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Web Design Garage

jsuda (John Suda) writes "Web Design Garage is a remarkably clear-headed, concisely-written and feature-rich book about contemporary web-design topics. It is part of a "Garage" series of hip-looking, style-laden books published by Prentice Hall (Prentice Hall Professional Technical Reference -- PH PTR) and is targeted at the "garage" level designer: small business professionals, hobbyists, and technophiles. It assumes some modest familiarity of HTML and working with Javascript." Read on for the rest of Suda's review.

Web Design Garage author Marc Campbell pages 530 publisher Prentice Hall PTR rating 8 reviewer John Suda ISBN 0131481991 summary Hands-on Guide to web design and usability

This is not a primer, tutorial, or concept-bound book. It is meant to provide practical guidance and solutions to the most common Web design issues dealt with by Web designers. Author Marc Campbell, offers a set of 86 topics about Web design problems and solutions. The format for nearly all of the 86 topics is to highlight a design challenge, then offer solutions using pictures, examples, and code snippets. Although a good and quick read from beginning to end, the book can be read piecemeal for information and guidance on a specific issue. One can pick and choose topics depending on interest or need.

There are no traditional chapters, only a set of design topics of relatively short length organized into 8 general categories. Those categories include design and usability topics, layout, images, text, links, forms, and two others -- one of miscellaneous items, the other an explanation of basic Web-design material. There is also an index and a short glossary of HTML, CSS, Web, and graphics-related terms.

The fundamental theme of the book is that design and usability are, or should be, the same thing. Usability is paramount, of course, but the author's approach to Web design emphasizes creating a "sense of place": good design unites pages so that they look like they belong together.

This is not an earth-shattering idea, but like most of all of the design treatments, the goal is to design pages which make it easy for visitors to use the site. Many good design virtues are virtually invisible to the casual user. There is a confluence of design and usability; it's only when a design element doesn't work well that it comes to the attention of the user, and that's something to avoid. The author shows by example how design and usability are intertwined.

There are a handful of themes which guide the book. Admirably, the author emphasizes for every design element a concern for accessibility. Many of the design guides refer to accessibility by screen-readers and non-graphic browsers. A second major concern is for compliance with contemporary Web design standards as those promulgated by the World Wide Web Consortium. Consequently, there is much emphasis on the separation of page structure from content, where CSS is used for structure and HTML is used for content. A contrast of HTML and CSS formatting is highlighted in many of the chapters.

There is a large handful of sections which express HTML and CSS formatting differences on page layout, text and image positioning, and other Web design elements. There is clear discussion on how to work with Javascript and stylesheets. The emphasis is on "forward-looking" coding, i.e., clean, standards-compliant, and accessibility conscious. Campbell offers an experienced designer's insights on choices to be made in design components. There is much value for both inexperienced and seasoned designers.

Each topic is richly expressed with clear and straightforward text, illustrations, screenshots, and sidebars on a variety of related matters. There are sidebars throughout titled "FAQs" and "Geekspeak," explaining concepts or terminology for the less-knowledgeable reader. Then there are those called "Tips" which usually offer an insight to practical problems, especially dealing with browser-compatibility issues. There are many useful tables and charts indexing specific tag attributes, with examples. In addition, and most useful, are the "Toolkits" which are sample code snippets. It would have been nice to have the code snippets available for downloading from the publisher's Web site.

This is a dense volume containing all sorts of information useful for the "garage" web designer. For some reason, the depth and weight of the content is reflected in the book itself, which is remarkably heavy, weighing in at a well-produced 29 ounces.

There are many books available on basic Web design, but this one is unusually clear and well-expressed. This is the type of book one keeps handy in the bookshelf next to the computer to access for quick solutions to everyday Web design problems.

You can purchase Web Design Garage from bn.com. Slashdot welcomes readers' book reviews -- to see your own review here, read the book review guidelines, then visit the submission page.

103 comments

  1. I'll take content over "hip-looking, style-laden". by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Of course, the eMpTy-V generation probably disagrees with me.

  2. Re:I'll take content over "hip-looking, style-lade by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    And the Apple generation. Generation Q.

  3. take a look in the book by WaldoXX · · Score: 3, Insightful

    "This is not a primer, tutorial, or
    concept-bound book. It is meant to provide
    practical guidance and solutions to the most
    common Web design issues dealt with by Web
    designers.

