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Spam and Spyware Too Much for Some Users
stewart_maximus writes "Spam and spyware is annoying to everyone, but some users are giving up on the Internet (mirror). Any Slashdot readers know someone who pulled the plug in frustration? Any advice for frustrated users, especially non-technical users?"
Disclaimer: I don't use Macs.
You don't have an excuse now. Get the minimac. It will suffice for many people (sure, _some_ people just have to have those silly apps that only work in windows, for them, the future is not so bright).
The choice is obvious.
Easy to install, easy to use and they handle almost all of the problems that end users will run into.
1. Buy a mac or other non-windows machine
2. Use a browser with pop-up and ad blocking capablility.
3.
4. Profit from the wealth of information on the web.
I am not giving up as a user, but yesterday I have announced the closing of my hosting services (that I run as a side business) because I am tired of being trying to be hacked, and people exploiting scripts on the server, and running worms, and trying to DoS my server, and trying to flood other servers... I have way better things to do with my life than trying to protect my little server from punks out there...
What's the answer? Well, you could have pushed Linux until you said non-technical. Otherwise this thread could pretty much just be an ad for the Apple Mac Mini or even the iMac G5.
No, I won't add links to those. They're everywhere this week. And yes, I want one. Either one.
My own pointless vanity vintage computing page
For the first time in ages, I can say this with a perfectly straight face and without reservation:
Get a Mac.
They're affordable, they're stable, they're powerful, they're easy-to-use, they're resilient against infection, they come with excellent software, there are some great games available, and yes, Virginia, they'll even work with your multi-button mouse.
For the basic user, what else is there?
Obliteracy: Words with explosions
I guess you think AutoCAD and ArcGIS are "silly apps." I know Mac people like to use their computer to make a fashion statement, but some people use computers to do work.
i know everyone is going to say this but two things immediately leap out at me.
1) don't use windows, for chrissakes. how many people out there in the world don't know that there are alternatives? is it really that many? is apple's media saturation here in the bay area completely nonexistent anywhere else?
2) the solution isn't legislation -- it's people making crappy products. if toyota made a car that constantly ran into trees, the solution wouldn't be banning trees, it would be making toyota make some good friggin' cars.
lord stuff like this makes me pissy.
go get it
While I realize that my knowledge may be at least slightly higher to some of these people when it comes to computers... but really, what are they doing?
I've had zero spyware items on my machine ever (that I didn't intentionally install for testing). Also had zero viruses. That being said, what are these people trying to remove these things? And if they're not removing them, who are they going to for support? Any competent PC tech should have a thorough knowledge of spyware and how to remove it (safely and effectively). Your typical outsourced phone support probably can't do this.
Also about the guy who was running his business with his PCs and searching for vendors and such online - says he lost a years worth of receipts from spyware... how? And why weren't there backups? If he's storing financial data of any type on just one PC with no backups (cd, floppy, tape drive? something!), he probably shouldn't be running a business with a computer in the first place.
Like many others here, a lot of people ask me what I think they should buy when it's tine to get a (new) computer. I now have an easy anwer for all of them: an Apple Mac Mini. The $499 model plus $75 to bring it to 512 MB RAM is *perfect* for everyone I know. Nearly no one I know *needs* Windows for anything. If they do, they can get a second, older computer and not connect it to the Internet.
I am so, so happy Apple has finally made a *really* affordable good Mac. (Where "affordable" means "less than $800" and "good" means "doesn't have a bloody great CRT built-in." Yes, the iBooks are fabulous, but the small screen and keyboard aren't so great for some folks. And $1000 is a lot more than $600 for a lot of people.) Thank you thank you thank you!
Dear Slashdot: next time you want to mess with the site, add a rich-text editor for comments.
But 2004 "was a real turning point in a bad direction," said technology analyst Ted Schadler of Forrester Research. "People are getting really angry. They're angry at Dell and Microsoft and their cable providers, and that's appropriate. They should be."
Be upset at MSFT for the spyware, trojans, and worms. Be upset at the little bastards that make this shit. Be upset at yourself for not properly protecting yourself. But certainly do no blame Dell and do not blame your Cable provider as they aren't at fault.
We are in a time period of blaming everyone else for our problems. Personally, I spent the time protecting myself and my network from issues. Yeah, they could probably still come through but I have at least closed most of the holes that I know of. If you are on the Internet without a hardware router/firewall and using software without a software firewall and surfing the web without virus protection and Spyware detection I really don't feel sorry for you.
