Slashdot Mirror


Hotel Tracks Towels With RFID Chips

nonprofiteer writes "An unnamed hotel is now putting RFID tags in their towels: 'The Honolulu hotel (the hotels have asked to remain anonymous, just to keep you guessing) says it was taking a bath to the tune of 4,000 pool towels per month, a number that it has reduced to just 750 (a savings of $16,000 per month). And that's just at the pool.' It's unclear what they do if the towel flies to the Midwest."

118 of 173 comments (clear)

  1. RFID chips in laundry by Pneathery · · Score: 4, Interesting

    My Uncle, and his family own a dry cleaning business in north Carolina and they have been doing this for years. It has caused the dry cleaners to make more money, as well as their clients. Plus as everything comes into the plant, it gets sorted so easily. You can run a cart through a scanner, and the computer reads everything in the cart, telling it where to go, and it is tracked from start to finish. The best part is, the cleaners and their customers make the agreements on the items that are supposed to be cleaned, not the actual pieces being cleaned, so they can tell the hospital who didn't turn in their shirts that week, yet collect for cleaning them. It is the future of dry cleaners.

    1. Re:RFID chips in laundry by CohibaVancouver · · Score: 2

      used the fucking RFID to track your unsuspecting customers

      Do any of you tinfoil-hat wearing anti-RFID ranters know anything about the technology? The cheap passive RFID tags that are used in applications like this have a very short read range, and can only be red if they're excited by an appropriate field. THE MAN isn't going to be able to track you to with a drycleaning RFID tag unless he's from Hogwart's...

    2. Re:RFID chips in laundry by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Funny

      Did you know that RFID tags are now embedded in Aluminum foil? THAT'S RIGHT!!! THEY ARE TRACKING YOUR TINFOIL HAT!!!!

    3. Re:RFID chips in laundry by geekoid · · Score: 1

      depend. They might be paying an annual fee that gets broken out per month. So some month will have less then some would have more then the median agreed upon number of units.

      yeah, Fuck hospitals and there treating people.

      Are you stupid? I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and just assume you know nothing about how a hospital runs.

      --
      The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
    4. Re:RFID chips in laundry by digitig · · Score: 1

      THE MAN isn't going to be able to track you to with a drycleaning RFID tag unless he's from Hogwart's...

      Damn wizards. I knew all along they were working for The Man.

      --
      Quidnam Latine loqui modo coepi?
    5. Re:RFID chips in laundry by lul_wat · · Score: 1

      You americans and your user-pays hospitals. Ha ha ha. I laugh.

      --
      Divide a cake by zero. Is it still a cake?
    6. Re:RFID chips in laundry by TheRealQuestor · · Score: 1

      I'd laugh too except it makes me want to cry too much

    7. Re:RFID chips in laundry by blair1q · · Score: 1

      >I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and just assume you know nothing about how a hospital runs.

      That's not the benefit of the doubt, that's you projecting.

      If they're paying an annual fee that gets broken out per month, then it doesn't matter at all how much they are or aren't sending to the cleaners. It's an annual fee. No counting necessary.

      As for how hospitals are run, anything non-medical is handled by a separate contractor known generally as the "Hospitaler." They're basically the hotel-management side of the hospital. And despite the fact that most hospitals are really shitty if looked at as hotels, they bill about $600 a day, while the medical side bills $6,000 per day, which pays for the nurses, monitoring equipment, medical transport orderlies (those people who push you around in the wheelchair, yes?), IV changes, procedure schedulers, and the base rate for the attending physician for your ward. Any actual performance of doctoring by doctors is broken out separately, and any actual procedures are as well.

      So I'll say that again: the part that's just about changing your towels and bringing you your meals and making sure your TV isn't shooting sparks into your heart monitor and running a crusty swiffer over the MRSA colonies on the grimy tile floor? They bill like the Ritz for that, on top of the but-it's-a-Hospital stuff.

      When your economic ethics stretch that far, you stop even bothering to pay attention to your costs, because whether you overcharge for laundry by 900% or 950% is a detail that cuts into your beach time.

  2. Ok but I would by dicobalt · · Score: 1

    take a towel from the maid's cart. It isn't registered to anyone and they are always sitting there in the hallway unattended.

    1. Re:Ok but I would by blair1q · · Score: 2

      Seen a modern maid's cart in a nice hotel lately?

      Like a giant safe. Locking rollup doors on all four sides, and a locking flip-top lid. She goes into a room and pulls this thing flush to the door frame. It may even lock to the doorframe (that's next if it's not already).

      No more casually walking by and grabbing whatever you need. You have to get her to intervene, and then you're tracked.

    2. Re:Ok but I would by WuphonsReach · · Score: 1

      Like a giant safe. Locking rollup doors on all four sides, and a locking flip-top lid. She goes into a room and pulls this thing flush to the door frame. It may even lock to the doorframe (that's next if it's not already).

      I could see that having more to do with stopping theft from open rooms while the maid is busy in the bathroom.

      Protecting the towel supply might just be a fringe benefit.

      --
      Wolde you bothe eate your cake, and have your cake?
    3. Re:Ok but I would by Khyber · · Score: 1

      "Seen a modern maid's cart in a nice hotel lately?"

      Mission Inn in Riverside, 4-star hotel, President Taft has a special chair there (which he hated, and anyone sits in it just to use it because he loathed it and wouldn't touch it.)

      Carts are as open as ever. You can snag towels, shampoo, and more.

      What are you staying in, a 1/2-star Motel 6 where everyone steals everything except the worthless TV?

      --
      Still waiting on Serviscope_minor to wake up to fucking reality and realize that Jessica Price isn't going to fuck him.
    4. Re:Ok but I would by bledri · · Score: 4, Insightful

      take a towel from the maid's cart. It isn't registered to anyone and they are always sitting there in the hallway unattended.