    Each topic is richly expressed with clear and
    straightforward text, illustrations,
    screenshots, and sidebars on a variety of
    related matters. There are sidebars throughout
    titled "FAQs" and "Geekspeak," explaining
    concepts or terminology for the
    less-knowledgeable reader."


    So another HTML for dummies?

    1. Re:take a look in the book by hyperstation · · Score: 1, Insightful

      yay, more "less knowledgable" people making web sites - just what we needed. be sure to check out the publisher's php nuke book for the less knowledgable too...

    2. Re:take a look in the book by dcbarker · · Score: 1

      Oh I don't know if I'd agree. I've had a look at some of the other Garage series books and they've been pretty detailed! Then again every one is different so I can't really comment until I've seen the web design one!

    3. Re:take a look in the book by PepeGSay · · Score: 1

      When I started doing web development 10 years ago we were all pretty much faking it, just using good business sense and general programming principles. The field is *still* developing like many others. So everyone has to learn somehow. There is a lot more to go on for companies seperating web hacks/hobbyists from the professionals however. So I wouldn't worry about an influx of what should be hobbyists like after the bubble burst because of this book. :)

    4. Re:take a look in the book by klugerama · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Why is that bad? Because people who are less knowledgeable about HTML and Javascript have nothing else important to say?

      The only well-presented websites are not only presented by, but composed by professional web programmers?

      I'd have to think that there are at *least* one or two people out there that are smart, but don't know anything about web scripting. Probably.

  4. review? by CynicalGuy · · Score: 2, Insightful

    This review doesn't even say whether the book is any good or not.

    1. Re:review? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      There are many books available on basic Web design, but this one is unusually clear and well-expressed. This is the type of book one keeps handy in the bookshelf next to the computer to access for quick solutions to everyday Web design problems. I'd personally take that as an "it's reasonably good", and there's lots of comments about why above this...

    2. Re:review? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Rating 8 out of 10 - waddya think?

    3. Re:review? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      That's just an image. It doesn't change.

  5. Thinking of Us by filmmaker · · Score: 5, Funny

    I would like to thank the author for putting a guitar on the cover of that book. This way, at a glance, a girl would probably think I play guitar. Bonus.

    1. Re:Thinking of Us by The+Amazing+Fish+Boy · · Score: 2, Funny

      I would like to thank the author for putting a guitar on the cover of that book. This way, at a glance, a girl would probably think I play guitar. Bonus.

      This just in: Apple sues publisher for use of a picture of a guitar and the word "Garage", allegedly infringing on their GarageBand software.

      In related news, I am posting this from a Mac. Please, please, folks, don't murder my karma.

      Signing off... this is Amazing Fish Boy... wishing you and yours... a fine evening.

  6. Wait a minute.... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Funny

    I thought we only promoted Apple and Google?
    Books too?

    1. Re:Wait a minute.... by jam3s · · Score: 1

      As a PowerBook G4 user, I am most pleased to be able to find this book on Google.

    2. Re:Wait a minute.... by LuxFX · · Score: 1

      I thought we only promoted Apple and Google?
      Books too?


      Web designers get to use Macs to build websites with a "Search the web" Google box.

      It's a cool-by-association thing.

      --
      Punctanym: alternate spelling of words using punctuation or numerals in place of some or all of its letters; see 'leet'
  7. Re:I'll take content over "hip-looking, style-lade by Reality+Master+101 · · Score: 3, Insightful
    If people like you were in charge of the world, we'd all be living in gray, concrete houses composed of efficient squares that could be stacked and pushed together.

    I know it's a radical concept to some Slashdotters, but style matters. I don't particularly want to go back to "green screen" text-only monochrome monitors.

    --
    Sometimes it's best to just let stupid people be stupid.
  8. This is just another tutorial. by dteichman2 · · Score: 2, Informative

    I just looked at the table of contents. This seems like just another average HTML/CSS/Javascript tutorial/primer. It's geared toward quick results, and is possibly a good refrence if you tend to forget things, but it's in no way a book that a web developer would want.

    --


    Silence is golden... and duct tape is silver.
    1. Re:This is just another tutorial. by cuteseal · · Score: 1
      You're probably right, but personally, I prefer learning from real world tutorials or examples, rather than just textbook style references.

