install has completed and get them using RedCarpet. The root password set and the user manager during installation both failed, but were simple to skip until I could get into YAST inside the GUI after the install had completed. My first impressions are that as this is a complete product with some coddling, the installation is far from thoroughly tested, and I would hesitate to put any IT department through installing this on a daily basis. It's a good start. I love what they've done with Ximian without resorting to making SuSE a Gnome-centric distribution and I think once this is complete, it can compete head-on with RedHat on the linux desktop/server market, however, I don't see any Microsoft zealots leaning this way any time in the near future. Then again, Novell has implicitly stated that they aren't after Microsoft Users, all the while every basic office function is included preinstalled with this distribution along with Exchange interoperability.
If you're half as beautiful naked, you'd be 4 times as beautiful with twice as many clothes on.
You don't need one unless you need to run nwadmin or install certain netware server products.