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Wii Shortages Costing Nintendo 'A Billion' In Sales

A New York Times article from this past Friday highlights the 'problem' that Nintendo is facing: more people want to give them money than they can handle. Analysts quoted in the story discussing Nintendo's unique Wii shortage problem indicate that the company could be selling twice the 1.8 million consoles a month it ships. All told, these same individuals believe the company could be leaving as much as $1 billion on the table this holiday season. "'We don't feel like we've made any mistakes,' said George Harrison, senior vice president for marketing at Nintendo of America. He said there was a shortage because the company must plan its production schedule five months ahead, and projecting future demand is difficult. He added that there had been a worldwide shortage of disk drives that had hurt Nintendo as well as makers of many other devices. 'It's a good problem to have,' Mr. Harrison said of the demand, but he acknowledged that there could be a downside. 'We do worry about not satisfying consumers and that they will drift to a competitor's system.'"

290 comments

  1. Let's use the music argument... by Gothic_Walrus · · Score: 5, Insightful

    When people try to justify downloading music, they say it's okay because they wouldn't have bought the album in the first place, which means that no money was lost in the process.

    Wouldn't the same kind of logic hold here? How can Nintendo lose money on nonexistent consoles if they're already at full production?

    --
    Goo goo g'joob.
    1. Re:Let's use the music argument... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Interesting

      That's the joy of theoretical money. If they could ramp up production, they'd make an extra billion dollars. And if I were able to work twice as many hours, I could make at least three or four times what I make now!

    2. Re:Let's use the music argument... by CastrTroy · · Score: 4, Interesting

      If people decide to buy something else instead, and never end up buying a Wii, then it is money lost. However, I think that a high percentage of people will just end up buying it later, once units become available. Also, if the buy it later, the cost to produce a Wii might have come down, and Nintendo may end up making more profit per unit. That could yield them even more money in the end.

      --

      Anthropic principle: We see the universe the way it is because if it were different we would not be here to see it.
    3. Re:Let's use the music argument... by lukas84 · · Score: 5, Funny

      Well, a day has 24 hours and if that isn't enough there's still the night ;)

    4. Re:Let's use the music argument... by Limb · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Because people want yo buy the wii, but can not find one. They WANT to give nintendo their money, there's just no wii's for them to get in exchange for the money. Using your example it'd be the same as someone going to the store to buy an album, only to find out that there is no more copies of the CD left, so instead they buy another bands album. It is money lost because people want to buy the product, but can not so instead they buy a competitors product instead.

      --
      -Limb
    5. Re:Let's use the music argument... by MobileTatsu-NJG · · Score: 1

      "Wouldn't the same kind of logic hold here?"

      No.

      "How can Nintendo lose money on nonexistent consoles if they're already at full production?"

      They're not filling a billion dollars worth of demand.

      --

      "I like to lick butts!" by MobileTatsu-NJG (#32700246) (Score:5, Informative)

    6. Re:Let's use the music argument... by neumayr · · Score: 1

      Huh?
      Kind of ignoring the season we're in, aren't you?

      --
      Truth arises more readily from error than from confusion. -Francis Bacon
    7. Re:Let's use the music argument... by xtracto · · Score: 3, Insightful

      But grand parent has a point, people who is trying to buy the Wii is people who will NEVER ever buy a Xbox or Playstation 3 (grandpas, grandmas, Joe Average without 50 fingers, etc). The fact that they can not get the Wii at this time only means that they will wait until sometime next year or later to get it. Maybe their impulse will not be very strong after christmass, but once they play it again in their friends or relative's house, they *will* like it again.

      --
      Ubuntu is an African word meaning 'I can't configure Debian'
    8. Re:Let's use the music argument... by sexconker · · Score: 1

      The Wii has been effectively sold out for over 12 months straight now.

      Insatiable demand + holiday season = insatiable demand.

    9. Re:Let's use the music argument... by Amouth · · Score: 1

      damnit i just used all my mod points - this hits home for me and how the company i work for thinks.. you have to be a workaholic just to apply here

      --
      '...if only "Jumping to a Conclusion" was an event in the Olympics.'
    10. Re:Let's use the music argument... by somersault · · Score: 1

      There's plenty of Wii's in mainland Europe though. They could maybe redirect some to the US/UK to help satisfy demand? I got one before Christmas last year anyway so I dont mind, hehe.

      --
      which is totally what she said
    11. Re:Let's use the music argument... by ZeroFactorial · · Score: 1

      I think so.

      The main point is that they can't suddenly beef up production to meet immediate demand. They have to ESTIMATE in advance, which is especially difficult if you don't know ahead of time that your product is going to be THE item for the holidays that year.

      Had they beefed up prematurely and then NOT been THE item for the holidays they would have been out quite a large amount of money.

      Would you rather be Sony, with thousands of unsold PS3's waiting around in warehouses, or Nintendo, with nothing to spare because your increased production rates STILL can't keep up with the demand?

      As for those saying people might drift to other consoles - are you stupid or just insane? The Wii is appealing to the masses because it actually has gameplay that appeals to the average person. The Wii wasn't made for fanboys (read: future 40 yr. old basement dwellers). It was made for regular people - with friends and families that don't just sit around gaming ALL DAY.

      On the whole, people who want the Wii (except wii fanboys) aren't going to drift to a fanboy console like PS3 or Xbox360.

    12. Re:Let's use the music argument... by evilRhino · · Score: 1

      You mean there's no X-mas in '08?!

    13. Re:Let's use the music argument... by kannibal_klown · · Score: 1

      Not necessarily true (but quite possible). However...

      One could have said the same thing about Tickle-Me-Elmos but the craze died down after the holidays. Were they any more fun because there was snow on the ground and holiday decorations up? No. Yet by the summer nobody really cared (I worked at a store that year). Besides the regular demand, people wanted one because "everyone" wanted one (whether in truth or just perception). Combine the holidays with a fad (or just a new item) and the demand can be multitudes higher than some random point in the year.

      In other words, by the time the supply is back up and even a birthday or another holiday comes by, the craving might not be as strong and they'd look elsewhere for a gift.

      Right now there's a big rush to get them because the holidays are coming up. Parents, Grandparents, good friends, etc might be looking to get someone a Wii for year-end Holidays (in whatever form they choose to celebrate). After all, the Wii is the gift kids want and isn't that expensive that someone well-to-do might not consider it for a loved one

      I'm not saying that this is the case, but could be the case. Someone striving to give it to their child/grandchild/nephew/etc this holiday might just forget about it afterwards if they fail and focus on something else down the line.

    14. Re:Let's use the music argument... by CastrTroy · · Score: 1

      Here's the reason that I don't think that is the case. The Wii has been selling out since November 2006. It sold out last Christmas, all the way through the year, and right on through until this Christmas.

      --

      Anthropic principle: We see the universe the way it is because if it were different we would not be here to see it.
    15. Re:Let's use the music argument... by 7Prime · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Yes, but this is the Wii's second holiday season, Tickle-Me-Elmo was simply a passing fad, after over a year, I think we call call the Wii whatever the iPod is... a total and utter success.

      --
      Multiplayer Gaming (defined): Sitting around, discussing single-player games with my friends, at the bar.
    16. Re:Let's use the music argument... by kannibal_klown · · Score: 1

      Selling out, perhaps. But at least around where I live it was possible to find them in the late Spring through late Summer. They weren't crowding the shelves like the PS3 but they were there. Obviously last winter holiday and today they're impossible to find again, but such is the nature of popular items.

    17. Re:Let's use the music argument... by kannibal_klown · · Score: 1

      Which is why I say "or a new item." IE, something that's a fad OR new. I still consider the Wii new since it's only a year old.

      Obviously it's a success, but that doesn't take away what I'm saying. The grandparent was implying that lost sales during this holiday aren't really lost because most consumers will buy them during the year when the supply/demand ratio is closer to 1.0.

      I'm saying that later in the year, a lot of people who couldn't buy one for the holidays won't care if they see one on the shelf on June 2nd even if it's little Timmy's birthday on June 10th. It's possible a lost sale during the holidays is truly a lost sale.

    18. Re:Let's use the music argument... by FlopEJoe · · Score: 1
      Because time is the forth dimension in economics. Getting $250 right now is different than getting $250 next year. Not only does inflation make it worth slightly less next year but you have to consider what you can do with that money over the period of a year. Even the crappiest 5% interest gets $12.50 and that's just $250. Multiply that out... a few million here, a few million there and pretty soon your talking about some real money.

      There's millions of examples. How much does a house really cost through a mortgage? Buy the house with money today (assuming you can't get a better percent return on the money) and you save thousands of dollars. So not having money right now costs money.

    19. Re:Let's use the music argument... by bcattwoo · · Score: 1

      No, not really. Actually in the article it says that Nintendo is "giving up $1 billion or more in sales in the ever-important holiday retail season". The truth is that they are giving up sales in the short term. Whether or not that may even out in the long term remains to be seen, but I think most businesses would prefer a definite sale now over a likely sale later.

      Beyond the consoles they are also missing out on the sale of games, etc. Somebody who has to wait a year to buy a console will have one less year to buy games before the next gen system comes out and they will have more used games available to buy as well.

    20. Re:Let's use the music argument... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      No the argument doesn't work at all.

      People who wouldn't have paid money for the album are spending the money that would have gone to purchase the music somewhere else and enjoying the music anyway through some other form, like letting someone else pay for it.

      The people who want to purchase Wii video games are spending their money elsewhere, and NOT enjoying the video games they originally wanted. (When was the last time you played WoW for a couple of months for free?) If they can't buy a Wii, they are "settling" for something lesser (if it were greater they would have purchased it instead of the Wii). The money they are spending is money Nintendo is losing because someone else in the video game industry is getting it, and I doubt people are saying, I'll buy an xbox this month and buy the Wii next month when it is more available.

    21. Re:Let's use the music argument... by Sancho · · Score: 2, Informative

      Right, but I can say the same thing as Nintendo.

      Because I don't have 1000 Wiis, I'm losing money by not being able to sell them on eBay.

      Does that help explain the flawed premise? It's money I never had. I have lost nothing, I'm just not achieving equilibrium on the supply/demand curve.

      Nintendo's loss is solely in opportunity. It is not money which they once had, and now do not.

    22. Re:Let's use the music argument... by King+Gabey · · Score: 3, Interesting

      I for one have wanted a Wii for quite some time. It just looks fun! However my impulse to buy has faded over the year+ that I've actually been looking to get one. If I have to wait wait much longer I'm plain not getting it. The PS3 and the Xbox are becoming far closer to the price of the Wii. While I won't buy M$, most people will, including grandpas and grandmas who don't know Mario from Halo. Many households won't buy two systems. Nintendo has self-limited themselves from a bigger piece of the gamesystem pie, which Sony and MS will happily lay claim to.

    23. Re:Let's use the music argument... by devjj · · Score: 1

      Not to mention the more obvious fact that people will wait for a Wii, and get one when they can regardless. This isn't a PS3 vs Xbox 360 toss-up. Nintendo's got something you can't get anywhere else.

    24. Re:Let's use the music argument... by webmaster404 · · Score: 1

      Not really... do to the fact that EU/UK is PAL while the US/Japan is NTSC and aside from TV differences, Wii games are region "protected" unless you get a modchip. So although it is a good idea it will not happen.

      --
      There is no "disagree" moderation, and troll, flamebait and overrated are not valid substitutes
    25. Re:Let's use the music argument... by Estanislao+Mart�nez · · Score: 1

      The fact that they can not get the Wii at this time only means that they will wait until sometime next year or later to get it.

      Maybe. The fact that they can't get the Wii right now means that Nintendo has to face the risk that they will never again be willing to buy one. That's a risk that can only be justified if it is likely to produce an excess profit over the profit of selling stuff to them now.

      You can't just say that those people will buy it anyway. To justify "sell to them later" you have to make a case as to why selling later has a chance of producing a larger return than selling now. And in this case, the argument likely is "the cost of manufacturing capabilities to deliver all the product that we could sell now would cut into our profit margin."

    26. Re:Let's use the music argument... by freemywrld · · Score: 1

      This also indicates that Nintendo simply CHOSE not to have more consoles available. Like many others have pointed out, production estimates were made many months ago. Nintendo isn't just sitting around saying "Oh well, we could make a billion more, but we don't feel like it." I'm sure they wish they had more units available for sale right now. They made a conservative projection earlier this year, now they are seeing the numbers in action. Not much they can do in the short term, other than save big bucks on mass advertising.

      I'm sure other console manufacturers are actually losing quite a bit more green due to: the Wii's popularity and the fact that there are some consumers out there who will simply wait until they can get a Wii, weak sales of their products (whether due to competition from the Wii or other factors), and mass amounts of money spent on advertising in hopes of increasing sales.

    27. Re:Let's use the music argument... by TooMuchToDo · · Score: 1

      Agreed. I've wanted a Wii for quite a while, and after the umpteenth time of going into GameStop/Target/etc. trying to get myself one, I just bought an Xbox360 Elite and Halo 3. I'd rather spend the money now to play now, instead of waiting months to get a system that may or may not be available.

    28. Re:Let's use the music argument... by servognome · · Score: 1

      Also, if the buy it later, the cost to produce a Wii might have come down, and Nintendo may end up making more profit per unit. That could yield them even more money in the end.
      But alternatively the money they receive now could be invested and yield more than any cost savings.
      --
      D6 63 0D 70 89 81 BB 8E 7B 7C 5F 5D 54 EA AB 73
    29. Re:Let's use the music argument... by Cecil · · Score: 1

      In other news, I am losing millions of dollars by not winning the lottery every week.

      You can't lose money you never had. Nintendo is missing out on potential income that they could be capitalizing on, but for various reasons have decided not to. That's not the same thing as losing money.

    30. Re:Let's use the music argument... by MobileTatsu-NJG · · Score: 1

      "In other news, I am losing millions of dollars by not winning the lottery every week."

      Um, no, that's just you not understanding what the discussion is about.

      "You can't lose money you never had. Nintendo is missing out on potential income that they could be capitalizing on, but for various reasons have decided not to. That's not the same thing as losing money."

      You're confused about what this story is about. Nintendo's not claiming 'losses' here. Read the story again.

      --

      "I like to lick butts!" by MobileTatsu-NJG (#32700246) (Score:5, Informative)

    31. Re:Let's use the music argument... by schlumpf_louise · · Score: 1

      I'm looking to buy my boyfriend a Wii for Christmas, I'm in the UK and I've been trying to get one for a month. The Wii on it's own normally costs £179, all the stores that have got them in have bundled them with games and accessories, and the cheapest one you can get at the moment is about £400 here. He certainly isn't getting one for Christmas, so I've had to tell him my plan to get him one and that he's going to have to wait until they have come down in price after Christmas. He is 23 so he understands by now that it's not a big deal that he doesn't get it for Christmas, but so many people have said they will not pay the double price just to get it in time for Christmas, so there will be a few disappointed kids out there, or some poorer parents. Do you tell your kid they have to wait for their present or buy an alternative console to give them there big present to open on Christmas day?. At least someone is making money out of the shortage.

    32. Re:Let's use the music argument... by buffer-overflowed · · Score: 1

      Try mail ordering from elsewhere in Europe. Outside the UK(and the US/Japan) I understand availability is a lot better. The Wii is region locked, but europe is a single region, so that's not an issue. Exchange rate wouldn't be a big deal either.

      --
      The key to the enjoyment of pop music is to replace any instance of "love" with "C.H.U.D."
    33. Re:Let's use the music argument... by urlgrey · · Score: 1

      I think that a high percentage of people will just end up buying it later, once units become available.
      I, too, think this is definitely the case in general; however, I'm sure there's some halo effect for other consoles, too, as some consumers who're perhaps new to consoles or who aren't really sure what the big deal is with the wii look to other brands thinking (as many folks do) that they're pretty much like computers... so they're pretty much the same.

      I for one tooled down to Fry's on a recent Saturday morning just before they opened hoping to get my paws on one (they had a shipment arriving) only to miss out on the line tickets by... one... person. :-(

      For a *blink* I thought about sticking around for something else, but that fleeting thought vanished when I remembered that consoles really are all the same... except for the wii.

      Instead I [cough] consoled [/cough] myself with a new game for my Mac.

      --
      Running 'Nix is like owning a Lightsaber. It's "a more elegant weapon for a more civilized time."
    34. Re:Let's use the music argument... by somersault · · Score: 1

      Okay, remove the US from that, it's still a good idea for the UK ;) lots of people are just going over to France to pick one up (and it's actually cheaper than the UK version, though obviously you have to pay for your travel)

      --
      which is totally what she said
    35. Re:Let's use the music argument... by ookaze · · Score: 1

      I for one have wanted a Wii for quite some time. It just looks fun! However my impulse to buy has faded over the year+ that I've actually been looking to get one. If I have to wait wait much longer I'm plain not getting it. The PS3 and the Xbox are becoming far closer to the price of the Wii. This is irrelevant. Xbox and PS3 are not in the radar of people who wants a Wii. Not even a chance.
      These are the same complicated nerd gaming systems in their eyes, no way they want that.
      BTW, that's why the Wii has been sold out all year long. Even during the summer, when Nintendo hoped to build some stock, they just couldn't.

      While I won't buy M$, most people will, including grandpas and grandmas who don't know Mario from Halo. Many households won't buy two systems. Nintendo has self-limited themselves from a bigger piece of the gamesystem pie, which Sony and MS will happily lay claim to. That's wishful thinking at best. Grandpas and grandmas won't play Halo or Mario BTW, except Mario Party 8 perhaps.
      Nintendo haven't limited themselves of anything except perhaps the risk of a Gamecube era like debacle.
      They sold more consoles than any other one in 1 year, which is a feat of itself. They also gained market leadership in 10 months despite the Xbox 360 having 1 year headstart, and the only territory where the Wii is not ahead is the USA, and they go on eating the Xbox 360 shares there.
      None of this is "self-limiting". Especially since the same media go on saying that the Wii is a fad and will die soon (nonsense).
      And the article is wrong, Nintendo is not losing any money by not selling more Wii, they just lose marketshare gain, at worst. Anyway, getting factories with enough quality takes time, and Nintendo requires high quality for their consoles. The best quality one that was making Xbox 360 now have abandonned the non lucrative Xbox business, and will start making Wii soon.
    36. Re:Let's use the music argument... by nbuet · · Score: 1

      It is much more critical to sell fast than to sell a lot. Take the example you someone building a new house. When you build it, you pay for two houses: your current, and the next. Near the end of the construction, every single week is critical for your budget. Because you have a high loan, and zero benefits out of the new house. This was development of the wii. This is investment.