      If I need to find which attribute values go with which tag, I just Google.

    2. Re:This is just another tutorial. by thryllkill · · Score: 1

      Informative my ass... the blurb on the front page said as much when it stated:

      "is targeted at the "garage" level designer: small business professionals, hobbyists, and technophiles."

      --

      Note to self: No more arguing with the faithful.

    3. Re:This is just another tutorial. by teeker · · Score: 1

      I just looked at the table of contents. This seems like just another average HTML/CSS/Javascript tutorial/primer.

      But the guy that actually read the book says specifically:

      This is not a primer, tutorial, or concept-bound book.

      I know a lot of /.ers don't read the linked stories, but when you don't even have to click a link....

      ugh.

      --
      teeker
  9. Designing With Web Standards by Mariani · · Score: 5, Informative

    Reading this review, instantaniously Designing With Web Standards by Jeffrey Zeldman sprang to mind. It has also been reviewed on slashdot here.

    I don't want to be looking down on the book by saying this but judging by the review it sounds like Web Design Garage is kind of a light version.

    1. Re:Designing With Web Standards by pigwin32 · · Score: 1

      Personally I found Zeldman's book less than practical. It's good background material on the browser wars and the current state of accepted page layout best practices. It's very css oriented and for practical insight into page layout using css you can't do better than Eric Meyer on CSS, except perhaps for his more recent book.

      Web Design Garage covers more than just css layout. The telling comment is perhaps There are many books available on basic Web design, but this one is unusually clear and well-expressed. High praise.

  10. Re:I'll take content over "hip-looking, style-lade by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Man... that'd be awesome!

  11. Re:I'll take content over "hip-looking, style-lade by lakiolen · · Score: 1

    Wouldn't that be generation i?

    --


    What are you expecting to find here?
  12. Re:I'll take content over "hip-looking, style-lade by serutan · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Of course, the eMpTy-V generation probably disagrees with me.

    Don't know about that, but the read-the-article-before-commenting generation might disagree with you. According to the review, this book seems pretty chock full of useful content.
    By the way, nice HiP-LoOkInG, sTyLe-LaDeN comment!

  13. And most importantly by lexsco · · Score: 5, Funny
    book itself, which is remarkably heavy, weighing in at a well-produced 29 ounces.

    Such a heavy book must contain lots and lots of usefull information!!!!

    1. Re:And most importantly by hyperstation · · Score: 1

      Such a heavy book must contain lots and lots of usefull information!!!!

      thick glossy paper...

    2. Re:And most importantly by Johnso · · Score: 1

      How many Libraries of Congress is that?

      --
      I'm a signature virus. Please copy me to your signature so I can replicate.
  14. Imagine my surprise by doombob · · Score: 3, Informative

    Well, I was looking for books with black and white animals on the covers and then I saw this. Needless to say, you can't judge a book by its cover. I found it to actually have useful real-world solutions to actual problems I have had in the past. I thought it would be useless and unprofessional, but it was not. It was also the least expensive web-development-related book in the major book chain store through which I was browsing.

  15. What you say? by Robotron23 · · Score: 2, Insightful

    "hip-looking, style-laden books"

    Don't take this as redundant, but since when were web design books "hip" at all? Most beginners in my view would simply want clear concise instructions, and clear concise instructions don't need to be dressed up or "style-laden", the aesthetics of the book are perhaps of the least importance to I daresay ANY web designer.

  16. Re:I'll take content over "hip-looking, style-lade by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Informative

    eMpTy-V

    MTV

    Get it?

  17. Re:I'll take content over "hip-looking, style-lade by Feynman · · Score: 1
    If people like you were in charge of the world, we'd all be living in gray, concrete houses [...] but style matters

    Agreed, but have you tried to read Tom Peters' Reimagine? Here's a sample chapter [PDF, 2.7 MB]. The Daily Show's America (The Book) is much the same: highly non-linear, making for a tough read.

  18. XMLHttpRequest? by sean23007 · · Score: 1, Informative

    I was hoping this book would have some valuable information about the XmlHttpRequest object, which is used by Google Suggest, GMail, and other sites around the web. Unfortunately, there is a dearth of information about it available on the internet. The way I see it, unless your site is going to be very simple, this is a technology you should definitely be using for all future projects ... I'm doing all I can with it, but there isn't any good info on it. Does anyone have links?

