Slashdot Mirror
Tron: Legacy
In preparation for this weekend's release of Legacy, I re-watched the original Tron. Yes, I own the DVD. I thought I would watch it ironically and sarcastically, but it turns out I just can't. I really like the original. As for the sequel, I'm not going to write a full review, but I'll say that the visuals were pretty amazing. The CG Jeff Bridges was pretty darn close, but just not quite there. And the light cycles were awesome. What are your thoughts?
My thoughts are: just because what you wrote exceeds Twitter's 140 char limit doesn't mean you should post it to Slashdot's front page intead.
i think the CG Jeff Bridges was sorta done poorly to give the impression of c. 80's technology. ya know? just like the real Jeff Bridges' dialog...
Daft Punk is amazing. The soundtrack fits into a movie of this type so well, I just had to buy it right after watching the movie on IMAX. The Daft Punk music suits a movie like Tron so much more than the original's symphonic score, I think.
Also, watching Michael Sheen do this unholy cross between Ziggy Stardust and Frank-N-Furter is hilarious.
My postings are informational and does not constitute legal advice. Act on it at your risk.
Taco posts and no replies??
wtf?
Prospecting Stinks. Stop Wasting Time on Cold Calling.
Does the new one have more of the corny computer science jokes the first one had? I remember lots of corny references to bits and bytes and things like that, which for someone with a CS background it was pretty funny.
Visually it was...perfect. It captured the feelings I got from books like Snow Crash and (especially) Neuromancer of a virtual world. The towers of darkness and light. The story was okay, not great but not awful. It more or less met my expectations story-wise but blew me away in the visual department. I actually got giddy the first time they showed the city from far away. Music was both good and not so good. Some of it was absolutely great and other bits a bit generic. And CGI Jeff Bridges was definitely skiing the Uncanny Valley. And while I was kind "eh" on Olivia Wilde beforehand I now have a huge crush on her. Sheesh.
The film was Tron merged with a Vin Diesel movie. And while some of it was good, and keeping Flynn having 80's exclamations as he's been isolated so long was a nice touch. Unfortunately the plot and writing hadn't evolved past the 80's like the graphics had.
Overall, I enjoyed it and the sneaked in references to 80's movies but I think they could have done better.
But I liked it.
And I got a kick out of the David Bowie-esque character. Hillarious.
It was a good romp in keeping with the spirit of the original film, but I have to say that the 3D effects were, with one exception, uremarkable and few and far between. I was disappointed to note that the 3D glasses darkened the film in general and when I took them off for comparison during 2D scenes, the colours were much move vivid. Worth seeing for the effects and not so much for the storyline which strings them together. A good effort, but I wonder if seeing the film in 2D (ie: without the glasses) would be more visually stunning.
End of Line.
AT&ROFLMAO
For me, the sequel was a total bore. I mean, don't get me wrong, the CG was very good, and the soundtrack was amazing.. but I mean, the first one was mostly about exploring this new world and concepts and CG that had never been seen before. But the reality now is, CG is second nature; it's used everywhere. And the world? Well I already knew about it from #1. There was nothing new. They gave what the people who loved the original wanted to see, but new new ships or anything.
More importantly, you can't just spend 90% of a movie on dramatic entrances and poor dialogue and expect it to hold up. If you don't believe me, re-watch legacy and count just how many dramatic entrances took place. The fact is, they had all the ingredients for making a truly amazing movie, and they completely failed to deliver. I wish it wasn't so.
That's redundant! Sarcasm is irony.
I've re-watched the original Tron on occasion over the years, and just recently last week in preparation for the new movie (which I haven't seen yet, because every theatre in my city has it in headache-vision only, but that's another rant).
Maybe it's just me, but I find it holding up less and less as time goes on. The first part of the movie is cut very poorly and frequently jumps around for no real reason. Once Flynn is in the Tron world, the movie ever-so-slowly gets rather tiresome and boring. Now, part of this is me just being used to modern movies that have a much quicker pace overall, but it's more than that. There really just isn't all that much story here. And all of it is hurriedly explained in the first 15 minutes or so, so the rest of the movie is just a Lord of the Rings style quest without much actually happening.
Now, visually - I'm one of the few that still think the effects hold up. They just have a unique look to them that really exists in no other movie of its time or any time. It always surprises me upon re-watching to realize just how many computer graphics were used. Knowing how much effort when into them, I always think there must only be a few shots, but it never ceases to amaze me just how often you see them. Plus, the costume effect is just something we'll never see replicated again.
If it's on in the background on mute, Tron is a pretty cool movie still. But actually trying to watch it? I'm just as likely to fall asleep somewhere around the 45 minute mark as not.
Not sure how much this will be considered Flamebait on Slashdot :)
Endless arguments over trivial contradictions in books written by ignorant savages to explain thunder in the dark.
I'm a huge fan of tron, the first one was amazing but this was better, is one of the few exceptions where a sequel is better than the first one.
There were several real, appropriate examples of UNIX in the movie. Things like "ps -ef | grep badprocess" and "kill -9 badprocessid". I caught that as it went by very quickly and was surprised at the accuracy.
/usr/bin/history to see what his last commands were. That whole sequence was pretty accurate.
Overall though, I left the movie feeling a bit uninspired. Not that it was bad movie... it was just felt rushed with no real sense of drama.
One of the displays showed a very Solairs looking version of top and login. I doubt this circa 1983 teminal had Solaris on it however.
