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Big Blue's Software Spending Spree

abb_road writes "IBM has gone on an aggressive acquisitions spree for document management packages in the past three weeks, spending more than $2 billion to pick up two companies. The companies, Webify and FileNet, are expected to become part of IBM's Information on Demand strategy. The acquisitions point to a larger industry trend: a focus on software for unified corporate data management. From the article: 'It's a crucial time to jockey for most-valuable-software-provider status, because companies want to buy more from fewer players, and they're tired of buying stand-alone pieces of software like customer-relationship management that don't fix real-world business problems. The new message to software vendors: Fix my call centers, don't just sell me a product. As a result, the lines are starting to blur between software companies that offer, say, Internet security, databases, and tools to manage nearly every part of the business. So, too, are the lines between service companies and software companies.'"

85 comments

  1. Oh, sure... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

    When IBM goes on a software spending spree, it makes the news. But when normal people go down the aisles at Best Buy and throw everything into their cart, THEIR spending spree doesn't make the news at all! Oh, the injustice!

    1. Re:Oh, sure... by tomstdenis · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Why can't these folks give me money for a change? Charities, other ceos, etc. Damn it I want a billion dollars to write OSS stuff :-)

      Tom

      --
      Someday, I'll have a real sig.
    2. Re:Oh, sure... by rubycodez · · Score: 1

      but poor IBM doesn't get any mail-in-rebate forms

  2. This comment by tka · · Score: 0, Offtopic

    is also under construction!

  3. Worthless by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Interesting
    I can't believe the money keeps flowing into IT, no document management solution is worth $2 million, let alone $2 billion. How long would it takes a team of 20 average slashdotters to code a full featured document management system? Let's say 2 years at $1 million each salary per year. Who here earns anything like $1 million a year?

    Don't even think of telling me that IBM are buying customers or market share! It's painfully obvious that the market is overvalued.

    1. Re:Worthless by Bozdune · · Score: 1

      I don't think this comment deserves "Troll." The poster has a point.

    2. Re:Worthless by pimpimpim · · Score: 1
      I agree with the parent, no mod points to untroll him unfortunately.

      Seriously. These firms make apparently only 1 software product, that is probably relatively complex, but no rocket science. How come that these two firms that I (as a general nerd, not someone working in the field) never ever heard of are worth a f**king 1 billion dollars each?!?!

      --
      molmod.com - computing tips from a molecular modeling
    3. Re:Worthless by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

      The value of a document management system is not in the amount of work that it took to code the system. The value is in the processes the business would have to do if it didn't have a document management system. All the paper handling. Shuffling carts of paper from floor to floor, department to department. Trying to find a document again in some filing cabinet, among rows and rows of filing cabinet.

      Many businesses and government agencies would simply not be able to function without this type of system. They know it, and the system providers know it. Hence the pricetag.

    4. Re:Worthless by Whelps · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Dude, do you realize how stupid you sound? FileNet has its flaws, but it is a full-scale enterprise application that has an enormous client base and it would be near impossible for 20 average slashdotters could create a rival an application that even comes close to gaining market share on them in a year or two timeperiod. Regardless of the quality of the application itself, a company's worth comes from its revenue stream.

    5. Re:Worthless by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I can't believe the money keeps flowing into IT, no document management solution is worth $2 million, let alone $2 billion.

      Document Management Solution - $2 mill.
      Above, with lifetime supply of hot chicks - $2 bill.
      Paying for it with somebody elses' money - Priceless

      That's all you need to know about business in the 21st century.

    6. Re:Worthless by huangpo · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Take this as constructive advice from someone who works in the field: what you don't know could fill a library (that's a building with books in it).

      You could try educating yourself first about Filenet before posting, but I forget; this is Slashdot. Filenet has a buttload of products; they also provide lots of consulting to go along with those products. BTW, consulting is IBM's bread and butter, if you didn't know. Filenet made $422 million bucks last year. At that level of income, IBM will make its money back in about 4 years.

      Sure, I'm a Filenet admin, so I'm biased. But I get paid pretty damn well for it.

      And it runs on UNIX. So there.

    7. Re:Worthless by putaro · · Score: 2, Insightful

      20 "average" slahdotters? About a million years. As far as I can tell the average slashdotter is not a programmer. 20 "average" slashdot programmers? Well, you can get a basic application together in a year or two. Then, you will continue to refine, improve, reduce. The big features actually tend to take the least amount of time. It's all of the little nice features that make a really polished product that take the time.

      In any case, as others have pointed out, FileNet was a functioning, profitable company with over $400 million a year in revenues. That's what you're paying for, not just the code. Flip it around. If you owned a company that was taking in $400 million a year would you sell it for $20 million?

  4. Or... by ReidMaynard · · Score: 0, Redundant

    IBM is just crazy.

    --
    -- www.globaltics.net

    Political discussion for a new world

    1. Re:Or... by Anonymous+Monkey · · Score: 5, Insightful
      Puts on Troll Foil Hat and says...I think IBM isn't the only crazy player in this field, because businesses are trying to fix something with software that is broken on the human side of things.

      Every job I have ever had has a pattern with IT: Our people aren't sharing information or documenting their work properly, lets spend X to upgrade our computers...Our people aren't sharing information or documenting their work properly, lets spend X2 to upgrade our computers...Our people aren't sharing information or documenting their work properly, lets spend X4 to upgrade our computers...and so on.

      People need to start being more organized before any data-management software dose a bit of good.

      --
      We are the Borg...
    2. Re:Or... by novus+ordo · · Score: 5, Funny

      Reminds me of this .

      --
      "You're everywhere. You're omnivorous."
    3. Re:Or... by 99BottlesOfBeerInMyF · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Every job I have ever had has a pattern with IT: Our people aren't sharing information or documenting their work properly, lets spend X to upgrade our computers...

