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PlayStation 3 HDD to Ship With Linux
timtwobuck writes "Gamespot.com is reporting that Ken Kutaragi, president of Sony Computer Entertainment, has disclosed in an interview that PlayStation 3 will natively run Linux. In fact, it will come bundled with it, if you purchase the HDD peripheral." From the article: "But while Linux would require a hard drive to run on, Kutaragi told Impress PC Watch, 'We're not going to equip [the PS3 with] a HDD by default, because no matter how much [capacity] we put in it, it won't be enough.' It was unclear whether he was referring to the previously known fact that the PS3 would not have an internal hard drive or whether he was indicating that the device would not come with the external 2.5-inch detachable HDD outlined in the specs revealed at E3."
This is not suprising. Of course they wouldn't ship it with Windows, they don't want to fund their direct competitor!
If it's running linux, do you think that the open source nature will help with emulation programs? What about running other emulators on the PS3? Perhaps that was part of Sony's strategy. Hell, it might even run WINE fairly well.
- Just because we CAN do a thing, does not mean we SHOULD do that thing.
After the whole fiasco that Sony had with the NA release of HDD (delaying it by years, promising it would do things it never did, then abandoning it completely with the PS2 redesign after being on market less than a year), I'm not beliving anything Sony says about PS3, HDD specs or otherwise, until it is physically at the store available for purchase.
Personally, I think it would be a mistake that they not include an HDD with the console, but considering the rumoured cost of the PS3, it is probably doubtful that it will include one at launch.
We're gonna *TAKE DOWN* those vi fanboys!
Gentoo Linux - another day, another USE flag.
Stable but wonky interface, in my experience. You have to manually poke it to get it to attach to a ;)
new device, and at least on my belkin parts you have to manually switch crypto off and then back on.
Oh, and anybody in the world can listen in on your keypress events, but that's not a Linux thing,
that's an auto-selected 4 numeral PIN thing
25% Funny, 25% Insightful, 25% Informative, 25% Troll
Nonesense. Never came close to filling up the 8gig on my Xbox, but every game I've played has made use of the HD because they KNOW it will be there.
Of course, since the HD is optional with the PS3, devs will have to assume that it will not be there to reach a wider installed base. PS3 has just made developing for their system more difficult by releasing two products - ones with HDs and ones without.
Even just a small 4gig drive might have been helpful and inexpensive.
It's a good marketing play. It just shifted my preference toward PS3 and away from Xbox360. The ability to use Linux on a system with some rather exotic symmetrical processors, and play all previous PS titles. Right now, all Xbox 360 has going for it is the promise of Halo 3.
Very good, it works great with Ubuntu and Debian as long as you can deal with setting up some things by hand (ie: editing /etc/default/bluez-utils and some files in /etc/bluetooth/)
You'll also need to setup HIDD and after the drivers and bluez-util init script has been ran just run "hidd --connect ".
For bluetooth keyboards you'll need another keyboard around to type a pin in. then type the pin into your new bluetooth keyboard to pair it.
It takes me about 5 minutes at worst these days to get a new bluetooth install going. Be sure to enable encryption and authentication in hcid.conf, too.
-- dieman - Scott Dier
No, the xbox is "so hackable" because they leave LPC points on the mobo for testing - it's easy to bypass the bios using these LPC pads and a ground on the d0 pad. It's more accurate to say "hackability is the reason linux runs on the xbox".
;P
always mosh clockwise
Other PC Operating Systems can run too, such as Windows and Tiger (Max OS X 10.4), if the publishers want [them] to do so. That happening seems so far-fetched to me that its very mention undermines the believability of anything else said in the article. That said, it is good to hear Sony will continue to support linux on PlayStation.
This announcement makes me wonder if Sony is positioning ps3 as a general purpose pc replacement. If the HDD includes not only the kernel but a windowing environment(KDE, gnome, etc...), I could see more than a few people using ps3 as thier primary web/email/office box. Assuming that it has keyboard/mouse support, the ps3 has more than enough power to handle normal pc usage.
Check out http://www.bluez.org/. I use an apple bluetooth keyboard with my debian system without any kernel patches and it runs overall pretty well (although there are a few glitches). By the time the PS3 comes out I have confidence that it will be completely smooth.