I also thought it was cool that the son looked to see what the father was up to by starting a bash shell and running something like
Tron:Legacy was like watching glow-in-the-dark paint dry. This was like "Avatar: the Last Electronbender"
and all I'll say is that the new one made me feel the same way (as an adult) that the original made me feel as a child. Yes, the graphics are cool, but the coolest thing is the sense of infinite possibility you get from the scenery. CGI jeff bridges looked alright but didn't sound great as they had to use old jeff bridges voice with young jeff bridges face. Lots of nods to the original, definitely rewatch before seeing the new one. Overall very good. Some pacing issues, but that is similar to the original.
In Soviet Russia jokes are formulaic and decidedly non-humorous.
After watching it, I was quite disappointed. It was all flash and no story (at least in my opinion). A few of things really bothered me....
Visually the movie was nice to look at, but it lacked a lot of what made the original movie so cool. And that was a good story. Unfortunatly, this seems to be par for course in Hollywood these days, so I'm not too surprised.
The real Sig captains the Northwestern. This one captains
And my 20 year old college student son came back from seeing it and said it sucked.
So I think I'll put it in my netflix queue instead.
It had some great visual evolutions from the original, and some interesting bits of the past come back, but at the same time, some of the characters did not quite work. There was a lot of wasted potential.
I thought that the "de-aged" CG faces were pretty great, and a wonderful touch for the movie. I don't think I would have noticed the effects right away if I didn't know they were going to be there. That being said, I was thrown off by the mouth. it just felt the slightest bit off, like it wasn't wide enough, or large enough. It didn't quite match up perfectly. The lighting on the first time we see CG Bridges was kind of off, but it worked great for the darkness of The Grid. I got used to it as the movie went on, and noticed the differences less and less. I think it was ultimately a great decision to go forward with those effects, it could be said that having that juuuust slightly uncanny look that we get from CLU adds to his character as exactly what he's meant to be: a computer rendered clone of his creator. Oh, and spoilers, I totally didn't realize that Tron was *also* a CG face until perhaps the next day when I read about it. So that just goes to show. If you weren't looking for it, you didn't see it.
After what George Lucas did to my bloody rectum, this wasn't so bad.
Tron Legacy is like the Super Mario Bros movie, but with programs instead of dinosaurs
Quorra is hot. End of line.
There's a theory that you only truly listen to a song or watch a movie once, and every time after that you are (perhaps subtly) analyzing it. When I watch Tron now, I am struck by three things in particular, depending on which lens you look at it through.
First, it's a really interesting interpretation/presentation of intellectual property laws. The whole movie is essentially personality rights projected onto the works created. A programmer has their own personality imbued within the program itself, defining how the program behaves, and from what I gather Tron: Legacy continues this trend. The programs, as works of art, act as extensions of their creators into the digital world. Flynn is essentially trying to win back his intellectual property from Dillinger (creative name, huh?), who is now profiting from Flynn's work through copyright infringement. It's no surprise that Disney portrays a hero as someone who fights to preserve his own intellectual property, a Lockean interpretation (Flynn/we did the work, only Flynn/we should have the rights to programs/Steamboat Willie).
Second, the movie is steeped in the geopolitical conflict between the USA and the USSR. Master Control Program is red, as are all of its input and output streams; once Flynn and Tron succeed all the red turns to blue. Hell, Dillinger is even okay when the sentient MCP hacks the Kremlin, but balks when it goes after the Pentagon. There are obvious ties to IP law on the national scale as well, but the movie is a strong symbol of the struggle between global powers in the 80s, albeit with cooler fight sequences.
And, finally, as a South Park fan, it's hilarious to see Moses as MCP.
I live in constant fear of the Coming of the Red Spiders.
I went to see it on Saturday night. I opted for the 3D version, and purchased tickets in advance, via "Fandango". Despite all the warnings I heard about the Friday opening being "packed full" -- it turns out I shouldn't have wasted the extra few bucks on service fees getting my tickets online, in advance. The theater for the 10:05PM show only had about 15-20 people in it!
Here's the stuff I found most notable:
1. As everyone else is saying, the visuals were top-notch. I really liked the "updated look" to the light cycles, and especially the ribbon trails they left behind them. The effect of people getting de-rezzed was amazingly good too. Even the re-imagination of the traditional Walt Disney castle logo at the beginning of the movie was very cool. The 3D was subtle, which I actually liked. If you were expecting to see Flynn chucking a disc so it looked like it was headed right out of the movie screen and into the theater? Nope... sorry. No gimmicks like that. Just a little added depth to the digital world. I think you won't lose any enjoyment if you skip the 3D version, but as long as you're paying today's ticket prices to see it on a big screen anyway? It's worth going with the 3D version, if it doesn't cost extra, or the extra fee is less than the price of a small soda!
2. The Daft Punk soundtrack fits the theme of the movie, and yes, it's not bad. But in certain spots, I thought it was mixed too loudly and becomes "overbearing", as if it's competing for your attention with what you're actually trying to watch on the screen.
3. I still have kind of mixed feelings on how "60's hippie" they tried to make the Tron world. I mean, Jeff Bridge's character's whole "zen" thing wasn't something I expected at all out of this sequel. Does it work? Yeah, because it helps explain a few questions you might be tempted to ask, like "If he's the creator of this whole universe and has the power to revise code, at will? Why has he been so restrained at doing proactive things to better the situation for the inhabitants?" But you couple all of that with the "Zeus" character who has that crazy David Bowie vibe going on, and arch-enemies who all do things in the vein of "big corporation" or "trying to take over the world" -- and you're looking pretty squarely at the hippie vs. establishment stereotypes.
4. There really wasn't much Tron in this Tron. He practically made a cameo appearance! Since he's many people's favorite character of the original, I thought he deserved a little more screen time.
