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MMOG Market Mutterings
In the past few days there have been several new developments in the Massive Gaming market. Jessica Mulligan's departure from Turbine now has an end destination, with the announcement that she'll be the executive producer for Nevrax's Saga of Ryzom. In a swashbuckling tie-in, Disney announced they'll be adding to their Massive Gaming portfolio, with a Pirates of the Carribean MMOG joining Toontown Online sometime next year. The always excellent CNN Money column Game Over has word that Sony Online is planning a new Action MMOG, a possible strategy title, and some new non-mmog titles. From the article: "Though the numbers for massively multiplayer games aren't bad, they remain a niche in the gaming industry. To expand SOE's potential audience, the company will soon announce smaller puzzle games for two and four players. While those games won't be massively multiplayer or have any sort of persistent world, it's not out of the question for the long term." Finally, there are many stories over on Gametab discussing the "I'm cancelling because of the WoW Honor System" thread on the official World of Warcraft boards. They were likely sparked by this Kotaku post about the thread. I just want to put in my two cents and state that this isn't news. Forums are not an accurate way to get a picture of a game's user base. Doom may be coming to Blizzard's game, but the subscriber charts are the only real way to know for sure.
If I were a statistician and cool I might have some kind of real data to suggest that every new product endures some kind of fallout after the initial enthusiasm. But since I am neither a statistician or cool, I'll just suggest it without the data in an uncool way:
New TV shows always seem to have a drop-off in ratings, a cliff in the number of watchers. If the show is decent and watchable, then it'll climb from there at a steady rate. I have no doubt that Blizzard in their infinite wisdom foresaw this, and is probably bidding good riddance under their breath. If WoW is worth its weight in gold (get it, gold?), then it'll begin to slowly accumlate more users through word of mouth while at the same time perfecting the game for upper-level players.
You DO NOT have to PVP.
The reason the MMORPG is a nich genre is because nobody in their right mind is going to subscribe to more than possible two titles at a time, whereas most people wouldn't think twice about buying another FPS, even if they already own a few.
For any MMORPG to really succeed in keeping it's fanbase happy it will have to have constant expansion. Without new items and quests people get bored quickly. This is why it is good to allow players to create items and even quests so that it's always evolving and not going stale. Second Life has an interesting way of handling this problem. And I won't even bother discussing money issues...
"A truly wise man realizes he knows nothing."
I'm not a player and that link doesn't lead to any information I can use ... can someone explain the problem?
Let's hope Sony learned well from Planetside.
Simply being profitable wasn't enough for them; they kept pushing for higher sales until, ultimately, the game gave up being a war sim and devolved into MMO Quake with some of the worst net code conceivable, and it's still not any more successful, yet they've alienated most of the original players that weren't there for verbal wanking over kill stats.
If you want subscriber charts...
One man's Funny is another man's Offtopic.
being a 46 rogue in WoW, I love the honor system. 'Ganking' is easy as 1-2-flee.
Posts not to be taken literally. Almost everything is sarcasm.
Give me a break. These people who are "quitting" (yeah, sure) are all people who consciously CHOSE a PvP server and are now complaining that they can't quest because people are participating in PvP. Here's your sign.
This will have zero impact on the big picture.
i really wish i had a penny for every i'm quitting thread after some change to a game. I'd be a fricking millionare by now.
:D
I wonder if more people are 'quitting' WoW over the honor things than people who are 'quitting' eq2 over the exchange server thing, If more wow people are quitting we might see a boost in eq2
"Forums are not an accurate way to get a picture of a game's user base."
/pizza command.) Releases in other countries. Weekends. College breaks. Successful advertising campaigns in specific markets. Holidays. So, subscriber numbers aren't the sole metric of a game's approval rating here.
I find the OP's logic flawed... Accurate or not, a discussion forum is the best way to hear the opinions, rants and ideas of a broad variety of players. Excuse me, I mean "user base." You can even (gasp!) participate, and interview the players there to find out what their experience in one area or another has been.
