Slashdot Mirror
House Dems Turn Out the Lights On the GOP
Politico is reporting that while GOP leaders opposed a motion to adjourn the House, the Democrats have closed up shop and even turned out the lights. While the lights and microphones have since been turned back on, it makes for an amusing mental image and possibly even a few dark YouTube video spoofs. "Only about a half-dozen Republicans were on the floor when this began, but the crowd has grown to about 20 now, according to Patrick O'Connor. 'This is the people's House,' Rep, Thaddeus McCotter (R-Mich.) said. 'This is not Pelosi's politiburo.' Democratic aides were furious at the GOP stunt, and reporters were kicked out of the Speaker's Lobby, the space next to the House floor where they normally interview lawmakers."
It's great that C-SPAN covers kindergarten now.
I'm missing the story other than Boehner and gang are trying to make a fuss about nothing.
The motion to adjourn passed, so the Speaker banged the gavel and they went home. Am I supposed to think that the Democrats are somehow disregarding the rules of the House and refusing to let Republicans speak?
The summary didn't state everything. Pelosi was trying to stop a vote concerning foreign oil drilling. The REP's are currently mad and speaking to the public who have gathered in the upstairs gallery, arguing (one-sided, of course) their concerns and solutions for rising gas and energy prices.
What actually happened, of course, was that the House adjourned for its August recess. As scheduled. Just like it does every year. Presumably it was scheduled months in advance. Everyone knew it.
Except this time the minority party refused to, you know, leave. Though the government is not in session, the Republicans insist on hanging around anyway.
Why? Not to get any work done. They're sticking around in the hopes of getting some press simply for being stupid.
It may work. If the Democrats did this, the media would be happy to portray them as whiny little losers who didn't know when to go home. (Which would basically be accurate.)
But since it's Republicans doing it, the media -- including Slashdot, in this case -- will find amusement in what the Dems "did" to the GOP. Politico, which is generally an organ of the Republican Party, is true to form by calling Democrats "furious" and "complaing" [sic]. Slashdot says the Dems "turned out the lights on" them and giggles that the Democrats left even though "GOP leaders opposed a motion to adjourn." (It doesn't matter what "GOP leaders" wanted. The motion to adjourn passed. So the House adjourned. Learn 2 parliamentary procedure, noobs.)
Calling the House a "politburo" (meaning "the policymaking committee of a Communist party") because it adjourned on schedule is -- and here I have to agree with the Democrat who was quoted -- moronic.
And the issue the GOP is demagoguing is gasoline prices and offshore drilling. This pushes today's stunt from ridiculous to pathetic. The Department of Energy's official projection is that if offshore drilling were legalized immediately, "any impact on average wellhead prices is expected to be insignificant" -- even in 2030.
And that's an inflated stat, since its numbers include hypothetical drilling off the coast of California. The GOP is pushing to allow states to allow OCS drilling if they choose -- "states' rights," as the slogan goes. And California's politicians, including its Republican governor, have made it clear the state will not allow more drilling off its coast. So the actual benefit of the current GOP proposal would be about 2/3 of the DoE's hypothetical. In 2030 :)
It's hard to believe that the Republicans would hang around a vacated government building after everyone's gone home, and yell into a bullhorn about how Congress needs to debate lower gas prices right now -- not in September! -- when Bush's own Department of Energy admits any changes would have zero effect on oil prices for 9 years and "insignificant" effect after that.
The GOP's twitter feed indicates their dogma du jour is: "drill here drill now to get us through the next 10 to 15 years." Again, the DoE's projections indicate zero effect on oil production or prices for the next 9 years, and "insignificant" effect after that.
It's unbelievable how pathetic our national politics has become. This embarrassment is why we need the grownups back in charge. And every media outlet that fails to make clear why the stunt is pathetic is part of the problem. Sadly, I include Slashdot in this.
Yawn...."Minority Leader John Boehner (R-Ohio) and other GOP leaders opposed the motion to adjourn the House, arguing that Pelosi's refusal to schedule a vote allowing offshore drilling is hurting the American economy. They have refused to leave the floor after the adjournment motion passed at 11:23 a.m. and are busy bashing Pelosi and her fellow Democrats for leaving town for the August recess."
What a load. Even if the offshore drilling is allowed it will be many years before we see any benefit from it (assuming that prices actually go down) More corporate welfare from the Repubs.
I think that's closer to what he was trying to say.
'Loose' is when your pants are three sizes too big. 'Lose' is when you misuse 'loose'.
GOP: "We must protect this House!"