Overall? I enjoyed/liked this movie, and I think they did a good job of trying to respect the original, instead of stomping all over it, like SO often happens when they sequel a movie that was made so much earlier. In the end though? Given the original's whole premise, I'm not sure how this could have been re-made to have a fully believable story-line or deep plot/message? Much of the "magic" of the original Tron came from the fact that back in the 80's, computers were still a brand new and fascinating thing for a lot of us. As kids, we saw Tron and said "Wow.... that's a pretty cool way to imagine what the inside of a computer would be like if you could really become a part of one!" Now, almost 30 years later? We've all progressed far past the extent of computer games being things as "basic" as a light-cycle or person vs. person battle with throwing discs, and computer have become as much of a commodity item as our washers or dryers. We've all seen plenty of movies covering more expansive concepts like the entire Internet (The Matrix, etc.), too. So in a sense, the magic has evaporated with time -- and the best they could do is try to give back a little with the visuals and some nostolgia.
The sequel was nicely done. I was a bit worried about exaggerated 3D effects, but they were well done, subtle and immersive. In fact I really didn't notice which scenes were done in 2D and which were 3D - that's how subtle the use was.
The new light cycles are most excellent, apparently they can switch on and off the deadly wall-trails at will. The new "recognizers" are much more believable as actual vehicles, and look really cool as well. The new virtual cityscapes look really creepy and neat - especially the Disney Castle at the intro! That was a shocker... The new "Carrier" at the end was a nice update on the old one.
The soundtrack also went very well with the action and fit perfectly to the type of future-scape being presented. The club scene with the hilarious David Bowie clone had a particularly good track or two going in it.
The dialog wasn't as bad as it could have been, to be sure. There weren't too many computer in-jokes, most of the dialog was believable. There weren't too many throwback references to the old film either - there were a few, of course - the old laser, the Mattel Football game, the name "Dumont" appeared on a freight container that was part of Sam's house, but overall they were few and also subtly done.
If you had not seen the original you really wouldn't be at a disadvantage seeing this movie - there were quite a few youngsters in the audience that had either not seen it or had only recently heard of it and had watched it maybe once.
Overall I liked it very much - saw it in IMAX 3D which is polarized with dual projectors so there is no shuttering action on the glasses - they were light and comfortable and don't give you headaches, and it's at full frame-rate for both eyes.
-- You are in a maze of little, twisty passages, all different... --
It was exactly the reason I didn't care fro Tron 2. The first movie presented you with a world that it gave you a lot of time to take it all in. From the scenes of sitting around drinking the water, to wandering around through the crowds after crashing the Recognizer. The scene where they ride over the grid made it totally obvious, grid bugs etc.. In Tron 2, they jump scene to scene, and I didn't want that. I want to take my time and see everything. I wanted to know more of the world they created. Instead all I can remember is: Flynns Place, Arena, Hole in a mountain, disco tower, lake + pillars, and the beam to leave the world. Compare that to the first movie and it feels like they almost hold your hand through the entire world at times. It was awesome.
I think it was visually stunning movie that needs to be seen in IMAX in 3D. The 3D is subtle and adds a layer of depth like some of the themes of the movie that I think most critics missed when they call it an incomprehensible plot. Unlike Pocahontas in Space last year the plot didn't hit you over the head with the themes (Last year it was pretty easy to follow Greedy white man invades kill natives, Military bad, Ecoterrorism good) On the surface it is the typical Joesph Campbell Hero's Journey: reluctant Hero (Sam) gets a message(page to Alan Bradley) to set him off on his quest, meets wise old wizard (kevin) and mythical creature (Quorra) on the way to defeat the baddie (Clu) and save the kingdom along the way a lost warrior returns to the light to redeem himself. But deeper it is the primal story mix of Lucifer trying to overthrow God and rule the kingdom of heaven and Hitler trying to rule the world with his perfect solution. Clu is not some cookie cutter mustache twirling villain at his base core he is the illegitimate son trying to win the love and respect of his father and know he did right. He does what he does fanatically because he is limited by his program, he can't think outside the box and hates the Isos because they now have God's love (who also have free will like Man) Have we solved the uncanny valley with Clu (Bridge's deaging) not completely but at the same time we know he is a program limited by that programing code so the fact he looks a little off actually works for me. definitely go see it in the theater, the acting is not Shakespeare, but did anyone compare Mark Hamill in Star Wars to Laurence Olivier? Tron has always held a special place in my heart as that is about the time I started programing (BASIC on a TRS-80 after an elementary school summer camp) and it showed the wonders of the inside of computer. Tron Legacy is the next evolution has us question what is digital life, with all our social and virtual interactions of cyberspace these days does our cyberself represent us or something more. Now with the grid existing on Sam's neck server what new evolution will it take place? What is the future for Quorra? Did Kevin's final embrace/rectication with Clu jump start a new ISO life in the sea of simulation (sort of like the monolith causing Jupiter into a Sun to support life on Europa in 2010) Will Dillinger leave Encom to start his own company to rival Sam?
I caught a glimpse of the version of the OS. It was Solaris 4.0, and some minor revision.
Some of the visuals were delightful and the audio was remarkable for its amazing rumbling low end, but as a story this movie really stank. A young CGI bridges is hardly a worthy villain. The plot was just hollow and boring. I hope I never see the lead actor again. Other redeeming factors: fine girls in tight, fetishy outfits and smokey eye makeup, daft punk, linux commands on Flynn's computer, and the English guy. Really irritating: Tron magically changes his mind and what little suspense they had managed to create immediately dissipates. I give it a "D".
