iPad Owners Are 'Selfish Elites'

The iPad is not that bad by SlothDead · 2010-07-27 01:03 · Score: 4, Insightful

The way I see it the iPad/Phone/Apple in general is like a very large, beautiful prison cell. Sure, WE might walk far enough to reach the walls and be unhappy about it, but to the average consumer (who doesn't walk far and never reaches the walls), it feels like beautiful freedom. It's like the restrictions don't exists.

Re:The iPad is not that bad by Abstrackt · 2010-07-27 01:11 · Score: 3, Insightful

The way I see it the iPad/Phone/Apple in general is like a very large, beautiful prison cell. Sure, WE might walk far enough to reach the walls and be unhappy about it, but to the average consumer (who doesn't walk far and never reaches the walls), it feels like beautiful freedom. It's like the restrictions don't exists.
Sorry, but that's kind of a depressing analogy. It seems to me that most of the people with iPads are getting exactly the features they want or enough of the features they want that the ones they don't have don't matter. If I only wanted or needed a car on weekends and someone rented me a car Saturday and Sunday for a good rate I'd be happy with that, even if it wasn't ideal on long weekends.
I don't own any Apple products and I don't intend to any time soon (my wife breathes fire at the mere mention of an iPod) but they seem to make people happy.

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They say a little knowledge is a dangerous thing, but it's not one half so bad as a lot of ignorance. - Terry Pratchett
Re:The iPad is not that bad by geminidomino · 2010-07-27 01:17 · Score: 5, Insightful

It seems to me that most of the people with iPads are getting exactly the features they want

Well yeah, considering that, for most of them (judging by the iPhone users and other macfans), that consists of "it's shiny and makes me look hip."
Sometimes I think these people would pay a grand for an Etch-A-Sketch if it was white and smoothly-rounded.
Re:The iPad is not that bad by MBGMorden · 2010-07-27 01:20 · Score: 5, Insightful

The way I see it the iPad/Phone/Apple in general is like a very large, beautiful prison cell. Sure, WE might walk far enough to reach the walls and be unhappy about it, but to the average consumer (who doesn't walk far and never reaches the walls), it feels like beautiful freedom. It's like the restrictions don't exists.
Sorry, but that's kind of a depressing analogy. It seems to me that most of the people with iPads are getting exactly the features they want or enough of the features they want that the ones they don't have don't matter
So, pretty much exactly what he said, just worded a bit more cheerily?

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"People who think they know everything are very annoying to those of us who do."-Mark Twain
Re:The iPad is not that bad by Anonymusing · 2010-07-27 01:22 · Score: 4, Insightful

Well yeah, considering that, for most of them (judging by the iPhone users and other macfans), that consists of "it's shiny and makes me look hip."
No, it's shiny and makes me look hip and it actually helps me do useful stuff in ways I couldn't before.

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Liberal? Conservative? Compare perspectives at Left-Right
Re:The iPad is not that bad by Anonymous Coward · 2010-07-27 01:26 · Score: 4, Funny

it actually helps me do useful stuff in ways I couldn't before.
If you get the rubber band or a cover you wont have to hold your new Iphone that way any more.
Re:The iPad is not that bad by instar · 2010-07-27 01:32 · Score: 4, Interesting

I own one, as do two of my close friends. We all fit the late 20s, middle-class, lower/middle management, computer geek stereotype - we love gadgets and are early-adopters.
I understand full well that the iPad is only a fraction of what it could be if it had been produced by a company other than Apple and ran Android instead of iOS. But I happened to be in the market for an e-reader anyway, and the iPad happens to excel at that (iBooks is overrated, but there are now apps for just about every major e-book store), and also lets me read news feeds, check email, look up video game stragegies online, etc. It's also a great airport time-waster. Apart from the price difference there was just no reason to NOT buy an iPad rather than a Nook or Kindle or whatever.
Anyway, I don't think you're particularly wrong.. there's just another class of us out there who bought the iPad because it filled a niche that no other product currently fills. There are a lot of Android tablets slated for this holiday season, though :)
Re:The iPad is not that bad by Anonymous Coward · 2010-07-27 01:41 · Score: 3, Insightful

Sometimes I think geeks will buy lousy products just because they are marketed with geeky buzzwords like "openness", "linux" or "free", even when those products are not really open *to them*[1], they do not implement a linux build that is truly optimized to the device[2], they come with badly implemented dev tools[3] and cost even more than apple products.
People buy android based devices because it is considered "hip" amongst geeks as much as "selfish elites" do it with apple products.
[1] The geek consumer thinks "open source" is heap and buys an android phone, only to discover he just bought a walled garden with software he can't get rid off.
[2] Some android based devices could have worked much smoothly with an optimized OS instead of just throwing android on them.
[3] It is amazing how sucky and sloooow the android simulator is, for example. It is almost unusable and you end up testing on the device all the time.
Re:The iPad is not that bad by Theaetetus · 2010-07-27 01:55 · Score: 3, Funny

Well yeah, considering that, for most of them (judging by the iPhone users and other macfans), that consists of "it's shiny and makes me look hip."
Sometimes I think these people would pay a grand for an Etch-A-Sketch if it was white and smoothly-rounded.
Based on your post, we can deduce you don't own an iPad (and probably not an iPhone), nor are you likely to ever have used one. Furthermore, you are likely an atheist or agnostic, have no children. Additionally, you are not one of the elites, and no one finds you sexy, although you wish someone did.
Sorry, it's science.
Re:The iPad is not that bad by gstoddart · 2010-07-27 01:58 · Score: 3, Insightful

Sure, WE might walk far enough to reach the walls and be unhappy about it, but to the average consumer (who doesn't walk far and never reaches the walls), it feels like beautiful freedom. It's like the restrictions don't exists.
You know, I'm going to define your "we" as people who feel the same way as you do thereby giving you a smug sense of self and superiority. Just as elitist as people are accusing the iPad owners of.
I don't mean that to be rude, but you seem to think that "we" is all geeks. It isn't. (Sorry, I don't meant to attack you, but you're a good example of "oh, it's OK for the average consumer, but not us" which I think is just as bad.)
Seriously, I've got an honors degree in comp-sci, I've been coding for around 20 years. I've got Linux and FreeBSD virtual machines (I've had physical boxes over the last 15 years too), and I know my way around technology. My favorite editor is still vi. I've read just as much sci-fi as the next geek.
Do you know why I bought an iPad? There's lots of reasons -- not the least of which is in my estimation, the iPad represents the first new change in computer interfaces in my lifetime. If there is something which is even similar, I'm unaware of it. Even as a geek, I don't want to tinker with everything all of the time. Thus far, I've not paid for a single app on the iPad -- there's literally hundreds of free applications for it, and loads of free content in the form of eBooks. It's an exceedingly comfortable form factor that unchains me from a desk. For reviewing large technical PDFs, I'd rather use iBooks on my iPad than my laptop -- not the least of which is I can have an unlimited number of bookmarks in a document. So, last week when I was reviewing a PDF document of approximately 1000 pages, it was far easier to flip through the sections I needed.
The next time I go on vacation, I've got music, movies, games, and books to keep me entertained for days. I can sit in my backyard in a lawn chair and read my email, surf the web, or just read a book. The fact that I can plug it into my existing iTunes which I already had for my iPad was a bonus. It's not like maintaining a whole computer -- it's a device, which I bought knowing full well wouldn't be used like a general-purpose computer.
Yes, you could buy a netbook for less. But, I don't want a netbook. I don't want to have a keyboard and a mouse. I want something I can use laying down for casual usage. You wouldn't use it for extensive work -- though, with something to prop it up and a bluetooth keyboard, you could use it much more extensively for document editing.
Even knowing there are "walls around the garden", I don't exactly feel restricted by this device. If anything, I feel somewhat liberated by it. I find the more rigidly defined behavior of it to be a great simplifier -- it really is an easy device to get used to, and I use it entirely differently that I would use a desktop or a laptop. They're complementary in my experience.
It is entirely possible for an actual geek to like the device. And, it certainly has nothing to do with someone else's perception about me or the device -- it rarely leaves the house. The walled garden is hardly like being shackled, it's more like a place where you can work in peace without getting pestered.

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Lost at C:>. Found at C.
Re:The iPad is not that bad by betterunixthanunix · 2010-07-27 02:03 · Score: 2, Funny

The iPad helps you do useful things in ways you couldn't before? Really? Is that you, Steve?