      Now, you start living in your house. You need to refund the bank. The faster you give the money back, the fewer interest you will pay. And at the end of the day, your house will be cheaper if you pay it in 7 years than if you pay it in 20 years. Same for the wii: nintendo is now paying for the development. Once they managed to refund the development, they start to earn money, and they can get even more benefits of that money (develop new products, buy buildings, ...). And you enter a virtue circle.

      If you sell very little at the beginning, you will have to sustain the high costs of daily business + refund investment for a longer time. Which means that you will not have capacity to invest, that your product will have to remain expensive. And ultimately, a new product will be released and you will be out. That's why taking 5 years to be a blockbuster is usually not an option, and that's why you see so many efforts to sell products exactly when they are released (movies, games, houses, ...)

    37. Re:Let's use the music argument... by xtracto · · Score: 1

      While I won't buy M$, most people will, including grandpas and grandmas who don't know Mario from Halo.

      And there is where you are wrong, grandmas and grandpas will *never* play halo! god, just make a test and give your grandma or other people over 50 a PS2 or Xbox 360 control, and you will see what I mean. Even if the game is very simple they will be scared. My mother and uncle had lots of problems playing SNES mario kart and Pilot Wings (but yet, they liked it) because of the number of buttons!

      What these people is buying and will buy is the Wii, with that game about the sports (golf, bowling, tennis etc) and Wii play. Seriously, Wii play is ridiculously simple and boring (for hardcore or even some non hardcore gamers as me) but for these people, they ARE very funny and entertaining, and they CAN play it.

      --
      Ubuntu is an African word meaning 'I can't configure Debian'
    38. Re:Let's use the music argument... by plumby · · Score: 1

      This is irrelevant. Xbox and PS3 are not in the radar of people who wants a Wii. Not even a chance.
      Not on the radar of some people who want a Wii. Those people are also quite likely to be the ones that want a Wii simply because it's not avaiable ("if it's sold out, it must be great"). On the other hand, there's people who just love to spend money on new tech for Christmas - and the Wii still just about fits into that category. If they can't get one at the moment, they'll go out and spend the money on something else. By the time stocks are fully available, many of them will no longer care as it will be old hat.

      The Wii is certainly our office's must have toy this year, and I've seen both types around here. Thanks to online stock-watch sites, not one of them's had a real problem getting hold of one but I suspect if they'd all failed for Christmas, at least 50% of them would never bother getting one.
    39. Re:Let's use the music argument... by tehcyder · · Score: 1

      How can Nintendo lose money on nonexistent consoles if they're already at full production?
      Because production capacity is not fixed. I
      --
      To have a right to do a thing is not at all the same as to be right in doing it
    40. Re:Let's use the music argument... by jbash · · Score: 1

      I just went to Target and asked an employee if they had any Wiis in stock. She said "no" in a very rude and arrogant manner. I decided to never buy a Wii. Count me out. Granted, I'm just one insignificant data point.

    41. Re:Let's use the music argument... by Aphex+Junkie · · Score: 0

      So the behavior of a minimum-wage asshole at Target is Nintendo's fault? Nice troll!

  2. RIAA styled math by pryoplasm · · Score: 1

    Is there anyone who can still read about a projected loss and still find it even remotely believable?

    --
    Those who live by the sword, get shot by those who live by the gun...
    1. Re:RIAA styled math by jeffasselin · · Score: 2, Funny

      Following computer virus loss estimates, and the *AA estimates, I think we can define a new branch of mathematics, defined as the branch of mathematics devoted to making up numbers.

      --
      If he explores all forms and substances Straight homeward to their symbol-essences; He shall not die.
    2. Re:RIAA styled math by smussman · · Score: 1

      Don't we already have that?
      I'm sure you've heard the truism that 84.6% of statistics are made up on the spot.

    3. Re:RIAA styled math by pragma_x · · Score: 4, Funny

      I think those all fall under one or more branches of Bistromathematics.

    4. Re:RIAA styled math by paranode · · Score: 1

      In this case it makes more sense. The demand is high and the supply is low. You can browse eBay and see people making good profits off of them. If those people could have walked into a store and bought a Wii at retail, they certainly would not be buying them for $500-600 on eBay. So everyone who is not willing to pay the markup just doesn't buy one, that is money lost for Nintendo.

    5. Re:RIAA styled math by Ryan+Hemage · · Score: 1

      It's called "economics".

    6. Re:RIAA styled math by TheGreatGraySkwid · · Score: 1

      That's been around forever!

      It's called "Proctonumerology."

      --
      The Humblest Mollusk on the Net
    7. Re:RIAA styled math by jeffasselin · · Score: 1

      I had never heard this neologism before, but I shall adopt it right away!

      --
      If he explores all forms and substances Straight homeward to their symbol-essences; He shall not die.
    8. Re:RIAA styled math by petermgreen · · Score: 1

      What I don't understand is why nintendo doesn't do the obvious thing and raise the price.

      --
      note: i'm known as plugwash most places but i screwd up registering that here somehow in the past and now can't register
  3. Curious by Infinite+Wave · · Score: 5, Interesting

    I just don't understand how they could not have for seen this shortage. I mean last year the same thing happened and they said then they would be ready for this year. Yet here we are. I have friends, family and co-workers asking me where they can get thier hands on a Wii. It really makes me wonder about the rumors of intentional shorting. From a business point it would make no sense to short your sales. From a marketing point however it's been brilliant. Wii is all the rage and is likely so popular BECAUSE it's hard to get. Nothing lights a fire under middle American purchasing power like that hard to get must have Christmas gift.

    1. Re:Curious by Luminus · · Score: 2, Interesting

      "[the wii] is likely so popular BECAUSE it's hard to get."

        This sounds true in theory, but is not true in practice. The majority of children don't realize that it's a hard to find item - they just know their parents tell them Santa might bring one, and he might not. Certainly they are aware that it's not readily available in the stores, but thinking back to my own childhood, there wasn't a single item (that I _remember_ at least) I wanted badly because it was hard to find. Supply and demand wasn't a huge factor for me when I was 10.

      Moving further on the age scale, a 25 year old friend of mine wanted one because it sounded cool, and because of how I explained it to him. He had a Gamecube and had been a longtime gamer, but didn't have anything next gen (current gen?). He wasn't willing to spend $350+, but he'd gladly spend $250 on a clever system filled with nintendo nostalgia.

      I told him he'd have trouble getting one, and he said, Oh? He had no idea. He then called 9 stores and found one. This was a month ago.

      But when we move to the 30-45 year old crowd, and I can imagine that a big desire to grab anything on their part is because it's hard to find, whether it's for their kids or for themselves. You're at least right about the fact that "Nothing lights a fire under middle American purchasing power like that hard to get must have Christmas gift."

      But the actual desire for the wii, for the people who will spend the most time playing it, is probably less related to it's rarity (although 12 million have been sold...) and more related to it's price and control scheme.

    2. Re:Curious by DrLang21 · · Score: 0

      It's fairly obvious to me that they are intentionally holding back. They know that the competitors to the Wii do not have anything that's the equivalent to the Wii. The type of interaction is different, the types of games are different, and in many cases, the type of people playing are different. So by setting production to meet nice hefty profit goals each quarter, they can draw out their income and keep the demand going. As long as demand is going, game development won't go stale either, giving them that source of royalties as well. Granted, I'm no business expert, but this makes perfect business sense to me.

      --
      I see the glass as full with a FoS of 2.
    3. Re:Curious by AmaDaden · · Score: 1

      I remember reading somewhere about what Nintendo had to say about the shortage. It went something along the lines that knew it was coming but to prevent it they would have to open up a new factory. If the shortage is only for this holiday the cost of opening a new factory would not out weigh the money they would make. Also the factory would only be able to open after the holidays. So they went with taking the conservative road on it by not opening a new and hoping for the best. At the moment they are at full production. You can see that because if you REALLY need one you can get it, after going through the normal holiday hell. You will have to either camp out on expected ship days, get a bundle, or neurotically check web sites. I have a friend who just got one by going the web site route.

    4. Re:Curious by Fozzyuw · · Score: 5, Informative

      I just don't understand how they could not have for seen this shortage.

      They saw the shortage and they knew it was going to happen. The people running Nintendo's financial and business planning know what they're doing and probably have spreadsheets of predicted outcomes.

      The problem is reaching the best profit margin. (Reminding of an old computer game in High School business class) Nintendo could build spend money on 100 new factories and pump out 100 million Wii's in one month to satisfy demand. But what happens when the month is over? Nintendo is left with 100 factories with 1000's of works sitting around picking their noses. Effectively, they'd start hemorrhaging money in keeping said factories with the only recourse to sell the factories.

      Otherwise, they're now pumping out millions of of systems a month that no one is buying, because demand was just satisfied in one orgasmic explosion. All those systems are being pushed into storage, which costs money. Now, we look at something like the PS3 and all the design/model changes it had. If a design/model change happened to the Wii, it'd have to firesale it's entire stock to make way for the new stuff.

      It's a balancing act and Nintendo has the benefit of pop-culture status with the Wii. The "OMG, there's a Wii on the Shelf" shock (thanks to customer experience and news media hype) practically guarantees an impulse purchase, if for no other reason to tell their friends they finally found a Wii (even if they just got a 360/PS3 as a gift).

      Also, Nintendo increased output (that started 5 months ago) to *help* meet holiday demand but as there is with super popular things, there can only be a reasonable amount of product produced. Demand can come in spikes (holidays), but production simply cannot be spiked like that. It takes time to make a product, but takes an instant to create demand. And unlike the 360 or PS3, the Wii hasn't had time to stock up units for the holiday rush as it's been more-or-less sold out since it launched.

      Cheers,
      Fozzy

      --
      "The past was erased, the erasure was forgotten, the lie became truth." ~1984 George Orwell
    5. Re:Curious by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      But according to the article Nintendo could be selling twice as many consoles as they are now. They could be selling hundreds of thousands more consoles than they are selling now and still have a shortage to the point where consoles wouldn't be available in stores. If it was really an intentional shortage, I think this is what they would do.

    6. Re:Curious by pushing-robot · · Score: 2, Informative

      Yes, but tons of people also thought that the Wii was a fad and demand would drop off in the middle of 2007. Factories are damn expensive, and Nintendo didn't want to sink billions into a manufacturing blitz only to have production lines sit idle when the "novelty wore off". They've still dramatically increased production, but they've done so at a more cautious rate.

      The Wii is in uncharted waters: More than a year after its release, it's still selling twice as fast as any console in history. It's silly to think that this is all - somehow - part of Nintendo's sinister master plan.

      --
      How can I believe you when you tell me what I don't want to hear?
    7. Re:Curious by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It really makes me wonder about the rumors of intentional shorting

      It is intentional, but it also makes sense: they could make enough consoles for everyone if they spent billions of dollars to build 1000 factories and staff them to run 24x7. But what do they do with the factories and workers once everyone has a Wii?

      The other solution is to outsource your console construction to Mexico and China like Microsoft did.

    8. Re:Curious by CastrTroy · · Score: 1

      There were rumours that Microsoft did the same thing with the XBox 360 when it first came out. Seems like it didn't work out all that well for them, as their system has been out for twice as long, and has less units sold.

      --

      Anthropic principle: We see the universe the way it is because if it were different we would not be here to see it.
    9. Re:Curious by Neoprofin · · Score: 1, Troll

      I must live in the oddity spot of America.

      I had a large number of friends who were pretty excited about the Wii, I know four who got them, all within the first couple months of the systems release. A couple got it fairly easily, one spent every weekend calling stores until she could find one but even that didn't take more than a month.

      I also know one who still uses it. The supply of worthwhile games between Metroid and Supersmash Brawl has been such a desolate wasteland that they've all moved on. Yes the Wii is cheaper, but what am I going to do with it? I refuse to invest in a next-gen system at the prices they're sitting at especially with the continued production of new, quality, PS2 games.

    10. Re:Curious by MobileTatsu-NJG · · Score: 5, Insightful

      "I just don't understand how they could not have for seen this shortage."

      In the space of a year, Nintendo sold 14 million consoles. That's more than the 360 sold in 2 years. Historically, consoles don't hit 10 mill in a year.

      "It really makes me wonder about the rumors of intentional shorting."

      The Wii was a surprise hit. The surprise wasn't that it's a hit, but that it was such a massive hit. Even the biggest Nintendo fanboy wouldn't have expected nearly this many sales the first year. The Playstation didn't even manage that and Nintendo's last couple of consoles didn't even come close.

      --

      "I like to lick butts!" by MobileTatsu-NJG (#32700246) (Score:5, Informative)

    11. Re:Curious by xero314 · · Score: 1

      When Nintendo said they would be ready for it, what they meant was they would be ready to profit. what is happening is that Nintendo isn't hardly shipping any units, just enough to make it appear that the product is available in stores. Instead they are setting up hundreds of Ebay accounts and selling the hardware directly to the customers through auction. This allows them to charge the same price as Sony and MS with it appearing like they have the cheaper console, while making 4 times the profit they would have with their MSRP.

      If you don't beleive me then check out this stack of Wii's which is more than any Best Buy has received all year.

      Ok there is my conspiracy theory of they day. Enjoy.

    12. Re:Curious by linzeal · · Score: 1

      Average price right now for a Wii is Almost 500 dollars, I live in a small town and there were 40 people waiting for 5 Wii at Gamestop yesterday. I have never seen anything like this for a game console. Half of the people waiting were over 60.

    13. Re:Curious by bleh-of-the-huns · · Score: 3, Interesting

      You hit the nail on the head there with the shelf shock statement. I had been going into local electronics stores whenever I happened by them, for about six months, asking if they had wii's in stock, of course the answer had been a solid no for 6 months, till the day someone said yes.. and I was confused for a min about what to do. Naturally I bought the wii.

      The problem I came across, is that even though I played it for the first week or 2 (this was about 6 months ago too), after that it lost its playing appeal when I was home alone and with the wife (who hates it because the controller is not exact enough and she cannot play with it without getting pissed off). These days, I only play it in party conditions and when we have friends over for dinner. Its a great social game console, but beyond that I find it no fun to play. Unlike my old xbox (non 360), which I can sit and play alone all the time.

      --
      I came, I conquered, I coredumped
    14. Re:Curious by Wdomburg · · Score: 1

      I just don't understand how they could not have for seen this shortage.

      They grossly underestimaed sales. Analyst forecasts were way short as well, so it's not like they were alone in that. They introduced a significantly different product marketed to a much wider demographic than the industry addressed previously. I would have been surprised if their projections were correct since it was essentially just an educated guess.

      And while it was good for sales and installed base that they didn't suffer the typical depressed sales in the summer months, it also means they lost the opportunity to warehouse additional stock for the holiday season. And because of the lead time required to expand capacity they're pretty much stuck.

      I believe that the current plan doesn't actually call for any additional production increases. Additional production wouldn't come online before the holiday anyways and the current production rate of 1.8 million units per month is comfortably ahead of non-holiday sales even discounting that latent demand will decrease over time.

    15. Re:Curious by Pharmboy · · Score: 1

      I think you nailed it. Everyone is looking for a conspiracy when the facts are simply that the unit is THE most successful, ever. You can't "plan" that.

      Hell, even retirement homes are buying Wii systems as fast as they can get them. I don't think the PS3 or 360 will see that kinda demographic broadening.

      --
      Tequila: It's not just for breakfast anymore!
    16. Re:Curious by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Mario Galaxy, Trauma Center 2, Zach and Wiki, Guitar Hero 3...

    17. Re:Curious by ELProphet · · Score: 1

      1. Intentional shortage
      2. Reduce marketing spending
      3. Hype via "Lone-Ranger" marketing
      4. ???
      5. Profit!

    18. Re:Curious by poot_rootbeer · · Score: 1

      Nintendo could build spend money on 100 new factories and pump out 100 million Wii's in one month to satisfy demand. But what happens when the month is over? Nintendo is left with 100 factories with 1000's of works sitting around picking their noses.

      I wouldn't expect Nintendo to double the size of their production force to deal with the current demand. But I do wonder why they didn't start planning at this time last year to raise production capacity by 10% or so -- a relatively low-risk increase which probably STILL would have led to this year's consumer frenzy, but with increased gross sales and greater customer satisfaction.

      If a design/model change happened to the Wii, it'd have to firesale it's entire stock to make way for the new stuff.

      I think there's something to this. Look at how Nintendo began selling the DS Lite 18 months after introducting the original DS, and the Gameboy Advance SP 2 years after the original Gameboy Advance. Wouldn't surprise me at all to learn that Nintendo has been working on a revised version of the Wii hardware (different colors maybe?) and has been avoiding overproducting Mark I consoles to prepare for a forthcoming re-launch.

    19. Re:Curious by mcsqueak · · Score: 1

      From a business point it would make no sense to short your sales. From a marketing point however it's been brilliant.

      No, hype without the ability to deliver is a stupid marketing tactic (full disclosure: I'm a professionally employed marketing goon).

      The whole point of marketing is to increase sales. The only reason companies desire hype is that it can help sell more units (which, if their manufacturing is on target, they'll have available in semi-reasonable quantities). However, Nintendo is already selling their maximum volume produced each and every month. 'Hype' in this case just leads to frustrated consumers and lost sales. Some of these people will return at a later date to purchase a unit, but there will be a percentage that will not. If I was Nintendo, I'd be worried about this.

