Irish Domain Registry Banning Adult Domains

Karate Sid writes "An Irish adult website has blogged about the Irish domain registry banning adult domain names, including porn.ie and pornography.ie. The IEDR's reasoning is that the words 'porn' and 'pornography' are offensive and immoral. Of interest is how Sex.ie took legal action against the IEDR — and proved that neither word is offensive — yet still lost the case, as the IEDR are the highest authority in Ireland when it comes to deciding what is and isn't an offensive domain."

Comments

It's a shame

[MBGMorden]

Really a shame on this. I'd argue that we need more Irish porn in the world :(.

Re:It's a shame

[Anonymous Coward]

I dunno. I get tired of girlswithsunburn.com pretty fast.

Re:It's a shame

[meringuoid]

Ah come on now. When have you ever seen the sun in Ireland?

Re:It's a shame

[Anonymous Coward]

damn, no more redheaded women with their burning bushes

Re:It's a shame

[redkcir]

As if they needed another reason to drink. No porn? I guess I'd have to start.

Re:It's a shame

[Hognoxious]

The Irish are so pale they can get a tan from a full moon.

Re:It's a shame

[Anonymous Coward]

On another note, the words: 'torture', 'decapitation', and 'rape' are still allowed because they OTOH are *not* immoral or in the slightest bit offensive.

Thank you,
Your totalitarian government

Not so big an issue

[EdIII]

Really. Who gives a shit? Nobody should.

This is just a TLD, which is obviously run by some governing body in Ireland. They get to choose what they want on the TLD, and I assume at some level it is supported by the politicians.

Now, if there are people that feel oppressed in Ireland, they can simply get a domain at a different TLD. They could also just move out of Ireland. That's a choice too.

The real problem is when Irish ISPs start blocking other TLDs and controlling what domains people can resolve on their networks. Then of course come all the blogs and posts about proxies/TOR/Freenet/OpenDNS.

Maybe I am triviliazing the issue, but being restricted on possible domains on a TLD that only applies to a single country does not seem as big of an issue as actually interferring with what traffic can reach a country. It's large scale censorship such as the Great Firewall in China that should be more concerning than this.

If the Irish people feel that they are being oppressed and it is a free speech issue, then they need to address that with their politicians. It's still largely ineffective.

Re:Not so big an issue

[Facegarden]

Really. Who gives a shit? Nobody should.

This is just a TLD, which is obviously run by some governing body in Ireland. They get to choose what they want on the TLD, and I assume at some level it is supported by the politicians.

Now, if there are people that feel oppressed in Ireland, they can simply get a domain at a different TLD. They could also just move out of Ireland. That's a choice too.

The real problem is when Irish ISPs start blocking other TLDs and controlling what domains people can resolve on their networks. Then of course come all the blogs and posts about proxies/TOR/Freenet/OpenDNS.

Maybe I am triviliazing the issue, but being restricted on possible domains on a TLD that only applies to a single country does not seem as big of an issue as actually interferring with what traffic can reach a country. It's large scale censorship such as the Great Firewall in China that should be more concerning than this.

If the Irish people feel that they are being oppressed and it is a free speech issue, then they need to address that with their politicians. It's still largely ineffective.

It's still a government trying to tell its people what words they should and should not see, which is censorship and something to notice and oppose.
-Taylor

Re:Not so big an issue

[Anachragnome]

While I can agree with you on some points, this is still a "foot in the door", so to speak, for censoring, a foot in MY door, regardless of where I live.

What is next? Government editing of dictionary entries? Wikipedia? Banning the word "pornography" from all search entries? Will I still be able to park my soapbox on the corner and mutter the word "pornography" over and over without fear of arrest?

It's the same foot in the door(censorship), just with a different shine on it...slam the door on it before it gets in.

Is the obvious(everyone starts using a different word! Gasp!) that far from their mental grasp? Or is there ulterior motive here? Hrmm?

Re:Not so big an issue

[Chyeld]

When I start seeing porn sites on .us, .gov, or .edu domains, then you have a point. Till then, this is a non-story. There are TDL's out there that are open to everyone. The nationally owned ones are solely responsible to that nation's government.

Re:Not so big an issue

[Chyeld]

Slippery Slope arguements are fallacy's. There is no proof that one step forward equates the same thing as ensuring that someone is going to go the full nine yards, or even that if they were, they'd end up where you want to paint them as going.

There is a middle ground here, there are plenty of TLD's out there that you can register with that are open to all comers. Government TLD's, despite the recent trend towards poorer countries whoring them out, are meant for that nation's government's use. If the government of Ireland wants to nix porn on the government owned TLD, that's entirely their perogative (till they are no longer the government of Ireland).

Re:Not so big an issue

[grcumb]

Really. Who gives a shit? Nobody should.

[snip]

It's still a government trying to tell its people what words they should and should not see, which is censorship and something to notice and oppose.

I give a shit, precisely because it's not government performing these actions. I get worried whenever an autonomous body takes it on itself to be an arbiter of public morals, and even the courts refuse to step into the fray.

I've a number of personal reasons for finding this particular story interesting. My parents and extended family are Irish, and some of them have been fighting for a generation against the reactionary inclinations of some elements of Irish society. (That's half the reason I was born in Canada.) This sanctimonious approach to 'dirty' subjects is typical of the kind of thing that makes even a polite discussion about morality nearly impossible. How can you talk about something if you can't even use the word that most aptly describes it?

Second, I'm coordinating work on the creation of a governance mechanism for a ccTLD in the developing world. Society here is very conservative in nature, and this is exactly the kind of object lesson we need to learn from.

You may not find this an interesting or enlightening topic, but those of us who care about the places where technology and society intersect find stories like this fascinating, challenging and yes, definitely news for nerds.

Re:Not so big an issue

[Anachragnome]

"Slippery Slope arguements are fallacy's. There is no proof that one step forward equates the same thing as ensuring that someone is going to go the full nine yards, or even that if they were, they'd end up where you want to paint them as going."

I've heard THAT bullshit before, and I'll respond the exact same way I do every time I hear it used.

While it may be true that a certain step, in a certain direction, MAY not end up with bad results, if it DOES, you then have to go back two steps, instead of one, to fix that which is broken.

That is PRECISELY the thought process these people are using to THEIR advantage. Take a little at a time, under the radar, infuse yourself into the "system", to the point it is too hard to undo the damage once everyone gets wise to the effects.

The A.I.G. mess is similar. Too big to fail? Not at all. Simply to big to LET fail...as was their intended goal all along.

Re:Not so big an issue

[Chris Acheson]

Like lu.scio.us?

Re:Not so big an issue

[Shakrai]

Slippery Slope [wikipedia.org] arguements are fallacy's. There is no proof that one step forward equates the same thing as ensuring that someone is going to go the full nine yards

Which is why our social security numbers are only used for the purposes of tracking our social security accounts and not for identification or anything extra like that.......

Re:Not so big an issue

[Anonymous Coward]

please mod this guy up. I almost forgot about that grat site.

Re:Not so big an issue

[DGolden]

It's still a government trying to tell its people what words they should and should not see, which is censorship and something to notice and oppose.

The irish constitution has some dangerous weasel-wording in it around that area. Lately it's been taken that european/international human rights law trumps more problematic aspects of the constitution, and it's important to remember that basically no sane irish person takes mere human law entirely seriously in the first place, but it just isn't particularly wonderful as constitutions go. May still better than still being ruled by the British I guess (I mean just look at Jacqui Smith...)...

6. 1. The State guarantees liberty for the exercise of the following rights, subject to public order and morality.

i. The right of the citizens to express freely their convictions and opinions.

The education of public opinion being, however, a matter of such grave import to the common good, the State shall endeavour to ensure that organs of public opinion, such as the radio, the press, the cinema, while preserving their rightful liberty of expression, including criticism of Government policy, shall not be used to undermine public order or morality or the authority of the State.

The publication or utterance of blasphemous, seditious, or indecent matter is an offence which shall be punishable in accordance with law.

Re:Not so big an issue

[microbee]

I give a shit

To whom? I don't want it.

Re:Not so big an issue

[Anonymous Coward]

How'd you feel if your child saw a bumper sticker on a car, in a grocery store parking lot that said, "your wife's other car is my big cock". Some things don't belong in public discourse.

Re:Not so big an issue

[rts008]

Hear! Hear!

It's like a game of red light/green light, and the citizens are 'it', and blindfolded. By the time you hear gov't.'s footsteps running up on you...it's too late.

Those that ignore/don't learn history, are doomed to repeating it.

Slippery Slope arguements are fallacy's. There is no proof that one step forward equates the same thing as ensuring that someone is going to go the full nine yards, or even that if they were, they'd end up where you want to paint them as going.

He will wake up one day, wondering WTF??!!?...Then try to blame his lack of attention on everyone else.
Unfortunately, most people are wearing blinders, and only pay attention to what is right in front of them; failing to notice that slippery slope just past their focal point.

Liberty, freedom, and justice all require constant vigilance. Always...Not only when affected, but always.

Keep up the good fight, sir! I'll be there beside you.(metaphorically, as I have no clue where you are at-no matter though...rts008 has your back and flanks in this fight:-)

Re:Not so big an issue

[Idiomatick]

Many tiny steps are easier to take. Even if we don't want government censoring of wikipedia now. When we get used to government censoring a wide variety of things. It becomes easier for a large number of people to swallow the scarier ideas.

Re:Not so big an issue

[Kingrames]

Clearly you have no idea how the internet works.

Deliberate acts of censorship are interpreted as DAMAGE to the internet, which routes around it.

This means that the actions of the governmental body have caused irreperable harm to the internet.
Al Gore might very well sue. That's his baby.

Re:Not so big an issue

[Anonymous Coward]

Actually, sex is illegal in Ireland. That's why there are so few Irish. The ones that are there are artificially... oh, you know.

