Alienware Won't Sell Consumers CableCard PCs

An anonymous reader writes "Alienware doesn't think CableCard is ready for the mass market. The Dell subsidiary is coming out with some high-end Media Center PCs but won't sell them directly to consumers because the HD-enabling CableCard 'requires the expertise of a reseller and installer.' CableCard was supposed to be the savior for Windows Media Center, which has been held back by its inability to support high-def content. Alienware made its mark selling tricked-out computers to gamers, so it's telling that the company doesn't think its traditional geeky customer can handle CableCard without professional help."

Comments

It's telling, but of what?

[bigstrat2003]

Is this an indicator that CableCard really is awful, and should be avoided like the spawn of Satan?

Or is this an indicator that Alienware has been completely absorbed by Dell, and has nothing left of what once made it good?

I'm gonna go with the latter here, although the former may be true as well.

Re:It's telling, but of what?

[DaHat]

I thought it was an indicator of the paranoia of the content holders that refuse to let their pretties be broadcast in hi-def without some degree of onerous protection.

Re:It's telling, but of what?

[Arthur Grumbine]

To build off of that, and in response to the summary. Maybe it's not so much that the "traditional geeky customer" "can't handle it", as that they don't want to handle it, and Alienware knows this.

Re:It's telling, but of what?

[garcia]

Is this an indicator that CableCard really is awful, and should be avoided like the spawn of Satan?

Or is this an indicator that Alienware has been completely absorbed by Dell, and has nothing left of what once made it good?

Its an indicator of both of those things including the simple fact that Dell doesn't want to deal with any customer calling up to complain about the thing not working. Regardless of how many people can actually get it to work just fine, means that a good number of people won't and will call up and waste their CSRs call time fixing problems caused by clueless owners.

Re:It's telling, but of what?

[iminplaya]

I just thought it was they don't want it to get hacked.

Re:It's telling, but of what?

[Ash Vince]

If you want to get modded as a troll less often, try describing the problems you had in more detail.

Also try swearing less as that always helps too.

Re:It's telling, but of what?

[Maniac-X]

if by "traditionally geeky" they mean people who couldn't be bothered to *learn* about PC hardware, and would rather pay a rather high premium to have someone else do it for them, then yes.

Re:It's telling, but of what?

[cheater512]

Or the company who made it could be clueless.

Re:It's telling, but of what?

[Xichekolas]

More likely an indicator that Alienware no longer caters to it's original knowledgeable geek crowd.

I don't personally know anyone technically savvy that actually buys Alienware stuff. It's top of the line for sure, but if you are technically savvy you can build your own equivalent system for much cheaper. Alienware caters to the hardcore gamers that aren't necessarily able to correctly install a cpu/heatsink.

Before someone mods this flamebait, let me make clear that I'm not saying every Alienware customer doesn't know how to do this stuff, I'm just saying that due to the price premium it's more likely that most do not (or they would be building it themselves), and if the CableCard involves opening the machine, it would be a tech support nightmare for them to support these non-knowledgeable users.

Re:It's telling, but of what?

[Pollardito]

Regardless of how many people can actually get it to work just fine, means that a good number of people won't and will call up and waste their CSRs call time fixing problems caused by clueless owners. right, but if there's anything that Alienware knows how to do it's pad in lots of extra price into a high-end PC, so can't they just pad it a little more to cover the calls?

Re:It's telling, but of what?

[__aawkdb2598]

I bought an Alienware PC (I'm using it to type this post) a few years ago. I'd agree with GP, though perhaps with a slightly different choice of words.
Now, I literally would not buy from them if you payed me money to do it. It's just not worth it. "Best support in the industry"? Bull. My computer was an absolute lemon and Alienware did nothing to fix it except lead me around until my warranty expired. Plus they falsified my support records. Failing videocard? Only a few months old? Went down on the books as "Customer had loosely plugged in video card. Fixed." More like "Video card defective, about to explode." Which it did, right after my warranty expired. I've had just about every type of problem you can imagine with this machine, and Alienware has treated me like crap the whole time.
I'd never buy from them again, and the fact that Dell bought them cheapens Dell in my eyes, not the other way around.

Re:It's telling, but of what?

[Fred Smythe]

No, it's an indicator that the cable companies have been completely and totally incompetent with regard to implementing the CableCard standard. (At least, in the United States.) Mainly because they don't want to (they make a fortune renting you that cable box; why would they want to provide an alternative that removes that from the equation?) and nobody (and by "nobody" I mean "this incompetent corrupt government") is making them. I bought a Tivo HD last weekend. It took no less than SIX CableCards PLUS a visit from the cable guy to find two that worked. CableCard is a GREAT idea, that was completely neutered by an FCC on the take.

Re:It's telling, but of what?

[WhatAmIDoingHere]

"it's original knowledgeable geek crowd."

If you knew anything about computers, you'd not be shopping at Alienware. You'd be building your own or at least going to Falcon-NW or VooDooPC.

also, "it's" is a contraction meaning "it is."

Re:It's telling, but of what?

[wilkinism]

'the company doesn't think its traditional geeky customer can handle CableCard without professional help.' I think Alienware needs professional help.

Re:It's telling, but of what?

[Anonymous Coward]

and should be avoided like the spawn of Satan? I work with some people that think the spawn of Satan should be followed you insensitive clod!

Re:It's telling, but of what?

[Kadin2048]

right, but if there's anything that Alienware knows how to do it's pad in lots of extra price into a high-end PC, so can't they just pad it a little more to cover the calls? Doubtless some MBA somewhere in their organization decided that it's not cost-effective to do that; they can just refuse to sell them to consumers without impacting their sales significantly, and not have to deal with the additional overhead.

In short: Alienware knows that their customers are chumps (I mean, anyone with a clue isn't going to pay the Alienware premium), and that CableCard isn't mainstream yet.

Re:It's telling, but of what?

[HeroreV]

Alien fucking sucks. They always have. Now now, let's not be hasty. Alienware was getting pretty good reviews for a while back in the day. And they started sucking before Dell got to them, so it's not Dell's fault that they're so terrible now.

Re:It's telling, but of what?

[Antique Geekmeister]

It doesn't take an MBA. Customer support calls are very, very expensive to handle, especially when you get several hundred of them at once and you have to have a tech support who actually has a clue to help handle it. They can eat up your profit margin very, very quickly, especially if soome of the customers are really unhappy and start shipping the PC's back.

I've seen companies embrace exciting new technologies with exciting new business plans without actually testing them together, and it's often disastrous. It's also why building your own PC is so much fun and so educational, but you have to enjoy losing operation of your PC for days while working out how to get that hard drive controller driver into your OS's boot system and getting that video card to actually be used by your OS, even though the driver overwrites and breaks other software.

Re:It's telling, but of what?

[Charcharodon]

I think you second point is more valid. The truly geeky build their own rig, not buy a Dell.

Re:It's telling, but of what?

[mabhatter654]

CableCard on Windows can actually lock out our PC from using cablecards as well as the actual CableCard. Weren't there reports a few months ago about that?

That would mean the PC would have to be RETURNED to the vendor after so many failed attempts.... and they're LEGALLY BOUND by silly cable rules not to tell you how to reset the PC side to try again. It's quite nasty and poorly implemented even for Microsoft standards.

Re:It's telling, but of what?

[mqduck]

also, "it's" is a contraction meaning "it is." Apostrophe-S is used after a noun to imply ownership by that noun. The word "its" should be spelled "it's" but it's not for the sake of clarity, I guess (though without any logical justification).

Re:It's telling, but of what?

[DMUTPeregrine]

Alienware used to be the place to get a good computer with a cool case and not have to mod the case or upgrade the computer. It was a way for geeks to save time and still have a nice system, at the sacrifice of money. Now there are tons of cool case makers, most cases have tool-free installs, and it's not at all time consuming to build a computer. What used to take me 2-3 hrs (putting in all the screws, flipping the DIP switches for the IRQs, etc, now takes 30 minutes. Motherboard goes on the MB tray, which snaps in. Video card snaps in and the tool-free bracket holds it in place. HDDs are held in by brackets. Etc. Only my PSU actually has screws in the case. Faster, easier, and my case looks cool. AND, there are a lot more modding sites and case modding materials/plans available now. You don't have to do everything yourself, you can do a custom case mod much more quickly. Alienware's niche has been replaced by the case manufacturers.

Re:It's telling, but of what?

[Anonymous Coward]

His. Hers. Its.

None of them have apostrophes.

The English language is anything but consistent, but in this case it's pretty close with possessives. Had that actually been "hims" instead of "his" it would work better. Oh, and "it" (in this usage) is a pronoun, not a noun.

Re:It's telling, but of what?

[jellomizer]

I would go with the first... Even if it is targeted at the Techie Geek market it doesn't mean that these people are smart enough to use it. I have seen plenty of people who are self proclaimed geeks and techies, most of the I would say have average skills, perhaps a couple of points because they know what Linux is, not afraid of the command line, made a computer program once, followed instructions to hack a program, read slashdot or downloaded a tool that broke into someone else's computer. It doesn't mean that they are skilled enough to use this product yet, or if they take the time to figure it out they will deem the idea as bad and not go with Alien Dell, just because they released a product before it hit its potential.

Re:It's telling, but of what?

[Frantix]

I also think it's the latter... It's amazing that a company as Alienware, that caters to geeks, is afraid to release something that every geek would eat up. Then again I build my own systems because they add little value to a good system built inside of a nice case (like the Antec 900) that may not have that "Alien" look to them but works just as well for a hell of a lot less.

Re:It's telling, but of what?

[dcraigw]

The word "its" should be spelled "it's" but it's not for the sake of clarity, I guess (though without any logical justification).

Sort of how we write "his" instead of "hi's".

Re:It's telling, but of what?

[WhatAmIDoingHere]

The problem with tool-free is that when you're transporting your computer things tend to pop out. I prefer to at least use thumbscrews for the expensive bits.

Re:It's telling, but of what?

[foeclan]

What's more likely is that Alienware's abysmal technical support department couldn't identify a CableCard if an irate customer stabbed them with it. You couldn't pay me to buy another Alienware system. After dropping $3500 on a gaming laptop that's had numerous problems, and having had to register complaints with the Better Business Bureau and the Florida Attorney General's Office just to get them to replace a battery, I'm pretty much at the point where I'm going to build another desktop system and shoot skeet with my m9700. Selling it on eBay would just make someone else think it worth buying.

Re:It's telling, but of what?

[Technician]

Or is this an indicator that Alienware has been completely absorbed by Dell, and has nothing left of what once made it good?

It's more of a case of cablecard secrets and DRM. They are not going to pass any trade secrets along to end users. Read any of the CableCard forums for the problems. They are many.

From a Forum here
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=77 1387
Even if someone is to sell you the OCUR (CableCARD reader), it will not work by just plugging it in. You are going to be purchasing a new system if you want CableCARD.