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Palm trees and 8
Re:The iPad is not that bad by wfolta · 2010-07-27 02:04 · Score: 5, Insightful

Well yeah, considering that, for most of them (judging by the iPhone users and other macfans), that consists of "it's shiny and makes me look hip."
Sometimes I think these people would pay a grand for an Etch-A-Sketch if it was white and smoothly-rounded.
Sometimes, the product I'm using is simply an outlet for my geeking, like when I fire up Linux in VirtualBox. Other times, I need a tool like R, which has few if any limitations (though it has a corresponding complexity). Most times, though, I simply need a tool that elegantly and straightforwardly does the job. In no case does "it's shiny" or "it makes me look hip" have any bearing on the matter. And I think I'm not alone in this.
Of course, a sense of style and elegance of operation is important... for you as well as me. Unless you simply wear trash bags instead of clothes, because trash bags are stainproof, waterproof, and cheap, I imagine you actually wear clothes that are comfortable and look good. And I doubt that you make all of your own clothes because you insist on pockets being a specific width and lined with a specific material.
Similarly, when I need a computer, I have choices of multiple languages, multiple OS's, and multiple IDE's on my MacBook. When I want to read a book, or get the news, or check the weather, or follow a flight's arrival status, or check my stocks, or monitor tasks, or organize my thoughts, or handle most email..., I use my iPad or iPhone or other convenient form factor. And I don't need to use a half-baked interface designed by a geek instead of a designer in order to do so.
Re:The iPad is not that bad by Anonymous Coward · 2010-07-27 02:05 · Score: 2, Insightful

"I understand full well that the iPad is only a fraction of what it could be if it had been produced by a company other than Apple and ran Android instead of iOS."
So why is it that a few Android devices exist in this vein, and none of them are even a fraction of the use that Apple brings it?
By that same token, Linux should be vastly more usable than Windows or OS X. I *REALLY* can't stand Windows, and I run my business off of unix based servers...but I have to say, I'd use Windows over any Linux distro out there.
Freedom does not necessarily afford more useful features or a more stable operating environment, or even more programmers to give you quality products.
I bought a Nook last year knowing it was Android. It went back to the store just like the Kindle. I hacked it and installed a few apps on it, but being an android device didn't make it any more special. Honestly, if I only needed an eReader...it still wouldn't have been good. PDF support sucks. (Just like on the Kindle...which acts as though it is there, but 'reflows' anything that is not of the simplest format into something unreadable). Unless you get the files in the exact format that the Nook (or Kindle) want, expect to not be readable.
Anyhoo...
Re:The iPad is not that bad by kikito · 2010-07-27 02:08 · Score: 5, Insightful

I'm curious. What are those things that you coudn't do before?
Re:The iPad is not that bad by TheRaven64 · 2010-07-27 02:09 · Score: 2, Insightful

Well, my toaster can also make cheese on toast and even small pizzas, so that's not a great example, but even if it were, it's a different sort of limitation. A toaster can only make toast because it is a simple device. If you can modify it to something else, however, no one is stopping you. It is typically held together with standard screws. You can remove them, modify the heating elements, or do whatever else you want with it.
Now imagine a toaster that, in addition to these limitations, contains a colour sensor near the heating elements and refused to toast white bread. There's no technical reason why it can't toast white bread, but someone at the manufacturer has decided that white bread is unhealthy and has invested engineer time (paid for out of the money you paid for the toaster) to ensure that you can't do it. The toaster might toast brown bread absolutely perfectly, and you might not actually like white toast that much, but would you buy the toaster knowing that this was the attitude of the company that made it?

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I am TheRaven on Soylent News
Re:The iPad is not that bad by Sethumme · 2010-07-27 02:17 · Score: 2, Funny

Obviously, pinch-to-zoom over a 9" area.
Re:The iPad is not that bad by postbigbang · 2010-07-27 02:17 · Score: 2, Insightful

Sadly, not so.
I feel strange here, defending Apple, but your inference isn't correct.
Fujitsu and other tablet PC makers based their products on Windows, not (as Seinfeld might say) there's anything wrong with that. The actual form fact was larger, heavier and had more cubic displacement in prior models having similar functionality. Kindles don't fall into the iPad category in terms of overall functionality, but they're good media playback devices.... unless you need storage and decent video playback. The iPad is smaller than notebook/tablets, does have a longer battery life, and comes with an ecosystem of stuff you can put it inside that Apple largely has to vet for ostensible wholesomeness (not that there's anything wrong with that). You have to be willing to either user WiFi or AT&T's plan, so you need to have some masochism, unlike the Fujitsus (et al).
Apple's iPad also syncs up in some ways with Apple's other wholesome products and has familiar Apple media consumption stuff, something that the Windows-based machines don't have. Oh, wait....
Some people need walls and prisons. Reminds me of the end of Kubric/Clark's 2001, A Space Odyssey.

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---- Teach Peace. It's Cheaper Than War.
Re:The iPad is not that bad by jitterman · 2010-07-27 02:28 · Score: 4, Insightful

Man, you need to lower your caffeine intake! People have opinions, but honestly there's only one person who can control ow happy or angry you are, and that's you. If you have this strong of a reaction, don't read here (not because you're not wanted, but because you don't seem to enjoy what you find on the site).

I was cursed out yesterday on /. because of my religious beliefs, but you know what? It's not my problem that some people are immature or speak out without considering more than one viewpoint (in fact, I'm 100% certain that without realizing it, I probably am guilty of the same at times), so it's no big deal. Relax, breathe deeply, and remember - these are opinions, not facts, and we won't all always agree with one another.

Not trying to beat you up over this - I think you've got enough internal anger so that you don't need anyone else to fan the flames. If you find some of the things here offensive, roll your eyes and laugh about it. That feels much better than remaining bitter and enraged does.

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For conscience is the wound, and there's naught to staunch it
Re:The iPad is not that bad by FreonTrip · 2010-07-27 02:29 · Score: 2, Informative

And in your "deduction" you've engaged in the same kind of reductive judgment-passing of which the grandparent is guilty. Some people will vocally dislike things you enjoy. Their vitriol doesn't validate conducting yourself as a prick.
Re:The iPad is not that bad by jo_ham · 2010-07-27 02:44 · Score: 3, Insightful

You know those tasks that you can use a netbook or a laptop for, but that can sometimes be a little annoying, that's where the iPad excels. It is clearly a niche product - it does not replace a standard computer, but it fills the gap for people who want portable computing on a screen bigger than an iPhone but who don't a netbook.
I don't have one (student, lacking disposable income) but I did borrow one for a couple of weeks and I can see exactly how it would fit into my daily life if I owned one.
I liken it to owning two cars - a big family car with a huge luggage space and 7 seats, and a smaller Smart Car with only 2 seats, very limited storage space but the benefit of getting 70mpg and the ability to park perpendicular to the kerb; the ideal errand vehicle for short trips and little jobs, but no the car you would take on a 300 mile journey.
It's not that you can't do things the iPad does if you don;t own one, it just offers a different way to do them that some may find convenient. I personally don't need a miniaturised computer with a full keyboard, array of ports, CD drive etc for the times I want to quickly check my email or watch a TV show on iPlayer in my living room. A netbook can do both of those things perfectly well, but in both cases it's a little bit overkill - if I want to type a serious email or a long document I go to my main computer. If I'm watching TV, all I need is a screen.
I have an XBMC box connected to the TV which I control with my iPhone, and I know the equivalent iPad app would look lovely with all those graphics and banners on the large screen, with more room for the touch controls and information - it would be practically like being in Star Trek with a Padd or Tricorder. Essential? Not at all. Controllable with my standard Apple IR remote that came with the iMac? Of course. Better than using that remote? Definitely.
When you boil down any modern convenience you are left with "what can you do that you couldn't do before" and the only real answer is "a new choice in how to do something". You could cook food before the microwave, you could check your email before the netbook, you could make a cup of tea before the electric kettle, you could make a phone call before the cellphone.
So, yes it doesn't do as much as a netbook, but what if it doesn't need to? More choice is good and it adds a new option for those looking for extensions to their main computer.
Re:The iPad is not that bad by NekSnappa · 2010-07-27 02:58 · Score: 2, Insightful

Yeah. Because that G4 Luxo lamp iMac that I just retired was brand new! I can't believe that I had to upgrade from a machine that was built in 2003 just to run the latest OS.
I mean really! Only 4 OS updates before they quit supporting the hardware from before they made an architecture change? I'm so sick of this treadmill where I have to upgrade every 7 years!

BTW I bought both the G4 iMac, and the Intel Mac Mini that replaced it used.

And I don't know what you're talking about with losing files. You make it sound like Apple routinely changes file formats with no backward compatibility. Unless you're referencing the 10.5.1 issue with moving files from local to network storage.

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I want to shoot the messenger!
Re:The iPad is not that bad by knghtrider · 2010-07-27 03:05 · Score: 2, Insightful

So..let me get this straight,
In order to even *use* an iPad, you're required to have some form of wi-fi or AT&T Wireless service? of what use is it really?
I can edit a document/spreadsheet/whatever on a netbook if I want something lightweight (I don't own one, mind you) or on my laptop; even if I'm in the middle of nowhere, without wi-fi access. I can print on portable printers..they make small, portable projectors so you can show presentations to clients. With no network available, I can still work.
Tell me again why an iPad is so useful?
(oh, yeah, and don't drop one from more than 1ft high---the screen will shatter. it happened to someone I know from work; they posted the picture on FB. It was knocked off of a coffee table onto the carpeted floor even.)

