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Pentagon Aims To Buy Up Book

jamie writes "Operation Dark Heart, a book about the adventures and frustrations of an Army officer who served in Afghanistan, has ruffled some feathers at the Pentagon. From the article: 'The Defense Department is attempting to buy the entire first printing — 10,000 copies — of a memoir by a controversial former Defense Intelligence Agency officer so that the book can be destroyed, according to military and other sources."

347 comments

  1. Is this really censorship? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Interesting

    They're buying the damned book themselves, paying cash for it. It's not really censorship if they, instead of banning it, go through entirely legal channels to simply purchase every copy of it, is it?

    Grey area?

    1. Re:Is this really censorship? by Dunbal · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Your tax dollars at work...

      --
      Seven puppies were harmed during the making of this post.
    2. Re:Is this really censorship? by Jah-Wren+Ryel · · Score: 2, Informative

      They're buying the damned book themselves, paying cash for it. It's not really censorship if they, instead of banning it, go through entirely legal channels to simply purchase every copy of it, is it?

      It is when they are requiring that any additional print runs be redacted, which is the case here.

      --
      When information is power, privacy is freedom.
    3. Re:Is this really censorship? by KarrdeSW · · Score: 5, Interesting

      I think at the point that they are using any resources (yours or their own) to make some determination as to what you can/cannot read. That is censorship.

    4. Re:Is this really censorship? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

      It's really censorship if they're taking actions to make sure that certain views aren't expressed. Censorship doesn't have to be illegal to be censorship.

    5. Re:Is this really censorship? by zippthorne · · Score: 4, Insightful

      But when the first printing sells out, the publisher is only going to print more. Clearly this is a scam to funnel taxpayer money into the pockets of this "former officer", paying a hefty fee to the publisher to launder the dough.

      --
      Can you be Even More Awesome?!
    6. Re:Is this really censorship? by Jawnn · · Score: 3, Insightful

      ...Clearly this is a scam to funnel taxpayer money into the pockets of this "former officer", paying a hefty fee to the publisher to launder the dough.

      How and where, exactly, is this made "clear"?
      Oh. You were joking? Silly me for missing the sarcasm. In that case, it's not the least bit funny. This action by our nation's military is deeply troubling. No matter how you figure who is writing the check, that the military is attempting to suppress information that the public has a right to see is frightening in it's implications.

    7. Re:Is this really censorship? by morari · · Score: 1

      It is most certainly censorship. It's also great publicity! I hadn't even heard of the book before. Now I'm somewhat interested to at least find out more. Surely there has to be something interesting within its pages to warrant this kind of discussion. ;)

      --
      "He who can destroy a thing, controls a thing." --Paul Atreides, Dune
    8. Re:Is this really censorship? by Mr.+Freeman · · Score: 1

      It is censorship because they're spending TAX money to buy books for the sole purpose of keeping them from citizens. That's the definition of censorship. It's just that rather than outright attempting to ban the book, which would create a hell of an uproar and not end well for the government, they've decided to do the exact same thing but in a way that looks more innocent.

      --
      -1 disagree is not a modifier for a reason. -1 troll, flaimbait, redundant, overrated are NOT acceptable substitutes.
    9. Re:Is this really censorship? by ScrewMaster · · Score: 1

      But when the first printing sells out, the publisher is only going to print more. Clearly this is a scam to funnel taxpayer money into the pockets of this "former officer", paying a hefty fee to the publisher to launder the dough.

      I, uh ... what?

      --
      The higher the technology, the sharper that two-edged sword.
    10. Re:Is this really censorship? by king+neckbeard · · Score: 1

      Car salesman aren't agents acting on your behalf.

      --
      This is my signature. There are many like it, but this one is mine.
    11. Re:Is this really censorship? by GNUALMAFUERTE · · Score: 2, Informative

      From wikipedia:

      "Censorship is the suppression of speech or other communication which may be considered objectionable, harmful, sensitive, or inconvenient to the general body of people as determined by a government, media outlet, or other controlling body."

      This clearly qualifies as censorship. It doesn't matter how the suppression of information is achieved, as long as information is being suppressed intentionally because of its content, it is censorship.

      And, regardless of how you define this (censorship or otherwise), it certainly is still wrong.

      --
      WTF am I doing replying to an AC at 5 A.M on a Friday night?
    12. Re:Is this really censorship? by MaskedSlacker · · Score: 1

      Neither are government employees. You've confused 'should be' with 'is'.

    13. Re:Is this really censorship? by deapbluesea · · Score: 5, Informative

      But when the first printing sells out, the publisher is only going to print more.

      Did you even RTFA? Let me sum up since you seem to be too lazy:

      The first run was printed after the author received permission from the Army Reserve. The Pentagon got wind of it after the first printing and discovered that there was a lot of material that shouldn't have been printed in the first place. The publisher and author then worked with the Pentagon to redact the questionable material, but that left the publisher with 10000 books sitting in a warehouse that can't be sold.

      Since the Army Reserve is really the unit that screwed up in this case by not sending the manuscript up the chain for higher level review, the responsibility for paying for all those books rests with the DoD in general. It's actually the honourable thing to do in this case - along with firing whoever signed off on it in the Reserve component.

      --
      Government is not reason; it is not eloquent; it is force. Like fire, it is a dangerous servant and a fearful master.
    14. Re:Is this really censorship? by sumdumass · · Score: 1

      This isn't really anything new. About the only reason it's news worthy today is because of all the "we are spending too much" and "Wikileaks is teh evil". It's happened in the past and I first remember hearing about it was back in 7th or 8th grade in US history class (circa 1984).

      anyways, it seems this has happened in the past and my US history teacher made the same claim that laws concerning disclosure of national security and military secrets make it illegal for someone to publish a book like this so it has to be an obvious ploy to divert money to the former employee's pockets. Otherwise existing laws would allow them to swoop in on the writers and confiscate the books without payment as they would be violations of existing laws.

    15. Re:Is this really censorship? by tacarat · · Score: 5, Interesting

      I fail and read the article. The book will still be publicly available after things like specific names and other sensitive bits of information get sanitized. By not doing so, lives and missions are placed in jeopardy with little real benefit for society. The publisher will be releasing the book for the public, but the DOD is compensating them for the loss they'd incur from not being able to sell the original printed products.

      Does the public have the right to all the information? Sure, in time. There are procedures under the Freedom of Information Act to get it later on, like when revealing it will cause minimal damage (and probably just PR damage). Demanding to know it right now just because of curiosity? Would you like identifying information to be posted on 4chan? There are many "reasonable and normal" people out there who would react in the same way as them.

      --
      "Common sense will be the death of us all"
    16. Re:Is this really censorship? by ScrewMaster · · Score: 1

      They're buying the damned book themselves, paying cash for it. It's not really censorship if they, instead of banning it, go through entirely legal channels to simply purchase every copy of it, is it?

      Grey area?

      Grey, trending towards black. If a government takes steps to prevent me from reading certain material, that's censorship. Now, in certain cases that may be justified, but the way they're going about this says it probably isn't.

      If the Pentagon purchased those books for training purposes, say, or to use as reference materials ... no big deal. The government buys plenty of books. In this case, they want to have a government-sanctioned book burning and that's just wrong (no, I don't care if they're actually just going to shred them or something, the principle is the same.) If there's classified materials in there, there are plenty of ways to legally have a book suppressed on national security grounds. That the military is doing it this way indicates that they probably don't have any legal grounds to have it classified or otherwise banned. Probably some high-ranking officials are going to get embarrassed over what he's written and just want to cover their collective ass. The problem is, using public funds in such an obvious attempt at a cover-up will likely make for even more red faces at the Pentagon that whatever is in the damn book.

      This is probably a perfect candidate for taking a hands-off approach. All they're doing is legitimizing the book in the public's eye, and creating a huge demand for it. Come on, guys, people get all excited when Britney Spears shaves her head ... all you're going to do here is help the publisher sell a lot more copies. Worse yet, once a single copy gets out, it'll be all over the Internet anyways. Wikileaks should have taught them that much.

      --
      The higher the technology, the sharper that two-edged sword.
    17. Re:Is this really censorship? by couchslug · · Score: 2, Insightful

      "I think at the point that they are using any resources (yours or their own) to make some determination as to what you can/cannot read. That is censorship."

      So is security classification. Perhaps we should not have any such, and trust everyone with everything. Surely the world will embrace our example and instantly do likewise.

      --
      "This post is an artistic work of fiction and falsehood. Only a fool would take anything posted here as fact."
    18. Re:Is this really censorship? by shentino · · Score: 1

      It's unfair competition for the regular joe who might be interested.

      You can't really compete with a federal budget, especially one as large as that of the DoD.

    19. Re:Is this really censorship? by Jurily · · Score: 4, Insightful

      It's actually the honourable thing to do in this case - along with firing whoever signed off on it in the Reserve component.

      Once you accept that "a lot of material that shouldn't have been printed in the first place" indeed shouldn't have been printed, sure.

      However, it's still censorship. The only question is whether we approve of it.

    20. Re:Is this really censorship? by Anonymous+Cowpat · · Score: 1

      Sorry, the only one left is here, and that's not in international waters.

      --
      FGD 135
    21. Re:Is this really censorship? by hedwards · · Score: 1

      At which others have said, the publisher will order more printed until such a time as they stop selling like hotcakes. The only people harmed by this are the people that are paying for the books to be bought. And it had damn well not be the US tax payers. If these yahoos want to spend their own money, that's fine by me.

    22. Re:Is this really censorship? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

      Boy are you naive...
      I don't know how old you are but have you heard of the Pentagon Papers? Do you honestly think that was the one and only time ever that acting leaders thought it would be a good idea to withhold facts to get public support and backing for their "agenda"? How about the drug war or weapons of mass destruction? Let me guess.. you agree that random searches should be legal because only those with something legal would object.

    23. Re:Is this really censorship? by Albanach · · Score: 1

      Your tax dollars at work...

      Well, at least they aren't trying to buy up the entire first run of the kindle edition.

    24. Re:Is this really censorship? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Fascistic bollocks. What good is releasing information long after it can do any good? Placing "lives and missions" in jeopardy right now is exactly what we need to be doing to cause some change - the USA's empire-building needs to be definitively stopped, and seriously inconveniencing their war machine is important.

    25. Re:Is this really censorship? by garompeta · · Score: 1

      If this was a movie they would have sent professional killers to silence the officer. I feel that reality is even more unbelievable than fiction.

    26. Re:Is this really censorship? by Paracelcus · · Score: 1

      Can you say thank you! and can we print more?

      --
      I killed da wabbit -Elmer Fudd
    27. Re:Is this really censorship? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      tZqJdr BJsqWv TQdbUd RLoxQh DzMxji XEHWLo xowMlt iGSkgx ptSGLE pqwmHL MtasrG srQqyp CqKIfbaokiIs MLIhHX BxhRWb vSSJnw HEWOXW xufWZD osffDL NUCTIt JPddHi RTycqo. WWFcoB sbckZg GBOyLN TvViqK FIvuhW uPmasH zyuNKZ BSQsOo zQEBku xBRFfxfy jxWR sCncLifFXzqs oXekIp TOUwDn VVBhLf weWvRy dwqHXm XjGYCo NOzAXR quDjoo sEflLt kHUdPd LIRkhQ KHytaY yBEWNT peRPZT IEBkhv heSkBW OvHEne FKGfxl teovQqGwynao vjanGH nwOYRs aCFrtr QjQyeF wpKbgi BhFToY gMlfQtmXq VDO IUHSvo iWsJZn KYLhUC NjCkdl dXzKMF MGaEbs jeBaka pYAMPI EsChaC IobZLf hsoHoI EoaXdO MTpSoL jPmsSm RwqVEz BbNPCj otRNPO GQKzjU XjXEFp YASrSG eCLuet cvvyhP PdjiNV IXGPLT IQjlsD ifvrvV aKQihd Zubfus VCHWBYXYedyr brqgIw edLbKw UJoiIZ OLEBRR oWYJGh hVGCCS KvqIun qnSbJK VdXZQx jrzaUb ozlQsZ

    28. Re:Is this really censorship? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Classified information is censorship?

    29. Re:Is this really censorship? by deapbluesea · · Score: 0, Troll

      Wait, you mean that asking an author to not print something, getting that author's agreement, and then paying for the printing cost of books that had the material the author agreed to remove is censorship?

      The publisher and the author are under no legal requirement to furnish the first run of this book to the Pentagon. They are doing so voluntarily. How is this censorship?!?

      --
      Government is not reason; it is not eloquent; it is force. Like fire, it is a dangerous servant and a fearful master.
    30. Re:Is this really censorship? by tacarat · · Score: 1

      Nope. Random searches shouldn't be legal. It's unconstitutional. I think that a "conspiracy" can involve as little as a single person in the right place. Depending on the level of addictiveness, drugs would be ok legalized. I think banning alcohol was a mistake we didn't quite learn from as a society, but others may have adopted as a way of getting funds for "other" projects.

      Back on topic, it's a damn difficult line to walk. Protect too much and people can get away with murder (literally). Protect too little and it's the information works against us. Remember the incident during the Iraq invasion (no WMDs, just a chance to prove GB Sr wrong) when Geraldo started drawing out battle plans, complete with locations, for the cameras? Did that information benefit the public more than it put those soldiers at risk of getting killed in an ambush?

      I'm sorry you posted AC. It sounds like you have enough background information, most of which I've never learned or forgotten, to make this a really interesting thread.

      --
      "Common sense will be the death of us all"
    31. Re:Is this really censorship? by tacarat · · Score: 1
      --
      "Common sense will be the death of us all"
    32. Re:Is this really censorship? by Zixaphir · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Because you can't read the damned book. God.

      --
      "Now I am become Death, the destroyer of worlds"
    33. Re:Is this really censorship? by Jurily · · Score: 1

      Can you verify that the offending parts are offending?

    34. Re:Is this really censorship? by TaoPhoenix · · Score: 1

      He's not quite joking.

      Notice they didn't buy the copyrights (pauses to check TFA), so just "buying copies" is totally stupid. All it takes is for the author to first, scalp the now-rare copies, and then release the text into public domain, and then within a month every net citizen in the entire world will have downloaded a copy.

      Unless this is Marketing 3.0. "Do not BUY Operation Dark Heart. We're making it scarce. That's right, go back to your tv show now. We repeat : do not BUY Operation Dark Heart. Remember, it's Operation Dark Heart that you must not BUY."

      --
      My first Journal Entry ever, in 8 years! http://slashdot.org/journal/365947/aphelion-scifi-fantasy-horror-poetry-webzine
    35. Re:Is this really censorship? by Tacvek · · Score: 1

      If you had read the story, the Army Reserve approved the book (without checking with the Pentagon), but the Pentagon later found out that it contained sensitive information. The author agreed to remove said information after hearing the pentagon's concerns.

      Both the author and Pentagon have agreed on text for the second edition, but as for the first print, the only reasonable thing to do is for the the Pentagon (or better yet the Army Reserve) to purchase the books from the publisher at publishing cost, and destroy them at its own expense.

      It could have used national security reasons to steal the book, but that would be unfair to the publisher, while buying them is not.

      --
      Stylish sheet to fix many problems in Slashdot's D3: https://gist.github.com/801524
    36. Re:Is this really censorship? by C0L0PH0N · · Score: 3, Informative

      Amazon's Statement - I went to Amazon to see if it was still available. Here was their statement about the book: "Important Message for Customers - On Friday, August 13, 2010, just as St. Martin’s Press was readying its initial shipment of Operation Dark Heart, the Department of Defense expressed concern that its publication could cause damage to U.S. national security. The publication of the initial edition was canceled. However, after consulting with the author, Lt. Col. Anthony Shaffer, St. Martin's Press agreed to incorporate some of the government’s changes, which includes redacting classified text, into a revised edition, which is releasing on September 24. "

    37. Re:Is this really censorship? by Zencyde · · Score: 1

      ellowell wut budjet dehfeesit?

      --
      What day is it? Could you please tell me?
    38. Re:Is this really censorship? by GooberToo · · Score: 1

      He may have been rated funny but it actually is, "clear". When a printing sells out, publishers print more. Anyone hearing about such a book which the government "doesn't want you to read", is going to so what with its second print? Sell more or sell less? Sell more obviously. A lots more, no doubt.

      Its clear to anyone who can chain together the inevitable sequence of events which will follow such a buy out. Its about as clear as clear can be unless they will not only buy out all current printings but completely prevent all future printings. He used the word, "clear", accurately and concisely. What more do you want?

      As a side note, Scientology used the same scam to generate interest in their church and its book, Dianetics.

    39. Re:Is this really censorship? by Pikoro · · Score: 1

      Is that a Windows 8 product key?

      --
      "Freedom in the USA is not the ability to do what you want. It is the ability to stop others from doing what THEY want"
    40. Re:Is this really censorship? by DaveGod · · Score: 1

      Did you even RTFA?

      Did the news submitter? The Slashdot editor? Frankly I'm inclined to wonder if an editor at the Post read it either.

      The article kicks off with a paragraph designed to mislead in order to maximise views, eventually the real story is revealed as a relatively uninteresting screwup over green-lighting sensitive information. The submitter (and Slashdot) then goes and promotes this sensationalist journalism by copy and pasting the offending paragraph.

