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Space Station Computers Partially Restored
Raver32 writes with the news that a partial restoration
of computer control was established on the International Space Station (ISS) Thursday. Systems controlling critical elements like navigation and life-support failed on Wednesday. "Flight controllers were able to re-establish some communication with the computers overnight, with Russian engineers working Thursday to restore the rest of the system, NASA space station flight director Holly Ridings said. The U.S. space agency and Russian officials are still trying to determine the cause of a failure affecting multiple computers in the Russian network ... Since an earlier failure on Monday, thrusters on the space shuttle Atlantis have been fired periodically to help maintain the station's position. The Russian and U.S. space agencies said they could extend Atlantis's mission by one or two days to fix the problem. In the worst-case scenario, NASA said the ISS crew members -- two Russians and an American -- may be evacuated from the station."
The computers are dead, not half alive as previously reported.
6 -15-spacewalk-three_N.htm
http://www.usatoday.com/tech/science/space/2007-0
Fascism trolls keeping me up every night. When I starts a preachin', he HITS ME WITH HIS REICH!
First spotted on the USS Lexington.
Lacking <sarcasm> tags,
They forgot to register their Vista ISS edition copy of Windows and their 30 day trial is over.
Of course, if we launched enough smaller ships to where we had multiple birds in the air at any given time, space for evacuation wouldn't be a problem. Just catch the next transport.
Which reminds me, did NASA ever get around to installing the emergency escape craft? I know it was supposed to be a stripped-down capsule, but I don't remember if they just decided to keep something docked at all times instead.
Javascript + Nintendo DSi = DSiCade
Get a clue before moderating.
Lacking <sarcasm> tags,
I simply replace one part at a time (hardware), or segment off functions (software), and then try again. If it works then I've narrowed the hunt down.
Of course, if one isn't permited to replace parts, alter functions, or even examine it unless you are Moscow ground control, then "Houston, we have a problem".
Think of it this way, if you where in the hospital on life support would you want the latest tech or something that powers a cell phone now adays?
Well, I guess we all know what OS they're NOT running!
This is what happens when these ungodly Hollywood types with hyperactive imagination give ideas to our enemies. Why did they show that one way you could sabotage the spacecraft of an alien race would be by uploading a virus and crippling the computer systems? Now see what happened once the Klingons got the picture, so to speak. They are using the techniques developed by us against us.
sed -e 's/Chuck Norris/Rajnikant/g' joke > fact
MOSCOW, June 15 (Itar-Tass) -- A fivefold over-voltage resultant from the unfolding of extra U.S. solar batteries caused a computer failure at the Russian segment of the International Space Station (ISS), a source at the Energia Aerospace Corporation told Itar-Tass on Friday.
1 633186&PageNum=0
"The power units of six computers of the Russian segment had a breakdown because of the over-voltage. The American partners unfolded new solar batteries on June 11," the source said.
The German-made computers withstood the 2.5-time over-voltage last September, when the first segments of solar batteries were unfolded. The June 11 over-voltage hit the computers hard, he said.
While experts are trying to reanimate the computers, new power units will be delivered to the ISS onboard a Progress freighter, Energia General Director Nikolai Sevastyanov told a Friday press conference. He said the new power units would be better protected.
The Progress will be launched two weeks earlier than planned because of the ISS situation. Initially, the launch was scheduled for August 6. The U.S. segment of the ISS will provide for the station's orientation in the meantime, and engines of the docked Progress will be used if necessary.
The ISS crew evacuation is not on the agenda, although a relevant plan has been drafted. Some of the computers of the Russian segment are still operational.
Source: http://www.itar-tass.com/eng/level2.html?NewsID=1
If you have a critical system that does everything you need and runs fine, never update it.
The Kruger Dunning explains most post on
Trusting your porn collection to the latest crap is one thing; trusting lives to it? Never.
Not to mention, show me the life support machine that needs, say for example, a core 2 duo processor with a GeForce 92842984984 Tritanium EE Xtremeeeeeeeeeeee. Adding unnecessary cruft and complexity tends to diminish relability, not increase it.
