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Ubuntu May Be Killing Your Laptop's Hard Drive
wwrmn writes "There's a debate going on over at bugs.launchpad.net on whether it's the Ubuntu, BIOS, hard-drive manufacturer, or pick-any-player's fault, but Ubuntu (and perhaps any OS) may be dramatically shortening the life of your laptop's hard drive due to an aggressive power-saving feature / acpi bug / OS configuration. Regardless of where the fault lies or how it's fixed, you might want to take some actions now to try to prevent the damage."
I'll just buy another 4 hard drives with the money I saved not buying Vista!
FOXTROT UNIFORM CHARLIE KILO
Yeah, sure. Whatever it is, it can't be compared to the damage done to Ubuntu's launchpad after it was slashdotted.
:(
Once they control the fire and get the backup server online, maybe I'll be able to RTFA.
That's why I use windows. So I don't have to wonder who the culprit is ;)
^_^
This is the sig that says NI (again)
If perhaps it could be "any OS" then why headline this as "Ubuntu" killing laptops? I can't find much in TFA that makes a compelling case that it isn't APCI. I'd read more but that page hurts my eyes.
May i just warn ya all to NOT play the blame-game?
It does sound like it's the fault of the BIOS (and somebody should contact them).
To rescue a hard-drive in distress sounds like something that should have a high-priority (critical?).
Not because it's ubuntu's fault or the bios fault. But because Ubuntu can solve this issue _now_. Doesn't sound like it is NOT being dealt with, it just isn't listed everywhere as critical and in the news all over the intarweb tubes.
Support NYCountryLawyer RIAA vs People
Windows 3.1x calc: 3.11 - 3.10 = 0.00
here is a good workaround: http://www.debian.org/
Politics is Treachery, Religion is Brainwashing
From Google's cache:
/etc/acpi/power.sh issues the command hdparm -B 1 to all block devices. This leads to extremely frequent load cycles. For example, my new thinkpad has already done well over 7000 load cycles -- in only 100 hours. That's at least one unloading per minute. Googling for "load unload cycles notebook OR laptop" shows that most laptop drives handle up to 600,000 such cycles. As these values clearly show, this issue is of high importance and should be fixed sooner rather than later.
/dev/sda /etc/acpi/suspend.d/ /etc/acpi/resume.d/ /etc/acpi/start.d/
/etc/laptop-mode/laptop-mode.conf, setting
When switching to battery power,
The command hdparm -b 255 turn off completely APM.
Here is how I permanently fixed it:
1) make a file named "99-hdd-spin-fix.sh". The important thing is starting with "99".
2) make sure the file contains the following 2 lines (fix it if you have PATA HDD):
#!/bin/sh
hdparm -B 255
3) copy this file to 3 locations:
Voila! After that the HDD never spins down on power (looks like it actually spins down on battery at modest rate).
Sorry if the instruction is too detailed, no offense.
An alternative to the "99-hdd-spin-fix.sh" fix is to install and enable the package laptop-mode-tools,
then customize
Got Trader Joe's? friendwich.com RSS feeds work now!
It's important to note that this only occurs if ENABLE_LAPTOP_MODE is enabled. By default it is NOT set. From /etc/default/acpi-support:
# Switch to laptop-mode on battery power - off by default as it causes odd
# hangs on some machines
ENABLE_LAPTOP_MODE=false
According to gentoo-wiki.com/MAN_hdparm -B is:
Set Advanced Power Management feature, if the drive supports it. A low value means aggressive power management and a high value means better performance. A value of 255 will disable apm on the drive.
I would say blame the hard drive vendor.
This space is not for rent.
Workaround #1. Edit /etc/hdparm.conf, add the following to the end (or modify the existing /dev/sda area, etc. This assumes your primary disk is your only disk and you're using SATA):
Then enter "sudo update-rc.d hdparm defaults" to ensure the changes take effect.
Workaround #2, edit /etc/apm/event.d/20hdparm, find the line "APMD_SPINDOWN=18" and add a zero to it (APMD_SPINDOWN=180). Again enter "sudo update-rc.d hdparm defaults".
The first of the options disables the whole spinning down thing. The second changes it so it spins down less (every 15 minutes rather than every minute and a half.)
At least, that's what the Launchpad contributors claim.
You are not alone. This is not normal. None of this is normal.
Here's the fix http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=596602
Actually, if you R(TRO)TFA, you'll find that Ubuntu is not issuing that command at all. Rather, this is a default set by the drive manufacturer.
I have seen the future, and it is inconvenient.
First off, putting a launchpad link on the frontpage of Slashdot is bad form. Launchpad is for discussing and resolving bugs, and we're not helping by swamping that page. It might be better if people read the wiki that has been set up to summarize the issue.