Was running SunOS 4 (Solaris was SunOS 5), which is roughly contemporary to the original Tron, but slightly later (exactly as would be needed to have set up the new Grid). He was also running iostat, and the blk_writes went up as the laser switched on.
Somebody, somewhere, cared about that scene.
Cheers,
Ian
I enjoyed it a whole lot more than I expected to. The visuals were great and the soundtrack fit them perfectly. The story was merely passable, but at least it was no more insipid than your average action flick. If you're fond of the original you'll probably like this one (unless maybe if you're a lightcycle purist who thinks they should only go in straight lines, dammit!) Conversely, if you didn't enjoy the original there's nothing here for you. It's a worthy successor to the original Tron, no more, no less. Take that however you like.
But am I the only one who couldn't stop thinking of Rinzler as The Stig's evil digital cousin?
Chelloveck
I give up on debugging. From now on, SIGSEGV is a feature.
At the end of November I posted in my journal about Tron Legacy and how it would be an overall failure. I explained to those who responded that from what I saw of the commercials, it would be explosions for the sake of explosions interspersed with blue and orange lights.
From what I've read about people's comments, I wasn't too far off in my assessment.
For any that are interested, fell free to read what I wrote.
We will bankrupt ourselves in the vain search for absolute security. -- Dwight D. Eisenhower
They've got uploading someone into a computer, and obviously teleportation... and all they could do with it was make a video game.
mark "Hollywood, where the producers' IQ
is equal to their shoe size"
I liked the fact it wasn't quite realistic, and I do think the film makers knew it too. It made him look a little more deranged, a little more mad. The effect worked for me.
I liked the film. Very different in tone to the first - my kids love the first (eldest is 9) but I doubt they'd get on well with the second. That's fine though - the film is aimed at mid-to-late thirties like me, people who saw the original and wanted it taken one step further. Lots of doom-laden portentous imagery, but that's fine.
I would have liked more of Tron himself, and felt slightly cheated of a big Tron/Clu showdown. Still, it's a minor point - I really enjoyed the whole thing. I think one thing that helped me do this was staying away from all pre-film publicity and speculation other than the initial trailer. I had no preconception coming into the film, and I'm sure I enjoyed myself more as a result.
Cheers,
Ian
I can hardly count the number of things about the script for Tron: Legacy that made no sense whatsoever. As the subject says, although I'll try to keep it tame, there be spoilers here:
I give up. The list goes on and on. This movie pretty much required you to check your brain at the door -- and frankly, I didn't find the visuals all that impressive. Avatar tried to create a realistic alien world with its 3-D computer rendered visuals; Tron: Legacy tries to create a sterile, inorganic environment dressed in neon and glass. It gets old to look at. In fact, the whole movie gets old, fast. I found myself looking at my watch often and I was glad when it was finally over.
Breakfast served all day!
It was awesome. I'm convinced Daft Punk and Jeff Bridges could make Eat, Pray, Love watchable. Story isn't great, but is good enough. The mood and visuals are incredible. IMHO, certainly a worthy sequel, and in many respects better than the original.
I had expected so much more from this movie. I loved the original Tron. I had been looking forward to this movie for months. The depth of the story was pretty shallow. And the only plot I could get was that the creators son was coming to save the grid. Almost biblical. Oh and the other plot, cute girl in tight outfit. I understand what her character was supposed to represent and do but that was not used or utilized to it's fullest potential. I see no sequel coming out of this. Tron is pretty much dead at this point. It's a shame because they could of done so much more.
So CGI Jeff Bridges looked perfectly fine. I'm curious if we would have noticed any uncanny valley effects had we not had to run the wipers every few minutes! Aside from that, we liked it. I was especially glad for the attention and respect given to the original--there were -many- nods to the original Tron--the "bit" models on the shelf were a nice touch, and I loved the vintage light-cycle).
You realize CLU was supposed to be a CG version of Bridges, right? He's SUPPOSED to not look 100% perfectly real.
I want to delete my account but Slashdot doesn't allow it.
They build up Flynn's kid to be some computer hacker/x-treme athlete in the beginning of the movie, but really doesn't use any of those skills once inside "the grid". (Sure, he jumped out a window with those fairy wings, but seriously, that was it??).... In the original, Flynn had special powers because he was a user. They really didn't explore or take advantage of that in this one. Not sure why.
Flynn's kid might well have been very good with computers outside, but once in how do you know how to interact with the computer world around you?
Now Flynn himself did know how, and they showed three clear examples - when he stopped the elevator, when he fixed the girl, and when he pulled Clu back to him.
The girl part was the clearest example of knowing well how to interact with the world, since no other character could do anything but view data on the ID discs
The Iso's (sp), still don't really get it.
They were what Flynn was really trying to protect, and pass on. That was also something a bit more for the next sequel I think, but it was meant to in part be about AI potentially arriving at intelligence if only given the right primal conditions. Also a lesson about hubris and how it can destroy what the future you cares about most.
What happened with Tron when he finally "turned" was pretty lackluster
They were setting that up for the sequel (note him changing colors as he sinks (syncs?)).
Jeff bridges "clue" character was so "wax" like, that it was a huge distraction. I'm sure this technology will get better with time, but it's not there yet.