This is still a dynamic situation. Moscow only has line-of-sight communications with the ISS, so their interaction with the on-board computer system is limited to certain time windows. Over the last few days, the ISS computers have been going flaky, on and off. Since this article was written, they've completely died. However, as of a few minutes ago, they have successfully booted 2 out of 3 lanes in the terminal system, which is way more progress than they've been making previously. Just prior, they disconnected a power cable which extends to where the next solar panel array will be installed. This may have been the source of the problem, as the computers started acting up right around the time the cable was initially connected. If you're more interested in up-to-date information regarding the situation, don't turn to CBS. Try www.spaceflightnow.com (realtime updates).
Did it have anything to do with this woman hacking them with a baby monitor ;)
s _International_Space_Station_Rather_Than_Baby
http://digg.com/offbeat_news/Baby_Monitor_Monitor
Corrections always appreciated -- I make enough mistakes that Shannon's Theorem indicates a serious need for error correction.
Lacking <sarcasm> tags,
this is probably the most informative thing I've read on the situation at this point.
Watch, as all your tax dollars go down the drain.
Assuming the computers cannot be restarted in a day or two, the shuttle and station crew will have to depart. Without those computers, the station will be put in an ever increasing spin due to tidal forces. Once the shuttle leaves, it will never be able to dock with the station again.
Eventually, the orbit will decay and cause the station to enter an uncontrolled reentry. By uncontrolled I mean hundreds of tons of flaming white hot metal could end up crashing in a heavily populated area.
I hope it doesn't, but you never know.
don't Russian computers run on metric electricity?
* Winners compare their achievements to their goals, losers compare theirs to that of others.
Nice attemp at a cover up. We all know the computers were really confiscated by the RIAA for filesharing.
Do not try to read the dupe, thats impossible. Instead, only try to realize the truth
What truth?
There is no dupe
Why don't they just divert power from the shields to the life support system?
Every system I've worked on required redundancy for precisely that reason. And that's the real lesson to be learned from this incident. It's not about computers, or software, or even solar panels, it is about compromising the neccessary quality & efficiency, for outdated political & proprietary reasons.
So basically they fried the power supplies on a bunch of computers. Doesn't matter how 'clean' the voltage is, if there's simply more than the power supplies can take. Sounds like they're hosed unless they can install the software on other hardware and get it working.
:-)
Don't these folks have UPS or surge protectors?
-EvilMagnus
This was the question that was asked on a locally hosted talk radio show yesterday. I called in and explained that if it was an American computer, it would probably be running Windows. I asked if they had heard of the "Blue Screen of Death", which they had. I explained that deploying Windows in a life-support function would give new meaning to the term. Then the host, intelligent guy that he is, said, "But they could use a Mac". I said, "Or, better yet Linux".
"Do the Right Thing. It will gratify some people and astound the rest." - Mark Twain
David Gould
main(i){putchar(340056100>>(i-1)*5&31|!!(i<6)<< 6)&&main(++i);}
Hmmm, a current-inrush I can see, but over-voltage? Someone didn't study the blueprints. I'd say inexcusable, but hey, I'm
a NASA fan, so I won't. yet.
Toil is Stupid. Don't be Stupid.
Troubleshooting can be pretty difficult to do, and problems can be expected to occur on every system, but what's important is that you are permitted to fix the problem.
Car analogy. What if one day you got a flat, but the manufacturer had placed DRM locknuts in order to keep the tire on, which essentialy prevented you from fixing the tire yourself, without taking it back to the original dealer.
In that case, would you be content to listen to him blame how poor the roads are, or would you make sure the next car you invested in, didn't have a defective-by-design design?
attack
What idiot designed this system? Seriously. If this article is to be believed, then there were serious screw-ups at the very initial planning stages.
It shouldn't matter if there's 1 set of panels, or eight. The main trunk for the ISS should always operate at a constant voltage; the extra panels should only increase the available amperage.
If anything, extra panels should equal more stability, since it would be less likely to suffer a voltage drop when an appliance turns on.
Further, there should be regulators/surge protectors at the initial power coupling, in between modules, at the computers' power hookup, and within the computers' power supply.
