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Cops To Start CrimeTube To Report Offenses
An anonymous reader writes "UK citizens may soon be able to report crimes by uploading videos taken from their mobile phones. Ian Readhead, director of information for the Association of Chief Police Officers, told silicon.com that forces want to build a video reporting portal to allow the public to upload potential evidence. Checking YouTube is now a routine part of many police investigations, he said, and police want to build on the extra functionality that this gives them."
So as a subscriber, I get to see stories before TFA is slashdotted. The preview stories come with this little question: "See any serious problems with this story? Email our on-duty editor." I don't think emailing the Slashdot editors is going to fix the problems I see with this one!
TFA gives the example of a white van involved in some crime. Well, I have a neighbor whose dog barks all night, but drives a brown van. No problem, a little Photoshop here and there, and voilá! "Instant Evidence"! The neighbors dog spends 6-8 months in the kennel while his owner does the same thing.
John
How long before people start using this new tech to make bogus insurance claims??
So what are they going to do when people start uploading videos en masse of the police breaking the law?
Your every action is already videotaped in England.
I think that this will be mostly used to video tape cops doing terrible things and uploading it for all to see. I also can't help but think that it will be largely ignored.
This is brilliant, but I don't know how well it will work.
I tried it out, to see if I could get results. After spending a full day videotaping the dealings of the CEO of a major US company this week, and posting it, the police responded "Well, I mean, we don't really deal with this kind of stuff. Find me a guy who stole some cigarettes or something"
Belief? Hope? Preference?The Existential Vortex
Orwellian much?
If they had this in the US, I would upload video of my ATT phone/wireless/internet bill.
... are BIG BROTHER ... Who knew????
Agent K: A *person* is smart. People are dumb, stupid, panicky animals, and you know it.
You shouldn't have dueled in Diablo 2.
I don't see any way this could possibly go wrong!
What happens when you upload a video of the police abusing a citizen (assuming you can smuggle your copy out of the situation)? Do they auto-delete or does the spin machine automatically fire up?
If you submit a video of a cop committing a crime, would they actually do anything about it? Or is that what YouTube is for?
I'm sure the British are not as lawsuit-happy as Americans, but I'm sure the lawyers still are going to love this.
Just think all the people, whose faces get inserted into questionable videos. The more rich and famous you are, the more people want to do that to you, and the more likely you are to sue for defamation.
Unless they really are able to sort the videos out in some meaningful way, that will be a cross between 4chan and Big Brother, in a way that minimizes comedy and maximizes misery.
Every problem has a solution that is simple, easy and wrong. Selling our Liberty for a little Security is a much too de
We are getting closer to the panopticon concept.
I'm more interested in a mobile phone YouTube to report misdeeds and abuses by police officers.
I say that even though most of my interactions with police officers, even if they haven't been necessarily pleasant due to the circumstances, have been professional. It's just that I've been there and seen enough abuses of authority by bad cops to know that when it does happen, the only thing that's going to help you is video evidence.
I wish those nine out ten good cops wouldn't cover for that one bad cop.
...crimes committed by cops
Right?
Right?
This is a bit pointless, as it will just give the police one more place to check. Some users are still going to upload their video to YouTube and not CopTube, so the police will likely still need to search YouTube for videos.
What I don't see in the article that would be more useful, is having all videos submitted to CopTube be watchable by the public. Then users get to ridicule the perpetrators and can even help identify some of them. The cops could even post their own surveillance videos that needed identification.
And, as for this being too Orwellian, I would agree if you were posting videos of your neighbor contemplating a crime, but until cell phone cameras can read minds, I don't see it happening.
Aero
Classic all-time backfires much?
"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
Checking YouTube is now a routine part of many police investigations
I'd bet that checking other kind of *tube sites is more like their daily routines for a part of them.
My concern is that this will turn into citizens adopting a semi-crazed state of vigilantism. In the States where I'm from people around here take the Neighborhood Watch program WAY too seriously -- 24/7 neighborhood patrols in their cars, radio communications, etc. Now that people can upload possible evidence, I can see people taking a fairly innocent concept to a whole new level -- actively looking for "crimes" and recording the footage. And, what about privacy issues? It would only be a matter of time before people start suspecting their neighbots of "crimes" and put 24/7 surveillance on them.