      I cannot believe that this shortage has been engineered by Nintendo on purpose. There is no company that would short themselves THIS many units and THIS much money, especially right before the end of the year. Keeping a product this hard to find for this long is stupid, not brilliant. This type of hype and product scarcity should be maintained only in the opening weeks. What I think is going on is that Nintendo is betting the cost of opening a new plant to manufacture more Wii's would not pay off in the long run as demand drops. We'll see if this holds true.

      Looking back at how the Gamecube did, I doubt Nintendo expected to sell this many Wii's and didn't plan their manufacturing accordingly... no conspiracy here IMHO, just a failure at proper planning.

    20. Re:Curious by MenTaLguY · · Score: 1

      Those are scalpers, dude.

      --

      DNA just wants to be free...
    21. Re:Curious by xero314 · · Score: 1

      Those are scalpers, dude. Sure they are.
    22. Re:Curious by ultranova · · Score: 1

      You can see that because if you REALLY need one you can get it, after going through the normal holiday hell. You will have to either camp out on expected ship days, get a bundle, or neurotically check web sites. I have a friend who just got one by going the web site route.

      Here in Finland, I could get one just by walking to the nearest store and forking over 260 euros, if I had that much :(.

      --

      Forget magic. Any technology distinguishable from divine power is insufficiently advanced.

    23. Re:Curious by blighter · · Score: 2, Informative

      What about if they saw the demand a year ago and made plans to bump production by 80%? But what if that additional production came nowhere near meeting demand? Because that's what happened: http://www.wired.com/gaming/hardware/news/2007/11/wii_shortage When they started a year ago they had 1M per month capacity, now they're cranking out 1.8M per month and still running way behind demand.

    24. Re:Curious by eison · · Score: 4, Informative

      They doubled capacity. And still can't meet demand.

      I suspect that nobody believed that doubled capacity would continue to sell out during the year; they figured that they would build up a stock to carry them into Christmas season, like every other console ever.

      --
      is competition good, or is duplication of effort bad?
    25. Re:Curious by Danimoth · · Score: 1

      I saw a very interesting chart this morning on CNBC. Last year, the PS3 lead demand with the Wii and Xbox slightly behind it. This year, the demand for a Wii is FOUR TIMES demand for both competing systems combined. I believe this is the link to the relevent piece. http://www.cnbc.com/id/15840232?video=608260302&play=1#

      --
      No smoking sigs indoors.
    26. Re:Curious by UbuntuDupe · · Score: 1

      I'm kind of in the same spot. I got a Wii at launch and as far as I can tell, people aren't having trouble getting it. I suggested to my health care professional that she buy one for her family, and at the next week's visit, she told me she got it, no problem.

      Since, like you, I'm getting kind of bored with it despite having gotten a lot of games, I'd gladly sell it if I could get $500 for it, but i just don't think could pull it off.

    27. Re:Curious by link5280 · · Score: 1

      The are popular becasue Cartman wanted one, he even went to the future to get it.

    28. Re:Curious by Maul · · Score: 1

      What worthwhile exclusive titles have appeared on the XBox 360, or PS3, over the past year? Halo 3 for the Xbox 360 is the only one I can think of. The PS3 has nothing worth mentioning. At least Nintendo has their first party titles, because lately, 3rd. party titles on all systems have been pretty lackluster.

      --

      "You spoony bard!" -Tellah

    29. Re:Curious by RobBebop · · Score: 1

      Reminding of an old computer game in High School business class

      The Lemonade Stand game? or Drug Wars? both were fun. :)

      I like my Wii, though it is fundamentally different from MSFT or Sony so the target audience is different. I don't get blown away by killer graphics, I've never gotten into online gaming, and I don't spend that much time gaming in general. I think a lot of people are like me... and this group doesn't care if they get it now or later.

      Furthermore, the killer single player games are out (Metroid, Zelda, Mario Galaxy, Mario Paper, Resident Evil, Fire Emblem) but Nintendo excels at multi-player games that you can play with friends. Next year you'll see Mario Cart and Smash Bros... and they will do well there.

      What's more... the only game from above that is available on other systems is Resident Evil. Exclusivity deals are something that is lacking in XBox/PS3. That means it makes much less sense for somebody who has a Xbox to get a PS3, but this type of person would have to get a Wii to play the awesome exclusive titles that are out.

      --
      Support the 30 Hour Work Week!!!
    30. Re:Curious by Ang31us · · Score: 1

      As the biggest Nintendo fanboy, I have to say that I did expected the Wii to DECIMATE ALL in this console war all along. I knew this system was going to !!!ROCK!!! when they first announced it.

      I also have to say that I expected Wiis to be available on shelves in February of 2007...so, yes, even I under-estimated by how much the Wii would annihilate its competition.

    31. Re:Curious by hey! · · Score: 1

      I'm not sure that makes any sense. They make money on games sold, and when customers can't buy the console, or worse go to a competitor, Nintendo loses.

      Why not simply raise the price? This is already happening de facto, as people snag Wiis and resell them on eBay for $200 over MSRP (questionable warranty to boot), and resellers sell incredibly lame bundles for $500 or even $600. This is classical Econ 101: buyers are demanding more at MSRP than Nintendo can produce, so the theory goes that Nintendo should raise the price until supply and demand balance. This would allow them to produce more by hiring more expensive production lines (I assume this is totally outsourced), and snatch customers for future game sales.

      Since Nintendo won't raise the price, speculators have done it for them. So why doesn't Nintendo just do it? The excuse that they demand is hard to predict is lame; the Wii has been hard to get forever, they had to know that they weren't producing enough.

      My guess is that it is brilliant marketing, but not because Nintendo benefits from a shortage. They know something about consumer behavior that is not obvious to the casual observer.

      I suspect it has something to do with product positioning. The Wii is not, technologically speaking, very sophisticated. Presumably Nintendo could have designed a console that went toe to toe with the PS3 or XBox 360. But why duke it out in a crowded niche when you can create a new niche and own it completely? That means you have to be at a different price, because no matter what subtle marketing cues you give the customer, if the Wii were priced the same as a PS3, the consumer would set the two boxes side by side and start asking questions like which has the most realistic graphics.

      So they can go higher or lower, but realistically, higher isn't a viable option when the competition is already so good at stuff you pay lots of money for. So you go with a simpler, cheaper, more family friendly box and give it a few neat but cheap gimmicks.

      I don't doubt in the least that the Wii is a much bigger success than they dreamed it would be when it was on the drawing boards, but it certainly isn't a bigger success in December of 2007 than the expected it to be in June of 2007. The problem is they can't ramp up production without raising prices, and they can't raise prices without inviting comparisons to things their box was never meant to be compared to. So they live with other people effectively raising the price for them, even though they (theoretically) are leaving profits on the table. Those profits are illusory, because a box with a higher MSRP whttp://games.slashdot.org/comments.pl
      Wii Shortages Costing Nintendo 'A Billion' In Salesouldn't sell when stacked up against a competitor's console.

      In the meantime, the average consumer curses the greed of the speculators and bundlers, but the accusation of greed never sticks to Nintendo, after all they are keeping the price low, right? They grumpily shell out $450 or more for a Wii, but they by in large don't even consider that they might get a more powerful XBox 360 for a hundred dollars less. It's not a substitute for the Wii, because the Wii is a different class of product. Keeping it that way requires a low, low MSRP. Nintendo tolerates speculators because when you crunch the numbers, and those numbers include accurate predictions of consumer behavior, they're better off allowing a secondary market to be created.

      --
      Post may contain irony: discontinue use if experiencing mood swings, nausea or elevated blood pressure.
    32. Re:Curious by MeanderingMind · · Score: 1

      Nintendo technically has the power to raise the price. They won't for a very obvious reason, PR. There are very, very few items classified under "electronics" that get to cost more as time goes on. A price hike on a video game system is completely unprecedented, and would bring with it incredible amounts of negative press.

      Consider how much negative press Sony has received for their hubris and minor slip ups. Multiply that by several orders and you'll have the general reaction to a price hike.

      --
      Thunderclone: ONE MAN ENTERS! TWO MEN LEAVE! ONE MAN ENTERS! TWO MEN LEAVE!
    33. Re:Curious by MeanderingMind · · Score: 1

      That account has existed since Nov '00. That's some foresight on Nintendo's part.

      --
      Thunderclone: ONE MAN ENTERS! TWO MEN LEAVE! ONE MAN ENTERS! TWO MEN LEAVE!
    34. Re:Curious by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Nice little anecdote, but there are 15 million other Wii users calling BS on that.

    35. Re:Curious by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      ...but takes an instant to create demand.

      We'd be very interested in hearing more. Please contact us at marketing@sony.com

      Thanks.
    36. Re:Curious by hey! · · Score: 1

      I don't think they'd get bad PR at all. All they have to say is that by raising the price to $330 anybody who wants one can get one right away, and nobody has to go to a scalper reselling warranty-less wiis for $450 or more. This would be a move that almost unquestionably would be good for their customers.

      They would get zero bad PR except for the people who bellyache about everything, including the status quo. The problem is that when you got to the store you'd sure as heck look at the XBox 360 which cost only $10 more, and ask why you'd pay so much for a console that is clearly less powerful. A lot of people paying $450 for Wiis wouldn't even look twice at them if they cost $120 less than they're paying now.

      --
      Post may contain irony: discontinue use if experiencing mood swings, nausea or elevated blood pressure.
    37. Re:Curious by PixelScuba · · Score: 1

      The bigger question... for me at least... is WHY is it a surprise hit? There still are so few, really good reasons to own a Wii. In the past year very few blockbuster titles have been released... and others delayed. People are quick to claim that Nintendo made a console that is "just for everybody" and people are buying it in droves because it is so awesome and original... but I don't think so. I have never met anyone who didn't grow up with video games even give another thought to the Wii above any other console. My parents bought one for the grandkids and were totally confused and could care less. My old coworkers... could care less. Grandparents... don't care.

      I still believe that the reason... the REAL reason... the Wii is selling is the "cool" factor. Why did everyone want a Tickle me Elmo? Why do certain Action Figures sell out? Something picks up steam and word of mouth and soon everyone wants one... the less they can find it... the more they want it. I know tons of people who bought Wiis the first year because they thought it was cool... now it collects dust because they beat the 3 games they owned and nothing has been released. I owned one myself but never saw the allure. A fine console... but not amazing like it is claimed. If the Wii is TRULY selling to every demograph and a huge hit... then me being an average slice of the consumer market should see it... but I just don't.

    38. Re:Curious by MobileTatsu-NJG · · Score: 1

      "The bigger question... for me at least... is WHY is it a surprise hit? "

      Price. Intuitive games. Intuitive controls. Virtual Console.

      --

      "I like to lick butts!" by MobileTatsu-NJG (#32700246) (Score:5, Informative)

    39. Re:Curious by mcsqueak · · Score: 1

      What worthwhile exclusive titles have appeared on the XBox 360, or PS3, over the past year? Halo 3 for the Xbox 360 is the only one I can think of.

      I'd agree with this. The Xbox 360 also had Gears of War for awhile, but thats out on the PC now. As far as the Wii is concerned, it has had one Metroid game, two Mario games and an exclusive packed-in Sports title that still remains incredibly popular.

      Some of the 3rd party, non-exclusive games have been well done too: Godfather and Lego Star Wars The Complete Saga come to mind.

      I use to be a hardcore gamer in my youth, but now that I'm an adult with a job and all that stuff I just don't have the time. I find the Wii fits into my life well and offers a good range of game types.

    40. Re:Curious by MeanderingMind · · Score: 1

      I don't believe your prediction would pan out in reality for several reasons.

      1) Raising the price will only potentially curb demand. It will not place additional Wiis on shelves in time for Christmas, let alone "right away".
      2) Your solution works by reducing the number of people who will want the console via the price hike. These people are very unlikely to be happy about Nintendo making consoles available to other people by making consoles unavailable to them. Their criticism will be voiced, and it wouldn't be bellyaching.
      3) No console (bundles excluded) has ever had its price raised in the history of video games. Were Nintendo to do so, it would be unprecedented and worthy of plenty of media attention (and criticism).

      But then again, we can always agree to disagree.

      --
      Thunderclone: ONE MAN ENTERS! TWO MEN LEAVE! ONE MAN ENTERS! TWO MEN LEAVE!
    41. Re:Curious by hey! · · Score: 1

      I don't believe your prediction would pan out in reality for several reasons.


      I'm not predicting a price rise. I'm predicting there WON'T be a price rise. I'm just saying PR has nothing to do with it.

      1) Raising the price will only potentially curb demand. It will not place additional Wiis on shelves in time for Christmas, let alone "right away".


      Exactly what I've been saying. The only thing is it's not because people aren't willing to pay, say, $330 for the Wii. They aren't going to pay $330 for an XBox alternative that is considerably less powerful.

      2) Your solution works by reducing the number of people who will want the console via the price hike.


      I'm assuming no such thing. I'm assuming they have some suppliers who can build a Wii for (say) $100, and others who can build a Wii for $200. If they are wholesaling the Wii at a price that allows the retailer to sell a Wii for $230, then clearly they can't use the $200 factory. If they're selling at a price that allows the retailer to sell it at $330, they can afford to hire the second factory (or chip fabrication facility, whatever is the financial bottleneck). They could end up spending more for each Wii, selling it to the retailer for more, who puts it on the shelf for more money, and the result would be that consumers could easily get their hands on one for less than they're spending now.

      The important thing to remember is that the MSRP is not the market price. The market price for a Wii is currently around $450, judging from ebay auctions. An increase in MSRP and wholesale price would actually reduce the market price for a Wii. Unfortunately although the actual market price would fall, consumer demand would collapse, because consumers don't use a rational decision process like cost/benefit to decide what they buy. If they did, Nintendo could raise the MSRP, and consumers would buy more of them at a de facto lower market price.

      3) No console (bundles excluded) has ever had its price raised in the history of video games. Were Nintendo to do so, it would be unprecedented and worthy of plenty of media attention (and criticism).


      I don't believe this is true. Even if it were true, they could simply "upgrade" the machine in some modest way. True, some people would criticize them, but who cares? They're criticizing now and creating crackpot conspiracy theories to boot. Why not give the consumer a cut in actual market price and make it easy for him to find product? By any rational standard this would be a good thing for consumers.

      Because consumers aren't rational. It's not that they'll criticize Nintendo. It's just that they value a $230 MSRP console at $450 or more if it is hard to find. They would value the same console less if it were priced at $330 and easy to find at that price.
      --
      Post may contain irony: discontinue use if experiencing mood swings, nausea or elevated blood pressure.
    42. Re:Curious by petermgreen · · Score: 1

      Another reason I can think of is nostalgia. There must be many people who had nes's megadrives and so on who really liked some of the games but thier hardware died or they sold it to get the next generation of console or because they didn't have room for it and buying secondhand equipment that old is always something of a gamblem. Emultation on PCs is one route but its always been a bit of an undergound activity since for most people the only practical way to get the games to run in such emulators is to pirate them.

      with the Wii they can buy those games from the comfort of thier own home and play them on a modern and reliable console.

      --
      note: i'm known as plugwash most places but i screwd up registering that here somehow in the past and now can't register
    43. Re:Curious by dtjohnson · · Score: 1

      These days, I only play it in party conditions and when we have friends over for dinner. Its a great social game console, but beyond that I find it no fun to play.

      If your experience were common, then ebay and Craig's list would be flooded with used Wiis' for sale. As it is, used Wiis' for sale are relatively rare. The truth is that the Wii is a great console that people find to be a lot of fun. Yes, there are a lot of crappy games for Wii that are just cheap ports of PS2 or Xbox 360 games. A few of these are good such as Resident Evil 4 or Guitar Hero 3 but most are not. No, there are not a lot of great Wii games yet. Yes, most of the better Wii games are from Nintendo, such as Zelda or Super Mario Galaxy.

      All of that is about to change, though. There are a lot of native Wii games that are due in the next 3-6 months that will finally natively use the Wii's Broadway processor, controllers, and built-in wireless internet connectivity. With its motion-sensitive wireless controllers with individual sound channels, the Wii has the potential for some awesomely good online multiplayer games, which it lacks now.

    44. Re:Curious by PixelScuba · · Score: 1

      The 360 is relatively the same price... $270, even if it is the version without the HDD it is still a "360" as far as they care. The people buying them as gifts don't care about price, for the most part... if their kid wants a 360, then so be it, that's what they'll get.

      This is an honest to god response I got from a middle aged woman at work when I told her my parents were looking for a Wii, "What's that?" the other secretary said "It's the thing where you move your arms around to bowl." the first woman replied "Ugh, no thanks." i know this is just a silly anecdotal story... but this isn't the first time I've hear the Wii described as a toy. People say "old people and every generation are playing the Wii" and the commercials try to paint that, too... but I have never seen it. I'm sure there will be a story or two of a grandparent using it... but it just isn't happening. The people buying them are the same gamers that have always bought consoles and kids who ask their parents for it because it's the hot new item. I'm sorry if it hurts to hear, but I just don't see the "outreach" people claim the Wii has... I really think it's just the hot thing to have, particularly because you can't find it.

    45. Re:Curious by buffer-overflowed · · Score: 1

      The Wii library satisfies genre needs/gaming itches the other two libraries don't. It's a very different library, so I can understand why someone who views gaming through the lens of what's currently available on the 360 and PS3 as the end all be all would not find very many reasons to purchase one(I don't find much appealing about the 360/PS3 lineups either, fwiw). For instance Zack&Wiki, Trauma Center, the upcoming game No More Heroes. All niche, downright odd titles or throwbacks, and there's no equivalents really elsewhere, outside handhelds.

      My parents own one. Wii Sports got them hooked, and my Dad loves Tiger Woods golf. If they ever truly nail a motion-based golf game(Tiger and it's ilk fall a bit short), I know my uncles and grandfather would snap a system up in a heartbeat.

      Honestly, I picked up a Wii for novelty. I figured best case, I'd get a ton of wierd thought experiments, some genres, and some genuinely new fare. Worst case, I'd get a new way to play some older genres. So far, I'm pretty happy with it. It's not balls to the wall amazing, but I wasn't expecting it to be.