    --

    Lack of eloquence does not denote lack of intelligence, though they often coincide.
    1. Re:XMLHttpRequest? by hyperstation · · Score: 1
    2. Re:XMLHttpRequest? by Narcocide · · Score: 2, Informative

      a brief overview i found pretty useful: apple.com

    3. Re:XMLHttpRequest? by hyperstation · · Score: 1

      way to go slashcode...

      google this:

      XML httprequest object site:developer.apple.com

    4. Re:XMLHttpRequest? by sean23007 · · Score: 1

      I've seen that, and it's kind of what I was talking about. It was extremely brief and didn't give general information. It doesn't describe how to submit data within a page, or how to interact with a database.

      --

      Lack of eloquence does not denote lack of intelligence, though they often coincide.
    5. Re:XMLHttpRequest? by hyperstation · · Score: 1

      ignore the troll, it's server independent.

    6. Re:XMLHttpRequest? by hyperstation · · Score: 2, Informative

      this was in my bookmarks. you can use the HTTP request to call a script (in turn accessing a database), or whatever else you want to do...

    7. Re:XMLHttpRequest? by Jerf · · Score: 1

      XMLHttpRequest "just" lets you access a web page. It doesn't let you interact with a database.

      If you want to interact with a database, you have to add a web page that does that. I strongly suggest adding a back-end to your website that just dumps out the data you want as a Javascript object, and use "eval" to read it in, as that is by far the fastest and most flexible approach. (XML is great and all but in my experience on Mozilla the XML parser can nail you for entire seconds worth of time, which is unacceptable.)

      There isn't much to say about XMLHttpRequest; its capabilities are a straight reflection of the capabilities of a website, on its own it can do nothing more than retrieve static data. Oh, and use async for everything but debugging, or Mozilla will kill your performance.

    8. Re:XMLHttpRequest? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      but not browser independent. try using this technology without javascript or better yet - be blind and try to use it with a text reader. This technology is horrible for developers, we need a standardize event driven model for the web not this hacked together javascript nonsense.

    9. Re:XMLHttpRequest? by hyperstation · · Score: 1

      This technology is horrible for developers, we need a standardize event driven model for the web not this hacked together javascript nonsense.

      that's true, but do you have a better idea and implementation (with a massive installed base)? :)

    10. Re:XMLHttpRequest? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      why do we need a massive installed base? no one had a web browser before they were invented and people went out of there way to track one down. if it easy to code for and easy to install people will download and use it. and yes I have a better idea - a standard event driven web model - its that simple. define the widgets, define the events they can generate, and provide an open source implementation of the whole thing.

    11. Re:XMLHttpRequest? by hyperstation · · Score: 1

      why do we need a massive installed base? no one had a web browser before they were invented and people went out of there way to track one down. if it easy to code for and easy to install people will download and use it. and yes I have a better idea - a standard event driven web model - its that simple. define the widgets, define the events they can generate, and provide an open source implementation of the whole thing.

      don't get me wrong, i wholeheartedly AGREE! this would have been a lot easier before the web became so ubiquitous. now, you'll have to somehow coerce MS into embracing (and not extending) the standard, or hope that a real migration away from IE to something we have more control over occurs.

      i read a comment somewhere today that mentioned boycotting IE browsers by redirecting them to some page when they're detected and not allowing access to the site. i think this idea is half-baked, and by that i mean one part is viable - i'd like to temporarily redirect users coming to my site to warn them about IE, and then allow them to continue on, hopefully after installing firefox. a standardized message without the usual kiddie shit would do just fine. of course, you'd never get this out to any real corporate site, but bloggers however...

    12. Re:XMLHttpRequest? by Rick+and+Roll · · Score: 1
      This might be of interest.

      AJAX Considered Harmful

    13. Re:XMLHttpRequest? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      May be horrible, but it has one massive advantage. By using stuff like XMLHttpRequest and other JS "abombinations" you can offload the processing of every button click from the server to the client, which when you're dealing with large userbases is very important.

      Thats not an excuse for having a vanilla HTML version with no JS that relies on HTTP POST, but why restrict all the users of the web to the lowest common denominator (i.e. screen readers or people running lynx on VT100s)?

    14. Re:XMLHttpRequest? by Zontar+The+Mindless · · Score: 1

      > we need a standardize event driven model for the
      > web not this hacked together javascript nonsense.

