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Making a Child Locating System
celtic_hackr writes "Well, I never thought I'd be an advocate for placing GPS devices on people. However, since it took less than three days for my local school district to misplace my daughter, I have decided that something needs to be done. By the school district's own admission it has a recurring problem of placing children on the wrong buses. Fortunately, my daughter was located, with no thanks to the local school district. Therefore, I would like input on a way to be able to keep track of my child. I know there are personal tracking devices out there. I have nothing against these systems. But I want more than this. My specification are: 1) a small unobtrusive device I can place on my daughter, 2) an application to pull up on any computer, a map with a dot indicating the real-time position of my child, 3) a handheld device with the equivalent information, 4) [optional] a secure web application/plug-in I can install on my own domain allowing me to track her from anyplace in the world, 5) a means of turning it all off, 6) a Linux based solution of the above. I believe all the pieces for making such a system are out there. Has anyone built anything like this? Is there an open source solution? How would I go about building my own? Has anyone hacked any of these personal trackers before, to serve their own purposes? How does a tinfoil hat wearer engineer such a device to make sure Big-Brother isn't watching too? Can these devices be locked down so only certain devices can pick up the GPS location of an individual locator? What other recommendations do you have?"
Holy crap- you are, what we in the biz call, an over-reacting parent. Calm down and take it easy before you destroy your daughter's life.
That being said- verizon has an application for cell phones that lets you track your children- it's on get it now. I'm sure other carriers have something similar.
Belief? Hope? Preference?The Existential Vortex
Buy your daughter a cellphone and have her use Google Latitude? Set up speed dial to call you, your wife, etc.? Just kicking ideas around...
Posts not to be taken literally. Almost everything is sarcasm.
When I was in middle school they gave all the kids a laminated bus pass with the bus number in big block type, and had the bus numbers spray painted on the sidewalk so everyone who had to ride the bus knew exactly where to line up. Nobody ever got on the wrong bus because nobody ever got in the wrong line. So why is this a recurring problem for your daughter's school district?
I say make them fix the problem instead of forcing you to shell out money to cover it up for them.
Why not just drive her to and from school yourself? That would provide additional time with your daughter as well.
You wouldn't have to trust the school to not lose her on the bus system
You don't need a subcutaneous lo-jack.
Comment forecast: Bits of genius surrounded by a sea of mediocrity.
You probably don't want it continually transmitting. Easiest way would be to it respond to a 'ping'. http://www.mightygps.com/smsgps.htm looks to fit the bill perfectly. There are probably cheaper Chinese clones.
Get it a SIM card and you'll be able to track her anywhere there's AT&T Signal (so you're equally fucked anyway). Google Maps API kicks ass. It's not hard to write some code to take that SMS and turn it into a dot on a map.
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However I agree with the other posters. Your kid's fine. How many kids have they PERMANENTLY lost? So the kid gets on the wrong bus. Teach your daughter English and she should be able to find out where she is at any time.
Reminds me of the mother who caught a ton of flack for letting her young son find his own way home (he asked to) from a big store in NYC.
The people that want to rape and molest your daughter statistically are yourself or one of your brothers(-in-law)
Teach them their phone number and give them a bracelet or something with their address on it.
You should also probably stop watching television. Give up on the news especially. It's just scare mongering crap.
Oh and watch Finding Nemo. It's got some lesson in there about being an overprotective parent.
However, since it took less than three days for my local school district to misplace my daughter, I have decided that something needs to be done. By the school district's own admission it is a recurring problem of placing children on the wrong buses. Fortunately, my daughter was located, with no thanks to the local school district.
The problem isn't that you don't have a tracking device for your daughter. The problem is that your local school district isn't doing its job correctly and regularly putting kids on the wrong bus. Instead of posting on Slashdot for a technical solution, a far better solution would be a call to your local news organizations about how the school district is getting kids lost on their bus system and admits to doing that regularly. Raise a stink at school board meetings, PTA meetings, and so forth. Get other parents involved. You're talking about a school district's incompetence endangering not only your own child but all the children in the district.
Pretend, for instance, that you get a perfect tracking device for your daughter. That sorta solves your problem, in that you can go and pick up your daughter from wherever she was left, but doesn't solve your neighbor's problem, and doesn't solve the problem of what happens to your daughter when she's standing around in a strange neighborhood.