Re:Not so big an issue

[Basehart]

First they ban porno.com - next they'll be burning women at the stake because someone called them a witch.

Re:Not so big an issue

[Basehart]

I know we're not talking about .com here btw - but you get what I'm ranting and raving on about here ;-)

Re:Not so big an issue

[MindlessAutomata]

So you'd be fine with it if it was the government doing it?

Re:Not so big an issue

[XnavxeMiyyep]

Who cares? Just because it hurts your feelings doesn't mean the government needs to do something about it.

Re:Not so big an issue

[ScrewMaster]

I get worried whenever an autonomous body takes it on itself to be an arbiter of public morals, and even the courts refuse to step into the fray.

Well, sure ... that always happens when the government happens to agree with what that autonomous body is doing, and is perfectly happy to let said body take the heat.

Re:Not so big an issue

[Anonymous Coward]

Not everyone on slashdot lives in the states you insensitive clod.

Re:Not so big an issue

[stonecypher]

Really. Who gives a shit? Nobody should.

I do. I just found an interesting domain hack (that is, in the way that del.icio.us is a domain hack) ending in IE that was about porn, it was short, it was memorable, it was available, and now I guess I can't register it.

Porn is a massively oversaturated marketplace of free goods. Don't underestimate the importance of a short, memorable domain in porn; in many cases it's the only way a pornographer can stand head and shoulders above the rest. Is it some kind of ethical outrage? No, but it's a drag, it's silly, and it's a slap in the face to those people who had already begun a business in their existing .IE domains.

I mean seriously, who are we kidding? The word "porn" is offensive now? They're not saying the actual pornography is offensive; the way they've written this ruling would not affect a porn site run on the theoretical site BlueWallPaint.ie, which has no offensive words in its title.

This is just some middle manager pretending to have moral authority, and that sort of thing is very much a "boo, hiss" sort of thing. It also sucks for the pornographers who have to start over with a sixty character domain name.

It sucks because .ie is valuable to hacks and for it to be off the table because of some random dude thinking he's a legislative body is lame.

I mean sure, it's not genocide in Rwanda. But it is pretty fail on the part of that registrar, don't you think, to pretend they're in an ethical position to do this? The only reason they can do this is because the design of the network grants them a monopoly. Nobody's ever actually given them any such authority; they're just doing it because they feel like it and nobody can stop them. Someone even took them to court and won and they're doing it anyway, because they think they know appropriate ethics better than do the local courts.

If you were making $20k/y per domain from a domain group that got axed because of some jerk, and had no way to redirect or retain that traffic or its revenue, all because some dude thinks the word porn is somehow offended, wouldn't you be pretty pissed?

Re:Not so big an issue

[Anonymous Coward]

Really. Who gives a shit? Nobody should.

Well, I'm guessing the Irish might give a shit.

Re:Not so big an issue

[mmclean]

Slippery Slope arguements are fallacy's. There is no proof that one step forward equates the same thing as ensuring that someone is going to go the full nine yards, or even that if they were, they'd end up where you want to paint them as going.

The issue here though is that the discussion is centering around governments, laws, and lawmaking. Laws and lawmaking are based on precedent, which is just another way of saying they are based on slippery slope. Governments also are based on slippery slope using a small step (or removal of a small civil liberty) to justify and implement the next not-so-small step.

Re:Not so big an issue

[panoptical2]

Although its not the government that directly controls the TLD, they still operate under regulations and orders provided to them by the IEDR. They could refute the orders, but they'd risk losing their mandate/contract.

Re:Not so big an issue

[JWSmythe]

> It's like a game of red light/green light, and the citizens are 'it',
> and blindfolded. By the time you hear gov't.'s footsteps running up
> on you...it's too late.

Don't worry, you won't hear their footsteps. The snipers are already in place, and the swat team is standing on the roof ledge ready to rappel in to clean up after. There weren't any extra witnesses in the house that "accidentally burned down, killing all the occupants", were there?

Excuse me, there's a knock on the door. Funny, I don't remember seeing that black van [no carrier]

Re:Not so big an issue

[JWSmythe]

    You don't "have" to provide your SSN to anyone. Then again, they don't "have" to provide you with the services you are requesting.

    Your serial number has been issued citizen. Please report to your assigned re-education and work camp via the transport the government has been gracious enough stop in front of your house. Never mind the nice men with weapons, they are here for your protection. You know, there could be a terrorist behind any Bush.

Re:Not so big an issue

[Florian Weimer]

It's still a government trying to tell its people what words they should and should not see, which is censorship and something to notice and oppose.

It's not the government. IEDR is a private company, which, like most of the other private companies running ccTLDs, ended up with the TLD management monopoly by accident. Certainly, decisions by the registry can be challenged in the courts---real courts, not internal, registry-controlled review procedures. (The linked article doesn't make it clear that court action was actually involved.)

Re:Not so big an issue

[teh kurisu]

The government is democratically accountable, the IEDR is not.

Re:Not so big an issue

[u38cg]

If I *did* give a shit, you'd be the first person I'd give it to.

Re:Not so big an issue

[Anonymous Coward]

Like lu.scio.us?

or empornium.us ?

Re:Not so big an issue

[bigtomrodney]

Also, from their site

The IE Domain Registry is not a governing or regulatory body, but provides a public service for the .ie namespace on behalf of the Internet community.

I am Irish and I'm more than a little bit outraged. For a start, neither of the words in question are taboo or offensive; they are english words of greek origin and are in daily usage. My main problem with this is that it claims to be on moral grounds but this body is in no position to determine what is or is not moral, nor are they under their own mandate a governing or regulatory body.

Re:Not so big an issue

[the_womble]

Actually, European human rights law has some similar exemptions - that is why Britain was able to propose a law restricting offensive speech about religions.

The British law was fortunately stopped by a public campaign. Incidentally I am a Christian and I am offended by some things that are published (especially ignorant crap as you often see of Slashdot), but free speech too important to be impeded by giving people a right not to be offended.

Re:Not so big an issue

[h4rm0ny]

"Slippery Slope arguements are fallacy's. There is no proof that one step forward equates the same thing as ensuring that someone is going to go the full nine yards, or even that if they were, they'd end up where you want to paint them as going."

Oh not this crap again. If I see some people take a few steps toward a cliff, I say "hey - that's dangerous where you're heading." I don't expect someone to leap out and try to stop me speaking shouting 'just because they've walked some way in a bad direction doesn't mean they'll keep on walking that way.' Well no, it's not conclusive proof, but when you have definite forces pushing for something and you see concessions starting to be made, then it's legitimate to speak out against them. And what makes the difference between whether those people walk off the cliff or not might just be those people warning at the start that they are starting to take steps in a dangerous direction.

Pointing out that we're on a slippery slope is a warning, not normally a prophecy. It says continue in this direction and it's going to come to a bad end. And the second point about the slope is that it's slippery. Once steps are taken, it can be hard to take them back - for example making an organisation un-ban words again.

Re:Not so big an issue

[Anachragnome]

How is it that my above post was modded +4 insightful, with the thread having several people supporting my position, until I responded to YOUR post, in a negative way?

Now your post is +5 insightful, and I'm down exactly -5...an apparent troll.

Now, don't get me wrong, I'm not accusing you of anything, it just seems REALLY odd to me.

 

Re:Not so big an issue

[Anonymous Coward]

it's important to remember that basically no sane irish person takes mere human law entirely seriously in the first place

There are other kinds of law?

Re:Not so big an issue

[Anonymous Coward]

To the Irish government I say:

Pogue Mahone!!!

Re:Not so big an issue

[VariableRob]

You see, some people have a really weird obsession with male chickens, and they like to imagine that there are cockerels so big they can jump on their back and outrun a car. This is another example of why I am always saying people are insane and you should never trust any of them.

Re:Not so big an issue

[johnsie]

I'm pretty sure the owners of the US .gov TLD do exactly the same thing. Why is nobody making a deal about that?

Re:Not so big an issue

[easyTree]

it's important to remember that basically no sane irish person takes mere human law entirely seriously in the first place

There are other kinds of law?

Perhaps you've heard of the bible?

Re:Not so big an issue

[easyTree]

Slippery Slope [wikipedia.org] arguements are fallacies

Re:Not so big an issue

[Shakrai]

You don't "have" to provide your SSN to anyone

So when I file my tax return without the SSN the IRS won't give me any grief?

Re:Not so big an issue

[Anonymous Coward]

LOL - which Ireland did they grow up in? It's never been that bad here for 50 years. So they blocked an .ie site.. big wow, it's not like they actually achieved anything useful; it would be better if no one tells the idiots that stopping porn.ie is about as likely to prevent porn on the internet as sheep dip.

Re:Not so big an issue

[commodore64_love]

Or the Roman mythology? They tell me that if I'm wrong by my girlfriend (i.e. she cheated) I have the right to slaughter a cow, bathe in its blood, and curse her. Do you think the government will let me get away with that?

No? So then we don't truly have freedom of religion.

Re:Not so big an issue

[indifferent children]

Can I sponsor a visa for you to come to the USA? You would be a good influence on many of our 'Christians'.

Re:Not so big an issue

[Chyeld]

How is it that my above post was modded +4 insightful, with the thread having several people supporting my position, until I responded to YOUR post, in a negative way?

Now your post is +5 insightful, and I'm down exactly -5...an apparent troll.

Now, don't get me wrong, I'm not accusing you of anything, it just seems REALLY odd to me.

Maybe people waking up this morning realized that modding a post by someone who spouts only rhetoric and attempts ad hominem attacks as an argument against the 'slippery slope of censorship' as insightful was a dangerous step towards chaos and anarchy on the site, and thus refused to take that step down a slippery slope and reversed the moderation.

Or you know, maybe the folk who woke up this morning read your post and realized it was just a troll.

Re:Not so big an issue

[Chyeld]

Like lu.scio.us?

or empornium.us ?