      Laziness of parent is the least of the problems here.

    41. Re:Is this really censorship? by guruevi · · Score: 2, Insightful

      The government does not have their 'own' resources. The government deciding to do a book burning is basically censorship very similar to the church buying up bibles in the Middle Ages to burn them.

      --
      Custom electronics and digital signage for your business: www.evcircuits.com
    42. Re:Is this really censorship? by siddesu · · Score: 4, Informative

      Yes, it is called "voluntary" censorship, and worked very well for many years in the Soviet Union where famous authors would hide or modify their manuscripts for publishing.

      It was derided and criticized by the West all along, and many books that were "unpublishable" in the USSR in their "unabridged" format were moved to the West and printed there.

    43. Re:Is this really censorship? by siddesu · · Score: 2, Funny

      Considering how easy it was to leak several years of electronic communications, maybe you're doing it already ;)

    44. Re:Is this really censorship? by ScrewMaster · · Score: 1

      If you had read the story

      Yes, well, I didn't, and the summary was so far off-base to make me wonder why I bothered reading it. That applies to a lot of Slashdot summaries, now that I think about it. This story was actually about the U.S. military doing the right thing.

      Ah, well. Not the first time I went off half cocked.

      --
      The higher the technology, the sharper that two-edged sword.
    45. Re:Is this really censorship? by Cyberllama · · Score: 1

      It's not a grey area at all. If the government tries to muzzle someone, even through legal means, that's censorship. It would be fine if someone else did it, it's not fine if the government does it.

      That said, THIS is their plan? Seriously? They're spending my tax dollars on THIS? What's exactly do they plan to do after the first print run is such a smashing sell-out success and the publisher decides to do a second print run of 50,000 copies? Do they buy that print run too and wait for the 3rd run to be 100,000 copies? Moreover, haven't they ever heard of the Streisand effect? They just plucked this book from obscurity and straight into the headlines. What do you want to bet the publisher is already working on significantly increasing the size of the print run? Surely they must have someone with a brain who can explain to them what a terrible idea this is?

    46. Re:Is this really censorship? by ToasterMonkey · · Score: 0, Troll

      It is not up to you to decide what is sensitive or classified, and kept a secret from not only the public at large, but compartmentalized and kept a secret from any persons without a need to know.

      We have an elected panel of citizens who represent you and have the power to declassify things. Go talk to them.

    47. Re:Is this really censorship? by nacturation · · Score: 1

      Because you can't read the damned book. God.

      You also can't read my private diary, because I consulted with people that I wrote about and we mutually agreed not to publish it. OMG CENSORSHIP!!1!1!!one

      --
      Want to improve your Karma? Instead of "Post Anonymously", try the "Post Humously" option.
    48. Re:Is this really censorship? by russotto · · Score: 1

      Wait, you mean that asking an author to not print something, getting that author's agreement, and then paying for the printing cost of books that had the material the author agreed to remove is censorship?

      That depends. Did you put a gun to the author's head any time in this process? Threaten his livelihood or his family? Offer to imprison him if he failed to comply? If so, then YES, it damn well is censorship.

    49. Re:Is this really censorship? by Zixaphir · · Score: 2, Informative

      Damn right. You are "censoring" information you deem "inappropriate" for your audience. "Censorship is the suppression of speech or other communication which may be considered objectionable, harmful, sensitive, or inconvenient to the general body of people as determined by a government, media outlet, or other controlling body." "When a publisher comes under pressure to suppress a book, but has already entered into a contract with the author, they will sometimes effectively censor the book by deliberately ordering a small print run and making minimal, if any, attempts to publicize it. This practice became known in the early 2000s as privishing."

      --
      "Now I am become Death, the destroyer of worlds"
    50. Re:Is this really censorship? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "By not doing so, lives and missions are placed in jeopardy with little real benefit for society."

      If there were *real* risk to military lives and missions Army wouldn't need to restort to buying the book: it would wave laws with regards of national defense and warfare and they would simply have taken the book out of print if not menace with treason charges.

      The case that Army haven't gone that path is a clear indication that all damage is only on the PR side. And the PR side of a public entity is only damaged when there are things to be ashamed of. Is that simple.

    51. Re:Is this really censorship? by turbidostato · · Score: 2, Insightful

      "Wait, you mean that asking an author to not print something, getting that author's agreement, and then paying for the printing cost of books that had the material the author agreed to remove is censorship?"

      (the music from The Godfather sounds)
      I'll make him an offer he can't refuse.

    52. Re:Is this really censorship? by turbidostato · · Score: 1

      "Classified information is censorship?"

      Why, of course yes. Legally and socially accepted censorship, but censorship nevertheless.

      How else would you call at forcibly forbidding releasing info you are aware of?

    53. Re:Is this really censorship? by hairyfeet · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Personally I believe the only way forward is for ALL drugs to be legal, and here is why: I'm sorry if I don't get this quote right, or if I attribute it to the wrong person,(I believe it was from William F. Buckley Jr) but it really helped explain it simply..."If I put a bottle on a table with a skull and crossbones on it, and I say to you "This is poison, it will destroy your health, marriage, family, and finally kill you" and you push past me and down the bottle? STUPID YOU! Why should I have to saddle MY family and MY country with billions in debt and taxes to build cages and armed guards around that bottle?"

      As for TFA, frankly with the amount of pure bald faced lies we have seen coming from the military (we're winning? civilian deaths are low! the government there works!) I wouldn't trust them to tell me water was wet if it was raining on my head.If you want people to support you then you have to stop CONSTANTLY LYING. So until they do a 180 on their current SOP I'm gonna have to vote for them being lying scumbags and call this censorship. After all, if you go ahead and trust the person of has repeatedly lied to you over and over and over again, who is the fool?

      --
      ACs don't waste your time replying, your posts are never seen by me.
    54. Re:Is this really censorship? by 0111+1110 · · Score: 1

      Except all the interesting parts will be removed courtesy of Uncle Sam.

      --
      Quite an experience to live in fear, isn't it? That's what it is to be a slave.
    55. Re:Is this really censorship? by tacarat · · Score: 1

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sanitization_(classified_information)

      The entire book isn't that sensitive, just specific details, such as names. And again, they're just buying the unedited/sanitized version. Granted, that only applies if you care to believe the official story.

      --
      "Common sense will be the death of us all"
    56. Re:Is this really censorship? by tacarat · · Score: 1

      Honestly, I'd rather have drugs stay illegal (except maybe pot) and get legalized prostitution. Some drugs have a greater effect on one's free will than others. Society would benefit more from have Firefly's Inara than a $10 crackwhore in more ways than one.

      Nice response. I'm going to sit and soak in it for a bit.

      --
      "Common sense will be the death of us all"
    57. Re:Is this really censorship? by Anachragnome · · Score: 1

      "...There are procedures under the Freedom of Information Act to get it later on, like when revealing it will cause minimal damage (and probably just PR damage)...."

      Why wait?

      From the article:

      "And we do not control the fact that copies were disseminated prior to that second review process."

      I eagerly await a torrent. Please.

    58. Re:Is this really censorship? by digitalchinky · · Score: 4, Interesting

      I gather you don't really quite understand how society works. "Stupid You" if you take the drugs right? I think we both agree. But, how many stupids are there in the world? How many people exist that are too immature and not evolved enough to have the sense not to swallow the entire content? Who pays to clean up that mess? I can understand moderation - but our newspapers are littered with stories of people who don't do moderation.

      Which is cheaper - the army surrounding the bottle, or paying to have a support net to catch the stupid when they fall?

      For as long as I exist, I have to depend on others doing the right thing just to stay alive, all of us do. Mostly this works out pretty well given average life spans and such. You are honestly suggesting we legalize all drugs? No controls at all? What about the medical profession, prescriptions exist for good reason, far more than just limiting supply to drug users.

      I'll side with you as soon as you can eliminate society from your equation.

    59. Re:Is this really censorship? by anagama · · Score: 5, Interesting
      I was gonna mod you "flamebait" because there is no "FUCKING RETARD" option. Instead however, I'll respond to this:

      The book will still be publicly available after things like specific names and other sensitive bits of information get sanitized. By not doing so, lives and missions are placed in jeopardy with little real benefit for society.

      Our current state secrets regime is based on a Supreme Court case, United States v. Reynolds, which protected Boeing from revealing information regarding the deaths of three engineers in a plane crash because it would endanger national security. From the blurb for Claim of Privilege:

      But the Air Force, at the dawn of the Cold War, refused to hand over the accident reports and witness statements, claiming the documents contained classified information that would threaten national security. The case made its way up to the Supreme Court, which in 1953 sided with the Air Force in United States v. Reynolds. This landmark decision formally recognized the "state secrets" privilege, a legal precedent that has since been used to conceal conduct, withhold documents, block troublesome litigation, and, most recently, detain terror suspects without due-process protections.

      Even with the case closed, the families of those who died in the crash never stopped wondering what had happened in that B-29. They finally had their answer a half century later: In 2000 they learned that the government was now making available the top-secret information the families had sought long ago, in vain. The documents, it turned out, contained no national security secrets but rather a shocking chronicle of negligence.

      In other words, the very case that gave us the state secrets BS that Obama is latching on to harder than Bush II, was based on a COVERUP of NEGLIGENCE, not for any actual national security reasons. Boeing and the Air Force killed these smart geeks, and then LIED to protect their ass. That's what the state secrets doctrine is about -- it isn't about protecting anyone but the fuckwads ruining our country. Wake up already.

      You can also listen to the TAL report, it is the second story.

      --
      What changed under Obama? Nothing Good
    60. Re:Is this really censorship? by anagama · · Score: 1

      2nd edition is redacted. RTFA.

      --
      What changed under Obama? Nothing Good
    61. Re:Is this really censorship? by dryeo · · Score: 1

      According to the Constitution of the United States of America, having laws that classify stuff is illegal to begin with. See the first amendment which hasn't been amended to allow congress to pass laws stifling free speech.
      Also note that it would be easy to get an amendment passed allowing classifying sensitive information.

      --
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverted_totalitarianism
    62. Re:Is this really censorship? by NotQuiteReal · · Score: 1

      I did not RTFA, but if that is the case, they are probably not "buying" all the books (at retail), but rather paying to reprint the first run.

      I suspect re-printing 10,000 books is somewhat less than buying them at the MSRP.

      --
      This issue is a bit more complicated than you think.
    63. Re:Is this really censorship? by DavidTC · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Indeed, the 'state secret' privilege is an entire fraud, as is 95% of the stuff we have classified.

      The only thing the government should be able to keep secret are future or active military operations, still-living intelligent assets, and some stuff like military blueprints and things.

      There is no military operation older than a month in the past that should be kept secret. What, are our enemies using carrier snails? I think they've pretty much figured out what happened. All reports generated should be public, period.

      There will be moron who talk about classified 'tactics' and crap. They're lying. Our military has no secret skills that let them do things. Ask a soldier. There's stuff they don't want to talk about in advance, before the enemy figures out they can do it, but once you start doing things in a war, um, duh, the enemy knows it.

      No, the reason the military keeps operations secret is not a damn thing to do with tactics, which the enemy can figure out pretty easily. It's to do with the fact the military makes blunt statements about innocents getting killed, and, um, the public doesn't like that.

      Yes, the military would not, due to public pressure, be able to fight any recent wars if everything it did was open to the public...and that's a good thing. If the public doesn't like an action the government does, perhaps the government shouldn't fucking do it. Not speak vaguely about what it does and pretend everything is some huge important secret.

      Now, I'll agree that sometimes we do need to keep secrets that are outside that. For example, perhaps we have evidence some Russia diplomat is selling nuclear secrets to Iran, and the CIA shoots him. Well, okay, we don't want that public, okay. Not to keep it from Russia, who probably figured it out, but to keep it officially from Russia.

      But if there's something like that that does need to be kept secret, it should have to go through a fucking closed session of Congress and specifically be classified that way. No, not 'notify' half a dozen people, and threaten them if they tell anyone, the congress should actually vote on it, or decide to just tell everyone. Giving the damn branch of government, hell, the specific group that did it, the power to classify it, is utterly absurd. And it's doubly absurd to let them assert they have a right to keep it secret in court.

      Granted, this incident seems pretty reasonable. This isn't the government keeping anything secret, but working with a publisher and author to voluntarily keep information secret. The problem isn't the 'secret' stuff we hear about.

      --
      If corporations are people, aren't stockholders guilty of slavery?
    64. Re:Is this really censorship? by Doc+Ruby · · Score: 1

      Of course it is. Censorship is often legal.

      Censorship is simply the prevention of a speaker's words reaching a listener, without the agreement of either speaker or listener. Buying the speech without getting the speaker's agreement not to speak is censorship. It's a clever way to do it that doesn't include direct confrontation or exercise of power over either speaker or listener, but it's censorship.

      --

      --
      make install -not war

    65. Re:Is this really censorship? by rhook · · Score: 1

      All of "their" resources belong to the people.

    66. Re:Is this really censorship? by deapbluesea · · Score: 1

      Can you verify that the offending parts are offending?

      Does it matter? The author chose not to release those parts. If he felt that the information he was planning to release was vital, he could have published against the Pentagon's wishes, in which case, they would have had to get a court injunction to stop the publication. That would have then been censorship.

      Merely agreeing to rewrite portions and compensate the publisher's printing costs from a premature decision to print is more of an edit - unless you want to accuse all editors in the publication business of censorship as well.

      --
      Government is not reason; it is not eloquent; it is force. Like fire, it is a dangerous servant and a fearful master.
    67. Re:Is this really censorship? by amRadioHed · · Score: 1

      Which is cheaper - the army surrounding the bottle, or paying to have a support net to catch the stupid when they fall?

      Paying for the support net is obviously cheaper.

      --
      We hope your rules and wisdom choke you / Now we are one in everlasting peace
    68. Re:Is this really censorship? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yes?

    69. Re:Is this really censorship? by lamapper · · Score: 1

      It's their new open source data format, totally compatible with all operating systems and all applications. You can't read it until you pay your Microsoft tax.

      --
      Is your Internet Throttled? Install DD-Wrt, OpenWRT or Tomato to learn the truth! Google: 1Gbps/1Gbps: 5 Communities
    70. Re:Is this really censorship? by Mr2001 · · Score: 2, Insightful

      But, how many stupids are there in the world? How many people exist that are too immature and not evolved enough to have the sense not to swallow the entire content? Who pays to clean up that mess?

      The consumers can pay for it, by way of a tax on the drugs, like they already do for tobacco and alcohol.

      You are honestly suggesting we legalize all drugs? No controls at all?

      I'm not him, but I think that's the right idea. The problems caused by prohibition far outweigh the problems caused by the drugs themselves.

      What about the medical profession, prescriptions exist for good reason, far more than just limiting supply to drug users.

      Such as?

      I'm having a hard time thinking of a good reason to require prescriptions for anything except antibiotics (since improper use can create resistant strains).

      --
      Visual IRC: Fast. Powerful. Free.
    71. Re:Is this really censorship? by plague911 · · Score: 1

      dumb ass.... if you actually bothered to rtfa you would realize this is exactly like, revealing who our CIA agents are, with a name and photo. You just cant do that...you do NOT have the right to that info.. ...... dumb ass

    72. Re:Is this really censorship? by TubeSteak · · Score: 1

      Yes, it is called "voluntary" censorship, and worked very well for many years in the Soviet Union where famous authors would hide or modify their manuscripts for publishing.

      If you get a security clearance, the documents you sign stipulate that anything you want to publish is subject to review before it can be released to the public.

      And Soviet authors participated in "voluntary" censorship to the extent that they criticized their leadership & oligarchs anyways through extensive and satirical allegory that could pass the censors' review without diluting the message.

      --
      [Fuck Beta]
      o0t!
    73. Re:Is this really censorship? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      After all, if you go ahead and trust the person of has repeatedly lied to you over and over and over again, who is the fool?

      You would be referring to the parable of the Little Boy Who Cried "Wolf!"

      But I'm not sure exactly how it applies, since this is a case of a military insider writing a book about classified stuff. They didn't redact everything they should have (You're surprised the gov't screwed something up? REALLY?) and since the books had printed they decided to just buy them. The only alternative would be to order them destroyed and get sued by the publisher for the losses.

      The only thing fishy about this story (other than the summary, which is rotten) is that the military seems to be exercising an uncommon amount of Good Judgment.

    74. Re:Is this really censorship? by Mr.+Freeman · · Score: 1

      By definition, yes, classified information is censorship. However, keeping nuclear bomb designs secret is censorship in much the same way that a 16 year old kid with a girlfriend is a pedophile. Technically, preventing the release of ANY information is censorship.

      However, in this context we are OBVIOUSLY using the unofficial definition of censorship which is to prevent the release of information which cannot be justifiably concealed.
      You're making a bullshit semantic argument that adds nothing to the conversation. Go away.

      --
      -1 disagree is not a modifier for a reason. -1 troll, flaimbait, redundant, overrated are NOT acceptable substitutes.
    75. Re:Is this really censorship? by siddesu · · Score: 2, Informative

      If you get a security clearance, the documents you sign stipulate that anything you want to publish is subject to review before it can be released to the public.