      One question: Why?

      --
      Some privacy policy Slashdot.
    5. Re:Ok but I would by blair1q · · Score: 1

      Encore Las Vegas. About an 11-star hotel. The only reason they'd coccoon the cart other than simple security would be because seeing all that stuff is just gauche.

    6. Re:Ok but I would by Khyber · · Score: 1

      Except the rating only goes up to 5 stars in the Mobil ranking.

      --
      Still waiting on Serviscope_minor to wake up to fucking reality and realize that Jessica Price isn't going to fuck him.
    7. Re:Ok but I would by blair1q · · Score: 1

      I exaggerated. Just like you did.

    8. Re:Ok but I would by SleazyRidr · · Score: 1

      You can never have too many towels.

  3. The hotel -- The Hilton Hawaiian Village by mbates · · Score: 5, Informative

    The Hilton Hawaiian Village. Signs all over the place that the towels are tracked and you will be charged if it is not returned.

    1. Re:The hotel -- The Hilton Hawaiian Village by Obfuscant · · Score: 2

      Does the Hilton HV also have an in-room microwave for guests?

    2. Re:The hotel -- The Hilton Hawaiian Village by Zerth · · Score: 1

      That's why they should bill you based on the missing tags, not by detecting them leaving the room.

    3. Re:The hotel -- The Hilton Hawaiian Village by AvitarX · · Score: 1

      Wouldn't a towel checked into your room, but not to cleaning be billed, even if it was microwaved?

      --
      Wow, sent an e-mail as suggested when clicking on "use classic" banner, and got a fast response that addressed my msg
    4. Re:The hotel -- The Hilton Hawaiian Village by Obfuscant · · Score: 1

      "Dear VISA: I left every towel I was provided by that hotel in the room when I checked out. I did heat some of them up in the microwave so I could have a warm towel for my morning shower. Perhaps the hotel needs to actually count the towels and not just the number of working RFID tags, especially when they've provided the means, motive and opportunity for the destruction of the tag without damage to the towel itself. If any of the towels were missing, then the staff stole them, not me. I have no use for used, dirty towels. I have enough of them of my own already. I contest this charge."

    5. Re:The hotel -- The Hilton Hawaiian Village by publiclurker · · Score: 1

      Dear Obfuscant: Please find attached an updated bill for repairs to the damage you caused to out hotel's microwave.

    6. Re:The hotel -- The Hilton Hawaiian Village by Obfuscant · · Score: 1
      Dear VISA: The microwave oven in the room I stayed in appeared to be in perfect working order when I left. If the microwave oven was damaged in any way by simply heating a towel in it for 30 seconds, then the microwave oven was obviously defective to start with, and any damages would be attributed to either the previous guest or normal wear and tear. I contest this charge, too."

      Let's face it, I can keep this up for as long as the Hilton can. What they are counting on is their customers being business travellers whose accounting departments will simply pay the bill because it is cheaper than contesting it. I, on the other hand, am a vacationing curmudgeon who enjoys seeing large companies getting dinged for making ridiculous fraudulent charges.

    7. Re:The hotel -- The Hilton Hawaiian Village by EdIII · · Score: 1

      Interesting you bring that up since I doubt I am the first person to take a small wash towel, soak it in water, and microwave it in the hotel to place on my face before a shave. Of course you need to use the right power setting or wait till it cools to just the right temperature.

      Shaving really does work better after soaking your face in hot water and the hot towel is nicer to do this, and more relaxing then trying to use all of the hot water in the shower on your face. Not to mention more effective.

      Yet at the same time I am kind of surprised that so many people take hotel towels. Is it souvenirs or what? I just don't get it. I have never taken anything from a hotel in my life. 99% of the time it will not be as nice as the stuff you have at home... and the whole thing about it not being your property of course.

      I take it back. I might have nabbed a pen once or twice (not on purpose) and one hotel actually gave me a coffee mug for staying with them. Still use it years later. St. Regis in Houston.

    8. Re:The hotel -- The Hilton Hawaiian Village by cdrguru · · Score: 1

      Was just there and I saw the signs. But, pulling pool towels never caused anyone to scan them, so the signage is just there to scare people. Nor were they really "checked in".

      I think someone else is doing it for real.

      I suppose it might be possible that they are scanning for them at the exits so if you walk out with 30 towels in your suitcase they can stop you.

    9. Re:The hotel -- The Hilton Hawaiian Village by Kilrah_il · · Score: 1

      Assuming the regular traveler doesn't heat the towels in the microwave, how is what they are doing count as "ridiculous fraudulent charges"? They had 4,000 towels stolen a month. Now they use a system of towel check-ins so they can track them* and prevent theft. If you rent a movie (if you still do such things) and you don't return it, is asking you to pay for it a "fraudulent charge"?
      I mean, it's great to rant about "Corporate America" fucking the "Average Joe", but face it, this isn't one of those cases.

      P.S. if you've never stolen a towel in your life, you should be even happier about this system. More stolen towels mean higher maintenance charges for the hotel, which in the end means a higher bill for everyone. In the end everyone pays for the towels some of the people stole.

      * And like some people noted on this thread, since this is a passive RFID chip, it cannot be used to track you. So don't start with the privacy rant also. kthxbye.

      --
      Whenever in an argument, remember this.
    10. Re:The hotel -- The Hilton Hawaiian Village by Siridar · · Score: 1

      P.S. if you've never stolen a towel in your life, you should be even happier about this system. More stolen towels mean higher maintenance charges for the hotel, which in the end means a higher bill for everyone. In the end everyone pays for the towels some of the people stole.

      You're making the assumption there that if their costs go down (due to better tracking of towels) then their prices will fall by a similar amount. This is, I believe, false - they will simply enjoy a (slightly) fatter profit margin, because now they don't have to pay for the towels.