If this were Chicago the system would eventually become overwhelmed by police crimes.
These evil word bastards are perpetuating non-Cubic myth. Only Dr. Gene Ray, wisest human, can possibly understand the depth and importance of this harmonic system with 4 simultaneous days in a single rotation...
Oh, wait; Crime Tube? Um, err, sorry about that. My bad.
Man, that sucks.
If you have something to share, just post it to YouTube. If the police are interested they know where to look.
mmmm...forbidden donut
Dont' know about the UK, but I seem to recall something in the USA that doesn't allow video/audio tapes to be used in court unless the defendant knew about the taping.
I finally have a server that I can store all my snuff films on!
Isn't the UK already famous for the security cameras on every street corner? I thought that would be enough...
Now when people upload video evidence of police officers committing crimes and the cops delete them there are TWO crimes committed. Something tells me that this is not going to replace youtube any time soon.
Here in Erie, PA, recently a cop was filmed off duty in a bar apparently mocking a homicide victim and his family in a rather obnoxious manner. Somebody put it on YouTube, and now the papers are reporting that the police are launching a "probe" to find the naughty poster. Meanwhile the cop is on TV crying. No joke. Cops love it as long as it doesn't cut the other way.
What about downloads? Does this mean we can watch every crime ever filmed? That would beat the heck out of COPS.
Youtube better watch out.
"Man is nothing without the works of man" -- Helvetius
So what will happen to the system when the police are the subject of these videos? Should I be concerned with retaliation? Will submission be anonymous? Will this be an opportunity for the proverbial 'Little Brother' to force the police to see what they are doing? Or just a place for photo-shopped blackmail?
In the UK, a CCTV recording is only admissable if it has the date/time written on the video.
Most places with video cameras have "CCTV system in use" signs on the windows. There was also a case in the South coast of England where a home owner was being harassed by kids in his neighborhood (they were throwing stones at his windows and vandalising his car). He installed a CCTV system to record the activity, then after catching the crime happening, he checked the video then called the police. The officers came to his house, asked if he had viewed the tape, then said they couldn't use it as "he had tampered with the evidence".
Another time, a disabled resident who had a similar problem with kids and his disability adapted car and put up a CCTV system without planning permission, was sent a notice by the council to remove the CCTV system. He did so, and his car was vandalised that night.
Vintage computer adverts: http://www.vintageadbrowser.com/computers-and-software-ads
I read crime tube as Time Cube on the first pass.
Aren't they going to make it illegal to film cops (or was that Germany or did I dream it?)? Do the cops get to solve two crimes if one uploads a video of a cop breaking the law?
Some of my favourite people are from th US; Vonnegut, Chomsky, Bill Hicks.
This seems like a good way for your phone to end up as evidence instead of in your possession.
I've been wanting to put a camera in my car, and record people driving like drunken morons during my commute. I'd love to have a forum to post this kinda stuff, and even better if the police do something about it. Bug reports for the neighborhood. People need to be shamed into driving better. Or shot.
Zhrodague.net - I do projects and stuff too.
nationoffinks
Shoes for Industry. Shoes for the Dead.
...watch your view counter spin like Orwell in his grave.
You may need to gear it down and use a tachometer. I understand he's starting to fly apart in there.
Zhrodague.net - I do projects and stuff too.
You warned us this would happen.
Does no one remember the trouble those guys go into in their last episode...?
Arash Partow's Philosophy: Be a person who knows what they don't know, and not a person who doesn't know.
Arguments like yours seem not well thought out to me. Yes you could frame him for a crime. Hell, why not shoot a few people and leave the smoking gun in his garage too?
Well I'll tell you why, because police actually INVESTIGATE a crime. They aren't going to look at one video or piece of evidence, throw him in jail, and call it a day. They are going to look at all the evidence as a body to see what fits...
So what happens when the evidence YOU submitted turns out to be the only information that doesn't mesh with everything else they have collected? They are going to come asking you some tough questions, and if you really tried to frame someone I hope you like sharing rooms with rough men because that's where you are headed.