      And if you had a "writer" clearance in the SU - a membership to the Writers' Union (a professional organization of writers there) - you'd sign documents that stipulated your work is subject to editorial review before it could be released to the public. It was considerably more difficult to get a book out "officially" without such membership.

      You can see how similar is this in form to what the Pentagon is doing. One difference is that publication money was never an issue, as the state was paying all the bills anyway. ;)

      And Soviet authors participated in "voluntary" censorship to the extent that they criticized their leadership & oligarchs anyways through extensive and satirical allegory that could pass the censors' review without diluting the message.

      First, there were no "oligarchs" in the Soviet era, there were Politburo members. The oligarchs are a new development.

      Second, satirical allegory, especially extensive one, was allowed (or passed censorship) on very rare occasions. Most censorship violations happened when unapproved books were distributed by Samizdat (self-publishing).

      Third, this is largely irrelevant to the question is voluntary censorship a censorship. I am not implying that censorship is necessarily bad, I am just answering GP's question with an example.

      So, is what the Pentagon is doing a form of censorship? Yes, it is, no doubt about it.

    76. Re:Is this really censorship? by nacturation · · Score: 1

      Thanks for the Wikipedia quotes, though I noticed you censored yourself from sharing where they came from. You are, of course, correct. People censor themselves hundreds of times every day because they "censor" information they deem "inappropriate" for the people they interact with. If they didn't, we'd have a society of sociopaths... people telling others to "hurry the fuck up" or "damn you're ugly" or "put down the pizza, you're far too fat already" or "I want to fuck your brains out". Censorship is necessary for society to function smoothly.

      --
      Want to improve your Karma? Instead of "Post Anonymously", try the "Post Humously" option.
    77. Re:Is this really censorship? by ultranova · · Score: 1

      For example, perhaps we have evidence some Russia diplomat is selling nuclear secrets to Iran, and the CIA shoots him.

      Wouldn't it make more sense to give the evidence to Russia and let them deal with him? Unless, of course, we exchange happened with Russia's blessing, in which case shooting the diplomat would be pointless, since Russia would simply use other people to continue.

      Well, okay, we don't want that public, okay. Not to keep it from Russia, who probably figured it out, but to keep it officially from Russia.

      Or you could declare it openly and officially. What is Russia going to do, nuke you?

      --

      Forget magic. Any technology distinguishable from divine power is insufficiently advanced.

    78. Re:Is this really censorship? by ZDRuX · · Score: 1

      STOP IT!! You're making too much sense!! The socialists and liberals don't understand this "logic" thing!!

      --
      The magical number is: 09 F9 11 02 9D 74 E3 5B D8 41 56 C5 63 56 88 C0
    79. Re:Is this really censorship? by bbtom · · Score: 1

      He doesn't even have to do that: sell all the print copies to the CIA (or whoever) and then make it available as a (paid-for) e-book. Good luck trying to buy up all the copies of an infinitely reproducible ePub or PDF or Kindle file!

      It is also a highly ineffective censorship technique: it only takes a few copies to get out into the hands of newspaper reviewers, bloggers or other people who might be able to lead public opinion for the public to demand a reprint. And since you can't copyright facts, if anyone gets a copy they can simply rewrite the facts (sort of like Wikipedia does) and republish those in a newspaper or online etc.

      Buying up all the copies can work in some limited domains: if you are a local politician who wants to keep a story under wraps, going out and buying all the copies of a local paper might be effective. But at the level of international politics and military affairs? Can't see it being effective except as a marketing technique ("OMG look the government are trying to censor it! Go buy it!") that has been used most effectively by the video game and movie industries.

      --
      catch (HumourFailureException e) { e.user.send("You, sir, are a humourless idiot."); }
    80. Re:Is this really censorship? by AG+the+other · · Score: 1

      Quick release it as a digital book. The author will make billions and it will bankrupt the Pentagon. Wait, that's not a good idea. Crap! This isn't going to work as well as I thought.

      --
      Non bene pro toto libertas venditur auro
    81. Re:Is this really censorship? by Phoghat · · Score: 1

      Made the guy a profit and spurred a second printing!

      --
      Think of how stupid the average person is, and realize half of them are stupider than that.
    82. Re:Is this really censorship? by Kevin108 · · Score: 1

      How many people exist that are too immature and not evolved enough to have the sense not to swallow the entire content?

      If the shit was legal, there would be dosages listed on the back of the plastic container it came in, just like any other OTC substance you can buy.

      --

      It's a perfect time for being wasted.
      A perfect time to watch the stars.
      - Burden Brothers, "Beautiful Night"
    83. Re:Is this really censorship? by geirlk · · Score: 1

      In Soviet Russia, the army buys _you_!

      It would probably be cheaper if the US army did so in this case. Allthough, further down the line you'd have a lot of entrepreneuring soldiers wanting to write books. Sure is better than the pension they'd receive.

    84. Re:Is this really censorship? by jc42 · · Score: 1

      In other words, the very case that gave us the state secrets BS that Obama is latching on to harder than Bush II, was based on a COVERUP of NEGLIGENCE, not for any actual national security reasons.

      So how's this a news story? Since at least the 1950s, it's been understood by anyone who can read that "National Security" is primarily used as an excuse for coverups like this. Most people I've known from anywhere else in the world says the same about their government's secrecy.

      A coverup should be the default inference whenever you read about anything being silenced for national security reasons. Yeah, there are occasional cases where there are actual security concerns. But those are relatively rare, while incompetence and malfeasance are common (in any organization, not just government). The biggest fear in any government is always that their own people will learn the details of what their government is up to. This is as true in democratic governments as in any others; they just have the additional problem of needing to maintain a public image so that people will keep voting for them.

      The funniest case I remember reading about was back in the 1970s (or maybe the late 1960s), when the US DoD funded a study by several university researchers of what could be learned about US military forces from public information sources. After a few months of studies, the researchers submitted their report, and according to numerous news sources within a day or two, it was given some sort of "Secret" classification. (Which level wasn't clear from the news stories.) This was all covered by an amused press. We all got a lot of laughs out of it. Nothing much changed.

      (I do wonder how much the publisher increased their print run when they realized that they could sell it all to the DoD? ;-)

      --
      Those who do study history are doomed to stand helplessly by while everyone else repeats it.
    85. Re:Is this really censorship? by Trailwalker · · Score: 2, Informative

      What about the medical profession, prescriptions exist for good reason, far more than just limiting supply to drug users.

      The "good reason" was part of the AMA's campaign to eliminate competition during the early 1900's.

      This long effort eliminated midwife home birthing in many states, prescriptions by pharmacists everywhere, and any other potential competition. Nothing like a monopoly to insure income.

      Medicine in a business like any other and their lobbyists in the AMA delivered.

      All under the guise of "professionalism" and think-of-the-lives-that-could-be-saved.

      Control of all drugs through prescriptions was just part of the campaign. What became Big Pharma was one of their major allies.

    86. Re:Is this really censorship? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      How many people exist that are too immature and not evolved enough to have the sense not to swallow the entire content?

      This is called natural selection -- those unfit to preserve their existence will remove themselves from the gene pool. It's not pretty, but it's logical and it's part of nature...

      Who pays to clean up that mess? I can understand moderation - but our newspapers are littered with stories of people who don't do moderation.

      What mess? If you mean who cleans up the dead people who overdose -- well we have that problem EVEN WITH drug prohibition -- people commit suicide all the time and people kill each other all the time.

      If you mean who cleans up for the stupid actions people take when they're under the influence of drugs -- THEY do. If you go out and assault someone, YOU pay for the consequences by spending time in jail and likely being fined. If you happen to be under the influence of a drug while you do that, YOU STILL should pay the same cost.

      Which is cheaper - the army surrounding the bottle, or paying to have a support net to catch the stupid when they fall?

      I think cleaning up after the actions of irresponsible drug users is much cheaper (we have to clean up for their actions ANYWAYS). The war on drugs cost almost $14 BILLION DOLLARS in 2009.

      Furthermore, if you look at countries that have very relaxed drug policies, you'll notice that they have much fewer drug addicts. Why is this? Because the forbidden fruit is much more tempting... Many countries in Europe have no enforced legal drinking age, and they have much less problems with excessive youth drinking than the United States does. In fact, most of the marijuana smokers in Amsterdam are tourists; the native residents don't even smoke that much marijuana!

      http://www.drugsense.org/wodclock.htm
      http://www.whitehousedrugpolicy.gov/publications/policy/09budget/index.html
      http://www2.potsdam.edu/hansondj/Controversies/1098894305.html

    87. Re:Is this really censorship? by commodore64_love · · Score: 1

      >>>This action by our nation's military is deeply troubling.

      Yes. We taxpayers are paying 10,000 * ~$25 == $25,000 so the Pentagon can hold a book burning. It's suppression of information and completely unacceptable. Also a waste of OUR money.

      --
      "I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it." - historian Evelyn Beatrice Hall
    88. Re:Is this really censorship? by DavidTC · · Score: 1

      Wouldn't it make more sense to give the evidence to Russia and let them deal with him?

      It is sometimes impossible for countries to do what they need to do for political reasons.

      Unless, of course, we exchange happened with Russia's blessing, in which case shooting the diplomat would be pointless, since Russia would simply use other people to continue.

      Well, not pointless. But at that point we'd semi-openly be at war with Russia, so we might as well admit it.

      Or you could declare it openly and officially. What is Russia going to do, nuke you?

      No, but internal political pressure could force them to remove support from you.

      I think you're reading too much into this example. I was just using this an example of one of the few covert ops we probably shouldn't declassify for five years or so....which we should have to classify via Congress, not just someone slapping a label on it.

      Under no circumstances should the people who made the decision, or carried it out, be in charge of if anyone knows about it. All incident reports or whatever the military and CIA calls them should be automatically be released two or three months later, with redacting of names only, unless Congress does something about it.

      What sort of covert ops are allowable or even a good idea is a different question.

      --
      If corporations are people, aren't stockholders guilty of slavery?
    89. Re:Is this really censorship? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Why do we need to catch them when they fall?

    90. Re:Is this really censorship? by chrb · · Score: 1

      how many stupids are there in the world? How many people exist that are too immature and not evolved enough to have the sense not to swallow the entire content? Who pays to clean up that mess?

      I would agree with you, if it weren't for the fact that alcohol is already legal. The Drug Harm Index lists alcohol at number 5, way ahead of the most restricted class A drugs like Ecstasy and LSD. Prohibition of alcohol was a failure. So the genie is out of the bottle... given that one of the most dangerous and addictive drugs is already legal, and that there is no realistic chance of it becoming illegal, then I don't see any reason to prosecute people for trading or consuming drugs that are less harmful.

    91. Re:Is this really censorship? by carp3_noct3m · · Score: 1

      I've been aware of this for quite some time, and will probably be getting the book anyway. What those of you new to the story are failing to understand, is that they are not just purging names. I agree the names should be purged, but in their press release (too lazy to go find it), they state they want to sanitize names, AMONG OTHER THINGS. This is the key here, using the chance they have to go ahead and take care of any other passages that are a little too embarrassing.... Ideally, I hope someone gets the original, redacts only the names, and then publishes it. Comon wikileaks, get on it.

      --
      "It's ok, I'm completely secure as long as my iron is off"
    92. Re:Is this really censorship? by Zixaphir · · Score: 1

      My entire point revolved around what is and isn't censorship, not about the advantages or consequences of censorship. We have agreed that the book has been censored, so I have no further comments.

      --
      "Now I am become Death, the destroyer of worlds"
    93. Re:Is this really censorship? by Pichu0102 · · Score: 1

      The issue is that they can't be sold immediately, it seems like.
      Why not store them under a confidential warehouse until the information is no longer relevant to the war efforts and would have little effect, then release them?

    94. Re:Is this really censorship? by Vegemeister · · Score: 1

      Well, it's not rot13 or any other substitution cipher.  The word length has a suspiciously small spread.

      Text Statistics
      Friedman IC:     1.0032
      Kappa-PT:        0.0386
      Words:           101
      Upper Case:      312
      Lower Case:      318
      Numbers:         0
      Spaces:          100
      Newlines:        0
      Symbols:         1
      Other:           0

    95. Re:Is this really censorship? by tacarat · · Score: 1

      But if there's something like that that does need to be kept secret, it should have to go through a fucking closed session of Congress and specifically be classified that way. No, not 'notify' half a dozen people, and threaten them if they tell anyone, the congress should actually vote on it, or decide to just tell everyone. Giving the damn branch of government, hell, the specific group that did it, the power to classify it, is utterly absurd. And it's doubly absurd to let them assert they have a right to keep it secret in court.

      Of all the posting responders so far, you're the only one that proposed an alternative to the current system of classifying information. A discussion on the pros/cons and implementation methods of it would be fun. I'd love to see how we'd keep the politicians from utilizing the information for their own benefits (geopolitical information could make them lots of money, not to mention "hot button" issues for election years). Somebody please mod DavidTC here up.

      --
      "Common sense will be the death of us all"
    96. Re:Is this really censorship? by tacarat · · Score: 1

      You did bring up an interesting point about the non-name items being removed. I overlooked that in the earlier post. I think some other stuff that might be taken out would be anything that indicates flaws in adversary security, maximum ranges on signal interception equipment and our mistakes that will point out what they're doing right.

      Hmm. Somebody please mod parent up. Thanks Carp.

      --
      "Common sense will be the death of us all"
    97. Re:Is this really censorship? by shermo · · Score: 1

      That's right, people can't be trusted to make sensible decisions and need to be protected from themselves.

      Sadly, I'm not sure if I'm being sarcastic.

      --
      Insanity: voting in the same two parties over and over again and expecting different results
    98. Re:Is this really censorship? by GameboyRMH · · Score: 1

      Hey don't give them any ideas, you know they'll try.

      --
      "When information is power, privacy is freedom" - Jah-Wren Ryel
    99. Re:Is this really censorship? by GrpA · · Score: 1

      Nice to see so few RTFA'ed... The book was cleared for publication and only after they printed it did some of the agencies involved dispute it. The second edition has been corrected and is underway, so no one is going to reprint the disputed version.

      That leaves 10,000 books that the publisher legally printed that the US army wants gone. They are negotiating to buy them all.

      At worst, it's negotiation ploy. If the book has a wholesale value of $10 and the publisher says "Hang on, these are worth more now" then they might be trying to up the bargain or incite others to buy them at inflated profit margins.

      Or it could be what it looks like. That they are just embarrassed about something they should have picked up earlier and are trying to fix it in the most acceptable way and that this is still good advertising for the second edition.

      That's what it looks like too...

      GrpA

      --
      Enjoy science fiction? "Turing Evolved" - AI, Mecha, Androids and rail-gun battles. What more could you want?
    100. Re:Is this really censorship? by FredFredrickson · · Score: 1

      Stop being levelheaded and rational. We don't like your kind around these parts!

      Now, where were we? Oh yes! GOV IS BUYING BOOKS WITH MY MONEY STOP ITTT!!!

      --
      Belief? Hope? Preference?The Existential Vortex
    101. Re:Is this really censorship? by bluefoxlucid · · Score: 1

      The new edition has many redactions and the first edition currently sells for around $1500

    102. Re:Is this really censorship? by bluefoxlucid · · Score: 1

      That depends. Typical americans are comfortable at a 5th grade reading level. I of course read standard American English at masters degree reading level (Stephen R. Donaldson's "Chronicles of Thomas covenant" series is favored by me for its reading level; "The Gap Cycle" for its amazing story content), and also can read British Adult-level fiction (which seems to be on a college reading level but with Britishisms).

    103. Re:Is this really censorship? by DavidTC · · Score: 1

      Ah, yes, it's the 'socialist and liberals' who think the military and executive branch aren't abusing 'national security' and 'states secret'.

      --
      If corporations are people, aren't stockholders guilty of slavery?
    104. Re:Is this really censorship? by Actually,+I+do+RTFA · · Score: 1

      But when the first printing sells out, the publisher is only going to print more.

      And the Army expects them to. From the article:

      The publisher asked the Army Reserve to review the book for information that they wanted to keep secret.

      Army Reserve said "looks good."

      Publisher prints 10,000 copies.

      DIA sees a copy after printing started, before release. Has issues that escalate through the Chain of Command.

      Army and publisher negotiate to remove some details from subsequent printings, and buy and destroy the first printing.

      --
      Your ad here. Ask me how!
  2. Founding Fathers do facepalm by 0111+1110 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I think our government should just abolish the first amendment. They clearly don't believe in it. This just makes me so sick. Where is wikileaks when you need them?

    --
    Quite an experience to live in fear, isn't it? That's what it is to be a slave.
    1. Re:Founding Fathers do facepalm by Delarth799 · · Score: 1

      Being interrogated and detained

    2. Re:Founding Fathers do facepalm by Ziest · · Score: 2, Interesting

      This government, I would not call it "ours", has not believed in the Constitution and the Bill of Rights since at least the late 60's. The peak of this country was some time in the early 80's. The downward spiral has begun.