'a';DROP TABLE users; SELECT * FROM DATA WHERE name LIKE '%'... if you're reading this, it didn't work.
As I recall in 2003 the GOP chair of a committee refused to allow the Democratic members of the committe to speak, ignored a motion to continue the hearing and stormed off WITH the gavel in hand...all this beacuse the dems wanted to call some witnesses for testimony.
I forget the details but google knows all.
wait until you see the singapore or korean parliament footages. circus doesnt describe it.
even in turkish parliament there has been a lot of fights, and one representative was killed even, by a stray fist landing unintendedly.
Read radical news here
Even if the offshore drilling is allowed it will be many years before we see any benefit from it...
And you guys have been saying that for many years. That's why we couldn't fix the problem back then too. Now, many years later, it is not fixed.
More corporate welfare from the Repubs.
Translation: "Americans can't have cheaper gas because some corporation might make some money. It's worth it to have poor people suffer just so you can stick it to those nasty corporations."
I for one welcome our new Republican overlords... wait a minute
First, it hardly seems cool to hijack the floor and irk a bunch of Congressional police who should be going home to try and ram some unlikely legislation through before a scheduled vacation.
Secondly, typing the PIN into the PA on accident isn't hacking, especially when that PIN is probably "12345." That only counts as being a hacker in a Harrison Ford movie. Real hacking films, like "Hackers" and "Jurrasic Park" show us true hacking, where you fly through file-systems in 3D.
all it is is flames in both directions. we have more important things to discuss. like, for instance, goatse.cx
if this is supposed to be a new economy, how come they still want my old fashioned money?
Oil prices are high because speculators think future supply will be low. If we drill, speculators may think future supply will be higher. This will lower current prices even though the oil won't be immediately available.
You are assuming that everyone is going to go hang out at their own 1000 acre ranch.
Congress adjourns BECAUSE we are a representative democracy. Most congressmen go to their home districts and then spend all their time meeting with the people (YOU) to better understand what you want and represent you better.
This is congress doing their job.
What really tells is how active Congress is when they are in session. This Congress has been very active even though all the important legislation has been vetoed. Personally I am looking forward to meeting with my representative (Jim Marshal D-Ga) without having to fly to Washington.
News for Nerds... er, ok.. how is this?
Were the lights turned off by robot running linux?
Seriously editors, the best way to compete with Digg is not to compete with Digg. People will come.
Elected representatives are supposed to remain in touch with the districts they represent. Having them remain in Washington, D.C. 11 and 1/2 months a year makes it difficult to do that.
Not, of course, that every representative uses his or her vacation time to keep in touch with his or her constituents, mind you. But that's part of the point, at least.
Sean Daugherty "I have walked in Eternity -- and Eternity weeps."
You are an idiot. Gross profit means nothing. Their profit margin was about 8%. There are many more companies with a higher profit margin.
The value of crude oil has gone up considerably in the last 10 years. All the oil that was not pumped out of the ground under the U.S. and burned in the last decade is now much more valuable, and if you can avoid pumping and burning it for another 10 years then it will be still more valuable.
Given that Americans are handing huge bills to future generations, including a $10 trillion debt and another $80 trillion in unfunded liabilities (Medicare, Social Security), it is nice that some valuable resources can be passed on too. It is unfortunate that many Americans seem to think "If we don't drill and burn this crude oil now, *I* won't benefit from it! Drill Drill Drill, Burn Burn Burn! It's MY crude oil and I want to BURN it NOW!"
any impact on average wellhead prices is expected to be insignificant
zero effect on oil production or prices for the next 9 years
It's ths kind of thinking, or lack of it, that got us into this problem in the first place. You folks can't think 6 inches in front of your dicks. IF it does take that long to get production started, then GET THE FUCK STARTED ON IT!
And despite the drugs you are on, if the situation was reversed, then ABCCBSNBCMSNBCCNN would have folks up there covering it like flys on horse crap.
When Fascism comes to America, it will call itself Anti-Fascism, and tell you to give up your guns.
Politics is mostly theater, faux outrage, and pandering. Why would a stunt like this cause the average Slashdot reader's blood to boil?
Because it's the GOP pulling the stunt. I don't recall much scoffing at Dennis Kucinich's attempt to hold impeachment hearings on President Bush. No, I guess that was all about a righteous avenger shining a spotlight on The Greatest Evil Our Planet Has Ever Known.
These kinds of stunts get the media's attention and some coverage for issues one party or the other thinks is important. The fact that the Democrats didn't even hold a vote on domestic drilling despite overwhelming public support is something that ought to be mocked.