There you have my complete agreement. It wasn't "Polar Express" bad, or "Moms need Mars" bad. It was close, but it was still bad.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
Big Lebowsky, Jedi Master
09 F9 11 02 9D 74 E3 5B D8 41 56 C5 63 56 88 C0
It's not a seminal work by any means. I expected the CG of the young Jeff Bridges to be flawless, but it ended up looking like the best efforts of 10 years ago. It was fine as long as he didn't try to speak or pull an expression. It dipped into Uncanny Valley too often. I expected better stuff from Daft Punk for the soundtrack. I thought it was appropriate, but not mind blowing. The music had its moments, but the theme's predictable progression didn't leave much room for expression I guess. Olivia Wilde was surprisingly good. The original is unforgettable. This one is very Hollywood feeling, and forgettable.
I wasn't happy to see the movie become one big Ducati commercial. Some bum at Disney made his nut on that deal. (Light cycles? Sell in-movie ad deal to Ducati?) Lame, really lame. Reminds me of the Audi tie-in in I Robot.
Base jumping? Lame.
Well, it was a Disney movie. I guess I should be happy there was no stupid dancing included.
You know the 20 second mp3 loop that plays while the TRON demo loads on the iPhone? The whole soundtrack sounds like that 20 seconds looped for 45 minutes with just filter changes.
And the Daft Punk cameo? Super lame.
I did miss the Ford Econoline from the original movie.
And where were the grid bugs?
It sounded like Jeff was having a hard time hitting his lines for the voice acting. The CGI version of Jeff was very rubberfaced, looked like something out of Crysis. You could replace all the dialog with "shuh shuh shuh" and it would lipsync better with the rubber teeth motion.
The movie was too visually dark for 3d.
The first thing that happens to Sam when he enters the computer world is they cut off his clothes and re-clothe him in "computer clothes." Huh? Are they used to guys just showing up wearing Earth clothes now?
Why would they care? The programs job is to put on game armor. They would have cut off whatever they were wearing.
As for the clothes not being in the first movie remember this is a while different laser system in operation, if Flynn was going in there all the time why would he not want to keep whatever clothes he had on at the time?
omputer clothes look like clothes. Walls look like walls, floors look like floors, doors look like doors. You can actually slam the door, in a computer. If you drive a computer car on a computer racetrack, your tires leave computer rubber on the road (rubber?).
Again, this is a much improved system which could explain better visual fidelity, and honestly who wouldn't want to look at clouds? Although I have to admit the more realistic physics bothered me, because why even have them?
There's a major villain type character that's hunting our heroes throughout the movie -- that is, until he decides he's actually a hero type character, for no apparent reason whatsoever.
Dude, that was Tron, from the first movie. He was reprogrammed to be subservient to Clu, but in the end hunting users reverted control to his primary purpose.
Similarly, Sam is told to go see a character who is supposed to be able to help him out. Said character has been living a double..triple life
That made plenty of sense to me in the context of earlier events. He was helping the ISO's, and was caught be Clu. He was allowed to live on the condition that he reported everything back to Clu and kept in contact with the resistance. The flamboyant thing was just a disquise to keep too many people from pestering him and keep alive the mystery of Zeus.
That's all well and good, but just what was it that happened in the computer world that convinced him to do that?
The whole AI spontaneously forming from nothing?????!?!?!? That was not important at all?????
He's taking over the company to finish what his father started, to show the world there is artificial life with independent thought. That was also why they showed her thirst for reading and understanding, to show that she really was on par with humans and not just a program.
Well, it must work, because Olivia Wilde's elf character manages it at the end... but no, seriously, how does that work, exactly?
Ok, that certainly requires a bit of suspension, but given that we accept it can re-integrate a human from the dust that was left after a full laser scan, there's no reason it couldn't simply print out another being - part of the "magic" of the iSO's might well have been they had complex enough DNA to actually survive the transition.
I kind of thought during the thing that if Clu succeeded it would have just meant 4000 soldiers and Clu re-created in the same basement space - awkward. Not sure he thought that through really.
Isomorphic algorithms. They'll cure disease, end hunger, and generally save the world. Because they're isomorphic, I guess.
They'll change the world, because they are true artificial life. Curing disease would actually be more than possible if you could be taken apart by a laser and put back together without whatever ailed you, so from that standpoint just perfecting the transition technology could have been part of it too.
Mind you, I don't think the movie was perfect. I just don't think it had nearly as many plot issues as I was expecting.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
I dug out the originL Tron to watch in the morning with my 8 year oldmson, and then we played some fairly good recreations of packman and pong to get into the mood. After watching he said "you plaid money to see this?"
However Tron Legacy got a full thumbs up and a grinning "awesome!" review on the way out of the theater.
A very pretty movie, and now has a new fan for the franchise, so not all bad I guess.
If they make one I do not know, but the movie was aiming for a sequel. We don't know Flynn is really dead. We are pretty sure Tron was re-activated. We know they are about to announce full AI that came from nowhere to the world.
I wouldn't mind seeing a sequel to this.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
I thought the movie was excellent. I just really enjoy the whole premise. The only disappointing part was that it was 3D. This is the first 3D movie I have seen since I was a kid, and I found it largely distracting. The polarized lenses made it hard to see in some of the darker scenes... and they seemed to give me a headache after the 2+ hours.
I also really enjoy retro video games, so this movie really appealed to me.
...in 3D. The first third of the movie is 2D, and doesn't start the 3D stuff until after he enters the digital world. I thought the 3D movie preview advertisements before the movie started were more impressive 3D (cartoon birds flying out of the screen, LoL), but I digress....
Anyway, I thought the movie was pretty freakin' awsome, both in storyline and in special effects. And I'm a 50 year old computer scientist.
I can't re-watch the original...Netflix doesn't have it...