    11. Re:The hotel -- The Hilton Hawaiian Village by Dr_Barnowl · · Score: 1

      It works out in the long run. If you can keep costs down, yes, you enjoy a fatter margin. But costs inevitably rise via inflation ; if your margin was high, you can fix your price for longer, so eventually, the customer sees a saving.

  4. Re:Nuke the chip by LearnToSpell · · Score: 4, Funny

    Free towel, I guess.

  5. Well damn by Dyinobal · · Score: 4, Funny

    I often pop my towel in the microwave for a few seconds to make it nice and toasty. I wonder if I've ever nuked me any chips?

    1. Re:Well damn by clang_jangle · · Score: 1

      Gosh, I haven't seen a hotel room without a microwave (coffee maker, minibar, etc) since like the '80s...

      --
      Caveat Utilitor
    2. Re:Well damn by thegarbz · · Score: 1

      If one part of the towel mysteriously catches fire then yes. :-)

      Seriously though small electronic devices like RFID chips have zero chance of survival in a microwave even for a few seconds. Metal bits almost instantly start to arc and spark in the presence of microwaves and there's no RFID chips which I know about that are hardened against this kind of abuse.

    3. Re:Well damn by greg1104 · · Score: 1

      It depends on the market and price class. In areas where real estate is expensive, you'll be hard pressed to find a microwave, or even a refrigerated mini-bar, in hotels now. New York and London are examples where I've run into this recently.

      There also seems to be a trend toward including less of these things in expensive hotels. If you're at a $200/night hotel, the presumption is you'll be ordering room service, not reheating your leftovers in the microwave. And even in the cases where that isn't true, it's not always in the hotel's best interest to provide you with a microwave. Yet another thing to clean and otherwise maintain, while working against sales of room service and in-hotel dining. It doesn't seem to be a competitive feature people demand anymore, and since it distracts from selling other services it's easy to see why they aren't included.

    4. Re:Well damn by KitFox · · Score: 1

      Things that are small enough will not arc or destruct. You'll notice that if you microwave a CD, it will arc and separate the foil down to a given size, and no smaller no matter how long you bombard it. A (house) fly in a microwave is too small as well. (Horseflies are SOL).

      The chip itself is of course too small, but the radio antennas that actually allow it to operate as an RF tag are not. So now the question comes up: Is it possible to create an RF tag that works at a high enough frequency that the antenna can be small enough to evade 2.4 GHz?

      How long before they lock out microwaves from starting up when it reads an RFID tag inside?

      The next worry though that I have is that now I'm afraid to take my towel to the pool. Somebody can swap theirs for mine. I turn in theirs and they're good. They steal mine and I get charged.

      --

      @Whee

    5. Re:Well damn by martin-boundary · · Score: 1

      Never do that! The fine water mist makes your towel invisible to spaceships.

    6. Re:Well damn by StuartHankins · · Score: 1

      Hampton Inn, SE US (Atlanta GA, Chattanooga TN, Palm Beach FL), $150-$250 a night, has a microwave, fridge, iron, coffee maker, etc. Other hotels such as Doubletree do the same thing. In many places you can get a much nicer Hampton Inn room for a little more than a crappy Holiday Inn room, and stays at the Hampton include complimentary weekday 5 pm drinks (beer and wine), free newspaper (usually USA Today) delivered to your door each morning, hot breakfast buffet, weight room, shared computer, wireless internet, breakfast-in-a-bag (Otis Spunkmeyer muffin, banana or apple, random packaged item such as a granola bar), and fresh baked cookies around 7pm every night.

      I don't have any special connection with the Hampton, but I've always had excellent service with them and the one in Palm Beach at Okeechobee and Jog is especially nice.

    7. Re:Well damn by Kilrah_il · · Score: 2

      A (house) fly in a microwave is too small as well. (Horseflies are SOL).

      How the hell do you know that?

      --
      Whenever in an argument, remember this.
    8. Re:Well damn by Gordonjcp · · Score: 1

      I don't go to hotels cheap enough to have all that crap in the rooms.

    9. Re:Well damn by thegarbz · · Score: 1

      There is actually another phenomena at play here too. That is one of standing waves. Microwave ovens are a nice boxy shape leading to a clear pattern of standing waves inside the Microwave. Yes common houseflies are small and thus most of the energy emitted by microwaves won't actually be absorbed by the fly. However a fly that is standing still in a strong part of the oven will not only die but end up a lovely charcoal mess. A fly would need to stand in a null of the standing wave or would need to move around between the peaks and dips to remain cool.

      The CD bit is quite true though.

      The RFID frequency is chosen because... well fuck everything goes on the 2.4GHz wasteland. But while it in theory is possible to make RFID work at far higher frequencies at some point you suffer problems with signal penetration and design. 2.4GHz has a wavelength of 125mm. The RFID antennas are only as small as they are because of fancy antenna design, however as you crank up the frequency you run into considerable problems with regards to tolerances, and also interactions in the circuit design.

    10. Re:Well damn by drsmithy · · Score: 1

      Note that should you travel outside of the USA, microwaves in hotel rooms are relatively uncommon.

      ...Just in case you want to steal any towels.

    11. Re:Well damn by migla · · Score: 1

      Note that should you travel outside of the USA, microwaves in hotel rooms are relatively uncommon. ...Just in case you want to steal any towels.

      One should always pack a hammer in case one happens on a hotell room that hasn't got a microwave for nuking towels.

      --
      Some of my favourite people are from th US; Vonnegut, Chomsky, Bill Hicks.
  6. old news, or a hoax. by pbjones · · Score: 3, Interesting

    this story is about 2 months old. The RFID triggers a sensor and then you may be asked to take the towel out of your luggage, or be billed for a towel. This type of news could also be a hoax and people read the sign and don't take the chance. Theft is theft, it shouldn't happen.