Good heavens Miss Sakamoto - you're beautiful!
You've a great deal of unfounded claims there.
This was not an abuse of rules, nor would any reasonable observer claim the Democratic Party members have "abused" the rules as aggressively (nor broken as many) as the Republicans who control the House for the previous 12 years. Simply adjourning - which cuts off formal floor debate inherently - is not comparable to changing bills after they had been passed, holding votes open longer than permissible or the abusive use of holds (in the Senate). Your claims to the contrary are transparently partisan.
I know Congress has a deserved reputation for wasting money, but somehow I don't think they keep all the microphones, cameras and lights on in the months they spend adjourned. And C-Span is not contractually required to carry what is being said in the House regardless of whether or not its in session; you invented that out of whole cloth. They frequently don't show House debate - for instance if there is a major political story or an important House committee meeting. To make such a suggestion implies an almost total lack of familiarity with the channel.
The Ds adjourned. They didn't let the Republicans control the agenda. Boo-hoo. The House is designed for majority rule and the Republicans should get used to it since few 'experts' think they'll have more than 200 members next term.
Exactly. Instead of drilling domestically, where we know we can do it cleanly and for little political cost, we import oil from places like Mexico and Nigeria where environmental regulations are lax, and places like Saudi Arabia and Venezuela, where the governments are actively working against our interests in the world. This makes no sense and I don't see how any thinking person can think this policy - Nancy Pelosi's policy - is helping to save the planet.
Good heavens Miss Sakamoto - you're beautiful!
"The point is that more drilling isn't a fix. More drilling in the US will provide a relatively small amount of oil which will delay our energy problems for months, maybe a few years at best."
More drilling alone isn't a fix by itself, but it's patently stupid and dishonest to say that more oil in the supply line won't help prices.
"The Republicans are putting on a show today because it looks good to the unwashed masses, but getting their drilling won't solve our energy problems."
I notice that, to liberals, when the issue is liberal and popular with Americans, then they're a great and wise people, righteous in their anger at the Republicans. But when the issue is conservative and supported by Americans, they're stupid unwashed masses.
If you were really concerned about us solving our energy problems, you'd actually let us solve them. We've got plenty of ways to do it... more drilling, more shale, more coal to gasoline, more nuclear... liberals just don't like those options. What you're really mad about is that we won't do it your way... with nothing but biofuels and electric cars.
Life is hard, and the world is cruel
While I agree the stunt is a little immature I commend them for drawing attention to such an important issue- Nancy Pelosi. She has refused to allow the house to vote on offshore drilling.
First and foremost, unless the issue involves human rights: such as legalizing rape or murder, the house has a right to vote on it. The people of this country have a right to vote on subjects- that's what makes a democratic republic.
Second, I am one who feels the price of oil would drop with offshore drilling. It's a simple supply and demand problem. The supply is scarce so the cost rises. This allows oil speculators to raise the price even higher. Oil industry experts believe that oil could reach the market in 3 years; don't believe the 7-15 year nonsense. See 1980s oil glut for how supply and demand effect oil prices.
Third, I truly believe moving away from oil as a fuel source is the ultimate solution. This will not happen today, tomorrow, or 10 years from now. The correct action today is to unburden the lower class and the economy with the cost of gasoline by increasing oil supply.
Fourth, anyone who believes that Exxon makes excessive profits is a moron. 11.68 billion on 138.07 billion of revenue- 8.45% profit. That's considered an average profit in the business world.
Your argument is essentially that they acted inappropriately because their adjournment was premature and was therefore a premature adjournment.
There was a perfectly valid vote where a majority chose to adjourn. Republicans wanted to take control of the agenda. They were not allowed to. The Senate had adjourned the day before. Its grandstanding by a party too used to being able to bully Democrats.
If the Republicans cut off debate on the Democrats and went home for vacation, I can guarantee you that this story would have been about the Republicans censoring the Democrats.
The public is wrong. The price of crack has gone up and instead of trying to get off, they're demanding increased supply.
Yeah, that tends to happen in the House, where the majority tends to do whatever it wants. In the Senate, the minority has more rights. And your party has played the Senate rules and Harry Reid like a fiddle. Seriously and with no sarcasm, well done. If the Democrats had 1% of the balls your guys have, we'd have never been in Iraq. THAT would have kept oil prices down.