      And where have you been for the last 5 years...?

      http://www.w3.org/TR/DOM-Level-2-Events

      --
      Il n'y a pas de Planet B.
    15. Re:XMLHttpRequest? by renimar · · Score: 1

      Chris Justus Dissects Google Suggest is one I've been looking through lately. He breaks down the javascript and explains what's going on with this nifty piece of tecnology.

      --
      In other news, Microsoft Windows users are now covered under the Americans with Disabilties Act...
    16. Re:XMLHttpRequest? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Slashcode breaks the link description if it's too long, but not the link target:

      http://developer.apple.com/internet/webcontent/xml httpreq.html

      I guess you previewed as a plain text link, then copied and pasted to form a real link using the slashcode-broken one?

    17. Re:XMLHttpRequest? by hyperstation · · Score: 1

      i'm not sure, but i did it twice to try and see what was happening. as plain text, i pasted the url, then added tags and the url again as the link text. it made that broken one both times. not sure what happened...

    18. Re:XMLHttpRequest? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      See Very Dynamic Web Interfaces by Drew McLellan based on this earlier blog entry by him.

  19. If you need an HTML/CSS/XML primer by fontkick · · Score: 5, Informative

    Visit:

    http://www.w3schools.com/

    Good stuff, easy to navigate, covers the basics, free.

    1. Re:If you need an HTML/CSS/XML primer by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Goddamn communists giving out good information that I should be able to charge for!!

  20. Re:I'll take content over "hip-looking, style-lade by Quiet_Desperation · · Score: 1

    But then again dry, pure information can get tedious sometimes. There's nothing wrong with a little style.

  21. Wow. You people are disgusting by arhar · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Completely ignoring the review, and focusing only on how the book is packaged (without even seeing it yourselves). Based on author's description of HOW THE BOOK LOOKS, you concluded that it's aimed at the MTV-generation, putting style over content.

    For some reason, most geeks think that anything that looks good is somehow 'below' them. That's why there hasn't been a good-looking Linux desktop GUI yet ... Have any of you ever thought that if something LOOKED good, there might, just might be something worthy under the cover too?

    1. Re:Wow. You people are disgusting by Quiet_Desperation · · Score: 1
      Have any of you ever thought that if something LOOKED good, there might, just might be something worthy under the cover too?

      Agreed, but such things ARE pretty rare in this plastic, dippy world. Tech people can be pretty prejudiced against the artistic world. People like me who straddle both worlds can have a rough time.

      Personally, I wuv my Macs, but I'd like to buy a really UGLY computer some day. :-)

    2. Re:Wow. You people are disgusting by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Have any of you ever thought that if something LOOKED good, there might, just might be something worthy under the cover too?

      All the bright lights in Las Vegas might, just might mean you will get rich gambling there.

      But probably not.

      -Anonymous Phil

    3. Re:Wow. You people are disgusting by cranos · · Score: 1

      Damn you mean I am meant to take things on face value, judge a book by its cover and believe the hype?

      So thats what I have been doing wrong all this time.

    4. Re:Wow. You people are disgusting by st0rmshadow · · Score: 0

      How is judging a book negatively based on its cover or how it looks any different than praising a book based on its cover or how it looks?

    5. Re:Wow. You people are disgusting by prockcore · · Score: 1

      putting style over content.

      You know, I have no problem putting style over content.

      Art is what inspires man. If it were up to the content-nazis, we'd be nothing more than machines... processing data all damn day.

      Art inspires imagination. Imagination drives brilliance. Brilliance drives innovation, and innovation drives society.

      The Renaissance saved humanity.

    6. Re:Wow. You people are disgusting by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      interesting flame war here. It is cool, me being all resting in my chair and trying to learn. And there are these people like you who misunderstand the motivations of others and create these stereotype 'most geek' fantasys of people who don't even exist.

      When I saw that this was a book on style I wasn't sure if they were taking about coding style, whihc I like to call 'idiom' or graphical style which I like to call 'layout'.

      It is interesting that the ambiguity of the word style is featured by the posts here today.

      Often things look good but they don't work. If that is the case it is bad style. But the colors might match what you are wearing.

      It is like the guy that wore a coat that matched his car. But if the car doesn't run then that coat better be warm.