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In America today you can murder land for private profit. You can leave the corpse for all to see, and nobody calls the c
Re:The iPad is not that bad by Derkec · 2010-07-27 03:10 · Score: 2, Insightful

Before I bought my first iPhone? Surf the web happily from my phone. There was mobile web browsing pre-iPhone but I found it unpleasant. On the iPhone, it worked.
Actually, basically all the things that a blackberry did three years ago, but did in an unpleasant enough way that they were not compelling, the iPhone made compelling.
Ease of use (and pleasantness of use) is a feature. I know that's an unpopular sentiment on /. where ease of use is to be ridiculed (see MS vs Linux), but similar to how Apple made a unix based operating system accessible to the masses, they also made the smart-phone accessible enough to me, that I would buy one. Their competitors have (largely) caught up, but give them their due. Apple democratized the smart phone with the iPhone.
Re:The iPad is not that bad by esme · 2010-07-27 03:16 · Score: 3, Insightful

OK, I'll bite:
I recently bought an iPad to replace an old laptop and a portable DVD player.
It's better than the portable DVD player because instead of carrying around DVDs, I can just load up movies from iTunes. I can rip the DVDs using HandBrake, and put them in iTunes, or I can buy stuff from the iTunes store. As a nice bonus, it's also a much better map in the car than an iPhone, because the screen is so much bigger.
It's better than the laptop because it's a couple hundred bucks cheaper than buying the new laptop we were considering. It can handle all of the same tasks we used the old laptop for (it was our living room computer which we mostly used for checking email, web browsing, etc. while hanging out with our kids, watching tv, etc.). It's also easier to use standing up, which is great when you mostly use the computer for only a minute or two at a time to lookup a recipe, read a few emails, check movie times, etc.
I was initially skeptical of the iPad because its limits are pretty obvious (like most tablet computers). But it fills a niche for me much better than a laptop would, and at a lower price.
-Esme
Re:The iPad is not that bad by demonbug · 2010-07-27 03:35 · Score: 2, Insightful

I liken it to owning two cars - a big family car with a huge luggage space and 7 seats, and a smaller Smart Car with only 2 seats, very limited storage space but the benefit of getting 70mpg and the ability to park perpendicular to the kerb; the ideal errand vehicle for short trips and little jobs, but no the car you would take on a 300 mile journey.
Mostly off-topic, but according to the EPA the Smart ForTwo only gets about 36 mpg. Which actually fits pretty nicely with your analogy, as it is a vehicle designed to look eco-friendly and trendy, but doesn't actually perform very well in that respect.
Actually, I think the iPad is way better than a Smart car - it might actually be useful for something at some point (I've only played with one a friend won in a raffle, but it was kind of cool - can't really say anything positive about the Smart car, which might have been interesting if it got in the neighborhood of 50 or 60 mpg but is totally useless as-is and is only owned by eco-posers with too much money and too little sense).
Re:The iPad is not that bad by Duradin · 2010-07-27 05:03 · Score: 2, Informative

./, where (willful or feigned) ignorance is insightful.
Re:The iPad is not that bad by skribble · 2010-07-27 05:25 · Score: 2, Insightful

"I understand full well that the iPad is only a fraction of what it could be if it had been produced by a company other than Apple"
Om yea okay, because all of those other companies are putting out all those other so much better tablets running those better OS's. < /sarcasm >
Apple might not be the darling of geekdom anymore (something I don't think they every really aspired to), but the fact is, no other company would have produced anything close to the iPad, and as of today no other company has. To say that some other company and OS could have done this so much better is just simply ignoring reality and replacing it with some pseudo dogmatic wishful thinking.

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--- Nothing To See Here ---
Re:The iPad is not that bad by AltairDusk · 2010-07-27 06:21 · Score: 2, Interesting

Spoken like someone who has not used both an iPhone and a decent Android phone. Please show me this magical Android "walled garden". Other than one carrier who has stupidly crippled their Android offerings (presumably to prevent pissing off the maker of their cash cow) you'll be hard pressed to find it.
Re:The iPad is not that bad by Kitkoan · 2010-07-27 07:55 · Score: 2, Insightful

Not all tablets are either iOS or Windows though. There are Android tablets and have been since September of last year. They also have the same pros that you've listed for the iPad (being smaller then notebooks/Windows tablets, have long battery lives and come with a large (and expanding) ecosystem, just not vetted "ostensible wholesome" by a company). Some of the other (and in to many people better options) is that lack of needing to sync it up to a computer. When you need to sync a device to another computer, it loses some of it's portability since you will need a "home base" from time to time. With something like an Android tablet, this option is completely removed and grants more portability then the iPad. Like the iPad, you can use apps that are located on the market place and be happy. But your not limited to these choices. You can also do more things like download apps from the web. Run Flash (not every viral video site has an non-Flash version, nor does Farmville/FB game run without Flash yet that I know of). One of the things that really made my friend interested in the Android was watching that I could download compressed files and unpack those files, move them around the HD to sort them better. This isn't something you can do with iOS products (it was a .rar file, so not sure if a .zip can be opened with iOS). Now yes, not everyone wants to do this, but knowing that if you get some email with a compressed file and being able to actually open it up and view its contents now without needing another computer shows how portable a device it really is. It can and truly is a stand alone product, something that the iPad cannot truly claim. As for the walls and prisons, I don't feel anyone needs walls and prisons, they just need walkways and warnings to help guide them around on auto-pilot like in real life.

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Attention... all grammer nazi"s! Is they're anything; wrong with: my post,

Sampling Bias? by BlkRb0t · 2010-07-27 01:03 · Score: 5, Insightful

Sampling Bias?

Re:Sampling Bias? by Anonymusing · 2010-07-27 01:20 · Score: 5, Insightful

My thought exactly. Maybe only elitist snobs took the survey? In fact, according to the study author, the surveys were taken via Facebook, which I would expect already has a bias to it. (He also mispells the name of a another stat firm, Forrester.)
Secondly, they assume "selfish elites" based on people self-identifying themselves as "interested in business and finance". This is a purely psychographic correlation. They have made ZERO correlation to income levels or other economic demographics. This study is absolutely useless as a result: a homeless man interested in business and finance would still qualify as a "selfish elite" under these methods.

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Liberal? Conservative? Compare perspectives at Left-Right
Re:Sampling Bias? by Dr.+Eggman · 2010-07-27 01:25 · Score: 5, Interesting

Brother, you ain't kidding:

From March through May of 2010, MyType surveyed over 20,000 of its users on Facebook

As much as I want to describe my self as a "self-directed young [person] who look[s] down on conformity and [is] interested in videogames, computers, electronics, science and the internet," I can't say that this study is even remotely non-baised.

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Demented But Determined.

Seriously, I want to know by Tim+C · 2010-07-27 01:04 · Score: 4, Insightful

Is this site about news for nerds, or gratuitously bashing companies and/or their customers for no discernible logical reason?

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It's official. Most of you are morons.

Re:Seriously, I want to know by eldavojohn · 2010-07-27 01:10 · Score: 4, Insightful

Is this site about news for nerds, or gratuitously bashing companies and/or their customers for no discernible logical reason?
This site is about generating readership and discourse because that leads to more ad views which is their primary source of income. You may accuse them of baiting the users to incite a veritable shitstorm of comments with a particular summary instead of having actual valuable content or you can claim that this is what interests nerds and therefore should be reported on. Both are true. Plus it's CmdrTaco editing which can be more volatile than the other editors.

I would posit that particularly resentful stories that are sure to create serious nerd carnage are accepted when they come from high profile sources. What I mean is that this is coming from Wired which has one of the higher approval ratings of nerd news out there and not some unknown site. You're free to go to the original source for more data (which, ironically, is an unknown site but does a good job of visualizing the survey data).

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My work here is dung.
Re:Seriously, I want to know by gclef · 2010-07-27 01:22 · Score: 3, Insightful

"C": Nerds sometimes enjoy gratuitously bashing companies and/or their customers for no discernible, logical reason.
Re:Seriously, I want to know by rotide · 2010-07-27 01:23 · Score: 3, Insightful

Ya, I hate Apple and its products as much as the next anti-fanboi, but this submission just comes across as.. juvenile?
One step away from an ad hominem attack.
Re:Seriously, I want to know by elrous0 · 2010-07-27 01:28 · Score: 3, Insightful

Hello, you must be new here. Perhaps you missed the image of Bill Gates as a borg?

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SJW: Someone who has run out of real oppression, and has to fake it.
Re:Seriously, I want to know by gstoddart · 2010-07-27 02:07 · Score: 2, Insightful

Ya, I hate Apple and its products as much as the next anti-fanboi, but this submission just comes across as.. juvenile?
So, is it just an irrational hatred because you think Linux is better and everybody else is wrong, or are you actually basing it on something?
Because, around here, it seems popular to hate Apple just as it used to be popular to hate Microsoft a few years ago.
Having been around computers and technology since the 80's, and having been a raving Linux fanboi at one point, I'm no longer sure I get why people divide up into camps. I have Windows, Linux, FreeBSD all running at home. I've got iPods and now an iPad -- it was iTunes that made me choose iPods since I've had a really good experience with it in the decade I've been using it. I haven't use a Mac in over a decade, but I can't think of reason to hate them. They're a bit spendy, but there's nothing inherently wrong with them.
It just sounds like you're defending a hatred of Apple because it's trendy.