I heard this before somewhere but no one has said why it will not work. Can you give me some details as to why this will not work in another system. Is it drivers, new mobo, connectors, etc....

Surely like everything else there maybe some hack/diy guide to install these in another system.

There are specific bits both in Windows and outside of Windows that are needed. The hardware itself is the smallest part of the picture. You can only get the other parts needed if you are a Microsoft Certified OEM (not System Builder).

Re:It's telling, but of what?

[Fulcrum of Evil]

No, it's not like that. It possessive is spelled its - English has its own funny way.

Re:It's telling, but of what?

[Fulcrum of Evil]

It's quite nasty and poorly implemented even for Microsoft standards.

My understanding is that most of this is on the cable companies - MS would like to implement something well, but cable doesn't care if it happens or not. This makes getting commitments rather hard.

Re:It's telling, but of what?

[mqduck]

Well, yes. I think that's what I said. I just also said it's "without any logical justification".

Re:It's telling, but of what?

[powerlord]

No. CableCard may be a bastard step child of sorts, but it works.

I've been happily using my TiVo, with CableCards, for the last 9 months. TiVo's underpinnings are Linux. Its been rock-solid. Yes, as far as the Cable Companies are concerned in my neck of the woods (NYC), a service tech had to come out, put the CableCards in their slots, and then call in the pairing information over the phone to someone else (who entered it in manually ... geez talk about a system that could be automated and let you enter information from home via a website and a customer service kit with a cable card in it).

I haven't had any issues with it. Its been working wonderfully.

If Windows has problems dealing with CableCards, then it is a fault of Windows (surprise).

Re:It's telling, but of what?

[mqduck]

Wow, are there really people with so little joy in their lives that they get their kicks silencing people for carrying on side discussion?

Re:It's telling, but of what?

[mqduck]

Sort of how we write "his" instead of "hi's". Do tell me what a "hi" is.

Re:It's telling, but of what?

[NateTech]

Agreed. Alienware moved away from the tech crowd long ago.

And someone will sell Cablecard PC's if they won't. The market corrects itself.

Alienware can continue their slide into uselessness, no one here will shed a tear when they're gone. Buh-bye.

Re:It's telling, but of what?

[Anonymous Coward]

There's just so many levels of wrong here, it's not funny.

Re:It's telling, but of what?

[jotok]

They were getting good reviews in the 90s.
This was also back when people thought HampsterDance was cool, c|net was worth reading, and everyone was, in general, gaga over how nifty the internet was.

It's kind of like how in the 70s people thought vinyl suits were neat, but now we generally know better, about everything.

Re:It's telling, but of what?

[lonester23]

Aliennware computers are so cheaply made and engineered. The company is also run by monkeys!

http://freagair.com/swapoid/p/search/search/100830 /6/

Re:It's telling, but of what?

[Anonymous Coward]

"...the company doesn't think its traditional geeky customer can handle CableCard without professional help."

Geeky customer? Geeks don't buy overpriced Alienware PCs, they build their own.

Re:It's telling, but of what?

[jamie(really)]

But the content holders are *not* the cable companies. How many of the content holders let you buy their content with much less painful DRM solutions? Er, all of them. I can get my Battlestar Galactica on iTunes. I can get movies on Blu-Ray or HD-DVD, both of which have been cracked. My opinion is that CableCard is a way for content holders to completely screw cable companies. Either that or the Cable Companies are just utter morons who thought they'd have a nice monopoly on distribution. Who knows. Whatever the reason, I no longer have cable. I just get what I want from the internet or the store. Good job cable card!

Re:It's telling, but of what?

[jamie(really)]

Anybody that thinks that cable tv is a sane way to distribute digital content in this day and age is a Neanderthal. CableCard was a stupid idea, if only because everyone required to implement it were the very people who stood to lose from it. If you think that anyone, let alone a government, could make a company successfully implement something so complicated when it really doesn't want to then you are a bit naive.

The beauty is that the content providers now have many ways to completely by-pass these maggots-in-the-middle, and they are happily doing so. I no longer use cable tv. Saved me $70/month, and I spend that on buying content that I actually want and own it forever.

Re:It's telling, but of what?

[mqduck]

Many, it would seem. It's okay, you can take your frustration out on me. 3

I must be missing something

[NeverVotedBush]

If the card even works, why can't they put together a manual that would allow users to get the things running? Do they not even work? What's the deal?

Re:I must be missing something

[Zondar]

There are many many horror stories out there from Tivo 3 and Tivo HD users about cable installers making 3, 4, 5 or more trips to get them working, or going through stacks of cards just to get two to work... The cablecard setup procedure *should* be as simple and seamless as a DirecTV authorization or a cable box authorization, but something's broken either in the process or the architecture.

Re:I must be missing something

[Joe The Dragon]

You will still need to call the cable guy anyways and even them they don't work that well.

Re:I must be missing something

[Anonymous Coward]

CableCard is a perfect example of why government shouldn't interfere in the free market. CableCard was created by the FCC in an attempt to do - well, who knows what. It's big government. Hardly anything they do makes sense.

In any case, it's an example of why big government and regulation is a bad thing. CableCard was forced on the cable industry by regulation: it's no surprise it doesn't work.

Re:I must be missing something

[MBCook]

I've got a Series 3 ( fanstastic device). I've read those stories. I offered to install the cards myself. I'm smart enough to stick two cards in two slots and call the numbers on them in. Heck, TiVo included a nice guide on how to install them... for the installers. That's how frequently cable cards were used last year when the Series 3 came out.

I had some decent luck. When I called Comcast after getting my S3 the person who answered the phone actually knew what a cable card was (which was an improvement of some of the stories I've heard). I set up an appointment and a week or so later when it arrived I got my cards. They did function to a certain degree (the channel mapping worked, for example).

That said, I couldn't watch certain channels (Discovery HD being the one that really got me). They twice sent out technicians to check signal level and other things. I had to confirm everything with them, and they discussed replacing the cards and everything. That's what the third guy came out to do.

He figured it out in 30 seconds on a hunch.

I didn't have HDTV. I could watch local HD channels thanks to the must-carry rules, but they hadn't enabled HDTV on my account, so the channels (which had great strength) were black (because they weren't authorized).

This despite how I upgraded my package. "I just got an HDTV and would like HDTV service." "So this will give me all you HDTV channels that aren't premium like HBO?", "And I'll get Discovery HD, right?"

I love HDTV. I especially love how Comcast really can't screw up the picture quality like they can with all my analog channels. But they managed to mess up putting two identicle PCMCIA cards into two identical slots and clicking the appropriate box on their sales screen for the package I specifically asked for.

I got off REAL easy compared to some others. This may be due to lack of complete and utter incompetence on my local Comcast's part. This may be due to me waiting a month or two after the S3 came out to buy it (so others already went through things). This may have just been the best luck I've ever had with Comcast.

I've setup at least a half-dozen DirecTV receivers over the years. Easy a pie. There is no technical reason I couldn't do the cable card install myself. The only reason I can think of would be they wanted the service charge. Worst case scenario, it didn't work and they had to send a guy out anyway. I'd have taken that risk.

Worse than the hassles of getting the cards installed are the prices for the things. I'm being charged a few dollars a month for each card, despite the fact both are in the same device (and there are two only because Comcast isn't using multi-stream cards, I'm guessing so they can charge more). Some people don't get charged at all (at least for the first TV). Some people get charged $10 or more per month per card. From what I remember reading it isn't consistent in operators. It seems to be up to the local Comcast, Time Warner, or whatever office how they want to handle it.

Considering those problems, the worries about copying (which is why the SATA port on the S3 hasn't been active and TiVo2Go and Multi-Room Viewing don't work, stupid Cable Labs) I'm not surprised they aren't rushing to let Windows Media Center boxes work, let alone Media Center boxes built by individuals and not companies like Alienware.

Re:I must be missing something

[NeverVotedBush]

Thanks for the information. My TV has a cable card slot but we don't use it. Probably never will unless they get this sorted out.

It seems like satellite is the way to go. I like my Dish Network and an IR blaster lets me tune channels, etc.

Re:I must be missing something

[Anonymous Coward]

i work as cable service technician, and i can say from much experience with them... installed/serviced probably somewhere between 250 and 300 cable cards in the system where i work, and they're awful. they do not work properly, and are very unreliable. i agree we need an open standard for third party hardware vendors, and cable card is nice in theory, however, we need something more robust, and preferably something that supports 2 way communication for interactive services.

now, i will say this, a shotty cable system can make cable cards even more of a nightmare. but i work in one of the cleanest and most state of the art systems in the midwest(went through a complete rebuild within the last 5 years). and they're still awful here. i would never recommend one, or install one in my own house.

Re:I must be missing something

[Ahnteis]

Umm... cablecard is a half-hearted effort by the media companies to comply with legislation that requires them to make cable available without the need for a set-top box. If it weren't for the legislation, they'd just require the box (and charge your for it) and leave with a "Screw you and your PVR."

Re:I must be missing something

[Buran]

There is an unofficial way to get the eSATA port to work although I'm waiting until the official updates allows it to happen before I do it -- I don't want to lose data. But considering how much History Channel I watch, I hope it's soon because next month I'm getting History Channel HD in my area and I watch a lot of stuff on that channel.

However, the delay isn't CableLabs -- Tivo doesn't need their explicit approval to turn on the port.

Re:I must be missing something

[TheBigBezona]

I have heard enough of the horror stories to believe there must be some real issues out there, but my experience getting the two cable cards (via Comcast) installed in my my TiVo S3 was totally painless.

The installer simply followed the TiVo instruction sheet, called in the numbers and they worked properly the first time, and have been entirely glitch free for 9 months.

Perhaps I am just very lucky.

Re:I must be missing something

[Anonymous Coward]

preferably something that supports 2 way communication for interactive services.

No way fucker. I don't want you shitballs to be able to fuck with my equipment remotely. My computing capabilities shouldn't require sending data back across the cable.

Re:I must be missing something

[RpiMatty]

http://www.maximumpc.com/article/ocur
Maximum PC ran an article about trying to get a cablecard installed into an Alienware rig they got to review.
Didn't get it working. They were hoping the bugs would be worked out before consumers could buy them... guess that didn't happen.

Comcast Tech: Hey, this is ** from Comcast. I'm trying to hook up a customer's PC to our system, but I can't get it to work. Can you help me out?

From the article
Microsoft Guy: Yeah, well, we don't have our tiered tech support set up yet, but I can try to walk you through it. What are you hooking up?

CT: Well, he has two computers, one from Voodoo PC and one from Velocity Micro.

MSG: He's got both those machines?! That's $13,000 in computers!

CT: Yeah, he's reviewing them. He's an editor at Maximum PC.