      I find that there aren't any 'most geeks'. There isn't even one. They are all individuals with their individual sense of being themselves. Your concept of the pan-geek stereo type and your derision towards geeks style sense is a fantasy of your over active mind.

    7. Re:Wow. You people are disgusting by cupraman · · Score: 1

      Exactly. Shouldn't we be aiming for great content that's delivered with style?

    8. Re:Wow. You people are disgusting by ciw42 · · Score: 1

      The review is pretty poor, and tells you very little of any worth about the book itself, so it's not surprising people are ignoring it.

      The language used is at times awkward, and you get the idea that the author has used a thesaurus to try and drop some interesting words in place of more commom ones. It suggests to me that he/she is actually quite young.

      The review just way too vague, and reminded me very much of a school book review where it's obvious the student hadn't even read the book, just looked at the sleeve and contents pages.

      OK, so anyone with an interest in the topics covered by the book will no doubt hop on over to Amazon to get more information, and in that sense, getting even this half-effort on Slashdot will have achieved something. Simply putting the title of the book and a link to the relevant Amazon page would also have achieved the same.

    9. Re:Wow. You people are disgusting by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Have any of you ever thought that if something LOOKED good, there might, just might be something worthy under the cover too?

      That's not very logical. Why do you think so many sci-fi book covers look great only to contain a piece of S*** story. At least consumers might be attracted to its professional appearance and look into it further and it might actually gain popularity. Add ease-of-use, and there would be some real wow.

  22. YEA!!!! by Core-Dump · · Score: 0

    Breast!!

    Uuh.. oh..wait.. never mind..

    --
    What would you do without a monitor? Sit and look stupid behind a keyboard and a mouse
  23. Re:I'll take content over "hip-looking, style-lade by justforaday · · Score: 2, Funny

    I don't particularly want to go back to "green screen" text-only monochrome monitors.

    Of course not. Everyone knows amber was much better...

    --
    I'll turn into a supernova and burn up everything. Well I'll turn into a black little hole and you'll turn into string.
  24. Re:I'll take content over "hip-looking, style-lade by johnnyb · · Score: 1

    "I don't particularly want to go back to "green screen" text-only monochrome monitors."

    That's funny, because that's exactly the color scheme I have mine set to. Of course, that's because it's easy on the eyes.

  25. Building the perfect personal ad site... by machinegunhand · · Score: 2, Funny

    Does it include any information on how to build a personal ad/dating site that actually works? I've noticed that all the popular sites look good but prove to be defective upon use. I'm sure we've all noticed this. Please validate me, please...

    1. Re:Building the perfect personal ad site... by __aaclcg7560 · · Score: 1

      Please validate me, please...

      You have been validated. Please show your validation to the attendant before leaving the garage. Have a nice day. :P

    2. Re:Building the perfect personal ad site... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Maybe they're not defective as much as you're just unwanted? :) Kidding.

  26. at least it cheap by qwerbus · · Score: 2, Interesting

    I don't know about everyone else, but at least this is a book that sounds pretty good without costing 25+ dollars. It seems you can't find a single technical book thats also affordable, so I'd think about pick this one up if only for that.

    --
    the toothpaste is frozen
  27. Re:I'll take content over "hip-looking, style-lade by Reziac · · Score: 2, Insightful

    And when my eyes are tired, I find I miss my old amber mono... (well, I guess I could fire up the 286... it still works.)

    There's a grave tendency to mistake flamboyancy for style. Sortof the same mentality that uses the BLINK tag for emphasis!!

    --
    ~REZ~ #43301. Who'd fake being me anyway?
  28. Cool Factor . . . by Java+Ape · · Score: 3, Informative
    The "garage" books caught my eye at a local bookstore -- definately very stylish looking. However, after spending a half-hour or so browsing the tome, I was left feeling like it lacked focus. As the orignal reviewer indicated, it isn't a tutorial, cookbook, or referece, it seemed to wander through topics, somtimes giving very detailed examples, and sometimes doing vague arm-waving sketches of major concepts. For my money, I think O'Reilly does a remarkable job of delivering content efficiently and accurately.

    On the other hand the w3.org maintains a bang-up bunch of white-papers on all web-related technologies. Nothing say's nerd like volumes of loose-leaf white papers falling out of your attache case . . .