    --
    There was an unknown error in the submission.
    1. Re:old news, or a hoax. by ClioCJS · · Score: 1, Funny

      Theft is theft - but if every person always takes $8 in towels, they will simply charge people $8 more for the room. At which point, I've kind of paid for the towel. And if it's a $600/night room? That towel is a tip for me for paying that. (Okay, *I* didn't pay that, but I spent a week in a $600/night room and took toilet paper, soap, glasses, towels, washcloths. They're not losing money. They didn't even have a dvd player in the room. You can watch movies at the wrong aspect ratio for $16/ea. When it's messed up they'll pretend to take it off the bill without doing so...) Morals are relative to situations...

      --
      -Clio
      Karma: Bad (mostly from not giving a fuck)
      Blog: http://clintjcl.wordpress.com
    2. Re:old news, or a hoax. by LordLimecat · · Score: 4, Interesting

      This, right here, is proof that when people want something for free, they will have no problem rationalizing it-- be it free music, or free software, or free towels.

    3. Re:old news, or a hoax. by ClioCJS · · Score: 2, Funny

      You wouldn't download .. a towel .. would you?!?!

      --
      -Clio
      Karma: Bad (mostly from not giving a fuck)
      Blog: http://clintjcl.wordpress.com
    4. Re:old news, or a hoax. by Senes · · Score: 1

      It's called fighting fire with fire. If some little punk just walks up to me out of the blue and gives me a smack on the back of the head, getting even is all the rationale I need. If it were someone else I wouldn't jump on a high horse and give him this whiny lecture about how hitting people is wrong even if they hit you first.

    5. Re:old news, or a hoax. by geekoid · · Score: 1

      No, it's called being stupid. even you example is stupid.

      the best way for society, and the safety of people is to teach and train better behavior. Hitting doesn't do that.

      You attitude is why recidivism rate is through the roof compare to win people in prison where talk to, taught better behaviors and skills.

      You don't fight fire with fire except in the most extreme circumstances.

      Of curse, you should steal towels and this method is a fine way to do it. Personally, I would include a free towel set in the price and just give them to customers. I mean, clearly there is a market. Not that market might be the ACT of stealing a towel.; which is different.

      --
      The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
    6. Re:old news, or a hoax. by mysidia · · Score: 1

      Theft is theft - but if every person always takes $8 in towels, they will simply charge people $8 more for the room.

      People have gone to jail for stealing $0.50 candy bars. If they know a guest intentionally stole a towel, that guest should get charged with the proper crime.

      However... there's a problem. How can you prove the guest stole a towel, without invading their privacy, insulting them, or accusing them of a crime with little evidence (and possibly major embarrasment for the hotel with cost much greater than $8)?

      RFID in towels might be an answer. At least you can inform them there's a hotel towel in their luggage (possible accident), without having to accuse the guest of any malice.

      You can just ask them to return it, bill them, or say "Sorry, we cannot return your room deposit until this is returned"

    7. Re:old news, or a hoax. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Stay classy, Clint.

    8. Re:old news, or a hoax. by Idarubicin · · Score: 1
      That's true, the costs of the least honest and most unpleasant people are spread across everyone. Tragedy of the commons.

      I'd hate to have to share an office with you; since I make $75k a year, you'd no doubt assume that you were justified in stealing the pens from my desk and my lunch from the fridge, since I can afford to replace them.

      Society only works when the proportion of assholes is kept low. Otherwise, you're why we can't have nice things. Oh, and please don't waste your time on the lecture you were about to give about how faceless corporations deserve to get ripped off because you've occasionally been unsatisfied with the customer service you've received, or how I'm hopelessly naive because I actually assume that most people aren't sociopaths like you.

      --
      ~Idarubicin
    9. Re:old news, or a hoax. by NotQuiteReal · · Score: 2

      They're not losing money.

      Are you sure? Was it one of the hotels owned by Host Hotels? (Hyatt, Hilton, Four Seasons, Marriot, etc. etc.) If so, then yes, they ARE losing money.

      You kind of sound like a jerk, but based on your sig, I guess that is the vibe you are going for.

      --
      This issue is a bit more complicated than you think.
    10. Re:old news, or a hoax. by Senes · · Score: 1

      Personally what I'm thinking is that people should just bring their own towels - that's what I do because I don't want a flimsy cheap one that's been in a thousand other armpits. The thing is; every business has its obstacles - that's life. I don't want the hotel's armpit wipes but every time something annoys me in a hotel I think of how the towels disappear thousands per month and then I smile.

    11. Re:old news, or a hoax. by Senes · · Score: 1

      Cool, when someone assaults you or your family you can take the moral high ground and teach him about how assault is bad mmkay. I'll stick to my implements of self defense and do whatever is necessary to stop the attacker in his tracks.

    12. Re:old news, or a hoax. by hldn · · Score: 2

      everyone's against you, but i'm with you clint. i always take towels from hotels, i even take the book they put in the nightstand!

      --
      http://www.accountkiller.com/removal-requested
    13. Re:old news, or a hoax. by ClioCJS · · Score: 1

      Yup. I'd steal your lunch from the fridge. (rolls eyes) And what type of job pays you $75K a year, but doesn't give you pens? Funny example is funny.

      --
      -Clio
      Karma: Bad (mostly from not giving a fuck)
      Blog: http://clintjcl.wordpress.com
    14. Re:old news, or a hoax. by ClioCJS · · Score: 1
      Seeing as TFA doesn't specify which hotels they are, other than being 3 individual hotels, you've failed to validate your point, though I concede it is possible to be valid.

      It is generally assumed when buying services or goods from someone that you are paying more than they are worth.