For the person that they quoted at the beginning of the article saying that he was playing Pong and had the first desktop on his block... I'm sure he knew what he had to do to protect himself. He was just too lazy to do so.
Gerald Stark, 52, trained on computers in school and in the Navy before starting a small cleaning business in Lisbon Falls, Maine.....A virus killed one machine. Then spyware infested the next one, wiping out a year's worth of receipt records.
No, Gerald lost his receipt records. Why weren't there adequate backups? Why didn't he keep the originals for 7 years? Why didn't he have multiple off-site backups in a format like TXT or CSV which is not vulnerable?
People need to protect themselves and stop asking the government to do it for them. LEARN to use a computer, LEARN how to protect yourself, and LEARN not to be stupid.
Not everyone can know everything but at least know the basics and you will be a lot better off.
Q the dogmatic mac and *nix zealots who will tell us "MY system never has problems so nah nah nah nah nah"
Before you do people, get this, people wo DON'T work in computers - they just don't care - did you know that? they don't care if it's linux, max, pc, or whatever, they just want to start using this new intahwebeh thing.
When they go to a shop to buy one what do they get? Windows, cos that's what 95% of other people do. Windows is big, it's always going to be big, deal with this fact.
My Portfolio
I'm not a computer technician or anything, but i have not come across a virus i could not get rid of. However.. some spyware programs are rooted into IE somehow and i just don't bother.
But alas! The soloution: Mozilla Firefox!
This is a very elitist view and in no way expressed in an effective manner. However, the point is kind of a valid one.
The "Internet", whatever that actually means, was definitely different 10, even 5, years ago. Not only were there less people online, those who were needed at least some technical savvy to be successful. Anyone who remembers trying to get a dialup modem working in Windows 3.11 for Workgroups should be able to agree. The people you met tended to understand the technology behind the Internet, the reasons why it exists and, as such, had a direction and a reason to be online.
However, as more people have got online and surfing has turned from a technical tool into a hobby and then participatory and ultimately passive form of entertainment things have definitely changed. Without the popularization of the Internet we wouldn't have websites like Slashdot, we wouldn't have widely accessible Email, we wouldn't have Instant Messaging clients (IRC excepted, maybe) and us geeks would have had a much harder time getting hold of Linux distros.
Yes we have to put up with Spam, yes we have to put up with annoying AOLers, yes we have to fight off evil spyware, yes we have to put up with annoying personal webpages with flashing text and badly sized pictures of peoples dogs. However, it's a price though I think we are willing to pay for all the fun the Internet can bring. Also, don't tell me I'm the only one who gets at least a little enjoyment from successfully setting up a new firewall or configuring a new piece of anti-spam software?
I gave up on the Internet for a while, then I came back with multiple computers. One for the Internet, and the others for applications. I only brows with opera and Mozilla and I have everything turned off. I use ad-aware programs and I delete webcheck.dll, loadwc.exe, and set reg keys : "RegDone"="1" "EnableDCOM"="N" and delete c:\windows\wscript.exe
I disable something with ad-aware's LSP Explorer plugin, forget what...
It's still not enough. I shouldn't have to do all this crap.
One thing I have given up on is e-mail. I change my e-mail every few months and I almost never use it, and I never give it to anyone. I also never use IM or IRC.
Get a Mac!
I found the meaning of life the other day, but I had write-only access.
1. My parents both use Windows PCs at work. they work for large companies that are not going to transition from Windows to Linux or Macs.
/.ers suggest that I wish a perfectly straight face suggest they use a Mac or Linux? Not gonna float people.
No - they use Office at work. Admit it!!
That is why there is Office X for the Mac.
2. My parents get confused if I alter a toolbar on their home PC when I am working on it. They think it is broken if it does not look exectly like the one they use at work.
You give them too little credit. Perhaps they will like how the Mac works better overall?
3. They do not want to learn how to use a PC. They still can't program the video player, they have no DVD player, they think CDs are some sort of voodoo.
Then probably, they should have a Mac and not a PC.
How would
Pretty easy, really. How are they going to fare in the long term when Longhorn comes out if they don't even like changig a menu?
