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WinOS+QEMU+Knoppix 3.8 = WinKnoppix!
chronicon writes "As reported earlier Knoppix 3.8 was presented and CD's distributed at CeBIT recently. For those of us who were not able to attend, some kind folks have posted a torrent for all to enjoy.
Now, here's where it really gets interesting. Using QEMU (processor emulator) chris-uk has posted a modified version of Knoppix 3.8 that will run under Windows if auto-played, or if you wish, you can boot the CD for normal Knoppix. You can find the torrent here."
Can it run WINE?
Knoppix continues to be all that and a bag of chips :)
You're right, I wouldn't steal a car. But if it were possible, I sure as hell would download one!
You can save Knoppix settings to a drive. Presumably the people have done this (couldn't RTFA, site is slashdotted)
What is the point? What is the point of art? What is the point of music? What is the point of climbing everest? What is the point of spinners? I digress. . . The point is well - hey it is cool! ( I think) :)
Is import all the settings across from windows and you can tell you granny it's the latest version of the internet and your away.
thank God the internet isn't a human right.
Gesundheit.
i never tried out qemu, but i suspect it to be substantially slower than a native knoppix boot.
on top of qemu comes the fact, that the whole system runs from a cd, which by itself has bad seek times.
i hope that people won't get false implessions, because they will get that 'linux runs slower than windows' feeling.
Only morons moderate based on a sig.
Because you can then let people try before they buy without even needing to reboot.
It just removes one more hurdle. People aren't going to wipe out their system just because the local geek said "its ready for the desktop".
People need some proof that it really is better.
liqbase
I've recently been looking into running Linux on my primary desktop to record music with. I could never get the Knoppix live CD to run correctly on my Gateway X700 system. I'll have to try this version and see if I can get anything to work.
Linux has been a frustration of mine for the past 4 years. I know a smattering of Unix commands and even armed with that I still can't ever seem to get a program downloaded and working like I can with windows. I'm looking forward to trying it again before I make the move to DeMudi.
Is there heaven? Is there Hell? Is that a Tuna Melt I smell?-Primus
free, is it?
"Who says nothing is impossible? Some people do it every day!" - Alfred E. Neuman
You're right about Knoppix not needing an installation process, but in the case of naive Windows users, even asking them to reboot can be a scary concept for them.
The other case where I can see this being useful is when you're trying to demonstrate Knoppix to someone and they already have work running on their Windows desktop - spreadsheets, telnet sessions, and things of that nature. If they can see Linux running within a window, they'll be much more likely to play around with it since they know that they can just click a close box and return to their normal routine whenever they want.
It may not work for everyone, but for those people who this can influence, I see nothing wrong with extra shiny things to attract the naive.
How do you explain to your friend/relative whos computer is configured to NOT boot from cd to change their BIOS settings?
I agree though, Live eval cds are invaluable, and are preferable to running a slower emulated environment, but this cd allows both options, so why not say its a good thing?
liqbase
From the reports I've seen, qemu is VERY slow. Is there an advantage to qemu over coLinux? I've been using coLinux to give me Linux under Windows for about a year now, and there is a lot to be said for native execution speed. You also get networking, and recently easy access of the native Windows filesystems without employing samba-type file sharing.
Of course, it's difficult to deny the power of running a gameboy emulator on a GBA emulator on a Linux emulator on a Windows emulator on your Mac...
Holy crap!!! the Poster actually linked a .torrent, maybe all the complaining actually got somewhere.
Now only if others would follow.
Im glad
I like booting Knoppix in VMWare! Same concept.
Oh the horror of rebooting a windows machine!!! I'd say that it's akin to the terror of sleep, but sleep only comes once a day
90% of everything is crap. Also, crap is relative.
Here's the Coral Cache and the Mirrordot Mirror.
CoLinux is also a very handy package for running linux on windows. It installs linux on a single file on your HD, then runs linux on it, and you can access it throught VNC. So you can have windows and linux sharing the same machine and HD, running at the same time, on different windows. Pretty handy.
http://www.colinux.org
You can use it to run linux from some other partition too. It comes with a version of debian built it, but there are other packages for other distros.
You can also try topologilinux.
http://wwwtopologilinux.com
It's a bundled installation of coLinux and slackware with all bells and whistles.
I'm hoping they will release it as an installable distro at some point. The demo scripts worked great for patching different applications through jackd w/ ALSA. Very cool.
but the wireless communications that carry the code for this software will propigate into space forever.. your puny mountain will only last until our Sun runs out of hydrogen and helium.
** "It's not my job to stand between the people talking to me, and the ones listening to me." -- Pego the Jerk
'Seriously linux users, you're operating system wont make up for the fact that girls are repulsed by your bodies.'
That's ok, I'm gay.
thank God the internet isn't a human right.
but in the case of naive Windows users, even asking them to reboot can be a scary concept for them.
Hmm, I think you're exaggerating a bit... Windows users should (and I'm not even joking) be quite used to booting and rebooting their systems. Even my mom would understand the implications of restarting the computer.
Beware: In C++, your friends can see your privates!
Cluster Knoppix has been around for a while, i think i have some releases dating 2001-2002, and i noticed that the torrent tracker the poster linked to hosts the .torrent for the current release of Cnoppix. 12-04 IIRC. /.ers able to recall some larger torrents?
A side note: being that the poster was smart enough to link to a torrent tracker in the story, I'm interested to see just how big this torrent will get, as i speak, the tracker lists over 800 hosts, 200+ seeds and over 600 leechers. The largest torrent i've ever seen was on bt.etree.org with something like 400 seeds and 700 or so leechers. That was last year. Any other
without the need to reboot. Run them side by side and compare the features.
It is, after all, emulation, so don't expect to break speed records with it. Also that IP connection limitation in XP won't be broken by running KNOPPIX in an emulator.
Now KNOPPIX can join the ranks of MacOS 8.1 (BasiliskII), AmigaOS 3.1 (Amiga Forever), as yet another OS emulated under Windows.
The advantage I see for this is that web developers will finally be able to check how their web pages look under different browsers and operating systems without having to reboot Windows each time they want to look how it looks under Linux.
The next step is to make KNOPPIX run AntiVirus, AntiSpyware, AntiAdware, and AntiTrojan removal programs and make any FAT32, FAT16, or NTFS partition as read/write so the Malware can be removed. Yet what is the point when you can run the KNOPPIX HD Install script and get rid of Windows and all of its flaws that allow Malware to be installed in the first place.
P.S. I am moving to KANOTIX now, it seems to be a bit better than KNOPPIX.
Remember, Slashdot does not have a -1 disagree moderation, and no, troll, flamebait, and overrated are not substitutes.
QEMU is an EMULATOR. They want to demo linux to windows users running under a full blown emulator? I can see it now. "This lunix thing looks nice, but it's just so SLOW!".
They're going to end up convincing dumb windows users that Linux is slow as hell!
Before you say anything, keep in mind that they are running QEMU on windows, and the QEMU virtualizer is closed-source and linux only. So they can ONLY do full emulation.
knoppix.net is really slow and the forum is /.'ed, people must be storming that site with this news out.
/.'ed but not posted on slashdot? I mean, no direct link, everyone just goes there themselves.
Is this this the first time a site has been
I christen it, the slashdot halo effect.
The preceding message was based on actual events. Only the names, locations and events have been changed.
Following the QEMU list, this was done some time back by a Japanese developer Kuniyasu Suzaki I believe.
.EXE from CD.
Discussions ensued about how to make it faster... some patches are available to directly mount the compressed Knoppix volume so that portion doesn't need to be emulated. Also, the SaveVM feature was improved, so rather than boot knoppix, just keep a compressed VM ram image on the Knoppix CD. That makes it boot instantaneously.
QEMU is the fastest thing going as far as Free emulators, given more improvements on the virtualization side, I think this will be *the* way to run Knoppix for Windows users that just want to try it out. The speed will come in time.
Some of us pushed for features like User Mode Networking in QEMU just for this purpose. Windows users in larger corporations often do not have administrator level rights, so they can't install any special drivers. So Knoppix under QEMU can get right to the net on any Windows box that will run a
-- John.
Now all they need to do is add the following ability to make it perfect:
1. Allow people to apt-get packages while the CD is running. Then...
2. Import user files from Win into a Knoppix-side directory. Finally...
3. (this is the important one) Press a button and presto! The system builds an ISO of original winknoppix+packages+userfiles that is a no-fuss super-customized knoppix CD!
If they could make that... then a seamless transition to Linux goodness would finally be within reach for everyone!
That's . . . very, very odd. I've often been able to max out my bandwidth with torrents (though not nowadays, considering that I'm at the university residence . . . faster even than my prior aDSL, true, but if I let it go, I'd break my weekly download/upload limits damn quickly!). There are many things that could be going wrong. One of the problems often encountered, which is the most likely cause since I've seen similar same symptoms on many a computer, is your router. Part of the reason I've never had to care is 'cause I've eskewed routers; I hate them, I reallly do. But if you're using one, and getting crappy speeds using BitTorrent, this may very well be it, so just read up on the solution here. Hope that works for ya.
I remember sigs. Oh, a simpler time!
Stability of Linux is only a small part of the story. But you're not right anyway. An emulator is a nice cozy environment for an OS. It should be more stable there than running natively.
The bigger advantage for users is the number of applications freely available for Linux.
What comes with a new Windows machine? Usually a lot of "lite" versions of various payware. Word processor, maybe. Eventually the system gets hosed and even those may be lost.
I don't think most users have any idea what it's like to think "I wish I had a program that did ____" and then apt-cache search'ing for it 3 or 4 programs that do it ready to be downloaded...
And Knoppix has a lot of stuff just available in the menus right off the bat. Just give the users the caveat that, yeah, this isn't going to be real fast, but it will give you an idea of what is available.
I have used DSL (Damn Small Linux) before and been able to use it on some users machine to log in to the server quickly with my SSH keys all setup on the key. When I am done, I kill it. I love this because I can use it on any machine I have and be able to test scripts and such on my machine without risking any of the stuff on the local machine. Will it run slow? Yeah, but if you have a ton of RAM and speedy processor(preferably 1 GHz or faster) it should run just fine.
Gorkman
I just started a torrent, and I'm already over 12KB/s.
Yes, I'm sharing too.. 16KB/s up is my limit for torrents (384K DSL uplink).
Isn't the idea that a slashdotting is the best case scenario for a torrent? Provided, of course, that the traffic ramps up gradually so that there is a significant body of (different) data distributed.
"Because Science" is one step from "Because old book". Try "Because of my experiment testing my falsifiable assertion".
I just tested the disk on two different systems running a fully patched XP SP2, I get an error 3 lines in to the boot up sequence and it craps out.
Well, if I want to test my website Linux browsers (Konqueror comes to mind), this would be a lot nicer than rebooting. Or having another box around. Especially if all I need to do is test a browser.
But even above and beyond that, it's nice to know that I have access to a Linux environment without having to do anything but pop in a CD.
Who doesn't like free music?
...but in the case of naive Windows users, even asking them to reboot can be a scary concept for them.
OK, people are asking why this is scary. Here's why:
You reboot, and suddenly, all this small text in bright colours is crawling across your screen (at least, that's what Knoppix did, the last time I tried it). Your Windows environment is gone. You don't know if it's coming back, or even if it's reformatting your hard drive, that's what it's supposed to look like, right?
Yeah, I know, this crap is irrational. But guess what, if the world was purely rational, Microsoft would have gone out of business ages ago...
Having Knoppix run on the Windows desktop is reassuring. It lets you know that Windows is still there and you can return there at any time, and since all your icons are still on your desktop, your files must therefore be safe. Yeah, more irrational fears, sorry, but that's how many people think.
Maybe I just know a lot of stupid people but if you run linux under windows, your average user won't understand that linux actually replaces windows. A lot of people just assume to see the little magic start button when they power up. Booting directly into linux helps simple folk (in regards to their technological prowess) realize that windows isn't magically built into the hardware and doesn't need to boot for the computer to run.
I did this on XP:
Downloaded and ran win version of qemu
Create an image file bigger than your iso using qemu
Point to your ISO
Run! (Knoppix took about 8 mins on old PIII laptop)
http://pcblues.com - Digits and Wood
Here's another option, designed for a USB key. It runs Firefox, Thunderbird, etc. all in a virtual linux machine. The release is planned to work on GNU/Linux, ms windows and mac os x, although the current release candidate doesn't work on the mac. It also uses qemu, of course. More info: Portable Virtual Privacy Machine.
Every post in this thread I've written from Firefox running in a coLinux instance displaying via the Cygwin X server. I use coLinux, I like coLinux, but that's not to say that other solutions like QEMU have no place. The parent asked if there existed any advantage of QEMU over coLinux -- not specific to Knoppix but in general. I answered that question.
QEMU with KNOPPIX
. html
- en.html
h tml
http://unit.aist.go.jp/itri/knoppix/qemu/index-en
coLinux with KNOPPIX
http://unit.aist.go.jp/itri/knoppix/colinux/index
Here is an installer to NTFS of Windows2000/XP.
Install2win
http://unit.aist.go.jp/itri/knoppix/win/index-en.
My granny was Admiral Grace Hopper, you insensitive clod!
If your aunt is that stupid, the only way she'd be at university would be in a jar of formaldehyde.