There's a reason in the past why people generally don't try to make up evidence and video is no exception. Personally I think it's great that people can submit video to help catch criminals if they are too concerned about personal safety to get involved. Wouldn't you rather have user submitted videos of crime submitted by real people than have monitoring cameras everywhere "just in case?". I lean on the side of trusting people in an area to say "hey, there's a problem here".
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
And, what about privacy issues?
It boggles my mind when people out in Public expect everything they do should be Private.
If someone started recording my home 24/7 I'd say - thanks for taking on the expense of extra security footage, sucker.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
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Do you think that Cops are on Youtube "doing research?" I mean really.
In England, they've spent loads of taxpayer money to carpet the country with video cameras. Here in the good old US of A, we leverage the network effect by spying on each other. Much less cost to the taxpayer.
Film a cop abusing his authority or breaking the law and post said film and one is a hero.
Film a criminal breaking the law and post said film and one is a fink, or snitch, or any of a dozen other insults.
Have you all forgotten
Yet, you would have bystanders do nothing while crimes are committed, then you cry about the crime rate.
There is no "-1 offended" or "-1 you don't agree with me" mod options for a reason.
I bet the submitter releases all rights to the material as part of this deal. In a sense that's sorta ok, but if you don't own the rights anymore, you can't use the material to make a big fuss independently if the material is ignored.
I also bet that the rights are not grabbed is not the case if the material is from the press. 'cos the press are savvy are copyright.
Sorry, nothing like that in our database. Nothing to see here. Move along.
Anyone with any sort of film SFX training can fake the hell out of something and make it look realistic. It's especially easy if you took a real video and then added some CG or other alterations then sampled it down to cameraphone quality. It'd look perfect. You could easily make it look like a gun that was being pointed at someone fire even though it never did. Add a little flash overlay and a sound effect with a filter to make it sound camera phone-like and tada, you've just been shot it. In fact, it'd be simple to add the gun to an empty hand too. This is pretty ridiculous.
Google's Super Secret Search Algorithm: SELECT @search_results FROM internet WHERE @search_results = 'good'
My worst experience with a police officer. It was very bad and I cannot and will not go into details. The police are power-fucking-mad. The best use of this tool would absolutely be to report crimes committed BY police, even though the chances of them arresting and prosecuting one of their own is slim to none.
I learned a long time ago not to argue with a cop because they WILL USE WHATEVER FORCE NECESSARY TO OBTAIN 100% COMPLIANCE AND ESTABLISH THEIR DOMINANCE (RIGHT OR WRONG).
I fear the police. Not because I broke any laws. I did not. Not because I am a criminal. I am not.
I fear them because they are power mad mother fuckers who will beat you to within an inch of your death, perhaps even kill you, simply to get you to submit to their authority or just because you pissed them off by questioning that authority.
There is a reason police have a higher incidence of spousal abuse than the general population. Studies have shown more than 64% of officers in their 20s have committed domestic violence and that, if you're being conservative, 41% of all police officers commit abuse but that the number could easily be over 50%.
Yes, this means most police officers are wife beaters. Spineless pricks who love to beat the shit out of people weaker than they are to prove they're stronger and to feel better about themselves. I suppose kicking the crap out of kids, weaklings, and women makes you feel like a man...if you're a cop.
Fuck the police.
I for one can't wait to see all the G20 videos up there for extensive public analysis.
http://rocknerd.co.uk
What exactly is wrong with reporting a crime that your neighbor did?
I'm glad I'm not the only person here who understands that, sometimes, people who are reported to the police find themselves in that position because they've committed a crime.
I'm also glad that most of the population of /. seems to live in crime-free areas where the only offense ever committed is the illegal downloading of a bit of music. Other people in this world have more serious problems to deal with and actually need to be able to report crime to the police.
Here is the news: Crime happens, and when it does it needs to be dealt with. Dealing with crime does not make one an Orwellian/big brother/Stasi/thought police/ninja stormtrooper. It makes you a responsible citizen.