The fun-packed grammar and spelling nazi show can be followed by the Useless Japanese Trivia show:
Ken Kutaragi -- in Japanese, v'½--Ç-Ø OE', is one of those lucky fellows with a four-character surname. You can go for years among Japanese people and never meet such a person; it's like having a European-language surname that starts with "X". There are even web sites devoted to listing up all the 4+ character surnames.
And that was Useless Japanese Name Trivia for today!
I wish that you didn't have to buy a proprietary HDD from Sony, because you know that the markup on a "Sony Brand HDD" is going to be way over that of normal store bought computer HDD, even though the Sony HDD is just a regular hard drive that's not even made by Sony. I'm also wondering what capacity limit it will recognize. The PS2 will only recognize up to 127 Gigs (even though the PS2 drive is only 40G). If we're lucky they'll let you use a 3rd party drive via USB. The ideal would be to let us use 3rd party drives and let us download the version of linux they're offering.
PS: I also hope they allow you to do more with the HDD this time around. The only thing my PS2 drive was good for was 'FFXI' (which I barely played) and to watch live highlights from my ESPN NFL 2K5 games. And take a hint from the XBOX, let us rip our own music to the HDD so we can make our own in game playlists.
"Plans are for fools! Oglethorpe, the plutonian (Aqua Teen Hunger Force)
Can anyone understand what this guy is saying? It seems like everything he says he says the opposite like 2 seconds later!
.. but...I thought...WTF!
"We're not going to equip [the PS3 with] an HDD by default."
"So in order to declare that the PS3 is a computer, I think we'll have [the PS3's HDD] preinstalled with Linux as a bonus."
Basically he wants to have PS3 seen as a computer not just a game machine. OK, fine. He says to do this it will need as OS (Linux) to be installed on the HDD. OK, fine. But PS3 won't ship with a HDD. OK,
"reality has a well-known liberal bias" - Steven Colbert
me as a linux fetish put all my hopes and prayers into sonys PS3. since apple/microsoft/intel more and more try to get rid of us linuxers i think the future of linux is in the cell processor. also the ps3 used as standardized personalcomputer would take away a lot of work to figure out drivers and sh*t.
Terrible move by Sony. Developers ignored the PS2 hard drive because the installed base was so low, and I'm sure PS3 will be the same way.
LordBodak's journal.
Simple - becasue they will get FOSS people to help them with the API's. Not only that but this means that there is already a Linux ported to Cell, so that's proof that it works for IBM to start selling Cell PC's. All in all it doesn't cost them much to put it on the HDD but they get good press, a few more sales, and most importantly free dev work to advance the software for Cell (compiler, graphics API's for the chipset that the PS3 uses etc). Remember - this thing won't run Direct X and programming for that many processors (and taking advantage of them) is a real problem. Sony needs all the help it can get.
In TFA, Kutaragi says "even though we're making something that has the capability to be recognized as a supercomputer and requires paperwork when exporting or importing, the government sees it as a 'toy.'" Obviously, this is a ridiculous statement. The new consoles are extremely powerful, but Kutaragi completely ignores the fact that the lack of memory in all three consoles reduces them to just above the status of today's computers - nowhere near a supercomputer.
The problem here is that Sony is pushing video game systems as "entertainment supercomputers." That's not what they should be for, and that's why the quality of Sony games really hasn't improved. They're not pushing innovation. The EyeToy is a neat idea, but every game for it is basically an oversized minigame. And that's been pretty much all their innovation since... well, since they decided to make the PS1.
However, Sony's business model is obviously the most successful. I have a feeling that, unfortunately, Nintendo may die out in this or the next generation of consoles. They may last longer in the handheld industry, but kids these days want hookers, blood, and gore in their games, rather than fun, replayability, and innovation. Microsoft will increase its market share, and the competition between Sony and MS will drive gaming to a low point, as the market becomes saturated with racers, shooters, and dull, homoegeneous platformers. Eventually consumers will realize what they've done and - I hope - there will be an upwelling of creativity in games.
Yeah, I'm sure all the applications written will be 100% safe, polished and complete. No chance of installing trojans, bots, malware etc... Great fucking idea until the most massive DDOS ever hits the country, all coming from comprimised linux/PS3 zombies.