      [Unless it's a loss-leader strategy like Microsoft losing money on an X-Box in hopes they'll gain money from the games -- but in that case, it's still true for the aggregate cost of the "Xbox experience" (xbox + games).]

      Generally business works on the profit of "we price things such that we make a profit on them".

      This is a rule of thumb, but one that is applicable far more than average (as a rule of thumb, rules of thumb are true 80% of the time, and I'd say this is more like 98%).

      --
      -Clio
      Karma: Bad (mostly from not giving a fuck)
      Blog: http://clintjcl.wordpress.com
    15. Re:old news, or a hoax. by ClioCJS · · Score: 1
      Of course, incarcerating someone costs ~$30K a year - so if we sent everyone to jail for stealing 50 cents, there'd probably not be much money left for anyone else. (This is an absurd claim, but hopefully you get the gist of my point.) It's not worth spending $30,000 to save 50 cents. (Okay, you probably wouldn't go to jail for a year, but hopefully you get the gist of my point.)

      So yes. This is a much more logical and practical solution.

      --
      -Clio
      Karma: Bad (mostly from not giving a fuck)
      Blog: http://clintjcl.wordpress.com
    16. Re:old news, or a hoax. by ChrisMaple · · Score: 3, Funny

      You attitude is why recidivism rate is through the roof compare to win people in prison where talk to, taught better behaviors and skills.

      Would you mind rephrasing that?

      --
      Contribute to civilization: ari.aynrand.org/donate
    17. Re:old news, or a hoax. by Nikker · · Score: 1

      Your ham sandwiches need more mustard btw.

      --
      A loop, by its nature, continues. If that didn't make sense, start reading this sentence again.
    18. Re:old news, or a hoax. by Nikker · · Score: 1

      Somehow taking the gay out of the bible for everyone else and carrying it with you where ever you go seems fitting....

      --
      A loop, by its nature, continues. If that didn't make sense, start reading this sentence again.
    19. Re:old news, or a hoax. by ClioCJS · · Score: 1

      Oh zing! I think you just called me gay! Whatever will I do! (besides roll my eyes, that is)

      --
      -Clio
      Karma: Bad (mostly from not giving a fuck)
      Blog: http://clintjcl.wordpress.com
    20. Re:old news, or a hoax. by Tropico · · Score: 2

      This is a common logical fallacy. We don't incarcerate people for stealing $0.50 candy bars to prevent the theft of further $0.50 candy bars. We do it to preserve the rule of law in our society. Consider the crime of perjury in federal court. No one is losing money when perjury is committed. But the government is willing to spend millions of dollars prosecuting perjury none-the-less. The reason is the same, to preserve the integrity of our legal system. So yes, stealing one or two towels isn't the end of the world. But we still prosecute it because theft is bad, and not punishing thieves only encourages widespread theft.

    21. Re:old news, or a hoax. by margeman2k3 · · Score: 1

      No, but if you find a way to download a towel, I'll fax you a prize.

    22. Re:old news, or a hoax. by ClioCJS · · Score: 1

      hahah... Would a JPG of Towelie count?

      --
      -Clio
      Karma: Bad (mostly from not giving a fuck)
      Blog: http://clintjcl.wordpress.com
    23. Re:old news, or a hoax. by ClioCJS · · Score: 1

      nitpick - Perjury can definitely cause people to lose money!

      --
      -Clio
      Karma: Bad (mostly from not giving a fuck)
      Blog: http://clintjcl.wordpress.com
    24. Re:old news, or a hoax. by Nikker · · Score: 1

      You picked up on that quick, very impressed!

      --
      A loop, by its nature, continues. If that didn't make sense, start reading this sentence again.
    25. Re:old news, or a hoax. by ClioCJS · · Score: 1

      It wouldn't be a very good insult if someone couldn't discern what you were saying now, would it?

      --
      -Clio
      Karma: Bad (mostly from not giving a fuck)
      Blog: http://clintjcl.wordpress.com
    26. Re:old news, or a hoax. by mysidia · · Score: 2

      It's not worth spending $30,000 to save 50 cents.

      Imprisoning people who cannot follow the law is not about making an economic tradeoff based on the offense they were caught committing. It is about protecting order and society, and removing threats from the streets.

      If they steal a total of 200 $0.50 candy bars a day, it will exceed $30k, by the way.

      If there is no robust punishment for stealing a $0.50 candy bar, then there is no deterrant against them stealing many frequently and many others doing it, since there is no deterrant to scare the on-the-fence folks from starting a life of crime.

      Moreover, stealing $0.50 candy bars, getting that as a habit, is quite likely to lead to other crimes. Law enforcement generally only has the benefit of knowing about the crime the person was caught committing. A fair portion of the people who steal $0.50 candybars today are likely the people who steal $30,000 cars 10 years from now.

      Anyways... it's indeed a total farce it costs $30,000 to keep someone in prison. Frankly, prisoners should be required to perform productive labor to fund their meals, rent, health care, comfort (eg air conditioning), and other amenities in prison.

      Anything beyond a 5-foot by 5-foot by 5-foot enclosed space with temperature kept above 40 degrees and below 85 degrees; 1 liter of water, an hour of sunlight a week, a half pound of gruel, a wash cloth, and a small trashbag to pee and poo into, are luxuries, and prisoners should be required to perform work for all luxuries that provides an amount of revenue to the state equal to at least 120% of the cost of those luxuries.

    27. Re:old news, or a hoax. by Kilrah_il · · Score: 2

      So hotel A calculates the cost of a room as X. They price it set at X + 10% (or whatever you want). After 2 months of operation they find out that (some) people steal towels and thus the cost of the room goes up to Y (Y > X). The price is now Y + 10%. Guess what? You steal a towel, everyone pays more! Thanks Clint.