In answer to your question about how this isn't Ubuntu's fault, apparently the problem is that the manufacturer sets certain default values for "aggressive power management" and enables this aggressive power management by default. Ubuntu's policy is to not change the manufacturer defaults, and simply uses them. Unfortunately these defaults are "too aggressive" and cause the hard drive to park/unpark too frequently.
But Ubuntu is not blameless. First of all, if Ubuntu can push out a patch that resets the manufacturer defaults to sane values (and this will save some people from hard drive failures), then it definitely should. Also, there is some discussion that perhaps an Ubuntu daemon is probing the hard disk too frequently, so that the hard-drive can't sit in the parked state for long enough to actually make it a useful feature.
Regardless of who is to blame, it would appear that the Ubuntu devs should push out a patch that forces systems to ignore the manufacturer values, and use settings that will protect the drive lifetime.
Ive tested on 3 Ubuntu laptops here and found no problem. Here's a little script to test yourselves (can't remember where i found the greppable bit - perhaps a Planet Ubuntu author).
/dev/sda with your own drive. Not sure which? sudo fdisk -l. You'll need smartmontools (sudo apt-get install smartmontools).
/dev/sda | grep Load_Cycle_Count` " | " `date` >> load_count
Run this every hour and compare differences in the load count (the last value in the output written to the file 'load_count' in the current directory).. Replace
echo `sudo smartctl -a
If the difference in this count is more than 90 from one hour to the next you may be in trouble if there is anything to this wear and tear fear.
I have an Dell Inspiron 6400 running Gentoo. I had this problem too. I fixed it by adding
/etc/conf.d/hdparm. This would fix the issue on boot, but after resuming, this would be moot. For that, I added
/etc/init.d/hdparm restart
/etc/acpi/suspend.sh in /etc/acpi/default.sh, though I suppose I could have put that line somwhere in suspend.sh.
# -B 255 doesn't work for me
sda_args="-B 254 -S 60"
to
# redo hdparm settings on resume
after running
The key thing here is to run hdparm on boot *and* on resume
The aggressive power saving settings here are perhaps a little too aggressive, but did anyone really think you could do that totally without cost? This isn't magic, you know. It's a trade-off. If you tell your computer (usually in a laptop) to spin down the hard drives to save power, you're going to cause greater wear-and-tear on the things because each time they spin down, they have to spin back up before you can use them again. If you want to save energy without the wear, turn the bloody thing off when you're not using it.
What, you're in too much of a hurry to view the latest pr0n? Chill, dude, before you go blind!
If you run a desktop, it's doubtful you'll have a problem with this, as most desktop users turn power saving features off entirely (and yeah, I also drive a big honkin' SUV. Bite me), but be careful on a laptop. If your hard drive supports SMART, you can do a quick check of the numbers (I think the one you want is # 193, IIRC), and see if you're at risk. But not all drives support SMART (I have a laptop drive that doesn't), so as usual, YMMV.
"My country, right or wrong; if right, to be kept right; and if wrong, to be set right." --Senator Carl Schurz (1872)
I actually disagree. Sure, if the manufacturer issues a recommendation or something to change it, then by all means. Otherwise Ubuntu should just keep their hands off and let the HDD manufacturer deal with it. Does Windows automagically disable this behavior?
Live today, because you never know what tomorrow brings
http://mjg59.livejournal.com/77672.html
Matthew garret, who runs the laptop testing team. Read this, instead of just spreading FUD.
A conspiracy theorist might suggest that the hardware manufacturers are intentionally adding a feature that causes the drives to fail eventually (but statistically outside of the manufacturer's warranty period), so that people have to buy more hardware. The more likely explanation is that the manufacturer set the defaults, but didn't notice that the values were unsafe because Windows ignores them.
Getting Ubuntu to override the defaults should be viewed as a short-term solution. Ultimately the hardware manufacturers should be setting default values that will not damage the hardware. Ideally they would design safeties into the hardware, which do sanity checks and reject ridiculous values.
echo -e 'global _start\n _start:\n mov eax, 2\n int 80h\n jmp _start' > a.asm; nasm a.asm -f elf; ld a.o -o a;
Considering the HD failure rate on Dell laptops, I doubt anybody will notice a difference.
Exactly. See this article on thinkwiki about the problem. This is obviously HDD or HDD-controller specific, and is therefore a hardware vendor problem, not an Ubuntu problem. The article is FUD.