Too late to retract .us from the list? ^_^

Seriously though, the difference between the .ie TLD and the .us TLD is that one is being run by a government sanctioned group of academics and the other is being run as a profit center for a company with a contract with the government. Prior to 2002, the .us domain was run with the same 'iron grip' that the .ie one is currently.

Re:Not so big an issue

[Chyeld]

Is it really any business of those not living in Ireland to tell those living in Ireland how to live or how 'prudish' is OK?

If you want a stake in how a place is run, have a stake in it. Live there. Join the 'rebels' attempting to over throw the government, do SOMETHING other than sit there outside it and criticize those in it for not being as enlightened as you. Till then, while the group running the domain isn't government controlled it is government sanctioned with a Sword of Damascus hanging over their head ready to fall should they decide to do things that the government doesn't like. That's sufficiently 'government connected' to me to count as being run by the government.

Re:Not so big an issue

[mdwh2]

They could also just move out of Ireland. That's a choice too.

I take it you make this point everytime there's a story about things going on in the US? "Why complain, you could just move to another country!"

Maybe I am triviliazing the issue, but being restricted on possible domains on a TLD that only applies to a single country does not seem as big of an issue as actually interferring with what traffic can reach a country. It's large scale censorship such as the Great Firewall in China that should be more concerning than this.

Thank you Captain Obvious. A kick in the teeth is not as bad as dying. What's your point, other than to argue with a straw man?

Since when did "must be at least as worse as what happens in China" become a criterion for covering the story? How many of the Slashdot stories currently on the front page are about things as bad as bad things in China?

Honestly, the "not as bad as China" meme is getting old.

If the Irish people feel that they are being oppressed and it is a free speech issue, then they need to address that with their politicians.

Again, thank you for your insight into the bleeding obvious. And how do you think people might be aware of this issue so that they can contact politicians? Perhaps by covering the story on news sites such as this?

Re:Not so big an issue

[mdwh2]

I don't know if the US does things differently, but things like .uk, and I presume .ie are country codes, not Government ones. They are in no way comparable to .gov or .edu (that would be .gov.ie, I presume).

Possibly you are confused how country codes work, because in the US it's common to just swipe up .com or .org, even for US-specific sites. But there are country codes out there that the rest of the world uses, and they are intended for all uses in that country, not just the Government.

The nationally owned ones are solely responsible to that nation's government.

Yes, heaven forbid anyone be allowed disagree with what a Government does. I'll remember that next time there's a story about the US Government does something - "Who cares? It's solely the responsibility of that nation's Government".

Re:Not so big an issue

[PotatoFiend]

with a Sword of Damascus hanging over their head

Um, that's Sword of Damocles. Given the number of factual errors in your posts on this topic already, you should probably just call it a day.

Re:Not so big an issue

[Chyeld]

Yes yes, dear me I got a reference wrong, therefore my entire thought process must be incorrect. I should stop posting immediately. Or perhaps, you should stop looking for the small details to nit pick about and actually provide a rebuttal to the points I've presented.

Re:Not so big an issue

[fiannaFailMan]

Sounds like a good time to take it to the Euro Court of Human Rights, or at least invoke the ECHR. There are times when I'm glad that Europe is there as another level of appeal for cases like this.

Re:Not so big an issue

[JWSmythe]

    Please read and quote the entire line.

>> You don't "have" to provide your SSN to anyone. Then again, they don't "have" to provide you
>> with the services you are requesting.

    Nope, you don't have to put in your SSN. You don't even have to file a tax return. You are not forced to provide your information to the IRS. Then again, if you fail to do either part, they may not play very nicely.

    By filing your tax return, you are requesting the service that they accept your paperwork and either allow you to pay, or refund your overpayment. By refusing to prove a SSN, they don't have to provide that service. Of course, they'll still come after you, so you're just out of luck.

Re:Not so big an issue

[mpe]

How'd you feel if your child saw a bumper sticker on a car, in a grocery store parking lot that said, "your wife's other car is my big cock".

Maybe car manufactures should try naming their vehicles after poultry :)

Re:Not so big an issue

[mpe]

Even if we don't want government censoring of wikipedia now.

Governments are more likely to use Wikipedia (and similar) to push propaganda. Censorship being only likely to happen in the case of propaganda is effectivly opposed.

Re:Not so big an issue

[mpe]

The issue here though is that the discussion is centering around governments, laws, and lawmaking. Laws and lawmaking are based on precedent, which is just another way of saying they are based on slippery slope.

There is also several thousand years of history about the behaviour of people in governments. Rather important is that governments tend to attract people addicted to having power over others. About the only effective countermeasure is to prevent self selection of members of government. Something which modern "democracies" utterly fail at...

Re:Not so big an issue

[Hognoxious]

it's important to remember that basically no sane irish person takes mere human law entirely seriously in the first place

So it's the rabidly literal papists are the sane ones?!?

Re:Not so big an issue

[Hognoxious]

I am Irish and I'm more than a little bit outraged.

Well there's not much you can do about it. You could possibly emigrate and eventually apply for new citizenship in the host country. But you'd maybe have to learn another language or at the very least lose the accent. For full effect you might have to dye your hair some colour other than orange and apply fake tan cream.

Much less effort to just go have a pint or 12.

Re:Not so big an issue

[EdIII]

I do. I just found an interesting domain hack (that is, in the way that del.icio.us is a domain hack) ending in IE that was about porn, it was short, it was memorable, it was available, and now I guess I can't register it.

Are you a citizen of Ireland? If you are not, then you are not fundamentally entitled to register a domain on that TLD. At some point, we have to recognize that the owners of a TLD really do have the right to determine what can and cannot be registered, even if you vehemently disagree with their decision making processes.

Now if you are an Irish citizen, and the IEDR is ultimately connected to the state at some point, then you need to "participate in your democracy" and tell your politicians that you are not going to put up with these policies controlling what domains can be registered on that TLD.

If your only reason for caring is related to profits and protection of profits, and you are not an Irish citizen, then you are out of line. Your sense of entitlement is worse than any problems they have. You have no rights to get involved in the issue.

The wonderful thing about the Internet is that it routes around damage both technically and politically. My point that this is not something people should care about is that it is only a single TLD. You could just as easily go to another TLD that can be just as easily resolved in Ireland, as it can in Brazil, Indonesia, Canada, etc. If the Irish TLD is for profit, or needs tax revenue to operate then they are shooting themselves in the foot. The value of the domain just became a heck of a lot less to the world.

Is it a form of censorship? Yes. However, it is a form that is 100% ineffective against the people it is designed to "protect".

What we need to worry about is when government bodies or state sponsored/condoned regulatory authorities start interfering with the traffic itself based on their own moral imperatives. That would be many orders more effective than TLD restrictions and should be fought tooth and nail till the death by those affected.

You want to bitch about 64 letter domain names. Well that is the fault of the people that own and operate all the TLD's. It's all the domain speculator fucktards that have caused the problem in the first place. If we started to enact and enforce rules where if you did not use a domain, you would lose it then we would all be in much better place. All the domain squatters would have to shell out some serious fucking cash to keep squatting on millions and millions of domains that are valuable to people that would actually do something with it.

Also, keep in mind that a lot of those domain hacks exist simply because the rules are not being followed in the first place. How many .Net and .Org domains are there out there that have nothing do with network companies and charity/non-profits? Shit loads.

So maybe the whole reason you feel pressured to go the .ie domain name with your hack, with possibly no rights to complain, is the completely unneccesary and artificial scarcity that has been created on primary domains in general.
Do you see that with trademarks and business names in the US? Of course not. There is not a speculative market where you have to pay a private individual what he thinks it is worth. Otherwise Starbucks would have had to deal with stupid fucking squatter instead of paying a flat rate fee to the state to register that business name and their associated trademarks.

Re:Not so big an issue

[Hognoxious]

There's no proof in a mathematical sense. But this is people - or rather, politicians - were dealing with. If they are going to go the whole nine yards, then it's a lot easier to stop them now than it is after they've gone eight yards two feet and eleven inches.

Re:Not so big an issue

[Anachragnome]

Ah, yes, the Fates are fickle creatures.

Maybe the first post I made in this thread may have been seen as a little bit "hip shooting", and I admit it was, but my response to YOUR post was NOT.

No trollin' there, and it appears I'm not alone in that sentiment.

But, in all seriousness, in a day and age where there is more taking then giving of personal liberties, we can not afford to be on slippery ground. Each step in ANY direction that threatens my, as well as your, personal liberties needs to be fought tooth and nail. We cannot afford to lose what so many have fought for, and in many cases, given their lives for.

The value we all place on liberty and freedom REQUIRES a healthy cynicism be firmly in place whenever dealing in such matters.

Re:Not so big an issue

[Anonymous Coward]

Slippery Slope arguements are fallacy's.

Fallacy's what? You can't end a sentence on a possessive noun. You have to tell us what you're talking about, e.g. fallacy's playground? fallacy's substitute for snow skiing? What?

Re:Not so big an issue

[EdIII]

Because there is no issue. Citizens don't have a right to it. Its for government use only. That's like bitching you have rights to enter government facilities simply because its a free country.

Re:Not so big an issue

[Chyeld]

And yet, when they've only moved a centimeter, and a centimeter that has absolutely no connection to the hypothesized destination other than being in a direction on the same hemisphere as it, it seems rather overreactionary and ridiculous to get up in arms.

When the course is obvious, then take action. Don't simply refuse to allow any movement whatsoever under the mistaken guise of 'preventing what could happen'.

Re:Not so big an issue

[Chyeld]

I have a healthy cynicism, and it is in place not just to cover this topic but the topic of flag waving, gung ho, "We must stop this before anything happens, EVER!" rehtoric comes into play. Act with thought, as the humans we were born to be, not with catchprhases and kneejerk reactions that the sheep those who would control us wish us to be.