      In the civilized world you pay for a product/service, with the terms of the service clear in advance. Neither party can change the terms, because they feel like it*. The hotel cannot suddenly change the price mid-stay, and you cannot add perks at-will. Not all hotels give you the same terms: Some have free Wi-Fi; some charge you $9.99/d. Some have breakfast included; some don't. It doesn't matter. What does matter is that once you agree to the terms, you cannot decide that you can take a towel because you deserve it/the hotel can afford it/you are doing them a favor with free publicity/whatever other great excuse you can make up.
      Taking a towel without permission is stealing. Stealing is wrong. If everyone were to do it, modern society would cease to exist (and no, I am not overdramatizing).

      * Example: Sony removing the OtherOS feature was Bad. Why? it was part of the advertised features of the product. People paid to have it and they removed it with no compensation.

      --
      Whenever in an argument, remember this.
    28. Re:old news, or a hoax. by lexsird · · Score: 1

      If you have a problem with "theft" I guess you shouldn't take towels. Ironically, it's not the poor I think that steal the most. When I was a kid, some of the finest thieves I knew were from well to do families. But of course when their precious kids got in trouble, it was their poor (economically) friends that got the blame. It's ok, we shouldered that blame, it comes with the territory. I would have liked to been a mouse in the corner years later when they fessed up to their parents the things they did and who really was to blame. I could always tell the difference after they were told, they looked at me a lot different, not like I was a bug under glass.

      You are right, it's very situational. If I am in a $2000 dollar a night hotel, I am taking a towel home if I so choose. But I don't, because I find that tacky and low rent. If I want a towel, I will sally forth and shop for one like a civilized person. Now if a towel strikes my fancy, I am off with it, I will probably announce with a wink that "I am stealing one of your magnificent towels for a souvenir, I would even fight you for it if you insist, but I would prefer you just add it to my bill." to me that is the slightly cheeky but civilized way to make off with a towel.

      I blame a lot of this bad behavior not on poor upbringing and horrible social skills/responsibilities, but on stress. Modern living is highly stressful and I think it drives us down into what they call the "reptilian" part of the brain. I would call it an engagement of base instincts when stressed. We hail from nomadic hunter/seekers and finding any "treasure" laying about not nailed down, engages our older instincts. We pick it up instinctively, thinking we have a treasure we will need later, if the gaze of the more powerful members of the tribe aren't directly intimidating you from this thing you think you need, you will make off with it. This is how many survived in the wake of the strong. It's really damn funny how things change, but they really are the same. How do I put this gently, a lot of our "crime" isn't really a crime, its a matter of rule breaking. Who makes the rules? The strong do. Who breaks the rules? Hmm... We need to evolve our thinking to catch up with our technological developments. We still mire around with "reptilian brains" more than we think, we haven't conquered modern living enough to de-stress ourselves, modern living conquers us.

      Frankly, I would factor in the towels being stolen EVERY time a customer comes through. I would encourage it in fact, why? Because then we wouldn't have to take them and throw them away. We would provide only new towels to customers and these would be washed, and dried first. The same with sheets. I don't imagine budget minded places can afford that standard though. We travel more these days, but I don't think we travel as well. One could also say, that with more of the population traveling, you get more of a baser class traveling as well. Baser class as in scoundrels who cause the rest of the people to pay for their shenanigans.

      Word of warning: if you steal towels on a business trip with me, you are fired. The towels will come out of your severance pay. You will be out the door so fast, HR will get wind burns from your passing. In fact Security would have a catapult I would special ordered for launching people with such ilk of improprieties off of the premises. Happy landings and don't bother writing!

      Never steal small, you hurt the small people, and we NEVER hurt the small people. You always steal BIG from the big, preferably the biggest. Anything less is petty, crass and definitely less than magnificent. Magnificent should be the standard, not the exception.

      --
      Take the Red Pill.
    29. Re:old news, or a hoax. by russotto · · Score: 1

      Modern living is highly stressful and I think it drives us down into what they call the "reptilian" part of the brain. I would call it an engagement of base instincts when stressed. We hail from nomadic hunter/seekers and finding any "treasure" laying about not nailed down, engages our older instincts. We pick it up instinctively, thinking we have a treasure we will need later, if the gaze of the more powerful members of the tribe aren't directly intimidating you from this thing you think you need, you will make off with it.

      This isn't instinct, this is from playing Zork and/or nethack during one's formative years.

      Anyway, the towels at most of the hotels I stay in aren't worth stealing. Either they're crap to begin with, or they've worn thin after many uses and washings, or both. If I'm going to steal something, it's going to be better than that.

      Never steal small, you hurt the small people, and we NEVER hurt the small people.

      Hey, Hilton IS pretty big.

    30. Re:old news, or a hoax. by ClioCJS · · Score: 1

      Actually, whether or not *I* steal a towel, someone else will, so you will pay more with or without me. Case in point - I have only patronized 4 or 5 hotels in my life, and they probably aren't the ones you have. Your towels are more expensive because of other people, not me. If you want to blame my attitude, fine. But saying "Thanks Clint" is just completely fallacious. And no, modern society would not cease to exist, and you are completely overdramatizing. Hell, your comment made me burst into uproarious real-life laughter. Thanks for that.

      --
      -Clio
      Karma: Bad (mostly from not giving a fuck)
      Blog: http://clintjcl.wordpress.com
    31. Re:old news, or a hoax. by karbonforms · · Score: 1

      Anything beyond a 5-foot by 5-foot by 5-foot enclosed space with temperature kept above 40 degrees and below 85 degrees; 1 liter of water, an hour of sunlight a week, a half pound of gruel, a wash cloth, and a small trashbag to pee and poo into, are luxuries, and prisoners should be required to perform work for all luxuries that provides an amount of revenue to the state equal to at least 120% of the cost of those luxuries.