I am officially gone from
I have an easy solution, take your child out of the care of these incompetents and educate her yourself.
This is not entirely facetious. If the school can't even pay enough attention to your child to make sure that she gets on the correct bus, what makes you think they are paying enough attention to make sure that she is learning anything?
The truth is that all men having power ought to be mistrusted. James Madison
If this question came up a generation ago, before GPS trackers and similar devices were available, you would be looking for ways to better plan school events and to hold the schoolteachers and other school staff accountable for these kinds of mishaps. I think that's the right way to deal with this, though it's not the easy band-aid solution that installing a tracking device would be. In other words, the technological development of a wrong solution doesn't change what the right solution was all along.
I just don't believe in this widespread approach of dealing only with the symptoms of problems. I might consider it (though wouldn't like it one bit) if it were a material object, but the fact that this is a human being should be all the more reason to address the actual problem. The irresponsibility of the school system and the fact that it has taken its obligations lightly is the actual core problem here. A tracking device only provides an incentive for letting them off the hook when they should have to answer for their failures. Yes, that would be much harder to arrange and would probably require political pressure from other like-minded parents, but it would be so much more worthwhile in the end.
It is a miracle that curiosity survives formal education. - Einstein
It's really amazing how any of us, and humanity in general, ever lived past their 10th birthday without all the 'safety' gear that is available now. What a truly wonderful time to be alive, we now finally have the tools to live on past childhood.
"I use a Mac because I'm just better than you are."
Your kid will hate you for this should you ever try to do it. And I wouldn't be surprised if you had to do a lot of explaining to child welfare agencies.
You're like someone installing a firewall when an unpatched service allows arbitrary connections, instead of patching the service.
Your school places your daughter on the wrong bus, that's the problem. Not that you can't track her. Solve the underlying problem instead. Either storm the principal's office and fire up a storm, get the PTA (if existant) to do something about the problem (since it's a "recurring problem" you're certainly not the only parent in that situation, get in touch with the other parents) and if everything fails, get another school to teach your kids (which is probably a sensible idea anyway, if they're not able to get your daughter in the right bus and didn't manage to teach her to choose the right one, it's likely they don't manage to teach her anything else either).
You're looking for the solution for the wrong problem. The problem isn't that you can't find your daughter. The problem is that she isn't where she should be in the first place. Don't cure the symptom, cure the sickness!
We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
This happened to me when I was a kid. The school thought that I had signed up for Hockey, but hadn't. They sent me across town to hockey practice.
Instead of freaking out, I got there and started playing hockey. Then I called my mom and told her to come and pick me up.
Why? Because I didn't have psychotic over-reacting parents. I was smart enough to go "there is a problem here, I should fix it."
And I did.
Teach your daughter this same thing. Make her memorize your phone number.
NewslilySocial News. No lolcats allowed.
Wow. Perhaps she was trying to get away from you.
A slashdotter who didn't build his own computer is like a Jedi who didn't build his own lightsaber.
How about you just teach your child what bus to get on. Or pick your child up from school. In 20 years are you going to want your child to think it is ok to track a person? Will your child be one of the ones that says "Well my parents tracked me as a child and I was fine, so lets let the government track us". The buses have numbers written on them just teach your child what number theirs. Once you advocate tracking people as a valid solution to a problem everyone is doing it.
I smoked pot once. But I DID NOT inhale. Will you hire me?
Are we talking about a five year old? Eight? Ten? Fifteen?
The range of options varies with age. None of which involve tracking your child to a three-foot radius, btw.
By age 8, your kid should know which bus they're supposed to be on. (Probably earlier, but for the sake of argument.)
If younger, then you should be addressing it with the school.
Remember folks, it's been said over and over and over again... First it will be tracking criminals, then it will be tracking children for their safety, then it will be tracking the general populous because they grew up with it.
With technology come vigilance on how it's used and how it could *potentially* be used.
Humanity, sliding down that slippery slope since 1984.
Prepaid cellphone with long standby life in the pocket of her backpack or book bag.Recharge the battery a couple nights a week.Manage the lattitude account yourself to ensure only appropriate monitoring.
Just think of when your kid gets old enough to realize you're tracking her every move. Do you think that's going to go over well with her? What if you want to keep it on her to make sure she's not going to any "unacceptable" parties? There's a BIG consequence in doing something like this, in the parent/child relationship.