      --
      The key to the enjoyment of pop music is to replace any instance of "love" with "C.H.U.D."
    46. Re:Curious by MobileTatsu-NJG · · Score: 1

      This is an honest to god response I got from a middle aged woman at work when I told her my parents were looking for a Wii, "What's that?" the other secretary said "It's the thing where you move your arms around to bowl." the first woman replied "Ugh, no thanks." i know this is just a silly anecdotal story... but this isn't the first time I've hear the Wii described as a toy.. I've had a very different experience. The big appeal was that you could, believe it or not, bowl. That was the thing about the Wii's launch that absolutely floored me. Bowling was the BFD. Several of my coworkers, all 360 addicts, went Wii hunting so they could bowl and compare scores the next day. Then they'd all talk about how it was like a workout. Man... I still can't get over that. Bowling.

      I'm sorry if it hurts to hear, but I just don't see the "outreach" people claim the Wii has... I really think it's just the hot thing to have, particularly because you can't find it. You're not hurting my feelings. Heck, I'm sad about the lack of game selection at the moment. I still love the machine, but I'm seriously considering a 360 to augment it. That said, though, I think you're downplaying the bit about the interactive controls. They are appealing. It's a different, more intuitive control scheme, especially considering the barrage of buttons modern consoles have on their controllers. Heck, I'm a gamer, and I feel it's daunting. I remember back in the PS2 days one of the big things that kept me from really going out and buying tons of games was the groaning sound I'd make at being presented with this big epic game and trying to sort out what the developer had in mind when they laid out the buttons. It got even more confusing when the same developer made two different franchises. I remember going from San Andreas to Bully... wow that transition sucked. They weren't so different that it was unfamiliar, but man, there were differences in the control that I just didn't understand. It was baffling considering that both games share a lot of similarities. It made me yearn for better control.

      But.. now I'm just babbling. I respectfully disagree. Not because I'm a 'righteous' Nintendo fan. But rather because I watched the hype wave rise all around me. I never got the sense it was "I have one and you don't, thpbpbpbpbp". Believe me, I've seen that before. I used to be a video game salesman. Aye carumba.
      --

      "I like to lick butts!" by MobileTatsu-NJG (#32700246) (Score:5, Informative)

    47. Re:Curious by ravenlock · · Score: 1

      I thought there might be a shortage so I put in a mail order for one in mid-November, so I'd have it in time for Christmas. As it turns out, there's plenty of Wiis to go around here, so now I've been having to restrain myself from ripping the packaging open for a full month and then some. :-P

    48. Re:Curious by ookaze · · Score: 1

      I just don't understand how they could not have for seen this shortage. I mean last year the same thing happened and they said then they would be ready for this year. Uh, no!
      They said some months ago (IIRC October) through their marketing guy, that they would not meet demand, and that you should get a Wii while you could. IIRC it was even posted here.

      I have friends, family and co-workers asking me where they can get thier hands on a Wii. It really makes me wonder about the rumors of intentional shorting. From a business point it would make no sense to short your sales. From a marketing point however it's been brilliant. Wii is all the rage and is likely so popular BECAUSE it's hard to get. Uh, no!
      The Wii has sold more in 1 year than any other console ever did, which is insane, and they increased production to 1.8 M/month in 1 year.
      Keep in mind this is what the most successful consoles get in their last years of like, when they're hugely popular and low price. The Wii was there less than 1 year after launch, so this is insane too!!

      So that's not what I would call "intentional shorting". People that say that are stupid and have zero insight in the videogame industry.
    49. Re:Curious by grumbel · · Score: 1

      ### If you don't beleive me then check out this stack of Wii's which is more than any Best Buy has received all year.

      Wii shortages are local problems, not global ones. From what I have heard there are quite a few places that have plenty of Wiis, so its no suprise that somebody buys them and resells them.

    50. Re:Curious by ShadowsHawk · · Score: 1

      My experience has been the exact opposite. I'm a gamer, but my friends, relatives and wife are not. I bought one at launch because I thought it looked fun. I had it set up at Christmas and New Year's eve. Both night were a smash hit because of the Wii and several friends and relatives sought out their own to purchase. One never purchased anything beyond the Wii and three additional remotes. The rest have continued to purchase games like Excite truck, Mario party, Need for speed and Rayman's raving rabbids(very fun).

      Personally, I don't fret at the drought. I own Zelda, Metroid Prime 3, Rayman, Wii play and Paper Mario. Between those games and my PC, I have more than enough to fill what little spare time that I manage find. I think you under estimate the hands on 'fun factor' that drives people to purchase the Wii.

    51. Re:Curious by PixelScuba · · Score: 1

      True, buttons have become daunting... press this with this to crouch and fire mode 2. Metroid Prime 3 was an excellent use of the controls to play a 3D shooter. I think when you said you were going to augment your gaming library by having a 360 and a Wii is the most important part. Sometimes I don't want to monkey around and swing my arms like a gorilla... sometimes I want to sit on the couch with a controller and just be a vegetable. With the power of the other 2 consoles, there are many games the Wii simply can't do... which you need another console if you enjoy them (loved 'Dead Rising', Gears of War and a number of other 360 releases). I was particularly excited about the new Ghostbusters game and was saddened that the Wii version is dumbed down to a cartoon... I want photo-realistic shaders and high poly models with real time lighting and other buzz words for my Ghostbusters gaming experience... but would love to use the Wii controls.

      OK, so I'm rambling now and forgot where I was going with this. I think it will take some time before we will know if the Wii sold because it was hot... or peopel really wanted one. If Nintendo moves tons of games for the system, since there are so many in homes, then it probably was true... but if game sales are lax and people don't purchase many, I would argue it was probably a fad. We'll see, you might be right.

    52. Re:Curious by jbash · · Score: 1

      I just don't understand how they could not have for seen this shortage. Hindsight is always 20/20. But if you were a Nintendo executive last July (and lacking a crystal ball), you would have had to make your best guess for your manufacturing allocation by looking at the lessons learned by Tyco, maker of Tickle Me Elmo, another Christmas hit from a few years ago.

      Tyco put all its energy into manufacturing as many Tickle Me Elmos as it could, and by January and February after Christmas the market was flooded, and nobody wanted the toy anymore. Plus if you've got a product you're selling, it's definitely not bad if you've got customers begging for it. So Nintendo erred on the side of caution.
    53. Re:Curious by Neoprofin · · Score: 1

      Assassins Creed, Bioshock, Mass Effect, Blue Dragon... those are just the ones I've played personally.

  4. Aftershocks by Fozzyuw · · Score: 4, Insightful

    All told, these same individuals believe the company could be leaving as much as $1 billion on the table this holiday season.

    The question I have is, ok it's $1 billion this holiday season but what about the after affects of the holiday? How many people who are dying to get the Wii (but can't) will still go and buy it in Jan., Feb., Mar.? My guess? A lot. Considering they've been doing it since Nov. 2006.

    It reminds of the pirated music idea. A person who pirates music(or movies) isn't necessarly going to be buying said music(or movies). Thus, one cannot say that pirating is a 1:1 effect on sales. Likewise, you cannot say that people who cannot buy a Wii as a gift for the holidays will not buy one after the holidays. Theoretically, if the Big N satisfied demand in December, they would then loose all those Q1 2008 sales. So, what's the point? The real question is, if those who want a Wii, but bought a 360/PS3, will still buy a Wii in the future?

    Cheers,
    Fozzy

    --
    "The past was erased, the erasure was forgotten, the lie became truth." ~1984 George Orwell
    1. Re:Aftershocks by MechaBlue · · Score: 1

      Great points.

      Some more thoughts:
      - Of the $1 billion in sales, how much of that is profit? At 20%, that's $200 million in profits.
      - What are the costs of ramping up production? If current facilities are churning out as many as possible, stepping up production may be expensive.
      - How long will the increased production be needed?

      Of course, this all ties into what you were saying about people buying Wiis in 2008. Especially since certain retailers (and Nintendo?) offering rain checks for them.

      Last year, there was talk about the shortage being a result of Nintendo not wanting to scale up production because increase sales wouldn't justify the increased production costs. It wouldn't surprise me to see the exact same situation this year and possibly next year, too.

    2. Re:Aftershocks by LoverOfJoy · · Score: 1

      There's definitely no 1:1 ratio but the lost sales are real. I'm not even talking about people buying a 360/PS3 instead.

      If I'm planning on spending $X00.00 for my kids for Christmas and I had hoped to spend it on the Wii and Wii related products, then if it's sold out, I MIGHT give my kids an IOU for the wii and give it to them next month...but the remaining money I would have spent on extra controllers and games will now be spent on something else because I can't bear to give them temporarily useless products for Christmas.

      Come January/February I won't magically have more money to spend on all the extras. At best I'll have skimped on Christmas enough to buy the console and an extra controller and that's about it.

    3. Re:Aftershocks by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "Loose" and "lose" are not interchangeable.

    4. Re:Aftershocks by CastrTroy · · Score: 1

      Exactly. They've been going since November 2006 without anybody being able to find one anywhere. If they can keep that momentum up for a year, why not until March, April, or even next Christmas. The only point at which any of this will be hurting Nintendo is when they aren't able to see every single unit within days of it hitting store shelves.

      --

      Anthropic principle: We see the universe the way it is because if it were different we would not be here to see it.
    5. Re:Aftershocks by Fozzyuw · · Score: 1

      "Loose" and "lose" are not interchangeable.

      Thanks, I often make these spelling/grammar mistakes and never properly proof read. I just phonetically spell something out without thinking twice or looking back. I'll look out for it in the future (along with my other popular misspelling waist and waste). It's a dumb mistake and I like being called out on it to change my habit.

      Cheers,
      Fozzy

      --
      "The past was erased, the erasure was forgotten, the lie became truth." ~1984 George Orwell
    6. Re:Aftershocks by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Don't apologize to grammar/spelling Nazis. Fuck them for not being able to pull there head out of their collective asses long enough to realize that they're retarded for thinking that everyone everywhere cares about ZOMG! a mispelled word!!!

      That's write... Fuck you grammar nazis. Fuck you write in you're ear. People make mistakes. Deal with it.

    7. Re:Aftershocks by Skapare · · Score: 1

      My younger nephew wants a Wii. But he said he'd take something else instead. He's too young (8) to be in much of a financial position to buy these things on his own. So I must decide if I get him some other game console, or cash.

      --
      now we need to go OSS in diesel cars
    8. Re:Aftershocks by gatzke · · Score: 1


      Last January my wife found out that the local Target was getting some Wiis. She sent me out at 5:00 AM to wait in the parking lot.

      6:00 nobody.

      7:00 nobody.

      8:00 nobody.

      A handful of people showed up about half an hour before opening. We all got a Wii, no elbowing.

      I did not have whiny kid to satisfy before Christmas, so January worked for me.

      I love my Wii. I have help sell a number of other families on them. I should get a cut...

    9. Re:Aftershocks by bcattwoo · · Score: 1

      Yes, but if you were Nintendo would you rather have that $1 billion for sure now or possibly in the future? Wouldn't it be better to get the consoles in the customers hands and have them buying games as soon as possible? And for some people the money for a console and a couple of games may have been rebudgeted for other Christmas presents and won't be available again for a while.

    10. Re:Aftershocks by rhizome · · Score: 1

      How many people who are dying to get the Wii (but can't) will still go and buy it in Jan., Feb., Mar.?

      We already know the answer from our experience over the past year: all of them will wait and buy it later. Anybody who doesn't is just noise in the system. Nintendo was losing a billion (or some other made up number) last year, too.

      --
      When I was a kid, we only had one Darth.
    11. Re:Aftershocks by Toonol · · Score: 1

      And would no doubt love to lose another billion in the same fashion every year until they are richer than Microsoft.

    12. Re:Aftershocks by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      ok it's $1 billion this holiday season but what about the after affects of the holiday?

      Um, which holiday? Exactly how long is this holiday season to which you refer? Does it include President's day? Independence day? We basically have 1 holiday a month every month so where do you cut it off and for that matter, when did it start?

  5. What are people buying instead? by HockeyPuck · · Score: 2, Insightful

    If a $Billion is being left on the table, where are people spending it on? 360? PS3? Or how about this new fangled , environmentally friendly device called:

    GO OUTSIDE AND PLAY!

    Includes such games as Real World TENNIS (indoor and outdoor versions available)
    Real World BOWLING (available at a bowling alley near you).

    Both games come with a bonus titled called, GETTING FRESH AIR.

    *please do not frame me if the Wii is you only source of activity b/c of age/disability/religion/sex/creed/political stance.

    1. Re:What are people buying instead? by plague3106 · · Score: 5, Funny

      I'm spending it on mercury, then dumping it in the local lake. On the way home, I run over squirrels and cute bunnies.

    2. Re:What are people buying instead? by MarioMax · · Score: 1

      > Both games come with a bonus titled called, GETTING FRESH AIR.

      Fresh air doesn't always exist outside, especially in a heavy urban environment. I know a few people that got harsh lung diseases because they went jogging outside in a major city. The doctors told them they would need to stop going outside, or they wouldn't be healthy again. Kind of ironic, don'tcha think?

    3. Re:What are people buying instead? by Sciros · · Score: 1

      Dude you can do that with unmanned vehicles nowadays from the comfort of your own home. I really don't understand why going outside or driving around is at all necessary for this, and frankly I recommend avoiding it because if you mistake a moose for a bunny you'll at least be ok yourself.

      --
      I like basketball!!1!
    4. Re:What are people buying instead? by Chris+Burke · · Score: 5, Funny

      Includes such games as Real World TENNIS (indoor and outdoor versions available)

      I'm not sure where you are, but up here in the Northern Hemisphere it's winter when Christmas time comes. Even as far south as Texas playing outdoor sports is not something most people, even athletic, think is a good idea.

      As far as indoor, while it may be a helpful, I don't know many kids who are going to think "fitness club membership" is an awesome gift.

      bowling alley... FRESH AIR.

      You know in my word association, "fresh air" makes me think "bowling alley" just before I think "corner dive bar".

      --

      The enemies of Democracy are
    5. Re:What are people buying instead? by steveo777 · · Score: 1

      At least you're doing all that in the FRESH AIR.

      --
      This sig isn't original enough, it's time to come up with something witty...
    6. Re:What are people buying instead? by MobileTatsu-NJG · · Score: 4, Funny

      If a $Billion is being left on the table, where are people spending it on? 360? PS3? Or how about this new fangled , environmentally friendly device called:

      GO OUTSIDE AND PLAY! I hear ya, man. I wish I could impose my views on everybody in the world, too.
      --

      "I like to lick butts!" by MobileTatsu-NJG (#32700246) (Score:5, Informative)

    7. Re:What are people buying instead? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      About that whole GETTING FRESH AIR thing...have you ever been to a real bowling alley?

    8. Re:What are people buying instead? by moderatorrater · · Score: 1

      a bowling alley near you...come[s] with a bonus titled called, GETTING FRESH AIR I don't know what the bowling alleys are like where you live, but this is a patently false statement from all of my experiences.
    9. Re:What are people buying instead? by ChefInnocent · · Score: 1

      To add to this comment, let me say my local tennis courts have 4" of snow on them (other locations have more) with a sheet of ice below that. If the snow didn't imped the ball from it's normally regular path, I'm sure the extreme sport of ice tennis would put some folks off from it.

    10. Re:What are people buying instead? by lucabrasi999 · · Score: 1
      Includes such games as Real World TENNIS (indoor and outdoor versions available)
      Real World BOWLING (available at a bowling alley near you).

      Both games come with a bonus titled called, GETTING FRESH AIR.


      Fresh air? In a bowling alley?

    11. Re:What are people buying instead? by hoover · · Score: 1

      I'd mod your comment up if I had points right now, but you forgot about the bonus "to go" foot fungi you pick up in those old, rented bowling shoes ;-)

      --
      Ever wondered whats wrong with the world? http://www.ishmael.org/
    12. Re:What are people buying instead? by Cid+Highwind · · Score: 1

      Meh, "TENNIS", "BOWLING" and "GETTING FRESH AIR" got so-so reviews from gamespot.

      I'm holding out for "HEY YOU KIDS, GET OFF MY LAWN", and "IN MY DAY WE PLAYED WITH STICKS AND ROCKS, AND WE LIKED IT". They sound like titles you might be interested in too...

      --
      0 1 - just my two bits
    13. Re:What are people buying instead? by Kevin+Stevens · · Score: 1

      Or also the fact that even on an entry level tennis will still cost you about $200 to get into- two rackets, plus some balls- assuming you even have a tennis court near you- I sure did not have one in walk/bicycle range. Its also kind of tough to play at night, or by yourself, etc. etc.

      I think the OP is just jealous that they haven't come out with "Shaking Your Cane At Kids to Get Off Your Lawn" complete with a Cane accessory for the Wii yet.

    14. Re:What are people buying instead? by Chris+Burke · · Score: 1

      I think the OP is just jealous that they haven't come out with "Shaking Your Cane At Kids to Get Off Your Lawn" complete with a Cane accessory for the Wii yet.

      Wasn't that in Wario Ware for the Wii? If not, it should be in the sequel.

      --

      The enemies of Democracy are
    15. Re:What are people buying instead? by fyrewulff · · Score: 1

      No thanks, good luck finding a bowling alley who's air isn't made out of 90% cigarette smoke.

      Or finding a close by tennis court that doesn't have local gangs hanging around it, then buying the expensive tennis racquets and the tennis balls and hoping you don't knock them into the street and a car hits it and flips and explodes and you're now going to jail because you didn't get a Wii.

      --
      "We need to get over this notion, that, for Apple to win... Microsoft must lose." - Steve Jobs, 1997
    16. Re:What are people buying instead? by BostonVaulter · · Score: 1

      Makes me glad to live in Hawaii. I can still go to the beach or play tennis. Too bad I never leave my room...

      --
      Happy Puppy User
    17. Re:What are people buying instead? by Guppy06 · · Score: 1

      "GO OUTSIDE AND PLAY!"

      As opposed to sitting inside and trolling on Slashdot?