      Never been huh? A pissed off, uncomfortable prisoner is an expensive prisoner. We get TVs, and not because of someone in charge feeling kind. Take all privileges away from a wing and see what happens. Twat.

    32. Re:old news, or a hoax. by ClioCJS · · Score: 1

      Wow. People like you (I'm talking more about your last paragraphs than your first) disgust me. Fortunately pretty much every human rights organization on the planet disagrees with you. You might like Japan or the Middle East. They run their prisons more to your standards. You clearly don't belong in a democracy.

      --
      -Clio
      Karma: Bad (mostly from not giving a fuck)
      Blog: http://clintjcl.wordpress.com
    33. Re:old news, or a hoax. by ClioCJS · · Score: 1

      I like you.

      --
      -Clio
      Karma: Bad (mostly from not giving a fuck)
      Blog: http://clintjcl.wordpress.com
    34. Re:old news, or a hoax. by ClioCJS · · Score: 1

      I take towels from hotels.. but my favorites ones I got for $2 at a yardsale.

      --
      -Clio
      Karma: Bad (mostly from not giving a fuck)
      Blog: http://clintjcl.wordpress.com
  7. Fly to the Midwest? by SomePgmr · · Score: 1

    I wouldn't be surprised if they just bill the card associated with the room.

    1. Re:Fly to the Midwest? by blair1q · · Score: 1

      Yyyyyup.

      That credit card is like a damage deposit.

      Hotels know their shit. Even if they let a lot of mopes get away with things.

  8. Bloody genius by blair1q · · Score: 1

    This is a classic, 100%-nails example of a "wish I thought of that" idea.

  9. Re:42 by blair1q · · Score: 1

    It enhances their usefulness.

    Now you can use them as a form of ID, even if everyone else in the customs area on Baloofinax IV stole their towels from the same hotel.

  10. Re:Nuke the chip by blair1q · · Score: 1

    Free seared towel that smells like burnt popcorn forever.

  11. WHY would you want one? by wickerprints · · Score: 4, Insightful

    That's what I can't wrap my mind around (no pun intended). Even the most plush hotel towels are laundered and reused by guests, and the vast majority of hotel towels aren't really that high quality to begin with. Is the economy so bad that people are resorting (again, no pun intended) to taking used hotel towels instead of buying their own for a few bucks?

    Despite the use of what must be copious amounts of chlorine and near-autoclave cleaning, just imagine what some people leave on those towels. You still want them?

    1. Re:WHY would you want one? by LordLimecat · · Score: 1

      Is the economy so bad that people are resorting (again, no pun intended) to taking used hotel towels instead of buying their own for a few bucks?

      People dont rationalize it like that. They think "boy, this towel would be useful, and Im sure the hotel has tons of spares, and anyways theyve built the cost of losing a few towels into the price of the room, so really Ive already paid for it".

    2. Re:WHY would you want one? by LordLimecat · · Score: 1

      I live in the real world and recognize that if you remove all incentives to produce goods, you get garbage and leeches. Its why communism never works, and it frightens me to see a community of ostensibly intelligent people crusading for an attitude that leads to an economic gutter.

  12. Re:Who? by blair1q · · Score: 2

    Kleptos ruin it for everyone.

    But, if this RFID thing goes viral, you can expect the return of towels and robes and sheets and blankets that make you want to go to a hotel even if you don't have a reason.

    Now if only they could do something consistent about the fucking bedbugs.

  13. Call the writers... by roc97007 · · Score: 1

    They've got to work that into an episode of Raising Hope.

    --
    Oliver's law of assumed responsibility: If you're seen fixing it, you will be blamed for breaking it.
  14. that could be entertaining by roc97007 · · Score: 1

    All they'd have to do is incorporate the rfid detector with popup tire slashers, iron crossing barriers, klaxons and klieg lights. Locals could sit in lawn chairs across the street at checkout time and watch the show.

    --
    Oliver's law of assumed responsibility: If you're seen fixing it, you will be blamed for breaking it.
    1. Re:that could be entertaining by mysidia · · Score: 1

      All they'd have to do is incorporate the rfid detector with popup tire slashers, iron crossing barriers, klaxons and klieg lights. Locals could sit in lawn chairs across the street at checkout time and watch the show.

      Sounds like an excellent reason to take a cab (or airport shuttle) off the hotel premises when checking out.

  15. Re:Who? by dgatwood · · Score: 1

    Now if only they could do something consistent about the fucking bedbugs.

    But the bed bugs don't like RFIDs. And besides, the hotels want you to take those with you. Every bed bug that goes out with you is one fewer in the hotel.

    --

    Check out my sci-fi/humor trilogy at PatriotsBooks.

  16. Hilton Hawaiian Village by Mjollnir · · Score: 1

    It's Hilton's Hawaiian Village. Just spent a week there with the fambly. Inside the beach towel return bins, you can clearly see what looks to be a RFID reader wand/antenna along with other assorted electronics.

  17. Sucks to be the cust. service reps at that hotel by rsilvergun · · Score: 1

    That's the only way you could enforce this, when they try to walk out the door they set off an alarm and some poor dumb slob has to embarrass the hell out of a guest. OTHO, it'll get around pretty fast and it won't go over well. $16k isn't much money for a hotel you know. Just let it go.

    --
    Hi! I make Firefox Plug-ins. Check 'em out @ https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/youtube-mp3-podcaster/
  18. Re:Sucks to be the cust. service reps at that hote by DigiShaman · · Score: 1

    As SomePgmr said, they might just automatically bill you for it as walk out the door of the hotel. It would be interesting how many people will either contest the charge (knowingly they stole it in the first place), or just eat the cost because shipping it back would be just as costly for the refund. The idea being that the hotel can reduce the loss of revenue due to theft without causing a scene about it.