      --
      Another day closer to redwood heaven
    3. Re:Founding Fathers do facepalm by Sarten-X · · Score: 5, Insightful

      The first amendment is irrelevant. From TFA, the military's attempting to keep hidden the real names of intelligence officers involved with some actions. Any criticism of the military actions is still likely in the second edition, which is already approved. The first amendment does not grant the right to endanger others by means of speech. It grants the right to hold and express any opinions you want, and Congress will not render such expression illegal.

      --
      You do not have a moral or legal right to do absolutely anything you want.
    4. Re:Founding Fathers do facepalm by offrdbandit · · Score: 1

      Spoken like someone who doesn't understand the purpose of the Constitution...

      You seem to think the Constitution exists IN SPITE of the government, but to the contrary it exists BECAUSE governments (of all types) push the boundaries and strive for more power.

    5. Re:Founding Fathers do facepalm by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The US government is busy calling Assange and Manning Homosexuals, I suppose they have their calendars off by 60 years

    6. Re:Founding Fathers do facepalm by perpenso · · Score: 4, Informative

      I think our government should just abolish the first amendment. They clearly don't believe in it. This just makes me so sick. Where is wikileaks when you need them?

      The author is a vet and had the military review the book. After publishing someone thought something had erroneously been left in. The author and publisher are cooperating, a new version is already being printed without the part in question. Buying the first printing of books may be the simplest way to deal with them. The military reviewers goofed not the publisher so the publisher should not suffer any loss. Given that the author and publisher do not want to reveal anything sensitive and are cooperating with the government I don't see censorship. Censorship is when someone wants to publish and is prohibited, not when someones says is all this ok with you ... no ... ok lets edit.

    7. Re:Founding Fathers do facepalm by sumdumass · · Score: 5, Interesting

      Your history is a little too molested for my taste. the real destruction of the US constitution started during the civil war time and really became institutionalized during FDR. You are at minimum 100 years off and generalship at least 30 years off the most noticeable disregard of it.

      FDR said at a speech that the government shouldn't be involved welfare or social issues two years before he was elected president. He then did did an about face and trampled all over it. In 1930 FDR said:

      As a matter of fact and law, the governing rights of the States are all of those which have not been
      surrendered to the National Government by the Constitution or its amendments. Wisely or unwisely,
      people know that under the Eighteenth Amendment Congress has been given the right to legislate on this particular subject, but this is not the case in the matter of a great number of other vital problems of government, such as the conduct of public utilities, of banks, of insurance, of business, of agriculture, of education, of social welfare and of a dozen other important features. In these, Washington must not be encouraged to interfere.

      This s[eech was given considering the Volstead Act. He states that he knows they need a constitutional amendment in order to act on matters of the conduct of public utilities, of banks, of insurance, of business, of agriculture, of education, of social welfare and of a dozen other important features. Yet he totally ignores that two year later as president, creates a standoff with the supreme court in which they ended up backing down and bending the interstate commerce clause in order to save face, and this was the biggest disregard for the constitution by the government in recent times and it's still being conducted to this day. Why you just now think it's happening is a mystery to me. but it still happening is not surprising at all seeing how when you allow one infraction, others will follow.

    8. Re:Founding Fathers do facepalm by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      actually it is still censorship in this case ... he is likely cooperating to make his life easy.

      Having to submit the book to the military before publishing is pretty much by definition censorship

    9. Re:Founding Fathers do facepalm by theCzechGuy · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Nope, the "editing" is still censorship. There are many forms of censorship and reasons to do it, but the fact there is some kind of censorship in most states, even those that are supposed to be democratic. After all, the communists didn't prevent most authors and journalists from publishing, they just asserted the right to say what is ok and what isn't. And when it wasn't, there was editing. Yet saying the communist didn't censor the newspapers that were published is a little bit of a stretch. Like many thing the problem of censorship is not a black and white thing and there is no clearly visible line that has the freedom and law on one side and the orwellian nightmare on the other.

    10. Re:Founding Fathers do facepalm by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      actually it is still censorship in this case ... he is likely cooperating to make his life easy. Having to submit the book to the military before publishing is pretty much by definition censorship

      No, he's cooperating because he does not want to endanger anyone and the "experts" he relied upon for review came back and said they made a mistake. When you are cooperating with the military to write your book and relying upon them for expert review situations like this are not censorship. There does not seem to be anything the author wants to publish and is being told not to, he is relying upon and agreeing with the experts.

    11. Re:Founding Fathers do facepalm by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Wikileaks is busy getting accused of raping & murdering Glenn Beck.

      Is it censorship when they buy the entire first printing? Sounds like capitalism to me. It's censorship if they force the book from ever appearing on the shelves. I'm not censoring anything if I go around & buy up every single newspaper in a 5 mile radius of my home- I'm contributing to the local economy.

    12. Re:Founding Fathers do facepalm by hedwards · · Score: 1

      It's mostly on account of "American exceptionalism" it's as rank and disgusting in the US as exceptionalism is in other places like Israel. Anybody that points out that we're not the best at something, used to be better at it or that we could be better at it is shouted down as un-American.

    13. Re:Founding Fathers do facepalm by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Funny

      What are you doing posting such a sensible, truthful response on /.?

    14. Re:Founding Fathers do facepalm by tomhudson · · Score: 3, Insightful
      Is it censorship? Yes.
      Do you want someone killed because someone else screwed up in a cooperative deal that was supposed to prevent this? No.

      Not all censorship is created equal.
      We don't publish the names of children who are victims of sexual abuse.
      Is that censorship? Yes. Is it wrong? No.

      We don't publish the names of rape victims.
      Is that censorship? Yes. Is it wrong? No.

      We don't publish the names of stalking victims.
      Is that censorship? Yes. Is it wrong? No.

      We don't publish your credit card info all over the net (hopefully)
      Is that censorship? Yes. Is it wrong? No.

      We may disagree on the standard for reasonableness, but some things really don't need to be "out there".

      We practice censorship all the time.
      I won't watch "Silence of the Lambs" because I walked in on the scene where some guy is hunched over a sewing machine.
      "What's he doing?"
      "Making a woman suit."
      "A what?"
      "He killed these women, skinned them, and now he's ..."
      "Bye!"

      For me, that's not entertainment. For someone else, it is. And after hopping over to Wikipedia and reading the plot summary, I don't think I missed anything.

      Adults can decide to watch it, but I think we'd agree that children below a certain age (as determined by their parents) shouldn't watch stuff like that, without triggering the "think of the children" or "censorship" alarms.

    15. Re:Founding Fathers do facepalm by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "The first amendment does not grant the right to endanger others by means of speech. It grants the right to hold and express any opinions you want, and Congress will not render such expression illegal."

        Then lets hang the guy who outed Valerie Plame for treason.

    16. Re:Founding Fathers do facepalm by perpenso · · Score: 1

      ... they just asserted the right to say what is ok and what isn't ...

      That's the issue here. I don't see the military asserting any right in this second printing edit. Asserting a right is a unilateral action, its using force in some manner. In this case both sides agree. This isn't wikileaks, this is a military guy relying on the military to help him avoid releasing sensitive information. I agree the censorship line can be fuzzy but this case seems to fall short of even the fuzzy line.

    17. Re:Founding Fathers do facepalm by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

      I think you mean harassing young swedish women, don't you?

    18. Re:Founding Fathers do facepalm by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Agree on your assessment.

      This is the best solution for this problem. Rather than the big bad government telling the printer to destroy all copies and the printers expense.

    19. Re:Founding Fathers do facepalm by perpenso · · Score: 1

      We don't publish the names of rape victims. Is that censorship? Yes. Is it wrong? No.

      Using your logic every time an author decides to omit a piece of information he deems more harmful than informative an act of censorship is being committed. Such a definition so broadens (or perhaps dilutes) the definition of censorship that the word becomes virtually meaningless.

      If an author withholds the name of a rape victim because the law requires him to do so it is censorship. If the author withholds the name because he believe it is the right thing to do that is not censorship.

    20. Re:Founding Fathers do facepalm by Totenglocke · · Score: 3, Informative

      The downward spiral began with Lincoln violating the Constitution and starting a war to prevent people from peacefully leaving the US. I have an old Lit. book from college with personal letters in it written by Lincoln - there's one where he writes to the Confederate leaders and in very plain terms says that he's ok with letting them keep slaves as long as they rejoined the US and acknowledged his supreme power - if they refused to bow before him, he would destroy them. Then once FDR came to power and violated just about every last inch of the Constitution.........but I just expanded a comment below and saw that he goes into FDR, so I'll stop there.

      --
      "The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." ~Thomas Jefferson
    21. Re:Founding Fathers do facepalm by Totenglocke · · Score: 1

      The first amendment does not grant the right to endanger others by means of speech.

      I guess I missed that part in the first amendment where it says "This does not include factual information that the government doesn't want you to tell people". Any time a person's name is mention in a book / interview / tv, that person is "in danger" of someone who doesn't like them using that to locate and harm them. Unless you suggest we ban biographies and using real names and faces in interviews, that's a hypocritical stance to take.

      --
      "The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." ~Thomas Jefferson
    22. Re:Founding Fathers do facepalm by _Sprocket_ · · Score: 1

      Where is wikileaks when you need them?

      Wikileaks does self-promotion; they don't promote other people's works. Meanwhile, this book will (obviously) sell out it's first edition and get a huge boost in sales over the second printing due to the surrounding "controversy." The author might even get an additional air of legitimacy as word-of-mouth will be that this is the book the US Government tried to keep us from reading.

    23. Re:Founding Fathers do facepalm by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If my mail is censored, and I willingly send mail despite this, does this mean that it's not being censored?

    24. Re:Founding Fathers do facepalm by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If my mail is censored, and I willingly send mail despite this, does this mean that it's not being censored?

      If you edited your own mail because on a second analysis something was not appropriate then it is not censorship.

    25. Re:Founding Fathers do facepalm by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      All your books are belong to us.

    26. Re:Founding Fathers do facepalm by tomhudson · · Score: 1

      We don't publish the names of rape victims. Is that censorship? Yes. Is it wrong? No.

      Using your logic every time an author decides to omit a piece of information he deems more harmful than informative an act of censorship is being committed. Such a definition so broadens (or perhaps dilutes) the definition of censorship that the word becomes virtually meaningless.

      If an author withholds the name of a rape victim because the law requires him to do so it is censorship. If the author withholds the name because he believe it is the right thing to do that is not censorship.

      A court-ordered publication ban is something that a writer ignores at his or her own peril. Is it censorship? Yes. Is it wrong? No.

    27. Re:Founding Fathers do facepalm by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Names weren't the ONLY items the DIA and CIA had issue with. I'm so glad you mentioned that.

      You seem to be riding the wikileaks commenting wave of 'named personnel' being the story, rather than operational content of the war being attrituable to the entire picture.

      Thank you for conntinuing the decreased level of discourse here on Slashdot. That you are at +5 Insightful as I post this, confirms my continued suspicions of this forum.

    28. Re:Founding Fathers do facepalm by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "And after hopping over to Wikipedia and reading the plot summary, I don't think I missed anything."

      Way off topic, but you missed some of the most spectacular theatrical performances in the history of film-making.

    29. Re:Founding Fathers do facepalm by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      the military politicos always use this bullshit reason to justify silencing people they dont like the sound of. considering their immature behavior regarding wikileaks, it's hard not to take this position.

    30. Re:Founding Fathers do facepalm by tomhudson · · Score: 1
      I'd rather watch something that makes me laugh than something that grosses me out.

      I appreciate that it may have been "some of the most spectacular theatrical performances", but I am not going to watch a movie that uses skinning women alive as a "plot device."

      I don't know what it is, but we seem to be going along a trend where we want more shock, for cheap effect. Example, a couple of nights ago, I turned on the tv and the show's intro has a woman park in the driveway at night, and the remote won't open the garage door. So she unlocks the front door, goes back to the car to get her sleeping kid out of the back seat, and walks back to the front of the house. The front door, which had only been slightly ajar, is now open wider, but it's still dark inside the house.

      Sorry, but I find this sort of thing a turn-off. I'm sure many women do, or worse, have just become so desensitized from the over-exposure that when violence happens in real life, they just accept it as inevitable.

      I'd rather watch Spaceballs again, or go read a book. Make me laugh instead. I'll enjoy it more, and sleep better.

    31. Re:Founding Fathers do facepalm by TheVelvetFlamebait · · Score: 1

      Where in the US constitution, let alone the first amendment, does it prevent the US government from buying books?

      I suppose any government power not explicitly granted by the constitution is unconstitutional, so I suppose the onus is on me to find where they are granted the power to buy books. ;-)

      --
      You know, there is a difference between trolling and pointing out the flaws in your reasoning. Just saying.
    32. Re:Founding Fathers do facepalm by garyebickford · · Score: 1

      The only man my father disliked worse than FDR was Kennedy, scion of a smuggler, stock fraudster and tax cheat who bought the Presidency (with the help of the Chicago Mafia) for his son. After the Supreme Court shot down some of his more egregious acts, FDR tried to pack the Court with enough 'friendly' members to get what he wanted.

      As my dad told me, we officially lost sovereignty under FDR - prior to him, a person could actually own land. But legally after FDR the government is organized as a corporation, and owns it all. When you 'buy land' you are really just purchasing a license to use it that can be revoked at any time. The only limitation is that which the government imposes on itself, which can be revoked on a moments notice, for instance if it is 'needed for national security'. But the following poster about the Whiskey Rebellion also rings true :)

      --
      It's easier to be a result of the past, but more fun to be a cause of the future! http://www.spacefinancegroup.com/
    33. Re:Founding Fathers do facepalm by Sycraft-fu · · Score: 5, Informative

      Something I think many forget, or never know is that part of a security clearance is a non-disclosure agreement. You agree not to disclose classified material. It is as binding as any other NDA, and in fact has criminal penalties behind it. Now that doesn't mean you can never talk about anything. Things get declassified, after long enough passes this tends to happen by default (50 years usually).

      However it does mean that you have to be careful what you disclose. In general, the government works with people in this regard. You want to write a book about something that is legal for you to disclose, they'll review it to make sure nothing goes in there that shouldn't. In this case, it sounds like the events can be talked about, but not the names. Makes sense.

      What happened here is that it got missed somehow. They noticed they missed it, but to until after the printing run was done. So "mea cupla," they ask the author to change it, and teh publisher to do another run. However the first run is still done, the money spent. So they buy it up. Now everyone is happy.

    34. Re:Founding Fathers do facepalm by Sarten-X · · Score: 2, Interesting

      For that, you'll have to look at the Espionage Act, and its amendments in the Sedition act. In summary, it's illegal to aid groups the American government has declared to be enemies.

      I'm afraid I don't remember the details involved (coincidence, I swear), but I seem to remember a biographical book a few years ago causing quite a ruckus, as it indicated that an elected official (in California, I think) had a relationship with a prostitute. It turned out to be false, but the guy's career was ruined. Similar stories abound for abortion clinic doctors. It seems having a real identity in the public spotlight is indeed a risk.

      Relatedly, this is why so many fictional works have the disclaimer that "any relation to actual persons, living or dead, is entirely coincidental." Being responsible about others' lives does not have to get in the way of telling a story.

      --
      You do not have a moral or legal right to do absolutely anything you want.
    35. Re:Founding Fathers do facepalm by bcrowell · · Score: 1

      >>>The first amendment does not grant the right to endanger others by means of speech.

      >>I guess I missed that part in the first amendment where it says "This does not include factual information that the government doesn't want you to tell people".

      >For that, you'll have to look at the Espionage Act, and its amendments in the Sedition act. In summary, it's illegal to aid groups the American government has declared to be enemies.

      Er, I guess I missed the day in civics class when we learned that an *act* of congress could override the bill of rights.

      There are certain specific exceptions to freedom of speech, including slander, libel, fighting words, and yelling "fire" in a crowded theater. There is no exception for anything as broad as cases where you "endanger others." If there was an exception that broad, then I could have my book suppressed because it advocated having anonymous sex without a condom.

    36. Re:Founding Fathers do facepalm by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The first amendment does not grant anyone a right. It protects a right that a person already has. Read the constitution again.

    37. Re:Founding Fathers do facepalm by theCzechGuy · · Score: 1

      Like I said, there's no line and with all respect, I think you're still trying to draw it. Keep in mind there are even such things as self censorship and soft censorship. It doesn't matter how you dress it up or what reason you have for doing it, censorship is censorship. You don't see the military asserting any right in the second edition, because that's the one that has all the unwanted bits already taken out.

      Note that I not condemning it or making any assertion about its morality.

    38. Re:Founding Fathers do facepalm by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I was with you at first, then you started ranting about a movie you've never even seen and closing with a lame "for the children"

    39. Re:Founding Fathers do facepalm by sp3d2orbit · · Score: 1

      The history of the destruction of the constitution predates FDR and the Civil War. I'm not disagreeing with anything you say. But I would like to point out that the first infraction was Thomas Jefferson himself. His deal for the Louisiana Purchase was 1) not supported by the constitution, and 2) contrary to his own beliefs in "strict constructionism". Before this there were two camps: those who said the government had only the rights laid out in the constitution (strict constructionists) and those who believed the government had all rights not specifically forbidden by the constitution. Thomas Jefferson did not have the moral authority to both support the constitution's most strict interpretation AND buy Louisiana.