Re:Not so big an issue

[Chyeld]

And if we play that game, we should also remember that the tighter grasp a government attempts to have on it's people, the shorter it's lifespan. Regardless of how feasible Orwell's Oceania seems and as scary as places such as North Korea or Iran seem, they are still nations in their infancy, history has proven over and over again that when the burden of actual oppression (and not simply the inconvenience of not having your own porn domain with a catchy .ie at the end) reaches a point, the oppressors find themselves helped out of office.

Re:Not so big an issue

[Anonymous Coward]

Most Irish people have brown hair actually. Less than 10% of Irish people have "red" hair and that covers anything from slightly tinted blonde to light brown. I wouldn't worry too much about us Irish, we've been doing a fine job of emigrating and taking the jobs off the likes of you for several centuries now!

Re:Not so big an issue

[Anonymous Coward]

That's hardly something to brag about... being quicker than a 300lb couch potato with no intention of getting off his ass to work "Ma! them immigrints dun took ma job!"

Re:Not so big an issue

[Anonymous Coward]

Um. What? I'm *guessing* you're trying to troll given your nick, but really not getting it this time. "rabidly literal papist" seems a contradiction in terms given roman catholic ("papist", though I had to look that up to check, it's not exactly in common usage in the modern era) and especially irish roman catholic decidedly nonliteral take on many matters of faith - I mean, it's usually decidedly anti-catholic wackjobs in the USA that are "rabidly literal" these days, complaining about catholics supporting stuff like evolution.

Re:Not so big an issue

[EdIII]

I take it you make this point everytime there's a story about things going on in the US? "Why complain, you could just move to another country!"

Since I am a U.S Citizen, NO. My answer is to fight and fight hard. Civil Disobedience, protests, whatever is necessary. I was merely pointing out that Irish citizens have a choice of either fighting for it or just leaving Ireland. Since we are talking about Internet here, I was figuratively speaking about moving out of Ireland's control on their own networks. Just as certain people in the EU are utilizing hosting services in other countries to get around legislation and liabilities associated with data centers in their own countries.

Just recently the UK government was bitching up a storm since one of their own politicians was sending emails on a service outside of UK control. The UK government could not just walk in a seize servers in a data center so they started to complain quite loudly.

Thank you Captain Obvious. A kick in the teeth is not as bad as dying. What's your point, other than to argue with a straw man?

It's wonderfully easy to use the allegation of a strawmen to defeat an argument. Which is ironically, a strawmen argument it is not? Most people just use it as a buzzword with clearly no understanding of what it means. Try looking up the actual definition of a strawmen argument.

But.... Captain Obvious will try to explain it again:

The restrictions on the Irish TLD are 100% ineffective in actually enforcing any moral standards on the Irish people. It's not so much a matter of people actually being affected, but a matter of principles. Some Irish people WANT to register whatever domains they desire on that particular TLD. They can't. So they are a little pissed off.

So it is a non-issue in the context of what can actually affect the Irish people. The whole purpose of domain names is convenience. It so that you don't have to remember an IP address, and the network administrators can be more flexible in how they create and maintain their own networks.

Are the Irish people prevented in doing this? No, they clearly ARE NOT. They just can't use the .IE domain with certain words. That's it.

However, large scale content filtering and firewalling can and does affect people. The methods of circumventing such measures are non-trivial and require a considerable amount of sophistication that not everybody possesses.

Since when did "must be at least as worse as what happens in China" become a criterion for covering the story? How many of the Slashdot stories currently on the front page are about things as bad as bad things in China?

What are Earth are you talking about. I did not complain, or say this was not a non-worthy news issue. China is not a prerequisite for anything. I only used it as an example of content filtering and firewalling that clearly is affecting Chinese citizens in a way that TLD restrictions could never hope to achieve.

China was only an example, not a reason or justification for covering the story. Calm Down.

Honestly, the "not as bad as China" meme is getting old.

You need to slow down and read before furiously attacking the keyboard to post your flames. I never made a "not as bad as China argument". I specifically made a "TLD restrictions are not as bad as content filtering and firewalling" argument. China was only an example. Australia is trying to do it as well. Had it been Australia, would you have been flaming with a, "I hate the not as bad as Australia" complaint?

If you tried to read it and understand it, you would not have made Captain Obvious carefully and slowly repeat himself.

Again, thank you for your insight into the bleeding obvious. And how do you think people might be aware of this issue so that they can contact politicians? Per

Re:Not so big an issue

[MindlessAutomata]

So you're fine with censorship as long as it's democratic. Gotcha. Glad to see such a profound respect for individual rights in this day and age.

Re:Not so big an issue

[teh kurisu]

Every society has rules on what is morally acceptable and what is not, America included. Ireland, a relatively strongly Catholic country, chooses to draw the line in a different place. So what? It's not like they're banning internet porn, only offensive words in domain names.

Domain naming is not a free speech issue. If you think it is, then you're forgetting why free speech exists. When an Irish citizen is banned from discussing the domain name policy then there is a problem, but as far as I'm aware that hasn't happened.

Re:Not so big an issue

[Hognoxious]

when they've only moved a centimeter, and a centimeter that has absolutely no connection to the hypothesized destination other than being in a direction on the same hemisphere as it

Considering poilitics as spherical trignometry? Second worst epic fail everr - after doing it the other way round.

Tell me, Cheyld means witless sheep in which language?

Re:Not so big an issue

[Hognoxious]

Then again, if you fail to do either part, they may not play very nicely.

I didn't rob the bank, because I didn't force the teller to hand over the cash. I didn't force him to hand over the cash, I just suggested that Mr .357 might not play nice if he didn't.

Re:Not so big an issue

[Hognoxious]

we should also remember that the tighter grasp a government attempts to have on it's people, the shorter it's lifespan.

Bullshit. Or as you'd probably write it, bull'shit. Fidel Castro outlasted how many US presidents? How long has Mugabe been in power? East Germany lasted over 60 years with the same party (if not the same individuals) in power. You're living in a dream.

Re:Not so big an issue

[Hognoxious]

I have a healthy cynicism

Not as healthy as most people's it seems. That or you're a lying cunt.

Re:Not so big an issue

[stonecypher]

Are you a citizen of Ireland? If you are not, then you are not fundamentally entitled to register a domain on that TLD.

Nonsense. There is no requirement that a TLD be used only by people from that TLD; even its intended use is customer oriented, not vendor oriented. By that logic, amazon.co.uk shouldn't exist. And, of course, Ireland's TLD makes no attempt to control who uses their registrar; indeed they even charge foreigners explicitly higher prices, is how much they agree with you on that point. And nobody at any point in this has argued this as a point of rights due national origin, besides. This is as much a non-sequitur as it is a red herring.

At some point, we have to recognize that the owners of a TLD really do have the right to determine what can and cannot be registered

Number one, I recognize no such thing. Number two, I never challenged that. Number three, what they said does not match the law of their nation. Number four, a court has already upheld the speciousness of their arguments. Number five, my post explicitly acknowledge that this was neither legally nor ethically corrupt, merely a nuisance brought on by some middle manager with delusions of authority.

Rights aren't arbitrarily granted by holding a management job.

Your sense of entitlement is

Nonexistant. I explicitly stated that I had no entitlement. Please learn to read before criticizing people for the exact opposite of what they actually said.

You could just as easily go to another TLD

No, I can't. Domain hacks are explicitly tied to single registrars. Try to keep up.

If you are not an Irish citizen ... You have no rights to get involved in the issue.

Why? The registrar in question is owned by someone from not-Ireland, as are more than eighty percent of domains.

Did you think most TLDs were run by companies from the nations they point at? Have you ever actually read through the IANA root zone DB? The Irish registrar is run by a British company with an Irish tax ID, an explicitly for-profit organization who runs the domain as a for-profit venture. Their pricing structure directly countermands several of the claims you make. It's almost as if you haven't thought this through at all from the perspective that your guesswork might not be right.

Your insistance that only an irish person can have an opinion on the Irish TLD is uninformed by common practice, specific context or the RFCs which defined these terms and services. Your arguments are specious and driven by claims towards morality in an ethical framework you've pretty much made up.

Is it a form of censorship? Yes.

No. Censorship is when a government tells an individual that they cannot publish something anywhere in a nation. This is a middle manager in a commercial entity who's made a personal decision made by personal beliefs. They are not an elected official, nor has anyone in government given them any form of authority. They're just some jerk with the keys to a server and no process in place to tell them where their responsibility boundaries are.

The value of the domain just became a heck of a lot less to the world.

Uh, no, it didn't. The number of Irish domains hasn't changed, and the registration rate hasn't dropped significantly. You're just guessing based on some vague pablum about anthropomorphizing the internet to have behaviors and activities. Evidence or it didn't happen. (Common phrases aren't evidence.)

If the Irish TLD is for profit, or needs tax revenue to operate then they are shooting themselves in the foot

What are you talking about? Almost every TLD is a for-profit venture. There are only seven on earth that are government run, and only t

Re:Not so big an issue

[JWSmythe]

If I get your analogy right, you're indicating the IRS acts as bank robbers or mafia-style "protection" rackets do, correct?

    I strongly suggest you pay us, or "bad things" may happen.

    It'd be a terrible shame if we had to put you in jail, and take away everything you own. Your money is going to the government, so we can protect you.

    It'd be a terrible shame if Mr. 357 were to go off. It's for your own protection.

    It'd be a terrible shame if this nice shop of yours was to get messed up, but it's ok, you can pay us to protect you.

    Ya, I can see it.

Re:Not so big an issue

[EdIII]

Are you a citizen of Ireland? If you are not, then you are not fundamentally entitled to register a domain on that TLD.

Nonsense. There is no requirement that a TLD be used only by people from that TLD; even its intended use is customer oriented, not vendor oriented. By that logic, amazon.co.uk shouldn't exist. And, of course, Ireland's TLD makes no attempt to control who uses their registrar; indeed they even charge foreigners explicitly higher prices, is how much they agree with you on that point. And nobody at any point in this has argued this as a point of rights due national origin, besides. This is as much a non-sequitur as it is a red herring.