    18. Re:What are people buying instead? by prestonmichaelh · · Score: 1

      Or also the fact that even on an entry level tennis will still cost you about $200 to get into- two rackets, plus some balls- assuming you even have a tennis court near you- I sure did not have one in walk/bicycle range. Its also kind of tough to play at night, or by yourself, etc. etc.

      Although I agree that the OP is wrong (I'll get to that in a second), this seems like a little bit of an exaggeration for effect. If you are just getting into tennis, you don't need a $100 racket. My first racket cost $25. I now play regularly (at least once a week) and bought myself my "dream" racket (for me at least) after doing a lot of research on them and it still only cost $80 and I absolutely love it. Now if I was trying to enter tournaments and win every one, I might get a $100+ racket, but as a casual player (as I said once or twice a week with my dad or friends) I kind of view my $80 racket as a splurge even then. Balls cost $3-4 a can, so all together, assuming you have some kind of athletic shoes, you probably would need about $50-60 to get started. If you can convince a friend to start trying to play with you, then you only need about $30 since your friend can buy their own racket. Also, I am not sure where you live, but here in Texas at least (where football is king remember) just about every public high school has at least 1 or 2 courts at it that are free for anyone to play on (as long as the high school isn't currently having practice or a tournament). Also (again, this may be different in different states), pretty much everyone I know lives within bicycle range of a high school (some rides may be a little long admittedly). Lastly, most of those courts have lights that are on at least a couple of times a week and even have a plywood board with a net high line painted on it for practicing by yourself.

      Now with all that said I haven't played in the past month due to the cold, wind, and rain (and remember I am in Texas). I have played tennis on my Wii though. So even though I normally play real tennis once a week, these last few weeks have had to be Wii tennis weeks due to the weather.

      As for bowling, there are probably 3 or 4 bowling alleys left in my general area (close enough for me to consider driving to). They all fall into one of two categories, $20-25 per game per person (way too expensive IMHO) or a place where I fear getting shot/robbed/suffocated by smoking. I love bowling, but actual bowling alleys seem to have been in great decline lately and the ones left are either too expensive to go to a lot, or too scary to go to at all. I have loved having my Wii and getting to go bowling again, even if it is just a simulation.
    19. Re:What are people buying instead? by Chrisje · · Score: 1

      I don't know how many BOWLING ALLEYS (tm) you've been to recently, but I haven't noticed any FRESH AIR (R) around them.

    20. Re:What are people buying instead? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Instead of getting our kid Guitar Hero + game console, we got him a guitar + lessons. Much cheaper than game + console. Now, 6 months later, he can actually play guitar, while his buddies are still pressing 5 buttons while watching TV. Games are OK, but they seem to be purchased without thought by parents.

    21. Re:What are people buying instead? by DigitalCrackPipe · · Score: 1

      Even as far south as Texas playing outdoor sports is not something most people, even athletic, think is a good idea.

      In southern Arizona, winter is the time it doesn't pass 100 degrees Fahrenheit at any time during the day. So yes, we go outside in the winter and play outdoor sports (like tennis, rock climbing, frisbee, etc). With the same people we play Wii with (because games are a different kind of fun; there's time for both). And if we were in snow country, the winter sports wouldn't be the same outdoors, but there *are* winter sports fully intended to be played in the snow.

  6. Nothing new from Nintendo... by Dmala · · Score: 1

    Nintendo has been doing this since the very first days of the NES. In the beginning, I think the lesson of Atari's "ET parking lot" was fresh in their minds, and they didn't want to get stuck with warehouses full of crap they can't sell. These days, I have to think that they've figured out that the long term benefit of the frenzy that is created far outweighs any short term losses.

    1. Re:Nothing new from Nintendo... by Grave · · Score: 1

      Not to mention that with demand so high, they have a great bargaining chip with retailers.. Oh, you're not selling enough of game X, so we're not going to ship more Wii's until you ramp up sales. Sure, retailers make almost nothing on a Wii sale, but people buying Wii's generally also buy games and controllers along with them, thus making a shipment of Wii's very important.

    2. Re:Nothing new from Nintendo... by jimicus · · Score: 1

      Nintendo has been doing this since the very first days of the NES.

      For over a year post release?

    3. Re:Nothing new from Nintendo... by Dmala · · Score: 1

      Actually, yes. From what I've read and what I recall, there were holiday shortages of the NES for several years running in the mid-to-late 80s. They kept it going for quite a while with well hyped releases (Zelda, SMB2, etc.) that would cause a big spike in demand.

  7. Re:absurd by philspear · · Score: 1

    Well, it's easy to play armchair CEO in hindsight and say they should have charged more so they could have gotten that theoretical 1 billion. Of course, it's hard for me to understand the criticism when 1. if they had done that, it might be they're losing a billion in unsold consoles, which would be a much bigger problem than having a billion dollars more to expand, and 2. you're talking about raising the price of the wii. That would be nice for nintendo's investors and stock holders, but is anyone here either of those? No? Then let's be happy the price is too low than too high and hope that "marketing scheme" catches on. Phil

  8. My karma is so high that... by Sciros · · Score: 1

    "Wii shortages" heh heh heh

    Yes that's right I went there. Again.

    Anyway I had a thought... isn't this a very good time to advertise the HECK out of the, um, DS? Considering it's cool, makes a good gift, is also appealing to "casual" gamers, and is available? A solid marketing campaign for the DS right about now could sway some people who otherwise will purchase a 360/PS2/PS3 because a Wii is nowhere to be found.

    --
    I like basketball!!1!
    1. Re:My karma is so high that... by Turn-X+Alphonse · · Score: 1

      The DS gets more marketing in the UK than the Wii. I'd say it's 2/1 towards the DS on TV adverts. Nintendo sponsor the Friday night comedy slot on Channel 4, every 15 minutes 2 adverts for the Wii or DS play (one before and after the break). So it's not like the DS is unadvertised.

      The problem is the DS isn't innovative any more, it's been sold on cute games like Nintendogs and learning games like Brain age, so it's aiming at the 'intelligent' and 'casual' side of the casual market, the Wii is aimed at the 'family' part of the casual market, it's difficult to match the two or link them (no casual will buy a DS to play a Wii game)

      --
      I like muppets.
    2. Re:My karma is so high that... by Sciros · · Score: 1

      Well, there's no need to "link" them in the sense that you mean. After all, if Nintendo has concerns about people going out and purchasing a 360 instead of a Wii then we're not really talking about the "family-oriented, casual" market strictly.

      Nintendo's competitors aren't "innovative" in the sense that the Wii is, but if their product is available and Nintendo's isn't then for many that's a moot point. And in the US I don't see a whole lot of DS advertisements, at least not as many as I think I ought to be seeing with that being Nintendo's only available system in stores at the moment and it being the holiday season.

      --
      I like basketball!!1!
    3. Re:My karma is so high that... by techpawn · · Score: 1

      isn't this a very good time to advertise the HECK out of the, um, DS

      Also, the DS can be used in with the Wii you REALLY wanted and will eventually buy anyway

      --
      Ask not what you can do for your country. Ask what your country did to you
    4. Re:My karma is so high that... by moderatorrater · · Score: 1

      The DS is the highest selling gaming device period. It needs advertising less than the Wii does.

    5. Re:My karma is so high that... by Sciros · · Score: 1

      My logic detector isn't picking up any readings!! The Wii can be advertised to high heaven right now but no more units are going to be sold because none are available for purchase. The DS might be highest-selling but Nintendo is likely to move even *more* units if they can keep those who might otherwise opt for a 360 or Playstation this holiday season on "their side."

      --
      I like basketball!!1!
    6. Re:My karma is so high that... by svallarian · · Score: 1

      Well, it is a japanese product, and you know what they say. (or so I watched on south park)

      It's funny you should mention that though, they had to stop advertising the Wii in the UK due to lack of supply and instead replaced the entire ad campaign to the DS line.

      --
      I patented screwing your mom. But it got revoked for "prior art."
  9. Not Really... wider market appeal by binaryspiral · · Score: 1

    It really makes me wonder about the rumors of intentional shorting. From a business point it would make no sense to short your sales. From a marketing point however it's been brilliant. Wii is all the rage and is likely so popular BECAUSE it's hard to get. Nothing lights a fire under middle American purchasing power like that hard to get must have Christmas gift.

    I don't think the shortage is perpetuating itself... it's only a byproduct of mass market appeal.

    This game console appeals to people outside the normal game console demographic. I've seen Wii's in nursing homes, day care facilities, church groups (with adults and children), and actually on my parent's wish list.

    None of these groups would be on the PS3 or XBox 360's radar... but the Wii's appeal literally knows no boundaries.

  10. Re:absurd by bigdavex · · Score: 1

    Why the past tense? Is there any real reason they couldn't start charging more now? Not really.

    --
    -Dave
  11. For one, the artificial scarcity. by Besna · · Score: 0

    Apples and oranges. Music is artificially scarce. Wii is not.

  12. How to create an artificial demand by navygeek · · Score: 1, Insightful

    First off, don't misunderstand the subject line - there is definitely a high demand for the Wii, artificially inflated or otherwise. This is due, in part, to two major factors: the novelty of fairly well done motion control and the accessibility of the console to a significantly wider user base than the typical 'hardcore gamers'.

    That said, Nintendo is not 'losing a billion in sales' - they are, in fact, creating 'a billion in sales'. Okay, so the knee-jerk reaction is 'huh, stores are always sold out, I can't get one, they're losing my money - how are they creating sales'. Ironically, the question is its own answer. By restricting sales to North America, keeping the influx of consoles at a relatively low number - compared to actual demand - Nintendo is creating a sense of scarcity. This perceived lack of Wii increases the immediate demand for the console, virtually ensuring that new product delivered to stores will sell out within a day or two - three or four at the outside.

    This has the effect of creating a stronger the secondary market on E-bay, Craigslist, or the classifieds. People are willing to snatch them up at ridiculous prices in order to get one NOW, rather than wait a week or two for the next shipment and try to get one then - bird in the hand. This leads to further 'gotta have it' frenzy.

    By keeping production where it's at - does anyone REALLY believe they couldn't kick it up a few notches? - they are ensuring that the initial sales life of the console continues for a good long time. During which time they can maintain the price for the console itself, the accessories, and the games. It's a cash cow, a print-your-own-money machine. But the instant they jack up production and flood the market to satisfy all the demand - real and hyped - the consoles start lingering on the shelf longer, it's no longer the console to own, the novelty wears off and sales slump. Why on Earth would they want that!

    1. Re:How to create an artificial demand by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      By restricting sales to North America, keeping the influx of consoles at a relatively low number

      Restricting numbers shipped to North America? Source? If you have a set number of items shipped and you have to split up that number GLOBALLY - how do you NOT limit numbers to any given country? Should USA get 1.5m a month while the rest of the world goes Free For All for the last 300k?

      By keeping production where it's at - does anyone REALLY believe they couldn't kick it up a few notches? - they are ensuring that the initial sales life of the console continues for a good long time.

      Keeping Current Production - Can you guarantee that sales numbers will continue for a year? Years? I don't think anyone will say it WILL continue at this pace. If you can't guarantee sales numbers - what makes you think a company is going to risk the capital to invest in a new factory only to have demand die off (at least die off below the max production numbers of plant #1)?
      How do you keep the "Initial Sales Life" going?

      But the instant they jack up production and flood the market to satisfy all the demand - real and hyped - the consoles start lingering on the shelf longer, it's no longer the console to own

      The question tho... is what other items do we have to compare to? I don't think "Tickle Me Elmo" stayed on the "Shit Hot" List from Christmas to Christmas. Name another item that's been this hot for this long. Pogs, Elmo, etc... Christmas leads to a spike then back to normal. Wii has never dropped to normal.
    2. Re:How to create an artificial demand by ShadowsHawk · · Score: 1

      You have obviously never worked in the manufacturing sector. It basically comes down to the old adage; "fast, cheap or good. Pick two." I would wager that the only way to boost production is to add additional production lines to existing facilities or to build new factories. New production lines are constrained by power and floor space. New factories require months (6-9) to build and start up.

    3. Re:How to create an artificial demand by navygeek · · Score: 1

      And you've obviously never taken an Economics class. Absolutely everything I said was correct. I do believe I even pointed out they could increase production capacity - though I never went into ALL the factors as to why they don't. Of course increasing production requires increases in costs (labor, materials, consumables - like power, et al). Of course increasing costs decreases profit per unit.

      As someone has already pointed out, well before I am here, increasing production to fully meet real and implied demand would, in the long run, be a very bad thing. Once they get those factories up and running, well, they're up and running - using resources and costing money to maintain. When, not if, demand slips, those factories are then superfluous and only cost. So the whole point of my original post is, still, entirely valid. They are not losing anything by not meeting 100% of all demand - they are in fact making more than they would otherwise.

  13. no one's getting any by Scrameustache · · Score: 3, Insightful

    When people try to justify downloading music, they say it's okay because they wouldn't have bought the album in the first place, which means that no money was lost in the process.

    Wouldn't the same kind of logic hold here? How can Nintendo lose money on nonexistent consoles if they're already at full production? No, because no one is downloading magical Wiis and they WOULD give Nintendo that money if they could.
    --

    You can't take the sky from me...

    1. Re:no one's getting any by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      ..downloading magical Wiis

      Hey, how'd you get access to my porn drive?
  14. Cost nothing by Kroc · · Score: 0, Redundant

    No, this has cost Nintendo precisely 0. They have not /lost/ a billion from the bank because of the shortage, they have simply not earnt that money.

    The Wii is popular, and profitable. They've lost nothing, only potential sales.
    Sony could only dream of such a thing. PS3 availability was good even days after release, as Penny Arcade proved

  15. Something not right by Maximilianop · · Score: 1

    Increased production cost for uping the production factor?

    Since when mass production was a cost increaser?

    --
    The Universe is shrinking all around my head.
    1. Re:Something not right by jim.hansson · · Score: 1

      overtime cost.
      if you stress a production line in my experience it usually gets less effective

      --
      preview button, my computer does't have any preview button
  16. Food for thought by dj245 · · Score: 3, Interesting

    These are all good points, but I think the extra time that people spend waiting for the wii will be spend evaluating the other options, looking at the games, deciding if it is worth it and if the cross platform games perform the same or better on other consoles. While it is true that the wii has titles and gameplay the other consoles do not, cross platform game support for the wii is downright awful. Plus while it comes with wireless internet support out of the box, practically no game uses it for multiplayer play.

    When it comes down to it, for me the choice was pretty clear. Since I don't like Metroid that much and I've already completed Twilight Princess on wii, I could have a $300 mario machine with shitty 3rd party games or pay the same amount and get a PS2 with a pile of accessories and games. Is it fair to compare the mature PS2 library to the wii's? Not entirely, but the Gamecube's at end of life wasn't anything like the PS2's is now either. I don't have high hopes for seeing a wide variety of good games on the wii, aside from Nintendo published games

    --
    Even those who arrange and design shrubberies are under considerable economic stress at this period in history.
    1. Re:Food for thought by SargentDU · · Score: 1

      If you already completed Twilight Princess on the wii, why would you buy another wii?

    2. Re:Food for thought by callistra.moonshadow · · Score: 3, Insightful

      One thing to keep in mind is that some of the market for the Wii is the seniors. They are probably more willing to wait to get one than teens or twenty somethings. Another group are those with young children. I have a 3 year old and a 7 year old. When considering other consoles because of the Wii shortage, it became clear the other consoles would not suffice. The Wii is so young-kid friendly that we decided that if we couldn't get one for XMAS we'd wait until we could. I think that part the demographic for those that are in the line for the Wii will wait until they can get their hands on it. The seniors and young kids are what contributed to the shortage in the first place.

      My two cents.

      --
      --Cally
    3. Re:Food for thought by Turken · · Score: 4, Insightful

      When it comes down to it, for me the choice was pretty clear.


      And this is why your entire argument falls flat. You're a gamer, and you assume that everyone else looking for a Wii views it the same way that you do. Hardcore gamers have already made up their mind about whether they want a Wii and bought one if they wanted it. Now, the vast majority of people looking to buy a Wii are either new gamers, or parents of new gamers. These are people who have no clue what "cross-platform gameplay" means and if they wanted to buy a PS2 then they would have done so long ago, since the PS2 has been a mature and available system for years.

      The real driving force behind Wii is not that it is a "must-have-one-too" Christmas toy, but rather that the Wii is a social system. People play with their friends and/or family members' system, and decide that it is fun enough that they want one of their own. I may only have anecdotal evidence of the Wii's "viral" appeal, but I have seen it happen so many times I'm thinking about keeping a tally on the side of my Wii to record the number of friends and family who have gone and bought their own after playing with mine.

      Sure, there will be some people who don't buy a Wii after Christmas due to budget constraints, but the vast majority will simply wait and sustain the demand well into next year. However, they won't spend that waiting time "evaluating other options," because for these customers, there is no other option.
    4. Re:Food for thought by Steve525 · · Score: 2, Insightful

      However, they won't spend that waiting time "evaluating other options," because for these customers, there is no other option.

      For these non-gamers, other options are HDTV's, furniture, jewelry, or just about anything. I agree with you that these people are unlikely to evaluate other gaming systems. However, they still may loose their enthusiasm for the Wii, and spend the money someplace else. Sure, they might wait and buy a Wii when they are easier to find. Or, something else could catch their interest, and they may not care about the Wii so much anymore.

    5. Re:Food for thought by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      or pay the same amount and get a PS2 with a pile of accessories and games.

      It wouldn't be the same amount. Given the level of consumer-hostility (remember the rootkits?) for which Sony is infamous, any purchase of a Sony product includes in its price tag, "your soul."

    6. Re:Food for thought by Sancho · · Score: 1

      Perhaps he borrowed a Wii for the purpose of completing Twilight Princess? Or he mis-typed and meant that he'd completed it on the Gamecube.

    7. Re:Food for thought by gallwapa · · Score: 1

      huh? From Wii to HDTV? Theres a $800 difference there :)

      Unless you get a Samsung 50" 720p DLP from BestBuy for $899 and receive a $100 discount to NFLShop.com

      (Sorry for the plug, but after spending 3 weeks on backorder with Circuit City for the same TVs and receiving CRAP customer service, BestBuy deserves the plug for hooking me up for the same [better, really] price).

    8. Re:Food for thought by Envy+Life · · Score: 1

      The real driving force behind Wii is not that it is a "must-have-one-too" Christmas toy, but rather that the Wii is a social system. People play with their friends and/or family members' system, and decide that it is fun enough that they want one of their own. Sounds contradictory. A must have Christmas toy is typically one which people want because their friend has one and they want one too.
    9. Re:Food for thought by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Might try out of the way locations. I had a friend on a business trip to the middle of 'poorville' and when he went into their big store they had them in stock on the shelves.

      So if your kids need it, try the surrounding area....
      if you have a relative that you are planing on visiting and they are in the boonies...call their locale stores.

      Heck...call their local stores anyway and if the store has them in stock, go visit the relative....any excuse to get a Wii is a good excuse.....any...except this

  17. They make a pill for that... by russlar · · Score: 1

    Wii shortage? Sounds like a personal problem to me.

    --
    Anybody want my mod points?
  18. Production Ramp Up by rlp · · Score: 3, Informative

    They've ramped production from 500 thousand / month at release to 1.8 million / month now. That's a pretty sizable production increase. More importantly, I'm not hearing news about DOA units, so they've (so far) avoided compromises in quality while more than tripling production. So, yeah, they completely messed up on demand forecasting. As far as the production ramp-up, I think they've done well.

    --
    [Insert pithy quote here]
    1. Re:Production Ramp Up by Ang31us · · Score: 1

      Dude, I LOVE your object-oriented signature! Everyone who truly wants a Wii knows how they can get one. I stood in line for 12 hours for the midnight launch in Times Square (November 18th into the 19th, 2006) to get mine. Any hardcore gamer that wants one and does not have it is a total pansy ;-) . I also agree with the earlier threads on how the un-met demand is actually making Nintendo more $$$ in the long-run. When the system launched last year at $250, it cost more to produce it than it does this year. Now the Wii still costs $250, but instead of making $50 per system, Nintendo is likely to be making $75 per system. The big N's forecasts are probably for profit, while taking demand into account. Since this is Slashdot, Go Wii!!!

    2. Re:Production Ramp Up by MaWeiTao · · Score: 1

      They've ramped production from 500 thousand / month at release to 1.8 million / month now. That's a pretty sizable production increase. More importantly, I'm not hearing news about DOA units, so they've (so far) avoided compromises in quality while more than tripling production.


      I just wanted to point out that quality doesn't drop merely because production levels have increased. Defects are more prevalent at initial ramp up, when the equipment first starts manufacturing a product. Once that ramp up phase is complete manufacturing defects are very low, unless there's some kind of design flaw within the product itself.

      As molds and other tools see use they do suffer from wear and tear. More stringent quality control ensures these parts are replaced sooner than later, but this is something that would be experienced regardless of production quantity.

      Of course, this is dependent on manufacturing being solely machine-based. If there's a lot of manual labor involved I could see the potential for problems, but I highly doubt a modern electronic device, especially a Japan one is touched by many human hands.

      So there's no reason at all for quality to suffer merely because Nintendo is manufacturing additional consoles.
    3. Re:Production Ramp Up by Leo+Sasquatch · · Score: 5, Insightful

      There was an article ages ago about this, and the Nintendo guy said something I thought was very telling about their attitude to customers. He said they were ramping up production as far as they could, but to stretch the supply chains any further would mean dealing with component manufacturers and suppliers they neither knew nor trusted. Yes, the result would be a larger supply of Wiis, but a much higher percentage of defective machines; either as soon as the customer got it home, or soon after purchase. They didn't want that to be associated with their brand, and said they'd rather manufacture less consoles, and have them work properly, and hope people would be patient and understand.

      Compare and contrast Microsoft's attitude of denying the problem for ages, then setting aside billions to handle defective machines under extended warranty. My Wii's seen daily use since launch date - all I've ever had to do was change batteries in the Wiimote. If it does break down, I'm stuffed as far as getting another one is concerned, at least for a few more weeks.

    4. Re:Production Ramp Up by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      And I can say, from experience, that the "ramp up" did have its quality issues. There were scattered claims of overheating, and I, personally, found myself with a launch unit incapable of reading discs.

      Perhaps one important point, though, is how the situation was handled by Microsoft versus Nintendo. MS denied problems with the Xbox 360 for two years, until finally extending the warranty to a period so unconventionally long for a game console (three years) that it made it incredibly obvious that something was wrong with a lot of systems.

      When my Xbox 360 broke, I was without one for more than three weeks (and this was not during a period of shortages).

      When I turned my Wii on last year and found that I couldn't play anything, I called Nintendo immediately, and had a new Wii at my door in 48 hours. And that was at a time when they were absolutely impossible to find in stores.

      Perhaps the reason that we haven't heard about the Wii's quality issues is that even if they exist, Nintendo will replace warrantied consoles with virtually no questions asked, and it will often do so far more quickly than the competition.

    5. Re:Production Ramp Up by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      FEWER consoles

      (sorry, please don't kill me)

      Interesting post though

  19. Re:absurd by KDR_11k · · Score: 1

    That would be horrible PR. Besides, they make money on games sales and those need units sold, not profit made from hardware.

    --
    Justice is the sheep getting arrested while an impartial judge declares the vote void.
  20. What happened to ramping up? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I understand the argument for not meeting the insane demand at the holidays because you won't be able to keep up that level of production throughout the year - but here's where that argument breaks down. If Nintendo is currently at 100% manufacturing ability in all of their factories, they're doing something WRONG. Holiday surges are exactly the reason you don't run at 100% capacity. You RAMP UP for the holidays to meet the extra demand, then go back to your standard rate after it's over. All it costs you is the labor for getting more workers in over the holidays.

    1. Re:What happened to ramping up? by CrashPoint · · Score: 2, Insightful

      All it costs you is the labor for getting more workers in over the holidays.
      Right, because those workers are magical elves who simply will new Wiis into existence. It's not as if you need to build factories for them to work in or components for them to assemble.
    2. Re:What happened to ramping up? by edwdig · · Score: 1

      That's what they attempted to do. They ramped up production months ago, hoping to have a surplus for Christmas. But even at the increased production rate they still can't meet the demand.

    3. Re:What happened to ramping up? by Envy+Life · · Score: 1

      If Nintendo says they need 5 months advance notice, they had it. http://www.engadget.com/2007/07/12/nintendo-planning-to-milk-its-wii-shortage-through-the-holidays/

      Yes they are leaving money on the table, but it is also a known business practice to create increased demand with intended artificial restrictions on product availability. The iPhone is the most recent example of this.

  21. Re:absurd by NonSequor · · Score: 1

    Consumers view price increases negatively so price increases can do damage to public perception of a brand which can reduce the long term profitability of a product.

    --
    My only political goal is to see to it that no political party achieves its goals.
  22. Ever heard of contract manufacturing? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    No one needs to build factories any more. All you have to do is to use the same outsource manufacturers like everyone else in the industry. There is no excuses for not meeting demands if that's what they want to do.

    Do you think for a minute that MS has their own factories coming from a background of software vendor?

    1. Re:Ever heard of contract manufacturing? by Turken · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Even with outsourcing, complex products such as consumer electronics require many different parts from many different manufacturers. If any one part is in short supply, the whole product will be in short supply. And if you're sourcing parts that can be used for different end-products, then you also have to compete with other businesses for that resource.

      So no, Nintendo doesn't have their own factories where they make wiis from start to finish, but they do have to contract out all the appropriate parts and hope that those manufacturers can meet the demand. If Nintendo wants to instantly increase production, it may very well mean paying a premium for scare parts, which would cause them to lose a guaranteed amount on the increased manufacturing. So they get screwed either way, in which case it's better to stick with all the contracts that were negotiated months ago based on what they thought was a reasonable demand.

      Electronics don't just poof into existence. Whether company-owned or outsourced, factories must exist to make products and if those factories can't meet demand, the product won't meet demand.

    2. Re:Ever heard of contract manufacturing? by Chris+Burke · · Score: 1

      Electronics don't just poof into existence. Whether company-owned or outsourced, factories must exist to make products and if those factories can't meet demand, the product won't meet demand.

      Yeah, it really bothers me how this whole idiotic conspiracy theory is predicated on the notion that Nintendo HQ has a big knob labeled "Wiis per Month" and they can just turn the knob to however much they want (after inserting the proper amount of cash into the slot below the knob of course) and those malicious bastards refuse to turn the knob any more because they want "Wiis sold out" headlines in the news to generate hysteria.

      Think about just one component of the Wii -- let's say the ATI graphics chip. For a complex chip like that, it can take 2-3 months from sticking a blank wafer into the front of the fab to getting a printed wafer out the back, then tack on a couple weeks for testing, packaging, and shipping into supply chains. So ideally let's call it 2.5 months from N asking for more and the extra allotment arriving at N's assembly plants. However ATI outsources their manufacturing to foundries like Chartered and TSMC, so they either have to change their allocation of Wii chips vs their other products, or request additional allocation from their foundries, both of which must be done in advance, and depend on the other demands for the foundries' services as to whether it can even be done.

      So is it really that hard to believe that as George Harrison said that they must plan their production output 5 months in advance? They had already bumped it up from 1 mil to 1.8 mil/month earlier this year, and they would have barely had any time to see the effect of the increased production in the market before they would have had to decide to increase production, and by how much. And, even then, unless they had bumped it up by a huge amount like 2-4x, then it still wouldn't have resulted in enough extra wiis to have a serious impact on the holiday season.

      --

      The enemies of Democracy are
  23. Two words: Contract Manufacturing by StandardCell · · Score: 1

    The assertion that Nintendo would build an entire factory to satisfy the console demand is ludicrous. They would and should simply hire a contract manufacturer like a Foxconn or Solectron or Sanmina and get the product out. If quality issues are that important, they can put their own support in-factory to ensure that their standards are met. It's done on a regular basis in the electronics industry.

    What you also don't take into account in your analysis is how pent-up demand means lost dollars on licensing revenue. Each system that gets sold nets Nintendo additional dollars from the 3-5 games that will be purchased with the system. Don't forget things like additional Wiimotes, Nunchuks, the online classic game store, and other content. That doesn't even include the good press to see you tromp your competitors by another whole factor of their sales and the subsequent pop to Nintendo's stock price. In short, it makes no sense to delay revenue because basic finance demands money in now is better than money in later, particularly among a very fickle public who may very well buy a 360 or PS3 basic system and not look back no matter what the cachet of the Wii may be.

    This is simply an example of Nintendo's poor launch planning that is persisting more than a year since the console's introduction. The product managers ought to be fried for not contingency planning.
     

  24. think of the consumers.. by stormguard2099 · · Score: 1

    Ok, so if a "hardcore" gamer goes into a store, looking to purchase a wii but they end up having to come back over and over again in hopes of getting one they are going to really consider if the ps3 or 360 are really that bad. That makes sense to some degree but I don't really see too many people that were on the fence waiting a good year to change their minds. It seems like if someone was just waiting to get a wii since launch, they would have broken down by now. I know a lot of people who want wiis but wouldn't even consider another console because it's not what they want.
    If grandma or soccermom goes looking for a wii but doesn't find it, they aren't going to grab another console no matter how cool gears of war is. I'd say a fair share of the casual gamers that are after the wii aren't going to buy another console if they can't get a wii, they are just going to either wait or go spend that money else, completely outside of the gaming market.

    --
    http://greenobyl.com/ please.... think of the children!!
    1. Re:think of the consumers.. by Maul · · Score: 1

      The "truly hardcore" gamer already has a Wii, Xbox360, PS3, DS, and PSP.

      --

      "You spoony bard!" -Tellah

  25. It's still artificial scarcity by tepples · · Score: 1

    Music is artificially scarce. Wii is not. The Wii hardware is patented, and the Wii firmware is copyrighted. Otherwise, the console would already have been thoroughly reverse engineered and cloned in Red China.
    1. Re:It's still artificial scarcity by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
  26. Wiki? So why is it protected? by tepples · · Score: 1

    Zach and Wiki Shouldn't a "Wiki" game let the player edit all the levels?
  27. Where the Wii is by brkello · · Score: 1

    Just go look on ebay...there are thousands on thousands of them for sale. The reason why no one can get a Wii is because these resellers are buying them in bulk as soon as they can their hands on them. This is inflating the demand for them beyond reality. don't believe me? Just go to ebay and search for the Wii. There are plenty of them out there.

    --
    Support a great indie game: http://www.abaddon360.com
    1. Re:Where the Wii is by Skapare · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Yes, this can be a serious problem. If there is any level of shortage of a product (as many of the latest products coming into the holidays are), EBay will have the effect of making the shortage worse. And it's not the manufacturers that profit from it in this case (apparently); it's whoever has the connections to get those bulk deliveries redirected to them (possibly even stolen).

      --
      now we need to go OSS in diesel cars
    2. Re:Where the Wii is by Xmastrspy · · Score: 0
      Great Point... Although this is offtopic, I would like to hear what other /. people think about this type of activity?

      I will never purchase any item that has been put on e-bay in this way. A guy at work talks about how he will stand in line, buy as many as possible, then run home and put these items up on e-bay. At a greater cost.. because they are hard to get... because he just bought them all.

      I wanted a Wii. Guy at work would sell me one at a higher price then the store. I rented Wii for video store. I satisfied urge. I hope this dude at work sits on that Wii for 50 years waiting to sell the 10 he has.
       

    3. Re:Where the Wii is by Turken · · Score: 1

      Personally, I think that scalpers are complete douchebags. But, no matter what you do in life you'll have to deal with the occasional a**hole. That's just life and human nature.

      Personally, I'm not too put-off by Wii scalpers since comparing the NPD sales numbers with the estimated number of consoles selling in the secondary markets for the same time period, it looks like only a small percentage (5-10%) of the market is being picked up by the scalpers. So, for those willing to work for their wii, the console can still be found.

      What REALLY irks me though, is scalpers (for the Wii, or any other high-demand items) that abuse or exploit the system to gain unfair access to the products, thus allowing them to control a majority of the sales.

    4. Re:Where the Wii is by Is0m0rph · · Score: 1

      Or come to Phoenix. Guarantee you'll find one. I see them all the time at Walmart, Gamestop, Best Buy. Bought mine a couple months ago at Gamestop, went across the street to Walmart and they had them in stock there too. Have seen them in stock at a couple Walmarts every time I go there. Maybe it's hard most other places but doesn't seem like it if you are near a big city.

    5. Re:Where the Wii is by jbash · · Score: 1

      As soon as retail supply meets demand, the resale market premium will collapse, leaving these people who bought 100 $249 consoles out a lot of money. The eBay sellers are speculators, no different than the house flippers from a few years back.

  28. *sigh* by bigattichouse · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Step 1: Read Peter Senge's Fifth discipline
    Step 2: Understand that the Wii is a perfect example of the Beer distribution game
    Step 3: Realize that demand is at least ONE ORDER of magnitude smaller than reported.

    Case in point: Person X goes to store 1 and asks for a wii, then proceeds to search through store(s) 1-10 ... they may even place orders at each store... when person X gets a wii, they cancel all other orders. So "10" orders really was 1 order.

    If Nintendo attempts to fill the "Billion" in orders, they will greatly overshoot and end up with a flooded market that can't get rid of the damn things. Slow and steady wins this race, a few million in sales lost over the entire potential beats the crap out of overshooting with 100 million dollars worth of hardware sitting on shelves, or ending up in landfills

    --
    meh
    1. Re:*sigh* by edwdig · · Score: 1

      I think Nintendo, the retailers, and the analysts are all aware that when Best Buy tells someone they don't have a Wii in stock, the person is most likely going to check the Circuit City down the road if they haven't already. You'd have to be a pretty bad market analyst to not take that into account when you make your projections.

      To deal with it, the stores don't take preorders other than for the initial launch. Nintendo is working with GameStop to take a limited number of preorders (a few tens of thousands) this holiday season but is requiring you to prepay in full for the system in exchange for January delivery.

    2. Re:*sigh* by CristalShandaLear · · Score: 1

      I don't think they have much to worry about. There isn't a store in my area that can keep them in stock. I wanted to buy two for Christmas and still haven't been able to locally. It's kind of a pain. For once I have the cash, but there are none to be had. At least market rate cash, I refuse to pay $800 bucks on Ebay - my "kid" is a teen - she can wait until after Christmas if need be. But it would be nice to be able to give her one on Christmas Day. If I was the kind of person who did my Christmas Shopping in October, I could have, but the Wii has been MIA around these parts (Greater Cincinnati) except for random odd shipments since well before Black Friday. Unless you're sending out teams at 5 am to every big box store, you're not getting one.

    3. Re:*sigh* by bcattwoo · · Score: 1

      Case in point: Person X goes to store 1 and asks for a wii, then proceeds to search through store(s) 1-10 ... they may even place orders at each store... when person X gets a wii, they cancel all other orders. So "10" orders really was 1 order.
      *sigh* I thought "case in point" usually involved a real world, factual example and not some made up bullshit. While you have shown the fallacy of only counting orders to determine demand, you have not shown that anyone is actually doing that.
    4. Re:*sigh* by bigattichouse · · Score: 1

      See point #2 the "Beer Game" - this is what happens in the game, orders are inflated in the hopes of receiving more stock, to fulfill a smaller demand. so, true, taken at face value I was incorrect in phrasing. I was going to post the experiences of someone close to me, but decided not to.

      --
      meh
    5. Re:*sigh* by kiran_n · · Score: 1

      Agree with you.

      Also - suppose Nintendo wants to increase production - this would happen only by setting up new manufacturing / assembly plants (the cost involved - even if this is outsourced, would not be insignificant). If they do setup plants and manage to meet the demand - what happens if the demand falls (which it will, after the holiday season)?

      Having a shortage, in this sense, is good from a perspective of

      a.) free marketing by virtue of the coverage
      b.) Keeping the supply demand curve in check till the next version is planned.

      I guess there is an HBR case study in here somewhere...

    6. Re:*sigh* by jmdc · · Score: 1

      You seem to have forgotten the most important steps:

      • 4. ???
      • 5. Profit!

      Oh well ... You must be new here.

  29. Re:absurd by bigdavex · · Score: 1

    Besides, they make money on games sales and those need units sold, not profit made from hardware.

    That's self-fulfilling. They could be making more money on hardware. They can't sell more than all of the Wii hardware that exists, so they could bump it up a bit and not miss out on software sales. I suspect that the market price isn't _much_ higher than retail, or else they'd be increasing the price with some subtle bundling.

    --
    -Dave
  30. landfills by British · · Score: 1

    I highly doubt excess unsold Wiis would end up in landfills(literally or metaphorically). IIRC Atari made more copies of the ET game than there were 2600 consoles sold. Wha, you gonna buy TWO copies of the same game? A console itself is different.

  31. Solving the holiday product crunch ... by Skapare · · Score: 4, Interesting

    I have the solution to solving the holiday product crunch: spread the holidays out over the calendar. In the USA, divide the country up into 12 regions of about the same population and economics. Then assign each region a different month to have the gift giving holidays. Most people don't celebrate Christmas religiously, anymore, so this shouldn't be much of a problem.

    The above does still leave a big crunch at stores and malls within a region. So maybe it's better to divide things up on a micro-scale instead of a macro-scale. So, how about celebrating the gift giving holiday based on (zipcode % 12), where you celebrate gift giving based on your zip code modulo 12 to choose the month.

    This still means a big crunch for families and neighbors in the same zip code. So I have a better idea. Let's use the date of birth to determine when to celebrate the gift giving holiday, based on who the gift is for. And instead of having it all on one day of the month, let's spread it out further and use the actual date in the date of birth for everyone's own personalized gift giving holiday.

    Ooops. I didn't take into account February 29. Never mind.

    --
    now we need to go OSS in diesel cars
    1. Re:Solving the holiday product crunch ... by cowscows · · Score: 1

      What a perfectly geeky solution. There's a coherent logic to it, and the potential for some math to really optimize it. But it conveniently leaves out the fact that it deals with people, and as soon as you factor the human element into the idea, there are dozens of plainly obvious reasons why it would never ever work.

      But it's still an interesting thought to explore.

      --

      One time I threw a brick at a duck.

    2. Re:Solving the holiday product crunch ... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The mods apparently missed the joke, or really wanted to give interesting karma instead of funny non-karma?

    3. Re:Solving the holiday product crunch ... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I have the solution to solving the holiday product crunch: spread the holidays out over the calendar.

      Newsflash: we already have holidays spread throughout the year. I thought all those holidays are what people were referring to when they say "it's the holidays". I don't have a clue what that phrase means other than the guess I just made. It actually makes no sense because the US (and many other countries) don't have more than 1 holiday on any given day so it isn't possible for it to "be" more than 1 holiday at a time, not to mention it makes no sense for anything to be a holiday. It can be holiday time though or dare I say, Christmastime :o.

      Most people don't celebrate Christmas religiously, anymore, so this shouldn't be much of a problem.

      That is no excuse to remove all remnants of religion from it or to not ever again refer to it by it's proper name. You will not stop those who celebrate it for the proper reason. I don't think we ever refer to Labor Day as something else for fear those who are afraid of or offended by work would be offended by the name. We don't refer to Independence Day as Fireworks day for fear of offending those who are against independence. It would be absurd to do so. But we are afraid to call Christmas by it's name which is also absurd. Somehow I doubt companies spend millions in advertising (using Santa and Christmas carols as theme songs), so they can be sure they are in the black, do so because they know they will get millions or billions off Kwanzaa or Hanukkah. Christmas makes money whether it is hijacked by non-Christians so they have a reason to buy something for someone or because people celebrate it for the right reason. Any comments regarding the fact Christmas used to be a Pagan holiday are irrelevant in this case because those who started using Christmas as a Christian holiday did not try to minimize its meaning to those who already celebrated it.

    4. Re:Solving the holiday product crunch ... by petermgreen · · Score: 1

      I have the solution to solving the holiday product crunch: spread the holidays out over the calendar. In the USA, divide the country up into 12 regions of about the same population and economics. Then assign each region a different month to have the gift giving holidays. Most people don't celebrate Christmas religiously, anymore, so this shouldn't be much of a problem.

      Afaict at least here in the UK the convention is to have two times in the year where people take time off and splurge financially. In the middle of summer people go away to the seaside or some other kind of holiday that involves spending lots of time outdoors. In the winter people buy themselves, each other and thier kids presents than spend time off indoors enjoying thier presents with thier family and/or friends.

      In other words getting presents is part of christmas but having time of work/school and your friends and family having time off work/school at the same time is just as important.

      --
      note: i'm known as plugwash most places but i screwd up registering that here somehow in the past and now can't register
    5. Re:Solving the holiday product crunch ... by Hackie_Chan · · Score: 1

      Most people don't celebrate Christmas religiously, anymore, so this shouldn't be much of a problem.

      The date has nothing to do with Jesus' birth. The reason why Christmas is celebrated at he 25th is because that is when the ancient pagans celebrated the winter solstice. In order to appeal to the pagans to convert to Christianity, they just said "Oh well, lets have it be about Jesus!".

      --

      What's so bad about being lazy? What if there was a war and nobody showed up?
    6. Re:Solving the holiday product crunch ... by Gossy · · Score: 1

      How has every reply and mod missed the joke?

  32. I just bought a GBA and am loving it... by Junior+J.+Junior+III · · Score: 1

    $30 each for a pair of used GBA SP's, you can't beat that. And used games are $5-20/title at Gamestop. I'll buy a Wii when they come down in price. I said that last year, and it's a year later and you STILL can't find one in stores, so I know I have a bit of a wait in store before they drop down to the $149 pricepoint that I'm waiting for. I don't care, though; I have a good six generations worth of consoles in my spare bedroom and I can't play them all.

    --
    You see? You see? Your stupid minds! Stupid! Stupid!
  33. Production is based on forcasts using on hand data by trdrstv · · Score: 2, Informative

    I just don't understand how they could not have for seen this shortage. I mean last year the same thing happened and they said then they would be ready for this year.

    The issue is the Wii is selling better than any console in history. The Wii is selling faster than the PS2, the DS, or anything else that came before it. So Nintendo forcasted based on "Aggressive sales" and started with production of 1 million for launch, and 1 million a month, which they felt was a fair target (even optimistic, considering that's the rate of initial PS2 sales). Now demand is much higher than anyone (even Nintendo) anticipated, and even now at 1.8 million units per month it still isn't enough.

    From a business point it would make no sense to short your sales. From a marketing point however it's been brilliant. Wii is all the rage and is likely so popular BECAUSE it's hard to get.

    You're right in saying it makes no business sence to short your sales. Demand isn't a constant, neither is hype. You want to satisfy demand before it wanes.

  34. Re:absurd by krakelohm · · Score: 1

    I think Nintendo would be hit big time with bad publicity if they suddenly raised their prices. Have you ever seen any consumer electronic device come out and then suddenly raise their price when demand was high?

    --
    You are all a bunch of idots.
  35. I just ______ a GBA and am loving it... by Smordnys+s'regrepsA · · Score: 1

    You pay for the GBA? You do know you can just emulate it for free. Free for the system, free for the roms. The one reason I *might* buy myself a Wii or DS is the lack of working emulators.


    Afraid/Morally Obligated to only use legal software? Go to GameHippo.com (or one of the other thousand or so freeware sites), there are tons of free games to download - many of which you can use to edit your own new levels.


    Bought the GBA because its portable? Try getting some extra use out of your laptop (with such a low User ID, I would be surprised if you didn't have one). You'll get the extra benefit of looking like you're doing something important instead of just messing around with some kid game (because, really, how many adult-oriented games are there that aren't xxx-adult?).

    --
    Just -1, Troll talking to another.
    1. Re:I just ______ a GBA and am loving it... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I paid for my GBA (not SP) and an Afterburner light kit. And I still use it because it runs on replaceable AA batteries, making it the best portable game system for long flights where your laptop/PSP/DS/emulation_station_of_choice runs out of power after an hour or four. Laptops just aren't convenient to use in crowded moving vehicles.

    2. Re:I just ______ a GBA and am loving it... by Junior+J.+Junior+III · · Score: 1

      Those are all nice suggestions, and while I generally support the abandonware movement and emulation, I do think that it's important to note that the GBA is still being sold in stores, so it's not quite abandonware yet. If you're running an emulator for any ROMs that you haven't paid for, you're guilty of copyright violation and software piracy. There's no EULA on GBA games to my knowledge, so if you own physical cartridges, more power to you. I'm thrifty, but I do try to avoid breaking the law except when it's utterly ridiculous not to do so.

      Also, while I do like emulation, there's really nothing quite like the real thing, and I try to keep real hardware for my collections to the extent that it's practical. I've got original Atari 2600, 5200, 7800, Colecovision, NES, SNES, N64, and Gamecube in my stable. I do like the GBA because of it's portability, and it is MUCH more portable than any laptop. The GBA fits easily in a coat pocket. My laptop fits.... in a big-ass messenger bag. Also, I feel a lot less risk whipping out a GBA I paid $30 when I'm out somewhere in public than I would my $1000+ T61 Thinkpad. Besides, the native controls are better than anything I might plug into my T61's usb port. And if I lose the GBA, the only data I'm crying over is the saved game on the cartridge I left in the slot. I guess the T61 wins on screen size, but I can get 10 hours of battery out of my GBA vs around 3+ from the Thinkpad, and I have the 9-cell battery.

      --
      You see? You see? Your stupid minds! Stupid! Stupid!
    3. Re:I just ______ a GBA and am loving it... by Cyno01 · · Score: 1

      The DS lite gets 18 hours of battery on the lowest backlight setting (personal experience), which is plenty bright for the cabin of a plane.

      --
      "Sic Semper Tyrannosaurus Rex."
    4. Re:I just ______ a GBA and am loving it... by buffer-overflowed · · Score: 1

      Double AAs are still a bit more convienant for some people. I haven't run into any charge issues with an SP or DS, ever, but I can see how someone could.

      --
      The key to the enjoyment of pop music is to replace any instance of "love" with "C.H.U.D."
  36. eBay suggests that Nintendo isn't losing that much by brokeninside · · Score: 3, Interesting

    New Wii units without a multi-controller/multi-game bundle are selling for a fifty to seventy-five dollar price premium over retail. Even if the 15 million units they've sold to date were sold for USD 50 more, Nintendo would only be making an additional 750,000,000 bucks, less than three-quarters of a billion. And that assumes that everyone willing to pay $250 for Wii is also willing to pay $300 for a Wii which I doubt. It seems to me that a large part of the Wii's popularity is its price.

    But more importantly, the lack of a large premium on the Wii from resellers suggest that the present rate of production and price is very close to the market equilibrium. If demand were far outstripping supply, the premium from resellers on eBay would be far higher. If supply were far outstripping demand, we'd be seeing the boxes stack up on the shelves. But from first appearances, it would appear that Nintendo is very close to hitting the sweet spot with their present rate of production.

  37. Wii touts by bheading · · Score: 1

    Over here, the newspaper ads (and Ebay) are full of Nintendo Wii's being sold for double the market price. I suspect that a significant number of the Wiis sold in the three months prior to Christmas have gone to people who are holding them back and taking advantage of those who will pay any price to get one before Christmas.

    I suspect after Christmas the price on the Wii will collapse, and the shortages will magically disappear.

  38. George Harrison by caffeine_monkey · · Score: 2, Funny

    "'We don't feel like we've made any mistakes,' said George Harrison, senior vice president for marketing at Nintendo of America. He added mournfully, "I don't know how someone controlled you. They bought and sold you." And then Eric Clapton launched into a guitar solo.

  39. All Nintendo's manufacturing is by contract by Dorceon · · Score: 1

    So if they're already exhausting the supply of consoles their contract partners can produce, there are no partners left to contract out to.

    --
    What sound do people on rollercoasters make? Hint: it's not Xbox 360.
  40. Speculation by argStyopa · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Not sure, but how much of this 'shortage' was deliberate by a subset of consumers that bought Wiis simply for speculative reasons?

    I can find tons (right now I see 9000+) of Wiis on ebay at joke prices. Presumeably almost all of these will go back to the store within a week or two of Christmas.

    Not Nintendo's fault, really.

    --
    -Styopa
    1. Re:Speculation by myz24 · · Score: 1

      9,000? There were around 30,000 this morning and a majority of them are selling.

  41. $1 billion is peanuts by 644bd346996 · · Score: 1

    More precisely, $1 billion is just over two months of sales. I don't think anybody expects the market for the Wii to pop like a bubble before March, so this isn't really a problem for Nintendo.

  42. Not for Wii Re:Solving the holiday product crunch by Ang31us · · Score: 1

    The Wii has been sold out in all us zip codes every day for a full year, regardless of the person's DOB. This solution does not work for items that sell out the moment they arrive at the store. ;-)

  43. bought a 360 instead by thomasa · · Score: 1

    back in January you could not get any so I bought a 360 instead.

    1. Re:bought a 360 instead by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You want a cookie for that?

  44. Capitalist point about the Wii production ramp up by Ang31us · · Score: 1

    Presumably, the Wii is manufactured in a 3rd world country where things like overtime and night differential don't exist (as we are treated in most US jobs).

    I wonder if Nintendo and its partners are manufacturing Wiis 24 hours a day, 7 days a week, 365 days a year at their factories. Does anyone know?

  45. Re:Two words: Contract Manufacturing by Fozzyuw · · Score: 1

    The assertion that Nintendo would build an entire factory to satisfy the console demand is ludicrous. They would and should simply hire a contract manufacturer...

    Sorry, the point wasn't that Nintendo would literally build a factory. The use of "build a factory" was to simplify the point of manufacturing supply to avoid long convoluted business strategy, demand management, and time/cost constraints and complexities. Turken also points out other contract manufacturing dependencies.

    My apologizes if my statement seemed to literal instead of figurative. I'm familiar enough with contract manufacturing, I work for a manufacturing company that supplies big name retailers (obviously they're not going to build their own factory) and other manufactures, to name a few.

    Cheers,
    Fozzy

    --
    "The past was erased, the erasure was forgotten, the lie became truth." ~1984 George Orwell
  46. short term vs. long term by brokeninside · · Score: 1

    Economies of scale only work over the long term. Five years from now, when the additional fixed cost of building another factory has been entirely paid off, each additional unit of production will only be concerned with marginal costs.

  47. Raising Prices while adding value = no backlash... by trdrstv · · Score: 2

    I think Nintendo would be hit big time with bad publicity if they suddenly raised their prices. Have you ever seen any consumer electronic device come out and then suddenly raise their price when demand was high?

    They can't raise their prices without increasing the perceived value, or there will be a huge backlash. What they COULD do, is what retailers are doing and forcing bundles. Make the Wii available in 2 packages. 1 solo $250 package (what's offered now) that will get 30% of production, and 70% of production will go to the new $399 "Wii Multiplayer Bundle"; which includes the system, WiiPlay, an Extra Nunchuck, 2 Classic controllers, and $40 in Wii Points cards.

    That they could do.

  48. What disk drives? In a Wii? Needed for production? by analogduck · · Score: 1

    "He added that there had been a worldwide shortage of disk drives that had hurt Nintendo as well as makers of many other devices."

    Where are these Wii's with disk drives? I want one! Last I checked, they not only don't have any, but Nintendo has gone so far as to say that they never will.

    Perhaps he meant to say "disc drives".

    I'll reference this well written article Apple has provided regarding the difference between the words "disk" and "disc":
    http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=302152

    --
    ~"If at first you don't succeed, chainsaw juggling is probably not for you."
  49. disk drives by OrangeTide · · Score: 1

    My Wii doesn't have one, it has flash. Where can you get a disk drive? (perhaps it's a disc drive as in CD/DVD? I dunno)

    --
    “Common sense is not so common.” — Voltaire
  50. Good Grief! by LWATCDR · · Score: 1

    "Parents, Grandparents, good friends, etc might be looking to get someone a Wii for year-end Holidays (in whatever form they choose to celebrate)."
    It is called Christmas! That is the Holiday that most people are celebrating even if they are not Christians. Any one that is looking for a Wii as a Hanukkah present is an idiot or really shopping ahead since it ended about five days ago.
    It is Christmas or Hanukkah...

    --
    See my blog http://ilovecookes.blogspot.com/ for light hearted technical information.
    1. Re:Good Grief! by fotbr · · Score: 1

      Is it that big of a deal to you that someone is trying to not offend someone who may not celebrate Christmas?

    2. Re:Good Grief! by Zaphod2016 · · Score: 1

      Does anyone get offended by the phrase "Merry Christmas"? I'm an agnostic psuedo-Jew, and I *love* Christmas. I think both sides of the "War on Christmas" are insane.

    3. Re:Good Grief! by LWATCDR · · Score: 1

      Yes it is. It is just silly.
      I have a friend that is Jewish. She says Happy Hanukkah to me and I say Merry Christmas to her. It is offensive because it really is Christmas. I am sorry if you have issues dealing with being left out. You don't have to be but it is intolerant to expect people to change just to make you comfortable. It would be like me moving to Isrial or Sudia Arabia and getting bent that they have the nerve to celebrate Yom Kippur or Ramadan! Or for me to try an create a harvest festival that happens around Yom Kippur and try to say that it is just as important.
      That is offensive, Merry Christmas isn't.

      --
      See my blog http://ilovecookes.blogspot.com/ for light hearted technical information.
    4. Re:Good Grief! by LWATCDR · · Score: 1

      "I'm an agnostic psuedo-Jew"
      Wouldn't that be a "cultural Jew". Pseudo means false and I am assuming that you are Jewish by birth but are not practicing.

      And yes I know people that are offended by Merry Christmas. Heck I know people that are offended by any mention of anything to do with Christianity at all. What is so weird is that at least on of them is perfectly willing to go to Hindu religious festivals, Native American Festivals, and "celebrated Hanukkah".