    1. Re:Cool Factor . . . by katdesign · · Score: 2, Interesting

      I've currently got the 'Actionscript 2 Garage' book on my safari bookshelf, and it seems to suffer from the same lack of focus. Its tone of voice is intended to suggest matter-of-factness (is that a word?) but in fact the book has lots of gaps and covers topics very unevenly. There is no information there that isn't available in other books, only the style is (slightly) different. It does indeed seem to aim for the 'guys working in web design who think O'reilly books are boring' demographic.

  29. Re:I'll take content over "hip-looking, style-lade by mr_duget · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Actually, I'd love a book focussing more on "hip-ness" and "style".

    As a database-developer/web-site coder I often get asked to provide the design as well. Often I outsource the job, but only because I don't feel comfortable providing a professional looking design. Sure it might meet all the web standards - but it looks boring as bat-shit.

    Anyone got any recommendations for design books for coders... not so much "HTML for dummies" as "Web-Design for Geeks"?

  30. Re:I'll take content over "hip-looking, style-lade by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    How deep of you.

  31. Re:I'll take content over "hip-looking, style-lade by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    The poster you replied to said that he preferred substance over style, not substance instead of style. So am I to take your disagreement to mean that you would prefer a world in which everything looked nice, but was completely useless? I buy a nice looking car that falls apart when I try to drive it? Shit like that, eh?

  32. Re:I'll take content over "hip-looking, style-lade by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Interesting

    Sure, that's another extreme. But personally, 'hip-looking, style-lade' usually implies some jerk using lots of very fancy colors to totally obfiscuate any usefull content the site has, including taste.
    Style matters a lot, but I find it stylish to have a website with a clean look, not all kinds of fancy (read 'hip') colors and stuff. The same reason I like the look of for example XFCE over Windows XP. I know it's comparing apples to pears but XFCE generally looks clean and quite frankly attractive though be it grey, on the other hand Windows XP tends to just look overly 'hip' messy and ugly.
    Making a 'hip' site that looks good is relatively easy, building an attractive site is a big challenge. There are ways to make a grey concrete house look really attractive.
    But ofcaurse, this is just my humble opinion.

  33. Re:I'll take content over "hip-looking, style-lade by timmyd · · Score: 2, Informative

    I'm writing a paper on web accessibility for an ethics class this semester, while it's still in its infancy, I have some things I can share with you.

    Are you aware that "The U.S. Census Bureau says that
    more 49.7 million people have a disability or some sort of long
    lasting condition. Of these 49.7 million people, 9.3 million have a
    hearing or vision disability and 12.4 million of them have a condition
    related to cognition or difficulty in learning"? Due to advances in health, the world population is getting older and 53 percent of the people with disabilities in the US are 65 and older.

    And are you aware that about 71 out of the fortune 100 web sites according to one experiment have a severe web accessibility error (priorty 1) according to Bobby (web accessibility checker)?

    And there are only so many things that validation sites can check--what if a site uses a a color theme that is nearly impossible for color-blind users? Fortunately, it's possible to design an accessible website that looks good also.

  34. Re:I'll take content over "hip-looking, style-lade by Omega+Blue · · Score: 1

    What kind of sytle does Google has, anyway?

  35. Re:I'll take content over "hip-looking, style-lade by SoupIsGoodFood_42 · · Score: 1

    Since when did this book advocate content-devoided sites? Were you expecting some info on how to create good content? Do you expect books to cover every topic slightly related to the core topic? Are you assuming that anyone who reads this book must not be interesting in content?

  36. Re:I'll take content over "hip-looking, style-lade by pianoman82 · · Score: 1

    I'd have to agree...I could use some pointers in the artistic realm to complement the standards-based coding I already know how to do.

    Unfortunately, I don't think that the artistic sort of thing is quite as easy to get from a book, or to put into a book, for that matter. But even a few ideas to point me in the right direction would be nice...

  37. Re:I'll take content over "hip-looking, style-lade by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I'm sure he did. It's just not funny or original enough to comment on it.

  38. Recipe for success by Look+KG486 · · Score: 0

    1. Move computers to garage. 2. Start car. 3. ??? 4. Die

    --

    "Play is the only way the highest intelligence of humankind can unfold." -- Joseph Chilton Pearce

  39. Re:I'll take content over "hip-looking, style-lade by leshert · · Score: 1

    For most websites (excluding those intended as performance art, style portfolio pieces, or pure entertainment), a site focused on content without any style is still useful; a site focused on style without content is not.