Coder's Stone: The programming language quick ref for iPad
My only complaint was the movie took a bit too long to get started. A lot of the intro scenes seemed kind of redundant. I felt like the audience didn't really need a background on the original Tron. Even people that haven't seen the first movie are going to know the basics because it's a movie that's sort of embedded into the culture somewhat. Sure, not to the extent of films like Star Wars, but if you haven't seen the first movie the time they wasted recapping it at the start isn't going to help you much anyway. And it's just a bit boring for everyone else. I did like that young Flynn felt ENCOM's new OS should be free, while the corporate drones wanted to charge for it. Seemed like a subtle nod to Windows and its free rivals. And I get that they want to establish him as kind of a rebel without a cause, so he can find himself a cause in the grid world. But it just dragged on a bit too long for me. Once he gets in though, wow. The visuals are stunning, and not just in the Avatar sense that it's really photo realistic (in some cases it's not, but that make sense). But it's visually creative. Watching them activate the bikes or planes, it's just amazing. The light-plane that they're flying too, it's a bit surreal. One very smart thing they did with this movie is after he gets out it's basically over. There's very few scenes in the real world afterward, because the filmmakers were smart enough to know it couldn't compare to what you've just seen on The Grid. Is the plot far fetched? Sure, but it for the most part is internally consistent and there weren't any issues with the plot that I found too distracting. If you want creative visuals with a surreal quality, this is the movie. As a piece of story-telling, there are better films, but it's not terrible in that regard, or at least not so bad that it distracts from the visuals.
Oh, and I know it's popular to bash 3D on Slashdot, but I saw it in 3D and I feel like it added something to it. One thing though, there's a bit of a disclaimer at the start saying some scenes were filmed in 2D (like the intro scenes) but to leave your 3D glasses on the whole time. Whatever - take them off for the intro scenes, you don't need them and it makes the film look a bit brighter anyway. But once he gets inside, definitely put them on and keep them on. It's worth it.
"To confine our attention to terrestrial matters would be to limit the human spirit." -Stephen Hawking
I can't help but feel this movie (which more accurately should have been named "Flynn's Legacy) was nothing much more than an introduction to a franchise series. Too many obvious loose ends. Tron basically resets, but then is left floating under water (water?) leaving his status a mystery. Sam basically downloads the grid onto a memory card (that smartphone of his apparently can do anything), then makes it a point to hang it around his next on a chain. The corruption of ENCOM is left unresolved (excepting that Sam decides he's going to act the role of major shareholder). Edward Dillinger's namesake is introduced at the beginning of the movie, and is obviously setup to seek out revenge for his father.
I personally loved Tron. I got what they were trying to do. I didn't need explanations because I was able to suspend my disbelief and honor the genre/plot conventions that were implied. Everyone I've read on here who hated the movie, hated it because they are very literal-minded. They require full explanation and logical progression of plot because they cannot suspend disbelief. To them, gaping plot holes best explained by invoked plot/genre/narrative conventions are equivalent to getting kicked in the junk. Their minds get caught up in the logical inconsistency and they cannot reconcile it. Thus, the hate (because OTHER people get it and they don't-and no one likes to feel like they don't "get" it).
I'm in a writing group with a lady that's like this, so I understand the long litany of complaints. It's not that she's mean, or a griefer - she literally cannot accept narrative unless the writer shows explicit linkage between plot points. Otherwise she notices the gaps, and then her disbelief kicks in.
/* "The only winning move is not to play the game." */
simple_plot = cluster is entrance, action, quest, finale
rep = record [real_part: real, imag_part: cgi ]
entrance = proc [ s$put "GREETINGS PROFESSOR PROGRAM" ]
quest = pure_code [ AOS LTCYCL
MOVE U,3676
TRON U,3732 ]
finale = proc [open gate; close gate; run; run; run;]
end of line
/* I think Hollywood will start all over again,
probably with the bees.
*/
Some of us went to see it on the big screen at a local theater. To be honest, I didn't like it very much. The effects were good, but they alone weren't enough to save what was a weak and obvious plot. I thought it was boring. Today I really like Jeff Bridges' work, but I barely remember him in it.
I REALLY wanted to like this movie. I was hoping to leave the theater with the same "OH MY GOD THAT WAS AWESOME" awe I felt coming out of the theater after the original. That's not what happened, and at first I didn't know why. After reading others opinions I have to agree that the problem was that the movie was Hollywood formula and nothing more. Maybe the first one was as well and I was too young to recognize it back in '82, but I remember feeling like I'd seen something completely different than anything I'd seen before. I loved the idea of programs having personalities and feelings. I loved the idea that inside the computer there was a whole other world working. This movie had the typical Hollywood beginning, middle, end: misfit stumbles across something important, misfit becomes hero and falls for the girl, hero saves world (and add the optional "nobody is the wiser"). It wasn't bad, just so much less than I hoped for.
My favorite WTFs (incoming spoilers):
- Edward Dillinger, Jr: why was he even introduced if he was going to play such a small role? He could have been John Programmer and not kept me wondering for the rest of the movie when he'd show up again.
- Clu tells Quorra after capturing her that he has something special in store for her. Turns out that something special is shoving her to the floor 5 minutes later to supremely piss off Sam Flynn. Now that's special.
- As Tron/Rinzler is floating to the bottom of the digital ocean he lights back up, so I'm thinking "Finally, we get to see 21st century Tron in the new Tron movie!" Didn't happen; wtf?
Crossing my fingers that a Director's Cut comes out and that it contains more substance.
It was a good romp in keeping with the spirit of the original film
I did not think it was in the spirit of the original at all. Too many polygons.
Saying "I'll probably get modded down for this" in a post is the best way to get it modded up.
it turns out I shouldn't have wasted the extra few bucks on service fees getting my tickets online, in advance
I'm still surprised by how many people don't know how to get around this.