      --
      See my blog http://ilovecookes.blogspot.com/ for light hearted technical information.
    5. Re:Good Grief! by Zaphod2016 · · Score: 1

      That sounds like a bigot to me. I thought cultural diversity meant exactly that: accepting different beliefs and customs, and learning to coexist peacefully.

      Perhaps your friend can enjoy "XMAS" instead, and sing some pleasant secular anthems, like "Rudolph the Red Nose Reindeer" or "Santa Clause is Coming to Town". Perhaps you can explain that Christmas is actually an ancient pagan tradition, in celebration of the winter solstice, not the birth of the messiah. As a matter of fact, 18th century Christians outlawed Christmas in America as being "unwholesome"; too much gluttony and dancing, I suppose.

      Perhaps I am a pragmatist. Even racists and bigots enjoy a day off from work on MLK Jr's birthday. I figure agnostics and atheists deserve a day off too, even if they think the entire Christian ethos is hogwash, or simply aren't sure.

      Also, I'm not sure I deserve the title "cultural Jew" because I don't really like Jewish food, can't speak fluent Hebrew, and support a two-state Israel/Palestine solution. According to my orthodox cousins, I'm not a "real" Jew.

      I say: God bless us, every one. Even if God is dead, or a flying spaghetti monster.

    6. Re:Good Grief! by LWATCDR · · Score: 1

      Christmas was only outlawed by the Puritans not all Americans. The Puritans where a bit much.

      You may be what title you wish. I personally don't know if you must like Jewish food to be Jewish or support Israel politically on all things. I know that some Jewish groups felt that forming Israel was actually sacrilegious. They believed that Israel would only return when the Messiah came.
      Just like I wouldn't call someone not a real Christian for being pro-choice I wouldn't say you are not a real Jew but that is just me.
      Of course I had a friend that called me anti-semitic because I didn't like Steinfeld so what do I know?

      --
      See my blog http://ilovecookes.blogspot.com/ for light hearted technical information.
  51. Re:eBay suggests that Nintendo isn't losing that m by Chris+Burke · · Score: 3, Interesting

    But more importantly, the lack of a large premium on the Wii from resellers suggest that the present rate of production and price is very close to the market equilibrium. If demand were far outstripping supply, the premium from resellers on eBay would be far higher.

    Not necessarily. This could instead indicate that the demand is elastic with respect to price. That would mean the demand for $250 Wiis is extremely high, while the demand for $400+ Wiis is very low. An item being in short supply relative to the demand does not automatically mean that the people who want the item would be willing to pay more for it. That usually only applies to what are more or less necessities, like gasoline or food staples.

    This especially makes sense in the context of who the Wii's primary market is -- casual non-gamers. These are people who maybe saw a friend or relative's Wii, played it and had fun, and decided they want one despite not being into any previous game consoles. For them, $250 for a fun toy may seem like it's worth it. If the toy turns out to be hard to find, are they going to decide that they will instead pay $300, $400, or $500 for it? Or are they going to decide that they don't need it that bad, and can wait until more are available?

    It's only the hard-core that are going to be willing to buy their chosen console no matter the price. But even then they're also the ones who'd be willing to call every store in town and show up before they open on shipment day. The latter is the category I fell into. Even I, long-time Nintendo fan boy, wasn't willing to pay scalper mark-ups on a Wii.

    What this implies is that despite some theories to the contrary, the Wii's MSRP is in fact a major selling point.

    --

    The enemies of Democracy are
  52. Even the DS is sold out in the UK by Ian.Waring · · Score: 1

    Nintendo are still advertising the Wii and the DS on TV here - and both are as common as rocking horse droppings. My wife's had to settle for a silver DS after I couldn't get her a pink one. 50 years old and her first console - starting with "Imagine Babies" of all things.

    But, hats off to Nintendo. Brilliant execution after everyone had written them off...

    Ian W.

  53. Actually, by ElboRuum · · Score: 1

    Apple may do what it likes of course, however, without some technical reference or source OUTSIDE of Apple (apparently missing at the link), I'll be skeptical of this "difference".

  54. That's the problem by chemindefer · · Score: 1
    "'We don't feel like we've made any mistakes,' said George Harrison, senior vice president for marketing at Nintendo of America.

    And probably Ringo is in charge of forecasting.

  55. Hmm... by ElboRuum · · Score: 1

    Where can I get some problems like the one Nintendo's got?

    Nintendo: "Well, we're making money hand over fist here and we can't keep up with the demand. Woe is us!"

  56. Let's use the laughing-bank argument... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Quite so, and to be even more in tune with reality:
    Nintendo is the only console manufacturer to be making a profit on their entire hardware line. I *think* it was a minimum of $20 per Wii on launch day, and it must be quite a bit more now. Microsoft's entire console division didn't see a profit until Halo 3, and that was for their SECOND console. (I think Halo 2 basically paid for the R&D of both. ;-)

    So, stock shortage or not, the worst that can be said about "missing" a Billion in sales is that Nintendo and its investors are laughing slightly-less-hard all the way to the bank. And hey, don't forget about the DS sales. HAHAHA!

    (Boy I wish I bought Nintendo stock in the N64 days... /kicks self)

  57. Missed their mark by dkarma · · Score: 0

    sounds like they might have bought into as much of the ps3 hype as the rest of us did and just didn't make enough. Maybe it was an attempt at "shrewd" marketing

    IMO everyone loves the wii because for the first time video games made people move and interact with the other players instead of just pressing a button...now dad's really pitching to you...Hell even mom can swing a golf club.

    Will the wii bring families closer together? Does it count as quality time?

  58. Problems... by ElboRuum · · Score: 1

    Firstly, Real World Tennis comes some-assembly-required. It requires a tennis court, some balls, racquets and another person, not all of which are available all the time, and none of which are included in the base package.

    Secondly, Real World Bowling does not come with GETTING FRESH AIR as you've advertised. Real World Bowling comes with GETTING STALE BOWLING ALLEY AIR THAT SMELLS LIKE A COMBINATION OF STALE BEER AND OTHER PEOPLE'S FEET. Additionally, RWB can only be played at certain hours, and only on a pay-per-play basis.

  59. ebay is small beans in the bigger picture by freeweed · · Score: 1

    Just go look on ebay...there are thousands on thousands of them for sale.

    Your "thousands and thousands" amongst sales of nearly 2 MILLION per month ... amounts to little more than statistical noise. The vast majority of Wii purchasers are playing their consoles. Someone (well, people collectively) would have to be ebaying HUNDREDS of thousands, every single month, to make any noticeable impact to the market.

    --
    Endless arguments over trivial contradictions in books written by ignorant savages to explain thunder in the dark.
  60. License someone! by Kris_J · · Score: 1

    They should license Panasonic to make a Wii that also plays HD-DVD and Blu-Ray, like they previously made the Q that was a Gamecube that played DVDs. They could crank the price right up and plenty of people would still buy it until the normal Wii caught up with demand.

    1. Re:License someone! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Funny

      Panasonic is Nintendo assmunch

  61. Wii by djdavetrouble · · Score: 2, Insightful

    The Wii has been effectively sold out for over 12 months straight now.
    I don't understand this. The guy next to me at work was all, "I want a wii, they don't have it
    on target.com, its sold out blah blah blah". I called ghetto ass gamestop and they had a pile of them
    for the regular old price. Of course, the next day he "decided not to get it just yet". Anyway,
    Where is the shortage? The day before xmas? News flash, they are also
    out of the good barbies, transformers, and anything else interesting until they restock....

    Everyone that I know that wanted a Wii went to the store and bought one already.

    --
    music lover since 1969
    1. Re:Wii by sexconker · · Score: 1

      Everyone that I know that wanted a Wii went to the store and bought one already. I defy you to walk into any retail store not in the boonies and find a "stack" of Wiis.
      Pics or it didn't happen.
    2. Re:Wii by djdavetrouble · · Score: 2, Funny

      Gamestop, Broadway, New York City. It doesn't get any less boonie than that.
      I'm on my way there NOW to post pics on slashdot.... ...not

      --
      music lover since 1969
    3. Re:Wii by Brickwall · · Score: 1
      As I posted in another thread, CNBC released results around 11:15 this morning noting that fully 79% of potential game buyers want a Wii, 16% want a PS3, and a measly 5% want an Xbox. Among women, the number of potential Wii buyers is an impressive 90%.

      And when I went looking for Guitar Hero III for my daughter's Christmas present in Toronto, Future Shop (an electronics chain) doesn't even carry it, but they have scads of the Activision version. And at my local Wal-Mart, there are stacks of Activision, but no Wii copies. The sales clerk told me she doubts they will get any more copies before Christmas, and that they only got six in their last shipment, while they got cases of the Activision version.

      --
      What was once true, is no longer so
    4. Re:Wii by Jarjarthejedi · · Score: 1

      Pick a store in my area (Phoenix, Arizona). Best Buy, Circuit City, Gamestop, even EB-Games (NOTE: The one by me NEVER has anything in stock, despite supposedly having the same stocking as the 2 gamestops near it) had Wiis all summer, up until about a month ago. I would get pics, but I don't (yet) have a time travel device.

      I've noticed that the 'it's sold out' crowd is almost always crowded in 2 or 3 states that seem to either get less or buy more Wiis, or they just sit quietly, ignoring the current stock, until it sells out, at which point they start declaring how they've been trying to get a Wii but can't find one. Don't know what category you're in, but if you wanted to buy a Wii about 3 months ago I could have shown you 20+ in my area, you could have had your pic (and you can still have your pick of PS3s :P, no one's sold out of those that I know of).

      --
      There are two kinds of fool One says 'This is old therefore good' Another says 'This is new therefore better'- Dean Ing
    5. Re:Wii by KDR_11k · · Score: 1

      Activision is the publisher, not a console. They publish the Wii version, too.

      --
      Justice is the sheep getting arrested while an impartial judge declares the vote void.
    6. Re:Wii by sexconker · · Score: 1

      I was in the crowd that stood in line for 12 hours on launch day and got one, thanks.

      Absolutely no Wiis to be found from LA to Santa Barbara County.

      Yes - you might see some in stock, but they don't last.
      And I've never personally seen a Wii on a shelf (and I check whenever I get the chance).

      All the naysayers out there are unable to produce pictures of excess stock.
      The PS3 and 360 had to suffer tons of "LOL no one's buying it" pictures.
      Outside of Japan, this simply isn't true for the Wii.

      And if you really could have gotten to "20+" in your area, why not buy them and resell for a profit?
      If, as you claim, the issue is related to supply distributions, why not help out (and make a tidy profit) on eBay?

  62. It's region lock's fault by rabiddeity · · Score: 2, Informative

    They could have solved this entire issue by making consoles that aren't region locked. There are dozens of Wii consoles sitting at my local game shop here in Japan, and there's no big Christmas rush here. Since you're probably making the consoles in China or Malaysia and have to ship them anyway, and if there is a surplus in Japan, you'd say, why doesn't Nintendo just ship the extra units from Japan to the U.S.? Well they can't, because they've factory-locked the console to only play discs from Japan. Stupid, stupid, stupid.

    The way to design a product you're selling internationally is to prompt the user for a language on first boot-up (I think the iPod does this), package in a regionalized manual or a universal manual with just pictures of how to set it up, and include a localized power cord. Of course, you have to design the console to operate in either PAL or NTSC. But a nice perk of this is that you don't piss off the few customers who want to play games released only in another region. Of course, that means you won't be able to charge twice as much for games sold in the UK and Australia anymore, but you'll more than make up for it in volume.

    Nintendo really shot themselves in the foot with this. They got it right with the DS and fucked it up with the Wii. It was completely avoidable.

  63. Its called economics... by CalicoDreams · · Score: 0
    Lets assume that Nintendo in their infinite wisdom has at least one economist on their staff (its not like they are a huge company and would have an office full of them). That economist, after hearing about the MASSIVE SHORTAGE COSTING US 100 MILLION IN SALES would look at the figures (the statistics: how much they produce, how much it costs to produce another 100 000 units, etc) and determine the optimal amount of units to produce to MAXIMIZE their profits (by minimizing their production costs).

    Thats why they are selling as much as they are. They don't care about the loss of 100 million because the cost to produce the extra units would result in LESS profit then they are currently experiencing. This is a very simplistic overview of what they are doing on a decision basis.

  64. ...but save billions in marketing? by trawg · · Score: 1

    Thanks to the shortages and articles like this, the Wii is the hot item to get for Christmas. This year's Google Zeitgeist has an interesting page showing the surge of Wii searches as we approach the end of the year.

  65. Still insignificant. by Cyno01 · · Score: 1

    Even 30,000 is only 1.6 percent of their monthly sales...

    --
    "Sic Semper Tyrannosaurus Rex."
  66. Panic for no reason? by ooh456 · · Score: 1

    I've had a Wii since day one. I see them in all the stores I got to in both Europe and the U.S. Who are these people that can't find one? My guess is its only the people who need to buy one between December 10th and 24th. Plan ahead a little people, fer chrissakes.

  67. Still... by Cyno01 · · Score: 1

    Even if OP meant disc drive, i'm pretty sure nintendo manufactures their own, considering its a slot loading drive like nothing else i've seen. Its operation, grabbing the disc at the very edge and also accepting the 6cm sized gamecube discs, is different from any other drive on the market.

    --
    "Sic Semper Tyrannosaurus Rex."
  68. Let's forget for a moment... by unborracho · · Score: 1

    That the Wii's have no disk drives in them.

    --
    "You had this look that of an angel, it was such a bad disguise" --Dishwalla
    1. Re:Let's forget for a moment... by pembo13 · · Score: 1

      yup, those game disks read themselves

      --
      "Thanks for all the money you paid to us. We've used it to buy off ISO among other things" -Microsoft
    2. Re:Let's forget for a moment... by HTH+NE1 · · Score: 1

      GP and I come from an era where a "disk drive" meant a drive that took one of 3.5", 5.25", or 8" removable magnetic disk media, and would rather you young whippersnappers used more specific terminology such as hard drive, optical drive, or coin drive.

      Anyway, don't the Wii disks employ counter-clockwise spiral tracks?

      --
      Oh, say does that Star-Spangled Banner entwine / The myrtle of Venus with Bacchus's vine?
  69. Solution by matt+me · · Score: 1

    Sell Wii's at twice the price.

  70. Do we have another Gobots on our hands? by Lunarsight · · Score: 1

    You hope that Nintendo Wii doesn't become the Gobots of the decade.

    The Gobots line was a brilliant idea, but what ultimately sunk it was a lack of availability. Another toy came along that was able to keep up with the demand better [Transformers], and Gobots faded into oblivion.

  71. Re:eBay suggests that Nintendo isn't losing that m by ookaze · · Score: 1

    What this implies is that despite some theories to the contrary, the Wii's MSRP is in fact a major selling point. Not at all! This is a fact that Gamecube sold less than the others last generation, despite a lower price than even the Wii. So the "low" price has very little to do with the Wii's success. Of course, the price is in line with the strategy of Nintendo though, but it's not a major selling point.
  72. Griefers by tepples · · Score: 1

    Or how about this new fangled , environmentally friendly device called: GO OUTSIDE AND PLAY! Unfortunately, GO OUTSIDE AND PLAY! has more griefers who kidnap playing children than Wii Sports has. In addition, server conditions such as bad weather can make playing nearly unbearable.

    Both games come with a bonus titled called, GETTING FRESH AIR. Not if the local bowling center has decided that tobacco smokers are a more profitable customer base than non-smokers.
  73. Animal Crossing? by tepples · · Score: 1

    Fresh air doesn't always exist outside, especially in a heavy urban environment. Then you need to get Harvest Moon or Animal Crossing for GO OUTSIDE AND PLAY!. Here are screenshots.
  74. Re:eBay suggests that Nintendo isn't losing that m by Chris+Burke · · Score: 1

    Uh, being a "major selling point" is not meant to imply that people would buy any item at this price, or that it is the only thing about the item that makes it desirable. It's meant to imply that it is a major feature that in it's absence would stop many people from buying it. Motions controls and simple intuitive games like Wii Sports are also major selling points, and without them you basically get a Gamecube with commensurate sales. However, as the Ebay auctions show, most people are not willing to buy the Wii without the price-feature either. The people buying Wiis are not hard-core gamers, they were never in the market for a Gamecube-era system anyway, and they aren't willing to spend much more than the Wii's MSRP on any game console. Thus, it's price is a major selling point.

    --

    The enemies of Democracy are
  75. Three things to have a Wii think about by WillAffleckUW · · Score: 1

    1. If they put too much money into ramping up production now for the Wii, will that make it easier - or harder - when they come out with the 1080p HDTV-supporting Wii2 console?

    2. Even if they doubled production again, who's to say the true market is not four times the size, and there will still be lines?

    3. Do they have enough Wiimotes and Nunchuks for all those consoles, if they did double production - again?

    One hopes they will be ready for all the demand when they bring out the higher resolution Wii2 with the even more improved high definition storage drives (probably HD-DVD, but if Sony pulls an upset, I can see having Blu-Ray) and the better processors. It might even have a new name, since the chip designs will be radically different.

    --
    -- Tigger warning: This post may contain tiggers! --
  76. There are no other options by LKM · · Score: 1

    I think the extra time that people spend waiting for the wii will be spend evaluating the other options

    You're wrong. Here's how 90% of all Wii owners I know got their Wii:

    Played Wii Sports or Rayman or Carnival Games or EA Playground or Mario Soccer at a friend's place. Decided they wanted to have this game, too.

    They don't care about other options. You can't play Wii Sports on any other console, and Rayman sucks on the PS2, so there is no other option.

  77. Makes perfect sense... by nilbog · · Score: 1

    See, Nintendo's position here makes perfect sense. The problem this year was that Christmas wasn't announced until after their 5 month window to prepare for it had started. They weren't given enough time with that late announcement that we were doing the Christmas thing for once this year.

    Next time we do Christmas, let's just plan ahead a little and give some notice, m'kay?

    --
    or else!