Break them of the habit now, a short-term pain will go a long way in the future.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
Not to be a Microsoft apologist(and I eff'ing HATE Microsoft) they do appear to be on the road to fixing some of these issues. Now don't get me wrong, I hate Windows and Micrsoft and their bully monopoly tatics as much as the next guy, but you can't continue to fault them if they're actually working to fix their problems.
SP2 was a big step, as was their new anti-spyware and malicious program removal tools.
Whether or not these tools prove to be useful in combating spyware et al is to be seen, but you can't fault them, provided this is more than a BS token gesture to get people off their backs.
"So I says to Mable, "Hey, those are MY ferrets!"
when I got paid for knowing about computers for the first time I thought, "Everyone should own a computer!" I think that a lot less now. But not becuase I am 1337 and "they" are LUSERS with PEBCAK problems. Not at all.
The home computer has failed to become an appliance like a microwave, or a refrigerator. Is it really any easier than it was back in the Apple ][e, Commodre 64 days? Has WinXP or Suse 9.0 or OS X really made computing as transparent as heating a chicken? Has networking gotten much simpler?
For the average mom and pop at home who want to send some email, do some online banking, shopping, knowledge gathering and write a letter, maybe balance a checkbook really need dual G5s a P4 3.0?
The computer world looked ready to go back to main frame client/server models with things like Java et al. It should. Give mom and pop a 20+" monitor and keyboard and mouse and let them access everything though their browser. Here's you Word Processor, here's you email, here's your pr0n.
And for those of us bold enough to muck about in kernals, driver and whatnot well we still could. Andf we wouldn't have to do it everytime we visit our parents, neighbors, friend's office.
People are diving off the internet because configuring their computers is still hard. It's still "dangerous" and frankly all the pr0n in the world can't drive this "internet" thing much further. And to this point pr0n and games have driven the internet and home computing into the super computer realm to this point.
The users aren't the issue. The fact that some 40 years later not all that much has changed regarding setting up a network is an issue. The fact that there is a large corporation out there making consistently insecure software despite their responsibility as the market (well really as THE market) leader is an issue.
This
Give up IE and OUtlook.
I've shoved firefox/t-bird down many throats. Most have recovered and are back online.
-=fshalor
Seriously, Giving some family member who has finally grasped the concept of Windows a drastically differnet (and expensive) computer and operating system doesn't seem like a good idea to me. I have had great success installing Linux (Fedora usually) on familiy members pcs. I just adjust a few menu's and place some icons on the desktop and I'm done. They don't have to buy ANYTHING, they already have a computer. Even a cheap Mac ($800-$1000?) doesn't seem all that cheap to me.
People seem much brighter once you light them on fire.
I agree. To everything you said.
I had the pleasure recently to help a couple friends of my wife with their "slow as molasses" computer. They paid for sushi, so I said ok.
The box was Win ME Dell box from 2000, dialup.
Running ad-aware netted me 1400 nasties. The viruses (oh yes they were there) would not go away. They had not upgraded Norton Antivirus since their 1 year membership ended, in 2001.
So I took the box with me, to my business partners' and while I was working on code, he:
*Installed Nic card
*reformatted
*put Win2k pro
*drivers
*windows upgrade
*openoffice 1.4
*firefox
*Zone Alarm
*Adobe Acrobat Reader
*ad-aware
*spy-bot
The machine ran great, snappy, everything was hunky dorey.
And he gave them an unopened boxed Norton System Works 2004.
Then, I took the box back to my house, had the husband of the couple come over, and took 1 hour writing down, on paper, the dos and don'ts.
*Use Firefox for browsing the web
*Don't use Internet Explorer except for windows update
*Run windows update once a month
*Run Antivirus update once a month (they're on dialup remember?)
*Do not download email to your computer, use Yahoo mail.
*NEVER install any installation CDs from internet service providers.
He took the computer home, and we haven't heard a word from them.
My wife is pissed now because the wife didn't even say thank you. I'm okay because they just don't know.
But I already know what I will find when I go to their house next time:
They installed the MSN cd.
They are using IE.
They did not run any windows updates.
They did not even install the antivirus software.
They are using microsoft outlook express
They have viruses and spyware on their computer.
I told my wife: Computer security work for people she volunteers me for is $375USD per hour.
I have a great analogy, which I told here on slashdot before:
If all car mechanics replaced car engines for free when they break, why would anybody ever have an oil change done?