Drill baby drill - on Mars
I couldn't have been the masked robber of that liquor store. Right here on CopTube is a video of me littering 10 miles away at that moment!
Some see the vessel as half full; others see it as half-empty; We pour it out on the floor and laugh
Can we have this in the US, for my local sheriff's office? They like to speed near the park where the kids play. Sure, it's a 40 mph zone, and kids have some self responsibility, but 55 with no lights? When they ticket at 45? They also like to run the stop sign next to the school where the drunk driver's insurance company got to replace their brick wall and most of their furniture. If they think it's a yield sign for them, then maybe they can back off on ticketing my neighbors?
When I come from, law enforcement was held to a higher standard. Old men could sit on their lawns shaking their canes at "kids these days". These days, the kids who aren't inside playing on their Nintendo PlayBox3s would probably report me to Homeland Security for even owning a cane.
-1 1840 called. They want their faith in due process back. Please send by horse courier.
My first Journal Entry ever, in 8 years! http://slashdot.org/journal/365947/aphelion-scifi-fantasy-horror-poetry-webzine
Telegrammed? Wrote a letter? Send me to the first circle of hell where people who Invoked the Past mistimed the year.
My first Journal Entry ever, in 8 years! http://slashdot.org/journal/365947/aphelion-scifi-fantasy-horror-poetry-webzine
Is there a such a thing as a wireless streaming video camera? Then if you happen to film the cops in some sort of dubious behavior, you can hand over the camera like a good little citizen when the cops ask for it, knowing that the video is safe on a server somewhere miles away?
None of them can see the clouds; The polished wings don't care.
Apparently the Internet is a bunch of tubes, dudes.
I don't know how we ever got the idea that police work is particularly dangerous. (Wait...yes I do...from the police!). Police work isn't even in the top 10 most dangerous occupations. Death rate for Loggers about 95 per 100,000 per year, pilots about 90, steel workers about 50. Police are about 6 per 100,000. Only about 1/2 of the police deaths are due to encounters with violent criminals, the rest are things like traffic accidents and heart attacks. We don't condone brutality on citizens by garbage collectors, and their job is 5 times as dangerous as the police.
None of them can see the clouds; The polished wings don't care.
Now you can inform on your family and neighbors!!! Schweet!
I propose calling the site SnitchTube.
"Nothing makes a tyrant's job easier than the people policing themselves."
Power does not corrupt - power attracts the corrupt.
...youtube? wikileaks? vimeo?
heck, I dunno, maybe you'll risk harassment from your local corrupt cops (if any, I'll just presume the worst here) and start up your own site... www.badcoptube.com or somesuch, and accept -only- videos of cops violating laws. I'm sure you could make a mint.
I would very much simply assume that any videos they do not want to investigate - whatever the content - will simply be deleted. I also assume that they will not be posting these videos immediately after upload (after all, if you take a video of some corpse and that gets published all over the place before the family is notified, that would be some manner of suckage that the dept responsible for the site would have to answer for).
So I don't see why anybody would even bother to use -this- service to upload videos of bad cops.. or, rather, this service -exclusively-.
I thought movies taught people as much.. "if something happens to me, you should know that 3 copies were also sent to major news outlets, blabla".
Nothing is new under the sun...
Orwell of course predicted this type of thing but not quite in the same way. Had he lived a bit longer I'm sure he would have extrapolated emerging technologies to this sort of thing - videotaping people and sending it in.
David Brin did exactly that in his novel Earth. Before the onset of the WWW and when the internet was still in its infancy he extrapolated and predicted people wearing special glasses that could record everything. If they witnessed a crime they could then easily upload the video to the proper authorities with incredible ease.
You can use Nokia or Windows mobile with ustream.tv or qik.com. I think they both do live broadcasting and they record the video.
If you happen to be in range of Wifi, they can use that, but they also work over 3G.
Obviously, the CrimeTube is a playon YouTube. They should have called it YouRat.