MSG: Oh.... Sh*t, they're supposed to tell us before they send those things out to the press.

CT: Both these machines have internal OCUR cards, too; I've never worked with the internal cards before.

MSG: [Still unaware he's on a speakerphone] Yeah, those are really tricky. But don't tell the guy that, or he'll write it up. You're gonna start seeing Dells like that come through your system like crazy.

Re:I must be missing something

[Telvin_3d]

As someone who has worked in related retail I would like to comment on why they insist on a technician doing the install. They know that many of their customers can do it themselves, make no mistake about that. However, if they even give the option a large number of their customers will take that to mean that they should be able to install it, all evidence to the contrary. A certain percentage of the population is never going to admit that they need help. And let me speak from personal experience when I say that it is almost imposable to grasp the amount of damage that can be caused by someone who thinks they know what they are doing.

From a business point of view, it is easier, cheaper and less hassle to set up everyone than it is to deal with the repercussions of the few who screw up their own installation. As one of the people who could do it myself I don't particularly like it, but if I was running the business I would make the exact same call.

Re:I must be missing something

[|Cozmo|]

I just got the new tivo HD yesterday and it took me an hour on the phone with comcast to get the 2 cablecards working. The first one worked fine in a couple of minutes but the second took almost the entire time. Both cards were the first I had picked up, and are both working fine now. I would hate to see the trouble any 'normal' person would have getting these things working. The instructions with the tivo were pretty much nonexistent.

Basically the process is to stick in the card, call the cable co. and read them the IDs off the screen on the tivo. The cable co. sends the signal to your box to program the cards for whatever channels you're supposed to get, then you repeat with any additional cards.

Re:I must be missing something

[mkraft]

I can't speak for other devices, but the S3 was designed to be idiot proof. There is only 2 places to insert the cards with a big label saying which slot to use first. Basically if someone can make toast, they can install a cable card. After that the software does the rest. A screen pops up with the numbers that need to be given the the Cable Company.

It's impossible to insert the cards in backwards (they won't fit) so the worst someone could do is not figure out where to put the cards or call the wrong numbers in. In which case Comcast could send out a technician. There's no reason to not allow customers to install it themselves.

My experience has been that the reason probably is more of a training issue. My CARDs lost provisioning (completely my fault) and I figured I'd call in to give Comcast the new pairing numbers. Well it took 4 calls, speaking to a manager (who told me I needed a service call) until I finally found someone who would take the pairing numbers (after originally telling me it wasn't possible and then only after I verified my last 4 digits of my social). The whole technical process took a few minutes, yet I had spent hours on the phone. This indicates training or policies problems more than actual user intelligence problems.

Re:I must be missing something

[subterranean]

You might think from reading about cablecards that advanced skills are required to install them. It is NOT TRUE. There is no need for an installer to come out at all other than to attempt to confuse the customer about cablecards. The installation process is easy. You plug in the card(s) and phone in 2 number sequences per card. The entire process should take at most 20 minutes or even less if you are lucky enough to get cablecards that do not require an automatic firmware update. The reason that you want an installer that is experienced with cablecard installs is that they know how to work around the obstacles put in place or not addressed by the cable provider. Unlike a pcmcia network card for your laptop, cablecards do not get pulled in and out of computers repeatedly. That is why I cannot understand how the cablecards that were used for my Tivo install were scratched and dented like a 5 year old pc card. The installer told me that he was initially given a cablecard with a piece of cardboard taped around it to hold it together. No joke. Here is some advice for anyone who is thinking about taking the HD Tivo plunge:

• When the installer calls right before showing up, make sure you verify that he has 2 cablecards and has experience installing them in a Tivo.
• Write down the cablecard and host (tivo) id numbers found in the tivo cablecard host/device screen. The installer will read these back to the main office to activate the cards.
• If you are not getting expected channels, make sure the installer contacts the "DNS" office to make sure that the correct signals have been sent out to the cablecards.

Re:I must be missing something

[Charcharodon]

A manual, A MANUAL?! That would go against all that is good and holy in the tech world. That would be like asking for clear and concise instructions on how to set up a router.....pure blasphemy

Re:I must be missing something

[IchBinEinPenguin]

And let me speak from personal experience when I say that it is almost imposable to grasp the amount of damage that can be caused by someone who thinks they know what they are doing.

What did you break?

Re:I must be missing something

[Znork]

"a perfect example of why government shouldn't interfere in the free market."

Exactly! If the government didn't interfere in the free market with legislation such as 'copyright', this wouldnt be a problem.

Without such government interference, consumers and hardware vendors would simply figure that the whole conditional access crap of cable networks was too much of a pain, dump it, and simply use torrent capable media devices that accessed trackers with the whole worlds media on them. Instead of a paltry selection of what someone else thinks you should want to watch, you'd have the whole library of everything humanity ever made at hand to choose from.

Re:I must be missing something

[Rakshasa Taisab]

Basically if someone can make toast, they can install a cable card.

That's the problem right there; people who know how to make toast trying to install those cards. Someone is bound to stick a fork in there or worse, try to make toast.

Re:I must be missing something

[Rich0]

Well, in theory Tivo has to keep them happy - otherwise cablecards will no longer work with Tivos. The beauty of the system - explicit hardware pairing...

Re:I must be missing something

[enjo13]

Just bought the new HD Tivo, and had comcast out here to install the cablecards a few days ago. It was... fun.

The tech who came out had never done an install before. He got the cards in, and then called in the numbers to Comcast. Nothing happened. It took a bit of internet searching on my part to find the diagnostic information needed for me to know that the card was working (it tuned properly), but that something was wrong on their end since it didn't succesfully pair. I walked him through the process of getting things fixed, he re-read the numbers to Comcast central, and then magically everything just sort of worked.

It took 1 trip and about an hour and a half. I think the system itself looks like it's working ok. But the training for the technicians...s*u*c*k*s. Which isn't suprising, Comcast invested huge amounts of energy in talking me out of my decision to go the cablecard route. I only did it because the quality of their PVR's was absolutely laughable. We went through 3 boxes in 5 months.. and the last one didn't actually function as a PVR (changing tuners or rewinding/skipping caused the thing to freeze). I tried to get the entirety of the PVR service refunded for the last 6 months... was able to only get a month out of them. Screw Comcast.

Re:I must be missing something

[rollingcalf]

"CableCard was created by the FCC in an attempt to do - well, who knows what."

Wrong. CableCard was created by CableLabs, a private organization run by the cable TV industry. The FCC didn't mandate CableCard; they only mandated that something be available that allows consumers to buy compatible third-party boxes instead of having to rent the box from the cable companies. The unreliability of CableCard is the cable industry's fault, not the FCC. The cablecos could have designed CableCard better or chosen another technology.

Re:I must be missing something

[petermgreen]

In other words the fcc forced the cable companies into doing something they didn't want to do and so they did a half assed job of it.

sounds about right.

Re:I must be missing something

[powerlord]

Congratulations on making the jump to TiVo.

Yeah, the Cable companies boxes usually are pretty sucky. Glad you were able to get your CableCards installed, thats usually the biggest hurdle and completely depends on your location (they don't train the techs except through "On the job training" usually).

I was lucky. The guy came out and said he's been doing about three to seven installs a day (for the past three months, this was back in November).

Re:I must be missing something

[OMEGA Power]

Right, we would be so much better off if the government hadn't interfered. Then instead of having CableCards that still have technical issues (mostly caused by the cable companies themselves) but work most of the time we could still be forced to pay to rent converters from the cable company and have no option to purchase hardware or use Tivos or other devices not provided by the cable company.

But, I'm sure the free market would correct that even though it didn't at any time between the invention of cable TV and FCC CableCard mandate going into effect.

Re:I must be missing something

[Binkleyz]

No mod points, but a virtual +1 Informative...

Re:I must be missing something

[daveywest]

I work for a cable operator who just installed their CableCard system. We're in a small market. Our multi-stream card rental is $2 -- exactly the same price as our analog boxes. CableCard is a failed attempt at consumer protection. The idea that you would go to Best Buy and purchase your converter box is crazy. We aren't even one of the "evil" national cable operators, and we are still gettting the exact same income from rental fees.

People still buy from Alienware?

[Anonymous Coward]

Most people I know who were avid Alienware customers just stopped purchasing from them the moment they were bought up by Dell. Most power gamers don't want to be associated with Dell in any way. So I'm surprised that Alienware is still relevant. I would have thought by now that most gamers would have avoided them.

Re:People still buy from Alienware?

[untaken_name]

Most power gamers don't want to be associated with Dell in any way.

That's odd, there are quite a few hardcore gamers I know that work at Dell. They don't seem to have any problems being associated with Dell. Maybe your experience isn't universal. Not that I'm claiming mine is. Most power gamers I know wouldn't have any problem using an Alienware system; they just don't want to pay the premium for it. Of course, I doubt that most gamers are power gamers, and I would be extremely surprised if Alienware's install base has EVER been heavily power gamer. There just aren't enough of them to keep a company profitable. Now, casual gamers, on the other hand...

Re:People still buy from Alienware?

[Smauler]

That's funny - most power gamers I've _ever_ known did their own hardware. People who just wanted a decent gaming system without any hassle went to places like Alienware.

I'm kind of a power gamer, but I wouldn't touch a pre-made system because I know and enjoy the hardware. If you don't know what you've got and don't know how to manipulate it to your advantage, you lose a bit, and thus lose a bit as a power gamer.

If you've got money to burn, and are a power gamer, by all means grab an Alienware system every 6 months. If not, look into the hardware, and have a great system for a lot longer than that, like all true power gamers do.

Re:People still buy from Alienware?

[thesandbender]

Dell gaming rigs are good machines.

Dell gaming rigs loaded up with all the crap that Dell puts on them suck. The first thing you do with any machine from a top tier vendor (or possibly any vendor for that matter) is reload the OS and just the software you need. And I'm speaking from years of dealing with Dell machines as an IT director at a small consulting firm and IT support for friends and family.

Re:People still buy from Alienware?

[untaken_name]

Yeah, that's pretty right-on. Dell machines work just fine, once they're re-imaged. I find it telling that Dell's new small business offering uses a lack of bloatware and trialware as a SELLING POINT...considering that they were among the pioneers of that very movement, and the consumer machines still have it.

Yeah, and??

[Anonymous Coward]

/. has posted numerous stories about CableCard not being ready for primetime, and being a serious PITA to get working, with comcast in particular.

The only really surprising thing about this is that AlienWare cares enough about it's customers to not sell it.. AlienWare makes great hardware, but their customer relations SUCK. Anyone that's paid for their on-site 3-year support plan and tried to get them to actually come on-site can pretty much confirm that.

I wonder

[gen0c1de]

Really is it they don't think that the consumer understands how to use a CableCard, or is it they are getting paid not to, so that the cable companies can keep selling there sub-par TV-top pvr system to the masses? You know cable companies, thinking of the bottom line.