Non-Sequitur? Red herring? Come on....

The .IE TLD was granted to the country of Ireland. To say they have no autonomy over it's use is ridiculous. Whatever requirements are created for the .IE TLD are entirely up to the country of Ireland. Period.

Amazon.co.uk exists because the "owners" of the .UK TLD have granted Amazon that domain. Amazon did not have a pre-existing claim to it in any way shape or form.

As for charging foreigners extra, that is entirely their right.

What are you going to do if/when they start opening up the TLD's? Are you going to tell me I don't have the right to choose my customers, control their domains, and charge whatever I want?

Of course I do. So does Ireland. The difference is I would own my TLD personally and Ireland is supposed to be managing it on behalf of the people, the rightful owners.

At some point, we have to recognize that the owners of a TLD really do have the right to determine what can and cannot be registered

Number one, I recognize no such thing. Number two, I never challenged that. Number three, what they said does not match the law of their nation. Number four, a court has already upheld the speciousness of their arguments. Number five, my post explicitly acknowledge that this was neither legally nor ethically corrupt, merely a nuisance brought on by some middle manager with delusions of authority.

Rights aren't arbitrarily granted by holding a management job.

That is your problem. You won't acknowledge that Ireland has any rights here. Your number two and on, does not mean anything when your number one quite clearly indicates that you don't recognize Ireland has rights to determine what domain names exist under that TLD. Those rights were not granted arbitrarily by a long shot. They were granted by the organization that controls TLD's to the country of Ireland, which was supposed to manage those rights which belong to the people.

In fact, your whole statement is contradictory. You don't acknowledge it, but you don't challenge it either, but at the same time certainly seem to challenge it. Which is it?

You want to argue that what the politicians/managers did was wrong. That's fine. Be an activist and get your voice heard. If your not an Irish citizen though, then you have no rights to do so.

As a foreigner (if you are) I find it ridiculous that you think you can impose your will upon the country of Ireland.

Your sense of entitlement is

Nonexistant. I explicitly stated that I had no entitlement. Please learn to read before criticizing people for the exact opposite of what they actually said.

Same to you. You should learn to read. I clearly stated the condition that your sense of entitlement existed ONLY if you were not an Irish citizen and your concern was based on profits and opportunities lost. I believe that anybody could that could read the following would have come to the same conclusion:

If your only reason for caring is related to profits and protection of profits, and you are n

Cool

[nurb432]

Nice to know that stupidity isn't restricted to one country.

Re:Cool

[fuzzyfuzzyfungus]

This isn't exactly a huge surprise. Ireland is, in many respects, a fairly civilized country; but it has some hardcore traces of backwards popish hellhole around the edges. Of note, for instance, is the fact that divorce only became constitutional in 1995.

Re:Cool

[maxume]

It isn't entirely clear to me that stupidity is restricted to half of the global population; I sort of expect it in every country.

Re:Cool

[Anonymous Coward]

Yes, birth control was only legalized in 1979, and abortion is largely unavailable and must be obtained by travelling to England.

Re:Cool

[mi]

Ireland is, in many respects, a fairly civilized country

With its debt being about eleven times their GDP, which is huge even by European standards, Ireland may, indeed, be considered "civilized"... But only by those, who share the America's Administration vision of civilization...

Of note, for instance, is the fact that divorce only became constitutional in 1995.

And abortions are still prohibited. Unbeknown to most of Bono's "liberal" fans, moaning: "Why can't the US be more like Europe?"

Re:Cool

[Anonymous Coward]

>>It isn't entirely clear to me that stupidity is restricted to half of the global population; I sort of expect it in
>>every country.

I'm pretty sure stupidity is rampent through the other half, as well.

Re:Cool

[maxume]

Nicely done.

Name vs. content

[MrEricSir]

So this only applies to the domain name, and not the content, right?

Is there anything offensive about the name "goatse"?

Re:Name vs. content

[sortius_nod]

probably not, but goatse.ie really doesn't have the same ring to it.

Re:Name vs. content

[nick_davison]

Is there anything offensive about the name "goatse"?

I believe you mean goats.ie

Re:Name vs. content

[Larry Lightbulb]

Ring? Hula hoop surely.

Re:Name vs. content

[Fumus]

I would move the porn sites to kittens.ie or something similar. It's not an offensive name, and if some people get offended by the content, I get:
1) Free publicity
2) More profit

Re:Name vs. content

[AliasMarlowe]

probably not, but goatse.ie really doesn't have the same ring to it.

and goats.ie is taken http://goats.ie/ (don't look at it!)

Re:Name vs. content

[Anonymous Coward]

Obviously not...

http://goats.ie

Re:Name vs. content

[Anonymous Coward]

Thankfully it not what you think, no vile imagery to be found there

probably not, but goatse.ie really doesn't have the same ring to it.

and goats.ie is taken http://goats.ie/ (don't look at it!)

Honestly

[Anonymous Coward]

I don't think I've ever heard of a site that ends in .ie (I know that there are, I just never saw them)

Re:Honestly

[fuzzyfuzzyfungus]

But I've heard of a lot of sites that end IE...

Re:Honestly

[meringuoid]

And yet it seems that nobody's registered usefirefoxinsteadof.ie.

Re:Honestly

[icannotthinkofaname]

And it still ain't taken. Go register it now!

Re:Honestly

[Anonymous Coward]

your name looks a lot like "I can not think of enema."
Which would suggest a really gross party story.

Re:Honestly

[Anonymous Coward]

I wonder if I'll have any trouble registering my medical site about puss?

Re:Honestly

[ScrewMaster]

I wonder if I'll have any trouble registering my medical site about puss?

If you're talking about "pus", probably not. If your site is into pussy, I'll bet these guys will block it.

Re:Honestly

[shentino]

It probably got banned already.

And...what if MS tries to assert trademark ownership of .ie?

Darn!

[Locke2005]

Well, there goes my chance to register "p.ie"... by the way, isn't it already April 1 in Ireland?

Re:Darn!

[HTH NE1]

by the way, isn't it already April 1 in Ireland?

Hmm, UTC/GMT +1 currently, so yes by nearly an hour at the time you posted.

Where do I go to register .ie domains, and can foreigners to Ireland register domains?

Re:Darn!

[HTH NE1]

Answered my own question, so I'll share: iedr.ie

All applicants applying for a .ie domain name who are not situated in the 32 counties of Ireland, must demonstrate a Real and Substantive Connection with Ireland (with the exception of those applying with a registered Community Trademark)

Examples of acceptable documentation demonstrating substantial trade or commercial activity within Ireland are as follows:

• Copies of invoices (showing trade to or from Ireland)
• High-quality brochures
• A signed letter on headed paper from a bank manager, firm of chartered accountant(s), registered auditor(s), tax consultant(s) (where the tax advisor identification number is displayed), or solicitor(s) confirming the applicants trade with Ireland.

Re:Darn!

[Spatial]

by the way, isn't it already April 1 in Ireland?

[liar paradox] Yes. [/liar paradox]

Re:Darn!

[fractoid]

You can have p.ie. I reserve both "cakeisal.ie" and "puss.ie". ;)

Re:Darn!

[Anonymous Coward]

Answered my own question, so I'll share: iedr.ie

All applicants applying for a .ie domain name who are not situated in the 32 counties of Ireland, must demonstrate a Real and Substantive Connection with Ireland (with the exception of those applying with a registered Community Trademark)

Examples of acceptable documentation demonstrating substantial trade or commercial activity within Ireland are as follows:

• Copies of invoices (showing trade to or from Ireland)

I'll suppose I could have my brochures printed in four colors on some nice glossy stock then, even if it might be a bit ostentatious for my very modest proposal.

Re:Darn!

[fiannaFailMan]

Answered my own question, so I'll share: iedr.ie

All applicants applying for a .ie domain name who are not situated in the 32 counties of Ireland, must demonstrate a Real and Substantive Connection with Ireland (with the exception of those applying with a registered Community Trademark)

Examples of acceptable documentation demonstrating substantial trade or commercial activity within Ireland are as follows:

• Copies of invoices (showing trade to or from Ireland)
• High-quality brochures
• A signed letter on headed paper from a bank manager, firm of chartered accountant(s), registered auditor(s), tax consultant(s) (where the tax advisor identification number is displayed), or solicitor(s) confirming the applicants trade with Ireland.

Interesting gray area there. The 32 counties of Ireland include the 6 counties of the north that actually ceased to exist as administrative areas in the 1970s when town and county councils were replaced by a single tier of local government. The 26 counties of the south have since been rearranged slightly and there are now about 29 county or county-level councils in the south.

The original 32 counties still live on in popular culture, particularly in sporting terms as used by the Gaelic Athletic Association, but do not all have the same legal standing they used to.

Oop! Here we go!

[Samschnooks]

Really a shame on this. I'd argue that we need more Irish porn in the world :(.

Such as....

• Suck my potato.
• Eat my cabbage.
• My limerick or yours
• Kiss this blarney stone!
• Lass' ass
• Angela's asses
• Manly yes, but I like it too!(Gay site.)
• Shamrock hard
• Protestant against Catholic school girls!
• Catholic School Girls in the North with Big Bad Englishmen
• Brutish English MILFS and poor downtrodden Irish Lads
• Big Bad Burly English Men punishing little Irish Lads (Gay S&M site)
• Irish MILFS and English MILFS licking for a Truce

Oh God! I'm done.

Re:Oop! Here we go!

[Anonymous Coward]

Oh, no you're not.

Re:Oop! Here we go!

[Anonymous Coward]

Oh God! I've come.

Fixed that for you.

Re:Oop! Here we go!

[JLF65]

You need to watch more Family Guy. :D

Re:Oop! Here we go!

[ionix5891]

you forgot the following classics:

Real Sluts 9

and

Provisional Lollipops 3

and

Continuity Blondes 4

Re:Oop! Here we go!