The irony will be tragic.
Top 10 Reasons To Procrastinate
10.
The operative word here is:
EDITORS,
n.
One who edits, especially as an occupation.
The point here is that they should at least attempt to correct the mistakes that someone submits. The simplest task should be to correct simple spelling errors. Such as; changing willcom to will come. I know they get a lot of submissions, but for they few that get selected, they should check that the spelling is correct. It isn't that hard to run a paragraph through spellchecker.
I'm sure I'll get modded down to Hades for this little rant. Maybe I should've posted as an AC, but I'll stick to my guns here.
"Plans are for fools! Oglethorpe, the plutonian (Aqua Teen Hunger Force)
Any computer, stereo, car, house, mp3 player, mail-order bride I buy will never be good enough, so I'm just not going to buy anything.
And any food I eat for lunch today just won't be enough to fill me tomorrow. So I'm going to stop eating, too.
If PS3 adopts Linux, it's an opportunity for linux to get noticed by the games industry. They might realise that there is a market left unexploited.
They might also realise that if their games use OpenGL instead of DirectX they can run on any platform, whether it's windows or linux. So there is *no* extra cost in supporting linux.
If all games were published on linux as well as on windows, and linux was an equavalent gaming platform, gamers would sure go with linux, instead of windows, cause you don't have to spend something like £80 for an OS. Instead you can spend the extra money you saved on your favorite games. And that's even more sales for game publishers.
I wish they could see that. Could this be the beginning of linux as a gaming platform?
VStrider.
And with that comment, I didn't even consider that the PS3 is supposed to use bluray, not DVD. SIlly me...
Downmix - The Artscene News Source!
If this is true, and they write some reasonable accelerated X drivers, they've more or less sold me on the PS3. Why?
One reason: MythTV frontend. It's hard to justify spending $350 on a console. Spending $350-$400 on a console that replaces a $250-$300 mini-ITX box... that's much easier to justify. You gotta figure that MythTV will be ported pretty fast to it, if the video and audio drivers are reasonable. I also rather like the idea of using MythGame to emulate other systems - really makes for an all-in-one entertainment system.
X-BOX 360 was definitely a competitor for my cash and home media network, but I just can't bring myself to deal with MCE. For all its benefits (easy setup, well-supported), it has niggling annoyances (lack of friendly open formats, multiple tuner issues, proprietary extenders).
-Erwos
Plausible conjecture should not be misrepresented as proof positive.
PS2 Linux was a disaster. First, it was ludicrously expensive - considering you were paying for a free OS. Then there was the whole fiasco about suitable displays - you could only play games on a TV, but only use Linux on a monitor (and one with a "Sync on green" facility too). And finally, they crippled access to all the interesting bits of the system too for good measure.
If that was their idea of opening up the system, then I don't hold out much hope for Linux on PS3.
KK: Linux is legacy, but it will be a start.
Legacy? Riiight. No Linux fanboy here, but I know bullshit when I see it.
In the case of the Cell, operation systems are applications.
Wah?
The kernel will be running on the Cell, and multiple OSes will be running on top of that as applications.
Bah?
Of course, the PS3 can run Linux. If Linux can run, so can Lindows.
Comparing kernels to distros here. Despite the fact that the latter is built upon the former.
Other PC Operating Systems can run too, such as Windows and Tiger (Max OS X 10.4), if the publishers want [them] to do so.
But the odds of Microsoft or Apple doing so are zero. So why say it?
I'm sure the guys clever. But he's not technical in the slightest.
I think Nintendo will manage to stick around, because no matter what the kids want these days or will in the future, there's lots of non-kids with disposable income.
I'm over my blood and gore phase, but I still like games. I'm guessing I'll be playing games for the rest of my life, and I'm interested in new and fun things. If Nintendo keeps producing good stuff, I'll keep buying it. And I think a good number of people will too.
One time I threw a brick at a duck.
Seriously, why? It's not like the addition of Linux on the hard drive is going to garner any more sales of the product.
What makes you think that is true?
To start with, some fringe people WILL buy the device if it supports Linux, that may otherwise have bought soemthing else.