The only reason people change their oil is because a cracked engine block will cost them between $2,000 and $15,000.
So when someone comes and begs for you to "fix their PC", tell them it's a $1,000 flat. They'll come back and say: "But I can buy another pc for less than that!" And you reply: "Excellent! You do that. Now let me go back to my movie."
And if they say you are mean, ask them if their mechanic will fix their car engine for free.
"Piter, too, is dead."
"Remember, for the majority of people who buy from Dell, Dell configures the operating system for them and they don't change it." The important part of this is, "... and they don't change it." How is it Dell et al's fault if the end user doesn't keep their product updated? How is it Dell's fault if the user doesn't take the time to learn the basics about using computers and the internet? Dell is somehow at fault for providing a computer with some sort of default setup? Are you suggesting that Dell have to provide updates and software patches? That sounds like Microsofts job to provide, and the end users job to get. There's no excuse for not learning rudimentary security measues when dealing with computers on the internet.
"So I says to Mable, "Hey, those are MY ferrets!"
It would not require months to make people "internet literate", just one day, two or three changes, and 80% of this stuff goes away.
My windows workstation has been running for 5 years, every day, 10 hours/day, without anti-virus software of any kind.
A month ago, I actually installed Norton on it, and run a full system scan. No viruses. I then installed and ran Ad-Aware. It found a few dicey cookies in the tmp folder, and the Eudora cache was flagged, but other than that .... nothing.
And did not take any kind of tech genius to achieve this. I simply never, ever ran outlook. never opened an executable or .zip file from Email, sat behind a NAT router, and disallowed anything from Tiny Personal Firewall that I did not recognize. Eudora does an EXCELLENT job of filtering spam after 1 month AI learning.
Really, it doesn't require a Doctorate in Computer Science. Those that are "abondoning" the internet just don't care enough to take a few small steps to reduce most of the problems.
Ergo, I don't think this is a problem. The absence of those running Oulook and running the 0-200 ports wide open is probably a good thing for the internet - so it's mutualy beneficial.
Not being elitist at all. It just depends on how much effort you wish to put into making the experience more enjoyable. If that effort is "zero", then how bad do you expect others to feel about it?
Everything worth anything requires *some* effort to be worthwhile, and some people just want it all pre-packaged, which nobody has been able to do with any real success.
I'm sorry, but these people sound like complete idiots who need a computing appliance, not a completed computer. This reminds me of that rash of "sudden acceleration" stories in the late 80s or early 90s that had drivers complaining their cars where just randomly and without their input ramming into things. It turned out after investigation that these people were wildly incompetent drivers, and couldn't control what their feet were doing. If you aren't willing to take responsibility for using a tool, you're obviously not well adapted to the enivornment and should be removed from the gene pool to prevent the spread of stupid user syndrome.
Slashdot: Playing Favorites Since 1997
I read that as saying that every internet user has the responsibility to learn about how the internet works, what dangers are lurking, and what needs to be done to avoid those dangers.
WRONG!
That responsibility exists, but shouldn't necessarily be the user's responsibility. Just to use any piece of software, you don't have to know how it works. Not all users are also developers, you know.
By using network-enabled software like browsers, a user essentially trusts browser makers to manage the interface between the web and the user. And browser makers trust the operating system below it, to manage the interface between API's and the networking hardware. That trust includes an assumption of safety/reliability/integrity. The current state of software security tells me, that trust is often misplaced.
It's an endless battle of opinions, but IMO the #1 reason for having firewalls etc. is not functionality, but the fact that operating systems, networking software, browsers and so on, are BROKEN (unreliable, buggy, insecure). If they wouldn't be, there would be few reasons to put a firewall between a househould PC and the internet. Similar goes for virus scanners, anti-spyware, etc.
It may be a full time job to keep ordinary PC's secured & 100% functional, but don't assume that should be the user's job. I guess new developments like remotely managed, limited functionality PC's (see SimPC for example) could provide some relief here for many users.
Is the fact that spyware is blamed for data loss in this article. Spyware and Adware (however annoying) does NOT cause data loss! Any tech who's worth half their weight in beans knows this.
They had their computers fixed by people who obviously didn't know what the hell they were doing, charged them way too much (300 dollars for a wipe and reload? give me a break), and just basically screwed them.
You know who deserves a large chunk of the blame for SPAM in my honest opinion?