      From my personal experience, people don't share information because it is inconvenient. I generate tons of documentation and information and people regularly ask me for info on something, which I provide to them. A lot more people probably want information I have, but don't know where to get it or how to find it. Why don't I make this more available and searchable to the whole company? It is inconvenient. Some is in CVS, some on the intranet, some on wiki pages and Websites, some in shared directories, and some just on my laptop. If our company had software to easily put it all in one searchable database with say a right click, and keep it up to date I'd do it. The problem is most CMS type systems, just don't work very well or easily.

      As for documenting, well I think we all know what causes that and it is almost always that documentation is not given the priority is should be, because it does not cost money directly or immediately to skimp on it.

    4. Re:Or... by andrewman327 · · Score: 1

      Considering the massive volume of data still being processed and stored in paper form, software does very little. Even information in databases is often printed for different reasons and stored. Especially when an organization has cheap or free interns (cough... government) it is cheaper in the short and medium term to work inefficiently than to seriously commit to digital integration.

      --
      Information wants a fueled airplane waiting at the hangar and no one gets hurt.
    5. Re:Or... by geobeck · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Our people aren't sharing information or documenting their work properly, lets spend X to upgrade our computers...

      Wow, I wish I worked for your company. With mine, it's more like: Our sales are down; let's eliminate our Marketing department to save costs. (Actually happened.) We're still not bringing in enough money (surprise); let's move half the downstairs people upstairs, and half the upstairs people downstairs so they can communicate better. (Happens twice a year.) Our computers aren't running fast enough; let's put some more software on them to speed them up... as long as you can find a magic freeware speeder-upper program that will make an eight-year-old Pentium 3 run AutoCAD 2006 effectively. (Shockingly little exaggeration.)

      *sigh* Two more weeks of this place... then freedom!

      --
      Find environmentally and socially responsible products on http://buy-right.net
    6. Re:Or... by cynical86 · · Score: 3, Insightful
      It may be a software/IT problem to acquire and require metadata to be stored with a piece of information, but how do you design an indexing scheme that makes it obvious how to index data and enforces consistency while still allowing meaningful classification? How do you create a culture where a user's time spent indexing and cleaning said information is considered well-spent and valuable in its own right? How do you get people to look for and use the data, however well-indexed it is?

      It's not like we don't have examples of classification systems that work. Finding a piece of information in a library might take a few minutes to locate a set of data, and then minutes to review material and find a fact, or hours or days to poll opinions and assemble an informed picture of the subject under investigation. Indexing schemas in document management are evaluated by how many clicks it takes to get to an already known piece of information.

      Or maybe it is that the business metrics applied to this sort of activity are based on the speed and volume rather than the quality of work? If a poor decision was made through a lack of information, was it the difficulty in locating this information, or was it a lack of will or desire to adequately research a decision before making it?

    7. Re:Or... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      that's very easy to say when you work for a small to medium sized company let's say under 1000 employees. when your company approaches 60,000 employees no level of human organization is going to allow people to find eachothers information very easily. taxononmy strategies will help when enabled by search based technologies. another area ibm is trying to play in. In large organizations the key is to be able to search across your document management solution then information management is truly enabled but first you need some sort of uniform document management solution in order for your documents to be indexed. imagine going to your company portal and being able to enter search criteria like say an email subject for an email you deleted and being able to find that on the intranet.

      to respond to another thread too...someone said why can't a few slashdotters write this code. the answer is writing this code is extremely hard, you're not just writing a document managment system, you're writing a workflow system, search with the capability of reading the security attributes, document retention rule set, and etc. see in the real world we have this thing called requirements and if you don't respond to them noone buys you're software.

      its amazing how people on slashdot are so ignorant of issues in large companies they only tend to see small organizational issues related to individuals.

      rant over

  5. Are we talking Lenovo? by wwiiol_toofless · · Score: 2, Funny

    If we are, then Mao is rolling over in his spartan, commie grave. If not, then I'd say this is just a software version of vertical integration, first seen thousands of years ago, in the 1920's.

    --
    the mods may say you posted flamebait, but to me it's a flame that warms my heart. rock on, brother! --chebucto
    1. Re:Are we talking Lenovo? by unix_core · · Score: 1

      You mean his mausoleum?

    2. Re:Are we talking Lenovo? by alienmole · · Score: 1

      Lenovo has nothing to do with IBM's software business. Lenovo just bought IBM's PC manufacturing group.

  6. I'm a little confused by truthsearch · · Score: 4, Insightful

    IBM definitely has the resources to create many of these software services themselves for alot less money. I think it's as much about buying these companies up before the competition can than getting the software.

    1. Re:I'm a little confused by bhmit1 · · Score: 4, Insightful
      IBM definitely has the resources to create many of these software services themselves for alot less money. I think it's as much about buying these companies up before the competition can than getting the software.
      Yes and no. They do have the people, but most are off consulting or supporting the existing product set, not developing new products. IBM has been making all their advances by acquisition for many years now. And seeing what the products look like when IBM builds them in-house, we are probably better off that way. Hint: what do you think happens when someone says don't build something new if we already have it, and they have lots of different tools? Lots and lots of ugly glue and a poor tech that has to learn 15 products to do something other places do with a single simple interface.
    2. Re:I'm a little confused by kevin_conaway · · Score: 2, Insightful
      And seeing what the products look like when IBM builds them in-house, we are probably better off that way.

      Oh, really?

    3. Re:I'm a little confused by gstoddart · · Score: 3, Insightful
      IBM definitely has the resources to create many of these software services themselves for alot less money. I think it's as much about buying these companies up before the competition can than getting the software.