Lastly, why the hell did they not account for this after the first spike?
Even *I* have a surge-suppressor on my expensive electronics at home...
This is a massive oversight. First, (I suppose) the Russians didn't have any sort of surge protection on their critical systems. Second, the NASA engineers didn't do their research and understand what effect plugging more power into the station would have. (It's Tool Time with Tim Allen...)
This seems like a really amateur mistake.
Does it make you happy you're so strange?
Wow.
Single-point-of-failure, anyone?
I wonder why they didn't all die, though.
These are my friends, See how they glisten. See this one shine, how he smiles in the light.
I suspect they had six machines on the same circuit (probably all in one of the Russian modules). One or more of those machines controlled the thrusters. They all got fried. The Russian control software probably works fine on any one of those six Russian computers ... all of which got fried. ;-)
They didn't all die because there's very few disasters on the ISS that would produce near-instantaneous calamity. This particular one means no thrusters, which isn't usually a problem ( gyros work for minor correction ) - it's only bad because if it's not fixed in time for the Shuttle's departure, the shuttle's undocking will disrupt the ISS's position beyond the gyros ability to compensate.
-EvilMagnus
...the last of the hopi indian prophecies will have come to pass...
"And this is the Ninth and Last Sign: You will hear of a dwelling-place in the heavens, above the earth, that shall fall with a great crash. It will appear as a blue star. Very soon after this, the ceremonies of my people will cease.
you think it's easy, but you're wrong...
Spaceflightnow.com (http://www.spaceflightnow.com/shuttle/sts117/0706 14computers/index7.html) is reporting that bypassing a suspect power supply (does not indicate what the power supply is/if it's related to the new panels or not) resulted in 4 of the 6 computers coming back up and restoration of 2 of the 3 guidance lanes.
I ain't buying this. Supposedly three redundant systems, a previous record of over voltage, and NONE of the three systems was protected with an airgap, ie, pull the plug until the new power situation was tested?
Me smell a ratski here. There is something they still aren't telling us, or there's some dumb clucks running things.
This being slashdot, I know the first thing everyone thinks about when someone says "computer" is "OOOOOH is it a windows mac or linux????" You're thinking way too narrowly about the definition of a computer. Chances are, they have a custom-made OS, or even no OS at all (i.e. no need to overclock)--the truster control software might just run directly on the CPU. In fact, the CPU might not even be what you usually hear--I'm quite certain it's not a modern Intel/AMD processor (probably more processing power than is needed). Actually I just did some research, and they just use a bunch of 386s (http://www.dansdata.com/spacecomp.htm), clearly nothing modern. btw, this doesn't at all imply that it needs to run a consumer OS.
...are not really all that Russian at all. They are actually built in Germany by the European Space Agency. and they use a radiation-hardened version of the Sun SPARC V7 processor called the "ERC32", and they run an embedded firmware system that runs on top of VxWorks.
That's right, they're basically Sparcstations running realtime unix.
Yes, almost as if they Hubbled it up.
Sorry about that, Edwin.
http://michaelsmith.id.au
"Surge suppressors" as found on your PC are not designed to protect against steady-state overvoltage. In fact, most don't kick in until three to five times line voltage. Even then, they only act to shunt surges across the line. With a constant overvoltage in their operating range, they will cook themselves and fail quickly.
What they could (and may) have done is have a crowbar circuit that would draw extra current when run above a preset voltage to cause any fuses upstream to trip.
someone brought Knoppix. How else did they get boot and communications? Too bad no one had one of those back when Lexington had to be towed back to port.
Friends don't help friends install M$ junk.
The U.S. space agency and Russian officials are still trying to determine the cause of a failure affecting multiple computers in the Russian network
I seem to recall that the Russians had a penchant, dating from the early days of their space program, to design, build, and use analog computers as either backups to main digital computers OR in embedded subsystems such as attitude control, oxygen generation, and the like. It is interesting to note that the failure occurred soon after a new solar panel installation was completed, thereby increasing the amount of current flowing across the power bus. Is it possible that analog computers that were taking a direct shunt of that power as an input could have been gradually fried under the increased load? An interesting question to be sure, perhaps a more well versed engineer among us can answer this one.
Does that mean they can't disconnect the new solar array? - Because they did
Does that mean they can't try a separate power supply? - Because they did
Does that mean they can't transfer functions to an alterante system? - Because they did
I am talking about artificial impediments to logical troubleshooting (like requiring the station be physically over the Moscow ground station before troubleshooting communication can even begin) and suggesting we ammend this faulty defective-by-design principle with one where we don't have to wait 2 days before we can get some feedback. Your snide little Dell remark is not constructive.
Why are these critical computers not located down here on planet earth where they are safer, more easily repaired and more easily replaced?
All they need up there are terminals and a good link to the computers down here.
A replacement 1541 5.25" floppy drive.
Things are lookng up. They jumpered around a power switch and the computers ran fine.
:)
Maybe there is a design flaw. They ought to have independant power sources. Any decent server has at least two power supplies, that can connect to independant circuits.
Anyway there is a lesson for all you software guys. Bad power can kill any OS.
Also never trust any technology more complicated than a knife and fork.
Assuming the worst case scenario plays out (ISS is abandoned and ends up providing a spectacular fireworks show), what will the knock on effect be on manned orbital space flight?
The Russians have no need to continue flying manned Soyuz without the ISS, and lets face it space tourism isn't at the stage where it could sustain their entire manned space program. The Americans are already in trouble with their manned program. The shuttle is only flying to finish the ISS - it would be retired tomorrow otherwise. CEV (the Shuttle replacement) is having all sorts of technical design problems with the launchers and is still only a 'powerpoint project', given it is really only a 'quick & safe' replacement for the shuttle - chances are it could get axed if there's no ISS for it to ferry people to.
Can't really see the Lunar/Martian missions happening either, at least not unless China makes steps that way.. and lets be honest their space program isn't going accomplish anything greater than what the russians (who they are copying) already have. So overall the way I see it, No ISS = No Manned Orbital flight for a long time?
...I mean....have all of them connected all the time, even during such a critical upgrade?? I think that might be covered under rookie admin 101 "lame things to never do". And that is just for your home network, let alone being up in freaking space where it is sorta dangerous and you might need to keep your wits about you. Do you really think all of those folks, all of them, just forgot to do that or didn't think it was important? What's the point of having a spare if you subject all of them to the same stresses all the time? It's not like strange errors tied to hardware issues are unknown in the computer world, along with the "stuff happens" universal constant.
If so, I say shut the whole project down, too many tards on board and at ground control. And that's the part I have a hard time believing, just too many engineers and scary smart guys involved with this thing, I just can't believe that all of them wouldn't think to at least temporarily shut down one of the backup boxes during a hot hookup. I mean, I have a couple spare machines kicking around the room here, and no way do I ever have all of them plugged in at the same time, I've lost machines before, but I know a full airgap means if my main machine fails, I *really do* have such a thing as a backup machine, and yep, I lost a machine that was on a surge protector before as well, direct lightning hit to the wire coming in = crispy mobo. And dumbass me never bothered to send in the warranty jazz for the surge so I had to eat it. Learned my lesson on that one..but I still had my older spare machine to get back online with too, because it wasn't plugged in and running at the time, it was airgapped.
I think they're using some of those bodged VAX knock-offs.
Lucky thing the fuel lines didn't explode.
My other car is a 1984 Nark Avenger.
Hm.. each is blaming the other. What else is new?
I don't need to test my programs.. I have an error correcting modem.
I remember doing a chassis assembly that included a MOV for surge suppression and questioning the design engineer about the part number since it looked to me like a 32 volt MOV in a 120 volt AC application. The reassurance that the part was correct plus the spectacular failure during the first power on test made for great conversation.
I have not seen crowbar protection used on the input side of a power supply but I have designed in cascode disconnects before. The power supply was rated for 48 volt operation but would accept 600 volts until the thermal limit was reached on the cascode pass element at which point the supply would disconnect itself. Protection above that was surge suppression.
Scotty: I dinna know if the power supplies can take it Captain!
Captain Kirk: Scotty, just do it now!
Scotty: Oh shit!
Captain Kirk: What is it Scotty?
Scotty: I dinna know if you realize that I wasn't FUCKING AROUND Captain!
Captain Kirk: I just got caught with my britches down and Khan isn't anywhere to be found. Where's Janice when you need her?
The End
Fascism trolls keeping me up every night. When I starts a preachin', he HITS ME WITH HIS REICH!
Crowbars on power supply inputs are common in automotive applications since 24V busses and positive-chassis vehicles are out there.
Haven't they heard of an power conditioner or UPS?
Seriously, I'll offer to buy them a Furman Strip out of my own pocket. Hell, I'll buy them two.
Whatever happened to manual controls?
"partially restored" means "they don't work" amirite?
Snowden and Manning are heroes.
Alternators are something of a special case since their output characteristics and high leakage inductance make it safer to short out the input side of the power supply then disconnecting it in the event that the battery goes open circuit. Automotive systems tend to be designed incredibly cheaply.
Good post!
An earlier post asked us to make a choice between new tech and cell phone tech....how about neither!
I read somewhere (Popular Mechanics I think) that a 1999 Chevy Impala had more computing power than the complete Apollo 9 spacecraft and launch vehicle.
Yes, they could have increased Apollo's computing power at the time,(and after missions) but they chose the most reliable/easier to hack by the astronauts (via ground control) systems that were available...not the most cutting edge by a long shot.
Another aspect is the hardware support of some older systems. I can't speak about ISS's spec's, but I know I have a ready market for OLD hardware with some industries and universities. Like 286's, 386's and 486's for equipment that was designed around these old computer systems, and the equipment is still profitable to run due to the expense of upgrading the computer systems and equipment.
An example is the gas spectrometer that runs on an old 286 cpu that sits in my workshop...I picked that up in a surplus auction amongst much other stuff on a pallet for $5.00 in 1996, replaced the cpu with another 286 from a PC in the same pallet), and had a working GS!
It cost the university mucho $$$'s to make the upgrade, but this kind of thing is still in a transition state.
Just a thought.
Down With Slashdot BETA!!! I've been around the corner and seen the oliphant; you can only abuse me from your perspecti
What are specifications of computers aboard ISS? what kind of computers do they have up there and how powerful are they? perhaps beowulf clusters of few of the astronomers would be enough calculating power and humor?
It's being reported in the news EVERYWHERE, except in the US. In a nutshell, the US panels fried the Russian computers.
I guess the details will come out of NASA eventually. But for now, the US media are deliberately covering up what happened.
The Atlantis crew better watch out for runaway equipment while they are replacing the AE-35 unit.
(1.21 gigawatts) / (88 miles per hour) = 30 757 874 newtons
The best is when IT security meets moderately-high-end science. I've heard of cases where operating systems have be desupported (think NT), and the knee-jerk reaction of IT security is to ban the use of the OS. The problem is that many equipment vendors didn't have software that ran on newer OSes. The knee-jerk response? "Well, just buy new equipment!" The only problem is that we are in some cases talking about $500k+ scientific instruments, whose purchase was based on an operational lifetime of a decade or two - not a few years of OS support.
The other problem is when IT isn't invited to the table at all when decisions are made to purchase said equipment in the first place. The only considerations are cost and scientific benefit, and as a result systems are often difficult to maintain after a few years when their attached computers become relics. That 286 might work fine, but if you can't attach it to the network to run backups you're suddenly increasing the costs of administrating the system significantly...
A three-person Soyuz (sp?) Space Capsule is docked with the ISS at all times, which is why the ISS never has more than three people on board unless a Space Shuttle is visiting.
When the Russians send up a new crew, the incoming Soyuz docks at another port, and the old crew returns to the Earth on the old Soyuz.
In this way, there is always a recently used Soyuz available to use as an escape craft or "lifeboat" in case something goes seriously wrong with the ISS (e.g., meteor impact, spilled Pepsi causing nuclear meltdown, etc.).
(Note: Posting anonymously in case I'm full of shit.)