The 1% of the people who respond to it. For without them, there would be no spam at all.
Open letter to Intuit - I will not recommend 2005 to clients until it can run under limited user rights.
Create an easy way to overwrite critical Registry sections that are responsible for explorer tie ins. As a matter of fact, I think I'll write a tool like that.
Stop making people administrators by default, and the problem becomes localized and easily stopped.
No one remains an administrator or at least a defaultly configured Administrator after I see their PC.
Enjoy.
Leonid S. Knyshov
Find me on Quora
You mean, when they are working to create a solution that they can sell you to work around the problems they created for you.
Did you read the article?
The guy from main had 2 firewalls, spyware and antivirus software. Still 1 machine had a virus that killed it that the vendor was behind on, and the second had spyware that brought it down to its knees. I think as a (l)user he did a fairly good job and a huge effort compared to 90% of the internet users.
He lost all his reciepts for his business purchases and vows never to buy anything online again. Ouch but can you blame him?
The fact is its out of control and a firewall wont protect your system if you recieve an email that is written in html and has some javascript exploit to install some worm. You do not even have to read any attachments. Just read it.
But another point is why should users spend so many resources learning, buying firewalls, using windowsUpdate, updating anti virus software, and keep updating lavasoft? Yes users need to take precautions of course but what is happening is just silly. I spend at least 2 hours a week updating my computer at home now.
I for one is nervous about doing ecommerce on the internet even on firefox. How do I know my machine is not infecting and not telling me? I even have two installations of Windows and one is used to watch porn and listen to music. I do not trust my files and think they could be infected.
I find spyware all the time on my systems and most of the time the anti spyware and virus software is a few weeks behind.
Yes like changing oil in your car a user should be minimally educated but we need drastic action. Either start procecuting these people are work on adding extensions to IPV6 to have better tracking and better security so admins and ISP's can block most of this.
I fear though DRM will be trounced soon by the likes of MS and the net and ecommerce communities will rejoice since it will finally stop unathorized software to be installed by these pesky hackers.
If we in the hacker community do not take care of it they will and take away your rights in return.
http://saveie6.com/
Sure, some may argue that people would then not have access to needed apps, but surely giving up the net connection is more of a hinderance than using linux. Are these people just not educated about alternatives to microsoft? Somebody like Mandrakesoft or Lindows should find a way to reach these people, it seems like a growing opertunity for profit.
True genius is grasping a situation like a peice of fruit, and peircing it just right so that it drains dry.
The only problem with the Mac Mini for a home user is that wacky thing we call human nature. For 90% of the home market, computing is a life experience that has trained them to be terrified of change. The very fact that the default Dock setup doesn't have a friendly blue 'E' for Internet Explorer could cause paralysis for those not willing to experiment to see what the computer can do and thus, learn that the compass icon points to a web browser (Safari...duh!) that is superior on many levels than IE.
This can be overcome by geeks like us who hold the hand of new Mac users who we convince to switch - my in-laws WILL be getting a Mac Mini for their next computer or I'll refuse to help them continue cleaning spyware off the system - but how many "normal" people want to learn a seperate OS from the one that they use at work - no matter how much better it may be?
Don't get me wrong - I am sold on the Mac OS X experience and have used a dual-G4/G5 alongside my Windows box for - wow! - five years now. However, I understand that Apple has a huge challenge in front of them. I'm just extremely glad that they've decided to release the Mac Mini so that they can see if the experiment is going to work.
Think more about the point your trying to make. You've used computers your whole life, your current profession is probably heavily computer centric. You've stated that noone, without similar credentials, should use computers. Now, imagine you had some influence and were able to make that law. Also imagine that like minded individuals of other industries were able to pass similar laws. You wouldn't be able to drive any longer. As an non professional, you could cause injury to others. You couldn't listen to music. As a non professional you have no true understanding of what's good and what's not. Don't give me that old "but I just like it." That's as ridiculious as expecting a computer "to just work."
In fact, pretty much everything you do, you'd no longer be able to do. And you wouldn't have been a King with your 2400-baud BBS's, because you, with your inexperience, would never have been granted the opportunity to try.
No offense, but I feel we aren't getting the whole story here. If he is running two firewalls (which I assume is 1 hardware and 1 software), is running anti-virus and ad-removal stuff, and STILL has crippling stuff on his machine - then this guy has encountered nastier spyware than I have ever seen.