      I blame Southerners (Confederates) for destroying the rest of the constitution. Before 1865 there was a gentle balance between states rights and federal rights with states given deference in accordance with amendments 9 and 10. The lecherous confederates (I do live in the South) screwed everything up for the rest of us by insisting on holding onto slavery. Faced with the choice between slavery and the 9th/10th amendments most reasonable people sided with the Federal government and the rest was history. States rights don't exist anymore because of stupid fucking rednecks who couldn't act in a way that tolerable the rest of civilization. If the battle had come down to health care, or drug laws, or basically any other issue except slavery we would still have the 9th and 10th amendments. If I haven't said it before, fuck Confederates.

      I don't hold on too much hope for state rights making a resurgence, thanks to my home state of Arizona. We are seeing again people hold onto unreasonable demands (the right it ID anyone anytime) and hiding behind state rights. Normal, educated people will never side with this totalitarian approach and, in time, more state rights will be destroyed by angry racists.

    40. Re:Founding Fathers do facepalm by perpenso · · Score: 1

      Like I said, there's no line and with all respect, I think you're still trying to draw it. Keep in mind there are even such things as self censorship and soft censorship.

      I think English is an imprecise language and that "censor" is an overloaded word with multiple meanings. The topic of this thread was government sponsored censorship, self censorship is something entirely different. "Homicide" is another overloaded word. Would you equate all forms of homicide, say murder and self defense, simply because the end result is the same? Would you refer to someone who acted in self defense by saying "he committed homicide"? I doubt it, without a context people tend to assume the most severe interpretation of the word. Similar story with "censorship", using "censorship" rather than "self censorship" is quite misleading.

      It doesn't matter how you dress it up or what reason you have for doing it, censorship is censorship. You don't see the military asserting any right in the second edition, because that's the one that has all the unwanted bits already taken out. Note that I not condemning it or making any assertion about its morality.

      Sorry, I phrased that poorly. I meant that I don't see the military asserting any right resulting in or necessitating the second printing.

    41. Re:Founding Fathers do facepalm by Coryoth · · Score: 1

      The downward spiral began with Lincoln violating the Constitution and starting a war to prevent people from peacefully leaving the US.

      The downward spiral began with Jefferson violating the Constitution and purchasing Louisiana from the French when the constitution gave no provision for such actions. President's all throughout history violated strict readings of the constitution whenever it was expedient. Yes, in principle they needed to get a constitutional amendment passed; in practice that was either infeasible,or would have taken to long for the problem at hand (Jefferson's Louisiana purchase being a fine example, FDR's New Deal being pushed through when it became necessary is another). Ultimately this is a weakness of the constitution -- what the correct fix is, I am not sure, but let's be honest enough to admit that Presidents of all stripes have had to work around, ignore, or nibble away at the consitution for all sorts of reasons.

    42. Re:Founding Fathers do facepalm by Sarten-X · · Score: 1

      I guess you did miss it. As a quick review, acts of Congress become laws. The first amendment to the Constitution specifically limits the powers of Congress. The judicial branch of government is charged with determining if a given law is in line with the restrictions in the Constitution.

      The relevant details are in the case Brandenburg v. Ohio, which held that the Espionage Act can indeed limit speech if that speech is likely to result in "imminent lawless action", the precise definition of which has not been declared. In fact, the Brandenburg case modifies the ruling of Schenck v. United States, which is where the common example of 'yelling "fire" in a crowded theater' comes from.

      In short, it's not the act of placing others at risk that's the problem, but creating a situation that's likely to lead to illegal action. Releasing the names and details of intelligence officers puts them at risk of murder, which is illegal everywhere I know of. Sorry for the lack of clarity.

      --
      You do not have a moral or legal right to do absolutely anything you want.
    43. Re:Founding Fathers do facepalm by Sarten-X · · Score: 1

      s/grant/guarantee/g

      --
      You do not have a moral or legal right to do absolutely anything you want.
    44. Re:Founding Fathers do facepalm by tomhudson · · Score: 1
      I walked in on the sewing machine part. It grossed me out, the idea of some guy skinning women alive. You like that sort of thing, well, all I can say is that it must be a guy thing.

      As for the "for the children" - I said "I think we'd agree that children below a certain age (as determined by their parents) shouldn't watch stuff like that". Are you saying that parents should not have the right to decide what is appropriate for them to watch in the home? Who would you give that power to decide to?

      The problem isn't just that it might give them nightmares - too much exposure will also tend to desensitize them to it. Violent killings and rapes are something that should horrify. It's not entertainment in and of itself.

    45. Re:Founding Fathers do facepalm by azmodean+1 · · Score: 1

      Adults can decide to watch it, but I think we'd agree that children below a certain age (as determined by their parents) shouldn't watch stuff like that, without triggering the "think of the children" or "censorship" alarms.

      The problem with this is that you are not describing what is generally referred to as censorship. What you are describing is parents controlling what their children are exposed to, which I think shouldn't be interfered with, and should likely even be promoted, such as by legislation of means that parents can use to control access to content.

      The implementation that we have of this concept though, is that the broadcast of "potentially offensive" material is chilled by the levying of heavy fines against the broadcaster, (this includes television, movies, books, and probably other formats that don't spring to mind as readily) instead of providing parents with effective means of controlling access to the content. THAT is what is generally referred to as censorship, and what I have zero tolerance for. The problem is that when the government steps in to protect "the children" or anyone else, they tend to "protect" everyone equally, most of which neither want nor need their "protection".

  3. Where have I heard this before? by gman003 · · Score: 1, Insightful

    Didn't the Church of Scientology do something similar to this once?

    1. Re:Where have I heard this before? by muuh-gnu · · Score: 2, Informative

      They sent out their minions to buy up Hubbard books in order to artificially push them into the charts.

      Maybe the Pentagon is trying something similar here? ;)

    2. Re:Where have I heard this before? by Mikkeles · · Score: 1

      Sure, and a Florida pastor was recently trying to make a start in doing the same to the Koran.

      --
      Great minds think alike; fools seldom differ.
    3. Re:Where have I heard this before? by Lehk228 · · Score: 1

      that "pastor" is a cult leader, his students are forbidden from seeing their family without special permission and death in the family is not an exception to this rule.

      --
      Snowden and Manning are heroes.
  4. Kindle Version by virtigex · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Maybe he should also publish a Kindle version. The author could really clean up then.

    1. Re:Kindle Version by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      definitive Streisand effect.

    2. Re:Kindle Version by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Obligatory xkcd

    3. Re:Kindle Version by danwesnor · · Score: 2, Funny

      Wouldn't the Pentagon just buy up all the Kindles and burn them?

    4. Re:Kindle Version by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I hear they make good kindling.

    5. Re:Kindle Version by TheGratefulNet · · Score: 1

      kindle-nacht?

      (sorry. really, I am).

      --

      --
      "It is now safe to switch off your computer."
    6. Re:Kindle Version by Sparx139 · · Score: 1
      --
      Our culture doesn't get smarter, it just finds new ways of being retarded.
  5. So.. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Isn't this like a license to print money? Just make another edition and pentagon is guaranteed to buy it all up?

  6. Don't bother, it will be on Wikileaks eventually. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    that's what SHE said

  7. Here's what he should do by Pojut · · Score: 1

    He should have a copy transcribed, and release it in a torrent.

    1. Re:Here's what he should do by couchslug · · Score: 1

      "He should have a copy transcribed, and release it in a torrent."

      Government employees, military and civilian, are subject to NDA regarding classified information. Naming names is desirable to those who want to expose everyone involved in classified ops, but not necessarily required for the public to be entertained.

      --
      "This post is an artistic work of fiction and falsehood. Only a fool would take anything posted here as fact."
    2. Re:Here's what he should do by Totenglocke · · Score: 0

      Government employees, military and civilian, are subject to NDA regarding classified information.

      I love every time that this is pointed out. It shows what a joke the myth of "government of / by the people" is.

      --
      "The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." ~Thomas Jefferson
    3. Re:Here's what he should do by ArundelCastle · · Score: 1

      He should have a copy transcribed, and release it in a torrent.

      Hold up, you might be going for +funny, but did you just mean to imply that the author wrote his drafts on paper? Or that the publisher used a letter press?
      I realize some seasoned authors like to use a typewriter from time to time. But I can't imagine a publishing house that would not be doing digital typesetting in 2010.

  8. They are going to run out of money... by solidhen · · Score: 1

    or the world is going to run out of trees. The publisher can just keep doing new print runs forever. If I were the author I would love this. Besides you can't really get better PR then this.

    --
    Some things are more important than an animated rat
  9. If the Author really wants to get his story out... by willyd357 · · Score: 1

    ...he'll release the book in digital form. Good luck buying up all the copies of that.

  10. Ignorance: America's biggest gift to itself. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    So we go from burning Korans to burning military memoirs.

    America may be a bastion of free speech, but when we lack the ability to openly discuss things with every last bit of information at hand, we become blinded by ignorance. The government would not be helping itself in this instance - they would merely be strengthening the appearance of being censors and spreaders of ignorance, doubt, and fear.

    1. Re:Ignorance: America's biggest gift to itself. by Americano · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I'm sorry, before I can take your post seriously, I require full disclosure, in the form of all of your personal information, Anonymous Coward.

      Please submit it for open discussion, and then we can continue talking about how the only way to discuss anything is with all information being freely available to the public.

      I mean, fair is fair, right?

    2. Re:Ignorance: America's biggest gift to itself. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I'm sorry, before I can take your post seriously, I require full disclosure, in the form of all of your personal information, Anonymous Coward.

      Please submit it for open discussion, and then we can continue talking about how the only way to discuss anything is with all information being freely available to the public.

      I mean, fair is fair, right?

      Sure thing, as long as the government (and companies, etc.) does it at the same time too.

      Otherwise my personal details could be used against me - without me having a fair chance to prove any act of discrimination, retaliation, etc.

      I want to be able to review the activities of all elected officials as well: whom they met with, why did they meet, what was said. Same deal for aides of elected officials. I'd like to see all bank account details of them as well.

      I'd also like CCTV to be installed at known crime spots: i.e. I'd like a public CCTV installed above the doors of elected officials, with annotations about who went in and out.

      I mean, fair is fair, right?

    3. Re:Ignorance: America's biggest gift to itself. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      but when we lack the ability to openly discuss things with every last bit of information at hand, we become blinded by ignorance.

      Very true, those words of yours.

      For example, in your case you obviously lack the ability to click the link to the actual article, and instead post a knee-jerk reaction based off a bad summary. Why, if you HAD the ability to click the link, you probably wouldn't have made such a dumbass comment about the military burning books and attempting to compare it on the same level to some asshat bigot and his 'church'.

    4. Re:Ignorance: America's biggest gift to itself. by Americano · · Score: 1

      Well then, I'd say it looks like a Mexican Standoff, but you're unarmed.

      Here's the funny thing: even if you had all that info, you'd never be able to go through it all in any sort of timely fashion, meaning that your information age would experience ever-increasing lag ("HE BROKE THE LAW 10 years ago - we just got around to reviewing that information!"), or you'd simply give up on trying to parse the fire-hose of information you've directed at yourself, and instead start believing whichever news source confirms your biases for you and allows you, in the words of JFK, "the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought."

      One of these scenarios has already happened. I'll let you guess which.

  11. Feudal America by ductonius · · Score: 0, Flamebait

    What America's aristocracy cannot do with the law they will do with money.

    1. Re:Feudal America by Steeltoe · · Score: 1

      Correction: ...they will do with _your_ money.

  12. Blurb totally misleading. by Jartan · · Score: 5, Informative

    The blurb is intentionally misleading here. The govt gave the OK for the book but then upon a later review they were worried about some names released and a 2nd printing has already been agreed upon by both parties. They are just deciding what to do with 10k books that were already printed. Obviously the publisher spent money to already print them so they aren't going to just destroy them.

    1. Re:Blurb totally misleading. by BlakJak-ZL1VMF · · Score: 5, Insightful

      mod parent up, case dismissed, nothing to see here, move along...

      misleading blurbs FTL.

      --
      -.-. --.-
    2. Re:Blurb totally misleading. by Nailer235 · · Score: 2, Insightful

      No kidding, let's not become the Fox News of the internet.

    3. Re:Blurb totally misleading. by bjourne · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Since when does publishers have to get OK from the government on what to print? The freedom of the press guarantees that the government will not interfere in publishers work. Then, if, after the fact, they find that something libelous or damaging has been printed, they can take action. But not before that. That is censorship.

    4. Re:Blurb totally misleading. by 0123456 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Don't US officers have to agree to let the military vet any books about their experiences if they want the job?

    5. Re:Blurb totally misleading. by Sarten-X · · Score: 0

      First, you're missing a little thing called "courtesy". It doesn't really matter to the publisher if the book has real names or not, but the military potentially has a lot of security to lose. Getting approval is the responsible thing to do.

      Second, there's the whole issue of national security. Leaking classified information is a crime, so the military has processes in place for publishers to make sure they're clear of any problems. The book passed a quick review, but then the government got worried. There's no way to force the publisher to destroy them, so the Pentagon is resorting to the normal civilian system called "commerce".

      It's not a big deal.

      --
      You do not have a moral or legal right to do absolutely anything you want.
    6. Re:Blurb totally misleading. by Aladrin · · Score: 2, Informative

      "agreed upon by both parties"

      Maybe you missed that bit. It's not government forcing anything. The publisher agreed to it. The government made a reasonable request and was willing to compensate the publisher for their trouble, and everything is fine. The 2nd version will be printed and anyone can buy it.

      --
      "If you make people think they're thinking, they'll love you; But if you really make them think, they'll hate you." - DM
    7. Re:Blurb totally misleading. by Trepidity · · Score: 1

      The publisher probably can't be prosecuted (which is one reason they're being paid off instead, probably), but ex-intelligence officials do need permission to publish about their work. When accepting employment, they sign a contract agreeing to run any future publications about their work by the Publication Review Board for prepublication clearance.

      The Supreme Court upheld that arrangement in 1980 in Snepp v. US , in a short 6-3 per curiam opinion. It's a strange opinion, because this sort of thing usually isn't permitted, but the Court was probably swayed by the "CIA stuff is important / national security / etc.".

      Note that it does only apply to actual CIA employees. A non-CIA-employee author who's acquired information through leaks and interviews doesn't need the CIA's permission to publish his book.

    8. Re:Blurb totally misleading. by deapbluesea · · Score: 1

      Again, RTFA. There is a DoD regulation requiring that members of the DoD get approval prior to publishing manuscripts based on their job. The author did so, but only through the Army Reserve, not the Pentagon. The Reserve should have forwarded this up, but didn't, so the first run printing happened based on a SNAFU at the Reserve HQ and now the Pentagon is going to have to pay for it since the Reserves belong to them.

      --
      Government is not reason; it is not eloquent; it is force. Like fire, it is a dangerous servant and a fearful master.
    9. Re:Blurb totally misleading. by cdrguru · · Score: 1

      Comes with being in the military. I believe as an officer you have to pretty much sign a statement saying you give the military approval of anything you write.

      You say the guy is no longer on active duty? Fine, but if he was an officer he probably is still an officer, just not active duty. You have to go through a lot to actually resign your commission.

      If the guy was just a grunt this wouldn't apply.

    10. Re:Blurb totally misleading. by king+neckbeard · · Score: 1

      I'm getting tired of doing things in the sake of 'national security.' Besides, this almost certainly won't work. At least one copy will leak, and at least 100,000 people will see the names.

      --
      This is my signature. There are many like it, but this one is mine.
    11. Re:Blurb totally misleading. by ScrewMaster · · Score: 2, Informative

      No kidding, let's not become the Fox News of the internet.

      Too late.

      --
      The higher the technology, the sharper that two-edged sword.
    12. Re:Blurb totally misleading. by MaskedSlacker · · Score: 4, Informative

      The publisher is in the clear, but if classified info is in there the author can go straight off to prison. The issue here is that the DoD erroneously okayed the first edition on that issue.

    13. Re:Blurb totally misleading. by lordmetroid · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Yeah, it is so easy to say no when one party has immense firepower and the vail of legitimacy to make you dissapear if you do not agree.

    14. Re:Blurb totally misleading. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      There's still one issue. Why should I be forced to pay (through taxes) for the publication of some book that nobody will be able to read?

    15. Re:Blurb totally misleading. by Camel+Pilot · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Crap i had a rant all prepared and you go and take the fun out of it....

      Seriously this type of reporting is akin to all those emails I get from my Tea-Partier Mother-in-Law and I have to take time to let her know she is spreading lies and misinformation in order to incite and such is harmful to a democratic system of government.

    16. Re:Blurb totally misleading. by westlake · · Score: 1

      There's still one issue. Why should I be forced to pay (through taxes) for the publication of some book that nobody will be able to read?

      Because the copies accidentally expose the names of DIA agents who may still be in the field?

    17. Re:Blurb totally misleading. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You must be young.

      You're definitely naive.

    18. Re:Blurb totally misleading. by poor_boi · · Score: 1

      But they /are/ going to just destroy them. After paying for them, that is.

    19. Re:Blurb totally misleading. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      the VEIL of legitimacy.

      Vail is a town in Colorado.

    20. Re:Blurb totally misleading. by GiveBenADollar · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Why is this even a story?! On ship once, our cruise-book (think yearbook for the navy.) had to have pages cut out and sharpied over because there were pictures of things that the photographer and publisher had agreed not to use. It wasn't because we hated books or free speech, it was because there are some things we don't want potential enemies to know. This is no different. If you once had a security clearance and then write about your experiences you are still under contract for the clearance you once had. This guy didn't get permission to print this book before he published and now is in hot water over it.

    21. Re:Blurb totally misleading. by Americano · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Tell you what - I'm okay with MY tax money compensating someone for the DoD's screw-up, so why don't you cover universal health care for me, and I'll pay for the books?

    22. Re:Blurb totally misleading. by Cwix · · Score: 1

      To protect sensitive information that might mean the difference between success and failure of a mission. That could possibly entail needless death of people on both sides of the conflict, and civilians.

      Wires got crossed, appearntly the author did the correct thing, book got printed, now the military is backtracking, because they missed something the first time around. Shit happens, in the end the military is paying up because they are going back on what they had said. They are at fault, that means they have to pay. If they decided they wern't going to pay, you would be here bitching about how they are screwing the publisher and author.

      --
      You are entitled to your own opinions, not your own facts.
    23. Re:Blurb totally misleading. by guyminuslife · · Score: 1

      Huh, for some reason I thought Fox News was the Fox News of the Internet.

      --
      I don't believe in time. It's a grand conspiracy designed to sell watches.
    24. Re:Blurb totally misleading. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Huh, for some reason I thought Fox News was the Fox News of the Internet.

      Okay, let's rephrase that as "a Fox News of the Internet."

    25. Re:Blurb totally misleading. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Officers agree to defend and uphold the Constituion of The United States of America.

      People who deal with classified material permanently and irrevocably waive their Constitutional rights. Which is why they will eventually classify driving so everyone will have to so they can drive, and classify the city bus and Amtrack. Probably because of terrorists.

      Because if a random group of people (the government) can, they eventually will.

    26. Re:Blurb totally misleading. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      No, no, that's the Internet of Fox News. Sheesh!

    27. Re:Blurb totally misleading. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

      This guy didn't get permission to print this book before he published and now is in hot water over it.

      He did get permission and he's not in hot water. From the article:

      Shaffer's book was reviewed and cleared in writing by the Army Reserve earlier this year, but this summer the Defense Intelligence Agency objected to the use of the names of American intelligence officers, among other issues.

    28. Re:Blurb totally misleading. by Sarten-X · · Score: 1

      National security is why we have a government in the first place. It falls under the mandate to "insure domestic Tranquility, [and] provide for the common defence" that the Constitution was written for in the first place. I'm not saying it's a magic phrase that excuses heinous breaches of civil rights, but now and then there's a point to it.

      If one copy will be seen by 100,000 people, then two copies leaking is 200,000, and that's twice the risk. The government screwed up (big surprise) by approving the book completely in the first place. Now they're trying to clean up their mistake. A comparison to 1984 is almost (but not quite) appropriate here. The government isn't trying to change recorded history, but merely to delay facts from coming out while they're still risky.

      The publisher could do something underhanded, like deciding to only sell the books overseas, and would probably get a lot of love from the anti-government folks here. It'd also guarantee their next military-related book gets a much more thorough review. Is it really worth the trouble and risk, just so a few civilians can get a real name that they'll forget an hour later? I don't think so.

      --
      You do not have a moral or legal right to do absolutely anything you want.
    29. Re:Blurb totally misleading. by king+neckbeard · · Score: 1

      "If one copy will be seen by 100,000 people, then two copies leaking is 200,000, and that's twice the risk." I'm saying 100,000 people will see it because it's 'banned' information and thus more interesting. If they had just left it alone, the names wouldn't propagate much beyond the original 10,000 buyers, and certainly not as fast. As others have said, the Streisand effect will occur, and these names will be more readily available than they would otherwise be.

      --
      This is my signature. There are many like it, but this one is mine.
    30. Re:Blurb totally misleading. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

      Why is this even a story?!

      So that people don't just make shit up.

      This guy didn't get permission to print this book before he published and now is in hot water over it.

      1. He DID have permission, and the manuscript was cleared for publication by the military.
      2. They missed a few things.
      3. Because they cleared it originally, but the books are already printed, the military is buying up the entire print run since the mistake was on their side.
      4. The author is NOT in hot water.

      Or to answer you 1st question again, in a different fashion, it's so when Trolls like you just start making shit up, the rest of us can read the story and find out what actually happened.

    31. Re:Blurb totally misleading. by plague911 · · Score: 1

      Ya well your not allowed to you know....tell state secrets....that could easily you know.. result in millions of deaths. Sorry but that seems a pretty uhh blatant case where censorship is justified.

    32. Re:Blurb totally misleading. by mSparks43 · · Score: 1

      So this topic is part of:
      a) An advertising scheme.
      rather than:
      b) A genuine report on a scheme to suppress information.

    33. Re:Blurb totally misleading. by Sarten-X · · Score: 1

      So, in order to protect American soldiers, we shouldn't overreact to this and jump on the "OMG CENSORSHIP!" bandwagon. Instead, we ought to just say "it's not a big deal" and move on.

      --
      You do not have a moral or legal right to do absolutely anything you want.
    34. Re:Blurb totally misleading. by king+neckbeard · · Score: 1

      I'm saying that the US government saying "it's not a big deal" and moving on would be the best way to protect American soldiers. By attempting to prevent the information from getting out, they are ensuring that when it does, it is widely proliferated, quite likely much more than it would have been otherwise.

      --
      This is my signature. There are many like it, but this one is mine.
  13. Good for them by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    It's nice to see them take up a nice inoffensive passtime like reading instead of all that nasty stuff with guns and bombs.

  14. our government smokes crack by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    if i was the publisher, i would print up 100,000 instead of 10,000.

    1. Re:our government smokes crack by Yvan256 · · Score: 1

      There's no need, 10 000 copies is already over 9000!

  15. kill the head the body will die by jewishbaconzombies · · Score: 1

    Why not just kill him. It's vastly cheaper. Hasn't stopped the govt in the past - why stop now?

    1. Re:kill the head the body will die by plumby · · Score: 1

      I thought the trick was to simply smear them with alegations about sexual crimes these days.

    2. Re:kill the head the body will die by Starteck81 · · Score: 1

      Why not just kill him. It's vastly cheaper. Hasn't stopped the govt in the past - why stop now?

      Kill him now and you make him a martyr. Then everyone would be even more interested in what he wrote.

      --
      "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed H
    3. Re:kill the head the body will die by jewishbaconzombies · · Score: 1

      But make sure you fill his hard drive full of child porn - that'll make him really popular (planting evidence is easy when you're dead! s'fun!)

    4. Re:kill the head the body will die by jewishbaconzombies · · Score: 1

      Do both - it's easy to stage an accident, and plant child porn. Keeps the martyrs at bay.

  16. cost to the taxpayers? by Jakeva · · Score: 1

    This is going to make the author's sales look incredible. First printing sells out instantly... second printing? presumably the same. Until he's suddenly the best selling author of the year. I wish the military had this kind of interest in MY writing...

    --
    but if God created circular logic...
  17. The instant bestselling sensation! by bre_dnd · · Score: 1

    Sold 10000 copies in it's first hour of publication! Just keep those presses running, if every copy sells he's got a nice little money maker there.

  18. Time to get publishing! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I need to create abook the Pentagon doesn't like. First day you are instantly on the best sellers list, and then the game of cat and mouse begins. How many books will they burn... and how many publishers are lined up for the illustrated edition...

  19. It should now be obvious by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    that we in America live in a fascist state. It doesn't matter which of the two party oligarchy is in power any longer.

  20. Re:Print More by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative

    I realize you're just posting to spam your link, however if you look at the article it answers your question.

    It was initially cleared for printing by the military. A different military organization later took a look at the book and had some objections. The author appears to have edited newer editions of his book to comply with what the military wanted (changing names I think) however the first 10,000 books were already printed.

    The military now wants to buy the first edition out so that people will only be able to buy the newer, revised editions.

  21. Collectable... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Be worth grabbing a copy if this is true. A rare first edition.

  22. Scanned and available on p2p by now, I assume? by John+Hasler · · Score: 0, Redundant

    n/t

    --
    Warning: this article may contain humor, sarcasm, parody, and perhaps even irony. Read at your own risk.
  23. Richard Thomlinson by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I think I got the name right... Anyway, this uber spy got on the wrong end of bureaucracy when his gf was diagnosed with cancer. The UK govt went apeshit when he was about to publish his memoirs to earn a crust. The guy was one of those over performers that seems to be able to do everything with ease (the bastard!), and got a real full blown slagging off in the press by politicians that knew nothing about him, but they were told by #10 to say X, Y and Z when asked. No one had heard of him, cared about it, or what he was doing in and out of HMS until the propaganda mechanism got going. Net result? Book band in the UK, world wide coverage because so, many many people learned exactly what the govt was trying to hide.

    Streisand effect? Not really, only in name, Peter Wright had the same treatment a long time before with his Spy Catcher.

  24. Re:If the Author really wants to get his story out by Sarten-X · · Score: 1

    Or, he'll change the names like the military wants, and release a second edition, like he already has.

    --
    You do not have a moral or legal right to do absolutely anything you want.
  25. This would be funny if... by Nom+du+Keyboard · · Score: 0, Redundant

    This would be funny if there was a Kindle version offered. Try to buy out all of those {grin}.

    However, hop over to Amazon and they tell you that the first edition isn't available, no Kindle version is listed at all, and that a "revised edition" will be coming on Sept. 14.

    Here it was almost old time thinking colliding with modern day realities.

    --
    "It's the height of ridiculousness to say for those 9 lines you get hundreds of millions."
  26. misleading summary by cavePrisoner · · Score: 1

    If you just read the summary it sounds like its just a PR issue, when the issue is security. He put in a lot of sensitive information that needs to redacted in future versions. He has agreed to the changes. However, since the army mistakenly approved it originally, they are footing the bill for the first printing which still contains the sensitive information. Everything worked the way it should.

  27. We finally have the missing step by Yvan256 · · Score: 4, Funny

    1. write a book about a subject
    2. the subject must be something that someone or some organization wants to cover up
    3. the said someone or organization buys all your copies in order to cover up the subject
    4. profit!

    1. Re:We finally have the missing step by mmaniaci · · Score: 1

      Hah! Not to mention the obvious Streisand effect. Silly goverment.

    2. Re:We finally have the missing step by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Windows Antivirus

      You linux guys are slow.

  28. I'm guessing "PR Stunt", actually by Moraelin · · Score: 1

    Actually the idea of some entity trying to buy every single copy of a book to keep it secret, strikes me of more like a PR stunt than something feasible.

    If you want to actually bury something, you buy the _rights_ to it. Then you get copyright extended until kingdom come like Disney. Copyright is just as misused for preventing something from being seen as it is used as originally intended.

    Trying to just buy the copies off the market is purely pointless if someone else has the copyright, as basically nothing can prevent him from just printing more. I mean, it's not like buying something that costs millions and rare resources to produce. Printing another 10,000 copies or even a million is cheap and trivial. If anything, some entity trying to buy 10,000 copies just added demand worth 10,000 copies, and you'd be stupid not to cash in on it.

    On the other hand, the delusion that something is going to be rare because someone else wants to buy all copies, is a pretty much guaranteed way to make idiots think this is a literally once in a lifetime opportunity to grab a copy before the government. It's making it sound like it's more rare than it is, and about to run out.

    --
    A polar bear is a cartesian bear after a coordinate transform.
    1. Re:I'm guessing "PR Stunt", actually by Tacvek · · Score: 1

      The author has already agreed to changes in the second printing, but the first printing was already made. Instead of forcing the publisher to burn those books, the Pentagon is offering to pay for them, since the original edition containing objectionable content was the fault of the Army Reserve in the first place.

      --
      Stylish sheet to fix many problems in Slashdot's D3: https://gist.github.com/801524
    2. Re:I'm guessing "PR Stunt", actually by masmullin · · Score: 1

      One of those early print editions will be worth a fortune.

    3. Re:I'm guessing "PR Stunt", actually by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      A single intelligent poster on slashdot and not a single mod point.

      Figures, this is retard central isn't it.

  29. Don't Burn the Quran by Nom+du+Keyboard · · Score: 1

    Okay, suppress all of these -- take 'em, shred 'em, burn 'em -- but don't you dare touch the Quran.

    --
    "It's the height of ridiculousness to say for those 9 lines you get hundreds of millions."
    1. Re:Don't Burn the Quran by Thing+1 · · Score: 1

      So, here's one for the world: "Quran rolling papers". Don't have time to make and market them for tomorrow; so just use a crayon and write "Quran", or "Koran", or even "Co-ran", doesn't need to be spelled correctly as long as the phonetic Gods are appeased; then roll it around your favorite herb, and smoke it. Dude, you're burning the Quran!

      --
      I feel fantastic, and I'm still alive.
    2. Re:Don't Burn the Quran by Larryish · · Score: 1

      I rather fancy the idea of an extended bukakke session on a picture of the Prophet Mohammed.

  30. Re:Print More by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Informative

    Exactly what I was thinking, and what they appear to be doing. According to the article, the second print run has been edited enough that the DoD is okay with it being public. The DoD is buying the 10,000 copies that are already printed, and allegedly didn't go through the proper DoD security review prior to publication.

  31. Re:Print More by Yvan256 · · Score: 1

    I bet his spam link is full of virus-infected crap, too. "Hey, it's 50 CODECs into a single installation package, what can go wrong?"

  32. Simple by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    1) Take the money.
    2) Print more.
    3) Profit!
    rinse & repeat ...
    When you are done, release it electronically (creative commons anyone?). Information wants to be free.

  33. Bestseller by mwvdlee · · Score: 1

    So the government is going to buy all prints straight from the press?
    How about a second print?
    Surely this will become the most popular book of all times, as measured in sales.

    --
    Slashdot social media options: AIM, ICQ, Yahoo, Jabber and Mobile Text. Why no MySpace?
    1. Re:Bestseller by Lloyd_Bryant · · Score: 1

      So the government is going to buy all prints straight from the press?
      How about a second print?
      Surely this will become the most popular book of all times, as measured in sales.

      Except the second edition has been edited to remove the information that the DoD objects to in the first edition. They're just trying to clean up after a mistake (the book was cleared for release, but now they're claiming it wasn't cleared by the "proper" authorities).

      --
      Don't tell me to get a life. I had one once. It sucked.
  34. Won't the publisher just print more? by Fallen+Kell · · Score: 1

    I mean, they sold out the first printing, which means there is plenty of demand :D

    --
    We were all warned a long time ago that MS products sucked, remember the Magic 8 Ball said, "Outlook not so good"
  35. YOUR tax dollars is paying for it by Steeltoe · · Score: 1

    AND it's paying for your enormous deficit, which is likely to bankrupt US pretty soon..

    Ok, you've got two unwinnable wars, then what?

    1. Re:YOUR tax dollars is paying for it by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

      Hey! We're down to one unwinnable war, and one unwinnable non-combat presence...

    2. Re:YOUR tax dollars is paying for it by hedwards · · Score: 1

      Then we cut taxes and balance the deficit by cutting job and education programs, duh. You act like it's going to take some actual consideration to look fora solution.

    3. Re:YOUR tax dollars is paying for it by flajann · · Score: 4, Interesting

      AND it's paying for your enormous deficit, which is likely to bankrupt US pretty soon..

      Ok, you've got two unwinnable wars, then what?

      The US went bankrupt many years ago. Why do you think all the gold was confiscated back in 1933

      http://www.the-privateer.com/1933-gold-confiscation.html

      and Nixon took the USD completely off the gold standard?

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nixon_Shock

      You only resort to these extreme measures if you have a negative ROI. If you have sustained negative ROI, that's actually worse than actual bankruptcy, which is an admission that you failed and promise to restructure. Nope, the rampant spending continues, and the fiat money flows. The broken system becomes even more broken, as fiscal fantasy becomes even more out of line with fiscal reality.

      That party cannot continue forever, I don't think.

    4. Re:YOUR tax dollars is paying for it by phantomfive · · Score: 2, Informative

      As a correction, it appears that what you are saying is that the government went broke in 1933, and it's been getting worse ever since. It's not the case; there have been times since then that the fiscal outlook was really good for the country. Of course, give politicians money and they will spend it. But you can't look at the 1933 gold confiscation and say it is responsible for the current government problems, anymore than you can say the 1930s depression is responsible for the current recession. And you can't say that unless you completely ignore history.

      --
      Qxe4
    5. Re:YOUR tax dollars is paying for it by complete+loony · · Score: 1

      The party is already winding down.

      --
      09F91102 no, 455FE104 nope, F190A1E8 uh-uh, 7A5F8A09 that's not it, C87294CE no. Ah! 452F6E403CDF10714E41DFAA257D313F.
    6. Re:YOUR tax dollars is paying for it by liquidsin · · Score: 2, Insightful

      whoa, whoa, whoa! so i was involuntarily entered into a contract whereby "the nation" gains wealth from the sweat of my brow, because they shoved some paperwork under my mom's nose when i was born and told her to sign it? that seems a little shady, wouldn't you say?

      also, it seems to me like gold isn't so worthless after all. as a matter of fact, it's been so stable over time that many investors maintain it as a hedge in case fiat currencies fail.

      --
      do not read this line twice.
    7. Re:YOUR tax dollars is paying for it by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Funny

      If you don't like it, go somewhere else.

    8. Re:YOUR tax dollars is paying for it by flajann · · Score: 1
      You miss my point entirely. We've become a nation that floats on debt. Always in the red. It's the mode of operation that's the problem. You cannot keep borrowing forever without repayment; something has to give eventually. When was the last time the US actually had a surplus? My point entirely.

      The debt model that the US has been operating under for the many decades is simply not sustainable.

    9. Re:YOUR tax dollars is paying for it by flajann · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I know you're trolling but I'll bite.

      I'm not trolling, actually, but that's besides the point.

      The US is no longer on the Gold standard because Gold is worthless.

      Worthless? Really? Can I have your gold then? I watch the financial markets nearly every day and gold is anything but worthless.

      What is valuable is debt aka IOUs or promissory notes aka US Dollars otherwise known as Government issued Reserve Notes. Debt is backed by labor or goods and services which have real intrinsic value.

      Ah, see, you are proving my point already, but let's continue.

      Gold is only useful in niche electronic components and fashion jewelry.

      FYI Reserve Notes are backed by Birth Certificates which have an economic value of ~$750000 - $1000000 for the lifetime of the individual, which is how much that Citizen is expected to contribute to the national economy in their lifetime in labor, services, intellectual property, etc.

      So us human citizens are being used as collateral for the debt! Ah, therein lies the rub! Unless you have infinite growth, this model fails. The planet is only so big, and there are only so many resources, places to live, farmland, etc. Population growth cannot continue to grow indefinitely -- it's mathematically impossible.

      So now what happens when your assumptions of infinite growth are dashed to the hills? You have enslaved all of your citizens into paying off this debt, and you have to use force to "exact tribute " -- the IRS -- but now the bottom falls out because you hit zero population growth, or perhaps population begins to decline.

      So now your creditors become restless and may wish to call back in the loan in full. Or drop you as a basis. Hello, what has China been doing recently? Making lots of noise about switching from the USD to some other standard for world currency -- like GOLD!

      Why don't you explain to China and India how "worthless" gold is. Go ahead. I dare ya.

      So to summarize we exchanged an economy backed by a semi-rare earth mineral for an economy backed by a population of contributing citizens and abstracted into a commodity by the vehicle of debt and debt reserve notes ( US Dollars).

      To rephrase what you've just stated, "we" -- really the US government, not us -- took us off a solid standard with builtin accountability, sold us all out and decided to use you and me as collateral for a debt they keep running up, higher and deeper.

      The wars fought today have nothing to do with "National Security" and everything to do with control of resources to keep the illusion going that the debt model will continue indefinitely -- which it will not.

      You may love a world of debt servitude, but I do not. You and I did not choose to become debt slaves -- we were signed up for it at birth, and you fully admit it.

      So thank you for making my point for me. I couldn't have said it better myself!!!!!

    10. Re:YOUR tax dollars is paying for it by phantomfive · · Score: 1

      As a matter of fact you can always borrow, as long as the debt doesn't grow too large (it probably is right now). The US does pay off it's bond obligations, and continually refinances them.

      You can't really say it's been a problem for many decades, either, because the Reagan debt could have been paid off by now, easily. It's only really become a problem in the last decade as entitlement costs (mainly medicare) have risen, and continue to rise.

      I don't like deficit spending either, and wish our stupid politicians wouldn't do it, but it seems wrong to characterize it as a problem that has been growing for many decades. Maybe that's just splitting hairs, though.

      --
      Qxe4
    11. Re:YOUR tax dollars is paying for it by flajann · · Score: 1
      If you have to keep borrowing and borrowing, and doing so faster than you can pay it off, meanwhile the basis of your credit is shrinking, it's a disaster waiting to happen.

      The Military sucks up a HUGE portion of the national budget. If you got rid of that alone, we'd probably be OK. Or at least not as bad off as we are.

      But what's wrong with being cash positive rather than cash negative? Continuous borrowing is always a loosing proposition, both for the borrower and the creditor.

    12. Re:YOUR tax dollars is paying for it by phantomfive · · Score: 1

      The Military sucks up a HUGE portion of the national budget. If you got rid of that alone, we'd probably be OK.

      Surprisingly, the military is a more or less fixed cost, and can be dealt with in various ways, by increasing revenue or cutting spending. As you can see from this graph, we've been cutting military spending for a long time (and replacing it with social programs), and Robert Gates seems to be doing a capable job of continuing that trend. I'm also going to suggest it would be unwise to completely cut military spending (and indeed, we couldn't immediately because a large portion of military spending goes to things like pensions).

      The biggest problem with the national budget is actually medicare (there are a number of ways to fix social security, it's just a matter of choosing one and fixing it). As you can see from this graph, medicare will eventually push out all other non-obligatory spending, and actually the problem has gotten worse since that graph was made.

      I'm ok with cutting military spending, but let's address the root of the problem.

      --
      Qxe4
    13. Re:YOUR tax dollars is paying for it by flajann · · Score: 1

      The Military sucks up a HUGE portion of the national budget. If you got rid of that alone, we'd probably be OK.

      Surprisingly, the military is a more or less fixed cost, and can be dealt with in various ways, by increasing revenue or cutting spending. As you can see from this graph, we've been cutting military spending for a long time

      On the graph it states that spending in Iraq and Afghanistan was "mostly" excluded, so we're not looking at a complete picture.

      (and replacing it with social programs), and Robert Gates seems to be doing a capable job of continuing that trend. I'm also going to suggest it would be unwise to completely cut military spending (and indeed, we couldn't immediately because a large portion of military spending goes to things like pensions). The biggest problem with the national budget is actually medicare (there are a number of ways to fix social security, it's just a matter of choosing one and fixing it). As you can see from this graph, medicare will eventually push out all other non-obligatory spending, and actually the problem has gotten worse since that graph was made. I'm ok with cutting military spending, but let's address the root of the problem.

      Yes, entitlements will eat the US alive. It was not sustainable to begin with. Something will have to give, and to "fix" the problem means either raising taxes, which would be devestaving, or cutting the entitlements, which will impact those who have the expectation of getting them.

      My retirement plans do NOT include entitlements of any sort. They simply will not be solvent by that time, or will pay so little it'll be a joke.

      This is the government's Ponzi at Gunpoint Scheme that it forces us all to "buy" into, but will leave us much worse than high and dry.

    14. Re:YOUR tax dollars is paying for it by phantomfive · · Score: 1

      Yeah, exactly. I don't know how the government's healthcare/retirement plans are going to be, but I intend to make sure I'll never need to rely on it.

      --
      Qxe4
  36. Sold out already? by Nesman64 · · Score: 1

    Instant best seller! Start the second run.

    --
    coffee | nose > keyboard
    1. Re:Sold out already? by Holammer · · Score: 1

      Not only that, double the price.. no wait! Triple! The sky's the limit here.

  37. Yea!!! by thestudio_bob · · Score: 1

    Yea!!! Modern day book burning!!!!

    We American's have finally come full circle now. Next week, burning a witch at the stake (Sponsored by Kingford)

    sigh...

    --
    The real Sig captains the Northwestern. This one captains /.
  38. Re:Print More by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

    Also, there's already a perfectly working package that does that.

    http://www.cccp-project.net/

  39. Re:If the Author really wants to get his story out by willyd357 · · Score: 1

    Yeah, I just saw that. What a shame.

  40. If there was an eBook... by pancakegeels · · Score: 2, Insightful

    presumably you'd have to do a denial of service? This is an argument for eBooks that I hadn't considered before....

  41. Free advertising! by leromarinvit · · Score: 1

    So, where's the torrent?

    Pentagon, meet the Streisand effect.

    --
    Proud member of the Ferengi Socialist Party.
  42. Re:If the Author really wants to get his story out by maxume · · Score: 1

    Yes, how dare the author choose to defer to the military, and how dare the military attempt to use the long arm of the dollar in order to protect other resources.

    --
    Nerd rage is the funniest rage.
  43. it's part of the deal for ex-spooks by YesIAmAScript · · Score: 4, Informative

    The government cannot censor material before it is printed by regular people. But if you worked for the government and write about intelligence you learned while there, then the government can review it and "suggest" redactions before it is printed.

    That's what happened here, it's just they printed 10,000 copies that were insufficiently redacted, so those will be destroyed, the company compensated and then more copies with the proper redactions printed. As to the jokers making comments about digital copies, those would be destroyed and no one compensated, because the "buying up books" here isn't to get them off the market, they won't be going to market anyway. It's just to compensate for expenses of printing books they cannot now put on shelves as-is.

    This is censorship, because it is the government restricting speech. But is is a special case of info from a government employee, and that is allowed under the law, whether you agree with it or not. It has been this way for some time, I used to have a paperback from the early 70s that advertised the government went to court to stop its publication because the author worked for the CIA before. That book was eventually published with some redactions as this one will too.

    --
    http://lkml.org/lkml/2005/8/20/95
  44. Book burning at taxpayer expense! by mykos · · Score: 1

    The publisher will just laugh and print more. I'm disgusted that the Pentagon would trade real taxpayer money for fake property.

  45. Wikileaks? by Frosty+Piss · · Score: 1

    Is this perhaps a job for Wikileaks? There are copies "in the wild" after all...

    --
    If you want news from today, you have to come back tomorrow.
  46. The thump heard round the world. by mevets · · Score: 1

    That was Assange's palm smacking his rather large forehead!

  47. Re:Print More by Entropy98 · · Score: 1

    Read the full article?? Cmon does anyone really do that???
     
    --
      free windows codec pack

  48. Re:Print More by jridley · · Score: 1

    This way, once both editions are OCR'd, a simple DIFF will tell us what the government considers to be critical data. The bad guys (if there are any who care about this and don't already know it) don't even have to read the whole thing now.

  49. i hope people rtfa by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Informative

    The Slashdot summary is a gross misrepresentation. The govt had problems with use of real names in a number of places. The publisher is already running a second printing that does not use the names. The ONLY issue here is what to do with the 10000 or so copies printed before the changes were made. To argue that this is about censorship is gross hyperbole.

    1. Re:i hope people rtfa by NiceGeek · · Score: 1

      You have too much faith in the typical /. reader. I did rtfa and you're 100% correct. This is a non-issue.

    2. Re:i hope people rtfa by cheekyjohnson · · Score: 1

      That's still censorship, though.

      --
      Filthy, filthy copyrapists!
    3. Re:i hope people rtfa by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Only in the sense that me using a friends computer w/o explicit permission is stealing electricity. In a more practical sense, I prefer the wiki definition where censorship is blocking data that is "objectionable, harmful, sensitive, or inconvenient." Here all they're doing is changing people's names. How exactly is the government protecting themselves from the truth here? If hypothetically the government released documents stating they blew up a innocent nursery, or something, does it somehow protect them if they said Joe Schmoe pulled the trigger instead of John Noland?

    4. Re:i hope people rtfa by cheekyjohnson · · Score: 1

      "objectionable, harmful, sensitive, or inconvenient."

      That could mean anything, though. While I agree that a little bit of censorship is okay if it will protect someones life, I was merely pointing out that this still could be considered censorship.

      --
      Filthy, filthy copyrapists!
  50. Making it poplar by cprocjr · · Score: 1

    ...and by doing so, they are making the book popular. Te publisher will just print more, and everyone's gonna want to read it because it's the book the Pentagon tried to hide. It'll also be on best sellers lists because they are buying 10,000 of them.

  51. RTFA - There will be a 2nd printing by darkwing_bmf · · Score: 4, Informative

    For all the people say "LOL they'll just print more" or "OMG censorship is bad!" here are the relevant parts of the story:

    "[T]he Defense Intelligence Agency objected to the use of the names of American intelligence officers, among other issues." and "A new print run, without the disputed passages, is being prepared by the publisher."

    This compromise is reasonable and legal. We still get the story but the intelligence officers names won't be published.

    1. Re:RTFA - There will be a 2nd printing by mmaniaci · · Score: 1

      Ah but somewhere, somehow those names are known. Its far too late for this not to be a controversy.

  52. So now by cvtan · · Score: 1

    So now I'll write a book explaining about how the Pentagon bought up the other book and they'll have to buy my book too = Profit.

    --
    Sorry, but gray text on gray background is making my eyes bleed.
  53. All this swiftboating of FDR by countertrolling · · Score: 2, Insightful

    It'll never end...

    The real destruction of the constitution started in 1798 with the Alien and Sedition Acts. Some might even say the Whiskey tax of 1791 was a breach.. Either way the path is well worn..

    --
    For justice, we must go to Don Corleone
    1. Re:All this swiftboating of FDR by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0, Troll

      Oh, to have mod points - well put.

      The problem with FDR wasn't so much that he was the first to stray into activities that weren't fully supported in the constitution, it's that he was one of the first to do it a way that aimed to help people instead of controlling them.

      The Ayn Rand types just hate that - they want the freedom to be the ones in charge of everything.

    2. Re:All this swiftboating of FDR by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      My first troll mod! Woo hoo! Now I wish I'd looked up my password - if this post scared someone enough they wanted to waste mod points on it, I must be saying something right.

    3. Re:All this swiftboating of FDR by dafing · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Thats a good way to deal with being modded "Troll" :)

      Its one of those things online, if someone doesnt agree with you, you are a *TROLL* man, a freaking *TROLL*!!!!1!!!1!

      I get it, you got modded down for speaking ill of Rand, yet others can get "+5 insightful" mods from similar comments!

      You have it exactly right "...they want the freedom to be the ones in charge of everything."

      --
      --- ...or a new slashdot signature. Dear aunt, let's set so double the killer delete select all
  54. Embarrassment or names? by Frosty+Piss · · Score: 1
    If it's just a matter of the names of operatives, that's one thing. To a point, I'm OK with that. But if it's a matter of scrubbing out any mention of missions and operations that might tend to embarrass the US due to impropriety, than yes, I'd like to know what was going on. We have a right to know what our government is up to.

    Shaffer, who is now a senior fellow at the Center for Advanced Defense Studies in Washington, describes a number of planned covert operations, including an aborted cross-border surveillance operation using sophisticated eavesdropping technology that targeted high-level al-Qaeda operatives based in the tribal areas of Pakistan.

    The operation was shut down by military officials concerned about offending Pakistan, according to Shaffer's account.

    So, we shouldn't be able to know that high level terrorists are still running about planning and participating in violent bloodshed against their own people and others?

    --
    If you want news from today, you have to come back tomorrow.
    1. Re:Embarrassment or names? by perpenso · · Score: 1

      The operation was shut down by military officials concerned about offending Pakistan, according to Shaffer's account.

      So, we shouldn't be able to know that high level terrorists are still running about planning and participating in violent bloodshed against their own people and others?

      It is not censorship if the author does not want to embarrass Pakistan and agrees that the incident should be omitted. You may disagree with his decision but that does not make it censorship. I think all you can accuse the author of is being political.

    2. Re:Embarrassment or names? by Frosty+Piss · · Score: 1

      It is not censorship if the author does not want to embarrass Pakistan and agrees that the incident should be omitted.

      Who said anything about censorship? I think we have a right to know.

      --
      If you want news from today, you have to come back tomorrow.
  55. The British crown did this with William Tyndale by brokeninside · · Score: 1

    They bought up his entire run of Bibles. He willingly sold them to the government knowing that they would be destroyed. Then Tyndale used the profits to finance an even larger print run.

    1. Re:The British crown did this with William Tyndale by Holammer · · Score: 1

      ... and later they killed him and burned his body. There is lesson to be learned here.

  56. buy up all copies ? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    they are aware of a thing called the internet, right.....
    you can't buy up all the copies

  57. A lesson for Pastor Terry Jones by joelsanda · · Score: 1

    Maybe Terry Jones ought to buy up all copies of the Koran instead of burning them!

    --
    The Luddites were ahead of their time.
  58. Hopefully, it'll pop up at Wikileaks or Cryptome by surfcow · · Score: 1

    Hopefully, it'll pop up at Wikileaks or Cryptome

  59. Do you even know what a conspiracy is? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    You need at least TWO people in order to have a conspiracy. You can't conspire with yourself, you dipshit.

    1. Re:Do you even know what a conspiracy is? by tacarat · · Score: 1

      Let's pretend you think there's a conspiracy at work to make you miserable. Let's pretend that "conspiracy" was only one person. Was there a conspiracy? Yes. Why? Because your paranoia created one. Feel free to provide a more suitable word.

      --
      "Common sense will be the death of us all"
    2. Re:Do you even know what a conspiracy is? by blackraven14250 · · Score: 1

      No, because your mind created the image of a person who is out to get you, is a shitty asshole, a fucktard, or a douchebag. I personally think a douchebag is the best way to describe one person doing things to fuck with you.. The entire point of a conspiracy requires the involvement of 2 or more people.