Re:I wonder

[cadfael]

ok, as a cable industry insider, no. Cable card SUCKS for the MSO's, as they are more expensive, they don't work easy (costs money to roll trucks), etc. If you want to blame anyone, look at the FCC who mandated separable security for set top boxes. Cable Card set tops can triple the price that SA or Moto charges the MSO (and trust me, they will pass that cost on to you).

Say what you want, but Cable Card is NOT the desire of the MSO.

Re:I wonder

[Planesdragon]

1: What the hell is an MSO? Common etiquette is to explain terms that your audience may not understand, and industry-specific jargon is pretty much the reason that rule exists.

2: The FCC says "It must do X." YOUR industry can't seem to figure out how to make it do X. The blame doesn't lie with the FCC, it lies with your industry.

Re:I wonder

[OhPlz]

MSO = multi-system operator, which is a company that provides cable television service to more than one community. Comcast, Cablevision, RCN, Rogers, Videotron, etc are all MSOs. A community that provides their own cable services wouldn't be an MSO.

Re:I wonder

[forty7]

ok, as a cable industry insider, no. Cable card SUCKS for the MSO's, as they are more expensive, they don't work easy (costs money to roll trucks), etc. If you want to blame anyone, look at the FCC who mandated separable security for set top boxes. Cable Card set tops can triple the price that SA or Moto charges the MSO (and trust me, they will pass that cost on to you).

Say what you want, but Cable Card is NOT the desire of the MSO. A valiant effort at misdirection, but here's the truth: MSOs don't want CableCARDs because there's no specification yet for two-way host devices, and therefore they don't work with VOD and PPV. CableCARDs represent a loss of revenue not because they're "hard to install" (they're not), but because those customers are then unable to use extra-cost services

Re:I wonder

[Anonymous Coward]

The thing is that they *need* their *competitors* at the cable company to *cooperate* in order to make it seem like the cablecard isn't a cheap piece of crap. (which it is, it's just a decryptor for something that shouldn't have to be encrypted anyhow). How many cable companies do you know that are above saying "buy our stuff and it'll work, but this other stuff is just aftermarket junk, unlike our quality product"?

Sure, you and I can push a PCMCIA card into the slot and call in the numbers but when it doesn't work, the fingerpointing starts and the vendor doesn't want to accept returns on hundreds and thousands of perfectly good cablecards just because the cable techs can't get their act together.

Oh, and the cable company doesn't want to see a cablecard in anything programmable by the end user. Linux box? forget it, unless it's tivo-ized. Media PC? Well, they can sue Microsoft so maybe....

Re:I wonder

[Icculus]

Common etiquette is to explain terms that your audience may not understand [snip] The FCC says

FCC? what is that?

AlienWare

[Enderandrew]

AlienWare markets to the rich enthusiast community who enjoy gaming, but who aren't geeky enough to build their own rigs. Perhaps the same holds true for the home theater PC market. The knowledgable, geeky crowd can build their own LinuxMCE box on the cheap with MythTV. The crowd that doesn't feel comfortable with such things wants to just buy it and have it work. If CableCard requires extensive knowledge, then perhaps they've placed themselves outside of any real niche market.

Re:AlienWare

[kaiborg]

mod parent up!

Alienware isn't for computer enthusiasts, it's for spoiled kids that think they know something about computers because they can recite technical specifications off of a website. Truth is, Alienware doesn't put anything in their systems that you can't buy and install yourself for half the price.

Re:AlienWare

[vux984]

Truth is, Alienware doesn't put anything in their systems that you can't buy and install yourself for half the price.

Not entirely true. At one point in time at least, they were one of the very few places to get a really performance oriented gamer friendly laptop.

The offerings from HP, Toshiba, IBM, etc at the time simple weren't in the same league and/or the options were extemely limited, and you usually had to compromise more. Building it yourself was pretty much not an option (and still isn't).

But as for their desktop line, yeah, it was nothing you couldn't build yourself for less. I don't disagree with you there. But that's true of every brand-name PC-builder.

Alienware isn't for computer enthusiasts,

Right. Computer enthusiasts build their own.

it's for spoiled kids that think they know something about computers because they can recite technical specifications off of a website.

Say what? No. Its for *gaming enthusiasts* who want to buy computers that are going to be good for playing games, without having to become a 'computer enthusiast' to do it.

Not everyone who wants silky smooth responsiveness in state of the art games wants to know how to swap a CPU, install an aftermarket heatsink, set memory timings, or choose a power-supply. They just want to play. Alienware satisfied that niche quite nicely.

Re:AlienWare

[geckofiend]

Except those people that run MythTV will never be able to use a CableCard and thus never be able to record anything other than Over the Air or QAM HDTV.

Re:AlienWare

[NoMaster]

AlienWare markets to the rich enthusiast community who enjoy gaming, but who aren't geeky enough to build their own rigs.

Hell, there's a whole spectrum of "gamers". From bottom to top, it ranges like this:

1. Gamer who knows his rig is 1337 because it's from AlienWare, and he read on a forum once that AlienWare m4k35 l337 rigz. Wonders why he keeps getting his arse kicked in WoW, so he buys a new rig every 3 months to get the latest video card he read about on Tom's. That extra 1/4 fps will make all the difference...
2. Slightly more 1337 than (1); still buys AlienWare PCs but only every 6 months. Between times, he takes it to the local PC chop shop because the PFY there can open the case and change the vid card without breaking the warranty seal.
3. Buys AlienWare PCs, but can change own video card. May also be able to change CPUs and heatsinks if they come with an A1-sized instruction sheet with lots of pictures, or a how-to DVD. Works part-time in the local PC chop shop, where his greasy skin comes in handy for unsticking warranty seals.
4. Owns an AlienWare PC - well, the case is still AlienWare; everything else has been replaced over the years. Used to work at the local PC chop shop - until some greasy pimply-faced kid offered to work for 5 bucks an hour + first crack at any porn found on customer PCs. Is now a counter-prop at the local Geek Squad.
5. Never bought an AlienWare PC, but owns one - made up from all the 'faulty' parts replaced at the local Geek Squad, where he is one of 3 trainee managers. Is currently on the lookout for a 10,000RPM 500Gig SATA HDD, so be careful...
6. 'Serious' gamer. Refreshes Tom's and Anand's every 5 minutes looking for the latest reviews, before ordering on-line (and sending the vendor emails every 5 minutes wanting to know why it hasn't shipped yet when he checked 'Priority Shipping'). Can replace his own video card, CPU, heatsinks, LED-equipped fans, and biohazard-shaped fan guards. Often also encountered on motherboard forums asking how to recover from a BIOS flash gone wrong, and bumping his post every 10 minutes.
7. Builds own PC. Sometimes gets into trouble with incompatible RAM or dodgy chipset drivers, but can generally work things out for himself. Continually installs the latest video drivers, but almost inevitably ends up dropping back to the previous version.

Note: only the last type might have a chance at getting something tricky like a CableCard working...

Re:AlienWare

[Dachannien]

Alienware doesn't put anything in their systems that you can't buy and install yourself for half the price.

Except CableCard receivers, apparently. I (and, I'm sure, bunches of other people out there) would positively love to get my hands on one of those suckers, but you have to be an OEM selling a DRM-wrapped, CableLabs-approved system in order to get them.

Re:AlienWare

[MrWa]

Can LinuxMCE use CableCard? How do you record protected HD cable content using MythTV?

Re:AlienWare

[Enderandrew]

Honestly, I don't know. I'm seriously considering looking into a home-made Linux based media center PC, but right now XBMC on my hacked XBox, and my cable box provide everything I need without spending any money on building a new PC. Cox, my cable company only charges me $5 a month for DVR service, so I haven't felt the need to really look into any of that yet.

I love running emulators and apps, not to mention a media server on my TV via my XBox. Honestly, my main desire in a media center PC wouldn't be in recording HD cable shows for free, but rather adding apps to increase functionality.

if alienware would have just

[Anonymous Coward]

lawnmowers are for heros, comic books are for zeros. face it silly boy.

Re:Um

[the unbeliever]

two seconds on wikipedia yields this link, sir :

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cable_card

Lrn2srch

Re:Um

[LordKazan]

it is supposed to be the tuning and decryption module provided to consumers to allow them to use their premium digital cable services, including all HDTV (because pretty much nobody broadcasts unecrypted QAM). It was mandated a decade ago and CableLabs has figured out how to delay a decade and when they finally make it available they don't even comply to the law because it cannot really be used by anyone making home-brew systems.

I couldn't be bothered to read the whole summary..

[benhocking]

So I thought it was an indicator that people who "install... Windows ... [need] ... professional help," although maybe I'm taking part of that out of context.

Re:Um

[RobertLTux]

it was supposed to be a way for folks to buy %random manufacturers units and then your local cable company can load the crypto needed to unlock your channels

but the problem is that these cards have DRM that slags the card if you so much as breath hard on the card oh and setting up the card requires talking to multiple techs and CSRs

Re:Um

[Anonymous Coward]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cablecard

Use google next time before asking, dumbass

Dell doesn't want support nightmare

[Anonymous Coward]

Has anyone used a cablecard with their local cable? What was the support experience like? I suspect since they feel the FCC shoved it down their throat, it might not be the best. My comcast says they support it, but it requires a tech visit and you lose on-demand, pay-per-view, and the channel guide. Perhaps dell doesnt want to get in the middle of that mess.

Re:Dell doesn't want support nightmare

[kannibal_klown]

I just had 2 technicians come in last week to install them in my Tivo HD.

The actual work took maybe 2 minutes, and if I had the cards and a phone number for support I could have done it myself. The thing is they can't do everything on my end, they have to call the office, read off some ID numbers from the diagnostic screen, and wait for the person on the other end to activate them. Unfortunately the person put them on hold for 15 minutes, then didn't know any of the procedures, and refused to pass them to someone who did. So after waiting for her to pt them off hold they had to step her through it from memory. They were annoyed at her to say the least.

So 2 minutes of work took 45 minutes. They work fine, but there's a glitch on my Tivo HD that Tivo is working on: random pixelation. They have it narrowed down to people that use a specific brand of CableCard (for the most part) and are hoping to fix it via a software update.

They said it doesn't matter, in a few months BestBuy and the like will be selling Cable Boxes in the stores, but they say they're cheaply made.

Re:Dell doesn't want support nightmare

[Kevinv]

I use 2 cable cards in my Tivo Series 3. The cards are from Time Warner. Installer came out, put them in, brought diag info via Tivo menus (or I did that part) called Time Warner, had them activated then left. My premium channels didn't work, I called support they reset the cards and everything started working.

Time Warner requires a site visit (and charges for it) but I thought it totally unnecessary, he didn't do anything difficult.

Disadvantages to cable cards: OnDemand and Pay-Per-View doesn't work (the cards can't report usage back to the cable company ). If your cable system has implemented Switched Video (the channel isn't streamed to you until you request it) cable cards don't work with that either, again because bi-directional communications aren't possible.

Re:Dell doesn't want support nightmare

[glitch23]

Has anyone used a cablecard with their local cable? What was the support experience like? I suspect since they feel the FCC shoved it down their throat, it might not be the best. My comcast says they support it, but it requires a tech visit and you lose on-demand, pay-per-view, and the channel guide. Perhaps dell doesnt want to get in the middle of that mess.

I've never used a Cablecard but my local TimeWarner talks about them on their website so I presume I could try them out if I wanted. The current specification (version 2.0 I think) is a one way communication to you which is why you lose the on-demand and PPV. The next spec is supposed to change that. I'm guessing you lose the guide because of other reasons such as the fact that the software is in the receiver and not able to be stored on the card but that's just a guess.

Re:Dell doesn't want support nightmare

[Randseed]

Has anyone used a cablecard with their local cable? What was the support experience like? I suspect since they feel the FCC shoved it down their throat, it might not be the best. My comcast says they support it, but it requires a tech visit and you lose on-demand, pay-per-view, and the channel guide. Perhaps dell doesnt want to get in the middle of that mess.

Here's my story, eerily similar to what others have posted here:
I have a machine at home which is (primarily) a Linux server with about 2.5TB of hard disk space situated in a RAID-5 array. The processor is a AMD X2 5000+, and it has 4GB of RAM in it and a top of the line Nvidia video card. (Why did I buy this? As a research data and number crunching box for bioinformatics, and I had the forethought when I bought it to go ahead and get a decent video card. The drives only cost me something like $750 total.) I also have a 42" plasma TV and cable service from the local company. When I bought this, I wasn't quite aware of all the cable card crap. What I figured, naively, was that if I subscribe to cable, I could get a TV card and MPEG encoder, and use my machine as a MythTV box when it wasn't otherwise occupied.
So I move, and sign up with the local cable company. It's then that I find out that I have to either go through the Cablecard mess, or use their sub-shit TV-top PVR, because their channels are encrypted and I can't just plug the feed into a capture card. The only reason for them to do this is to restrict people recording their shows, but their PVRs and the DVRs that use the Cablecard do that anyway. So what is the point?
So the result? Sure, I watch the channels (obviously, or I wouldn't be paying for them). I watch the video-on-demand. But when I want to keep a long term copy of something (read: fair use) or record it so I can watch it during my long nights on call when sometimes nothing happens, I have to pirate the damned thing off the Internet -- precisely what they were trying to PREVENT. I would prefer to do it my way -- hooking the computer to my damned cable feed.
The media companies need to buy a clue and figure out that the old distribution models are not dying, but dead.

I don't understand

[wamerocity]

why Alienware was all that popular. They are another Clevo/Quanta/Compal/etc. shell distributor. They are no different than Sager or any other local company that rebrands the shells as their own. My problem with them is that they charge a LOT more for the exact same system, because they think it looks cooler, and therefore must be cooler. In Salt Lake City, we have another company that I hate called PC Laptops that has radio adds about how their computers are the FASTEST ON THE PLANET! The sell the exact same shells as Sager and Alienware but add 1000$ to the price for Lifetime service. The only difference is that the other people's systems don't have the painted exterior and the alien head symbol on it. What's funny, is that if you buy these systems from a do-it-yourselfer website, you can get the same system AND and new 300$ HD TIVO for less than a stocked Alienware. But then again, I like keeping my money.

Re:I don't understand

[Shados]

Its fairly simple. Alienware appeals to people who want an above average system, without wanting to know what makes an above average system. I used to be a do-it-myself guy, and honestly, if I used my usual hourly rate, the time I spent looking up parts, benchmarks, what works well together, etc ended up being a FEW times more than the markup on alienware (or any other similar enthousiast pre-built), god forbid I assemble the computer myself. So its just easier that way.

Now, not saying I'd buy an alienware -today- (they don't seem to take as much care in their system specs as they used to), but thats kindda why they got popular.

Re:I don't understand

[Smauler]

I actually just created the system I would like on a UK website. It came to £1100 or so (excluding building, I think they charge £100 or so for that). I checked the same system (with options, making them lower categorically except for their windows install) at Alienware, and it came to £1700 or so. I'm not going to accused of shilling for this website, so I'm not going to say the name.

Alienware are expensive, but what they do do is important, I think. They emphasize the importance of getting a decent graphics card if you do now or ever will play a game other than solitaire on your computer. Most PC's sold now will play modern games very poorly. This makes people think that everything's progressing so fast, that they can't keep up, and have to buy a new PC every year. What is generally the case is that they're sold a decent computer with a crap graphics card.

I'm still currently using my AMD 2100+, with my ti4200. I'm not a luddite, I know it's old and obsolete, that is why I am getting a new computer soon. However, I did some research on which card and processor to buy _years_ ago, and now I still can play lots of modern games (my old 64mb ti4200 performs better than some 7x series cards in some games). Like I said, I am getting with the times now, but I'm making sure I buy sensibly.

Anyway, I'm going to build my PC - Firstly, because I can't get the exact configuration I want with pre-built systems (eg Alienware don't offer a RAID 5 system that I know of). Secondly, because I can get the system I want cheaper than a close approximation to my system. And thirdly, because I enjoy building cool systems.

Each to their own, anyway.

Re:I don't understand

[srmalloy]

As an illustration of the premium you're paying for Alienware, a couple years ago I bought a Clevo D900K laptop from Leadcomp (branded as ProStar); the same laptop ODM design, configured identically, from Alienware was $700 more than I paid, and the only difference was that I had a square 'ProStar' logo on the top instead of a blue Alienware case top. Must be really high-grade plastic...

Dude, It's A Dell (not an alienware machine)

[Bob9113]

Alienware made its mark selling tricked-out computers to gamers, so it's telling that the company doesn't think its traditional geeky customer can handle CableCard without professional help.

Alienware made its name that way. Dell made its name by getting ultra-cheap components built in lots of a million, thus undercutting competitors on spec/price, but producing machines that are unsatisfactory to geeky customers. Frankly, if there is a person who used to buy Alienware gear who is now willing to buy a Dell, just because of the brand name, they need to seek professional help.

Cable card in brief and explanations

[ThundrNeon]

Alienware isn't selling Cablecards for a few simple reasons. 1. Installation requires your local Cable company to come out and install the card as they have to do specialized setup similiar to when you first get digital cable turned on in your place for the first time. 2. Cable card is supported in very few select large cities/metropolis. 3. Even in cities where Cable Card is supported it often cannot be installed properly and does not sync up to channels properly from the cable company. (I remember this from an older slashdot article that was reviewing HTPCs, if I can find the article I will link it) For the Record a Cable Card is a Card designed to fit in either a TV or a PC with a Cable Card slot. It acts as a Digital tuner and is designed to replace set top digital cable boxes.

Re:Cable card in brief and explanations

[forty7]

It's quite clear from your list of "reasons" that either you've never actually used a CableCARD, or you're a cable company shill.

By way of refutation:

1. Installation only requires your cable company to come out because they say it does. The entire installation procedure consists of:
   1. Insert card.
   2. Call in pairing information. This consists of a couple of numbers found on a screen automatically displayed by your host device.
   Any deviation from those steps is almost certainly due to the incompetence of your cable company.
2. CableCARDs are supported everywhere by every cable company (with a few rare exceptions. The FCC mandates that cable companies (including Verizon for their FIOS service) will provide CableCARDs to any customer who asks for one.
3. Again, this has more to do with the cable company's incompetence that it does with the general bugginess of the CableCARD technology. It's true that the newer M-Cards are known for being more buggy than their older counterparts the S-Cards, but even this is somewhat overexaggerated.

I've been using CableCARDs in various host devices for the past year and a half, and I've never had any trouble with the cards themselves. I've had three separate installation experiences with two different cable companies, and while the most recent experience was an absolute horror story, that was entirely due to the company's screwed-up policies and unknowledgable install techs. The other two installations went perfectly.

Most of the purported "problems" with CableCARDs are cable company FUD, pure and simple. It's true that you lose support for VOD, PPV, and interactive program guide, but for many cable customers, these aren't a problem (especially those whose CableCARDs are installed in third-party DVRs). But it's a huge problem for cable companies, who generate tons of revenue from those features.

Re:Cable card in brief and explanations

[Osty]

1. Installation requires your local Cable company to come out and install the card as they have to do specialized setup similiar to when you first get digital cable turned on in your place for the first time.

That's what the cable companies want you to think. I haven't tried using CableCard, but my "installing" my HD STB was as easy as going to the local Comcast store and picking up a box. I phoned ahead, they scanned the box onto my account, I brought it home, plugged it in, and it Just Worked(tm). There's no reason that a CableCard should be any different.

In fact, I'd go so far as to say that the cable techs are incompetent with respect to setting up HD equipment. The last time I had a tech actually touch any of my stuff, he ended up misconfiguring the outputs of the box such that I couldn't actually get any HD content to my TV. The channels all worked fine, but the "installation" was botched. As soon as he left, I rewired it all to work properly. Of course that was back when HD was supplied by a side-car box, so the installation was a little tricky. The current Moto boxes are trivial -- plug in the cable, plug in your component/DVI/HDMI/Firewire cable for output, plug in your S/PDIF coax cable for audio, and you're done. Use the front-panel menu to configure (upscaling for SD channels, what resolution to use for HD channels, etc).

2. Cable card is supported in very few select large cities/metropolis.

CableCard should be supported anywhere that digital cable is offered. To the cable company, a CableCard should look no different than any other STB with the minor difference that it only allows one-way traffic (oh noes! I have to call teh Comcast to buy my PPV pr0n!).

3. Even in cities where Cable Card is supported it often cannot be installed properly and does not sync up to channels properly from the cable company.

That's usually either bad hardware or bad installation. There's no excuse for either scenario except that the cable companies want you to think CableCard sucks. If you're currently using a digital STB, there's no reason why a CableCard shouldn't work just as well in your house.

Re:Cable card in brief and explanations

[azrider]

In fact, I'd go so far as to say that the cable techs are incompetent with respect to setting up HD equipment. The last time I had a tech actually touch any of my stuff, he ended up misconfiguring the outputs of the box such that I couldn't actually get any HD content to my TV.

When my dad had HD installed (bought a 42" LCD), the installer told him that he:
1) Needed the component video cable.
2) Could only hook the STP directly to the monitor.
This, despite the fact that the original (non-HD) STB was hooked (S-VHS video and digital optical audio) to the receiver and working fine.

Dad ordered the requisite cable and rescheduled.

When the tech came out, after making the same claims, Dad called me. I told him to tell the tech to:
1) Unplug the S-VHS and optical cables from the existing box.
2) Plug the S-VHS and optical cables into the new box.

After doing so, the tech brought up "I Love Lucy" (I kid you not) and told Dad "See, you are not receiving HD-TV". Once he was told to actually tune a High Definition channel, everything was fine.

That is, until the "upgraded" STB they brought out 3 months later refused to display the channel guide/none of the remote control "advanced" functions/PVR could not be programmed (but that is another story).

My next "fun" project is to remind my cable operator (TW) of the following:

FCC mandate Title 47, Chapter 1, Subchapter C, Part 76, Subpart K requires that all cable operators that have not received an explicit exemption from the FCC offer any customer who requests it a high-definition cable box with an operational firewire port.

Re:Cable card in brief and explanations

[Osty]

After doing so, the tech brought up "I Love Lucy" (I kid you not) and told Dad "See, you are not receiving HD-TV". Once he was told to actually tune a High Definition channel, everything was fine.

Wait, you mean "I Love Lucy" isn't broadcast in high definition? Dammit!

I've found from experience that a competent cable tech is a very rare thing indeed. Here's another story as an example: In the spring of 2003, I purchased my first home. Prior to that, I had been using a DSL line in my apartment, but the new home was out of range for DSL and thus I had to switch to cable to get a broadband connection. Doing so was pretty simple, and even though the previous owners had used DirectTV rather than cable all of the wiring in the house was relatively current and up to date (1997 build). Unfortunately soon after getting everything setup and installed I started having very odd, intermittent connection problems. During the day and early evening, my internet connection would work just fine, but later in the evening and at night the connection would die. The TV signal was still good, but no internet. Calling Comcast tech support was pretty useless -- they had me reset my modem, and once that didn't work they couldn't do anything except schedule a tech. When the first tech came, he checked my modem, checked the signal on my cable, and decided that there was no problem at all. That evening, my internet connection went out again. This repeated for weeks, across ~8 tech visits. Finally the last tech solved the problem because he actually had a brain and could think. What was the problem?

Water damage at the street drop. The line had rusted, and while it would still make enough of a connection to transmit the TV signal it was too degraded to handle internet traffic. However because it was spring/early summer, the line would expand enough during the heat of the day to make a good connection, and then contract during the night to kill the connection. Since Comcast techs don't make house calls at 10:00pm, they obviously would never see the issue. The last tech actually believed me when I told him that I had gone through three different modems and crawled all over the attic of my house verifying the cable run. Since that ruled out a problem within the house, he took the logical next step -- check the line at the street. Once he did that, the water damage was extremely obvious. It was a 5 minute fix that took nearly two months to solve. If I hadn't eventually gotten a competent tech, it would've taken much longer than that to fix (would've had to wait for fall/winter for the problem to occur during the day as well as at night).

My next "fun" project is to remind my cable operator (TW) of the following:

FCC mandate Title 47, Chapter 1, Subchapter C, Part 76, Subpart K requires that all cable operators that have not received an explicit exemption from the FCC offer any customer who requests it a high-definition cable box with an operational firewire port.

Have you tried using the firewire output on your box? It works just fine on the Motorola boxes I've used from Comcast, without having to bug Comcast about it at all. If your provider's box doesn't have an active Firewire port, that's bad. Just note that the firewire interface only transmits video. It doesn't carry the overlay information for the channel guide or menus. That's not an issue if you're using Firewire to feed an HTPC, but it could be annoying if you're trying to connect the Firewire output directly to a TV.

Re:Cable card in brief and explanations

[glitch23]

For the Record a Cable Card is a Card designed to fit in either a TV or a PC with a Cable Card slot. It acts as a Digital tuner and is designed to replace set top digital cable boxes.

Actually, the cablecard acts to authorize/decrypt the channels because the TV that has a CableCARD slot would have a QAM tuner to tune in the channel.

Re:Cable card in brief and explanations

[b.e.n.n.y_b.o.y_1234]

When the tech came out, after making the same claims, Dad called me. I told him to tell the tech to: 1) Unplug the S-VHS and optical cables from the existing box. 2) Plug the S-VHS and optical cables into the new box. After doing so, the tech brought up "I Love Lucy" (I kid you not) and told Dad "See, you are not receiving HD-TV". Once he was told to actually tune a High Definition channel, everything was fine.

S-Video (often mistakenly called S-VHS) does not support HD resolutions. The technician was correct in specifying component connections to view HD at HD resolution.

Re:Cable card in brief and explanations

[AskChopper]

Yup..

HDMI and component are the only way of getting an HD signal from your STB to your TV. You can use an S-Video lead or even a crappy old scart if you like but the signal on your TV will not be HD.

Trying to prove the point with I love Lucy does seem a little out of whack though!

Re:Cable card in brief and explanations

[StikyPad]

Which raises the question of why PPV and VOD aren't supported in CableCard specs (if that's true). It's not as if some secondary industry created the CableCard -- the specifications are a product of Cable Labs, the same folks who brought us DOCSIS and VOD.

Re:Cable card in brief and explanations

[StikyPad]

This is Slashdot: Your facts and truths are not welcome here. Everyone else please settle down.. you can continue using your composite video cable to view HD, and anyone who says otherwise is just a naysayer!

Re:Cable card in brief and explanations

[Anonymous Coward]

Complete and utter bullshit.

Using inferior cables may mean you're getting analog HD signal to your TV, but you do get HD signal to your TV using component, S-Video, RCA cables, or even coaxial cable, if you want. It all depends on what outputs the STB has, and what inputs your TV has.

You wanted DIGITAL from the STB to the TV? That's an entirely different story.

Which you'll want to use in any given case often depends on which device has the better digital decoder built in.

Re:Cable card in brief and explanations

[_Stryker]

Actually, the current specifications do support these features. It is actually the current CableCARD host hardware that is in the market that only supports one-way services.

I suggest taking a look at the CableCARD Primer which gives a good overview of this topic.

Btw, CableLabs is one word (no space inbetween).

// Sean

Blurb is somewhat incorrect

[Erwos]

The blurb makes it sound like MCE is completely incapable of receiving HD content. That's not true at all.

You can actually get HD content into your MCE system already. You've got either OTA HDTV, which is officially supported, or clear QAM (which isn't, but you can do it with HDHomeRuns (via hack)). Clear QAM is going to be officially supported soon, or so goes the current hints from Microsoft.

Of course, that's not going to get you very much compared to CableCard, which is really the problem here. But saying that MCE doesn't support HD just ain't the case.

Re:Blurb is somewhat incorrect

[the_other_chewey]

You can actually get HD content into your MCE system already.

Yeah, but what about getting it out again?

Re:Blurb is somewhat incorrect

[eudaemon]

My system uses Windows XP MCE and a Silicon Dust HDHomeRun to tune digital
cable. The utterly AWESOME thing about the HDHomeRun is it is just a
network device, and VLC is very happy to talk to it. So yes you can use it
with Linux! Yay! (I happen to use MCE because it passes the wife
acceptance factor test)

Playback at my Viewsonic's native resolution of 1366x768 is accomplished
via an Nvidia 7600 video card with DVI out. Configuration was trivial and
XP is happy to drive a device at that resolution with no complaint.
Physically the DVI to HMDI cable is connected to an Octava 5x1 HDMI switch,
but before purchasing that my PC was connected directly to the 32"
Viewsonic with no problems. The Viewsonic supports "sideband" audio (i.e.
audio from another source than the HDMI input) so no problems there.

Even so when a decent NVIDIA card with HDMI and native audio mixing support
comes out (the current ones seem to be fairly noisy and hot) I'll jump to
that, and maybe to a native 1024p flat panel at the same time. The
Viewsonic is nice, but the one thing they can't do is automatic colorspace
switching. You have to manually flip the device when going between devices
with different colorspace schemes.

Anyway, your question was is it possible to get Cable's QAM HDTV content
from cable and output that to a display device? Yes, absolutely in Windows
XP natively and in Media Center Edition if that floats your boat. No doubt
native resolution device support in Linux is just as easily done by running
your X Server's configurator.

Re:Blurb is somewhat incorrect

[eudaemon]

Correction: Viewsonics are capable of automatic colorspace switching.
They just always get it wrong on my model the N3250W.

Or perhaps it's the old

[rolfwind]

you can't have that trick! No, no no! I said you can't have it.

What, how much money? Well, only since you ask, much to expensive for you, these are only for the "pros." There, get it? You can't have it.

(We'll make a deal in the backroom.)

Cablecard & professionals

[Anonymous Coward]

From what I have read previously, Cablecard's design *requires* your cable company to send a rep over to configure it. There is no way to do it on your own.

Re:Cablecard & professionals

[untaken_name]

Well, in my last apartment, the cable company *required* that a tech come out and install my basic cable service. They said there was no way for me to do it on my own. His ENTIRE visit consisted of plugging (my existing) coax cable into the wall. That's it. He didn't even have to flip any switches outside. Just because something is *required* doesn't mean it's necessary.

Re:Cablecard & professionals

[CoolVC]

So why didn't you plug in your existing cable into the wall before he got there, and then show him it was already working when he came in?

Re:Cablecard & professionals

[untaken_name]

That's what I had done for the two weeks I had to wait for them to get a tech out there. But I had to unplug it before he got there or I would get some bullshit charge for 'stealing' service. It's my contention that if you are piping something into my house without me asking, I shouldn't get charged for using it. However, my contentions rarely mean anything in the real world.

I tried to use CableCard....

[Above]

My TV supports CableCard, so I tried to use it. Before I moved I got it working. First trip, dead cable card. Second trip, tech brought an HD Box rather than a cable card. Third trip, bad cable card. Fourth trip tech brought two, one worked, one did not. The one that worked finally was set up and worked.

But of course, the Cable Company decided not to provide ANY guide info via the Cable Card interface, so the cable card showed nothing. But it worked.

For two months. When it died. They brought two more that didn't work, I told them no more.

So I moved to a new location, and a supposedly better cable company. When I got here they didn't have any, and I was told they had no eta. I called back three times, unable to even make an appointment to get one installed because "they don't have any".

Nevermind even if I wanted one I would have to take a day off work and wait for an "installer" to insert a PCMCIA card and phone in two numbers.

I am convinced of two things.

1) Cable card manufacturers, Motorola in particular, seem to make junk. Having multiple DOA cards (that are supposedly new) is just amazing in this day and age. Junk, junk and more junk.

2) Cable companies don't want to support it. Maybe #1 justifies a installer, I don't know. But I should be able to pick one up at my local store, install it myself, put the numbers in a web site and be good to go in a few minutes. I should get guide info. They don't do it because they want you to get their two way box, not because it's hard or expensive.

Cable companies didn't want cable card, so they have managed to kill it by making it as broken as possible while still offering it.

Re:I tried to use CableCard....

[rsmith-mac]

2) Cable companies don't want to support it. Maybe #1 justifies a installer, I don't know. But I should be able to pick one up at my local store, install it myself, put the numbers in a web site and be good to go in a few minutes. I should get guide info. They don't do it because they want you to get their two way box, not because it's hard or expensive.

The thing is, #2 doesn't make sense any more. The FCC is making the cable companies eat their own dog food, so to speak, as any new boxes they deploy must use CableCards instead of integrated security. So I'm not sure what's going on at this point, as they're obviously doing okay using their own CableCards.

Re:I tried to use CableCard....

[barzok]

Key phrase: new boxes they deploy.

Our first SA8300 from TW crapped out less than a year after we got it (HD failure). I'm fairly sure it was a refurb or at least recycled from another subscriber who had turned it in. The replacement I'm certain is a refurb/recycle and less than a year after getting it, the hard drive is starting to make noises just like the first one did in the weeks before its demise.

As long as the cable companies can keep recycling the majority of the boxes, they can put off using CableCards for quite a while.

Re:I tried to use CableCard....

[demon]

CableCARD doesn't provide any interface for the device it's installed in to get guide data - that's a totally separate function. You might be able to get channel information via PSIP data streams, but the normal guide data channels are via some proprietary means (digital cable boxes, TiVo's guide data downloads, etc.).

Retailers and Installers?

[Edward Teach]

Ok, my bet is that I'm much better at this than some Walmart drone or Geek Squad wannabe.

Re:Retailers and Installers?

[Joe The Dragon]

Even if you are you likely will still need a cable guy / tech on come out and install it.

I had no problems with the technology...

[Scyber]

Just had issues with the cable company. First was the fact that while I could go into a cablevision store to pickup a HD cable box for no fee (besides the additional monthly cost), Cable cards can only be acquired by getting a technician sent to my house (for a $40 fee). Then when the technician shows up he only has HD cable boxes on his truck and has to return 6 hours later with a cable card. Install took 20 minutes and it worked flawlessly for the 3 months I had it.

Cable companies are afraid...

[Tatsh]

They are afraid that once someone with a lot of time on their hands gets one of these cards they are going to hack it (to get all channels unrestricted, and maybe even surpass copy flags) and then release all details to the web. That is really all it is. I am sure the cable companies are urging all companies not to promote CableCard as they think it is not a very secure, and they have not so much prior experience with hacks regarding cards as companies like DirecTV and Dish Network do.

Once someone hacks this card, and everyone else does, the cable companies might have no choice but to kill that revision of the card remotely and have to send new cards to all customers, which would be "fixed," or reflash the cards remotely (which of course could mean downtime at the customers' ends, for those who watch late night, when they send updates to their boxes). The problem is then this cycle starts all over again. In other words, release card, someone hacks it, flash all cards, someone hacks it again, flash all cards again, someone hacks it yet again, and etc etc.

This is not much different than Sony releasing new firmware for the PSP, blocking homebrew, hacks and pirated games from playing, and then just waiting for someone to crack it before they release new firmware. Only one release of their new firmware really added new features thus far. The rest are all copy protection fixes. And sometimes it takes days, sometimes it takes months before the new firmware is hacked in some way, but it seems crackers never sleep.

I understand their dilemma but perhaps they should stop trying to shove 50 channels of stuff we do not want to watch and start providing REAL customer service, like custom channels at a DECENT price. Comcast here is over ~$60/month just for "digital cable" (where 1-99 are analogue for compatibility reasons, because it is easier on their side, even though they could easily make the box get digital channels of those) with HBO. Add slow internet (supposedly 4Mbps but I never see it, and BitTorrent traffic shaping on their end) and decent phone service and that is (likely over) ~$150/month ($15 off the total price for having all 3 services).

It is absolutely unacceptable the only other option for TV service is satellite, and while good (ALL digital channels, and more HD than cable) it does not provide the compatibility with older sets without a box, and internet service on it is completely unacceptable. And also there is no satellite phone service to make a package any cheaper. I really cannot believe how communities can think having ONE company for cable service is a good idea somehow. I used to live in a different town and Charter was the provider there, and if I had to choose I would definitely choose theirs. The box you get with Comcast is incredibly slow with a crappy interface, just completely unacceptable for the price you pay. Charter's box was very fast, a nice simple interface, and their internet service was cheaper and far better than Comcast's will ever be. Add the fact that they are also doing fiber optics soon.

My opinion is Comcast should not be allowed to exist. And there is no doubt in my mind that they pay off town governments to own the areas they have now, and it is only a short amount of time before they own everywhere.

Re:Cable companies are afraid...

[fast turtle]

I understand their dilemma but perhaps they should stop trying to shove 50 channels of stuff we do not want to watch and start providing REAL customer service, like custom channels at a DECENT price. Comcast here is over ~$60/month just for "digital cable" (where 1-99 are analogue for compatibility reasons, because it is easier on their side, even though they could easily make the box get digital channels of those) with HBO Actually they are required by FCC regs to provide the lower channels in analog format for those who don't wish to rent a box. Sorry but that's a government regulation they can't avoid without serious fines at this time

I do agree with you though that I'd much rather they finally get to the damn ala-carte stage we've been hearing about for the last two years. Give me the option of the analog service for a cheap price and allow me to add the channels I'm actually willing to spend money for while avoiding the 40 shopping channels we've now got. Hell I don't need all of the espn channels since I rarely if ever watch them, prefering discovery science, hgtv and this old house along with the weather channel along with a few others.

i'm confused

[phread]

who watches tv? who has the time? oops, my virtual fish is nibbling, gotta go!

Who writes this crap?

[TheNetAvenger]

CableCard was supposed to be the savior for Windows Media Center, which has been held back by its inability to support high-def content.

This is incorrect. Windows Media Center has been handling HD content 'easily' now for a few years.

Just plug in any HD tuner and it works from over the air HD Signals, and if you want HD from DirectTV or even your cable company, using their box with the IR adapter and Windows Media Center it 'changes' the channels, and records just fine at HD resolutions.

Besides the fact the Windows Vista (with Media Center) is the ONLY OS that supports Cable Card inherently as an OS level feature.

So whoever wrote this crap is either trying to spread FUD or is really stupid.

Re:Who writes this crap?

[lusid1]

You had me until "and records just fine at HD resolutions." I have to call BS on that one. There isn't an input device in existence that can take a 1080i analog signal into a media center pc and record it. Your only HD input options are RF (QAM/OTA) which your settop box does not output in HD, and Firewire which is 5c encrypted, so not usable. Are you one of those people that think they're watching HDTV over svideo?

Re:Who writes this crap?

[Fulcrum of Evil]

So the component video decoder I have next to me doesn't exist?

Re:Who writes this crap?

[lusid1]

Decoding component isn't the problem, it's the encoding it to an mpeg/transport stream that is the challenge. There are PCI cards that can do realtime component video encoding at 1080i, but they are going into professional video post production workstations, not MCE boxes. If you've somehow got your hands on one _and_ have it working in MCE, then by all means, post a full writeup.

Re:Who writes this crap?

[YuppieScum]

You need to pull your head out of your arse.

The hardware doesn't have to be PCI, and it doesn't have to go into "professional" video post-prod tin. Further, the sale of such equipment is not restricted, so "somehow" getting hold of it should present no difficulty.

I, for example, have a very nice external component/RBG/S-Video/composite/stereo audio -> IEEE1394 box that works very well with all manner of Windows (and OSX and *nix) variants. It cost me slightly under GBP100.

Re:Who writes this crap?

[lusid1]

I have no doubt that you do. Here, I'll even link to such a device in that price range:
http://www.adstech.com/products/API-557-EFS/intro/ api557_intro.asp?pid=API-557-EFS

Will it capture HD over those component inputs, uh, no.

Want one that will? You'll need a bigger check book:
http://www.aja.com/html/products_Io_IoHD.html

Want a cheap solution? This is the closest you'll get right now. It is brand new, eats 400+GB/hour at 1080i, and its not supported in any PVR app:
http://www.blackmagic-design.com/products/intensit y/

Not trying to be an 'arse' here, but pony up some product specs and I'll suspend my disbelief.

Most builders I've met are clueless

[bigtrike]

Most people I've met who build their own PCs don't really know what they're doing. They lack the testing tools they need to diagnose intermittent failures when they occur, which is a problem because you can't just ship the whole thing back for one that works. When your custom built system locks up once or twice a day, do you have the tools to figure out if it's a bad DIMM, a failing power supply, a loose power connection due to a cheap Y molex connector, a hardware conflict between your chipset and video card which haven't been extensively tested together, hot spots on your motherboard due to inconsistent air circulation, failing counterfeit formula capacitors, a buggy bios, or maybe it's just a buggy ATI driver. You may or may not be an exception, but most builders lack a PSU tester, a dimm tester, a good multi-meter and only follow extensively tested hardware configurations. Or maybe you're rich enough to have multiple systems where you can play the hardware swap game for days on end in order to diagnose an intermittent failure. I'm sure you've never had any problems. Yet.

Re:Most builders I've met are clueless

[Anonymous Coward]

wank wank buddy. you're a dick

Translation

[kahrytan]

Translation:

  Alienware believes their geeky|nerdy customers are idiots.

The lesser of both evils...

[thesandbender]

I don't like Microsoft. I don't like the fact that I can't install a server OS without installing a GUI component that I'll never use and that the security layers are becoming more abstract and obfuscated. But at the same time. Linux can be a pain in the farking arse. I have a MythTV setup that I've been running for almost six months. I'm connected to two Motorola DCT-6200's over firewire. For the entire time I've been running this system the firewire ports that are assigned to these turners will change. And this has happened on two different firewire controllers over a range of different kernels. MythTV won't pick this this up. It will just blindly try to fire commands out to a turner that doesn't exist and then ultimately lock up. I know ... it's opensource... fix it yourself. The problem is after 10-12 hours a day fixing other peoples problems sometimes I just want to come home and watch my favorite show without opening a terminal. And hence I'm ready to *pay* other people to fix this problem. Ultimately their time is cheaper than mine. My Mythbox is going on eBay and I'm getting Series 3 TiVO. This doesn't diminish my passion for Linux in the data center... but work is work and play is play and sometimes you just need to hang up your hate and enjoy the rest of your life.

Re:The lesser of both evils...

[pembo13]

I fixed this problem.. no coding required.

Re:The lesser of both evils...

[Phoobarnvaz]

The problem is after 10-12 hours a day fixing other peoples problems sometimes I just want to come home and watch my favorite show without opening a terminal.

I considered going the MythTV/Freevo route myself with a PVR150. EVERY time I setup MythTV/Freevo with no matter what distro (custom PVR or standard distros)...I have problems setting up the remote...won't record & numerous other problems. Seems like no matter how much time & extensive trouble you spend on issues which really have no business popping up for something like MythTV/Freevo...it is not worth my time to mess with less-than-ideal design flaws. With GBPVR (which I have used for a while now in XP Pro) & less so with Media Portal...you point & click in a GUI setup...then 5-15 minutes you are ready to enjoy it.

This doesn't diminish my passion for Linux in the data center... but work is work and play is play and sometimes you just need to hang up your hate and enjoy the rest of your life.

Same here & I would even say on the desktop...MINUS PVR software. Until the designers for MythTV/Freevo pull their heads out & understand that as long as you need to spend unreasonable amounts of time & trouble to even use their software...it will never face more adoption than it has right now. GBPVR/Media Portal/Windows MCE/YahooTV understands this while MythTV/Freevo does not. When the Linux designers do get this...I & others will move to their product(s) in a heartbeat.

Morons

[Anonymous Coward]

Conspiracy! Conspiracy! Conspiracy! Somebody won't support something that would cost them more to support than to not support? Your a bunch of idiots.

Re:Um

[Anonymous Coward]

what the fuck is google?

i mean seriously, its not like i dont pay attention to trends, but what the fuck is this pretend technologoy?

Switched Video is killing CableCARDs

[Secrity]

I have an HD TiVo with 2 CableCARD; setting them up took three installer trips and three stacks of cards.

Yesterday I received a call from a cable company rep telling me that a large number of digital channels will cease working with my CableCARD. She read off a very long list of channels, most of them were foreign language and weird channels that I had never heard of; she also said that any newly added channels will not work with CableCARD. The only channel I cared about was NASA, and I am not going to rent a cable box jut to get NASA.

When I asked why these channels are going away, she assured me that they were not going away, i just won't be able to receive them without a cable box. When I kept pressing, she told me that they were adding Switched Video.

Free Market?

[DingerX]

Dude, what kind of world are you in? The Cable industry is created and sustained by regulation. You can't lay cable without government approval. Why? 'Cos you have to dig up the whole town to do so. So what's wrong with the communities saying "Okay, you can dig up our town, but if you do so, it has to be in the potential interest of the whole town" (And not just the dense nucleus, where putting cable would cause maximum disruption to the community for only a portion of the population, yet maximum profit for the cable company). And even if you let four cable companies maintain redundant infrastructure (magnifying costs), you'll still end up with an oligopoly at best.

The point is, if you're going to privatize infrastructure items, like power, communications and transportation, the consumer is not the individual, or the household, but the whole community. Any appointed representative of the community who favors the producers over the community is acting in bad faith.

Governments have every right to specify to producers what it is they want, just as producers have every right not to produce.

With enough force, anything can fit.

[gzunk]

You would think that you couldn't get a VGA cable inserted upside down? My sister did and wondered why it didn't work. Luckily (although I don't know how) none of the pins were broken. I straightened them with pliers and managed to get it working.

Re:With enough force, anything can fit.

[dave1g]

thats quite the accomplishment I dont know how you take a standard trapezoid and insert the same shape trapezoid, but upside down into it. The physical packaging doesnt line up nor do the pins.. /__\ \__/ how can you possibly fit those together????

Sounds like Dell's Tech "support" model

[redelm]

Sounds very much like Dell tech [non]support: they don't want even few phone calls that make it through their automated phone maze.

Or maybe Dell wants to throw a bone to some (Tweeter?) resellers who they've scr3wed over more than once in the past.

In any case, why bother? Is Alienware offering something unique and unobtainable elesewhere (parts)? I thought HD decoders were widely available. Some hardware even open-source

Users are stupid

[nurb432]

Thats the general attitude of most companies, why should they be any different? Especially now.

Stinks DRM

[eiapoce]

Look, the inq reviewed the cablecar stuff and they weren't lucky enought to make it work. This thing stinks so much of DRM that any brain operated being would awoid that.

Can't blame dell nor alienware.

Yep, DRM strikes again...

[argent]

I really don't think there's any question but that giving people more control over their set-top scares the cable companies. And putting it in a computer gives up too much control...

All I want is watch DTV on my computer?

[Anonymous Coward]

Is it me or gone are the days of the simple computer life, when all you had to do is get a tv tuner card, plug it into your computer, connect the cable, and watch TV on the computer.

My cable signal is digital rather than analog. Is it even possible anymore to plug the cable into a tuner card and watch TV on the computer? Or do I have to go with a SlingBox, and an extra decoder box, or wait for a tv tuner+CableCard - is that even an option?

If I plug the cable in the tuner card, I can still catch some signals (about 50 rather than 35) on the DTV cable, but I think these are the analog ones, which will probably be turned off in the very near future.

The cable company is even more clueless than myself.

TIA

udev rules?

[Anonymous Coward]

might want to look in to udev rules, I use it to make sure NICs and drives are always in the same place

alienware customers are not geeks

[Anonymous Coward]

The title says it all. if your buying an Alienware machine, then you are not a geek. Any self righteous geek wouldn't pay that much for what they can build themselves. So yeah, your average Alienware customer probably wouldn't know how to use the CableCard without professional help.

"no longer"? "original"?

[SanityInAnarchy]

Alienware caters to the hardcore gamers that aren't necessarily able to correctly install a cpu/heatsink.

This has essentially always been their business model.

So it's not surprising at all, really. Alienware's target market cannot be the technically savvy, only the technical wannabes. A technical wannabe wouldn't mind a CableCard, but they would mind being asked to plug it in themselves...

Re:"no longer"? "original"?

[lilfields]

I resent that statement, having owned an Alienware for many years is what got me in the game of geekdom. Beside you overlook the fact that many software geeks are not necessarily inclined to be hardware geeks and visa versa. I consider myself to be very geeky, having written programs, websites and built PCs...but not so geeky as to remain a virgin well into my 30s; if my type is considered being a technical wannabe, I'll gladly let others be more "technical savvy" than I.

Re:"no longer"? "original"?

[SanityInAnarchy]

having owned an Alienware for many years is what got me in the game of geekdom.

Hmm... Could you explain how that works?

Specifically -- what about that Alienware made you more likely to be geeky than any other PC?

Or is it that you resent me calling you a "Geek Wannabe", even if you now realize how dumb an Alienware purchase is? I'll admit people can grow and change, but whenever you bought that Alienware, you were either a Geek Wannabe of some sort, or a complete moron with your money.

Beside you overlook the fact that many software geeks are not necessarily inclined to be hardware geeks and visa versa.

Maybe not, but it's a simple matter of economics. I'm not generally a hardware geek either, but I do my homework when I make just about any purchase, or I talk to someone who has. It is absolutely worth my time to do the research, and even assemble a machine myself if need be, when the price difference is $1000 or so for an otherwise identical machine.

This applies to other kinds of geeks as well. If I pick up Top Ramen at, what, $2 for a 12-pack, cook it, and serve it to you in an oriental-looking bowl, branded "Naruto Ramen," and charge you $50 for it, well, you got ripped off. If I take a $150 air conditioner, slap a sticker of an alien on it, and sell it to you as an "Alienware cooling system" for $500, guess what? You got ripped off.

Now, maybe you've actually reached the point where you make so much money that the time spent comparison-shopping is actually worth more than the thousand dollars or so you lose by going with Alienware. Or maybe I'm out of it and Alienware is actually charging reasonable prices now. Neither seems likely.

I am not normally so reflexively insulting. I'm a rabid Linux zealot, but if you have to use Windows, I can understand. I'm even more rabidly anti-DRM, but I can understand just wanting to plug in your shiny new Xbox 360 and not think about it. But I honestly cannot think of a good reason for buying an Alienware, other than, say, extreme inebriation.

but not so geeky as to remain a virgin well into my 30s

What does that have to do with the current discussion?

For that matter... Are you married? Do you think your wife would consider Alienware a good decision? A thousand dollars for a pretty-looking case, and better-looking and cheaper ones on Newegg for less than $50?

Wait, hold that thought. I have some ch34p r0l3x and v1agr4 to sell you.

What a mess

[jollyreaper]

I watch HD content on my home computer already. It's called "download the fucking things on bittorrent." No, I won't get live HD sports but I don't watch that stuff anyway. I get HD shows without needing to pay for an HD hookup at home or a fancy TV, I can just use my pretty monitor instead. Best of all, no DRM. Fuck these fucking fuckers.

Shenanigans!

[DigitalSorceress]

'requires the expertise of a reseller and installer'

Um, I call "shenanigans" on that!

Expertise of a reseller? BAH! Comcast isn't hiring the Bangalore Bargain Bin for their phone support, but the folks you talk to at the cable co call center have far less knowledge about the systems that your average geek.

Expertise of an installer? To carefully install a card in the right slot of your TV, then find the right menu to call up the relevant stats, then update a system with them? Not difficult at all, I say. Except of course, that there's no customer-side interface to update your account with the right serial numbers and IDs.

My guess is that by having an installer do the work, they don't have to worry about making a web front-end for the card info system, and they can make sure that you're installing it into an "approved device". At least that's my theory.

Re:Shenanigans!

[Chili-71]

Expertise of a reseller? BAH! Comcast isn't hiring the Bangalore Bargain Bin for their phone support, but the folks you talk to at the cable co call center have far less knowledge about the systems that your average geek. I have got to tell this one... I called Comcast because a replacement cable box wasn't working. After all the obligatory questions (is it plugged in, do you see anything on the TV screen) I was asked to make sure the power cord was plugged in good in the back. I told her that the clock was on. She still insisted that I make sure the power cord was "plugged in good". After several comments about me being an Engineer and her reading off a script, she finally got around to sending a hard reset signal to the box. Amazing it started working.

She was a nice lady, but...

Re:Shenanigans!

[DigitalSorceress]

Exactly what I mean. It's funny though, you can get such a difference in level of support from two different people. I called last night about a signal problem:

Some of the digital channels I'm supposed to have are either coming up "one moment please, your channel should be available shortly" or are pixelating and breaking up so bad as to be useless, or are coming up "no signal" depending on the device (I have one CableCard, one digital cable box (hooked up to an older ReplayTV), and one Comcast HD DVR). The analog signals look ok, and many of the digital channels are ok too. Though the response varies slightly, the same channels on each device seem to be affected.

The first lady I talked to could not get off her script - she believed that each was a case of broken equipment on my end... that my cable card, my digital tuner box, and my Comcast DVR were all independently broken... in the same basic way, with the same channels not working properly.

Fortunately, my cell phone lost signal in the middle of me RE-EXPLAINING that the problem had to be common to all of em, and I had to call back.

The new lady I got understood the first time I explained it, tried sending a reset signal, and apologized that she had to send a tech, but that the problem was likely signal and/or wire related, and would I like an appointment for between 5 and 7 tomorrow evening?