[BIG RANT]
*sigh* ok, let me clue you nerds in. I have to get this out because it's an endless debate between some of the most myopic people on the Internet claiming to be the most informed.
I know we're probably a good 300 posts into this thread already and this posting of mine will be lost, but I feel the need to intervene anyway;
Some thoughts, from what I see here:
1) Normal joe/jill average users don't want to, and shouldn't have to, make checking e-mail and surfing the web a second job. So keeping up with every latest turn in the spyware/adware/spam drama is not an option. Your "it's that simple" solution isn't that simple to people who aren't immersed in computer culture 24 hours a day. Drop the faux-Darwinism routine and join us in what I like to call "real life". We're over here, in the sun.
2) Normal joe/jill average users WILL NOT run more than one computer for seperate tasks. This is insanity to begin with. Don't take your desk as an example of a normal computer user. You may have a room dedicated to your four boxes with various chips and OSes, but no normal human wants to do that. They want A box, with A monitor, and A device to interact with that box. They want a TV with a keyboard, but one that won't force them to download porn or send and recieve spam. The solution isn't a NeXT box for checking e-mail and a Sparc for web surfing, with a Windows NT 4 box off network for accounting, or some other absurd scenario.
3) Normal joe/jill users will want to run some fairly mainstream programs. If you're running AutoCAD, or MSSQL, or Cybertrader, you're a professional so the rules above no longer apply. Normal joe/jill average users want e-mail, fun web pages, The Sims maybe, Quicken. They want to buy a CD or a book online maybe, if they're feeling fancy. No crazy NASA shit. Don't hold them to your twisted standards of what normal people do with computers.
Where am I going with this? The only logical recourse at the moment is to get an Apple Macintosh for these users who are not computer dependant or who are not computer experts.
I know you all hate to hear it (other than the Mac fanboys who love to hear it, but let's just tolerate them for a moment). It's the only mainstream path for people who are trying to make joe/jill average user's computer experience workable. I've done it. I've set people up on Apples. I don't get calls about computers! They talk to me about them, but only to say how much they want to hug the damn things.
Regarding the proposition of a Linux desktop for these people. If you want to inflict frustration or dependancy on the normal joe/jill average user you're trying to help, if controlling them through reliance on your godlike technical abilities is your bag, by all means set them up with a Linux desktop. You can claim to have grandma set up on linux, and all your friends will pat you on the back for being such a wise advocate. Your grandma will use her computer all of the one time she can remember he login and password. Then when her $2000 investment in technology is worthless to her, and she calls for help to get some sort of value out of it, you can sigh call her dumb under your breath for not knowing how to operate an expert level OS. Hope you feel big...
You people frustrate me beyond words sometimes.
Luck favors the prepared, darling.
That just does NOT work a lot of the time, but through no fault of our own. I am the family's IT coordinator, in addition to being paid to do that at a small shop of about 25 PCs. I can't tell you how many times I've personally gotten stopped by a website that insists on only playing nice with IE, even if I spoof Firefox to act like IE. That includes my own company's IT website (Remedy) and the banking websites of my parents and others. Telling them to switch banks because they don't play nice with Firefox or Mozilla gets me lots of deer in headlights stares.
Until we can REALLY use other (better) browsers for everything, we'll still be heading in the wrong damn direction.
The higher, the fewer.
Anyways this is why Apple decided to build the Mac Mini, its the almost perfect solution to a lot of entry user's dilemmas. The average PC owner is almost completely in the dark when it comes to most technologies. The average Windows User has almost no idea of what he/she is supposed to do to maintain a Windows OS. They are just clueless.
Linux is a great alternative but a lot of these people (the target audience for the Mac Mini) is just out of their league. Meantion sudo to them and they'll just stare at you blankly. A lot of people have PCs just to do the basic things, Windows does suffice some of the time. But usually there are too many problems. Most people just want to be able to chat, email, surf, print, write papers, organize photos, and so forth. Not all that easy on a Linux box, and more trouble than its worth for Windows.
Don't get me wrong I have a Linux box and a Windows box. I only use the Windows box for gaming, thats all that it really excels at. I use Linux for a lot of my programming, webserving, hosting, and other tech savy needs. My Mac I use for everything else. Its that everything else that Apple is banking on. They know that people just want to be able to do something easily, safely, and quickly.