[Anonymous Coward]

Oh God! I'm done.

Is that also the name of another porn title? =P

Re:Oop! Here we go!

[Anonymous Coward]

You forgot Aer Cunninglingus

How about pornograph.ie?

[Anonymous Coward]

Or, maybe not.

Re:How about pornograph.ie?

[meringuoid]

Not sure about that one. How about creamp.ie?

Re:How about pornograph.ie?

[shermo]

Wouldn't applep.ie be more appropriate?

Re:I just shit an obama

[MightyYar]

Everyone knows that the official unit of excrement is the Couric.

IEDR's a basket case

[hellsDisciple]

The IEDR is a hotbed of infighting and interference. Started by a few select academics in Dublin's UCD, it is still being meddled with non-stop. I sure as hell don't care whether or not they want to register adult websites, but the IEDR are particularly nasty even to legitimate domain registrations. For example, a private citizen can't register a personal domain unless they're a company or publicly known celebrity like a politician. Leave the policing up to people better able to do the policing.

Re:IEDR's a basket case

[DGolden]

For example, a private citizen can't register a personal domain unless they're a company or publicly known celebrity like a politician

That changed a while ago, though controls are a bit stricter than in other places. You have to register your real name (businesses are supposed to register their registered irish business names) and present some form of vaguely plausible ID. And it's relatively expensive. I have mine registered, much harder to lose to some squatter - even if I miss a payment, no-one else is going to be able to register it very easily (esp. given my real name is rather long) at least while they keep the rules in place. However I use my com/net/org domains day-to-day for business.

pen.is

[Anonymous Coward]

Well, there goes my chance to register "p.ie"... by the way, isn't it already April 1 in Ireland?

Yeah it sucks when that happens. I was hoping to corner http://www.pen.is (hint: it's not for an online stationary store) but it's already been registered.

The last time the meteors came...

[Anonymous Coward]

...we thought the sky was on fire. Naturally, we blamed the Irish. We hanged more 'n a few.

Hmmm....

[Facegarden]

I guess i shouldn't bother with my idea for ShitPissFuckCuntCocksuckerMotherfuckerTits.ie then, Huh?
-Taylor

Re:Hmmm....

[geekmux]

I guess i shouldn't bother with my idea for ShitPissFuckCuntCocksuckerMotherfuckerTits.ie then, Huh? -Taylor

Only if you take the word Cocksucker out. Apparently, umpires and the Irish are the two groups you don't want to offend with this word...

Re:Hmmm....

[Aceticon]

You might get away with DefecateUrinateVaginaPenisaspiratorMothercopulatorBreasts.ie

Or maybe just breasts.ie ?

Re:Hmmm....

[Elky Elk]

Is that your social networking site for people with Tourette's syndrome?

Too bad

[4D6963]

Some national TLDs just suck. That's why there's relatively few .fr domains, compared to .co.uk or .de domains. It's a shame, but it's not like you can't have your own .com or .net

Good for them!

[tomhudson]

This is slashdot. Anything with IE in it is dirty and disgusting and offensive and downright immoral.

BTW, next they'll be banning slashdot.ie because it contains the word "slash", which is reminiscent of Jack the Ripper and violence in general. They've already banned OJ's domain - (W - W - W -SLASH - SLASH - BACKSLASH - SLASH DOT EYE EEE).

Re:Good for them!

[Repton]

Is Jack the Ripper really the dodgiest connotation you can come up with for "slash"?

Re:Good for them!

[Anonymous Coward]

Slash fiction, (check *chan to know what that means.)

Re:Good for them!

[Anonymous Coward]

Residents and the city council of Scunthorpe have had periodic problems for years with blacklisting on filters and being prevented from registering on various sites (see: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scunthorpe_Problem ).

Of course since this is by far the most interesting thing ever to happen scunthorpe the filters may have a point after all...

Reminds me of Goatse

[SupremoMan]

Didn't goatse.cx get similar type ban from the Christmas Island Internet Administration?

Re:Reminds me of Goatse

[RiotingPacifist]

yeah but that was banned for content NOT just the name.

Re:Reminds me of Goatse

[shentino]

Sounds like a case of "my turf my rules".

I would rather ireland be dictatorial about IE than have some half-assed international committee try to worm its way in...particularly since that committee is likely to have hidden wolves of corporate interest backing it up.

So does the Vatican

[Anonymous Coward]

Well, I'd be surprised if they allow porn.va.

I''ve had it with this censorship bullshit.

[Jangchub]

It seems like every day on the front page is another story of how some gov't or corporation or religious group is trying - and succeeding - to destroy free speech. I just can't grok how stupid and greedy people are that they will stifle one of the greatest ideals in the world because they are offended/moremoneymoremoney/think of the children! C'mon people, the more you can deal with reality the more you can grow and learn. Censorship breeds weak minded individuals.

I'm not trying to troll but I'm so damn tired of people that can't even imagine that they might be wrong and that their values might possibly not be The Supreme Laws of the One True God For Real Cuz He Told Me So. Freedom of speech and press is the only light keeping the dark of ideological slavery and hermetically sealed ignorance at bay.

I hope live to see the day that there is cheap spaceflight and the people that can deal with reality the opposite opinions without knee-jerk animistic reaction can go terraform of the Moon or Mars. I'll leave this planet to the ideologues to enslave and go practice free speech somewhere else.

/rant. It was a shitty day at the wage slave factory, so forgive me. Or not.

Re:I''ve had it with this censorship bullshit.

[rts008]

Censorship breeds weak minded individuals.

That is the goal, easier to control. Can't rock the boat!...someone might fall in and discover they love swimming!

Freedom of speech and press is the only light keeping the dark of ideological slavery and hermetically sealed ignorance at bay.

Barely, but just so.

Re:I''ve had it with this censorship bullshit.

[Anonymous Coward]

I hope you'll keep in mind, though, that the Moon is a harsh mistress.

Bypass

[Anonymous Coward]

But it's still OK to register rn.ie, and set up a po subdomain, and launch your new site Pornie!

Very effective, Ireland.

Re:Bypass

[Anonymous Coward]

I'm gonna try to register Kidd.ie.

-AC

Re:Bypass

[Anonymous Coward]

There is already a p.orn.ie

Re:just move out of Ireland?

[macraig]

Now, if there are people that feel oppressed in Ireland, they can simply get a domain at a different TLD. They could also just move out of Ireland.

Or... they could revolt against their oppressors! Vive la revolucion!

Those Irish folks have been getting a bum rap for centuries. Hmmmm... if native American Indians started a revolt now, would we sing songs praising their righteous bravery or would we label them as terrorists?

Re:just move out of Ireland?

[Anonymous Coward]

Vive la revolucion!

Phrase you're looking for is 'tiocfaidh ar la'. It's Irish for 'I'm a fuckwit living in the past who thinks it would be a great idea if we all started shooting each other and letting off bombs the whole time just like in the good old days'.

Bonus!

[BluBrick]

Just to stay somewhat on topic:

$ whois hairp.ie

% Rights restricted by copyright;
http://www.domainregistry.ie/copyright.html
% Do not remove this notice

% Not Registered - The domain you have requested is not a registered .ie domain name.
$

:)

Heres an idea!

[Anonymous Coward]

If it offends you, don't type it into the damned address bar.

Re:Heres an idea!

[Anonymous Coward]

If it offends you, don't type it into the damned address bar.

Exactly! Did you expect to get anything besides porn when you typed in www.gayfiremenfisting.com? Did you really expect it was going to be happy pugilistic firemen?

Re:just move out of Ireland?

[macraig]

If you think we've finally become so "civilized" that physical revolutions with shooting and bombs are no longer necessary to achieve freedom and equality, then it's you who are the fuckwit.

We're overdue for one in the United States. If the American Revolution - the first one - had happened in a political and semantic climate like we have today, more likely than not the Founding Fathers who started it would be branded terrorists rather than revolutionaries. No doubt the British of the period did mentally picture the Americans exactly as we now mentally picture terrorists, even if they didn't use the word "terrorist" to describe that imagery. "Terrorist" is now an emotional buzzword taking its place alongside other words like "eugenics" and "atheist", all designed to twist and manipulate popular perceptions.

Revolutions are hardly a thing of the past. The people who deserve to be victims of them have simply gotten a LOT more skilled at manipulating people to forestall their punishment.

True

[Neanderthal Ninny]

What about "breast", "testis", or any legitimate body part that have diseases in and have legitimate research on can be block by this statute.
This is were people worry about blocking/filtering content from legitimate people from doing legitimate research.

I suppose it would suck....

[Anonymous Coward]

...for those registering www.shipornaments.ie or www.hipornot.ie or www.beertapornothing.ie

.IE Always Been Crap

[meehawl]

I had dealings with the .IE crowd back in the early-mid-90s trying to set up some domains. At the time it was being run by a small cabal of jumped-up sysadmins-turned-pointy-haired-bosses hidden away in University College Dublin (one of the larger public universities in Ireland). They blocked basically every application for any domain name that was any way lucrative, exciting, or with a potential to make a profit, and took an amazing amount of time to actually get anything done. I am unsurprised but a little dismayed to see that the descendant of that dismal sinkhole apparently still possesses much of the same bureaucratic DNA.

Re:.IE Always Been Crap

[Aceticon]

That was pretty much how any national domain name registrar worked in the 90s - your description could just as easily apply to .pt instead of .ie

At the time most national domains where managed by a clique of university teachers many of which were elitist unprofessional pricks with egos larger than their IQ.

I vaguely remember that it was easier to get a .com domain name than most of the national ones.

Re:.IE Always Been Crap

[forgotten_my_nick]

"They blocked basically every application for any domain name that was any way lucrative, exciting, or with a potential to make a profit, and took an amazing amount of time to actually get anything done."