If there's a large amount of complaint threads started by unique forum-goers, then that's an indication of a problem. Not every whiney kid who doesn't like how his shield looks slightly different in one corner after the recent patch (Oh Noes!! I quitzor!) is worth listening to and debating with, but when major gameplay mechanics change, forums usually light up with both pro and con threads. There is always a useful discussion to be found if you're willing to put up with all the whining.
If subscriber numbers fluctuate because of a change, that's great, but the reality is that the majority of players keep their subscriptions if they are unsatisfied with one aspect of the game. Most people just avoid the one thing that they don't like and get on with the game. What causes rises in subscriptions other than good decisions? Promotions at stores. In-game promotions. (See Ragnarok Online's recent double-exp weekend and increase in free trial length, FFXI's come-back campaign, and EQ's
Go ahead and call me out on this post if you like, but back it up... I'd like to know if my head's on straight or not.
The subscriber charts clearly state "M-O-N-E-Y", I'm pretty sure that's as far away from D-O-O-M as you can get.
What such immature babies. You say "The Honor systems sucks- I am cancelling boo hoo" - Why don't you grow up and get youselves a real life. The freaking system has only been in place just over a week. How can you determine that it sucks already? People were cancelling after only 1 day of "Honor" kills. It has not even had a chance yet and you freakin idots cry over it. You cry babies should NOT be playing any MMORPGs because you just look for excuses to quit. Same stuff with Everquest, same crap over Star Wars galaxies! GET A LIFE. QUIT because of the real reason you played the game to death because you have NO life other than a virtual life! Stop playing with your PC Games and go outside and have a catch, pick up a book (the kind with real pages, not an ebook) or go to a movie, stake a stroll in the park and play with a frisbee or something! DO SOMETHING REAL- FORGET MMORPGS AND YOUR CRYBABY SESSIONS! Geez already!
Man, I saw the parent and thought to myself, where is ringbarer when you need him, and Bang - there he is, right under my threshold!
http://hardware.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=05/04/ 27/1930218&tid=232&tid=126&tid=14 2 8/1518226&tid=232&tid=14
http://science.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=05/04/
This "I'm quitting because of the Honor System blah blah blah" thing makes me laugh. Lets look at the facts:
1) You _CHOOSE_ a _PVP_ server _KNOWING_ anyone, at any time, could kill you.
2) The Honor System has only been out for short period of time; already the large zerg groups have started getting smaller.
3) Refer to #1
4) There are TONS of instances in WoW - you can gain just as much or more XP on your way to level 60 in these instances; You have no chance of encountering PVP/ganks while in them.
5) Before the honor system, there were gank/zergs and PVP. Nothing has changed except players up to 12 levels appart can gain honor for wins.
6) Still want to quit? Fine. You are either a) on the opposite sice as I and pose no threat if I decide to kill you (Practice makes perfect ya know...) or b) on the same side as I and only taking up space in a _PVP GAME_
kthx.
I would say part of the problem is that it was pushed out in an incomplete form to try to preempt the launch date of Guild Wars. In addition, the lead designer was interviewed about the upcoming battlegrounds, and he demonstrated a shameful lack of understanding of how PvP actually works in practice on the regular realms ("Alliance outnumber horde? Oh, that's just a misconception, it's not really true. And we're looking to fix that. Massive lag around the massive battle areas? That's all in your head."). That's why people aren't optomistic about the future of "honor" in World of Warcraft.
You cry babies should NOT be playing any MMORPGs because you just look for excuses to quit. Same stuff with Everquest, same crap over Star Wars galaxies!
I don't think it's unreasonable to expect that features listed in the game manual are implimented within the first six months of game release, especially for a game with a monthly fee, do you?
These people are PAYING for the game on an ongoing basis. That gives them full license to complain about poor service.
If someone actually held the game companies liable for shoddy service and shoddy products (vote with your wallets), then perhaps they wouldn't be able to get away with these sorts of things so much.