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Lost at C:>. Found at C.
Re:Seriously, I want to know by Gadget_Guy · 2010-07-27 02:41 · Score: 2, Insightful

It just sounds like you're defending a hatred of Apple because it's trendy.
I think you need to learn to read entire sentences. It seems that you got up to "I hate Apple..." and then clicked the reply button immediately.
Rotide can hardly be accused of defending hatred of Apple when the point of the entire grandparent post is to label the article as juvenile for deriding iPad owners by using stereotypes.
Re:Seriously, I want to know by rotide · 2010-07-27 03:32 · Score: 2, Interesting

Frankly, I think Apple is a very good company for its shareholders. Its also great if you want something that (generally) just works without thinking. With that "ease" comes the problem of very limited choices. You're on an entirely proprietary platform, especially on their phones, ipod, ipad, etc. That's part of what makes it such an easy to use system.
That's not an inherently bad point, but it is one that makes me not want their products. Why? Because I like to run programs I want to run. If you make a program and I want to run it, I want the choice to do so. I don't want Steve Jobs saying "oh, I'm sorry, that doesn't work for us so we're not going to allow it to be distributed.".
That entirely kills the deal for me.
Plus the smug attitude Apple tends to take with regards to their sense of superiority. To sum it up nicely with a recent paraphrase of a quote: "You're holding our phone wrong". Great thing to tell your customers and great thing for those that aren't customers to hear. No, Apple didn't make a design that is sub-par in certain situations, no, you're holding it wrong. Holy arrogance.
I admit their gadgets are neat and tidy and seem to work with zero brain power in most cases. But me being a tech geek, I like to toy around with my toys. I like to get things working that normally wouldn't or that need tweaking to get a power use out of it (classic hacking).
On the other hand, am I a Linux fanboi? God no. I like it because it's free and allows me to hack around. Is it perfect? Holy crap far from it. The amount of times I've wanted to pull my hair out because simple things just don't work out of the box (sound, graphics, etc, etc). Am I a Windows fanboi? Eek, no. It does the job for things I need Windows for (apps I use for work, certain games, etc). But on a whole, Windows ends up being full of security risks and bloat like no other.
The one thing MS does allow you to do, besides pay them a lot of money, is install whatever you want. So that's a plus.
Apple charges you a lot and tells you exactly what you can and can't run. But if the twelve apps you want to run happen to be stuff Apple allows, enjoy! Just don't complain when there is some tool you want to hack around with that Apple simply says, no, you can't have it for x and y reasons.
So do I hate apple for legitimate reasons or just because they are fun to hate? They don't work for me. That's the way I see it. I want to mess around with my devices and not be told I'm not allowed.
However, I will agree that since I don't use them, they are easy to knock, but I try to do so only when it is deserved and not merely because its fashionable to do so.
TL;DR - I don't like their offerings at their prices along with their strict, allowed vs not allowed walled garden.

Rubbish. by grub · 2010-07-27 01:04 · Score: 5, Funny

I was showing this story to Charles, my butler, on my iPad. As he was handing me a snifter of brandy in the reading room he assures me I'm no "selfish elite" or a "snob".

--
Trolling is a art,

Re:Rubbish. by fuzzyfuzzyfungus · 2010-07-27 01:10 · Score: 5, Funny

You share your tech toys with the help? Fucking hippy.
Re:Rubbish. by Anonymous Coward · 2010-07-27 01:48 · Score: 5, Funny

Worse yet, he even named the help. Like some kind of pet.
Re:Rubbish. by Gnavpot · 2010-07-27 09:05 · Score: 3, Funny

Worse yet, he even named the help.
Don't worry. It is not because grub has developed any interest in the lives of his hired help and has learned the name of his butler. In order to make life easier for himself, he renames all his butlers to "Charles" when they are hired.

Troll article. by skgrey · 2010-07-27 01:05 · Score: 3, Insightful

How did this bullshit troll article make the front page? C'mon editors, this is ridiculous.

Re:Troll article. by kdogg73 · 2010-07-27 01:12 · Score: 4, Interesting

It is trollish. But the Slashdot community certainly has changed their opinion of Apple over the past year or so. Once cheering for the underdog, is feeling suppressed as the hacker within its walled garden.
We must feed the trolls.

--
Let's face it, most of us are scoffers. But moments before zero hour, it does not pay to take chances.
Re:Troll article. by drinkypoo · 2010-07-27 01:31 · Score: 5, Insightful

How did this bullshit troll article make the front page? C'mon editors, this is ridiculous.
I assume, then, that you have examined the study's methodology and discovered that is invalid, and are not simply being a knee-jerking iFanboy who has suddenly discovered sand in one's own vagina?

--
"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"

Ahh, the old days... by fuzzyfuzzyfungus · 2010-07-27 01:06 · Score: 4, Funny

I thought that Apple's market was supposed to be flakey arty creative types, with a smattering of unix geeks who either needed to use Word from time to time, or just didn't feel like fighting with pulseaudio anymore....

When did they add sociopathic assholes to the mix?

Re:Ahh, the old days... by Blakey+Rat · 2010-07-27 01:15 · Score: 5, Insightful

That's exactly what they want you to think, via marketing. You're falling right into their diabolical trap!
No, their market is actually douchebags with more money than sense. Which this article is just confirming.

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Comment of the year
Re:Ahh, the old days... by mikael_j · 2010-07-27 01:19 · Score: 2, Insightful

Oh, it's the difference between the Mac-owning Apple customers and the iPhone/iPad/iPod-owning Apple customers. Obviously some own products from both categories (and can thus fall in either category or both) but lots of Mac users like Macs (artsy types for the industrial design, workflow and such and the UNIX geeks for the UNIX underpinnings and no-fuss setup which reminds us of the old-school UNIX workstations that actually sort of worked out of the box) without liking iPhones, iPads and iPods (although as a Mac user I actually also own an iPhone 3G, it's served me quite well but I can see how it may feel limited or overpriced to many others).

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Greylisting is to SMTP as NAT is to IPv4
Re:Ahh, the old days... by Arkham · 2010-07-27 02:19 · Score: 4, Insightful

I'm not sure when liking a product that meets your needs turned you into some sort of fanboy deserving of an epithet, but it's sort of sad. I use a Mac ( a 5 year old one at that, but it suits my needs as a developer to have a UNIX machine with a good user interface and still be able to play an MMO game once in a blue moon). I also have an iPad, and I really like it for surfing on the couch. It's not that I have more money than sense, it's just that I like it, and I have enough money to buy it, so why shouldn't I? I use a Nokia N900 too, does that make me a socialist? I like Diet Coke, does that make me a shill for a sugar water company hellbent on making Americans fat and complacent? Maybe so, but somehow that's not how I identify myself.
People can be independent thinkers. Buying a product doesn't force you to assume a company's brand identity as your own.

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- Vincit qui patitur.

Generalization time by Pojut · 2010-07-27 01:06 · Score: 5, Informative

Nearly every Apple *fan* that I've met has been a pretentious prick. Now now, I don't mean if you use Apple products you are automatically a prick...but Apple fanboys(girls) are rabid on a level that is just plain scary.

For the record, I personally think Apple makes decent products, they just aren't for me.

--
Living With a Nerd

Re:Generalization time by elrous0 · 2010-07-27 01:36 · Score: 5, Interesting

The documentary Macheads sums this up pretty well. There was a hipster in that doc that refused to date men who owned a PC. If that's not drinking the Kool-aid by the gallon, I'm not sure what is.
The sad thing is that a lot of Mac fans think they're being rebellious and independent by using Macs. In reality, nothing makes you *MORE* of a conformist than using those overpriced, locked-down status symbols. It's the old "I'll show how rebellious and unique I am by dressing, acting, and talking like all the other rebels."

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SJW: Someone who has run out of real oppression, and has to fake it.
Re:Generalization time by Duradin · 2010-07-27 01:40 · Score: 2, Insightful

It's good that there aren't any linux, err, GNU/Linux (peace be upon RMS and his beard) zealots that fit the same bill.
Re:Generalization time by sootman · 2010-07-27 02:23 · Score: 4, Insightful

> Nearly every Apple *fan* that I've met
> has been a pretentious prick.
Congratulations, you've derived the definition of the word "fan", short for "fanatic." Owner != fan. Most sports fans are pricks, too, at least when it comes to "their" team.* Same with Ford/Chevy fans and all the rest. At least Apple fans have some class--I've yet to see an iPad with a decal of Calvin peeing on a tablet PC.
Back on topic, this article is absolute trollish bullshit--nothing more than a generalization. I can guarantee you that my 62 year old mom, 54 year old aunt, and 76 year old neighbor (all Apple users, one iPad (so far) among those three) are neither selfish nor elitist. What's next, a front-page Slashdot story proclaiming that Windows users are all mouth-breathing lusers and Linux users are either arrogant greybeards or basement-dwelling loners?
* hey, at least Apple fans do something with what they're fanatical about. Ooh, you paid money to go sit in a stadium and yell at a bunch of millionaires who wouldn't give a shit if you died in the stands? Good for you.

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Dear Slashdot: next time you want to mess with the site, add a rich-text editor for comments.
Re:Generalization time by silentcoder · 2010-07-27 03:57 · Score: 3, Informative

>The documentary Macheads [imdb.com] sums this up pretty well. There was a hipster in that doc that refused to date men who owned a PC
She didn't say "date" however, she said SLEEP with. Sorry, using a PC even rules you out as a one-night-stand.
That hipster was Violet Blue - sex columnist for the San Francisco Chronicle and one of the more famous of the 3rd-generation sex-positive feminists. Also the author of "The smart girls guide to porn" - her blog is tinynibbles.com (blog contains sex ed, opinion pieces and porn reviews - NSFW - you have been warned) yeah I hate apple but I'm a big fan of her work.
Actually despite her love for Apple products - her nature and job has made her quite a vocal critic of Steve Jobs's anti-porn crusade. ...come to think of it... I wonder how she feels about Linux users... maybe a gray area... the kind where alcohol can tip the scales... I can but dream...
Oh come now - seriously - a pornloving, sexuality expert from San Francisco... can you IMAGINE the tricks she would know ?

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Unicode killed the ASCII-art *

Crap... by Aeros · 2010-07-27 01:07 · Score: 4, Funny

My wife just got me one for the birthday. So im going to turn into an asshole? Is this what I have to look forward to? Maybe I should return it or blame my new-found sense of self importance on her!

Re:Duh by grub · 2010-07-27 01:07 · Score: 5, Interesting

Though, I have been considering an iPad for my technophobic grandfather-in-law, who "has no patience for" Microsoft Windows, OS X, or Ubuntu.

My dad is a techo-illiterate. A few months ago he came back from a trip to the US with an iPad (!!!) He was doing all sorts of whatever he does on it. I was quite blown away, here's a guy who never used or owned a computer suddenly buying this at age 75.

I was impressed enough with it that when they became available here (.ca) I picked one up. And I don't really have a butler...

.

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Trolling is a art,

no wonder by orthicviper · 2010-07-27 01:07 · Score: 2, Interesting

no wonder ipad sold hundreds of thousands so fast on launch and far exceeded steve jobs expectations. i still remember the 5000 dollar screensaver for iphone that just had text that read "i'm rich" and actually sold more than several times.

"selfish elites"?? by AntEater · 2010-07-27 01:07 · Score: 5, Funny

Like I care about what those insignificant little researchers say. They're just jealous of my success.

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Alex, I'll take keybindings not used by Emacs for $400....

People with disposable income buy widgets by BrianRoach · 2010-07-27 01:10 · Score: 4, Insightful

News at 11.

Seriously ... it's a fairly pricey, non-essential gadget. The demographic they are describing is exactly the one that can afford such a thing and not think twice about it. They also buy many other non-essential shiny things.

You could say the same thing about Mercedes automobiles.

Re:People with disposable income buy widgets by Anonymous Coward · 2010-07-27 02:01 · Score: 2, Informative

Guess it depends on your definition of "non-essential".
My clinic, which is in a large metro-area hospital, is now using iPads. We are on an EMR that offers an iPhone/iPad app. Instead of facing away from the patient to review clinical data, we can use it like we did years ago with the clip board, face to face. A few touches, a few swipes, don't have to have my back to the patient.
I think this is highly essential to progressing in the EMR space, without alienating the client.

I AM a selfish elitist bastard by lxs · 2010-07-27 01:14 · Score: 2, Funny

and I feel that I'm too good for a mere iPad.

Re:Oh, like my mother by drc003 · 2010-07-27 01:16 · Score: 3, Insightful

There are always exceptions to the rule. Notice in the summary it says "iPad owners tend to be...", not "All iPad owners...". Either way it is simply a study. Why are so many getting their panties in a bunch? Are people feeling guilty that they might actually fit this general profile of an iPad owner?

So that makes me.. by Vectormatic · 2010-07-27 01:18 · Score: 3, Interesting

a selfish independent elitist geek? (translation, i dont have one, but i kinda want one)

Yesterday at the big box store i saw the ipad for the first time, and used it to search imdb for some movie reviews before buying a dvd, and the thing that massively annoyes me about the ipad is, that from a usability point of view, they got it right, it works very nicely for webbrowsing and such. The reason i still wont buy one, it runs iOS instead of OS-X, and thus is tied into apple's view of the world

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People, what a bunch of bastards

Re:So that makes me.. by jaavaaguru · 2010-07-27 01:53 · Score: 2, Interesting

On my handheld device, I'd rather have an OS that was designed to be operated using my fingers or thumbs rather than one that was designed with a mouse and keyboard in mind. While I know that it is theoretically possible to use Windows or OS X on a tablet style device, most of the apps that run on those platforms are not designed to be operated on a small-ish touchscreen.
I imagine the ease of use that iOS provides on these devices would be far superior to OS X or Windows. So on that note, I will be staying away from any tablet style devices running OS X or Windows, and opting for iOS or Android instead.

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Follow me

Who did this study? by Drakkenmensch · 2010-07-27 01:18 · Score: 2, Funny

Was it the same people who concluded that PS3 owners are hardcore gamers, Xbox Live users immature people who constantly question your sexual orientation and Wii owners bowling-loving moms?

Do glasses get me shot? by jewishbaconzombies · 2010-07-27 01:19 · Score: 4, Insightful

Who wrote this? Pol Pot?

I'm not going to apologize for having an education and (finally) having a bit of money - although I still rent and have worked food kitchens. But hey - I'm an intellectual - shoot me and evacuate the cities for farming already. My skull will look good on a shelf.

(seriously this is thing is covered in Teabagger language - are they serious?)

Re:Do glasses get me shot? by Abcd1234 · 2010-07-27 03:53 · Score: 2

although I still rent
Totally off topic, but...
Don't say that like it's a bad thing. It's not. I'm a home owner, and I'll be the first to say that home ownership should *not* be a goal in and of itself. It's not for everyone, and it's not a measure of success by any means (in fact, for many, it's quite the opposite, considering how many out there are house poor).

I don't own an iPad by Dunbal · 2010-07-27 01:19 · Score: 4, Insightful

Or any other Apple product. But any study that comes off this way must be seriously flawed and is in no way scientific. First we have the problem of defining what a "selfish elite" is. Call me when the whole world agrees.

This is nothing but a smear campaign. Oh wait, the article says that this "data" was obtained by a "Consumer Research" firm, not the American Psychological Association, or some scientist. If we follow the money, I wonder who hired this company...

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Seven puppies were harmed during the making of this post.

Re:Surprise, surprise by LinuxAndLube · 2010-07-27 01:24 · Score: 3, Insightful

Good for you then that you're part of the elite and not an ordinary American.

Re:Surprise, surprise by mjwalshe · 2010-07-27 01:25 · Score: 2, Funny

well that is the reason the US doesnt play cricket - the "gentelemen" didnt fancy the posability of being beaten by the "players"

"Have Jobs"? by TheVelvetFlamebait · 2010-07-27 01:25 · Score: 4, Funny

As in the way lesser men "find Jesus"? Then no. They are clearly heathens, intent on besmirching our saviour's good name.

(Apple fanbois, I keed, I keed! I have nothing but love your you and your deity!)

--
You know, there is a difference between trolling and pointing out the flaws in your reasoning. Just saying.

Re:"Have Jobs"? by pak9rabid · 2010-07-27 02:11 · Score: 2, Funny

It gives a new meaning to 'WWJD'

They are "obviousness investigators" by OeLeWaPpErKe · 2010-07-27 01:27 · Score: 5, Insightful

In other news :

Expensive luxury products are bought by people with lots of money who want luxury for themselves. This probably goes for quite nearly all apple products.

- Captain Obvious

Re:They are "obviousness investigators" by Jeremiah+Cornelius · 2010-07-27 01:35 · Score: 4, Funny

I have a household of EIGHT people. 6 of these, own iPads - including 4 children.
We are all both "iPad owners" AND "independent critics." The bloody thing is a good portable consumption device. It is in some ways flawed. It is in other ways brilliant. It's not our religion.

--
"Flyin' in just a sweet place,
Never been known to fail..."
Re:They are "obviousness investigators" by OeLeWaPpErKe · 2010-07-27 02:02 · Score: 2, Insightful

You know, there's a reason it gets modded funny. If you need a "portable consumption device" you're exactly what the article claims.
Re:They are "obviousness investigators" by drsmack1 · 2010-07-27 02:16 · Score: 5, Funny

I don't think the average family can afford 6 iPads for "Portable Consumption" (whatever the hell that is).

In other news, those labeled as "selfish elites" in polling data lack personal insight and consider themselves average everyday people.

One "selfish elite" when asked for comment stated "Those of us who are amoungst the hoi polloi disdain the mincing posturing of the 'selfish elites'. Some of us have to make do with only one new polo outfit a year"

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Humor from a Genetically Molested Mind
Re:They are "obviousness investigators" by easterberry · 2010-07-27 02:21 · Score: 2, Insightful

Might I direct you towards TFA? "six times more likely". It has a full breakdown of the numbers and provides the group who did the study so you can backtrack to find their methodology.

Would you like a more complete breakdown? Here's the actual study by the people who did it with their full write up
Re:They are "obviousness investigators" by yog · 2010-07-27 02:43 · Score: 2, Funny

I recently sat on a plane next to a man with an iPad. Although I expressed great interest in the gadget, and called it "Cool!", he did not offer to loan it to me to play with, and indeed spent the entire flight playing games, reading a digital book, and watching videos on the thing.
Selfish jerk.
I consoled myself by watching an episode of Buffy the Vampire Slayer on my Nexus One android phone and then working on a document, and finally playing many games of sudoku.

--
it's = "it is"; its = possessive. E.g., it's flapping its wings.
Re:They are "obviousness investigators" by Anonymous Coward · 2010-07-27 02:44 · Score: 2, Interesting

Well, you are obviously relatively wealthy.
But I don't see how that is specifically related to the iPad. Wealthy people are always more likely to own any specific product, simply because wealthy people can afford more stuff than the average person.
I am critical of the iPad mainly for one reason: the most obvious use for a tablet is as a content creation tool for the visual arts. It should ship with a touch-sensitive pen and a suite of visual creativity software. The way Apple made it however, it's just a consumption device. Yawn. We already have laptops that we can view movies and read ebooks on. They even ship with an integrated stand/keyboard...
(The iPad is also a bit oversized if you compare it to a typical paperback book, which history has shown is ideal in size, but I'm sure Apple will fix that by releasing an iPad mini next year.)
Re:They are "obviousness investigators" by dcw3 · 2010-07-27 03:03 · Score: 3, Insightful

Maybe I'm a selfish elitist, but if I bought an expensive new toy, I wouldn't let you touch it either :-P

--
Just another day in Paradise
Re:They are "obviousness investigators" by arkane1234 · 2010-07-27 03:30 · Score: 3, Insightful

and I volunteer every week and give away a portion of each (meager) paycheck.
You're not poor. The "poor" category could not volunteer any time (unless unemployed) and DEFINITELY could not let go of a penny of their paycheck. The fact that you have an iPad and bought it, along with contemplating an android-based phone, means you have disposable income. Perhaps not a lot, but it's there.
You are what most people refer to as 'low income'. Other's would simply refer to you as a student.

--
-- This space for lease, low setup fee, inquire within!
Re:They are "obviousness investigators" by Jeremiah+Cornelius · 2010-07-27 04:54 · Score: 2, Informative

Netflix. eMail and eBooks without eyestrain. Paint programs, with reasonable touch surface.

--
"Flyin' in just a sweet place,
Never been known to fail..."

overgeneralization by jDeepbeep · 2010-07-27 01:28 · Score: 5, Insightful

Well yeah, considering that, for most of them (judging by the iPhone users and other macfans), that consists of "it's shiny and makes me look hip."

My mother has an iPad and she fits your gross generalization in no way whatsoever. In fact, she fits into a completely different category I would just call 'convenience based end user.' She cares almost nothing for what others think of her aside from how good her casserole was at the pot luck or if she was a good hostess for Thanksgiving. I'm really tired of the /. mentality on what an Apple product user is.

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Reply to That ||

Re:overgeneralization by igaborf · 2010-07-27 02:36 · Score: 4, Insightful

I'm really tired of the /. mentality on what an Apple product user is.
I know what you mean. It's almost as tiresome as the way people generalize about the /. mentality.
Re:overgeneralization by Skreems · 2010-07-27 02:39 · Score: 3, Insightful

I was a rabid defender of the Mac back when it was OS 8.5 against Windows 95. Sure, the hardware was a little pricey, but the quality was high, and you could hack around in it like crazy. Now their prices are still high, but the quality has slipped. And none of their systems seem to be geared toward modification or creation, just passive consumption.

They also used to be all about interoperability, and complained like crazy whenever Microsoft made it harder to migrate off their system. Now they exploit vendor lock-in across their family of products way more than Microsoft ever has or will, and expect you to smile about it.

Call me a social reject if you want, but I'm going to continue to not do business with companies that over-hype, under-perform, and lie to you with a condescending smirk on their face while they do it.

--
Slashdot needs a "-1, Wrong" moderation option.
The Urban Hippie
Re:overgeneralization by Anonymous Coward · 2010-07-27 02:49 · Score: 2, Funny

Almost every single one of the Apple lovers I know are the people who experienced social rejection in high school.

Yeah, homophobia's hard to deal with.
Re:overgeneralization by jDeepbeep · 2010-07-27 02:59 · Score: 3, Funny

touché

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Reply to That ||
Re:overgeneralization by Gilmoure · 2010-07-27 03:32 · Score: 2, Funny

none of their systems seem to be geared toward modification or creation, just passive consumption.
Damn it! Now I can't install any OS or software I want on my Mac?
Damn you Steve. Damn you to HELL!

--
I drank what? -- Socrates
Re:overgeneralization by Skye16 · 2010-07-27 04:06 · Score: 5, Insightful

Newsflash: Most of us have reasons for why Apple sucks. Just because we don't feel the need to wax poetic or pontificate at length about it doesn't mean it isn't there, it just means we don't feel like it.
Or, rather, they don't feel like it. I, on the other hand, love waxing poetic on how I can't stand Apple. Yes, they make legitimate decisions about what they think the best computing experience is. My problem is that there is no room for me what-so-ever in their calculations; I am not allowed to make my own decisions about what hardware I should use, or what I'm allowed to install.
First, they remove my ability to build my own machine, which is akin to giving me a most excellent christmas present that requires assembly, but not letting me put it together. Sorry, but you just took 98% of the fun out of getting a new machine. A pre-built computer feels like I'm always using someone else's computer - not mine.
Second, I have to jump through hoops just to get any app I want, even if I am willing to take the chance that I might be screwing myself over. To Apple, an informed consumer who is willing to take the risks regarding hardware (traditional computing devices) or software (ipod touch, iphone, ipad; the walled garden approach) is not welcome in their universe. Or so unwelcome that they make them jump through a ridiculous amount of hoops just to do something that should be patently trivial.
Apple isn't trying to market to me, they're trying to market to people who expect someone else to make everything work for them. I'm quite content (maybe even happy) doing that work myself, I feel like using OSX is akin to being told to tie my shoes with my teeth. I'm sure there are people out there who can rip through that in seconds, but it feels alien and cumbersome to me. Maybe it's seen as "better" by some, but better is a truly subjective term; I decide what is better for me, not an Apple UI engineer (who I am sure spend a lot of time thinking about it, but that still doesn't mean I like it better!)
I don't expect this to change your mind - obviously you're content with Apple, and I honestly think that's great. But don't sound surprised when those of us who feel constantly patronized and pressured by the Apple Marketing department and their volunteer wing, Apple Evangelists come calling. I don't mean to offend you, but an Apple Fanatic is precisely as bad as a Jehovah's witness interrupting early morning sex on a lovely Saturday morning. To expect those of us who don't respect what Apple produces to love you for pushing it is just irrational.
(Not that I hate loud apple fanatics, any more than I hate the Jehovah's witness who came-a-calling, but I certainly reserve the right to hate what they do).
Re:overgeneralization by insertwackynamehere · 2010-07-27 04:20 · Score: 2, Insightful

I wrote an entire disertation on why I hate the Genius Bar once. I am not a fanboi. But I like Apple's products and I hate these borderline troll articles and I hate the people who come in a say "Apple and everyone who likes them are stupid" because they piss me off. It's not about whether you like Apple or not, or whether I like Apple or not. It's about this idiotic mentality that discussion can be summed up in "UR A FAGGOT" statements. I tend to go crazy and participate when I see this, by trolling back because I have a short fuse and get easily angered but in general this whole attitude of "yeah FUCK APPLE i dont know what I'm talking about" is what pisses me off.
Re:overgeneralization by MF4218 · 2010-07-27 12:44 · Score: 2, Insightful

My problem is that there is no room for me what-so-ever in their calculations; I am not allowed to make my own decisions about what hardware I should use, or what I'm allowed to install.
First, they remove my ability to build my own machine, which is akin to giving me a most excellent christmas present that requires assembly, but not letting me put it together.
Of course the question must be asked - where were you when Macs were incredibly easy to open and upgrade parts. The entire box folded open like a piece of origami for access to vital parts, and then folded back for operation. No screws to undo, cables to unwind, just a few locking clips and unfold away.
If there were enough people who liked that in the '90s, then Apple wouldn't have had to change its way of doing things to become profitable again. Hence, the reason Apple doesn't care about you is that to them, you don't matter. The extra effort and spending just to entice you to buy one of their products is just not worth it. Or don't you like capitalism?
Apple used to say 'think different', but now they just go for the bulk majority market, and sorry but that just isn't you. It isn't really me either, but then again I managed to break the last easy-access motherboard I laid my hands on so currently I'm just looking for a computer that doesn't pretend to be accessible.
~
Meanwhile, back on the point of the article, I never thought that 'wealthy, sophisticated, highly educated' people were particularly kind or altruistic to begin with. Maybe it's just that selfish elites can afford iPads while non-elites cannot.

Re:Surprise, surprise by antifoidulus · 2010-07-27 01:31 · Score: 3, Insightful

Well the "unwashed masses" are generally products of the system set up by the elites, so if the elites don't like the results, why did they set up a system to produce people like this?

As per the religious right, while I am certainly not defending the religious right, I do sort of understand where a lot of them are coming from. The radical shift towards radical religion didn't really start until the 80s the elites started moving factories overseas en mass. When these factories closed a lot of people lost any real shot at finding meaningful work that paid a living wage. People want to find SOMETHING meaningful in their lives and since working retail isn't exactly the most fulfilling of occupations people start to look elsewhere for a reason to get up in the morning. The religious right was able to seize upon this unease and started pushing people into finding meaning in their life by becoming religious zealots.

Elites complaining about the society in which they shaped does strike me as a bit hypocritical.

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Monstar L

Re:Wait, a study of opinion? by Fnkmaster · 2010-07-27 01:31 · Score: 2, Informative

I think you misunderstood the study. From the source, it appears that they assessed personality characteristics based on answers to questions in a survey, and compared to self-reported iPad ownership status.

So in fact it *is* the case that iPad owners are more selfish, less altruistic, etc., or at least that they admitted to less altrustic, less kind behaviors in the study (whether admitted behavior and self-perception is somehow influenced by the fact that you just got them to admit to being an iPad owner is a fair question).

Except... by IANAAC · 2010-07-27 01:34 · Score: 2, Interesting

Ordinary Americans have allowed themselves to become loathsome. They think religion is science, they crave circuses instead of information, they are lazy, and they let their pandering media pundits of choice think for them.

Except they're not the ordinary Americans. They get all the soundbytes (and as such, appear to be the norm) because they're nutjobs, but really, they're not the ordinary ones.

Re:Oh, like my mother by gstoddart · 2010-07-27 01:36 · Score: 4, Insightful

There are always exceptions to the rule. ... Why are so many getting their panties in a bunch?

Because it's not a rule. It's a really broad generalization, based on some subset of iPad owners.

At best the sample is sketchy ...

From March through May of 2010 MyType surveyed over 20,000 of its users on Facebook

So, it's a heavily self-selected set of Facebook users (who might themselves be selfish elitists moreso than everyone else), which may or may actually be representative of anything. To top it off, the typical iPad critic:

If at this point you’re imagining the classic young male geek, your stereotyped imagination is right. iPad Critics do tend to be young men. To add even more color: they tend to have no children and little interest in family.

So, people who like the product are elitist bastards, and the people who don't like it are knee-jerk elitist geeks who live in their mothers basement and are responding viscerally as opposed to rationally. (And, yes, I'm intentionally injecting some slant to that.) But, I do mean the elitist geek -- the kind of person who believes that since they know something about technology, everybody else is misinformed and stupid. That's about as elitist as you get, and just as anti-social as the conclusions arrived at by the 'study'.

I think people are responding to this so strongly because it takes a sample of 20,000 people, drawn from the Facebook pool who already voluntarily self-selected themselves to participate. In my estimation, that makes the statistics pretty worthless since it's not drawing on a representative sample. Heck, as I said, do Facebook users themselves have a tendency to be elitist, narcissistic selfish bastards? It almost seems like drawing entirely from Facebook gives you a sample bias towards people who like Facebook.

I just don't see any validity to the sample, methods, or conclusion of this article. Any time anybody tries to make such a broad set of statements, people are going to get their hackles up, because it sounds like the worst sort of stereotyping.

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Lost at C:>. Found at C.

I have one. Meh. by UncHellMatt · 2010-07-27 01:37 · Score: 3, Interesting

I work for a law enforcement agency in IT, and one of the high mucky mucks decided to try out the iPad since another high mucky muck bought one. Now most of the command and admin staff have been issued the devices as well.

From a "user" standpoint, it's... A neat toy. I bought my daughter an iPod touch, and effectively that's all it is. Bigger, heavier. The book reader is nice, some of the aps are pretty decent, but really isn't anything ground breaking. Not by a long shot.

Now, taken from my profession's standpoint, it has the potential to be a very useful device. Currently we use laptops in our cruisers ("MDT", mobile data terminal) which we can use to connect to LEAPS (Law Enforcement Automated Processing System) and run plates, wants/warrants, BOP (bureau of parole) etc. I don't know if you've ever lifted a Panasonic Toughbook, but you could use one of these things to beat a whale to death. With a relatively simple ruggedized case, and at only about $900 (as opposed to $5500), iPads would be a great alternative for officers on foot patrol, bike, Segway and the like. However AT&T sucks balls. I am aware of talks that Verizon will be an available option for the iPad, which is currently the provider we use. They give us fixed IPs, restricted connections (i.e. goes from MDT to Verizon, from Verizon to our building's router, then off to LEAPS). Officers wouldn't be able to write reports since our and most report writing / case tracking systems for law enforcement require at least Java, but still, they'd be a great addition to the tools available.

IF Verizon offers normal business plans (which AT&T won't for these devices or iPhones), and IF Apple were to pull their collective heads out of their collective backsides, iPads have the potential to find their way into a lot of industries, and I can see many uses in emergency services. For EMTs, for fire and rescue, for law enforcement, the ability to bring up floor plans of buildings, maps, health records, I could go on and on. However, limited choice of providers and a lack of any sort of discount make it unlikely. Beyond the "Well HE got one, we need one!" attitude which landed this thing in my lap, the purchase never would have been made had we not faced an end of fiscal budget, and "spend it all or next year you get less" (which boggles my mind, frankly... I would get penalized if I didn't spend ALL of my budget). But Apple insists on offering no price breaks, they insist on going through iTunes to activate the stupid things, they insist on going through their company for any sort of new application installation (yes yes, I know about the court case and jail breaking), and currently they insist on using AT&T.

Anyway... Ramble ramble. They're neat toys, power to the people, off with their heads, bad social elite snobbery, blah blah.

Re:Surprise, surprise by Altus · 2010-07-27 01:43 · Score: 3, Insightful

Become? My friend you describe the human condition and it goes a lot higher up the social ladder than you would care to believe. When has man not cared for mindless entertainment over the persuit of knowledge. What generation has not described the youth as rebellious, crass and rude? When have people chosen to think for themselves instead of eating up propaganda.

Don't fool yourself, this is what people are. Sure there are those who break this mold in one way or another (often in a rather negative way) but what you describe is the human condition. It is not limited to one country or one time period.

--

"In America, first you get the sugar, then you get the power, then you get the women..." -H. Simpson

Not a troll by elrous0 · 2010-07-27 01:44 · Score: 5, Informative

This isn't some Mac-basher's blog post, it's an article in Wired that cites a real study. And it's relevant to techies (Wired certainly thought so too).

--
SJW: Someone who has run out of real oppression, and has to fake it.

Re:Not a troll by gstoddart · 2010-07-27 02:58 · Score: 3, Informative

This isn't some Mac-basher's blog post, it's an article in Wired that cites a real study.
A survey of 20,000 Facebook users isn't a "study". It's an opinion poll from a skewed subset of the population.

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Lost at C:>. Found at C.
Re:Not a troll by Requiem18th · 2010-07-27 08:00 · Score: 2, Interesting

The skewed subset of the population that represent the average ipad user however. Because --honestly-- what subset of ipad owners aren't facebook users too? And how many of them are unlikely to post about their ipad and thus get selected for the survey?
Actually I wouldn't be surprised if such definition turned out to comprise over 50% of ipad users. So it's a sample of the projected demographic.

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But... the future refused to change.
Re:Not a troll by jstomel · 2010-07-27 09:52 · Score: 2, Informative

I have an ipad and I've never even used facebook. Or myspace or twitter or friendster or anything like that. The other ipad users I know (which is admittedly only two) either don't use facebook or use it only rarely. I'm not sure I understand where your generalization is coming from.

Translation for non technical folks by pablo_max · 2010-07-27 01:44 · Score: 2, Funny

"selfish elites." = Douche-bag

Re:Surprise, surprise by e2d2 · 2010-07-27 01:45 · Score: 3, Insightful

What is the difference between this nonsense and the nonsense that tyrants spout? We should despise people because they aren't as strong as us or different from us? Because that's what you're saying.

You come off like you're better than "them" but you're not.

Seriously, explain logically how you are better than them and why we should despise them. It's illogical and reeks of idiocy itself.

I have a bridge for you... by ttimes · 2010-07-27 01:46 · Score: 2, Insightful

FIrst, the methods used in polling are not clearly specified. It is very easy to ask leading questions and very easy to interpret in a skewed manner. I am more saddened by the need to polarize responses as exhibited by this piece (all under the gentle guise of consumer reporting, what could be more innocent, innocuous?) - apparently these studies also show there is no longer a spectrum of behavior. That alone should raise a few geek AND elite eyebrows. In sum, for troll bait like this, it should be served under a bridge...

Re:Attention Slashdot Users. by jimboindeutchland · 2010-07-27 01:58 · Score: 2

I own a Macbook Pro, an iPod Touch and use iTunes, you insensitive clod!

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this post is now diamonds!

Re:Surprise, surprise by nomadic · 2010-07-27 01:58 · Score: 5, Insightful

The thing that really strikes me these days is the hatred for ordinary Americans by the elites.

I've heard this sort of claim before and I never really got the classification system here. Who are the "elites" exactly? Is it based on money? Because a lot of the people railing against the "elites" have more money than the "elites" they rail against. Is it based on self-perception? The big city professional may look down on the Bible belt housewife as unsophisticated, tacky, and ignorant, but the Bible belt housewife may look down on the big city professional as immoral, degenerate, effeminate, and communist. Does that make the housewife an "elite"?

Re:P{ao}d people are an odd bunch in general by thoth · 2010-07-27 02:05 · Score: 2, Insightful

Well since Apple isn't forcing anybody to buy their stuff, the bottom line is people like it. For various reasons: ease of use, simplicity, streamlined design & aesthetics, whatever else. Apple has passed Microsoft in market value, and had a string of successes over the last decade: iPod, iPod market, iPhone, iPad. Chalking that up to a few fashion seeking clueless posers is disingenuous.

What I can't figure out are people who keep thinking the rest of the population actually cares about the limits that Apple imposes. Apple has sold millions of devices. The market has spoken, the vast majority simply doesn't care, and if other companies had more of a clue and design skills, they'd compete. Maybe those other companies are staffed with people with their heads buried in the sand, refusing to consider "freedom to experiment and innovate" just isn't that high on the priority list of 90% of the customer base.

Other Paralells by Tisha_AH · 2010-07-27 02:09 · Score: 4, Interesting

Like the SUV driving "soccer mom" who is concerned about the environment and recycles her husband's beer cans but drives a vehicle that gets 7 mpg.

Boutique lifestyles of the nouveau riche. Wealth coming out of their eyeballs but morally bankrupt.

The 60's generation, "meet the new boss, same as the old boss".

--
Tisha Hayes

More Trollish Please by whisper_jeff · 2010-07-27 02:12 · Score: 3, Funny

I'm sorry, but the tone of conversations on Slashdot hasn't quite gotten insulting enough towards us Apple fans yet - could you please dial up the trolling a bit more. Perhaps a story that simply says "Fuck you Apple Fanboys" would suffice. I'm sure that one's coming soon enough, at the rate things are going.

Or, in other words, imagine how many heads would explode if a similar troll fluff piece was posted insulting Android users.

Seriously, this place is going to hell lately.

Re:Computers in the home are for 'selfish elites' by nOw2 · 2010-07-27 02:15 · Score: 2, Funny

I agree with your point, but twenty years ago was 1990. Pretty much everyone had a computer by then.

Don't mind me, its just that I woke up recently and realised that I was old.

Re:Duh by Rakshasa+Taisab · 2010-07-27 02:15 · Score: 3, Insightful

I can't believe there are still so many people who haven't figured out what Apple's geriatric target group really was...

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- These characters were randomly selected.

Re:heh ... by insertwackynamehere · 2010-07-27 02:18 · Score: 2, Insightful

Do some research on tax breaks from charitable donations before throwing that shit around.

Long story short: You don't "make" anything giving money to charity. Donating money isn't some sort of con into not paying taxes and ultimately saving money. You give to charity and you pay taxes. Sometimes, you lower your tax bracket by deducting donations.

Too bad... by Low+Ranked+Craig · 2010-07-27 02:20 · Score: 2, Insightful

That there isn't a way to moderate an entire post as flamebait.

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I still cannot find the droids I am looking for...

Hate Speech by wisebabo · 2010-07-27 02:32 · Score: 2, Interesting

You know it feels to me, that as a minority (racial) some people at Slashdot seems enjoy inciting anti-apple people using the kinds of hate speech that other people once (and still occasionally is) used to describe us minorities. Back then there were plenty of "studies" that purported to show how various minorities were inferior in intelligence, moral character, physical attributes, etc. I guess in Slashdot's case the key phrases would be "selfish", "elite" and previously "fanbois", "Stockholm syndrome sufferers", etc.

If the only purpose of journalism is to now provoke controversy (and worse) for the sake of ad revenue, then my respect for the profession has vanished. (No, I don't consider Glenn Beck and Limbaugh journalists). While Slashdot may not aspire to "only print all the (tech) news that's fit to print", it does claim to publish "stuff that matters". I fail to see how this posting reaches even that vague standard.

And yes, this was sent from my iPad. (also, as a matter of anecdotal record, I live in Vietnam and this weekend I was at a volunteer site where they're building a school for the children of extremely poor parents. Many of the the parents (and kids!) work in brick making factories and have severe respiratory ailments from the dust. I also just gave my maid enough money to pay for the medical costs of her husband who appears to have had a stroke. Their dumbshit son lost a lot of money betting on the world cup thus wiping out their family's meager savings.)

Re:P{ao}d people are an odd bunch in general by Spinland · 2010-07-27 02:58 · Score: 2, Insightful

Huh? Just what "experiment and innovate" activities are in question, here?

Setting aside the over-generalization of people merely seeking social status and "pretty hardware," just what are people who use an iPad giving up? The only thing that comes to mind off the bat is viewing Flash. Small inconvenience, rarely miss it. I'm sorry, but the image of people using a tablet computer to browse the web, read e-mail and play games actually being interested in "experimenting and innovating" is just silly. People who want that are on their desktop, writing code. Trust me, the Apple development environment provides tons of room to experiment and innovate--but again, that's irrelevant because we're talking about iPad users, not developers. Apples (if you'll pardon the expression) and oranges.

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"You can't be a real country unless you have a beer and an airline." - Frank Zappa

MyType.com by westlake · 2010-07-27 03:15 · Score: 2, Informative

If you are wondering where MyType is coming from, look no further:

Discover your personality type.

MyType Online Dating

Help us with MyType (Facebook App)

INTJ Forum.

"Masterminds, Innovators, Villians, Virgins" The perfect geek hang-out.

Kind words mean nothing. by aristotle-dude · 2010-07-27 03:27 · Score: 2, Insightful

People can have kind words and yet do nothing because they barely have the means to help themselves. In other cases, these "have nots" just have different priorities and spend their money on their vehicles instead leaving very little for anything else.

It could be that people who are well off simply don't talk about being altruistic and kind but rather put their will into action by helping others either through volunteering or donations. Not everyone feels the need to list off all of the good that they do because they have no interest in seeking the praise or approval of men.

You can answer a study to appear altruistic and kind and yet being either unable or unwilling to help others.

--
Jesus was a compassionate social conservative who called individuals to sin no more.

How accurate can such a study be? by walterbyrd · 2010-07-27 04:12 · Score: 2, Insightful

How do you accurately measure somebody's altruism? Some experts say that such a characteristic does not actually exist. How do you accurately measure somebody's selfishness, or elitism?

If you test people on their opinions of themselves, would those opinions typically match the opinions that other people hold of the tested people?

If somebody was truly humble, would that person call his/her self "humble?"

Does Bill Gates consider himself to be a rotten bastard? Is Bill Gates a rotten bastard? I mean, can such a characteristic be objectively decided by anybody, much less the person his/her self?

Re:"you found it unpleasant"??? by engele · 2010-07-27 04:39 · Score: 2, Insightful

Webkit on a mobile phone is what prompted me to buy my first smartphone, and I couldn't be happier that I did. Webkit is the rendering engine on the iphone. Almost every other smartphone has followed suit and is now using webkit. Tell me how this isn't innovation? Yes it is worth $700 and the data plan to go with it.

Altruism and kindness. by 1%warren · 2010-07-27 06:07 · Score: 2, Insightful

I haven't seen any iPad users mention anything at all about altruism and kindness in their attempts to refute the "selfish elites" tag.

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Full plate and packing steel! -Minsc

Re:Disposing income as one sees fit by jedidiah · 2010-07-27 06:45 · Score: 3, Insightful

A family that needs 6 separate "consumption" devices is a sad thing.

Just imagine the lot of them each hiding from the rest in their own corner of the McMansion.

Although that does address the lack of multi-user awareness on an iThing.

--
A Pirate and a Puritan look the same on a balance sheet.

I need to maintain my image by roman_mir · 2010-07-27 07:22 · Score: 2, Funny

I don't own any fruity products, but I think I made a HUGE mistake.

I need to maintain my image, I am going to buy 2 iPads and glue them back to back, just to be twice as much of a selfish elitist.

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You can't handle the truth.

Re:Disposing income as one sees fit by drsmack1 · 2010-07-27 07:37 · Score: 4, Insightful

6 iPads is about $3000. A nice HDTV-centered home theater can easily cost as much.

I think you missed my point entirely. The average family does *not* spend $3000 on *either* a "nice HDTV-centered home theater" OR 6 iPads. The average family buys a 42" HDTV from Walmart for $500 and has either a dish or cable hooked up to it.

You replied to a post that implied that mostly the rich are buying iPads.

In your post you seemed to be offering a counter point to that - but in doing so you seemed to reinforce his point (and the summary)*and* you seemed to say that *your* household usage was in fact normal and not unusual. This is where you swerved into "self parody" and "lack of insight".

Both are for "consumption"; one is portable.

The average person would never use the term "consumption" when describing the use of an entertainment device. Again you showed here that you are far from average personally, apart from iPad ownership issues.

Some of us, having such disposable income,

There is a recession going on - what percentage of American families do you think are blowing money on multiple iPads? I'm guessing it is in the .005% range.

You spend your money your way, I'll spend mine my way. Neither is evil based only on size/quantity of screens.

Again you misunderstand my point. I am *not* a liberal. I have no interest whatsoever in how you choose to spend *your* money. You earned it - you spend it.

--

Humor from a Genetically Molested Mind

Re:Surprise, surprise by steelfood · 2010-07-27 09:01 · Score: 2, Interesting

It comes down to the affirmation of self. It is the justification of existence. It is the rationalization of an otherwise meager, minute, insignificant, uninteresting existence. Because they believe themselves to be unique in some way, their existence has some meaning and purpose. Only, by being "rebellious" they are merely being another member of the pack that is not the member of the pack from which they originally started.

This problem doesn't plague those who already have another means to affirm oneself. But human beings are delusional regardless of the object of their delusion, be it the self or the other. That is truly the human condition. That is the curse and gift of self-awareness.

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"If a nation expects to be ignorant and free in a state of civilization, it expects what never was and never will be."

this says more about Apple marketing by alizard · 2010-07-27 10:11 · Score: 2, Interesting

than about the problematic iPad (see also class action lawsuit) itself, i.e. who Apple thinks its customers are.

A tablet is just a tool. Who will want it depends on what they perceive they can do with it.

I've got one. It's an Android-based, and I bought it direct from a Chinese vendor (you'll probably be able to get it retail by Xmas season) because I need it as a development platform for some greentech-oriented controller applications. I paid $133 for it including shipping. I hardly consider myself a member of a selfish elite any more than I consider myself an Apple customer. My tablet has an adaptor for a USB port and wired ethernet... two things you can't plug an iPad into.

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Tech Public Policy stuff

Re:Selfish Elites Definition needs some work by Red_Chaos1 · 2010-07-27 11:13 · Score: 2, Insightful

You clearly suck at logic.

"wealthy, sophisticated, (and) highly educated" = elite.

"while they scored terribly in the areas of altruism and kindness" = selfish.

Nice try though.

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iPad Owners Are 'Selfish Elites'

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