I knew guys that worked there. Basically they saw what a mess of what .com became (cybersquatting, typo urls) and made it hard to do this. Of course that is no longer the case.

why you have things like:
http://baords.ie/
http://board.ie/

Re:just move out of Ireland?

[RiotingPacifist]

whats the Irish/Gaelic for "Don't bomb McDonald lad, they're funding us so we stay away, that's how we got all these guns"

A picture worth a thousand words!

[rts008]

Hmmmm... if native American Indians started a revolt now, would we sing songs praising their righteous bravery or would we label them as terrorists?

'Nuff said.

It did not work out too well for us last time, unfortunately.

April's Fool

[Anonymous Coward]

Just look at it!

By the broth of me stubby shillelagh

[Phizzle]

The feckin' sheep-feckers at the IEDR haven't gotten a clue! They can all focal leat and imigh sa diabhal, after they dÃful mÃf bhad! And their mother is a hamster and smells of elderberries!

Re:Nay but I'll tell you bout my 1st time in Irela

[RiotingPacifist]

tl;dr
can you try and keep your trolls short, i mean "i just shat an obama" see below, is short, to the point (horrendous display of stupidity and racism) and even partially successful as people will take a second to reply to the troll.

Something's missing ...

[ScrewMaster]

The IEDR's reasoning is that the words 'porn' and 'pornography' are offensive and immoral.

I'm not sure "reasoning" is the correct word here.

From the country that brought you...

[geekmux]

It's still a government trying to tell its people what words they should and should not see, which is censorship and something to notice and oppose. -Taylor

Yes, I agree, and oddly enough, coming from a country that brought forth terms like "piss drunk", it seems rather strange that they deem certain words "offensive".

Hey, pot, the kettle called...

Alternate News Source?

[Wowlapalooza]

My workplace blocks all URLs with "sex" as a label of the domain name, you insensitive clod! So I can't access TFA.

But, as someone who deals with DNS professionally, I have a legitimate need to read about TLD registry policy changes.

Does anyone have an alternate URL for this story?

Re:Alternate News Source?

[MadMaverick9]

Porn.ie and Pornography.ie banned in Ireland

Sex.ie

I've been trying to register the domains porn.ie and pornography.ie for about four years. Every time I try to register either domain, the Irish Domain Registry (IEDR) refuse my application because "the proposed domain name must not be offensive or contrary to public policy or generally accepted principles of morality."

According to David Curtain, the chief executive of the IEDR, "the domain registry has no authority to vet content" (Sunday Tribune, 27/08/07) so their refusal is based on both words being offensive, rather than any objection to pornographic content. I tested this assertion by registering the domain orn.ie and setting it up so it displays hardcore porn under the title "p.orn.ie". This domain was deemed acceptable as the word "orn" is not offensive. Have a look for yourself: http://p.orn.ie/

Two years ago I decided to take legal action against the IEDR as I felt it absurd that they could judge either word as offensive. Apart from the obvious fact that both words are clearly not offensive ("pornography" is a noun, with "porn" being a shortened, slang version), I was also the owner of a business called "Porn" and a business called "Pornography".

I found myself a solicitor who specialises in digital law (i.e. cases involving the Internet) and arranged an appeal against the refusal of registration. Included in the first letter of appeal was the following:

Neither the term pornography, nor its abbreviation porn, can be described as offensive, contrary to public policy or generally accepted principles of morality. The leading dictionary of the English language, the Oxford English Dictionary, contains usage notes which mark terms as being rude, derogatory, or offensive. However neither term is marked in this way.

Indeed, the notion that the term pornography could itself be offensive, contrary to public policy or generally accepted principles of morality is simply absurd given the judgment of the Oireachtas that the term is appropriate for use in the title of the Child Trafficking and Pornography Act 1998.

Similarly, the term porn has also been frequently used in Parliamentary Debates and on no occasion has the term been objected to as unsuitable.

Both terms have been permitted by the Companies Registration Office for use in the registered business names held by our client, and it is entirely inappropriate for the Respondent to second guess the judgment of the body which is specifically mandated by law (under the Registration of Business Names Act 1963 as later amended and applied) to consider whether to refuse the registration of names which are considered undesirable.

It should also be noted that adult material is perfectly lawful in this jurisdiction unless it falls within a narrow class of material which may be prohibited by either the Film Censor or the Censorship of Publications Board. Consequently it is also entirely inappropriate for the Respondent to substitute its own judgment for that of the legislature by refusing to register a name in a manner which would appear to express a disapproval of adult material.

Indeed, even if the Respondent were entitled to express a disapproval of adult material, they could not do so in a manner which arbitrarily discriminates against a particular applicant. However, the Respondent has permitted the registration of numerous other terms which relate to either sexuality or adult material, for example, sexandviolence.ie, fcuk.ie.

The IEDR then responded with the claim that I had never formally or informally attempted to register porn.ie or pornography.ie. This of course was rubbish so we sent the IEDR copies of their previous refusal letters.

A week or so later we received their rather bizarre response which spoke of child pornography and other

Re:Alternate News Source?

[Charles Dodgeson]

My workplace blocks all URLs with "sex" as a label of the domain name, you insensitive clod! So I can't access TFA.

I think that the University of Essex is hosting a mirror.

Re:Alternate News Source?

[Hogwash McFly]

And Scunthorpe College.

Re:Alternate News Source?

[shentino]

Call the waaahmbulance?

Seriously, this is a case of "my TLD, my rules".

Re:I just shit an obama

[fractoid]

I thought it was the Metric Shitload, although the slightly smaller Imperial Shitload and the slightly larger U.S. Shitload are competing standards.

Addition

[modecx]

Princess she-lay-lee and the seven black Irish Dwarves!

(Stumpy, Baldy, Sleazy, Seamy, Kinky, Weirdo, and everyone's favorite dwarf, Erectile Dysfunction.)

Re:Nay but I'll tell you bout my 1st time in Irela

[Anonymous Coward]

If you insist posting sex stories, please don't repeat the same over and over again. This lack of variety would make even baby Jeesus cry.

rescue-a-pussy.ie

[Anonymous Coward]

So cat charities are screwed then (no pun intended)

On an Irish domain related note

[hack slash]

I'm almost shocked nobody has registered omgpon.ie

There was no sex in Ireland before television.

[Sir_Sri]

There was no sex in Ireland before television.-Irish MP Oliver J. Flanagan

Apparently there wasn't any before the internet, and they must put a stop to this before it catches on.

Re:I just shit an obama

[Tubal-Cain]

the slightly larger U.S. Shitload are competing standards.

Otherwise known as the US Government Bureaucracy. Also, orders of magnitude difference do not constitute "slightly".

What they really mean to say is...

[Hojima]

Irish Domain Registry Banning Porn Sites

So they're getting rid of the internet?

Re:just move out of Ireland?

[JWSmythe]

Be careful what you wish for.

American citizens are not well armed, compared to the government that controls them.

I was listening to the radio on the drive home today. The DJ made an excellent point.

He was talking about a news story. A guy in Eastern Europe decided his mother-in-law was the cause of his wife leaving him. He went to her house, and shot it with an anti-tank missile. The mother-in-law survived the rocket attack, so he continued his attack with a machine gun. She survived that too, and he was finally arrested. I imagine the police may have noticed all the noise. :)

The DJ said, "I make good money, and I know a lot of people. I have no idea where to get a anti-tank rocket nor a machine gun." He had a point. American citizens cannot own weapons that the government uses. If they are found with them, they will be taken away by the government, and the owner will end up in prison for a long time.

Here in America, we are well protected. We're taught guns are dangerous and we shouldn't have them. Gun owners are vilified. Those with collections are extremely dangerous and should be avoided. Citizens don't own anything more powerful than semi-automatic pistols and rifles.

Should the citizens of America revolt, the first in the fighting will be annihilated by law enforcement and the military. Obviously they are the subversives trying to destroy the American way. They will be made an example of to the rest of the population. Subversive "terrorist" cells will be hunted down and killed, with only a few surviving for prosecution in closed courts.

If (and only if) it continued, some would realize, "these are my friends and family standing up against what America has become", and then they may bring their weapons and training to the side of the civilians. This second wave will likely be annihilated also. Advanced weapons (bombers, UAV's, heavy smart weapons) will be employed.

In subsequent waves (if there are any), the tide may turn, as the sides become equal in power. Military units will side with the civilians. The lucky (?) survivors will live to tell the tales of the worst conflict the world has ever seen.

Other countries will take advantage of the unrest and the unavailability of American forces world wide to continue their "world police" actions.

Unfortunately, if an uprising like this did occur, it would be a disaster for America and large parts of the world, economically, socially, and politically.

The American Revolutionary War would seem like a civil dispute compared to what it would be like if America turned upon itself now.

It's not that I disagree that it couldn't happen. It's very likely that it could.

I am very hopeful Obama can turn quite a few things around, as he is trying to do right now. Unfortunately, as the American economy falls apart, people lose their jobs, homes, and ability to feed themselves, "bad things ©" will happen.

I won't say which side I will be on. I am an American, and as such I will defend the ways of America with my life. We have (hopefully) learned that violence is not the method in which things are changed, but not everyone else believes this way. I choose to protect my family and friends first from anything that may happen. Those who side with me will have chosen the peaceful and right way, but as the cold war proved, "peace through superior firepower" is a well ingrained belief in the government. They are willing to prove it through any group that looks like it may try "bad things ©". IANACT (I am not a conspiracy theorist), but please referenc

Re:I just shit an obama

[Anonymous Coward]

This is crap.

Exception.....

[IHC Navistar]

However, Leprechaun porn is still O.K.

Re:just move out of Ireland?

[macraig]

As much as I'd like it to be that everyone can be reasonable and egalitarian and work together for the common good, it isn't true. Some people cannot be taught nor rehabilitated to adopt those values. The most irredeemably antisocial people aren't the criminals in our prisons; they're the minor irritations, the warts and rashes of society. The most antisocial of all are the ones who manipulate the social system against itself, like some social autoimmune disorder, for their own selfish benefit. The only thing that such people will understand, the only "reason" to which they will respond, is the blunt reason of a bigger club, gun, or army than they can wield.