My blog
My company just issued me a Lenovo T60 laptop *yesterday*. I installed Kubuntu 7.10 *last night*. Prior to that it has had Windows XP on it since it was purchased via a corporate sale from Lenovo. It is about 15 months old and the value in question looks like this:
193 Load_Cycle_Count 0x0032 001 001 000 Old_age Always - 2144751
That is 2,144,751 in case the lack of commas throws you. This is just a tad more than the 600,000 that was mentioned in the original bug report, so I don't know out of who's hat that number was pulled.
For completeness, here is the drive info.
Model Family: Seagate Momentus 7200.1 series
Device Model: ST96023AS
Serial Number: 3MG06BZ3
Firmware Version: 4.06
Learning HOW to think is more important than learning WHAT to think.
I think the answer is they should both fix the problem. Drive manufacturers should issue a sane value and operating systems should check that the value is sane before using it. Same rule as accepting any data from an outside source, you tell them what they are supposed to do, but then you double check it to make sure they did. Pointing fingers at each other while customers hardware fries doesn't help anyone.
It's already been posted, but apparently no one's reading it
/etc/acpi/power.sh. The relevant sections are:
... /dev/$drive 2>/dev/null /dev/$drive 2>/dev/null
/etc/default/acpi-support). This means that, by default, we do not alter the hard drive power settings. In other words, the APM settings that your drive is using in Ubuntu are the ones that your BIOS programmed into it when the computer started. This is supported by the fact that people see this issue after resuming from suspend. We don't touch the hard drive settings at that point, so the only way it can occur is if your BIOS or drive default to this behaviour.
=====================
Linux-hero wrote about how Ubuntu kills your hard drive. The situation is somewhat less clear than you might think from the article, but the basic takeaway message is that Ubuntu doesn't touch your hard drive power management settings by default. In almost all cases, it's more likely to be your BIOS or the firmware on your hard drive.
The script that's executed when you plug or unplug your laptop is
function laptop_mode_enable {
$HDPARM -S $SPINDOWN_TIME
$HDPARM -B 1
}
That is, when the laptop_mode_enable function is called, we set the drive power parameters. Now, by default laptop_mode_enable isn't called:
if [ x$ENABLE_LAPTOP_MODE = xtrue ]; then
(sleep 5 && laptop_mode_enable)&
fi
because ENABLE_LAPTOP_MODE is false in the default install (check
If you enable laptop mode, then we will enable aggressive power management on the drive and that may lead to some reduction in hard drive lifespan. That's a fairly inevitable consequence of laptop mode, since it only makes sense if the laptop enages in aggressive power management. But, as I said, that's not the default behaviour of Ubuntu.
There's certainly an argument that we should work around BIOSes, but in general our assumption has been that your hardware manufacturer has a better idea what your computer is capable of than we do. If a laptop manufacturer configures your drive to save power at the cost of life expectancy, then that's probably something you should ask your laptop manufacturer about.
=====================
Don't fall prey to 'Digg-ish' sensationalism. You all are supposed to know better over here.
Senior NCO in the fight against entropy. I've seen things, man. Things no one should have to see.....
So, it comes down to: Ubuntu users were able to diagnose the problem, and have the tools to implement a workaround. Nix to either for Windows users -- they just need to remember to replace their drive once a year.
Sometimes boldness is in fashion. Sometimes only the brave will be bold.
- Disk 1:
- Seagate ST96023A (Seagate Momentus 7200.1 series)
- Power_On_Hours 1438
- Load_Cycle_Count 187925
- 130 load/unload per hour (roughly 2 per minute)
- Disk 2:
- Hitachi HTS721010G9SA00
- Power_On_Hours 818
- Load_Cycle_Count 90539
- 110 load/unload per hour (roughly 2 per minute)
- Disk 3:
- TOSHIBA MK6006GAH
- Power_On_Hours 2896
- Load_Cycle_Count 199757
- 68 load/unload per hour (roughly 1 per minute)
Then I've been monitoring the hard drive with this one-liner. Before you ask, it is only one line, as you only press enter onceThis shows on all three laptops that the load counts increases by 1 to 4 every minute.
Now I issued:
This has stopped load cycles on two drives.The third one (the TOSHIBA MK6006GAH) still continues loading and unloading like hdparm did not help at all.
However, setting the power-management level to "lowest power savings mode" with:
did prevent any more load/unload cycles from happening.So in summary:
Doesn't compare to what Video did... the scene at the Radio Star's apartment was BRUTAL.
No, i think it's fair to call this an Ubuntu problem, i mean 80% of the stories about linux these days are simply titled "Ubuntu" when they would apply to any distro at all. It's only a natural progression to start calling your computer and all the parts therein an Ubuntu :)
This is a joke. I am joking. Joke joke joke.
Then you must be a real masochist to keep hanging around here.
If you were blocking sigs, you wouldn't have to read this.