Get an AMC or Regal Cinemas membership card (they're free). Then use an online ticketing service that lets you plug in your membership account number to avoid said fees. Profit!
CGI was little-used in the original TRON. Most visuals were traditional cell animation and matte paintings.
"Ironically and sarcastically" ......
Learn what the definitions of those words are, then make another attempt at using them correctly. Thank you, come again!
This movie had more plot holes than The Phantom Menace. Having said that... it was very pretty.
When I watched Tron Legacy I had the same feeling I had when I watched the original Tron when I was 8: The feeling of being lost.
Most close experience of that was when I watch Matrix for the first time.
The sound was EPIC!!!!
DNA in your Linux: DNALinux
I hope everyone here appreciates the irony of a Disney movie with a protagonist who wants to give away IP for free.
Man, I'm just trying to get my rug back...and liberate the isos to save humanity.
A few things I caught and would toss out there for consumption. 1. The 'Disney Castle' / light tower was nice.. 2. The time delayed charges set on the walls of the club were Xbox red-rings of death. 3. The gold and silver spiky things on the mantle were Byte from Tron 2.0 (the game)! 4. The hex shaped "book mark" Quorra's book was the same for the 'build points' in Tron 2.0. 5. Daft Punk running the club music.. that was great. 6. The questions about freedom of information - what happens when the information wants to be free from you? 7. Castor going nuts about how he can make the primitives do what he wants... just like the coding style of 'cast'. 8. The names of the people in the game were from Tron 2.0 the game. 9. Zuse wanting to be high level and control the city - a nod to Konrad Zuse circa WWII and being the first "high level language" writer? 10. The dig on operating system creators when asked 'what is different with version 12? Oh it's just a new number on the box!". 11. All the sublte "Dude"-isms... 12. The call back to the only way to win is not to play.
For me, the youthified Clu completely crossed the uncanny valley - I didn't get any this-isn't-real vibe of him other than what one expects of the character. Combine that with the idea of an AI girlfriend that completely replaces the need for human contact ... and I felt like the movie was saying "you've heard these ideas before, but get ready because this stuff is seriously coming". The visuals felt like just a reminder of how far computer technology has progressed in the past decade ...before turning around and daring us to ponder what the world had been like if AI tech had progressed over the last 20+ years to the same degree that visual effects tech has.
The movie has been nibbling away at my imagination the last few days in a way that normally only happens with horror movies.
not enough nerd-computer references
There were some though, like the whole realistic use of the UNIX shell - including just executing some command from history to see what it would do... I thought that was plenty amusing!
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
Sam was nothing more than a MacGuffin. He manages to get sucked onto the Grid, participates in some games, and then serves only as a reason for other characters to explain things about the world.
That's not true at all.
Without him there would be no portal to fight over.
He also shook up a stalemate between the players. As explained in the movie, he was brought in by Clu specifically to add a new piece to the playing board, to make people change what they were doing. And he did have that effect as otherwise everything would have stayed as it was.
He also did serve as someone to explain some plot points to, but he was not extraneous at all...
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
but that he still did after being on the grid for 20 years
In the first Tron, they came across a pool they drank from, explaining it basically as power cycles...
You could think of food as a virtual representation of CPU cycles. You need to to eat to keep being scheduled.
Alternately, you could explain the meal as simply a thing you do with company, and was not something they felt a need for from a physical standpoint, just social.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
I thought you had a great summary, and I would agree with you about the uncanny valley emphasizing the artificial nature of Clu, Except...
The "real" younger Flynn talking to young Sam, also looked fake. Not for most of it, from the side he actually looked pretty good. It was only when he stood in the doorway saying goodbye that I was like "hello uncanny valley". So if they could have just got that one part over the hump I could have accepted it more.
But basically I agree with you, I enjoyed the movie and am looking forward to where they take the sequel.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
it would be explosions for the sake of explosions interspersed with blue and orange lights.
As one person noted it was something like 20 minutes of action in the whole movie. So you have it almost exactly backwards. If anything people seemed irked there was not more action!
I liked it because it was a more thoughtful movie and not Light NASCAR.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
The new light cycles are most excellent, apparently they can switch on and off the deadly wall-trails at will. The new "recognizers" are much more believable as actual vehicles, and look really cool as well. The new virtual cityscapes look really creepy and neat - especially the Disney Castle at the intro! That was a shocker... The new "Carrier" at the end was a nice update on the old one.
The light cycles, the Recognizers, the disk game... these were all pretty original ideas. That was part of what made Tron good. It was full of things you hadn't seen before. Not just effects-wise, not just seeing a fantastical version of cyberspace, but the actual contents of that world were unique. For example part of what made Recognizers so cool and menacing was how unbelievable they were as flying vehicles. It was something obviously divorced of any notion of what could work in reality. It makes virtual worlds where the best people can come up with is highly choreographed kung-fu sound lame and uninspired.
So my question is: Not counting face-lifts of old things, what cool ideas are in this movie? Like, new ideas? Is there any new game on the Game Grid? Any new vehicles outside? New characters or concepts?
I haven't heard of anything yet. Maybe it's just avoiding spoilers, but I'm not sure that even makes sense. It'd be disappointing if the writers, and thus by extension Flynn and all the programs he wrote, hadn't had an original idea in all the intervening years. The original games came from somewhere. Am I really to understand that it was the MCP who had all these cool ideas, and I should mourn its passing?