I live in the US, but what if I like to be an extra jackass and video tape US officers doing stupid things? I just proxy through the UK and post? Would they really come after me for something so trivial overseas? What if there are 50 people just like me, flooding the site with these videos? This idea won't last much longer, it was just something so the PR people didn't lose their jobs. Awesome! Now you just have to stop all the false videos filed under false pretenses! *stifles giggle*
"The best way to accelerate a Macintosh is at 9.8m/sec^2" -Marcus Dolengo
You might find that's exactly what they do. Police have been known to chase people through London and shoot them dead based on totally incorrect assumptions.
Besides, the point here, it seems to me, is that the system is approaching that of Nazi Germany, where neighbors were encouraged to spy on each other, and report each other, and so no one felt safe, and anyone could be picked up for interrogation even when they had done nothing wrong... except, perhaps, offend a neighbor, or be unusual in some way.
I wonder how long it'll be before a brain-drain occurs in the UK, with sane people who don't like this sort of abuse of liberty moving to other countries.
"80% of all Gestapo investigations were started in response to information provided by denunciations by "ordinary" Germans; while 10% were started in response in to information provided by other branches of the German government and another 10% started in response to information that the Gestapo itself unearthed" -- from Wikipedia's Gestapo article.
So that the police get the evidence before the press and can cover up and prepare spin before the masses see it (if they ever see it)?
I thought they had some "it's illegal to video police" bullshit "anti-terror" law over there anyway - what, you upload it and they come and arrest you on trumped up terror charges?
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Gene Simmons (KISS): Christine Sixteen
Is different than the actions of the homeless man in Aqualung, but still just as illegal (is that a problem, that the two are viewed the same legally)
I listen to both RIAA and non-RIAA stuff if I like the music, tangential business/politics nonwithstanding.
the cops REALLY HATE to be on the video themselves....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3CEFAifA1vY&feature=channel
It really remind me of Soviet Russia...but it is happening in USA.
There seems to be a group of people who have taken healthy paranoid delusion and turned it into something sick and twisted. The GP is so far gone that thanks to the curved universe he is coming back from the other side.
Recently in the Netherlands we had a case that seemed a bit like his example. A call was made warning about an upcoming terrorist attack. The police investigated the alledged bombers and decided, based on their criminal record, to arrest them. Turns out, it wasn't a real call. Much crying by the lefties (who conveniently forgot that the entire family involved had an extensive criminal record) about how innocent people could be harassed like this.
Here is a hint: THAT IS HOW THE SYSTEM WORKS!
The police has the power and for that matter needs the power, to arrest people while investigating crimes EVEN if they are not yet 100% absolutely sure the person is guilty, even following suspicious information. It is part of how the system works. Sucks if you are the one being grinded up by its gears but over thousands of years of civilization, this is the best we found so far. Only in La-La land can the police only arrest 100% guilty people with absolutely no invasion of anyones privacy.
The idea of using videos made by the public to solve crimes seems near perfect to me. Sure, some will try to frame others with it. Women are not unknown to on occasion report false rape. Does that mean you don't allow any rape charges because someone might be investigated not just for something they didn't do, but for something that didn't happen? Of course not.
As for photoshopping, the police ain't all that stupid. Sure they make mistakes and we read about them all the time. That again shows the system works. I would be a far more worried if I lived in a society where I never read about the police screwing up badly. That would scare me. If I see a person coming out of jail after a decade for being wrongly convicted I see a system that works. Slow, but works. Convince me there is an other system that would work better.
MMO Quests are like orgasms:
You may solo them, I prefer them in a group.
Why does it take 2 months 3 weeks to fire corrupt morons? :P
Oh yeah, corrupt unions.
I listen to both RIAA and non-RIAA stuff if I like the music, tangential business/politics nonwithstanding.
Funny how this story follows the one about the UK governments commitment to provide 2mb broadband to the whole of the country.
of Police officers beating people to death with batons at protests.
How long do you think the website will last with that sort of gold?
What's next? Crimespace - a place for criminals?
In communist Romania, people were encouraged to tell on each other's ... "nefarious" activities, so that any behavior that falls outside of the imposed norm would be "discouraged".
So to translate, you are saying that because a hammer can kill someone we should ban all hammers.
Never confuse the tool with the users. And never ban a good tool because of fear, instead make sure the users of the tools behave.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley