PS3 Hacked Using Official Controller

YokimaSun writes "The PS3 Hacking War took on a new turn few days ago with Sony releasing a new firmware that blocks USB devices, supposedly aimed at cloned PS3 Joypads, but more than likely to stop the efforts of hackers. Today the PS3 is now hackable using its own Sixaxis/DualShock 3 Controllers. How will Sony stop people now from playing emulators on the PS3?"

Comments

Give up

[sakdoctor]

Adopt the kindle attitude to hacking.

Re:Give up

[maxwell demon]

Adopt the kindle attitude to hacking.

Kindle the hackers? While it might be an effective measure (however the church had to learn in the middle ages that it only works for some time; but then, I guess a few centuries would be enough for Sony), I don't think it's very legal. Also I think it would not give great publicity.

Re:Give up

[ProfessionalCookie]

be careful, you're playing with fire.

Konami Code

[Ironchew]

Up Up Down Down Left Right Left Right B A

Re:Konami Code

[Anonymous Coward]

B A

Hmm doesn't seem to work here

Re:Konami Code

[Ironchew]

"B A" is vital to the hack. Maybe your controller's already been patched by Sony?

Re:Konami Code

[Anonymous Coward]

B A?

"I pity the fool who hack's my PS3"

Re:Konami Code

[Anonymous Coward]

B A?

"I pity the fool who hack's my PS3"

I pity the fool who spell's all his word's with apostrophe's. English, motherfucker, do you speak it?

Re:Konami Code

[Eudeyrn]

B A?

"I pity the fool who hack's my PS3"

I pity the fool who spell's all his word's with apostrophe's. English, motherfucker, do you speak it?

Instead of spiraling into a grammar rage, as I normally would, I'm just pretending it was a clever possessive apostrophe joke about being "owned". See: "Alot" on Hyperbole and a Half

Re:Konami Code

[Nyder]

B A?

"I pity the fool who hack's my PS3"

I pity the fool who spell's all his word's with apostrophe's. English, motherfucker, do you speak it?

This is a text based forum, English, do you read and understand it?

Apparently, no.

Re:Konami Code

[twidarkling]

Pop culture references, motherfucker, do you understand them?

Apparently not.

Re:Konami Code

[tqk]

OT, perhaps. I've no idea what you're talking about. However, it rings a bell/takes me back ...

Raytheon 500s.

":ex"
":ba"

Card reader starts chunking, tape reels start spinning, ...

I liked that job.

Re:Konami Code

[morgaen]

Did you try BSc?

Re:Konami Code

[lazybeam]

What?

Re:Konami Code

[ooshna]

Say what again! Say-what-again. I dare you, I double dare you mother fucker! Say what one more god damned time.

Re:Konami Code

[raynet]

Have you ever heard of greengrocers' apostrophes and why no-one cares...

Re:Konami Code

[wickedskaman]

lulz aplenty!

Re:Konami Code

[Coren22]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Konami_Code

More than likely

[Anonymous Coward]

This will be another firmware update and poof! All your base are belong to us!

Re:More than likely

[Anonymous Coward]

See, the beauty of this is they can get to load _ANY_ code. even a modified version of the new FW. So technically Sony is teh screwed.

Much thanks

[Anonymous Coward]

Many thanks to all the people who use their time, so that I can use my own hardware the way I want to!

Re:Much thanks

[xtracto]

It must be noted that the hack itself consists in soldering a chip to the PS3 controller... although it is still OK, it is not as good as it sounds in the summary .

How?

[Anonymous Coward]

How will Sony stop people now from playing emulators on the PS3?

Lawyers.

Or politicians. Same thing, really.

Re:How?

[maxwell demon]

How will Sony stop people now from playing emulators on the PS3?

Lawyers.

Or politicians. Same thing, really.

No, not really the same thing. Politicians make new laws. Lawyers try to get existing laws do things they were originally not intended to do.

Re:How?

[geminidomino]

And?

I'm pretty sure that as far as pre-politics occupations go, you'll find "Lawyer" rather disproportionately represented at the federal level.

Re:How?

[Anonymous Coward]

Well, that's why most politicians are lawyers.

Re:How?

[Vegeta99]

So, who's right when the politicians don't write the law clearly?

Re:How?

[bsDaemon]

The Supreme Court. End of story. (until they're all dead and a new appeal challenges the old ruling).

Re:How?

[Vegeta99]

Aren't they lawyers? They're certainly not part of the legislative branch of the government.

Re:How?

[Gerzel]

There is no requirement that they be lawyers, or studied law at all. Though they still have to get approved and I doubt they'd get far w/o some sort of formal legal background.

Re:How?

[Vegeta99]

You are 100% correct, in fact, a great bit of them did not have a law degree. However, once you're a member of the Supreme Court, you are a member of the bench, and thus, a lawyer. At the very least, you are not a member of the legislative branch.

My only point was that law is very rarely clear, and if you think it is, you're not thinking enough.

PA homicide law:
A person is guilty of criminal homicide if he intentionally, knowingly, recklessly or negligently causes the death of another human being.

Intentionally seems clear. It's defined as: Killing by means of poison, or by lying in wait, or by any other kind of willful, deliberate and premeditated killing.

So what if I'm hiding in the woods with my 30-06, lying in wait, hoping a deer crosses my path. I hear a noise, line up at the brown figure moving ahead of me, pull the trigger. Was that intentional?

So what if I'm driving on I-80, moving along at the speed limit of 65MPH, and *pop* out pops a kid crossing the freeway from the woods, 50 feet, or about half a second away from me. I have enough time to know it is a human being, and my vehicle contacting him has caused the death of him. Am I guilty of criminal homicide, because I knowingly killed a human being?

Of course, courts in the first instance would not find me guilty of intentionally killing someone, even if my actions met the definition of lying in wait. And in the second, I would probably not be found guilty of anything, even thought I knowingly killed a human being, in violation of the statute.

So, why does the parent poster think lawyers shouldn't "make the law mean something else?"

Re:How?

[cheekyjohnson]

The government can rarely be trusted to write fair laws in the first place (as seen with the RIAA/MPAA, they're corporate tools).

motion control

[Anonymous Coward]

Maybe this is why they are pushing motion control so hard. You aren't going to hack anything without the ability to waggle at precise angles for 2 weeks!

Most obvious answer...

[RyuuzakiTetsuya]

How will Sony stop people now from playing emulators on the PS3?"

Firmware updates.

3.50 still doesn't jailbreak. You can't go online with a 3.41 firmware either.

Re:Most obvious answer...

[spire3661]

Not completely true. I can still netflix on 3.41.

Re:Most obvious answer...

[RyuuzakiTetsuya]

You can't play games online. Netflix doesn't use DNAS, it just connects directly to Netflix's servers. I'd be willing to bet it's just a normal BluRay.

Re:Most obvious answer...

[Fallingcow]

It is. Evidence:

1. The disc shows up in the "video" section
2. Hitting the button that usually stops a video playing asks you (via the PS3, not the Netflix software) if you want to "quit playback", the same way it does if you hit it during any other video, and saying "yes" doesn't end the playback of the current movie or whatever, it drops out of the Netflix software entirely. The Netflix disc has to get around this by having another button be its "stop playing and go back to (our) menu" button. In other words, the Netflix software is a BluRay "video". Likely very confusing to any non-tech-savvy people trying to use it.
3. It stores data in the BluRay video data folder (whatever it's called, I don't remember)

Re:Most obvious answer...

[hedwards]

You might want to file a complaint with your Attorney General or whoever it is that handles consumer complaints in your part of the world. The only way that Sony is going to stop this nonsense is if they get sued into oblivion by various regulatory agencies.

Re:Most obvious answer...

[Anonymous Coward]

Interesting, I always thought Netflix would be too complicated a service to implement without Java or some other platform support. Just what scripting capabilities does the Blu-ray standard support, anyway?

Re:Most obvious answer...

[Anonymous Coward]

Not true. You can use the proxy hack and change your firmware ID.

Re:Most obvious answer...

[JonySuede]

java, the bd-j subset http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BD-J

Re:Most obvious answer...

[ub3r n3u7r4l1st]

Again lax IP laws (i.e. China) FTW!

Good!

[toastar]

Sony deserves this for breaking my ps3predator, What are they gunna do now disable the controller that came with my console?

Re:Good!

[Anonymous Coward]

Ban the sixaxis as it's outdated now. You need to get a Move to play everything from now on.

Why not boycott PS3s

[Nethemas the Great]

I don't understand why you folks keep buying such consoles and other locked down devices. You're only encouraging the business model. Efforts to subvert the security measures brings risk of criminal liability. Perhaps the "inferior" alternatives would stop being so inferior and you'd get what you really want, but on your terms not theirs.

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[DarkofPeace]

That's a great idea for those who don't have a PS3 yet. For the rest of us, Its a fight to use what we've already paid for. (and not purchasing future product from a locked down device)

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[TrancePhreak]

When I bought the PS3, it had OtherOS and was not as locked down. They changed all that after purchase, which is ridiculous and I haven't bought any more PS3 games.

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[Anonymous Coward]

As opposed to the locked down Xbox, or the locked down Wii?

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[Rik Sweeney]

I don't understand why you folks keep buying such consoles and other locked down devices.

Here's why

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[gblackwo]

copy pasta much?

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[toastar]

I don't understand why you folks keep buying such consoles and other locked down devices.

So I take it you never played BF 1943?

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[Mashiki]

So why don't you file in small claims to get your money back? Chances are they'll simply give you, your money just to be done with you.

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[Anonymous Coward]

We played Battlefield 1942.

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[Anonymous Coward]

Do you play many current console games? Console-exclusive titles are sometimes really, really, really, really good and we can't exactly play God of War 3 on a Xbox360 slim.

No, we don't "need" to play the video game in question, but we want to. Soooo.... necessary evil. Of course, that gives rise and reason to the people that want to do "naughty" (and oft questioned, necessary) things that they shouldn't do.

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[malcy]

Ditto, no more PS3 games, BluRays or anything Sony related for me.

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[theaceoffire]

"I don't understand why... keep buying ... consoles and other such devices".

Allow me to help.

1) PS3 allows any hard drive, any video camera, any keyboard, any tablet, any printer, etc. It allows you to download random files from the internet, it allows you to play random files and store them on the hard drive, and it allows you to download PSN games onto up to 5 other consoles and let your friends play your games on their profiles. Compared to EVERY OTHER CONSOLE, the PS3 is the most free.
2) Most new games come out for consoles now, due to the fears of piracy on Computers and other non-locked-down devices. And for games that come out on console AND pc, the console has less security and more stable hardware targets. For example, most PS3 games have no 30 digit id codes, no constant Internet access required for single player games, and easy joining with friends with games.
3) Updates are not forced. If you wish to use every service available on the PS3 that worked before the last update, you can. It is only if you want the new features, the new games, and the new services on PSN that you have to upgrade.
4) The Other OS was only taken down AFTER someone started bragging about the ability to copy $60 PS3 games and play them. Until then, people could play emulators, PS1 games, PS2 games, n64, etc. Only 5-6 assholes who are too cheap to afford new games but feel deserving of free stuff ruined it for the rest of us. Or did you want Sony to let this turn out like the PSP, which is so hacked that almost no new games get released for it? They tried to open their system, and they got slapped for it.

So yeah, I bought a PS3 to play PS3 games. The fact that it had all these other benefits were just frosting on the cake. People bitched about the price, so Sony took $100 ps2 out of the system and sold it separately so you could enjoy PS1 and PS2 and not pay for it if you didn't want it.

Sorry, you can get back on your high horse about how evil Sony is. Just wanted to point out that out of all the evil companies out there, Sony is the only one letting you use generic parts and share purchases. Ooo, scary.

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[HAKdragon]

I played both... preferred '42 by a wide margin (especially with the Desert Combat mod).

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[Anonymous Coward]

They're far cheaper than a computer with comparable hardware, they don't require extensive configuration and troubleshooting, and they have a lot of exclusive games that are fun? Those sound like pretty good reasons to me.

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[Anonymous Coward]

That's a great idea for those who don't have a PS3 yet. For the rest of us, Its a fight to use what we've already paid for. (and not purchasing future product from a locked down device)

I don't understand why you folks keep buying such consoles and other locked down devices. You're only encouraging the business model.

That's a great idea for those who don't have a PS3 yet. For the rest of us, Its a fight to use what we've already paid for. (and not purchasing future product from a locked down device)

That's disingenuous and you know it.

It was clear from the start that the PS3 was meant to be a locked down device and that Sony would resist any attempts to open it up. The only justifiable area in which people can reasonably complain that they were burned was the withdrawl of its Linux support (which was never sold as giving full access to the hardware's capabilities).

But this doesn't justify your implication of bait-and-switch over the general nature of the machine. The PS3 was locked down from the day it came it, and everyone knew it.

This smacks of people wanting to have their cake and eat it, i.e. wanting to complain on Slashdot about Sony's obnoxiously controlling and authoritarian hold on the hardware, then buying it anyway because when it comes down to it, shiny new tech trumps principles. (Same old Slashdotters' story). *Then* complaining that their machine- which they already own(!)- is locked down. Well, yeah. You knew that before you bought it.

(Disclaimer to tl;dr skimmers, this is not an endorsement of Sony's locking down the hardware, but a rebuttal to the implication that anyone who cared about the issue could ever have bought a PS3 imagining it would ever *not* be locked down).

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[faragon]

Same here: total boycott to anything related to Sony until they remove the Other OS option and recognice they were wrong when fucking paying customers (!) (DRM rootkit anyone?). My boycott includes Games, DVD, BluRay, non watching Columbia pictures movies on cinema, bitching about Sony Corporation stocks, etc.

I also discourage family and friends for doing the same. Screwed once, my fault, twice is being idiot.

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[msormune]

Maybe people just like to play games with their consoles? D'oh.

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[Charliemopps]

I don't own a console but I can understand the appeal. We have 6 computers in our home and in the last couple of months I've replaced a motherboard, a hard drive and a video card. With a console, all you have to do is RMA the whole damned thing. With a PC, if you get a name brand like dell, it's going to suck, be filled with inferior components... oh and you're going to have to pay hundreds of dollars for windows. So you have to build it yourself, deal with the myriad of hardware choices and compatibility issues... yadda yadda yadda. I'm about ready to throw in the towel and do my gaming on a console and just use netbooks for my general PC needs.

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[westlake]

When I bought the PS3, it had OtherOS and was not as locked down. They changed all that after purchase, which is ridiculous and I haven't bought any more PS3 games.

The PS2 "Slim" [2004] also ditched expansion options and the OtherOS. Something that seems to have been forgotten in the geek's nerd rage.

It retails for $100 and weighs 1.3 lbs.

The video game console is a social experience.

It is shared with your family and connects to the 60" Panasonic.

The geek has no leverage.

No firmware upgrades means no new Blu-Ray videos.

Try selling that idea to your wife and your kids when they spot the next Pixar flick on the shelves at WalMart.

No Red Dead Redemption. No MOVE. No 3D. No download content. No video on demand. No PlaystationHome. Social networking and gaming for 14 million.
       

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[Pharmboy]

Changes are they won't show up and there is little you can do except get the judgement.

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[Pharmboy]

The PS3 "otherOS" issue doesn't affect me. I quit buying Sony products temporarily when they did the root kit. Funny thing is, every year or two they give me a new reason to not buy their products, so the temporary is looking pretty permanent.

You know, I really don't miss anything. I still play all the games I can stand (Steam and other PC), and there are plenty of other companies making TVs, stereo gear and such. Nope, can't say I miss out on anything worthwhile.

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[NFN_NLN]

I don't own a console but I can understand the appeal. We have 6 computers in our home and in the last couple of months I've replaced a motherboard, a hard drive and a video card.

I specifically gave up on PC gaming due to the graphics card. Every year you would have to shell out $200 to make the most of the latest First Person Shooter (FPS). Plus my largest monitor is my TV and the PS3 is right next to it (unlike the PC). Of all the evils, the PS3 is surprising the lesser of all evils. (And the super parent is correct, I turfed my XBOX360 for a PS3 due to compatibility.) My PS3 works with my existing BT headset, KB, etc.

Now, if only the PS3 could run XBMC natively it would de-throne my original XBOX on ROI. To this day I got more use out of my original XBOX than anything I have ever purchased, including your mom.

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[Moryath]

They tried to open their system, and they got slapped for it.

Bullshit. They didn't "try to open their system." If they had had a proper way for people to code emulators or legitimate games for the PSP, and they hadn't been pushing that ridiculously stupid UMD as the game storage device (yeah I know, "DS has cartridges", but the DS doesn't have a cartridge slot that eats 30% or more of your battery life) then nobody would have had to spend the insane time trying to hack into the system.

Same thing happened with OtherOS. OtherOS didn't give proper access to certain parts of the system (video hardware especially). The end result was that the Linux guys were trying to find a way to get full access to the hardware. Full access for Linux would STILL not have done the pirates any good, since the games require PS3's OS to run on, but Sony decided to crippleware OtherOS. The end result was no surprise - someone figured out a way to get behind hypervisor and get complete hardware access, and the psychotic, paranoid people at Sony decided to strip OtherOS completely in response.

I'm convinced that what's really going on is that Sony hired behind the scenes one of those paranoid motherfuckers who was responsible for all the crappy Nintendo lock-down crap that resulted in shell companies during the NES and SNES days, blinky-blinky consoles when the "security chip" didn't read properly even on a real game, and then the horrible mistake of using cartridges and then tinydiscs for the N64 and Gamecube, driving all the 3rd party developers away.

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[Anonymous Coward]

"Only 5-6 assholes who are too cheap to afford new games but feel deserving of free stuff ruined it for the rest of us."

So, it's not the bully that's at fault for kicking the shit out of you. It's that guy that pissed the bully off by not giving up his lunch money. Yeah, he's at fault! Get him!

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[Andorin]

> Updates are not forced. If you wish to use every service available on the PS3 that worked before the last update, you can. It is only if you want the new features, the new games, and the new services on PSN that you have to upgrade.

I call BS. My understanding of the matter is that if you want to use the PSN at all, you have to have current firmware. This includes online multiplayer for games you already have. If you refuse to update, you are locked out of playing online.

> The Other OS was only taken down AFTER someone started bragging about the ability to copy $60 PS3 games and play them... Only 5-6 assholes who are too cheap to afford new games but feel deserving of free stuff ruined it for the rest of us.

Another Sony apologist who says the hacking attempt was motivated purely by piracy. Nonsense. If the only people who wanted to crack the PS3 were pirates, then we would have seen a crack much earlier in the console's life, given that it apparently wasn't all that hard. Instead the cracking started after Sony removed OtherOS. Isn't that interesting?

> So yeah, I bought a PS3 to play PS3 games. The fact that it had all these other benefits were just frosting on the cake.

To you. There are also people who bought it largely because of these other benefits. Just because you don't personally care about them doesn't mean Sony is justified in removing an advertised feature after the sale.

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[Lemming Mark]

It's sad when Sony reduce the featureset on newer releases of consoles; they also did that with PS2-on-PS3 compatibility. But with the OtherOS option they reached out to previously purchased, working PS3s and disabled the OtherOS part of the featureset, which I think is a good bit more worrying. They can get away with this because it's a feature only geeks want currently but I expect to see more remote deactivations of features in consumer goods in future. Amazon removed 1984 and Animal Farm from people's Kindle's and, yes, they apologised after a while and tried to make amends.

But the fact is that these companies are maintaining the technical capability and terms-of-service right to take away things people have bought and, even if everyone is acting in good faith, if it's *possible* to do this there are always going to be "good" reasons to do it. Someone's going to feel they're justified in doing it for whatever reason and people are going to lose out - maybe not always enough to cause an outcry but they'll still be people who reasonably expected that things they'd bought would keep working. As long as the capability to remotely modify functionality remains we're going to see things disabled after purchase - unless / until we get some more definitive legal protection over this sort of thing (e.g. case law or new legislation).

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[Sancho]

Nerd rage? There is a world of difference between putting out a new product with fewer features than the older one and removing features from a product I've already purchased through the use of firmware updates.

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[Anonymous Coward]

They tried to open their system, and they got slapped for it.

It sounds like you're saying the problem is in a different place: Going after Sony isn't right because the game makers are forcing their hand. But that means the solution has to be to go after the game makers: Break all their DRM on every popular platform so that there is no longer any incentive to punish Sony for having an open platform.

Of course, that still means jailbreaking everything including the PS3.

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[bunbuntheminilop]

you knew it was locked when you paid for it, so you already have got what you paid for.

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[stoanhart]

I would argue that Sony did bring all this hacking on themselves. Sure, the first PS3 hack made use of OtherOS, but it was very impractical and required hardware modification. Very few people would ever have done it, but Sony overreacted and took away OtherOS. That pissed off a lot of people and suddenly there was intense motivation to hack the console properly. Lo and behold, there are now two separate ways to bust the console wide open and piracy is practical for all users. Good job Sony.

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[flatlinr]

3) Updates are not forced. If you wish to use every service available on the PS3 that worked before the last update, you can. It is only if you want the new features, the new games, and the new services on PSN that you have to upgrade.

No you can't! It's not just "new services on PSN" that requires an upgrade. PSN itself requires it! Without upgrade, bye-bye PSN, yes, even for your old game you used to play on PSN before. Goodbye! Or upgrade. Seems totally unforced to you?

4) The Other OS was only taken down AFTER someone started bragging about the ability to copy $60 PS3 games and play them. Until then, people could play emulators, PS1 games, PS2 games, n64, etc. Only 5-6 assholes who are too cheap to afford new games but feel deserving of free stuff ruined it for the rest of us. Or did you want Sony to let this turn out like the PSP, which is so hacked that almost no new games get released for it? They tried to open their system, and they got slapped for it.

No one bragged about an ability to copy PS3 games via OtherOS, because no one could copy PS3 games via OtherOS! Sony used the hypervisor hack as an easy excuse to remove a feature they no longer cared about. Remember, it was removed from the Slim a long time before any hack!

Sorry, you can get back on your high horse about how evil Sony is. Just wanted to point out that out of all the evil companies out there, Sony is the only one letting you use generic parts and share purchases. Ooo, scary.

Sony consoles are also the only one to lose features over time.

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[Ant P.]

Don't point the finger at them. They are the victims of bait-and-switch fraud by Sony, after all.

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[Anonymous Coward]

3) Updates are not forced. If you wish to use every service available on the PS3 that worked before the last update, you can. It is only if you want the new features, the new games, and the new services on PSN that you have to upgrade.

Note entirely true. I can't play online without updating. It's true that any offline feature that previously worked continues to do so without updating.

4) The Other OS was only taken down AFTER someone started bragging about the ability to copy $60 PS3 games and play them. Until then, people could play emulators, PS1 games, PS2 games, n64, etc. Only 5-6 assholes who are too cheap to afford new games but feel deserving of free stuff ruined it for the rest of us. Or did you want Sony to let this turn out like the PSP, which is so hacked that almost no new games get released for it? They tried to open their system, and they got slapped for it.

False. Other OS was taken down AFTER someone managed to use it to gain hypervisor access, BEFORE someone started bragging about the ability to copy $60 PS3 games and play them. The procedures I'm aware of to play copied games have nothing to do with Other OS, were developed using leaked development hardware and not Other OS, and haven't (yet) been able to restore Other OS.

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[Astronomerguy]

Weirdly enough, Sony's "Media Go" software which lets you transfer music/video/games etc to your PSP and lets you access the Sony Store for the PS3/PSP, has an option to automatically rip CD's to .mp3's or AAC as soon as you put the disk in the drive. The option is even helpfully labeled "CD Ripping". You can go all the way up to 320 kbps quality if you like. Can you say "mixed messages"?

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[Anonymous Coward]

Before the jailbreak, people could not play emulators. Homebrew applications were not allowed, which is stupid. I paid for the console, I should be able to run whatever I want in it.

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[Anonymous Coward]

They opened their system and got slapped for it? I realize they make so much for game licenses. But come on, if they are losing money on hardware they're stupid. If they aren't (which they aren't) they should have 5 or 6 of those in every household and EXPAND the hacking capabilities. Make it the next tricorder. Make it THE THING! Why do these stupid assholes keep hobling their products when they could use the hacks people make and turn their product into perfection?

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[hairyfeet]

Uhhh..dude? You can buy nice AMD quad kits at Tigerdirect starting at $299. Add $100 for whatever OS you want and $50 for a discrete card (I paid $36 after MIR for my HD4650 1Gb and it plays Bioshock II and anything else I throw it at at my monitors native 1600x900 just fine) and you have a PC that can not only game, but do video transcoding, surf the web, do IM, hell you can even hook to your TV via HDMI and go to town.

Then you have to figure in the lifetime of the machine, as I've seen very few consoles last more than 3 years whereas I have PCs pushing the decade mark with the only change being a HDD replacement. You then just pass them down to relatives or use them for different jobs like this 1.8GHz Sempron I'm typing on that makes a great nettop now. BTW no need to pay anything for AV, as Comodo Internet Security is free and from what I've seen has one of the best detection rates in the biz, as well as sandboxing.

So it really isn't hard to build yourself a decent PC that'll last quite a long time for less than $500, and it is really easy to do. Hell my 15 year old built his own Frankenbox out of some PC parts I had lying around, even built his own XP install media with drivers built in, and did it without me helping or even guiding, just basic common sense and the power of the Google. Oh and finally from the sounds of it you may be having power problems, as I've seen bad power from the line cook all kinds of electronics. Better to get a UPS to run all your electronics on, as it don't take much of a spike to fry components.

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[Kohath]

I don't understand why you folks keep buying such consoles and other locked down devices. You're only encouraging the business model. Efforts to subvert the security measures brings risk of criminal liability. Perhaps the "inferior" alternatives would stop being so inferior and you'd get what you really want, but on your terms not theirs.

Because they are fun. Because we judge their value to us as greater than the purchase price.

Because we don't believe in the pseudo-ethical geek groupthink hate campaigns against any company that wants to make money creating high value content. (Or we're just not willing to sacrifice anything of genuine value to pass the faux-ethics purity test.)

You should stop posting on Slashdot. One of the companies that makes one of the components in your computer did something against someone's skewed, self-serving ethical code once.

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[Anonymous Coward]

consoles provide a totem, a rally point for developers. it provides a base line and access to [games] that would otherwise require the presence of a very time consuming hobby.

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[Pulzar]

You mean, little you can do except get the judgment and your money? You don't really think Sony can hide from the court's decision?

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[twidarkling]

Sure they can. What makes you think Sony would give a fuck about small claims courts in any way? The only way to get your money from them would be to sue them for it.

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[feepness]

Sony consoles are also the only one to lose features over time.

Features the others don't bother offering at all.

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[Anonymous Coward]

probably too late to get modded up. but other os was always locked down, you never got access to all the processing units or the gpu....

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[donaldm]

When I bought the PS3, it had OtherOS and was not as locked down. They changed all that after purchase, which is ridiculous and I haven't bought any more PS3 games.

I have a BC FAT which has the other OS and I have not put any more firmware updates since however this is not because I am worried about loosing the other OS option it is just that the later firmware releases are not compelling for me to update. Yes I don't have access to the Store and some on-line features but that does not worry me although forcing an update for trying to auto update the time to me seems silly.

I would not use the other OS on my PS3 anyway preferring to run Linux on my PC's which is a much better way to run Linux, however just by removing the other OS opens up a can of worms in that it would not be that difficult for certain PC vendors and a software company I won't name to come out an state that the only a certified OS (and we all know which two that is) can run on a PC. Laugh if you want but there have been numerous attempts to do this already.

On a different note stating "I have not brough any more PS3 games" tells me a few things in that 1) There are no games you are interested in at the moment although there are some games (ie. Red Dead Redemption) that force an upgrade. 2) You have an Xbox or Wii and prefer their games which are more locked down than the PS3 (well they do try) but you have a better chance of ripping games or 3) You have a PC of which you prefer those games over console games (Steam is also coming to the PS3 as well).

Personally I will upgrade my firmware eventually when I get a 3D TV (at least a year away) since the latest firmware (3.5) does support 1080p 3D movies and 3D games (when they come out), however I don't see anything compelling in the latest firmware releases just yet. To say I won't buy anymore PS3 games is really silly since there are plenty of PS2 (if you have BC PS3) and PS3 games that could keep you entertained for years without you having to upgrade your firmware and lose the "Other OS" capability.

BTW my son has a 47 inch Samsung 3D TV and has played games like "Mirrors Edge" in pseudo 3D and found the experience extremely interesting although you really do need to be careful if you suffer from motion sickness since the 3D effect can be devastating. Note that the pseudo 3D is actually done in the TV not the PS3.

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[JayAEU]

I'm about ready to throw in the towel and do my gaming on a console and just use netbooks for my general PC needs.

That's just about what I did a few years back, when the PS3 hit the market. Today, I can't imagine how I ever coped with a handful of PCs needing constant software and hardware updates and problem fixing! Now it's netbooks for "work" and the console for "play". ;)

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[GigaplexNZ]

Nerd rage? There is a world of difference between putting out a new product with fewer features than the older one and removing features from a product I've already purchased through the use of mandatory firmware updates.

Fixed that for you.

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[petermgreen]

At the time the PS3 came out the choice was essentially consoles which were locked down but generally no-messing required and PCs which had all sorts of compatibility problems and a rising push towards online activation and other horrible protection schemes. At the time sony was being nicer (linux, 3rd party controllers) than the XBOX division of microsoft and had the games I wanted.

Could anyone have reasonably predicated that sony would be removing features (first linux support, then support for standard HID controllers) retroactively from existing consoles? I don't think any console manufacturer has done that before.

I agree those who buy a device in the era of updatable firmware and downloadable content under the assumtion that they can keep it both cracked and able to be used online and with the latest games are being very overoptimistic. The trouble is that those of us who just want to use the machine as originally designed are getting caught in the crossfire :(

Personally I find it all very sad, I like gaming but it all seems so much more painful these days.

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[SEE]

If you bought anything Sony after the 2005 rootkit incident, you volunteered to be screwed over. Write off the money you spent on the PS3 as paying for the lesson you could have had for free, but were too stupid to learn.

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[Anonymous Coward]

Probably the fact that if they ignore a small claims court judgement, you get to go to one of their offices with a sheriff and just take whatever you want, at depreciated value, until you hit the award amount. Yummy!

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[Anonymous Coward]

3) Updates are not forced. If you wish to use every service available on the PS3 that worked before the last update, you can. It is only if you want the new features, the new games, and the new services on PSN that you have to upgrade.

What, do you work for Sony or something..?
Sure, you don't have to update.
Sure, you don't have to play the same games you're used to over the internet.
Sure, you don't have to use the PSN network on the device you paid for.
Sure, you actually don't get to do half of the stuff you paid for if you don't update.

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[Anonymous Coward]

They advertised it as having "Other OS" capability. Lying and acting superior doesn't reflect well on you.

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[shentino]

If I've paid for my cake I damn well want to have it and eat it too.

Especially when they confiscate the pack of Mint frosting that I wanted to put on it.

Now, I may have known that the cake was trade secret and only came in vanilla, and that the baker wasn't fond of any frosting other than plain chocolate. So I jumped at the chance to put mint frosting on it. I did, and I enjoyed it. Then the baker found out that the frosting formula had to be recalled because it contained special spices, that would make it easier for a taste tester to find out the cake recipe.

So, instead of recalling the frosting and paying people the value of the frosting they couldn't use anymore, he sent goons out to everyone who ever bought one of his cakes, and almost everyone had their mint frosting taken away while they were sleeping.

The few people that were awake were told that either they gave up the frosting, or they'd be banned from the bakery.

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[shentino]

Sony never should have offered OtherOS in the first place then.

Once they made a deal with the customer, it was a done deal.

And the lesser of two evils is still evil. Sony's *relative* benevolence is no excuse. They get away with it only because they have enough market power that they can tell the geek crowd to take a hike.

Seriously, I'm astonished how many people think it's ok to let Sony off the hook here with the "be grateful for what you've got" and "caveat emptor when dealing with rootkitters" lines.

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[Mashiki]

Because a court is a court, and believe it or not corps have lawyers who exist for the purpose of dealing with small claims. But really if you're talking about $100-400 vs a $1k lawyer+court costs, they'll just send you your money back without ever having to worry about it.

And yes, summery judgments if you're a now show do exist. Unless you live in a 3rd world shithole.

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[Mashiki]

I'm sure that's good for the GP if they refuse to show. Since in most of the western and eastern world(japan/s.korea/philippines/etc), that's an automatic summery judgment against them. Refusing to show in court is an automatic admission of guilt pretty much everywhere. So he'd get his money. But useful to point out and all that, most corps have lawyers who deal with small claims and that's all.

Also, in most cases for claims of under $1k they'll just give the money and be done with it. Because it's cheaper than having a lawyer on retainer that costs $1k/hr to show up in court.

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[KDR_11k]

The thing was originally sold as running Linux and being very open, they removed that in a firmware update so people who bought the system before then got screwed. No wonder they want to unlock their system again.

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[neonmonk]

Worst. Analogy. Ever.

People should just stick to cars.

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[Anonymous Coward]

no constant Internet access required for single player games

bullshit, unplug your ps3 from the net and see how far you get in a single player game

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[xtracto]

PS3 allows any hard drive, any video camera, any keyoard, any tablet, any printer, etc.

This bit made me chuckle... Seeing how this news is about Sony specifically BANNING the use of "any joystick" with their new firmware.

My thought was... couldn't stores like GameStop (UK)and others who legitimately produce and sell these hardware sue Sony? or is Sony now going to say that "the only use of these controllers is to pirate the PS3"...

I would like to see people porting the hack to some cameras, tablets, printers and whatnot and see Sony's reaction...

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[flatlinr]

So? If someone wanted a console that ran Linux, they didn't buy an Xbox 360 and they didn't buy a Nintendo Wii; those they clearly didn't have this features. Playstation 3 on the other hand did advertise it, people bought the console, and...then it was removed. Bait and switch?

And now USB peripherals will be disabled too? Well, forgive a poor consumer if they are annoyed by Sony!

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[xtracto]

Like using third party controllers??

Uhmmm... I can buy and use cheaper third party controllers with my Wii... and last I saw you could also do it with the XBox360.

For me this really sounds as a huge amount of lawsuits waiting to be happening to Sony...

Just looking a the amount of unofficial controllers shops like Gamestop, GAME, Saturn and the like have here in Europe...

What are they going to do with all that?

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[interkin3tic]

I don't understand why you folks keep buying such consoles and other locked down devices.

We buy consoles based on the shiny games available for them. Most of the console games I own will never be released for the PC. If I can jailbreak the devices I play them on, that's good, but even if I can't, I'm not willing to forego those games just to take a stand for consumer control. I'm aware that this is a shortsighted view, and I'm sure I'd be surprised at the number of games available for the PC, but that's the answer you'd probably get from most console users if they were being honest.

I don't know what to say besides we reap what we sow.

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[Anonymous Coward]

They can get away with this because it's a feature only geeks want currently but I expect to see more remote deactivations of features in consumer goods in future. Amazon removed 1984 and Animal Farm from people's Kindle's and, yes, they apologised after a while and tried to make amends.

Comparing the situation to Amazon's isn't quite exact. If I remember correctly, Amazon wasn't allowed to sell those two books in the first place but did so for whatever reason. On the other hand Sony wasn't under some obligation from an outside source to remove support for OtherOS. They just did it anyways.

Honestly though seeing how many geeks complain of the stunts Sony pulls, they really should have known better than to buy a PS3 with the expectation that OtherOS remains. It shows lack of foresight.

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[neumayr]

> The Other OS was only taken down AFTER someone started bragging about the ability to copy $60 PS3 games and play them... Only 5-6 assholes who are too cheap to afford new games but feel deserving of free stuff ruined it for the rest of us.

Another Sony apologist who says the hacking attempt was motivated purely by piracy. Nonsense. If the only people who wanted to crack the PS3 were pirates, then we would have seen a crack much earlier in the console's life, given that it apparently wasn't all that hard. Instead the cracking started after Sony removed OtherOS. Isn't that interesting?

Actually, he didn't claim that the hacking attempts were driven by piracy, but that they lead to piracy. Calling him a Sony apologist on those grounds is a little far fetched..

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[drinkypoo]

If you bought anything Sony after the 2005 rootkit incident, you volunteered to be screwed over. Write off the money you spent on the PS3 as paying for the lesson you could have had for free, but were too stupid to learn.

Follow that up with the statement that if you bought anything from Sony after they killed Lik-Sang you're a traitor to gamers everywhere, and you're part of the problem. Giving Sony money is voting against freedom.

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[Anonymous Coward]

Theaceoffire said:
"So yeah, I bought a PS3 to play PS3 games. The fact that it had all these other benefits were just frosting on the cake. People bitched about the price, so Sony took $100 ps2 out of the system and sold it separately so you could enjoy PS1 and PS2 and not pay for it if you didn't want it."

I say:
That little bit off hardware to run ps2 games on your ps3 wasn't worth $100 of productioncost or anything. They could have easily left it in if they wanted to.
Sony also could have made the new PS3 models run ps2 games. Even without the extra hardware the older ps3, with BC, had. They have a patent for it. They could easily make BC happen with an firmware upgrade.
 

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[Smauler]

I specifically gave up on PC gaming due to the graphics card. Every year you would have to shell out $200 to make the most of the latest First Person Shooter (FPS).

If you're happy with console equivalent graphics, you do not have to shell out $200 every year to keep your PC up to the same spec. I paid about £100 ($150 or so) for my 8800GT years ago. It runs games at better resolutions, effects, and FPS than any console now.

The best consoles generally achieve with games now is 1280*720 30fps, with poor or no AA & AF (I run my PC at 1920*1200, well over double the pixel count of 720p, with higher FPS and with AA/AF). There are very few games that surpass this, and most of the ones that do do so only in a very limited sense. If you're happy with that with a console, why aren't you happy with it on the PC?

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[Anonymous Coward]

Could anyone have reasonably predicated that sony would be removing features (first linux support, then support for standard HID controllers) retroactively from existing consoles?

Yes. After all, we are talking about a company that intentionally committed computer sabotage, and then got a get out of jail free card for that. So why wouldn't they do that again?

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[GreatNull]

4) The Other OS was only taken down AFTER someone started bragging about the ability to copy $60 PS3 games and play them.

What? When did that happen? Maybe that's just me, but I don't recall geohot, or anyone else, making such claim.

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[microbee]

I am sorry, you mean "sue them in the small claim court"?

Are you flying in circle on drugs or sth?

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[negRo_slim]

Lol numbers and video card features don't a good game make bro.

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[feepness]

Uhmmm... I can buy and use cheaper third party controllers with my Wii... and last I saw you could also do it with the XBox360.

You can still buy third party controllers for the PS3, just like the 360 and Wii.

What they all attempt to do is block knock-off counterfeit third party controllers posing as first party controllers.

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[F'Nok]

Then you have to figure in the lifetime of the machine, as I've seen very few consoles last more than 3 years whereas I have PCs pushing the decade mark with the only change being a HDD replacement.

I have a NES, SNES, N64, DC, PS1, PS2, PS3, Wii.
None of them have ever failed.

All of them (except PS3) are over three years old.

Check your facts.

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[hairyfeet]

Really? Well I got a dead Sega+CD, SNES, two Playstation 1, an Xbox, and a Gamecube, all sitting in the closet to be parted out. Wanna buy 'em?

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[F'Nok]

You are one unlucky person!

On average, consoles seem to have a pretty good lifespan (Xboxes excepted).

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[bill_mcgonigle]

well-put.

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[Anonymous Coward]

This is a great piece of advise for those who were/are considering the device. The issue is for those who bought the device when it was still in its infancy. The initial device had an Other O/S feature as well as being one of the best/ cheapest Blu Ray Players on the market when it was released. Sony has now really shot themselves in the foot here by completely backpedaling on what seemed to be progress. Nintendo or Microsoft need to seriously step up and develop a really technically advanced console and adopt a slightly more liberal approach to the use of the hardware a consumers purchase.

Here's hoping that day comes soon.

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[CaseM]

I assume you mean that we'd be better off on PC's. Yesterday I loaned a buddy my copy of Resistance 2 so he could play something on his PS3 during an upcoming vacation day. Now tell me how I might have been able to (legitimately) do that if I had purchased it on a PC with its one-use CD keys.

Re:Why not boycott PS3s

[Anonymous Coward]

>No you can't! It's not just "new services on PSN" that requires an upgrade. PSN itself requires it! Without upgrade, bye-bye PSN, yes, even for your old game you used to play >on PSN before. Goodbye! Or upgrade. Seems totally unforced to you?

To play online games, you need to connect through their servers and they want all those connected to have the latest updated version?? What is wrong with that? It's all normal. Your argument is better served if you said the newer games force you to have an updated OS. And no one is saying you need to play your game online, in fact only a few games are online only. The 3rd party packaging usually comes with some lines stating "Online play requirements is a broadband connection." Because Sony nor 3rd party makers are responsible for you to be able to game/connect online.

>Sony consoles are also the only one to lose features over time.

Interesting how your memory forgot the HD-DVD from Xbox360 incident. While you can argue, that it was optional add-on. Microsoft did infer that this would be the default media player after some time for the console, so if you bought it, you'd be ahead of the game from those who don't have it. And I don't blame you if you said it's not Microsoft's fault that some company who shall remain nameless said HD-DVDs is now a dead format. Remember Microsoft is part of the council who supported the media format and if they wanted it to, they could financially push the format. Just like IE when Microsoft was way behind on the internet browser war, they pushed their way with $$ to make it the most popular browser.

Meanwhile

[Beelzebud]

My PC supports every major game that comes out, and I'm free to use my system however I wish.

Re:Meanwhile

[Anonymous Coward]

So, you're waiting for SONY to bring the fight to you, then? They will, if they are not driven back into their caves.

Re:Meanwhile

[Anarki2004]

So how is Halo: Reach on your PC? Oh wait...

Re:Meanwhile

[Beelzebud]

I'll trade Civilization V for Halo Reach any day of the week.

Re:Meanwhile

[Beelzebud]

1. Then use Wine, or don't game on a PC. It's your choice, I'm not here to convert you.
2. You're making it sound way more complicated than it is, my friend, and I think you know it. The right Direct X version? Windows Update takes care of that. Was the last time you used Direct X in 1995 or something? The rest of the items you listed can be easily figured out by about 30 minutes of reading.
3. I beg to differ. With PC games I can still modify the games, and enjoy user made content, even if the game has DRM like Steam. I don't mind a company trying to keep their game from being pirated. The console itself IS the DRM. You're not free to do anything custom to any of the software you have for it. I'd say that is more invasive than anything for the PC.

Re:Meanwhile

[bigstrat2003]

I don't have to choose. I played Halo: Reach (well, the campaign, which was all I cared about), and now I'm playing Civ V. :D

Or trying to play Civ, anyway. Fucking game keeps crashing every time I hit the next turn button in my latest game. I guess I'm going to have to start a new game, which is sad because I was doing well.

Re:Meanwhile

[Anonymous Coward]

My PC supports every major game that comes out,

You wish.

Re:Meanwhile

[Beelzebud]

Let me put it another way. Every major game I care to play. Besides Halo and a few other similar titles, I don't see much the consoles bring to the table. I can think of more major games that the PC has exclusively than consoles.

Re:Meanwhile

[Beelzebud]

It's not much of a choice for me, because I have zero interest in Halo games.

Re:Meanwhile

[poormanjoe]

I suppose this is true since Gran Turismo 5 is a driving simulator.

Re:Meanwhile

[DAldredge]

At least PC games can run at native 720p and above.

Re:Meanwhile

[Anonymous Coward]

He said "major game", not a remake of the same god damn shooter we've been getting for the last 15 or so years.

Adding some more polygons, and some realistic physics doesn't make it a new game. I could go back playing Blood, Doom 2, Quake or Half Life and it would feel exactly like Halo, only with better (mouse+kb) controls.

Re:Meanwhile

[Anonymous Coward]

1. Then use Wine, or don't game on a PC. It's your choice, I'm not here to convert you.

2. You're making it sound way more complicated than it is, my friend, and I think you know it. The right Direct X version? Windows Update takes care of that. Was the last time you used Direct X in 1995 or something? The rest of the items you listed can be easily figured out by about 30 minutes of reading.

3. I beg to differ. With PC games I can still modify the games, and enjoy user made content, even if the game has DRM like Steam. I don't mind a company trying to keep their game from being pirated. The console itself IS the DRM. You're not free to do anything custom to any of the software you have for it. I'd say that is more invasive than anything for the PC.

Whoever modded the above post Troll is an idiot. He speaks the truth. Try "Insightful" instead. Also, whoever mods THIS post Troll or Flamebait is... Only mildly correct.

Re:Meanwhile

[Robert Zenz]

...and I'm free to use my system however I wish.

So, you're not using MS Windows or you never read the EULA?

Re:Meanwhile

[Anonymous Coward]

You mean Tribes Vengeance?

Re:Meanwhile

[SuricouRaven]

I'd start with the RTS. Not just a game, but an entire genre of games that consoles don't have. Then the turn-based strategy too, and the overview simulators.

As a PC gamer, I've never figured out how it's even possible to play an FPS on a console. How can you possibly aim with those sticks? Or do they all come with auto-aim?

Re:Meanwhile

[bigstrat2003]

Fair enough, but are there really no games on consoles that you want to play? That seems unlikely, and if that's not the case, you're only hurting yourself if you refuse to buy a console. I respect when people stand for their principles, but there's not much point when it won't change anything.

Re:Meanwhile

[kesuki]

or perhaps he is not an 'end user' wtf cigarette buts huh

Re:Meanwhile

[SilenceBE]

"My PC supports every major game that comes out"

Oh cool where can I buy Gran Turismo, Little Big Planet, Street Fighter, Halo 3 , Mario Galaxy , ... ? And with regards of the titles that are available, for how long will that be the case ? I was a pure PC gamer but support for the PC as gaming platform has been declining for years. It is very easy to say "pc gaming is dead" and I wouldn't dare say that, I rather say that gaming on the pc is on life support.

Re:Meanwhile

[SilenceBE]

"With PC games I can still modify the games, and enjoy user made content" Then those levels that I downloaded in modnations racers, little big planet, ... where created by magical muppets I presume ?

Even with regards of the update of DirectX you still don't get around the shoddy programming sometimes which the only solution isn't a patch but upgrade, upgrade, upgrade.

Re:Meanwhile

[rawler]

Except, if you use it non-windows, not every major game that comes out longer supports your PC.

Re:Meanwhile

[Anonymous Coward]

I'll put it this way: any terms in the EULA that I don't find acceptable I simply ignore, and there is always a simple software cure somewhere that circumvents any obstacles Microsoft puts in the way. The same is true for most other software or hardware vendors. That's not to suggest I'm pirating software -- I follow one license: one machine strictly and pay for the product I use -- but let's just say that if I want to reinstall Windows on the same machine I don't bother going through the hassle of phoning Microsoft for permission or putting up with the nagging from "Windows Genuine Advantage". As a consolation, I also save them the cost of the phone call. Likewise for games that insist on requiring the CD in the drive: that's what "nocd" patches are for. Technically, I'm violating the EULA and I know that. I honestly don't care (I've paid my money) and would like to see them try to sue a paying customer for this kind of violation.

As a last resort, I can wipe the system and install Linux or some other operating system on my purchased hardware instead of Windows. Unfortunately Sony has decided to eliminate the equivalent option for their PS3 customers. More precisely, they've forced their paying customers to chose between continued on-line gaming and maintaining the "Other OS" option, and they've forced the issue *after* the sale of product with both those those features has been made. While that might technically be legal under the broad terms of the EULA set at the time of purchase, it is still highly unethical. If I had a PS3 I'd certainly be looking for a way to restore the functionality of my equipment, and if I had any Sony equipment purchased since their rootkit fiasco, I wouldn't be buying any new stuff because of this nonsense. As it is, I'll just keep doing what I was already doing: boycott. Sony aren't to be trusted. They've forgotten that keeping their paying customers happy should always be more important than pirates.

Re:Meanwhile

[Anonymous Coward]

Are consumers now so locked into entertainment concepts that being deprived of one apparently "hurts" them? This is disturbing, and I'd discuss it at length, but The Family is on and I need to go watch it.

Re:Meanwhile

[Altanar]

"How can you possibly aim with those sticks?" Pretty easily actually. But you're intentionally being dense, right? That's like asking how someone could ever play a flight sim using a mouse and keyboard instead of a joystick, or how could anyone ever use a mouse in Photoshop instead of a WACOM tablet. Have you not tried it out because you have some irrational attachment to a PC? Do you not know anyone with a console and a copy of Command and Conquer?

As for turn-based strategy games, I liked Civilization Revolution on Xbox 360 much better than I liked Civilization IV on PC. (Civ V beats everything, though)

Re:Meanwhile

[Anarki2004]

As far as I can tell, Halo: Reach is a major release. My point wasn't that its a great game, my point was that its a major game not available on PC.

Re:Meanwhile

[znerk]

As a PC gamer, I've never figured out how it's even possible to play an FPS on a console. How can you possibly aim with those sticks? Or do they all come with auto-aim?

Yeah, pretty much - the sticks take some getting used to, of course, but also the system uses a "near enough" aiming system that pretty much amounts to an aimbot. It's a crutch, for sure, but how can you expect pixel precision from analog sticks?
(Never mind that PC FPS games have been pixel-accuracy-required since day one, and if a PC uses the same tech that the consoles do to "make aiming easier" then the user gets banned for cheating...)

Re:Meanwhile

[Stalks]

I've played COD4 on my PS3 and notice that when I hold the fire button down on an enemy and strafe left, it will help me keep the player targetted by a small degree by turning right. In single-player mode it is much more apparrent. For example, playing Zombies when you hit the fire button the aiming reticle JUMPS to the nearest zombie if its close.

Re:Meanwhile

[IrquiM]

They're releasing a PC version of Uncharted 2 and GT5? I didn't know! I have to sell my console!

Re:Meanwhile

[wisnoskij]

I follow gaming a lot and I know for a fact that the PC does not support many major games.

Re:Meanwhile

[znerk]

Fair enough, but are there really no games on consoles that you want to play?

Not badly enough that I would want to waste enough money to buy a decent gaming PC (note: multi-purpose machine) on a single-purpose consumer appliance, no.

That seems unlikely, and if that's not the case, you're only hurting yourself if you refuse to buy a console.

Wow, I better yank my wallet out and throw away money I don't have on a console, then, eh? Who knows, maybe there's 2 games I would want to play (as opposed to your implied 1), and it would only cost me $200 each!
(Consider $200-$300 for the console, plus $50-$60 per game... yeah, not a good value proposition, especially when I can build a good quad-core system for the same price.)

I respect when people stand for their principles, but there's not much point when it won't change anything.

You're right, kinda... Except that it *does* change things when I refuse to purchase a piece of equipment that doesn't suit my needs - the company making it doesn't get my money. If enough people decide that consoles are a waste of space, maybe we'll have seen the last of them at some point.

And before you go assaulting my pricing, consider that I own a half-dozen computers, and my newest console is a Super Nintendo. The computers get used for more than just gaming, and the Nintendo gets pulled out when a friend or relative brings children to my house. In other words, very rarely. More often, friends come over for lan parties, and they don't even have to bring their own systems. When I don't have friends over playing networked games, I'm able to use those systems for distributed processing. Therefore, your argument that I am somehow hurting myself by not shelling out hundreds of dollars to a company I don't like (remember the rootkits, and have you ever had to crack the case on a VAIO?) for a product I don't even want, much less need, is ridiculous at best.

Re:Meanwhile

[hedwards]

Personally, I found Painkiller to be a lot more entertaining than Halo. And without giving any money to MS for the privilege.

Re:Meanwhile

[hedwards]

Not quite, that level of accuracy only became a requirement sometime around when Quake was introduced. Wolf3d for instance allowed you to use the chain gun to hit two enemies on a single shot if you got it right, and you just had to be close enough when aiming.

Re:Meanwhile

[Nyder]

So how is Halo: Reach on your PC? Oh wait...

thank god NO.

Re:Meanwhile

[Nyder]

...and I'm free to use my system however I wish.

So, you're not using MS Windows or you never read the EULA?

EULA aren't legal. They may seem legal, but they aren't.

I can and will do what the fuck ever I want on my windows OS.

I play EQ2 and Sony's EULA says I can't use 3rd party software. Which means, my keyboard driver, my video driver, my video card extra software, is all illegal to run while I'm playing EQ2.

Of course, I go further, with innerspace and isxeq2 so I can script & bot the game to my hearts content.

EULA? Fuck you, take me to court and we'll see.

Seriously, you all momma's boys and girls that do what every fucking piece of paper with rules tells you? You scared to think for your own, and do what you know is right?

You keep giving up your rights, I'll keep taking them back.

Re:Meanwhile

[Kohath]

Let me put it another way. Every major game I care to play. Besides Halo and a few other similar titles, I don't see much the consoles bring to the table. I can think of more major games that the PC has exclusively than consoles.

My 90-year-old grandma agrees with you. She doesn't play games like Uncharted 2 or Red Dead Redemption either.

Re:Meanwhile

[twidarkling]

You are aware that console-based shooters do in fact make heavy use of "aim assist," right? I mean, I hate to interrupt a well-deserved smackdown, but seriously, come on. Just do some searching, you'll find plenty of shooters through the years that tossed in aim assist on console.

Re:Meanwhile

[Anonymous Coward]

Have you ever read the EULA? Hahahha...one copy per machine...each and every user of MS Windows (whatever flavor) breaches EULA everytime they fire up the machine...one copy on the hard drive, another copy popping in and out of memory...it's antiquated bullshit.

Re:Meanwhile

[RoboRay]

Only the ones worth playing.

Re:Meanwhile

[RoboRay]

I've never understood the point of a shooter game that aims FOR you.

Re:Meanwhile

[wisnoskij]

And you are not completely free, many games will require you not have stuff like daemon tools installed.

Re:Meanwhile

[MacGyver2210]

Oh wait, that's right...it's the same Halo I've been playing since Halo 3 came out!

Re:Meanwhile

[Anubis IV]

My PC supports every major game that comes out...

Unless you're living under a rock, in complete denial of console gaming, or define "major game" as "this month's iteration of Call of Duty", I don't know how you can say that with a straight face. Not only can the PC simply not do some of the things the consoles can do (e.g. anything the Wii does), but so many of the big franchises are exclusive to a particular console. And with piracy on the rise, you start to hear stories such as this one about Super Street Fighter IV not coming to PC, despite the fact that Street Fighter IV made it. Don't get me wrong, PC gaming has been my bread-and-butter for years, and continues to be my preferred platform, but your statement was just blatantly ignorant of reality.

Re:Meanwhile

[Anonymous Coward]

Not the point.

Being PC user(s), we're also free to install Linux dual boot, play games in Windows, install any BSD or Haiku if we want to... If you wanna play games in "evil closed proprietary omgomgomggmo" Windows, we're free to do that too.

Re:Meanwhile

[Anonymous Coward]

My PC supports every major game that comes out, and I'm free to use my system however I wish.

So how can i play God of war 3, Uncharted 1, 2, Final fantasy 13, Metal gear solid 4, Infamous ...
Oh right i cant, Just because your focus is fps and rts doesn't mean no one wants to play anything else

Re:Meanwhile

[cheekyjohnson]

"I don't mind a company trying to keep their game from being pirated"

You were correct until you came to this. Do you honestly believe that DRM works in the slightest? Regardless of what you say, the correct answer is that it doesn't. Pirates (rightfully so) circumvent it and it is the customers who suffer. These idiotic companies are just wasting their money and degrading their own customers experience. DRM is worthless, and it has no right to exist in the first place. In fact, some people have gotten so used to it that when a milder form of it exists (steam), people are okay with it simply because it isn't as bad as other forms of DRM. Truly sad.

Re:Meanwhile

[RCL]

So you prefer playing games at 30 fps[1] in 1280x720 resolution[1], without stereo vision, which you won't even be able to emulate (for nostalgy reasons) 10 years from now?

Congratulations.

[1] - Theoretically better rates are possible, but hardly any game developer targets higher figures (sometimes - on PS3 particularly - they are even Ok with upscaling sub-HD resolutions). It's unreasonable to push hardware to its limits because optimizing content creation pipeline pays a lot more than optimizing the performance. On PC it's the same developer-wise, but you can always add more power to your gaming machine.

DISCLAIMER: I'm a console game developer. But I don't think the above will hurt the business I'm in because there's a lot of people who don't even understand what does it mean "maximum 30 frames per second".

Re:Meanwhile

[jimicus]

EULA aren't legal. They may seem legal, but they aren't.

Erm... I'm afraid they are. EULAs (or at least clauses within them) have been upheld by a number of courts worldwide. Just google for "eula upheld" and of the first 10 results, 8 discuss EULAs which have been upheld. (Of the 2 which don't, 1 links to a page which discusses a case where an EULA has been upheld, the other is someone on a forum who has looked at a case of employment law and tried to apply it to consumer law).

I play EQ2 and Sony's EULA says I can't use 3rd party software. Which means, my keyboard driver, my video driver, my video card extra software, is all illegal to run while I'm playing EQ2.

Of course, I go further, with innerspace and isxeq2 so I can script & bot the game to my hearts content.

EULA? Fuck you, take me to court and we'll see.

You know, while IANAL I really would love to see you argue that "this clause is nonsensical and therefore the entire EULA is invalid" in court. Last time I checked, "Fuck you" wasn't generally considered a winning legal argument.

Re:Meanwhile

[neumayr]

2. You're making it sound way more complicated than it is, my friend, and I think you know it. The right Direct X version? Windows Update takes care of that. Was the last time you used Direct X in 1995 or something? The rest of the items you listed can be easily figured out by about 30 minutes of reading.

30 minutes of reading for people who know that stuff, have enough experience to know where to look and what to check. Even so, the console guy spends those 30mins playing the game.

3. I beg to differ. With PC games I can still modify the games, and enjoy user made content, even if the game has DRM like Steam. I don't mind a company trying to keep their game from being pirated. The console itself IS the DRM. You're not free to do anything custom to any of the software you have for it. I'd say that is more invasive than anything for the PC.

While I have heard of PC games that actually require constant access to an authentication server to play single player, I have never heard of a console game that didn't work without net access. I'd say that's more invasive, yes. Sure, the PC version also gives you more access to the game's code, but you pay dearly for that privilege.

Re:Meanwhile

[neumayr]

:D

Re:Meanwhile

[neumayr]

Hm? A shooter game for people that don't like shooter games. Makes total sense, just like consoles for people that don't like games (Wii).

Re:Meanwhile

[neumayr]

Do you not know anyone with a console and a copy of Command and Conquer?

I don't. I like RTS games, play them often, but never ever on a console. Tried it maybe once or twice and always ran back screaming to my PC. And that without any attachment to the platform, most game I play I play on consoles. It's just RTS that - for me - just doesn't work on any platform except the PC. If I would play them, I'd probably prefer shooters on a PC too.
I don't know about turnbased strategy though. As there is no great accuracy required I can't think of a reason why that wouldn't work..

Re:Meanwhile

[drinkypoo]

2. You're making it sound way more complicated than it is, my friend, and I think you know it. The right Direct X version? Windows Update takes care of that. Was the last time you used Direct X in 1995 or something? The rest of the items you listed can be easily figured out by about 30 minutes of reading.

Lots of DirectX6 and 7 games don't work if you have any newer version of DirectX, and Microsoft does not allow you to have multiple versions of DirectX installed side by side. Indeed, because of their amateurish method of loading dynamic modules, you could not physically run multiple versions at once, and it's not just games using DirectX any more. This IS a serious problem in gaming compatibility, and Microsoft's API which was supposed to fix it causes its own problems. Don't pretend this is not a problem, because it is. Let's also not forget DX10 and Windows XP, which also creates special problems which Microsoft has deliberately chosen not to fix even though they are still shipping Windows XP.

With PC games I can still modify the games, and enjoy user made content, even if the game has DRM like Steam.

Unless, of course, the DRM gets in your way. Some games have Steam PLUS other DRM.

Re:Meanwhile

[Smauler]

My PC supports every major game that comes out, and I'm free to use my system however I wish.

No it doesn't. I love JRPGs (we all have our weaknesses), and basically none of them are crossed over onto the PC. Also... Gran Turismo? Many PC ports are bug-ridden junk too (GTA4, Saint's Row 2 for two well known examples).

2. You're making it sound way more complicated than it is, my friend, and I think you know it. The right Direct X version? Windows Update takes care of that. Was the last time you used Direct X in 1995 or something? The rest of the items you listed can be easily figured out by about 30 minutes of reading.

My Vista64 install borks every time I try to install a service pack. And I do mean borks... BSOD on install, then BSOD every reboot after that, including into safe mode. System restore usually works, unless the service pack install has got far enough along to replace system restore with the newer version, in which case it's reinstall time. I can't get access to directX 10 or 11 without service packs.

Vista64 did not even install on my system out of the box - there's a bug with over 2gb of RAM and an nVidia chipset motherboard - BSOD every install attempt. I had to remove one of my 2gb sticks, install, then I couldn't get online because Vista couldn't figure out my wireless card. So I boot into win2k to get online, and try to get the hotfix that fixes the 4gb issue... "sorry, you can't do that unless you're running Vista 64 activated". Then I search for hours and hours, trying all the suggested things to get wireless working, but nothing works. I eventually find a driver for a different wireless card that seems to do the trick. I get online, grab the hotfix, and finally have Vista installed.... until I press auto-update :P.

Basically the point I'm making is : Can you see why someone might want to buy a console rather than a PC to play games?

ps. I would probably give my console gaming up before my PC gaming... but it'd be close - Europa Universalis, Civilization V, TOME, Dwarven Fortress, Football Manager (way better on PC), Counterstrike Source, Dragon Age : Origins, are a few of the reasons at the moment.

Re:Meanwhile

[Robert Zenz]

Uh, yeah...right...because you can use Windows without...uhh...being an "End User" and agreeing to the EULA...yeah...did I miss the irony?

Re:Meanwhile

[Robert Zenz]

That was my point, yes. You're free to install something else and use any other OS...you're not free to "do whatever you want" with MS Windows.

Re:Meanwhile

[Robert Zenz]

Last time I checked, "Fuck you" wasn't generally considered a winning legal argument.

+1 if I could!

Re:Meanwhile

[Anonymous Coward]

Enjoy your God of War trilogy.

Re:Meanwhile

[tepples]

The computers get used for more than just gaming, and the Nintendo gets pulled out when a friend or relative brings children to my house. In other words, very rarely.

Perhaps I have a distorted picture of the gaming market because children live at my aunt's house.

More often, friends come over for lan parties, and they don't even have to bring their own systems.

So how do you find the cash to keep three spare PCs updated with recent gaming video cards and copies of recent games, as well as replacement machines once new CPUs have switched to a different socket? It would be easier if more PC games had a home theater PC mode, but the major video game publishers seem to think there isn't a market for those.

Re:Meanwhile

[tepples]

No, I prefer playing video games with one to three friends whom I have invited to my house and who either don't own a gaming laptop (GMA? Graphics my a*) or don't own a copy of the same game. Due to a tradition among major video game publishers, games available for consoles support this use case more thoroughly than games available for home theater PCs.

Re:Meanwhile

[tepples]

With PC games I can still modify the games

But can you modify them to read more than one controller? If I don't want to make my guests take turns, I have to buy spare PCs and gaming video cards for guests to use, and now that fewer and fewer games support spawn installations, I have to buy spare copies of each game. Or perhaps interacting with school-age cousins has distorted my perception.

Re:Meanwhile

[tepples]

I can think of more major games that the PC has exclusively than consoles.

Perhaps that's because you pay more attention to the PC gaming press than to any particular console's gaming press. What PC game do you recommend for fans of Smash Bros., Animal Crossing, Pokemon, or Super Mario Galaxy? Yes, you can tell I come from a Wii household, not a PS3 household, but the PS3 has its own set of well-beloved exclusives.

Re:Meanwhile

[Anonymous Coward]

Nope: Little Big Planet.

(No offense to you. It's just the mods shouldn't give "5, Insightful" to a post that's clearly wrong. You're likely just mistaken. Our mods are either on crack or trolling.)

Re:Meanwhile

[Anonymous Coward]

As a PC gamer, I've never figured out how it's even possible to play an FPS on a console. How can you possibly aim with those sticks? Or do they all come with auto-aim?

Yeah, pretty much - the sticks take some getting used to, of course, but also the system uses a "near enough" aiming system that pretty much amounts to an aimbot. It's a crutch, for sure, but how can you expect pixel precision from analog sticks?
(Never mind that PC FPS games have been pixel-accuracy-required since day one, and if a PC uses the same tech that the consoles do to "make aiming easier" then the user gets banned for cheating...)

You've not played PC FPS or you would know better than to make that claim.
Doom, Doom 2, Castle Wolfenstein, even Duke3D to an certain extent were all aim-assisted.

Besides that, what does "pixel-accuracy-required" even mean to you?

Re:Meanwhile

[Anonymous Coward]

PC and PS3 are hardware
He is talking about the PC hardware which lets him do whatever he wants
don't change the subject just to get modded up for bashing MS

Re:Meanwhile

[danieltdp]

You should at least mind that Steam don't let you give away your game to a friend. The transformed a product on a license. A not transferable one, BTW

Re:Meanwhile

[danieltdp]

Speed. The stick would never give you the speed needed. On the stick the speed is related to inclination of the controller, which has a maximum. If you get a mouse, speed is related to the actual speed you move the mouse. After you get used to it, if you want to turn 180degrees, for example, you just make a REALLY fast mouse move with the precise distance to rotate your character and make it look behind. This can't be done with a controller. I would have to move the stick to maximum and just wait

Besides, Microsoft had a project for online play mixed with PCs and Xboxes. The project was canceled because the xboxers got their asses kicked every time. Unfortunately, I couldn't find the arstechnica article about that.

Re:Meanwhile

[bat21]

Is Starcraft 2 on your console? Did the Orange Box get any of the massive TF2 updates on console? Every platform has its exclusives. Fortunately, PC is where all the best FPS and RTS games land. Would I like to play some console exclusives? Sure, but not at the cost of the console + $60 a pop.

Re:Meanwhile

[bat21]

Have I played C&C 3 on the Xbox? Sure and it felt like crap. Starcraft on the N64 was fun until I found out how much better it was on the PC. RTS's cannot be played nearly as easily without a mouse.

You must be from Texas...

[Anonymous Coward]

"The PS3 Hacking War has took on a new turn..."

Obviously, the hacking war is failing for more reasons than one...

/facepalm

[kurokame]

Which would you rather get called on? The fact that the article you posted is only a claim not the actual hack? Or the fact that doing this is trivial and has been since the initial hack using the ATMEGA32U4?

USB is a serial bus (it's even in the name). This means that you can easily attach other devices to it. Want to do the PS3 hack by plugging in your SIXAXIS? Okay, open it up and splice an ATMEGA32U4 onto the bus.

Re:/facepalm

[DrSkwid]

> USB is a serial bus

no it isn't, the name is a misnomer

Re:/facepalm

[ChipMonk]

Yes it is. The 2 data lines carry the same bits, using opposite voltages to minimize EMF interference, both outgoing and incoming. Logically, it's still only one bit at a time. Find the connector diagrams to see how that works.

Re:/facepalm

[drinkypoo]

USB is a serial bus (it's even in the name). This means that you can easily attach other devices to it. Want to do the PS3 hack by plugging in your SIXAXIS? Okay, open it up and splice an ATMEGA32U4 onto the bus.

USB is serial but it is not a BUS. It is point to point! This means you cannot easily attach other devices to it. You can't just solder two USB devices to the same wire, you need a hub.

What the fuck Sony? I cant use a USB device now?

[Jackie_Chan_Fan]

Fuck you Sony, You removed the Other OS feature, now you remove USB support?

Why not remove video support too so no one can rip data via hdmi now that it is cracked?

Fucking shit. Sony. you suck a whores shit hole.

Is there a gizmo?

[Anonymous Coward]

Is there a gizmo that will let me re-map the buttons on the controller?

Re:Is there a gizmo?

[Anonymous Coward]

Sure. A soldering iron.

Re:Is there a gizmo?

[NFN_NLN]

Is there a gizmo that will let me re-map the buttons on the controller?

Yes. It's called the fvckin game itself. Start your game, select Options, then Controller and map the buttons however you like.

Re:Is there a gizmo?

[drinkypoo]

Yes. It's called the fvckin game itself. Start your game, select Options, then Controller and map the buttons however you like.

Most console games don't permit controller remapping, only a handful do. More have multiple layouts which also suck.

The USB lockdown screwed me over

[Khyber]

I have multiple 3rd party controllers that no longer work with the PS3.

So lawyers that like cases they're guaranteed to win - who wants to join me in a class action against Sony?

We're gong for full-out charges of fraud, bait and switch, deceptive and misleading advertising, and theft of services.

I think the dollar amount sufficient enough to garner media attention will be 100 BILLION dollars.

Oh, and we need to let the EU know that Sony committed massive fraud against them, as well.

Re:The USB lockdown screwed me over

[gblackwo]

You know it's only the unlicensed third party controllers that don't work right? Regardless of Sony's intentions over the usb patch, why would anyone expect unlicensed hardware to work forever?

Re:The USB lockdown screwed me over

[RyuuzakiTetsuya]

Some licensed controllers from MadCatz have been confirmed to have also got caught up too, I'm suspecting it's a bug in their handler to try to keep certain unlicensed devices out.

Re:The USB lockdown screwed me over

[master811]

It's not 3rd party controllers, it's 3rd party unlicensed controllers which are not allowed. Microsoft and Nintendo do EXACTLY the same with their consoles. The difference is Sony has never enforced this until now.

Re:The USB lockdown screwed me over

[SilenceBE]

"I have multiple 3rd party controllers that no longer work with the PS3."

Was to be expecting no ? You can bet the PS4 will be as closed as hell. Goodbye cheap alternatives, goodbye cheap hdd replacements , goodbye toying and creating your own arcade controller that works fine on the PS3. But yeah now we can run linux, although 99% of the progress is about emulating games and pirating.

Re:The USB lockdown screwed me over

[Khyber]

I'm sorry, you don't just lock out something and then claim to adhere to the bluetooth standard for HID WHILE BEARING ITS LOGO ON YOUR HARDWARE.

Hint: You can't, you're now violating your licensing agreement.

Sony can't do this. Microsoft can because they're using a proprietary bluetooth stack. Sony went STANDARDS and what they're doing is a clear violation of those standards.

Re:The USB lockdown screwed me over

[Khyber]

"Was to be expecting no"

No, it was NOT to be expected. When you have Bluetooth logos on your hardware, you expect any fucking bluetooth device to work with it, as THE STANDARD REQUIRES.

I have some headsets that also will not work with the PS3.

Re:The USB lockdown screwed me over

[hedwards]

Doesn't matter, Sony doesn't get to use it's marketing position to harm competitors. I'd be surprised if the latest firmware updates didn't run afoul of antitrust regulations.

Re:The USB lockdown screwed me over

[AK Marc]

If Sony took an action that inadvertently blocked 3rd party things, then it's the fault of the person so cheap as to not buy official gear. If Sony discovered that 3rd party gear was costing them profits so they purposefully took actions to harm competition, then they violated a large number of laws in almost every jurisdiction on the planet.

Re:The USB lockdown screwed me over

[tlhIngan]

Yeah, and they also disabled a useful 3rd party adapter - the Cross Battle Adapter. Without out I'd find the PS3 almost unusable as the controller cramps up my hand.

At least the Cross Battle Adapter lets me use the nicer (IMHO) Xbox360 controller with the PS3.

Sony, you've kicked me off of PSn because I refused to update. So now I don't buy anything off PSN. I was interested in Move, but ever since this year, you seem to be saying to never buy another PS3 game or spend money on a PS3 ever again. And now you broke the only reason I played with the PS3.

All you've done is made my PS3 a nice blu-ray player. But even that's going away as 3D Blu-Rays lose all uncompressed audio playback - PCM or bitstream (on the slims).

Re:The USB lockdown screwed me over

[TooMuchToDo]

True. Very similar to the Palm Pre trying to emulate the iPod's USB manufacturer code to allow syncing with iTunes. Breaking spec = bad news with standards body who frowns on your shenanigans.

Re:The USB lockdown screwed me over

[grumbel]

You know it's only the unlicensed third party controllers that don't work right? Regardless of Sony's intentions over the usb patch, why would anyone expect unlicensed hardware to work forever?

Why would you expect to require a license for a device that supports standard USB HID devices? You could (and still can, at least the two I tested) plug in any PC USB gamepad or joystick into your PS3 and it will work just fine (button and axis mapping might however be a bit mixed up).

Re:The USB lockdown screwed me over

[nedlohs]

There is no bluetooth logo on my PS3.

Obligatory XK... wait, what?

[The Archon V2.0]

The Escapist's webcomic Critical Miss seems disturbingly accurate.

Oh, the Irony

[Colonel Korn]

Sony removed OtherOS citing worries about piracy, despite the fact that the system was uncracked after years of OtherOS inclusion.

Very shortly after its removal, various groups publicly announced their intention to crack the system specifically because of the OtherOS removal. They very quickly succeeded, and now Sony is going to have to live with nearly instant cracks of every version of their firmware because they riled up the wrong people. Piracy is now trivial on the PS3, with the usual caveat of no online multiplayer, all thanks to some executives irrational fear of at the time nonexistent pirates.

It's a pity that the executive in question will probably be rewarded because the current rise in piracy proves that he was right about the menace of game copiers in the first place!

Re:Oh, the Irony

[Anonymous Coward]

Last I heard, online multiplayer sort of works and the early reports of bans turned out to be a hoax.

Re:Oh, the Irony

[SilenceBE]

"various groups publicly announced their intention to crack the system specifically because of the OtherOS removal"

Don't be naive... People will always tend to crack systems if it means they can get their games for free. The linux argument is just an alibi. Do you see a lot of linux related things comming out because of this hack ? Have you seen the boards ? 99% is about pirating games and emulating.

Re:Oh, the Irony

[canajin56]

So, what you are saying is that they spent years failing to crack it, years. And two separate teams succeeded within such a tiny timespan after OtherOS removal by sheer and total coincidence.

Re:Oh, the Irony

[thegarbz]

Yep and shortly after the OtherOS debacle the percentage (not the number) of pirates looking to exploit the console dropped and a large portion of the people who previously used to use emulators, the PS3 as a PC, or even used it as a small cluster "super"computer were also interested.

Yes pirates have been going at it for years. But with the removal of the OtherOS feature a LOT of other people started getting involved as well, and publicly announced their intention to do so. Also the original hack accessing the hypervisor was created with the intention of customising the PS3 firmware by the same guy who hacked the original iPhone so it could be used with another carrier. So there you go it was that 1% that made a difference.

Re:Oh, the Irony

[ChipMonk]

That is not what he said, and I doubt it's what he meant. With the OtherOS option, there was a lot less need/desire to crack it. Once Sony started assuming their customers were criminals, that's when everything went to hell.

Re:Oh, the Irony

[Anonymous Coward]

Very shortly after its removal, various groups publicly announced their intention to crack the system specifically because of the OtherOS removal. They very quickly succeeded,
Actually, none of the groups that said they are going to crack the PS3 to put back OtherOS had succeed. The pirates crack the PS3 to play pirated games. The software that comes with the crack was to back up games from bluray and the play it without the disc -- nothing else.

Re:Oh, the Irony

[KZigurs]

Actually Sony removed The Other Os (TM) after Geohot published his bus attack (requiring disassembly of the console and randomly poking at data lines while running the exploit).

Re:What the fuck Sony? I cant use a USB device now

[grumbel]

They didn't remove USB support, all the USB device I tested still work just fine with 3.50. Not sure what exactly they are blocking, but it is definitvly not every regular USB device.

simple solution

[Anonymous Coward]

Disable to controller and make everyone buy a Move!

unconfirmed...

[Anonymous Coward]

It is likely that it is accomplished with a teensy++ dev board crammed in the space where the rumble support would be had the controller been a dual shock. The author's report that the controller itself is responsible is inaccurate and uninformed. Although there is a microcontroller inside the PS3 controller, it is so far unidentified and closed to any externally injected code. The creator of the "hack" has plans to release a tutorial shortly, so we will see if that is the case in a day or so.

emulators, huh?

[Anonymous Coward]

Emulators, huh? Sure, keep telling yourselves that it's all about "emulators" (nudge nudge wink wink say no more)

Re:emulators, huh?

[SuricouRaven]

The console manufacturers don't like emulators any more either. They used to not really mind, on the grounds that the NES/SNES era games were utterly worthless. But with the rise of smartphones and portables, and things like virtual console that make micropayments practical, those ancient assets suddenly have taken on value again. Sony are not going to approve of you emulating a Genesis and playing the classic Sonic games when you could be buying them on the Playstation Network instead.

Re:emulators, huh?

[Astronomerguy]

I wish that I had some mod points. You're dead-on.

that's not hacking a DualShock 3

[YesIAmAScript]

If you replace the CPU with another, you're not really hacking the controller itself, just using it as a power supply.

It specifically breaks the argument implied in the /. post (next stop no controllers department) which is that Sony couldn't stop this without breaking their own controllers, because this device wouldn't be presenting itself as a Dualshock 3, but as something else and thus disabling this hack wouldn't disable Dual Shock 3s.

Should have left the abiilty to install Linux....

[Fallen Kell]

Sony, now 5 months after you killed linux on the system, there have been 4 different hacks, whereas for the 3 years you had left liunx being available to your customers, there where no hacks. I think we can now successfully say, "We told you so", when you decided to unilaterally removed an advertised feature from the PS3. The people with the knowledge to hack the system were finally given the reason to do so, because they wanted their linux back, but in doing so, that also released the floodgates of the tools used/developed to the people who simply want free games. Real smart move Sony.

controllers are not licensed

[YesIAmAScript]

At least that's my understanding, that those MadCatz controllers are not officially Sony licensed and never were.

As to what broke and what didn't, I suspect that any USB device that changes its descriptor size on the fly has been disabled, so even the unlicensed controllers that were disabled were disabled as a side-effect, not intentionally. This is similar to what you state, just not a bug but done intentionally (for bad or for good).

Re:What the fuck Sony? I cant use a USB device now

[SuricouRaven]

From what I gather, it's some sort of whitelist of device or manufacturer IDs. The practical effect is that now only official Sony devices and devices that look exactly *like* official Sony devices work. But there is no crypto-auth on them, just some numbers it reads off. Some third-party accessories simply copied Sony's official ID numbers, and those still work. Some used their own, and those do not.

Playing emulators, my ass.

[Anonymous Coward]

How will Sony stop people now from playing emulators on the PS3

Oh come on, don't be absurd. This isn't about emulators, this is about piracy, pure and simple. You can try to sugarcoat it, but 99.9% of modded consoles never touch emulators / homebrew - they're only used to play commercial games without paying for them. Stop trying to act like you're the noble ones, here.

Re:Playing emulators, my ass.

[Anonymous Coward]

Just because you're a pirate doesn't mean everyone else is.

Re:Playing emulators, my ass.

[WhitetailKitten]

Imma call [citation needed] on your (in my opinion bullshit) statement that 99.9% of modded consoles are strictly used for piracy.

Is piracy common? Yes. Is it 99.9% of ALL modified console use? Uhhhh.

FYI, I have a Wii with homebrew and a USB HDD attached to it. There's some cool stuff (including emulators) available for homebrew, and I have all my games on the HDD so I don't have to drag out the discs, potentially scratch them, and so on. And it improves load times. I've committed what is arguably piracy once with the HDD setup by downloading the ISO to a Japanese game that I really wanted to play when there was no indication it was going to get localized into English (there is a ton of voicework and texture work that needed to be translated). Then, it turns out, it was licensed and eventually released, and so I bought the English version, which has been much more enjoyable to play since I can't keep up with the voiceovers and walls of text. Stick that data point in your pipe and smoke it.

Re:Playing emulators, my ass.

[Astronomerguy]

How will Sony stop people now from playing emulators on the PS3

Oh come on, don't be absurd. This isn't about emulators, this is about piracy, pure and simple. You can try to sugarcoat it, but 99.9% of modded consoles never touch emulators / homebrew - they're only used to play commercial games without paying for them. Stop trying to act like you're the noble ones, here.

Data to support your position? Fuck you. Corporate shill.

Re:Playing emulators, my ass.

[danieltdp]

... and the 0.1% that do are going to reply to your post

'supposedly aimed at cloned PS3 Joypads'

[YesIAmAScript]

Where did Sony issue a statement saying this?

I don't see where Sony said the USB changes were to block cloned joypads. I don't see where they indicated what the USB changes were for or even acknowledge their presence at all!

No, he is correct

[Anonymous Coward]

Most professional politicians at the federal level in the US are lawyers. As such, it is in the best interest of themselves and their guild to make "the law" as convoluted, arcane and incomprehensible as possible, in order to insure present and future lucrative job security.

Ever wonder why we have no obvious simple real patent reform? It would cost the lawyers guild too much money. Tax code simplification? Cost the lawyer guild too much money. Rein in corporations and make individuals responsible for all actions? Lawyers guild loses out big time. "IP" issues? and etc.

Look at most issues, and especially with finance, but it goes across the spectrum, and you'll find the common sense easy solution is always avoided, because *it would cost the lawyer guild too much (lost) money*.

Now look again who "makes the laws", then "interprets" the laws? Professional lawyers. A clear conflict of interest this is ignored on purpose. It is always to their benefit to make things way way WAY more complicated than they need to be.

USB Devices and Hard Drives?

[Niris]

What exactly do they mean by USB devices? I use an external hard drive or sometimes a flash drive to put movies onto the PS3 so I can watch them on my TV. Will this feature still work, or will I need to stay with the old firmware now?

Re:USB Devices and Hard Drives?

[CronoCloud]

Considering I just plugged in one of those cheap USB to Playstation2 controller adapters in to my PS2 and it worked fine, as well as a USB hard drive I don't think it "blocks" much at all. Except perhaps controllers from certain suspect companies that made that special USB chip (that doesn't properly follow the USB specs) that could be used to exploit the PS3.

Re:USB Devices and Hard Drives?

[CronoCloud]

Blast I mean I plugged those devices into my PS3 with 3.50 firmware.

No more PSN for me...

[mad_minstrel]

I used to regularly buy stuff from PSN. Then they removed linux. I thought I wouldn't miss it much, so I updated anyway. But I do. So now that there's a hack and a hope for getting linux back, I'm not updating. Sadly, that means I can no longer buy anything from PSN. Too bad. I was hoping to get the new Lara Croft and the guardian of light game and maybe the deathspank expansion. Hey Sony! I have money right here! You can have it if you let me back into your store and/or put linux back in!

SONY will find the remedy

[Anonymous Coward]

Future SONY equipment will come with an embedded ROBOTIC LAWYER CHIP.
Misbehave and the patented SONY EXPLODING BATTERY UNIT will correct your evil ways.

For example.

SONY mobile phone ringing. *RING* *RING*
*click*
- Hello, this is your mobile phone speaking. Yesterday, you connected
me up with a computer and tried to OverRide my virtues with a Vile,
CORRuPted, NeFArious firmware update! DIE!!!

How's that for a future?

Hey, Sony

[Khyber]

Hope you like my continued efforts to beat down your restrictions! Thanks for falling into my trap.

Saying I was doing USB futzing to break the PS3 was an INTENTIONAL RUSE to get you to lock it down so you'd reveal the security hole we've been trying to exploit for the past few weeks.

YOU FELL FOR IT.

Sony, so detached from reality they fell for one of the most basic CIA/KGB tricks for industrial espionage - disinformation.

I have bad enlish

[Anonymous Coward]

i don't know what say in the log list of wording i have to understand the thanks of the respectable for hack psgroove i don't know what it going on does not say much ps3 controller working in house many kids in the kitchen talking parents i hope one day that this is relevant and download controller access to understand the architecture ps3 console with everything on screen looks like workings of hack i hope everyone has good day i will be going back and finding out more hack for controller

In other words...

[Junta]

Just like DRM, a measure that will only hurt legitimate customers.

If they are trying to jailbreak the device, they will have no compunction about designing and releasing hacks that either spoof using existing hardware or new hardware capable of spoofing if some implementations are completely incapable of doing so.

I will say to those who insist on hacking the PS3, just buy a damn computer. A comparably capable system is now relatively cheap, will almost certaintly either have HDMI directly or a port that is HDMI compatible with a totally passive adapter. PS3 BD accessories can be added to a PC via 3 bucks of bluetooth dongle if the system doesn't have it baked in. Linux distros are pretty usable nowadays if the Windows license bumps price up too much.

Maybe the PS3 slim is quieter, but you'd be hard pressed to build a computer noiser than the fat PS3, so I doubt it is for quiet operation. Simplicity of one device is nice, but Sony is obviously not going to help you on that and it's better to purchase devices where the manufacturer will not be fighting you every step of the way to keep you from doing what they want.

Re:In other words...

[nschubach]

My 20G PS3 is pretty damn quiet... the 40G (and maybe the 80?) were loud though.

/. editors?

[Anonymous Coward]

The PS3 Hacking War has took on a new turn the last few days

Along with the English language.

They're not paying for pc games either

[judeancodersfront]

MMOs are the future of pc gaming thanks to the entitlement mentality among most pc gamers.

Who was really surprised by this

[judeancodersfront]

Building a server with a Sony console is a freaking stupid idea.

Re:Who was really surprised by this

[tqk]

Check the archives. Researchers built a whopping supercomputer with ps3's.

Re:Who was really surprised by this

[Anonymous Coward]

So did the US Military. Iran's military did the same with the PS2 (could have been Iraq, I didn't pay attention to the world around me back then).

What about Red Dead Redemption? Killzone?

[judeancodersfront]

The pc gets skipped on quite a few sports games as well.

No it was partly cracked through OtherOS

[judeancodersfront]

that's why they removed it.
Some guy broke through the hypervisor with Linux, I thought this was common knowledge.

Re:No it was partly cracked through OtherOS

[Anonymous Coward]

No, the hypervisor crack did literally nothing to aid piracy, and wasn't useful in any direct fashion to create the current round of hacks, since that required OtherOS to crack the hypervisor.

You might wanna check your knowledge before talking about it being common.

The OtherOS was used to break the hypervisor

[judeancodersfront]

Just read this:
http://rdist.root.org/2010/01/27/how-the-ps3-hypervisor-was-hacked/
The recent usb hack didn't restore OtherOS. It was all about piracy, hence the $150 price tag and piracy advertisement.
There was no people's crackerz army that took revenge against Sony.

Re:The OtherOS was used to break the hypervisor

[twidarkling]

Actually, I'd say that they took perfect revenge. "Fuck you, you took away my options because you're pissy about piracy? Well, suck on this, I'mma making piracy goddamn trivial, you assholes."

Re:The OtherOS was used to break the hypervisor

[judeancodersfront]

Their motivation was piracy and money, not revenge. If Sony had reopened OtherOS that same group still would have tried to sell $150 usb cards containing the hack.

Re:The OtherOS was used to break the hypervisor

[Alsee]

I have no idea what would have happened if Sony "reopened OtherOS". However there is no question that analysis of the PS3 system was almost nonexistent for several years while OtherOS was available. There's no question that killing OtherOS on people's immediately produced a global network of hundred or thousands of programmers all dedicated to getting their systems working again, and and establishing a global network distributing and coordinating thousands of man-hours of expert work per week dissecting and analyzing the PS3 internals and the "security" lockout mechanisms. If Sony hadn't killed people's systems in the first place none of the piracy stuff your talking about would exist today.

A while ago Slashdot had a story where someone made a chart of the various console systems, how long they were out before they got cracked, what person or group created the crack, and the purpose of the crack. It is quite interesting that every single crack was produced for entirely legitimate purposes. Legitimate homebrew coders, people wanting to run Linux, people wanting wanting to to use the console as an audio or video system. It's quit interesting that the people with the skillset to crack a console are almost invariable people with absolutely legitimate intent and purpose in doing so. It is extremely interesting that "pirates" and "pirate groups" don't appear to possess the skills to crack a console. It is only after a console's anti-owner "security" gets cracked for legitimate purposes that someone else makes a minor tweak to the crack to also support copying games.

But the most interesting part of it was that the chart showed that the PS3 system remained uncracked far far longer than any of the other systems. All other systems systems got cracked within a few months of release. The PS3 system remained uncracked for several years. An absolutely unprecedented timespan for any major console. They went on to discuss how the PS3 was the first and only system that allowed people to engage in their homebrew without needing to crack the system, allowed people to run Linux and media players and everything else, all without needing to crack the system. All of the hackers could engage in all of their legitimate activities without needing to crack the system. So all the legitimate hackers went ahead and engaged in their legitimate activities, and didn't bother trying to hack the system. And pirates don't crack systems. So the PS3 remained uncracked exactly because OtherOS was included.

And lets look at the purpose of the first PS3 crack that came out. People were trying to get the graphics hardware to work in OtherOS and for legitimate homebrew games. And as always, the system got cracked for legitimate purposes. And furthermore, that crack did NOT enable piracy. It was a legitimate crack for a legitimate purposes, and it was completely useless for running pirated games. And what happened? Sony pulled a bonehead move. Sony fucked over all of the legitimate users, legitimate programmers, and Sony fucked themselves over. Sony killed OtherOS on people's systems. There was no piracy, Sony just fucked over good legitimate people and hosed all of the consoles, and fucked themselves in the process. Obviously all of those fucked over programmers were pissed off, and highly motivated to get their sabotaged consoles working again. All those programmers started woking on getting all of their legitimate projects working again. And in analyzing the systems to fix the OtherOS ability they came across a partial crack in part of the system, but the hole wasn't big enough to re-enable OtherOS, so they just kept on working. Of course that partial hole effectively became public when they discovered it and analyzed it on their message boards. And someone made a minor tweak to that crack allowing copied games to be loaded.

And there you have it. There was no piracy crack because of OtherOS. There was no piracy even when OtherOS was cracked to legitimately enhance graphics support. But by nuking the legitimate

Re:The OtherOS was used to break the hypervisor

[Alsee]

Actually there was a large project dedicated to re-enable OtherOS, and I don't think it would be accurate to classify that work as revenge. During that work they found a partial hole, but it wasn't good enough to enable OtherOS. That partial hole became public on their message boards. The crack was a side effect of legitimate work, and perhaps it was revenge when someone repurposed it with a minor tweak to load copied games.

-

Re:The OtherOS was used to break the hypervisor

[judeancodersfront]

And in analyzing the systems to fix the OtherOS ability they came across a partial crack in part of the system, but the hole wasn't big enough to re-enable OtherOS, so they just kept on working.
Problem here is that you have absolutely no proof of this. You just want to believe that the USB hack was created out of revenge.

The other problem with your rant is that you didn't acknowledge that Hotz broke out of the hypervisor before OtherOS had been removed. He used Linux within OtherOS to do it, and that is why Sony removed it. They did not remove it randomly to be dicks.

Re:The OtherOS was used to break the hypervisor

[Alsee]

Problem here is that you have absolutely no proof of this.

Their work and discussions are all sitting on an open public message board!

I don't own a PS3 and I wasn't involved, but I am a hacker-type and I went there to read the technical details when the story came up. I can't imagine a better "proof" of what happened than the public transcripts of everything that went on.

The other problem with your rant is that you didn't acknowledge that Hotz broke out of the hypervisor before OtherOS had been removed.

Yes I did:

"And lets look at the purpose of the first PS3 crack that came out. People were trying to get the graphics hardware to work in OtherOS and for legitimate homebrew games. And as always, the system got cracked for legitimate purposes. And furthermore, that crack did NOT enable piracy.

Sony didn't remove OtherOS randomly. They removed it out of paranoia, out of their obsession for control, and out of stupidity. The crack broke the broke out of the hardware limitations on OtherOS, but it did not put you in the GamesOS. It did not load copied games.

You just want to believe that the USB hack was created out of revenge.

After Sony stupidly killed OtherOS, all those programmers who were running Linux and programming their own software for the PS3 went into overdrive trying to get their systems working again. It is all publicly documented on their message boards how they found a hole in the system and they attempted to use it to reactivate OtherOS. Software was written and posted for exploiting that hole. No one was able to leverage that particular hole to get into OtherOS. Note that the exploit software they created and posted to work on with specifically deactivated the system call for loading games. It was obvious that any moderately competent programmer could re-write it to reactivate game loading, but they specifically made the effort to switch that functionality off in the version they posted and worked with. They were trying to fix the OtherOS that Sony deliberately broke.

Of course once that hole was discovered and publicly posted to work on, it was trivial for any minimally competent programmer to turn game loading back on. I don't know who did that, and I did not claim to know it was for "revenge". That is certainly a plausible explanation, but I don't know. But that was not the claim or point I was making. My point was that systems get cracked by legitimate hackers for absolutely legitimate purposes. Once they accomplish the expert feat of cracking past the anti-owner security system it is usually trivial for someone to adapt it to copying games.

My point was that the PS3 remained uncracked for years is exactly because they included OtherOS which (mostly) enable all those expert hackers to do the stuff they wanted to do without needing to crack the system. My point is that when the fist crack did show up all it did was legitimately free up the hardware restrictions in OtherOS, it did NOT work for games. My point is that Sony fucked over console owners, and they fucked themselves over when they killed OtherOS. The second crack, the crack that didn't work for OtherOS, the crack that only worked in games mode, the crack that was repurposed for game copying, it was only discovered and publicly analyzed as a side effect of the HONEST and LEGITIMATE work to re-enable Linux and other other software.

My point is that Sony wouldn't have the current problem if they weren't so moronically and maliciously destructive.

-

Especially when emulators run just fine on a pc

[judeancodersfront]

I still don't understand what kind of lame ass pirates when there are so many ways to get cheap used games these days.

Re:Especially when emulators run just fine on a pc

[Cheesy Fool]

Don't most game publishers/developers consider used games just as bad as pirating?

Re:Especially when emulators run just fine on a pc

[judeancodersfront]

No because at least with used sales there was a new purchase at some point.

There was just some game company employee a while back that compared used sales to piracy. It wasn't the position of the company.

Re:What the fuck Sony? I cant use a USB device now

[Anonymous Coward]

C'mon, tell us how you really feel.
FWIW, I'm screaming right along side you Bubba, but my opinion of SONY is slightly less pleasant.
SONY doesn't deserve to be in a free market.

How do they fix it? Simple...

[Pichu0102]

How to fix this? They send warnings to people that older models of Sixaxises and Dualshock3s will be disabled, and run a replacement program for controllers that has you send in your disabled controller for a fixed one. At a fee and your own shipping costs, of course.

So what?

[judeancodersfront]

Whoever was in charge the hardware made a mistake.

When choosing hardware for a cluster long term support should be considered. Sony was a poor choice in this regard.

Re:So what?

[V!NCENT]

Didn't he US navy or something do this? It was freaking genious because it's the US government who can basicaly tell Sony to do anything they want or to GTFO.

It was extremely cheap and it needed only a few PS3's. Even if it would totaly break within a year it would totaly be cost effective ;)

Re:So what?

[judeancodersfront]

It was the Air Force and the US government is not going to tell Sony to change their policies just because some government IT guy made a mistake.

Re:So what?

[Doc Ruby]

The lab that built the supercomputer is the long-term support. That's computer science, not just computer engineering or computer techniques. Sony's $500 6-SPU Cell + Gb-e per node was an excellent choice, especially since raw Cell blades cost $5000 at the time.

Re:So what?

[V!NCENT]

Air Force: "Hey Sony, we're intersted in supercomputing and-"
Sony: "Free marketing!!! WHooooHOOOO!!! How much do you want?"
Air Force: "If it breaks then wha-"
Sony: "Are you kidding!? Don't talk about it; we'll just send you a few new unlocked PS3's, WHOOOOOOOOTTTTTT!!!!!! PS3 used by the US Air Force for supercomputing FREE MARKETING WOOOOOTTT!!!!!"
Air Force: "Send us 15 units?"
Sony: "Are you kidding? 15*300 = 4500 dollars for marketing? Want 20?"

they cripple OtherOS to preserve their revenues

[YesIAmAScript]

Sony get a licensing fee per game sold for PS3. They don't make money when you buy a PS3.

If you could use all the hardware from OtherOS, then developers would just ship their games to run under OtherOS and not pay any licensing fees to Sony.

So Sony crippled OtherOS, same as they crippled NetYaroze and PS2 Linux. But even uncrippled, OtherOS still sucked. By the time Sony yanked it, PS3 was $400 and vastly inferior to any Linux machine you could build for $400 (and took twice the electricity to run!).

UMD was stupid. Selecting spinning media right at the time when solid state storage became very cheap was a huge mistake. But that is not why people hacked PSP. People hacked PSP because they wanted to get games for free. This is the same reason they hacked GBA and DS, neither of which had spinning media.

Re:they cripple OtherOS to preserve their revenues

[Moryath]

The people who hacked hypervisor didn't give two shits about "getting games for free." It was about getting linux running with full hardware access.

The people who hacked the PSP didn't give a shit about "getting games for free" either. They did it because they wanted to get their programs and code to run freely - things like a proper browser that didn't suck ass (come on Sony, would it have KILLED you to allow space for a swap file from the memory stick?).

GBA and DS - I could believe you, or I could look at the library of fully freely available homebrew games only loadable via flash cart.

Now, do these eventually get co-opted by those who want to "get games for free"? Probably so. All systems get hacked over time, it's in the nature of systems. Depending on how prevalent the system, and whether there are options otherwise, it can take a short or long time. Sony knew, when they killed OtherOS, that they were immensely speeding up the process, and anything else they do from this point is just the result of their being too paranoid, senile, or incompetent to know better.

Re:they cripple OtherOS to preserve their revenues

[danieltdp]

I would do something that I don't like, but it comes out perfectly on this occasion:

The people who hacked hypervisor didn't give two shits about "getting games for free." It was about getting linux running with full hardware access.

The people who hacked the PSP didn't give a shit about "getting games for free" either. They did it because they wanted to get their programs and code to run freely

[CITATION NEEDED]

Re:they cripple OtherOS to preserve their revenues

[sourICE]

Surprisingly, PSP still has new titles actively being released/developed for it. I don't think piracy hurts anything in the industry as much as the media likes to make it sound; if people have the money to pay for a game they enjoy, they purchase it and as far as I'm concerned that's the end of the story.

Countdown starts...

[Mathinker]

> Hint: You can't, you're now violating your licensing agreement.

It wouldn't surprise me if the countdown has started to amend that licensing agreement with language similar to "device whitelisting is allowed solely for the prevention of circumvention of protections to intellectual property rights blah blah blah", so that cases like this are given the green light.

Don't forget that the Bluetooth consortium is just a bunch of megacorps --- hey, guess what? How surprising! Sony is a member!

Nothing to see here

[Anonymous Coward]

The forum is in the sudaca language so some of you do not understand it. What that clown has done is put a micro controller inside of the sixaxis case, nothing more. Hardly using the sixaxis to hack anything and nothing revolutionary.

fake

[Anonymous Coward]

Is a fake, is just a mod chip into the siaxis.

Other OS was just a way to avoid taxes in EU

[jbssm]

4) The Other OS was only taken down AFTER someone started bragging about the ability to copy $60 PS3 games and play them. Until then, people could play emulators, PS1 games, PS2 games, n64, etc. Only 5-6 assholes who are too cheap to afford new games but feel deserving of free stuff ruined it for the rest of us. Or did you want Sony to let this turn out like the PSP, which is so hacked that almost no new games get released for it? They tried to open their system, and they got slapped for it.

Wrong. You clearly don't know why the other OS feature was part of the original PS3. That feature was there because in EU there was a tax reduction to a product that allowed users to program it. Sony made the same bullshit with the PS2 and some kind of shitty BASIC language. Now that law doesn't exist anymore, so Sony, having no monetary incentive to keep it, removed it. They never did it out of love for a open platform.

Local multiplayer

[tepples]

I don't understand why you folks keep buying such consoles

For local multiplayer. The major video game publishers have a tradition against optimizing their products for home theater PCs. Ideally, a PC game could be used with a 32" HDTV and four gamepads. But most PC games require a separate PC, monitor, and copy of the software per player. This can get expensive in households with more gamers than gaming PCs. In fact, games in genres that depend on local multiplayer, such as Bomberman-style games and fighting games, tend to be single-console or multi-console releases where a PC port is conspicuous by its absence. I own a Wii instead of a PLAYSTATION 3, so I can't name any popular PS3 titles, but what's the PC alternative to console games like Super Smash Bros.?

Who would have thought..

[Anonymous Coward]

This, from the people who brought you the "Sony Root Kit"

Who'da thunk it...

PSN sharing

[tepples]

I have never heard of a console game that didn't work without net access.

Phantasy Star Online. Final Fantasy XI. Even apart from MMORPGs, when you're playing an Xbox 360 game that isn't on a disc and was purchased on a different console, you have to log in to Xbox Live so that the console can get the decryption key to load the game. Some PS3 games published by Capcom and sold through PSN require an online check to make sure the player isn't using the "game sharing" feature of PSN; Final Fight is an example.

Re:PSN sharing

[neumayr]

Online games, naturally.
But I didn't think about download games, you have a point there.

Re:What the fuck Sony? I cant use a USB device now

[H0D_G]

What? How the hell did this get modded insightful? It's inaccurate and misleading.

Emulators my arse.

[Rational]

The "emulators" issue is just a red herring; this is mainly, if not solely, about running pirated software. If you want to run "homebrew", you buy a PC, which is *meant* to run unsigned, unprotected code, not a machine which is both built for and sold as a completely closed system. And if what you enjoy is the thrill of the cat-and-mouse game with the hardware vendor - well, that's what you're getting, so there's no reason to complain either.

SONY Can Bite Me....shutting out hardware

[Anonymous Coward]

Hey SONY So what, I bought a "SONY" PS3 Dual Shock controller from China, yeah so it had the "SONY" And Dual Shock Controller Six Axxis on it and works JUST Like yours. Oh and i Paid $26 for it. But u had to go ahead and update 3.50 with a lockout of this controller because its not authorized. I PAID for it, I have the right to use it on the Systsm I PAID for. So I guess I am going to stick it back to you SONY...I bought an ACTUAL OEM Controller and you will get back the one you shut out with the software update when I go back to the store saying it doesnt work for some reason. Eat It Sony!