The enemies of Democracy are
My favorite WTFs (incoming spoilers):
The first and last from your list, were setups for the sequel I think. Pretty sure there's at least one more, possibly two.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
Moments ago, I returned from the theater. It is unbelievable that I just saw Disney, of all companies, launch a tirade against closed source software. Spoiler alert...
Early in the movie, there was a board meeting where the Encom executives were laughing about their new operating system saying something to the effect of, "The only thing that changed was the number on the box." They were pushing their stock price while Sam Flynn was downloading the "master" program. He then released the code on the Internet, while Alan Bradley pulled out a tablet PC and downloaded it. There was even some dialog specifically mentioning "Open Source".
Once in his dad's basement, Sam Flynn accessed a terminal. While another terminal was running "top" in the background, Sam used "whoami" (answer: flynn), "ps -e" (forgot the other switches), and "history" (though it was located in /etc).
The conflict during the movie could be generalized as a conflict between control and freedom (similar to the previous movie). The thing that really struck me though was the "Ubuntu" logo on Zeus' forehead. (you may want to reread that last sentence). The forces for control were unable to even write their own programs, just re-purpose existing programs. What a hoot!
If life imitates art, you can expect your next operating system to be liberated. First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win. Linux is reaching a critical mass. Look out M$ and Apple.
I really enjoyed the movie. I saw it in 3D with the Dbox seating. (the motorcycle and flying scenes were especially enjoyable) I really felt that Disney in some ways was embarrassed of the original, hence the lack of availability of it on DVD. If it were me I would have re-released the DVD a month or two before Legacy came out just to put it back into everyone's mind. After watching Legacy I wasn't so sure they were embarrassed. There were several references and the spirit of it felt very similar. I loved it and will be watching it again. (this time probably 3D/IMAX)
www.unofficiall.com
I felt like I was watching a movie about "The Dude" rather than a sequel to TRON.
I also echo the sentiments of some other posters that felt that michael bay may have directed the movie. There really wasn't any depth to the story and that was very disappointing. With TRON there seemed to be a consistency to the digital world that I just didn't feel was there in Legacy.
I wasn't completely disappointed...but I left the theatre feeling only somewhat entertained and lacking any real after taste for the film.
The zen thing was mostly a joke, go watch Big Lebowski, it'll make more sense. That was the joke when he said "OK, you're really messing with my ZEN thing!!"
They kept it around past that because "fighting back" was how CLU gets stronger, kinda like how it works with violence. If that doesn't make sense, no sweat, I just tried to enjoy it anyways.
This movie could better be called Daft Punk the movie featuring TRON, than the other way around. Nonetheless, I loved the soundtrack. There's only 4-5 songs from it that I really like though, the rest were clearly soundtrack-music and thus not really worth listening to again. For those interested, go check out End of Line, Derezzed, Disc Wars, Tron Legacy (End Titles) and Castor. This last one fit in the movie a lot better because there was other stuff going on (club scene), simply listening to it it's a little bit more boring.
I think one thing this movie could have done with a little bit more of was hand-to hand combat. There were a few snippets with Quorra fighting, but not much actual battling. Seems like more would have been appropriate, certainly exciting.
Lastly, the lightcycles were AWESOME. Be warned, if you're a fellow motorcycle rider, seeing this movie will make you want to go do badass stuff IRL :) so don't!
All the way through this thing - Tron is looking like bad (black) STIG to me...
Or maybe I just too much top gear...
Where did the pig they had for lunch come from?
I'm a fan of the original and although the original is not perfect it's still overall a good movie.
The same can't be said of Tron:Legacy.
"""spoilers""""
The storytelling / writing was just awful. The hippy / new age quips from Flynn were out of place. Zeus was clearly a poor copy of the Merovingian from the Matrix.
Why the F are ISOs special? How will they save humanity?
The light cycle sequence had zero feeling of speed, tension or energy. Compare to the original which is full of speed, tension and energy.
In the original Flynn can play light cycles because he was good on the outside. He barely played the Jai alai game and he never played the discs game. Tron did that.
In Legacy, for no reason what-so-ever we are supposed to believe that Sam Flynn is an expert at all of these things.
Finally the ending has a continuity error with the original. In the original, standing in beam of light and holding the disc above your head is how you communicate with your user. It is NOT how you escape from inside the computer.
Other quibbles: Food. In the original they drank energy liquid that even Flynn craved. While food can be rationalized it wasn't worth the distraction of "wait what food? ... pull self out of movie to think of reason why food might exists inside the computer... get back to movie distracted".
Same with the real world like things in Flynn's place. The victorian mirror in Quorra's room caused the same reaction.
I really wanted to like this movie. I didn't expect it to be as good as the original but I hoped it wouldn't outright suck. But sadly, except for Olivia Wilde there's really nothing to recommend this stinker.
I sure hope that was a Daft Punk cameo I saw..!
Leela: "Is all the work done by children?" Alien: "No, not the whipping."
I'm a huge Tron fan and even though I enjoyed the movie, even catching the little things like the shot of a dusty hand held football game in the arcade cellar, which we see Flynn playing with in the original. One thing left me confused! Towards the end, we see a black leather clad figure, with the iconic motor cycle helmet on and Flynn says "Tron! What have they done to you?" -- Question, how the hell did Flynn know this character to be Tron? What did I miss?
I agree. Actually thought Wildes acting is brilliant in this and unfortunately sure to be overlooked, she pulls the young teenagerish curiosity, naivety and energy off to a tee. But in the end I also preferred the blonde :)
If you don't risk failure you don't risk success.
http://yro.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=1888084&cid=34462614
Like Windows the grid is no place for users but check it out 'caus it's flashy.