I'd go w/everyone else and say "Get her a cell phone". There are plenty out there for kids that lock down so they can't call foreign countries and text 1000s of times to her friends. Simple. If she's in trouble or lost, she can call you. No need to go CIA on her.
It is pitch black. You are likely to be eaten by a grue.
I am SO glad I'm not your kid. Yeah, its nice you care about your child and where they are, but this is so far above and beyond, I can't begin to express. Did your parents track your every move? If so, how did that make you feel?
Little girls, like butterflies, need no excuse. -- L. Long
Oh my god! Put on the wrong bus. The horror. As if the driver, when he/she got to the end of the route, wouldn't have noticed "hey, I've made all my stops and there is STILL a child on the bus. Perhaps I should do something about it".
I had a similar bus mishap when I was in kindergarten, and that's exactly what happened. I was waiting and waiting for my stop. Eventually the bus driver asked me where I was supposed to be and handled the issue. She got me back to where I was supposed to be let off. No GPS tracking necessary. Instead, my mom retold me what I needed to do to make sure I was on the right bus. After being a bit scared that time, I learned rather quickly and it never happened again.
There comes a time in everybody's life where we have to recognize that we cannot (nor should we) control every aspect of our child's life. Every time a child leaves the care of his/her parent, both are presented with opportunity. The child receives an opportunity to navigate a situation independently, learning to evaluate and rely upon their own abilities. The parent receives an opportunity to begin that process of "letting go", in addition to developing faith in the child's ability to care for himself/herself.
While I agree that it is painfully horrifying to confront the "what could happen" scenarios, subjecting a child to a constant police state environment will cause numerous forms of blow-back, both for the child and the parent.
[Insert pithy line of moxie here.]
You're upset that your daughter was lost, and everybody understands that. But you must consider what it means to have what you ask for become a trend, and to have the infrastructure built to make it easy to do.
Perhaps when your child is 6 nobody will claim she has any rights, and you are free to lojack her. But then we will have to ask the question, when does she gain some dignity and rights, at what age does it become a bad idea for you to do this? At what age should it actually be illegal for you to do this? We have not had to ask that question until you do it.
Location services all beg the question of what to do when one person is in power over another and can demand location data. You can over your young child, and more debatably over your older child. Can employers ask it of employees? On their breaks? Can husbands ask it of wives? Not demand it, you understand, but ask, as in, "Honey, what's wrong with me knowing where you are? Think how handy it would be. Don't you trust me? Don't you love me?"
This is the world you will help build. But it gets worse. You see, there will be flaws in the system. Not just hackable security issues, but mistakes. After a custody battle, somebody will forget to turn off the non-custodial parent's access to the location data on the child. This will assist in many kidnappings. (As you may not know, the vast, vast, vast majority of kidnappings are by relatives. The random stranger that everybody is afraid of barely exists.) Perhaps not in your case, but in many people's in this world you are creating.
A better idea? Teach your child, if lost, to approach a suitable adult, and hand them a card or show them her bracelet, which has your cell phone numbers on it. We tell children not to talk to strangers, but we forget to mention that means not to talk to strangers who approach *you*. It is perfectly fine to talk to strangers the child selects for help, more than fine, it's the right thing for her to do. Or sew the number in the lining of her coat, or shoes, or lunchbox or whatever. If you really think it's bad for her to approach strangers, teach her to identify police, teachers, people in uniform etc, but tell her that if she can't find one of those to approach any nicely dressed person.
She'll be fine.
Has it been over a year since you last donated to the Electronic Frontier Foundation
I discourage her from asking strangers on the street
Unrealistic threat assessment. The odds of a random person she approaches being evil are almost infinitely lower than the odds of someone whom approaches her being evil. Or, given the ratio of male to female predators, just tell her to ask a female, any female.
she's afraid of the police
Sadly, a realistic threat assessment for people of any age, not just kids.
compromised on convenience store attendants. It wasn't a perfect solution
Why? I think that's perfect. The odds of a random store clerk being evil are very low. In any transaction of evil, everyone knows she's on the surveillance camera, so thats kind of a downer for that plan. Most service clerks would love to help, hoping you'll say or write something nice to the boss or the newspapers. Its easy for you to find the store, gas stations are not exactly hidden from the street, and you've probably been there before so you know exactly where it is. Short of a donut store or a police station, I can't think of a more likely place to find a cop, hopefully a good one. Tell the kid, walk in the store, stand in front of the camera, and don't leave until you arrive. Away from the unfamiliar street means low odds of car accident. Most convenience stores are basically the same around the world, so no matter how lost she is, she'll be in semi-familiar surroundings, reducing panic and the bad decisions resulting in panic. Very hard to do better....