    However, reduces the whole argument to a false choice (the fallacy of the excluded middle, for the left-brainers).

    I don't think even the original anonymous poster is advocating eliminating style altogether--instead, (s)he rails against style that gets in the way of content. A successful design uses great style to present the content and doesn't get in the way of that content.

    Left-brainers like to tout Google as an example of the triumph of content over style, but it's really an example of using style where it counts, without empty gilding.

  40. Re:I'll take content over "hip-looking, style-lade by Dr.Opveter · · Score: 1

    a site focused on content without any style is still useful; a site focused on style without content is not.

    Actually, style without content doesn't have to be useful. I mean, why do people like to go see art in a museum, cause it's useful?
    I visit sites like css Zen Garden and CSS Beauty to check out nice designs. I couldn't care less what the site content is about.

    --
    Sample this!
  41. I'll take "What is Alzhiemers. Alex"? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    "I know it's a radical concept to some Slashdotters, but style matters. I don't particularly want to go back to "green screen" text-only monochrome monitors."

    Most of the people here, weren't even alive then.

  42. Re:I'll take content over "hip-looking, style-lade by leshert · · Score: 1

    What part of "excluding those intended as performance art, style portfolio pieces, or pure entertainment" did you not understand?

    I particularly enjoy CSS Zen Garden. It wasn't until I saw this site that CSS really clicked for me.

  43. Re:I'll take content over "hip-looking, style-lade by Dr.Opveter · · Score: 2, Funny

    The part which is in parenthesis ;-) Excuse me sir, i'm going to need some more caffeine to get me through the day...

    --
    Sample this!
  44. Oh, please by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    The poster was referring to comments about the book, not web sites. I don't know about your experience, but I've certainly seen more than my share of computer books that put style ahead of substance and wound up compromising their usefullness and being annoying.

    Extrapolating from that one comment by the poster to what kind of buildings he'd have us all live in is intellectually lazy. It's just as incorrect and pointless as saying that all FOSS adherents are long-haired, dope fiend, communists.

  45. Re:I'll take content over "hip-looking, style-lade by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Actually, those monitors were much more confortable for sight than white background web browsers.

    That's why all coders in my lab prefer to use black bg xterms with vi/emacs than gui editors like anjuta/kdevelop/devstudio... even if some of them can be tweaked to work in reverse video (mostly)

  46. Re:I'll take content over "hip-looking, style-lade by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Style DOES indeed matter, but there also needs to be substance. Without substance, as you know, style (appearance) will become invisible. With negative substance, it may even hurt appearance.

  47. Re:I'll take content over "hip-looking, style-lade by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Style DOES indeed matter, but there also needs to be substance. Without substance, style is irrelevent. With positive substance, style will become invisible. With negative substance, style will be appear ugly.

  48. Re:I'll take content over "hip-looking, style-lade by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I'm using one right now to reply to this message, you insensitive clod!

  49. Re:I'll take content over "hip-looking, style-lade by serutan · · Score: 1

    DuH.

    -"duh" - get it?

  50. Re:I'll take content over "hip-looking, style-lade by bad-badtz-maru · · Score: 1

    I suspect they'd agree that you take substance over style.

  51. Re:I'll take content over "hip-looking, style-lade by sane? · · Score: 1
    Yep, got it, and guess what...

    I like it

    The non linear nature of it, the use of typeface actually ADDS to the ease of use. I can read it by ignoring the sidebars, confident I know what they contain. I can read it taking note of the key points and not the explanation; I can read it in a variety of different ways.

    Above all, I read it because it doesn't bore me and gets across its message in a form that has impact.

    If you can't take anything other than linear text, with headings in bold 18pt and justified columns - you need to get in touch with your tacit, artistic side; you're preconception that the world is simple and logical is holding you back.

  52. only slightly OT by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Has anyone noticed that newer documentaries on Discovery, Nat Geo, etc. are getting more "flashy" and "stylish"? Take last night's program on National Geographic about the newly found human species for example. There were just too many camera and editing gimmicks. It was pretty much irritating to watch. A few special effects are okay, but they overdid it last night. And especially leave the weird camera angles to MTV; I don't want to turn my head sideways just to see who's talking.