      Well, companies have market share and customers. If you build from scratch, you have to go in and compete from the ground up. If you buy an established company, you then get to control the direction of that software, as well as instantly getting yourself customers.

      And, when fortune 500 buyers are looking at stuff, those reports from the Gartner Group go a long way. Basically, if your software isn't in the magic quadrant which makes it best of breed, you're probably not considered at purchase time. It goes a long way.

      Buying FileNet, they undoubtedly get a huge installed base, as well as the opportunity to further sell into that organization. (Never underestimate the value of credibly getting your foot in the door to sell all of your other products.)

      And, really, time to market and maturation of the software means that if you have the pockets, you can buy it sooner and possibly cheaper than you could build it. But, buying it means you get a salesforce, support infrastructure, and people who already know the software. As well as market recognition and whatever goodwill that has earned them from customers.

      I've been watching some heavy-duty consolidation in the markets for a few years. A lot of companies prefer to acquire than try to develop from scratch. So, you're partly right - it is about buying them before someone else does. But it's partly about being in a new market segment next month, instead of in three years with a rev 1.0 product. That's too long of a time when you're competing against people already established in the market. Because they will have moved ahead a lot in that time, so you'll always be playing catch up.

      Cheers
      --
      Lost at C:>. Found at C.
    4. Re:I'm a little confused by stevesliva · · Score: 1
      IBM definitely has the resources to create many of these software services themselves for alot less money. I think it's as much about buying these companies up before the competition can than getting the software.
      In the last quarter's earnings conference call, an analyst specifically asked the IBM CFO what form of acquisition IBM makes. Loughridge described the great majority as "accretive" almost immediately. There is little overlap with existing offerings, so the acquisition's continued growth does not cannibalize from the growth of existing competing IBM products. In other words, they're buying more revenue, more profit and more customers, not just source code.
      --
      Who do you get to be an expert to tell you something's not obvious? The least insightful person you can find? -J Roberts
    5. Re:I'm a little confused by bhmit1 · · Score: 1

      Yes, really. You do have a good example with eclipse, but I can find more than enough counter examples. I work in the systems management side, so my examples will be Tivoli biased. But one bad example is patch management. Yes, you're reading that right, 8 cd's to ssh to from one windows box to another and download patches from WSUS. And the product cannot be install on a system that has ever had any other IBM products installed before because of version conflicts.

      Another is the way IBM forced all the workload scheduler users to install the Tivoli Framework a few years back. There has yet to be a reason I can see for this. They already had a security mechanism to control logins before, and it's still there, but now it points to framework, so you have to configure a login in two places instead of one. Since then, the popular question on the mailing list has been "how do I fix Framework".

    6. Re:I'm a little confused by nostriluu · · Score: 3, Interesting

      IBM bought Cloudscape, which years later they released as Derby. Eclipse is a well designed product, but in effect they bought the developers who designed it (OTI, years ago admittedly, and they seem to work as a separate unit).

      In fact, IBM has bought most of their major products (Notes, etc) that I know of (I have no idea about the history of the mainframe stuff &c).

      This is all probably better than the "not invented here" syndrome, I would except that focused start ups are more keen to innovate, particularly on vertical apps, than workers in a giant company like IBM.

    7. Re:I'm a little confused by smallpaul · · Score: 1

      IBM definitely has the resources to create many of these software services themselves for alot less money. I think it's as much about buying these companies up before the competition can than getting the software.

      Software is only one asset of a company like FileNet. How about: brand, customer loyalty, domain expertise, market share, talent. Even considering just the software: it isn't really helpful to pay a half a billion dollars to duplicate someone else's product if you will end up being two years behind the market.

    8. Re:I'm a little confused by drix · · Score: 1

      Rational Rose comes to mind. They acquired that piece of junk when they bought Rational, and it still blows.

      --

      I think there is a world market for maybe five personal web logs.
    9. Re:I'm a little confused by Fafhrd · · Score: 1

      |Oh, really?

      Both Eclipse and Derby are the result of previous shopping sprees by IBM.

      Eclipse was developed by the IBM Ottawa Software Lab. This lab started life as OTI, a company which developed Smalltalk technology, that IBM bought in 1996.

      Derby is the open-source version of the Cloudscape DB. Cloudscape was a Java DB company which was acquired by Informix in 1999, which was in turn acquired by IBM in 2005.

    10. Re:I'm a little confused by SalsaShark42 · · Score: 1

      Almost--Cloudscape was acquired in 2001 via the Informix buyout, not the 2005 Ascential deal. There were 27 people focused on Cloudscape and within a week of IBM ownership, that number was whittled down to 9, then shuttled over to the DB2 Everyplace team. It took IBM a long time to realize the value of some of those Informix assets (and they still haven't figured out what to do with Red Brick), but they realized that Informix Dynamic Server is still a better-performing OLTP system than DB2 UDB and that Cloudscape has tremendous value all over the place...

    11. Re:I'm a little confused by Nerdfest · · Score: 1

      The traditional IBM approach seems to be to buy a software product, not improve it, and ride it into the ground, relying on people to keep buying it on name alone. I'm really hoping the open source stuff does not follow this path.

  7. More Crap for the IBM rep to push by BunnyClaws · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Dealing with the IBM rep is bad enough but now we will have to deal with them pushing their new products when I just want answers about the product I just bought from them. The only thing worse than this is when they "synergize" their sales force. I recently had a Symantec sales rep come in to discuss their Symantec Security Information Manager product and they sent a sales rep from Veritas. The only thing he could tell me was Veritas would make a great backup system. I had to tell him we already use Tivoli just tell me about the SIM product. Well you know sales people they don't take no for an answer until you kick them out the door. Well I am doing ranting.

    --
    "Anything tastes good if you deep fry it."
    1. Re:More Crap for the IBM rep to push by FooAtWFU · · Score: 3, Insightful
      Dealing with the IBM rep is bad enough but now we will have to deal with them pushing their new products when I just want answers about the product I just bought from them.
      I don't work for IBM (anymore! haha, byebye internship) but from what I've seen, IBM's focus is not on providing people spiffy software so much as...
      The new message to software vendors: Fix my call centers, don't just sell me a product.
      This is very much the direction they are trying to make things head - not a hardware company, not a software company, not even as "software as a service" company so much as a business company - they want to be "all sorts of IT and business services, including software and such to help keep things moving". They will gladly come in and show you all sorts of ways to change (ideally, to streamline) the way you're doing business. (If you pay them to. And I can't speak to their results one way or another. But would you like some links to spiffy promotional literature?)

      Hmm. Was the summary written by an IBMer by any chance? I don't see the words "on demand" or "business transformation" or anything like that, but...

      --
      The World Wide Web is dying. Soon, we shall have only the Internet.
    2. Re:More Crap for the IBM rep to push by cndrr · · Score: 1

      You sure you don't work for IBM anymore, buddy?
      Bluepages says otherwise...

      --
      cndrr
    3. Re:More Crap for the IBM rep to push by FooAtWFU · · Score: 1

      I turned in my badge and everything! Wait for the batch update. :)

      --
      The World Wide Web is dying. Soon, we shall have only the Internet.
  8. How is it going to integrate by eclipz · · Score: 4, Interesting

    The big question is, how is this all going to integrate? IBM already has it's own document management system that competes against FileNet in a lot of areas. So, is one going to go away? Or perhaps they'll continue to sell both and basically bring their credibility down for both. Not only that, but with FileNet phasing out one of their products and forcing their user base to upgrade, will FileNet lose a lot of their base because they don't trust that it will be around much longer? There are a lot of questions without much of an answer. Sure one hell of an impulse buy.

    1. Re:How is it going to integrate by halivar · · Score: 2, Interesting

      The goal is eliminate, not integrate.

    2. Re:How is it going to integrate by GoatMonkey2112 · · Score: 1

      Moving to something else is not a simple process. I work on FileNet based systems, but we are using a very old version. Even upgrading to the newer version of FileNet will not be a simple process.

      IBM stands to make a killing on the support contracts for FileNet. For even a medium sized company such as mine the support is very expensive.

    3. Re:How is it going to integrate by aafiske · · Score: 1

      Knowing IBM, it won't really, and they'll send out a dozen consultants to duct tape it together for you. It's hardly a surprise when a big consolidated software house says that big consolidated software is the way to go.

  9. Here's my thoughts... it is about time by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Because Companies want to buy more from fewer players, they are tired of buying standalone pieces of software like customer-relationship management that doesn't fix real-world business problems.
    I think that the new message to software vendors should be: Fix my call centers, don't JUST sell me a product.
    As a result, the lines are starting to blur between software companies that offer, for example, Internet security, databases, and tools to manage the business. Same with the lines blurring between service companies and software companies.
    If you were to add it up, I would say that it is a good time to be a software investment banker.
    New big spenders like IBM and HP are joining the ranks of Oracle, Symantec, and EMC.

  10. What is document management anyway? by Bromskloss · · Score: 0

    Huh?

    --
    Swedish plasma phys. PhD student; MSc EE; knows maths, programming, electronics; finance interest; seeks opportunities
    1. Re:What is document management anyway? by 0racle · · Score: 1

      Organizing your desk.

      --
      "I use a Mac because I'm just better than you are."
    2. Re:What is document management anyway? by pstorry · · Score: 3, Informative

      Good question.

      It's about control and structure.

      The usual question is "why can't I just use our shared mapped drives?" - so here's what you DON'T get from shared mapped drives that you do get from a Document Management System (DMS):

      * Metadata... Basic metadata on the document which can help searching, and can sometimes be sorted upon etc. The metadata often varies with the "document type" - so tender documents/procurement documents have an Account field, where meeting minutes instead have an Attendees field. Yes, this takes more time to fill in when saving a document into a DMS. This is why users hate the DMS. Business loves it, of course, because it makes things easy to find years later.

      * Structure... You create the overall structure, and nobody can change it. We've all seen file shares that have had no control - they become an impenetrable mess of folders, because everyone has their own slightly different filing system they're adhering to. DMS software allows an organisation to enforce just one filing system. Users hate that, too. ;-)

      * Conflict Prevention... Most DMS software has the concept of "checking out" a document, just like you would check out a book at the library. Whilst you have that document checked out, everyone can see you're working on it - and nobody else can check it out. This prevents two idiots^Wusers from applying changes to the same document. Checking a document out also allows for an audit trail to be built.

      * Versioning... Beyond the versioning that you get in Word - this is literally keeping a copy of every version that was checked in. You can usually also add a metadata comment for each vesrion when you check it in, to say what you changed. Often, you can even do this for each draft. Oh, by the way, being able to mark documents as either drafts or versions is also handy, and many systems do that.

      * Audit trails... Not your aneamic logs from an OS, but audit trails telling you who updated the document and when, often going back years. Very important in some environments.

      * Approval/Review Cycles... Workflow is a common extension to many DMS implementations, adn allows for simple approval/review cycles in which the checking out/audit trail/versioning features are combined to allow one person and one person only to approve or review at a time. Quite handy, if done well.

      * Records Management... Technically something else entirely, but records management often goes hand-in-hand with document management systems. Do all your invoices become unneeded after seven years? Fine - save 'em to the right place, and the DMS will handle that for you. Anything over seven years old simply gets removed, permanently, on a schedule. For you, this is useless. For a company GM's size, this saves hundreds of thousands of dollars every year. :-)

      * Searching... As alluded to above, most DMS software has a full-text search capability these days, and if it's "in the box" then it's one less thing to have to implement in your IT strategy.

      There's more, but you get the idea. It's basically there to control the way people work with documents, making sure that it's less likely to descend into a SNAFU where you can never find what you want...

    3. Re:What is document management anyway? by Vombatus · · Score: 1
      Shared Drives - Don't talk to me about shared drives.

      See http://www.naa.gov.au/recordkeeping/rkpubs/advices /advice70.html for information on why shared drives are a problem (besides the excellent list you have already given). Sometimes information is more readily accepted when it comes from a supposedly 'reliable' source.

      --
      This sig is intentionally blank
    4. Re:What is document management anyway? by pstorry · · Score: 1

      Nice link. :-)

      I work for a UK government-funded body, so we get the same sort of advice. It's all good, but selling it to users is pretty difficult at first. :-(

      I might just compare that link with our advice, and update accordingly. Thanks!

  11. Interesting point by Jerry+Coffin · · Score: 4, Interesting
    Reading this got me to thinking about a slightly different point -- one that's been niggling at the back of my mind for a while, but I haven't seen discussed much. Maybe that's just because to everybody else it's just to obvious to mention though...

    It seems to me that computers are progressively becoming less and less about computing, and more and more about simply storing and communicating data. A long time ago, IBM bought out Lotus software. Lotus became famous based on 1-2-3. It was the "killer app" that sold tons of DOS machines -- and oriented heavily toward doing computation. I'm not sure if IBM even still sells 1-2-3 or anything derived from it -- the big Lotus-derived products are Notes and Domino (I.e. storing and communicating data, not doing actual computing). In fact, you hardly hear about spreadsheets any more. Excel works, and a lot of people use it, but it doesn't seem to be a "killer app" for much of anybody anymore -- I'm pretty sure I haven't heard of anybody buying a machine to run it (or any other spreadsheet) in years.

    Now acquisitions (and new development) seem to be oriented almost entirely toward storing and communicating data, not toward doing any actual computing. The same seems to be happening in software development as well. Languages for doing real computation, like FORTRAN and Matlab are almost universally seen as boring and passe. Even languages like C++ oriented kind of halfway toward computation seem to be viewed as a whole less less than exciting, anyway. What's hot are things like Ruby on Rails. Of course, you can write computational code in Ruby if you want to, but I'm pretty sure nearly nobody uses Ruby to do things like matrix multiplication -- they use it for Rails, to set up web sites that talk to databases (storing and communicating data).

    In fairness, I suppose I should add that there are still a few "big things" oriented heavily toward real computation -- Folding@home and Seti@home for a couple of obvious ones -- and BOINC has a number of less obvious/well-known ones as well. Clearly computation isn't entirely dead and gone or anything like that.

    I'm a little uncertain what this emphasis on simply storing and communicating data really means though. Was most computing that involved real computation really just a fad, and people were doing it primarily because it was new and different? Is the current emphasis on data storage and communication really just a fad, and people will care a lot less about it in a few years? Is it a matter of the "computing" parts of things mostly being cured problems, so they're less apparent, even though they're really as important as ever?

    I suppose for this to be a proper comment, I should have a strong opinion to express about it, but I really don't -- at least for me it's almost entirely an open question.

    --
    The universe is a figment of its own imagination.
    1. Re:Interesting point by AutopsyReport · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Is the current emphasis on data storage and communication really just a fad?

      No, not at all. The current emphasis on storage/communication/collaboration is the due to the business world recognizing the capabilities of what computing can do for them. Most businesses are not interested in the computational power of computing as much as they are the expenditure-reducing, labour-reducing and capability-increasing power of computing. The present computations revolve around business logic. Typically the business world holds a much different perspective on how a computer is useful to them.

      Excel works, and a lot of people use it, but it doesn't seem to be a "killer app" for much of anybody anymore

      Excel was and still is a very powerful too. There really isn't a subtitute for it. Personal, business, and government all use it. Microsoft Office isn't popular by coincidence -- the Excel, Access, Word, etc., suite is very powerful for all categories of work.

      --

      For he today that sheds his blood with me shall be my brother.

    2. Re:Interesting point by smallpaul · · Score: 1

      Also: Excel is used as much for communication and data storage as it is for computation. It isn't as if an Excel spreadsheet is a stateless computer program. It's a container for data that can be easily transmitted and manipulated if necessary.

    3. Re:Interesting point by GoatMonkey2112 · · Score: 1

      FileNet is an imaging and workflow system. You are correct that it is not doing the processing. It is designed to integrate with your existing processing systems that actually do the work. The workflow piece pretty much tracks the process of how far along a work process is, even if it is a manual step.

      The imaging piece is made to store images of documents, especially in the case of businesses that are required by law to keep certain documents for a number of years.

      The thing is that many businesses already have the core computational pieces that they need already in place. Developers of FileNet applications have to find a way to neatly integrate these other things with FileNet, usually with a final goal of saving a company money. In certain businesses imaging and workflow easily saves tons of money over paper processes.

    4. Re:Interesting point by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The reason you don't hear about anyone using 1-2-3 or Excel anymore is that they are just doing it. It isn't new technology anymore and practically everyone knows what it does. This means less marketing and much les "buzz". What you hear about are things that are percieved as interesting or new.

    5. Re:Interesting point by mcrbids · · Score: 2, Insightful

      As technologies mature, they become infrastructure for other technologies, and slowly disappear from view.

      I remember a time, not so very long ago, when the very idea of a cellular phone was just electrifying. I watched the James Bond shows where he had a phone in his car with envy!

      Now, I have a cheap, reliable cell phone at my hip (pretty much) 24x7, and it's casual. I'm annoyed more often than not getting calls when I'm trying to get something done.

      The current emphasis on computing as a communications and data storage/retrieval engine is a consequence of the still fairly recent availability of the Internet. Sure, it was available in most areas in 1995, but you don't generally consider a 28.8 Kbps MODEM as "mature". DSL service is now hitting solidly in most areas, and represents the minimum degree of technology that could be used for reliable information storage and retrieval.

      So, the excitement is based around the new things that this technology makes possible.

      Give it 10-20 years, and the pendulum will swing back the other way, EG: "Now that we've been collecting all this wonderful data, how do we put it all together to show us what to do next?".

      --
      I have no problem with your religion until you decide it's reason to deprive others of the truth.
    6. Re:Interesting point by djk29a · · Score: 1

      I think the problem lies in the fact that computing software and hardware has basically solved the processing needs of most businesses from a computational perspective. Spreadsheets, word processing, and encrypting information are all most businesses really want that are computational problems rather than information storage and retrieval. The tougher problems like business process scheduling, supply line management, financial planning, etc. have yet to be truly automated because these are *gosh* very tough problems that generally seem to require some expert knowledge and are not even close to trivial to solve. If you [i]do[/i] have such software, you're likely a very large company. No small business can afford that kind of specialized software yet. However, if you give MS Office and Windows to most small-medium businesses they're pretty much set. IT for business has never been so much about processing information as much as storing and retrieving it in a predictable and reliable manner. Look at the job listings for DBAs and web developers (with SQL/DBA experience required) compared to the number of desktop application coders. Now look at how many of them are for full-time positions rather than contract / temp positions. So where is most information processing really done that's beyond trivial now? By the original business-oriented computers: people.

    7. Re:Interesting point by mstrebe · · Score: 1

      Congratulations, you've noticed that there are a billion times more trivial problems than there are hard ones.

      --
      aka Matthew at SlashNOT/!
    8. Re:Interesting point by raftpeople · · Score: 1

      Not only is your description accurate about business uses for computers, this has been the case since the mainframes in the 60's and probably b4.

    9. Re:Interesting point by OSXCPA2 · · Score: 1

      To speculate wildly, I suggest this is due to the changing nature of computer use - in the business world, where I earn my living, management is still learning lessons in computer use that researchers figured out a long time ago.

      Most business computer use *is* just about storing and organizing very dull data. Most accounting software STILL sucks (non-intuitive, complex UI; complete lack of interoperability; data lock-in; resource hogs...), fileservers are nothing but big file cabinets (and about as well organized) and document / content management is still in its infancy. These are the areas pretty much every company will be interested in, but they are areas where the relly gifted coders of the world have little interest in. So, we make due with whatever mess SAP, JD Edwards/Peoplesoft or Intuit feed us, and the IS groups (at least at my company) don't think about solving problems, but merely filter consultants and sales peoples' presentations for management.

      Conventional wisdom is that developing a project internally is way more costly than buying 'off the shelf'. If 'off the shelf' is generally bloated and crappy and the cost of using it is in worker frustration rather than direct dollars spent, well, that's ok - managers authorize purchases without having to use the beasts they buy, and no budget I ever audited had a 'Pissed off user / wasted time' line item, so no one will ever be held accountable for wasting employees time by buying a punishingly poorly-designed software package.

      So, puting a stop to the rant, the answer is that the user base is growing, but the intelligence of the technology user base is dropping, and therefore the expectations of that user base will drop, since they are less and less able to comprehend the true value in 'real computing' or figure out ways to make money doing such computing.

      Users are generally stupid and don't really know what they want or understand what they have. Gee, you could have asked any tech support person that one...

      YMMV.

  12. They just bought MRO Software as well by telemart73 · · Score: 1

    IBM paid just over 700mm for MRO Software last week. It's the best-of-breed maintenance management sytem in the market. I am very curious to see IBM buying up all these companies but their consulting wing does do a fair amount of work deploying Maximo and Filenet, so I see some synergy (to use a horrific cliche' from the 90s). ANyhoo, I'm hoping IBM increases the marketing exposure for MRO Software and their Maximo product. More sales means more value for my consulting services.

    1. Re:They just bought MRO Software as well by aapold · · Score: 1

      I'm an Maximo (MRO's main product) end user, kind of interested to see how this pans out. I see they're lumping it into Tivoli, which includes Websphere and DB2.

      For those unfamiliar, Maximo (from at least version 5 onwards) runs on an application server that is either IBM's Websphere or BEA's Weblogic, I don't have figures but I'd guess the majority of installations use the latter. This might be a worrisome development for companies that went with BEA instead of IBM. Also, the database normally runs on either Oracle or SQL Server, wonder if we'll see a DB2 version of Maximo in the near future.

      In talking with other maximo users, some have pointed out that IBM is more a service company than a software (or hardware) company these days, as such they may well be agnostic in terms of which platform to deploy on.

      Most also think that IBM went after them for their IT Asset Management portion of the MRO package, which is actually a relatively new field for the Maximo prodcut, it made its name in the industrial field, both for work order, maintenance, and asset management aspects. Some of the main parts of Maximo product compete with companies that IBM has agreements in place with, such as SAP.

      I guess time will tell how that sorts itself out. At MRO's yearly user conference, MRO world, held only a couple weeks ago at the end of July there was zero mention of this from anyone, though IBM did have a large presence at the event.

      --
      "Waste not one watt!" - CZ
    2. Re:They just bought MRO Software as well by telemart73 · · Score: 1

      There is a DB2 version already. The application is quite server agnostic, so I don't fear IBM pushing Weblogic out of the picture anymore than I would expect them to cease supporting the app on windows infrastructure. As far as why it's in the Tivoli group: the Tivoli group supports IT asset management, something that is an emerging market for Maximo. My only fear is that MRO loses focus on their bread and butter, which is serious maintenance management from asset intensive verticals, like utilities and facilities. I welcome our new IT Asset Management Overlords, but only so far as they don't neglect my power plant people...

    3. Re:They just bought MRO Software as well by Covener · · Score: 1

      I'm an Maximo (MRO's main product) end user, kind of interested to see how this pans out. I see they're lumping it into Tivoli, which includes Websphere and DB2.


      Neither DB2 nor WebSphere (the brand or the Applicaton Server) are a part of Tivoli.
    4. Re:They just bought MRO Software as well by aapold · · Score: 1

      The Tivoli division at IBM, not the product...

      If they aren't part of that division, then someone needs to update the Wikipedia entry on Tivoli.

      --
      "Waste not one watt!" - CZ
    5. Re:They just bought MRO Software as well by ArtDent · · Score: 1

      From said article:

      Tivoli Software is the systems management brand of the IBM Software Group. IBM purchased Austin, Texas-based Tivoli Systems, Inc. in 1996[2] and allowed it to operate as a wholly-owned subsidiary for a few years before forming the Software Group. In addition to Tivoli this IBM division includes WebSphere, DB2, Lotus Software and Rational Software.

      I believe "this IBM division" refers to Software Group, not Tivoli.

      Indeed, if you look here, you'll see the five IBM software brands are Information Management (for which I believe they used to use the label Data Management and the DB2 brand), Lotus, Rational, Tivoli, and WebSphere.

  13. Clearcase sucks! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    just my 2 cents.

  14. thousands of years ago? by CannibalSmith · · Score: 1

    0.086 thousands of years, to be precise?

    --
    being smart is exausting
    1. Re:thousands of years ago? by Schemat1c · · Score: 0, Troll

      0.086 thousands of years, to be precise?

      You neglected to factor in what a user once described to me as 'IT Time'. IT Time is when a tech tells a user, "I'll be back in 10 minutes.". That 10 minutes will actually be a minimum of several hours to a maximum of two weeks, at which time the tech flags the item in his queue as completed and then takes a 3 hour lunch break.

      I'll let you do the math.

      --

      "Nobody knows the age of the human race, but everybody agrees that it is old enough to know better." - Unknown
    2. Re:thousands of years ago? by wwiiol_toofless · · Score: 1

      talk about literal translation. It's like trying to joke around with Lt. Commander Data.

      --
      the mods may say you posted flamebait, but to me it's a flame that warms my heart. rock on, brother! --chebucto
  15. Bloat bloat bloat vomit by wsanders · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Document management is a technique for turning all the crappy little internal web sites in your company running Apache, PHPNuke, or some random blogging thing into giant bloated internal web sites with exactly the same content, overpriced on-site consultants, and $50K per year support contracts.

    --
    Give a man a fish and you have fed him for today. Teach a man to fish, and he'll say "WHERE'S MY FISH, YOU IDIOT?"
  16. New? by xdxfp · · Score: 1

    This has been the case for years. IBM has always specialized on "Enterprise Solutions" for businesses. Indeed, this is where IBM makes most of their money (not their consumer products).

    --
    HRESULT WinAPIGetSystemProcessThreadMetricsMenu...
    LibraryVolumeModuleHandlePtrEx(PHSPTMMLVM PHndl);
  17. Worthless-Perspectives. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    "Seriously. These firms make apparently only 1 software product, that is probably relatively complex, but no rocket science. "

    OK, since it isn't "rocket science". Were's the F/OSS equivalent, and why isn't IBM using that?

  18. IBM: PLEASE just trim some of the dead wood first by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    In terms of Content Management repositories, IBM now has ...

    DB2 Content Manager for Multiplatforms v8.3, then they got another busted up jalopy third wheel called Document Manager that rounds out the feature-starved Content Manager, then there's Content Manager for Z/OS, goofball plugins like VideoCharger for the last two, Content Manager OnDemand, OnDemand for Z/OS, Records Manager, Lotus Domino, Workplace and all that forms stuff, the Venetica acquisition, and I'm probably missing three or four more CM-like things IBM owns. And now, let's just throw in one more rusty battleship, FileNet.

    Each of those products is more or less not-integrated with one another. You've got Information Integrator 8.3 (formerly called Information Integrator for Content 8.3 (formerly called EIP ...)) which was/is the programming API and integration hub, which is a kludgy scary train wreck. Content Manager for Multiplatforms is the internal IBM solution, and (just like CM 8.3) it feels like it was architected by ivory tower folks and implemented by angry drunk Germans.

    The sales people at IBM are the best, but at this point the acquisition of FileNet only adds insult to their injury. What's their message gonna be now?? "You want Content Management? Why, we've got um ... 10 choices now, take your pick!" All of IBM's products are an integration NIGHTMARE, none of their products are turnkey, everything is crufty and old and flaky. The only thing saving IBM in the Content Management is that relevant competitors like EMC have lost their way (the wisdom of Documentum has been forgotten since the acquisition. Sadness.)

    I hate you IBM, you deserve to lose: DIE MONSTER, DIE! If only sweet little Magnolia could snag more marketshare! (http://magnolia.info)

  19. Um, you don't seem to understand "value". by Colin+Smith · · Score: 1

    Value is not cost.

    You may install and use a piece of software which cost $5.50 to develop but which saves your organisation $500,000 per year. Someone sells that software to you for $450,000. You save $50,000 on the first year and $500,000 per year every year after that. The vendor makes $449,994.5 profit on the first implementation and $450,000 profit on each subsequent implementation.

    What's the value of that software? $5.50? Bollocks it is.

    Cost and value aren't directly related and the reason you aren't earning $1 million a year is because you don't understand that, or if you do, you're unwilling or unable to exploit the knowledge.

    --
    Deleted
    1. Re:Um, you don't seem to understand "value". by blueOneDown · · Score: 1

      Nice point, but you are using an unrealistic cost model. Okay so the software costs $5.50 to write yourself. And we'll say the software saves you $500,000 a year, and has a price tag of $450,000. What you're missing is that blurring of the lines between software companies and service companies. You're CIO does the same math you do and he purchases the software plus a service package for installation, configuration and customization (generic software doesn't work the way your business works). Now initially the installation looks easy so we're only talking about a three month professional services deal for say 5 people at $100 hr (that's a project manager, the product manager, two custom install developers and a QA resource, notice only two guys will be doing any real work), That's another $250,000. Now during the discovery process (after you've written your first check for $750,000) everyone is surprised to find out that your physical data model is identical to the one used to develop the software so this will require custom code, and since we're customizing anyway lets throw in a couple of features that your managers really want. All of this requires separate requirements gathering phase, new design, a larger development and QA team, and probably a graphic artist or UI designer. Two years and $8,000,000 later you are rolling out software to the entire enterprise. Now your about to being realizing your $500,000 a year in savings... Of course, now you are on an old version of the software, and there is no easy migration to the new version because you went and customized it so much.

  20. Copy Kats by psybre · · Score: 1

    Wait, isnt this just what Xerox was doing in the '90s?
    ~psybre

    --
    Authority questions you. Return the favor. -- d474
  21. another uninformed pundit Re:Worthless by huangpo · · Score: 1

    What is obvious is that you have no idea what you are talking about.

    A document management system comparable to Filenet's offerings would require more than 20 man years to develop. If you disagree, then please go for it; Filenet needs the competition. Otherwise, STFU.

    Filenet provides more than just document management software. They provide a whole slew of products, as well as consulting services and support. Their document management, content management and workflow management products are used by 70 companies in the Fortune 100. Filenet is debt-free, flush with cash and is making money (~$422M in 2005).

    IMO, IBM got a good deal, and the market agrees with me.

  22. Re:IBM: PLEASE just trim some of the dead wood fir by cndrr · · Score: 1

    Don't say that too loud, IBM might acquire Magnolia next.

    --
    cndrr
  23. Software - Service by Mr.+Jaggers · · Score: 2, Interesting
    "As a result, the lines are starting to blur... between service companies and software companies."

    It seems to me that the F/OSS phenomenon is largely responsible for this shift. Think back to Cygnus, ISC, and other companies like them. For that matter, the early Red Hat years seem to fit that description, as well. Value-added service on top of a GPL'd stack is far from uncommon, these days, and often makes for a rather reasonable business strategy.

    Couple that with IBM's grand (and expensive) ongoing experiment with gnu/linux, and this sort of observation is hardly surprising. It will be interesting to see what tech from these recent acquisitions make their way out into the F/OSS community at large.
    --

    When I grow up, I want to have Christopher Walken hair.
  24. My how times have changed by NX-47 · · Score: 2, Informative

    IBM used to invest in it's employees as much as it did technology. Now, however, it's been paying for it's recent acquisitions by offshoring thousands. While I have no real problem with offshoring (it looks fine on paper), in practice it results in companies sacrificing real talent for less expensive labor. At some point, the pendulum needs to start swinging back the other way.

  25. Learn before you speak... by SalsaShark42 · · Score: 1

    This isn't Microsoft Sharepoint we're talking about here. This is a framework for managing unstructured content--that means forms, records management, business process management, content-centric workflow, email archiving and retention, regulatory compliance, web content management, imaging, search and discovery. FileNet spent 14 years building up their portfolio through acquisitions and development. IBM arguably invented document management in the 1960s and has been working on their Enterprise Content Management suite since the late 80's. Read the analyst reports to see how huge this market is. IBM picked up Informix for $1B in 2001--that grab was mainly for database marketshare. FileNet, at $1.6B, is a growth acquisition and a bargain by comparison. This market is so ripe for picking that SAP, Microsoft and Oracle--all companies that have ignored this space until the last couple of years, are making a headlong charge to grab what they can. EMC, IBM, SAP, OpenText, Microsoft, Oracle...and you say this market is overvalued? Do you know how much it costs a company when they can respond to a litigation discovery request in a timely manner? Do you understand the customer loyalty considerations when a company can put its electronic billing statements online? Do you know how much the Air Force saves by having its thousands of forms available electronically? These are just a few of the business pains that ECM solutions address... Just because content management doesn't have a mainstream mindshare yet doesn't mean it's minor league. You use FileNet and/or IBM content management products today, whether you know it or not...and don't think the big acquisitions are done. Microsoft and Oracle aren't just sitting on their hands going, "oh, that's nice"...

  26. Just part of a trend by Ian.Waring · · Score: 1

    IBM SWG's chief business issue is that they are hyper-concentrated at the top end - several hundred of their customers account for 90%+ of their revenue. They tell us that this available market is growing circa 2% a year, so the only way to increase market share in that segment is by acquiring other company's technology and customer bases... or by switching to more service orientated business (Business Process Outsourcing or Redesign is growing 100% a year at the moment). Or both.

    Same thing is happening for Oracle.

    They're also all looking over the fence at Small and Medium sized business, whose IT growth is 9%+ a year. So there's some effort to engage reseller channels to take them down lower, albeit more into the high-end of "M" rather than the "S" in SMB (in this case, Small and Medium size businesses). IBM are trying hard, other enterprise software vendors less so.

    So, all part of a general trend at the high end, where you get to embed yourself in business processes that are fairly core to enterprises hooked on spending lots of money. The more interesting things will happen once that consolidation has taken place, and the enterprise vendors really have to try hard to move down market to get growth.

    Ian W.