"Science flies us to the moon. Religion flies us into buildings." - Victor Stenger
>uh... how about no? how about you are irrational and fear addled?
The irrational and fear addled response to your child getting on the wrong bus is to think that GPS tracking has to get involved instead of a little common sense parenting.
-- Give me ambiguity or give me something else!
I thank God I grew up before cell phones and this 24/7 parental obsession. My son has several friends in those last few years of parental control and it's driving me nutz. We can't even get together and watch a movie uninterrupted.
One friend, his parents will call to tell him they're leaving his dinner in the fridge. Then call to tell him that the potatoes were over cooked, then call again to ask about next weeks soccer game. And it's literally every 10-20 minutes. If he doesn't answer, they call, call again and again... We'll stop the movie while he takes the call only to find out it's his mom wanting to tell him that next Saturday he has to go to Grandmas or something just as meaningless. If he complains "I'm in the middle of a movie!" She'll bark back "Too bad!, that's why we pay for unlimited cell usage, blah, blah, blah... so we can get a hold of you when we have too. Emphasis on "when we have too" is mine as it's apparently very subjective.
It's absurd. And, yes, I'm a father.
If I can't go a night not knowing where my son is, I didn't do my job as a parent. The world is not that scary nor dangerous. My son has a cell and knows how and when to dial 911 if he needs too. And I can certainly go a night not following a red dot on some tracking web page. I am sorry sir, but your fear is way over the top. Of course, as with anything else, that's just my opinion. Is is however a fear that you do share with a lot of other parents. Fear of what I wouldn't know as I don't share it.
Even in this case of a younger female home late from elementary school because she got on the wrong bus. I still don't see the need for this level of panic or overreaction. But, that's just me. I suspect my son appreciates the levelheadedness of the home he grows up in. I expect his friends do as it's here they all congregate.
-[d]-
I was once lost for a considerable time in a department store. Well, I knew exactly where I was. I was in the elevator, because I was 3 or so and elevators are awesome! And I wasn't going to leave the store without Mom. Mom panicked, store management had everyone looking for me and guarded the exits. Found me just fine. I wasn't abducted. I wasn't killed. Societal mechanisms are in place to return wayward children to their parents in the vast majority of cases. Yes, there can be a lot of panic involved, but I would be very interested in seeing statistics on how many lost children are recovered within a couple hours versus how many remain missing for longer periods. Unfortunately, I don't think such statistics could be properly gathered, given how many such incidents are resolved without ever making a blip on statistic-gatherers' radar.
-- I prefer the term "karma escort."
I understand that you're concerned for the safety of your child, but you're really assuming the worst will happen. You're also overlooking the fact that your daughter is a bright individual and that she can take care of herself so much as finding her way home or reaching you. Besides, if you start tracking your daughter when do you draw the line? Are you going to make sure that all of her friends are ok to play with? Are you going to pick out what she eats so it's what you think is healthy? At what age do you stop tracking your daughter? What about dating in the future? Are you going to lock your daughter in a tower?
As a parent I'd rather trust my children and they'd rather have me trust them.
"However, since it took less than three days for my local school district to misplace my daughter, I have decided that something needs to be done. By the school district's own admission it is a recurring problem of placing children on the wrong buses. "
Yeah... I can already tell you're going to be one of those asshole parents.
Grow the hell up. Put a dollar in change in your child's hands and a piece of paper with important phone numbers to reach you, it's what my parents did for me and it worked just fine. Problem solved and I didn't even need a cell phone.
Do not deprive your kid of real-life experiences dealing with the unexpected. You can hover over your kid all you like with gps, but some day shes gotta go out on her own. When kids are on their own, unmonitored, they learn to be self sufficient, calm under stress, and resourceful. Just get your kid a phone so she can call you when she gets lost.