I would say part of the problem is that it was pushed out in an incomplete form to try to preempt the launch date of Guild Wars. In addition, the lead designer was interviewed about the upcoming battlegrounds, and he demonstrated a shameful lack of understanding of how PvP actually works in practice on the regular realms ("Alliance outnumber horde? Oh, that's just a misconception, it's not really true. And we're looking to fix that. Massive lag around the massive battle areas? That's all in your head."). That's why people aren't optomistic about the future of "honor" in World of Warcraft.
What does HONOR system and Battlegrounds have to do with each other? Battlegrounds are NOT even implemented yet? And gee- a developer who is not in tune with the real world? Golly gee wilikers - I've never heard of that before! That's what customer satisfaction departments are for!
I don't think it's unreasonable to expect that features listed in the game manual are implimented within the first six months of game release, especially for a game with a monthly fee, do you?
Yes I do think this is unreasonable especially when the same complainers were also complaining to speed up the game release! We all seem to have forgotten that But even still, this game and it's developers have it hands down over any other MMORPG I've ever played. I don't expect perfection- I expect consistent delivery of service with improvements - what Blizz has been delivering all along!
These people are PAYING for the game on an ongoing basis. That gives them full license to complain about poor service.
I Agree - but after 1 day of the HONOR system release people were complaining - this is not reasonable - no one gave it a chance before they quit!
If someone actually held the game companies liable for shoddy service and shoddy products (vote with your wallets), then perhaps they wouldn't be able to get away with these sorts of things so much.
Um...its a GAME! If you buy a game for a PC, Console, board game, etc. and dont like it, you should NOT have the right to sue the game developer! What your dislike of a feature is ground for a law suite? So what if you subscribe to a service or not? You always have the option to cancel if you don't like it.
For one, Battlegrounds has been Blizzard's constant mantra for the last week. "Don't like the current honor system? It's ok, Battlegrounds will fix it. Immense lagfests in Tarren Mill/Crossroads/etc? That's ok, Battlegrounds will draw away the masses of players seeking honor. Level 48 characters can't even poke their noses outside of the towns on PvP servers without getting splattered by level 60 chars seeking honor? That's ok, Battlegrounds will draw the honor-seekers instead." If Battlegrounds is supposed to be the great compliment to the honor system that Blizzard has claimed it will be, then why was the honor system released before the Battlegrounds was ready? Why was the honor system released without dishonor? Ie, dishonorable actions have no punishments? It's because Guild Wars is out, and Blizzard needed to throw something out FAST so that bored level 60 players wouldn't hop over to that game instead. Well now they've put out a system that has degraded the quality of the game for almost everyone who isn't level 58-60.
I don't expect perfection. But I do expect progression. I agree that WoW is probably better than Everquest (that SOE auction site makes me nauseated) or SWG, etc. I really liked the game up until the honor system. I still like it for the most part. But if you're on an RP/normal server and the entire town you're at is massacred on a constant basis, then it becomes pretty hard to progress. This is, of course, not nearly as much of a problem for the Alliance as it is for the Horde. If it keeps up then people playing the Horde are going to give up, because where's the fun getting massacred in a town against 3:1, 4:1, 5:1 odds? Then who will the Alliance fight? Sure, places like Tarren Mill were always hotspots, but it was nothing like it is now. My problem with the honor system is that it currently encourages and rewards the worst of the anti-social tendancies of the game -- griefing and ganking. How is that an improvement over the system that was in place before? Oh that's right, the level 60 folks were crying that they were bored. And the competition was starting to look formidable..
My biggest problem is that originally we were sold the idea that PvP would be optional, that it would be a great system and there would be incentives if you wanted to take part in it. Now the nature of the game has been changed, and PvP is inescapable even on normal/RP servers (when a town is destroyed, it affects the low-level folks who can't PvP as well).
Um...its a GAME! If you buy a game for a PC, Console, board game, etc. and dont like it, you should NOT have the right to sue the game developer!
I never said anything about suing the game developer. Yes, that would be a rediculous idea. I specifically mentioned "vote with wallets," meaning to cancel the account. I was responding to the derision you showed towards those who were canceling their account.