Then a standard desktop would have been used probably with no backup at all. Users do not know about tape backups.
That's not completely true. Today's "standard" desktop usually comes with at least a cd burner, if not a CD/DVD burner. The majority of burning software that is include has some type of backup feature. Not to mention most users burn disks all the time (i.e. photo's, duping CD's, MP3's, etc.) Unfortunately, they never seem to backup all there important data, like business receipts.
Last I checked this wasn't actually an "Ask Slashdot" article, it was just a post about other people giving up on the internet. The end questions were merely a poll of ideas.
Now if this were "hey slashdot, I have spyware, how to you guys remove it? lol kthxbye!!!11!!" Then I would see your valid troll point. Otherwise, you just did not RTFA.
They do have other options.
Like what sell PC's preloaded with a Linux distro? Please! I'll probably get mod'ed as a troll, but I am so tired of this argument. Dell probably would LOVE to sell Linux preloaded on all of there desktops. Unfortunately the marketplace will not support that business model. The average user does not wnat to learn how to use Linux. The average user is compfortable using WinBlow$.
If Dell was to drop the WinBlow$ market and go strictly open source, they would lose over 90% of there potential customers. If that were to happen, they probably would not be in business for very long. Don't blame Dell for the problems, blame the users for not being motivated enough too learn a new OS and set of applications.
I find spyware all the time on my systems and most of the time the anti spyware and virus software is a few weeks behind.
How? I use firefox for web, outlook for email, and run a regular hardware firewall. No spyware, ever (apart from Kazaa ages ago). You need to figure out what the infection vector is, because you don't need to be getting all this crap.
---- Den ene knappen er powerknapp, den andre er Bender voice knapp "Bite My Shiny Metal Ass"
I quit counting the times one of my many relations mentions that it's time to buy a new computer because the old one is slow. Invariably it turns out to be a spyware issue. Instead of fixing, I should consider offering to buy the "obsolete" hardware.
The real solution is to beat it through the heads of small (and not-so-small) businessmen everywhere that you get get rich by paying a spammer. When that happens, the problem will disappear.
Dewey, what part of this looks like authorities should be involved?
I had a similar scenario - a few relatives asked me to come over and fix their computers - I re-installed windows (it's what they know) and made firefox the default browser, I haven't had to go back to un-spyware any of them yet ....
interesting point in that article - 80% of computers are infected with spyware, and 80% of computers are windows - coincidence? I think not - headless mac, here I come!
calling all destroyers
I am surprised at how many windows users browse the web (among other things) while logged in with administrator priviliges. If you want to use IE for browsing, better run it with limited priviliges. I can understand why some people may choose IE over netscape/mozilla -- I use a 400 Mhz machine to surf the net and IE loads and runs way faster than firefox. I even had firefox crash on me many times (enormous swapping, 99% CPU use sometimes for unknown reasons). But I don't end up with as much spyware as other users because I never use the administrator account for doing daily stuff. Also, using firefox over IE will not make things better for you if you already have adware/spyware that downloads and installs other programs from the net. The first advise I always give to spyware-striken users is "Get off the Administrator" (ok, pun intented)...
bah - most people are trainable, but make sure they get a quote on how much it will cost them at a dealer, first.
I cleaned up a computer like this once, then trained the user in firewalls, anti-virus, and anti-spam/spyware. I also told him where he got the spyware and viruses in the first place - audiogalaxy, porn sites, and free movie stream sites. I told him first off, if a site wants to automatically install software on your system without saying "download x software to view this site properly, it is probably software with a nefarious purpose. Yes, there are exceptions - macromedia flash is OK, as is Acrobat, but most of the time you see these sites, they'll at least ask you if you want to download the software first.
I just checked up on his computer a little over a year later, and everything is great - up to date virus checker, spam/spyware checker, and firewall. He still uses IE and outlook, but his spam/spyware software filters 99% of the junk out. I got him to not use preview pane in outlook, which stops auto-launching outlook viruses provided the message is deleted without ever being viewed (hey, every little bit helps). It's not perfection, but a huge step forward.
"... No one is immune. Microsoft Corp. Chairman Bill Gates discovered spyware on his personal machine not long ago. ..."
No one immune?
Pardon me, but WRONG! I'm on a Mac. I am damn well immune, thank you. I have no problems on my Safari og Firefox or Camino. I AM immune from spyware and malware.