Now consider the whole XBox hacking scene with stuff like media player and the like. If in the next round the PS3 supports Linux with no hacks, then where are the people working on those projects going to go? Probably the PS3.
Then fast forward a year later when you have multiple choices for media centers and other interesting programs running on the PS3 and no other game console. Don't you think at least a few people would be interested in this?
In my own case, I am probably going to buy a PS3 regardless. However currently I have zero interest in a PSP, which would change if I could program for it and turn it into a universal remote.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
Sad, but Linux just like video games is fast losing its "nerdy" qualities. Next thing is getting a girlfriend and than it's all lost... Linux will end up bald and with a beer belly.
"It is our choices, Harry, that show what we truly are, far more than our abilities." -- Prof. Dumbledore
I call your bluff -- ' v'½--Ç-Ø OE',' isn't a name at all! In other news, Slashdot (perhaps unsurprisingly) isn't very multilingual.
However, I did once know a Japanese lady whose family name was 'kyuuraku' as in 'long-lasting pleasure'.
I think it's one of those names awarded to artists and craftsmen way back when... they're getting pretty rare now.
There's a list of 4-character names here:
http://www.ipc.shizuoka.ac.jp/~jjksiro/4moji.html
Whence? Hence. Whither? Thither.
I think it would be cool if we could add off-load cards to our computer that programs could use when available. Much like servers can have SSL cards that they offload all cryptography too. Imagine a Cell processor on a PCI-X card, all graphics programs could use it (photoshop, 3dsmax, Edit) and even the video card could give it some jobs to do if it would be faster. While we're at it, lets take all the system memory and slap it in upgradeable cards. Why should the machine be limited to 2 Dimm slots. They already have cards with memory to run as harddrives (flash drives)
Yeah, I know... pipedream. I just think we should be able to add speed to our computer as easily as we can add capacity (memory, drivespace)
Do not meddle in the affairs of sysadmins, for they are subtle, and quick to anger.
Does this mean that the default games for the PS3 will include Tux Racer, and Penguin Hunt?
Saskboy's blog is good. 9 out of 10 dentists agree.
Just the other day I was ship-watching at a really noisy location with my foul-mouthed friend in the Navy and I said "HEY, YOU *$&%, IS THAT A DESTROYER?" and he yelled back "NO, CARRIER! *#&$!"
i'm so ashamed to have done that...
On the serious side, this is probably what sony wants to avoid. A lot of people were devoted to hacking the current consoles to run linux on them - and incidentally opened it up for piracy along the way. If it runs linux from day 1 there will be less people working to crack it. Won't hurt the big piracy orgs, but could stop a few of the smaller ones.
I am trolling
I disagree, 100 bucks for 40GB HDD, keyboard, mouse, network adaptor, custom linux distro, official pdfs on the internals of the ps2 including a manual for each chip seems like a good deal to me at that time(2+ years ago?). Concerning suitable displays, you could install out of the box on a ntsc, pal, or SOG monitor, through a controller cheat code, though this info was delayed, people were doing 'blind installs' on tvs. I understand that the latest homebrew development platform sps2 gets pretty close to the hardware. And I also use ps2linux to this day as a desktop.
I couldn't agree more. Besides the cost implications of having the HD come standard, I'm sure that Sony feels that the reception of the ps3 by the media and gamer community was so much greater than Xbox360 that they could safely take the hit in perception and still wind up a winner. An expensive gamble. I'd agree that ps3 probably has more buzz... but not THAT much more buzz.
You can almost hear the sound of mass high-fiving coming from Redmond. Not only does do they have the HD advantage, but there is simply no way that Sony is going to be able to put a cap on the royalty-free homebrew gaming exchange. My guess is that they figure the homebrew market wont big enough to be a concern, or maybe this is a move prompted by Nintendo (the rumor is that, like iTunes music store, indy developers will be able to create content for the Revolution's download service).
However, I still think Sony can change their mind. When they announced that the PSP would have 8 megs of RAM, the community balked and the developers were in a riot. A couple months of bad press and Sony revised the specs and upped the RAM to 32megs ("what? 8 megs? we never said 8 megs!").
Rest assured that if the media love-fest dies, or if the 360 gets too popular, sony will do an about-face. By then, however, the damage will be done on the first generation titles.