It sickens me that reason isn't enough. If anarchy ever arrives, I may be one of the first to die, as reason has been all I know... I've never even fired a gun, nor do I revel in manipulating people (even when I would benefit). If push comes to shove, I don't know if I can adapt quickly enough. I wish reason were enough, but it's not. I don't think evolution will ever take the race to a point where it is enough.

The only way to oust the entrenched antisocial people who caused the global financial meltdown and profited from it, who approved the Iraq War and profited from it, who brainwash people to buy and consume things they don't need at usurious prices that concentrate resources in their hands, and who draft the laws that protect this antisocial house of cards... ... the only way to oust them is a revolution.

There isn't likely to ever be a Presidential candidate who can achieve such a goal from within the system. Obama isn't such a man. Hasn't he demonstrated that well enough already? Two of the top three officials he appointed to our Department of (In)Justice are former lawyers for the RIAA! The closest we might have come to an insider to could instigate such drastic reform was perhaps Dennis Kucinich, who demonstrated an ability to bite the hands that sustain him and harm his own selfish interests to do The Right Thing (tm), but that ship sailed. Obama is not such a man. People still fail to comprehend that the necessary force has to be external, because the money-changers now own the temple and hired all the priests.

Not only Ireland...

[Gunstick]

Luxembourg's registrar is not allowing the registration of sex.lu

sex.ie

[sqldr]

I just checked it out. It's possibly the most disappointing porn site i've ever seen. It doesn't have any porn on it, for a start.

No to IE websites

[ChameleonDave]

Bah. I don't browse websites with ie anyway. I use Opera on Ubuntu, you insensitive clods!

Innuendo

[Anonymous Coward]

Bet the Irish watersports industry is panicking.. :D

So why cant I have a .gov domain name?

[Anonymous Coward]

It's not censorship, it's that sites need to qualify to be allowed the domain name. .IE domains are only for bonfide Irish businesses. They are different from dot coms which are available to anyone. I think it's good that these domains are being kept only for good Irish companies and not sites that would bring the reputation of Ireland down. .gov domains are given out with the same sort of policy. You will never see porn.gov either.

Catholic Church

[blackjackshellac]

Any money the bloody feckin' catholics are behind this one. Ireland is still mired in its catholic past. I would recommend registering popebanger.ie and see if they notice.

Re:just move out of Ireland?

[mrrudge]

You realise that the whole 'McDonald's supports the IRA' is an urban myth ? Probably brought about by McDonalds having an IRA deductions box on their payslips ( Individual Retirement Account in the US ? )

Apologies if you were joking.

Still want Internet "internationally" governed?

[mi]

Every time a story like this comes out, I recall the dreadful attempts by America-haters towards delegating the oversight of the Internet to an international, rather than, American body...

Certainly, Ireland is a fairly mild case — the country's ban on abortions, for example, is not as bad as curbs on freedoms placed by the likes of China, Russia, or Thailand.

But it would still suck to see America's influence over the Internet be diluted by that of the (some times much) less free countries...

Re:I just shit an obama

[Anonymous Coward]

Nonsense, the official unit of stools is the Palin.

Ban Irish IPs from porn sites

[Anonymous Coward]

I wonder what would happen if the admins of a bunch of high traffic porn sites decided to ban all Irish IP addresses from their sites in retaliation. Could be interesting!

Re:just move out of Ireland?

[Anonymous Coward]

Accidentally modded redundant rather than interesting. Sorry about that.

Re:Nay but I'll tell you bout my 1st time in Irela

[wmac]

Thank you very much I enjoyed it :) Where can I find more of these stories?

suggestion

[chrish]

Has anyone registered stupidit.ie yet?

Honest Question Here

[AP31R0N]

Why do we have the TLDs?

They seem to be meaningless and create problems like WhiteHouse.com/.gov. i'd much rather know that www.Coca-Cola belongs to Coca-Cola and not "Jeff who had 20$ and got to it first".

If we had some kind of enforcement of what could be on what TLD, it would make sense. As it is, only .gov, .mil and .edu are meaningful. Even the national TLDs are fudgable.

Having a TLD of .adlt or .prn would allow parents and schools to block pr0n from their kids. Then if a site had porn on it, and it didn't have an appropriate TLD, you could fine it or take it down for a day or two. This would be to the advantage of the porn sites because their customers could easily find the product. "in *.prn: Chasey Lane".

Re:Honest Question Here

[mpe]

Having a TLD of .adlt or .prn would allow parents and schools to block pr0n from their kids.

Except that there is no universal definition of "adult material" or "pornography". The only way you could even attempt this would be several hundred of .porn.legal-jurisdiction.

Big Surprise

[ExRex]

This is a nation in which it was illegal to sell condoms until 1978.

Re:Nay but I'll tell you bout my 1st time in Irela

[steelcaress]

Is that an Irish Catholic baby Jesus or a Protestant one?

Re:just move out of Ireland?

[JWSmythe]

    If (if, if, if) it ever came down to that, there is plenty of room for people like you. I would like to think that not every man would *need* to stand on the front lines, if such a thing could even apply in such a war.

    Those that go to the "we will fight" even if they win, will fail. Fighting against something isn't enough. There has to be a plan way beyond that.

    If someone says "I don't like the government, I will kill them", what do they plan for after that? Nothing. They have no plan, other than resisting what they don't like. Some sort of government is required to guide the people. We have the wonders of a capitalist society right now. People need, so someone else makes and sells. All is fine and dandy until ... well ... we're seeing the drawbacks of that. People need housing, yet housing is unaffordable. People need transportation, but they can't afford a car. They can't ride a horse. They can't walk because necessities are too wide spread. Greed has taken capitalism and brought us to the brink of of failure. The golden rule applies. He who has the gold makes the rule. It should be, the more intelligent people make the guidelines to which we live, for the benefit of society.

    I'd love to go to a homeless shelter and say, "I will take every willing man and woman. We will build shelter together, and we will grow your food." That won't work. Land is owned, and people can't just say "I need 100 acres to help these people. These 100 acres aren't being used." Is it wrong to want to help people in such a way? They are working, and they are being paid for their work. It may or may not be in gold or dollars, but they are being paid. Of course, our government will want their cut. They want to tax because they use the land. They want to tax because they have improved the land. They want to tax because they have made a product (the food). They want to tax because the product was sold (food produced and sold to those who made the food). It quickly becomes unsustainable. Even a small utopian camp would be taxed out of existance, unless they had a rich benefactor (i.e., he with the gold). It would then grow into what I mentioned before. Peace through superior firepower. These subversives aren't paying their taxes. The would be arrested (nice men with guns), tried for tax evasion, trespassing, non-licensed food production, etc. The homeless you've given a better way to live are now back where they started jailed, and then homeless once released.

    It's a game we can't win. I'm on the edge of it, as most of us are. I work hard, I make some money, and I will never be "he with the gold", therefore I will never make the rule.

    So, we continue... until something happens.

    I've read a few news stories about the government now trying to control and evict people from homeless "tent cities". Previously employed people who now can't afford anything, who just need a place to live are told they can't even live in a tent. I wish I knew what they (the government) expected all of us to do. Get a job? Jobs are fewer and fewer. Buy a house? Not without a job. Buy food? Not without a job. Get a job then. How?

    I'm not one of the homeless yet. Well, technically I am. I live with friends now. I pay rent through labor and favors (buy dinner. buy cigarettes). I don't have a place in my name, because I don't have the money. But everyone else likes the money that I do make. They all ask for it. I just want to live and thrive. Is there anything wrong with that?

Re:just move out of Ireland?

[fiannaFailMan]

Vive la revolucion!

Phrase you're looking for is 'tiocfaidh ar la'. It's Irish for 'I'm a fuckwit living in the past who thinks it would be a great idea if we all started shooting each other and letting off bombs the whole time just like in the good old days'.

'Tiocfaidh ar lÃ' means 'our day will come.' It's used by people who support a United Ireland, including the ones who opposed the IRA. For 'fuckwits' see the people who tar all Irish nationalists with the same brush and who think that the troubles that started in the late 1960s just spontaneously combusted rather than being the result of 50 years of one-party Protestant rule in the north, where the number of votes you had depended on your religion, and where job ads could legally appear in the papers including the words 'catholics need not apply.'

'Fuckwits' indeed. 'Informative' my ass.

Re:Nay but I'll tell you bout my 1st time in Irela

[Hognoxious]

I second what RP said.

Plus, could you make it fit the topic a bit better - make her from Ireland, not Spain. For an extra bonus, maybe even put something in about freckly tits and ginger pubes.

Re:Nay but I'll tell you bout my 1st time in Irela

[Hognoxious]

Neither, he's Jewish.

Obligatory

[fiannaFailMan]

Down with this sort of thing!

Re:just move out of Ireland?

[macraig]

There's nothing wrong with that, but there are Darwinian Highlander-type people who intend to disadvantage you in order to guarantee their own genes out-compete yours, and they will have a problem with you if you begin to succeed too much. If it were entirely up to those people, I would be dead already. They still win anyway, because I've been excluded from the gene pool. More like them, fewer like me.

"offensive"? "immoral"?

[Drone69]

Yes, and getting drunk and blowing up mailboxes isn't.

Re:just move out of Ireland?

[RiotingPacifist]

I didn't realize, given the American support for the bunch of terrorists i genuinely had no trouble believing that McDonalds would pay protection money to the IRA. However you are correct it was all an unsubstantiated rumor, thx for correcting me on this one.

Doomed To Failure

[meehawl]

Basically they saw what a mess of what .com became (cybersquatting, typo urls) and made it hard to do this.

Ah yes. .COM. It'll never catch on.