    3. Re:Do you even know what a conspiracy is? by tacarat · · Score: 1

      Very true. I think I'm going to just have to default to the "it's in quotes" defense. I'd edit it to be "a small group of people", but... yeah. Slashdot edits, proofreading ftl >.>

      --
      "Common sense will be the death of us all"
    4. Re:Do you even know what a conspiracy is? by Mephistro · · Score: 1
      Hummm... From the Merriam Webster 11 Collegiate Dictionary:

      "...2 a : an agreement among conspirators b : a group of conspirators

      synonyms see PLOT"

      'Group' is a synonym of 'set' - " 21 : a collection of elements and especially mathematical ones..."- and sets can have a single element.

      Perhaps it's stretching it a bit too much, but I think that you can "conspire with yourself" the same way you can "plot by yourself".

      Of course, the legal meaning of 'conspiracy' is a different matter.

    5. Re:Do you even know what a conspiracy is? by Hognoxious · · Score: 1

      Let's pretend that "conspiracy" was only one person. Was there a conspiracy?

      No, because a conspiracy - imaginary or not - needs two people. It's in the definition of the word. If you thought you were being followed by a unicorn with silver antlers then you're wrong, because unicorns don't have antlers.

      Just because words are used in a fictional context doesn't change their meaning.

      --
      Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
    6. Re:Do you even know what a conspiracy is? by bbtom · · Score: 1

      Say I believed there was an incredibly sexy pornographic performer beckoning to me at the end of my bed and requesting that we engage in certain activities that might be considered lewd everywhere but the darkest reaches of the Internet. I wake up to find it is just a sibling telling me to get out of bed because it is time for breakfast. But, you know, in my mind, it was a porn star. Therefore, my subconscious inner mind created a porn star and placed it at the end of my bed.

      The figment of your subconscious mind if not a real thing. It cannot beckon you on and offer to perform sexual acts, nor can it can conspire with another. Another person may exploit your suggestibility or paranoia, but we have perfectly good phrases for that: "exploiting your paranoia" or "exploiting your suggestibility".

      --
      catch (HumourFailureException e) { e.user.send("You, sir, are a humourless idiot."); }
    7. Re:Do you even know what a conspiracy is? by 7-Vodka · · Score: 1
      Let's pretend I'm fomenting a conspiracy right now. Me and my conspirators are raising an army to go and beat tacarat over the head with a clue. Let's pretend that I go up to the lieutenant in my army and SAY...

      Oh crap wait there is no army and I have no conspirators. But wait theres MORE! I'll just go convince him that there is a conspiracy and it will BECOME ONE.

      Oh shit yeah it don't work that way lol.

      --

      Liberty.

    8. Re:Do you even know what a conspiracy is? by GooberToo · · Score: 1

      That's a plot. A conspiracy is when two or more people conspire together. And in some legalities, it actually requires three or more.

    9. Re:Do you even know what a conspiracy is? by mhelander · · Score: 1

      but "conspirators" is plural.

    10. Re:Do you even know what a conspiracy is? by tacarat · · Score: 1

      I'm guessing it'd be some might consider it inappropriate (or really sexy) to point out that it is possible for both of your statements to be true...

      --
      "Common sense will be the death of us all"
    11. Re:Do you even know what a conspiracy is? by tacarat · · Score: 1

      Dear god... you were going to have me beat up by a lieutenant with a clue? Anybody in the military knows that they wouldn't know what to do with one of those.

      --
      "Common sense will be the death of us all"
    12. Re:Do you even know what a conspiracy is? by tacarat · · Score: 1

      Thanks :) Funny how my one misuse of the word "conspiracy" is a bigger issue than TFA. Must be a secret plot by allies of the grammer nazis.

      --
      "Common sense will be the death of us all"
    13. Re:Do you even know what a conspiracy is? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If it were a single person, it wouldn't be a conspiracy. It would be a malefactor.

  60. heh by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    They should sell the pentagon the first 10,000 copies, then release it as an ebook

  61. Review copy is up on Ebay by Pikoro · · Score: 1

    Looks like someone that got a review copy has listed it up on ebay

    Sitting at almost $1200 as I write this.

    --
    "Freedom in the USA is not the ability to do what you want. It is the ability to stop others from doing what THEY want"
    1. Re:Review copy is up on Ebay by 0111+1110 · · Score: 1

      Does the US Military have sniper training? I'd like to nuclear bid on it and then retract my bid at the end. It would be worth the negative feedback just to get into a bidding war with the US Military and actually win!

      --
      Quite an experience to live in fear, isn't it? That's what it is to be a slave.
  62. I didn't RTFA because it's behind a login by Legion303 · · Score: 2, Informative

    "Thank you for giving us a green light to print money, Pentagon." --The Publishers

  63. Wow! by PPH · · Score: 2, Insightful

    The first printing was so popular, we're going to crank out another 100K pronto!

    --
    Have gnu, will travel.
  64. where the books are by w00tsauce · · Score: 2, Interesting

    16365 James Madison Highway Gordonsville, VA 22942-8501 It would be a shame if that warehouse accidentally got burglarized and the book published online.

  65. Library of Congress by illtud · · Score: 1

    If the summary is correct, and the book is actually published (nevermind if the Pentagon magically buys all copies) it will be deposited at the Library of Congress (the US's only Copyright Library, unless I'm mistaken - we have 5 UK Copyright Libraries, including one outside the UK). Go read it there and post the contents (in your own words, other than where fair dealing/use allow).

    Copyright Libraries: Use Them or Lose Them!

    [yes, I do work for a Copyright Library]

  66. Monumentally stupid and wasteful by ismism · · Score: 0

    But then, that is the essence of the military.

  67. Burn the Books by b4upoo · · Score: 0

    At least the Nazis were practical. Burning books was far cheaper than buying them. And we certainly would not want citizens reading "unapproved truths". This stuff is way too sick for me to consider without getting angry.

  68. ....profit! by ukemike · · Score: 2, Insightful

    1. Write book the military doesn't want seen in public
    2. Publish
    3. Let Pentagon buy up entire printing
    4. Keep making more printings for them to buy
    5. PROFIT!!!

    --
    -- QED
  69. I'll bet it's not the military pulling this back by dbIII · · Score: 1

    I'll bet he just said something uncomplimentary about the poorly trained unaccountable spooks getting in the way of military operations and subverting the chain of command. That would get past military censorship but be objected to by a spook finding out about the book afterwards.
    The other more mundane alternative is that another copy of the manuscript lay gathering dust on a spooks desk until the books were printed.

  70. Sell them via auction by jvkjvk · · Score: 1

    Dutch auction, everyone pays the 2nd highest bid price. You could even limit one bidder from buying them all.

    Regards.

  71. Hide in shame or stand out with pride. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I'm guessing they're not that proud of themselves?

    Clearly cockroaches need darkness.

  72. Did they? by aynoknman · · Score: 1

    Did the DoD get a volume discount?

    --
    We need a "+1 -- nice sig" moderation.
  73. Retirement Perk ? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Ok. So the retirement's not that great, and this is just ingenuity at work to beef up the ol' pension - at taxpayers' expense, as usual. With the usual winks and nods. "What's wrong with that"?

    Geez. Stop complaining. Go write your own books. ;p

  74. Same old by Internetuser1248 · · Score: 1

    that the military is attempting to suppress information that the public has a right to see is frightening in it's implications.

    Where have you been? Living under a rock? What implications are there that weren't already implied many many decades ago. In fact most military organisations would like to suppress all information until they were the only ones left who knew anything.

    In case there are more people living under that rock I should add that the main implication of military especially military intelligence secrecy is that the organisations are not really there to serve the public good but to serve other goals against the public good

  75. And the government aren't begin dicks about it by Sycraft-fu · · Score: 2, Insightful

    The issue is, of course, that the publisher paid to have a first run done. Would rather suck if they couldn't sell any of those. It would be a big sunk cost. Never mind if the government would even have the authority to tell them not to sell it, it would be a really dick move, one that would hurt the publisher. So the government instead said "We'll just buy up the entire production run. You agree to sell them to nobody else, we take all of them and destroy them, you go ahead with the 2nd edition with our blessing." Government is happy, they got the names redacted. Publisher is happy, they didn't lose money. Life is good.

  76. Correct me if I'm wrong, but... by John+Pfeiffer · · Score: 2, Insightful

    ...if the entire first printing sells out almost immediately (Regardless of the reason), doesn't that pretty much ensure it will get another printing?

    --

    Friend: "The NIC is misconfigured..." Me: "No prob, I'll just telnet in and fix it." *Silence*
  77. Cut the Pentagon Budget by Doc+Ruby · · Score: 1

    It's perfectly obvious the Pentagon has too much money to spend. We spent $3 TRILLION for the Pentagon to lose the Iraq War, and will spend $TRILLIONS more losing the Afghanistan War. Over $1T a year for the past decade to make the Terror War permanent, and its threat to America's security an intractable problem. After spending about a half trillion a year on military and "intelligence" for the decade before that which failed to protect us from the attacks exactly 9 years ago today.

    The Pentagon shouldn't have enough money to spend censoring books that say how the Pentagon is a waste of money. The Pentagon should have $300B a year or less to spend on actual defense. Give $200-400B a year to NASA, and $300B a year to send everyone to college for free. Then watch the country's security stabilize and grow as we think up and execute actual solutions to our problems, rather than shooting everything in sight - and at our own shadow.

    --

    --
    make install -not war

  78. IMO A big part of the problem by Burning1 · · Score: 2, Interesting

    In my opinion, a big part of problem with the war on drugs (and abstinence only education as well) is that the people who support the lies become invested in them... Financially to be sure, but intellectually and emotionally more so.

    For some, it's cognitive dissonance and for other's it's reputation.For the emotional, there's such a belief in the lies told about drug use, and they are so heavily invested in those beliefs that it's impossible for them to truly consider alternatives. For the more rational supporters of prohibition, they've put so much of their reputation on the line, that it's nearly impossible for them to back off and admit that they spread misinformation, and wasted billions upon billions of dollars, ruined lives, and manipulated everyone over this issue.

    I personally suspect that drug prohibition will end in two stages... The first will be for a vocal group to really put the message out there, and to educate the public that legalization, while not perfect, would be a significant improvement over prohibition. This group needs to convince people that lies are not education, and that truth and reality are far more effective messages against drugs than scare tactics and misinformation.

    The second stage will be the rotation of those invested in prohibition out of power, which IMO will happen naturally - no one's going to be forced out of government due to an anti drug position, but they are going to eventually retire. It may take many years, but as those who grew up with a drug education take positions in government.

    Gay rights is a similar issue... It's been pointed out that gay marriage has overwhelming support from my generation (people younger than their mid 30s) and that it's really only a question of who will legalize gay marriage... Do those in power want to go down in history for supporting gay rights? Or do they want to wait another 30 years until my generation is in power to do it?

    End rant...

    1. Re:IMO A big part of the problem by GameboyRMH · · Score: 1

      Or do they want to wait another 30 years until my generation is in power to do it?

      Oh sure gen. Y will legalize gay marriage just like gen. X legalized weed...

      --
      "When information is power, privacy is freedom" - Jah-Wren Ryel
  79. Obviously, it implicates Obama by scottbomb · · Score: 1

    Because, as we all know, if BUSH!!!!111!!1 was involved, the administration would be offering to help promote the book.

  80. The constitution is obsolete by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Your history is a little too molested for my taste. the real destruction of the US constitution started during the civil war time and really became institutionalized during FDR. You are at minimum 100 years off and generalship at least 30 years off the most noticeable disregard of it.

    I certainly hope so! You guys need a complete remake. There are two things that Americans are obsessed for no apparent reasons: The constitution and the divine wisdom of the founding fathers. (Well, there are more then two but only those are relevant here)

    The thing is that the constitution was drafted centuries ago. By people who lived centuries ago and were just normal (though perhaps clever) humans. The world has changed in pretty much every possible way. Whether it comes to issues about communication, privacy, immigration, economy, weapon rights... In every possible aspect there are numerous entirely new issues that was not even possible to foresee when the constitution was drafted. There have been new theories in economy, politics and philosophy and whole new concepts have came up in all the areas... In other words: The constitution of the USA is a completely obsolete document.

    I't was meant to be changed and updated over time: Mechanics for that exist. But it hasn't been modified nearly as much as it should have been because it seems as if americans have been taught to worship it for its own sake! (There is similar problem with the constitutions of other countries but they're - in general - newer and thus more up to date. Also, it is less of a taboo to modify them.) It seems stupid to try to find out what the founding fathers in their divine wisdom would have thought about about any modern subject when what should be done is to find out what people are thinking about it now: If there is a consensus AND people consider it very important, it should be in the constitution. Else, it should not.

    Constitution in democracy exists pretty much for one reason: To prevent rights being taken away from one group too quickly. To use the mandatory hitler example: If a very fascistic movement somehow got to power in the USA, they couldn't just draft a law to put all jews to camps. They would first need to change constitution to do that, which would take time. This means that the people opposing such a law could rally at the next elections and failing that, jews would have time to move to another country, other nations would have time to interfere, etc... Or, to continue that example for 2nd amendment fans: If the people would consider overthrowing the government in non-democratic means, the government couldn't just stop that by ordering all private arms to be confiscated. It would take time and thus give the revolutionaries time to either act or choose to abandon the plan.

    So there is a reason to make it slow to take away certain important rights from the people. It doesn't make the constitution and everything itself holy or anything like that. It might be a good idea to force complete rewrite of the constitution every 50 years or so to make sure that it is up to date with modern society. (And also to force the society to think, examine and study its values every few decades or so)

    1. Re:The constitution is obsolete by sumdumass · · Score: 2, Insightful

      You sound like an outsider so I will pose this response in as clear and of modern of times as possible.

      I certainly hope so! You guys need a complete remake. There are two things that Americans are obsessed for no apparent reasons: The constitution and the divine wisdom of the founding fathers. (Well, there are more then two but only those are relevant here)

      The thing is that the constitution was drafted centuries ago. By people who lived centuries ago and were just normal (though perhaps clever) humans. The world has changed in pretty much every possible way. Whether it comes to issues about communication, privacy, immigration, economy, weapon rights... In every possible aspect there are numerous entirely new issues that was not even possible to foresee when the constitution was drafted. There have been new theories in economy, politics and philosophy and whole new concepts have came up in all the areas... In other words: The constitution of the USA is a completely obsolete document.

      The obsession with the constitution is because it's a document that gives the federal government it's power. The federal government was originally designed to simple be a common head of state and to settle matters between the states. The constitution is divided into 3 sections, 2 of which are basically the same. The first section described the only power the federal government has, the rest is left to the states and to the people where it respectfully belongs.

      The second part is called the bill of rights, this is the original 10 amendment (there was 12 originally but 2 of them took several decades after the constitution was ratified by all the states to be passed). These bill of rights do not give anyone any rights, they expressly forbid the government of the US or it's states from taking inherent rights away from us. Then there are the amendments. These are all the amendments after the first 10 which has been made for whatever reason as society deemed necessary. It requires a good deal of support in order to get an amendment passed and there was actually two amendments that would/could be unconstitutional (depending on the date passed).

      Now, how this all sorts together in modern times, support the EU became some massive monolithic organization that was imposing it's will on all the member countries. Some say it already is, but suppose that over the next couple of years, the EU government took control of all the military forces of it's member states, started declaring what kind of health care they could have, what kind of elections they could have, who could become citizens of the member states and so on. Also suppose they started taxing individuals within each member state. Now suppose a bunch of radicals decided it would be easier to change policy in England or France by simply passing laws in the EU which England and France were bound by.

      So you might say, but that will never happen, their charter doesn't permit it. Then someone comes along and says "the EU charter was drafted decades ago, by people who lived decades ago, it means nothing today because thigns have changed and aren't the same. I don't care that there is an amendment process to change the charter- it's simply too hard to get 3/4 of the people to agree on what I see needs changed". Now do you see where this is going? If the document that limits the power of government over the people is ignored for your convenience, it can be ignored for anyone else'. So why is there a document that limits the power of a governing body in the first place? Well, because people thought it would be good to limit that governing body's power to avoid certain things. Now we have to get into the founding fathers to find out what those things were and if it's a good idea or not. And no, this isn't limited to just the US, any country that has a constitution or charter or even the EU has founding fathers who directed the organization of that country or governing body certain ways for certain reasons. If those r

  81. I doubt it by mutube · · Score: 1

    I heard that the founding fathers RTFA

  82. For what it's worth by Burning1 · · Score: 1

    I really hate throwing around words like 'truth' and 'lies' given how strongly they've become associated with religious viewpoints and conspiracy theorists, but it seemed appropriate given the misinformation being intentionally spread.

    'Condoms don't work'
    'Marijuana is more dangerous than cigarettes and alcohol.'

    As an aside, it's really disappointed that we've given up the word 'truth...'

  83. Tactically brilliant by seebs · · Score: 1

    Nothing keeps a book from broader publication as effectively as the first printing selling out completely in a matter of days.

    --
    My blog: http://www.seebs.net/log/ --- My iPhone/iPad app: http://www.seebs.net/seebsfrac/
  84. Censorship is when one decides for everybody by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Censorship is not when you decide to not watch or read something. It is your right to do so.

    Censorship is if you'd decide that no one should be able to watch that movie and had the ability to enforce it. THAT is censorship.