Mostly because the Democrats promised all sorts legislation on which they couldn't deliver. Again, your party has done a good job of using the Senate rules to keep popular Democratic bills from getting passed. Republicans know most people don't care (or even know) about cloture motions or other arcane parliamentary procedures. All your average person knows is that Democrats promised they'd fix everything the Republicans screwed up and they're not doing it.
I wish they had the balls to say that. The American people need to be told the score without any fluff. The age of cheap oil is over and it's going to take some sacrifice to get our economy switched over to renewables. We can't drill our way out of this even if we wanted to. India and China took our advice and liberalized their economies which made them a competitor for the same oil we are using.
Yes, because Newt Gingrich and Dennis Hastert were *SO* well-known for their kind-hearted efforts to make peace with the opposition party and affect bi-partisan legislation. Nope, no heavy-handedness with those guys.
SJW: Someone who has run out of real oppression, and has to fake it.
The public overwhelmingly supports it? Citation or you're just talking out your ass. The last 3 polls I saw stated exactly the opposite.
My pleasue. Here you go. I got my poll results from CNN. Where are you getting yours?
73 percent of Americans favor offshore drilling.
I'd call 73 percent overwhelming, wouldn't you? And even in California, long an anti-drilling bastion, support for drilling is now at 51 percent and climbing.
Life is hard, and the world is cruel
Increased capacity down the line might move oil producers to increase their production now (because of the decreased future profits from keeping it in the ground). 20-40$ per barrel is of course a stupid amount of money to account for that.
The market doesn't speculate based on fundamentals though, the market speculates on based on what they perceive the market will speculate on based on what they perceive the market will speculate on based on what they perceive the market will speculate on .... based on the fundamentals. Pumping up bubbles is a completely rational thing to do when leverage is available (and the collapse of the housing markets have made a lot of capital available for oil speculation). Or at least it's rational as long as you think you are smarter than everyone else, better able to find the percentage advantages needed to make the most of the leverage and smart enough to see when to get out.
It's not so much that the announcement of drilling would change the fundamentals, but everyone expects it to be the pin prick which will burst the bubble (which thus becomes a self fulfilling prophecy). Don't be the one left holding the bag ;)
http://money.cnn.com/2006/05/09/news/economy/oil_cuba/index.htm
US companies didn't bother to submit a bid because legally they couldn't drill that close to US shore. China has no such limitation.
Changing a bill after it had been passed
Holding open vote
(additional examples)
It is against House rules to keep a vote open in order to alter the outcome.
"Abusive holds" is difficult to quantify but I'd point towards Tom Coburn's extensive holds.
If...
the price of oil = X dollars + (opening a wildlife area to drilling and damage)
...then we are not lowering the price of oil; we're just paying for some of the oil with financial resources and some with environmental resources.
The price of oil has still gone up.
What laws did they put in effect that are causing you to go broke? I'm not going broke driving to work, maybe your budget problems aren't actually congress' fault, you ever think of that?
- None can love freedom heartily, but good men; the rest love not freedom, but license. -- John Milton
Did you mean this part of the article:
recent Department of Energy studies [show] that drilling in the outer continental shelf will have an "insignificant" impact on costs in the next two decades.
It's always congresses fault when the wealthy or conservatives go broke.
contrawise
When democrats, the poor, or liberals are having issues, it's due to our lack of personal responsibility.
Didn't you get the Memo?
---------- Pug
An Invisible Entity of Vast Power whose existence must be taken on faith alone: Liberal Media
Maybe you're not aware of it, but from the mid 90s to 2006, there's all kinds of shut-out stories of precisely the kind you're talking about -- the Republican party didn't episodically decide to shut the Dems out, there was a concerted effort and plan for marginalizing them as fully as possible. Take a listen to Act III of This American Life's Houses of Ill Repute episode if you're interested in some perspective.
Personally, I don't recall stories during that time period about how the Republicans were censoring the Democrats, but perhaps, since you have *guaranteed* that it would be covered in that manner, you can put up some examples.
Tweet, tweet.
So on $400 an $11 markup is gouging? I want to shop where YOU shop.
I wanted to point out that those numbers are $11 billion per quarter and $400 billion per year. The correct numbers are $11.68b profit this quarter, on $138b revenue this quarter.
AND, do you want to know who's #2 in the 'record profits' field? Is it Shell, Conoco, etc? Nope, it's Walmart. Look it up.
I looked it up and you are incorrect. As of April 2008, the number two spot, sorted by profits, is indeed Royal Dutch Shell. Walmart is way down there at #19 (you'll have to count). See http://www.forbes.com/lists/2008/18/biz_2000global08_The-Global-2000_Prof.html .