    --
    Life is not for the lazy.
  19. there's a hitch... by DaleBob · · Score: 1

    The next thing you know they'll be releasing a towel with an embedded electronic thumb... the future is now.

  20. Re:Who? by slew · · Score: 2

    Why are people stealing that crap?

    Because they can.

    Doesn't matter what it is, or how crappy it is, sadly some pathetic folks just feel feel a compulsion to steal, others just feel entitled...

    Talk to a hard core song or movie pirate. Doesn't matter how crappy the song or movie is, they just want it in their collection (they often do not even listen to the song or watch the movie). That my friend is compulsive behavior...

    Talk to a person that constantly whines about faceless corporations underperforming, or overcharging them for stuff, or descriminating... Then you will understand the sense of entitlement that brings a person to steal.... Stick it to the man!

  21. Sell seats by www.sorehands.com · · Score: 1

    Why not sell seats to the locals?

    RFID tracking arrows and crossbows. If you make it by that, you win a towel.

    1. Re:Sell seats by roc97007 · · Score: 1

      Yeah, but it'd take a nerd to think of any of those, and nerds can afford towels. (Well, maybe not in this economy...)

      --
      Oliver's law of assumed responsibility: If you're seen fixing it, you will be blamed for breaking it.
  22. Re:Who? by xaxa · · Score: 2

    I have been in hotels all over the planet. Average to luxury, Asia, Europe and the US. One thing nearly all of them have in common (including high end Hawaii hotels) is that the towels are a joke. Small, thin, low cost junk. Why are people stealing that crap?

    The last time I was in a super-luxury hotel they had a small shop by the lobby where you could buy hotel-branded towels if you wanted a souvenir of your stay. They were better quality than the ones in the rooms, and very reasonably priced -- I doubt they made a profit, but I bet they had less towels stolen because of it.

  23. Re:NEWS? by MobileTatsu-NJG · · Score: 2

    This article is two weeks old, and RFID tagging in hotels has been known in the industry since 2009. Wakey wakey people!

    So, what, it's the first week of January 2010 for you? What the hell time zone are you in?

    --

    "I like to lick butts!" by MobileTatsu-NJG (#32700246) (Score:5, Informative)

  24. Re:LoJack for towels by MobileTatsu-NJG · · Score: 1

    Next step is to GPS the towels.

    That's like saying the next step from a Bic lighter is a phaser.

    --

    "I like to lick butts!" by MobileTatsu-NJG (#32700246) (Score:5, Informative)

  25. Re:Who? by NotQuiteReal · · Score: 1

    Stick it to the man! The irony - you've described the values of the core voters for the current "man"!

    --
    This issue is a bit more complicated than you think.
  26. Call ThinkGeek! by freeze128 · · Score: 2

    I see a new demand for Faraday luggage!

  27. these aren't the towels you're looking for by fred+fleenblat · · Score: 1

    notice it was specifically *pool* towels. i have to wonder if they were just counting towels removed from the pool area as losses. what i've often done is take a pool towel back to my room and leave it there for the maid to whisk away with the bath towels.

    possibly they weren't actually losing that many pool towels from the premises overall, they were just being diverted to the wrong pile. if they need RFID to tell a pool towel from a bath towel, i would suggest color coding or size/weight differences instead.

  28. Saves $16,000 per month... by The+Wooden+Badger · · Score: 1

    But how much did it cost to implement this plan in the first place?

    --
    Heroscape, it's like legos combined with anachronistic wargames.
  29. Sassy by ozbird · · Score: 2

    "There's a frood who really knows where his towel is."

    1. Re:Sassy by bpsheen · · Score: 1

      Not only does your towel allow you to escape the gaze of the Ravenous Bugblatter Beast of Traal but its now a identity mechanism. Nifty!!!!

      --
      My first computer had 1024 bytes of ram
  30. cost a bit much? by datapharmer · · Score: 1

    Am I the only one shocked that they are paying over $4.90 per towel? I would think hotels could get a better rate than that...

    --
    Get a web developer
  31. Can they ... by PPH · · Score: 1

    ... track towels you carry with you on a jump with the infinite improbability drive?

    --
    Have gnu, will travel.
  32. Re:Sucks to be the cust. service reps at that hote by formfeed · · Score: 1

    No. You call it the "if you like our towels, take one"-policy and bill it to the credit card.

    -Or you tell your guest: "We have this a special offer this week only, for only $1 you can upgrade to a brand new towel."

  33. No problem here by johncandale · · Score: 1

    Tech (most tech) is not inherently evil or good. This is the kind of stuff RFID tags should be used for, a private company in a closed system. Everyone knows you use towels at a hotel, it's just simple normal inventory control, You aren't taking the towels out of the hotel, whats the problem again?

  34. THEFT?!?! by theNAM666 · · Score: 1

    Whatch'you talking about?

    Isn't taking a towel like taking an embossed pen, using the stationery, taking the rest of a bottle of soap? Sure the hotel would like you to leave it, (and to charge if they can), but it's a consumable. Some people even take them home as souvenirs!

  35. Re:Who? by StuartHankins · · Score: 1

    Yes, these are the same people who stuff their plates at buffets then leave them barely touched while they get up from the table to get more food. I understand in some societies there is a belief of equating this with power or prestige, but it sickens me when I see it. Gluttony is not pretty.

  36. Mahalo by way2trivial · · Score: 1

    I'm thinking, shipping costs to the Island...

    --
    every day http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Random
  37. Re:Sucks to be the cust. service reps at that hote by John+Bresnahan · · Score: 1
    All they have to do is add a "Towel Deposit" to your credit card when you check in, and then refund the money if the towels from your room are still in the hotel after you've checked out.

    Whether customers would put up with that is another issue. I suspect that business travelers who aren't paying for the room themselves wouldn't care. If they are constantly generating "Towel Deposit" expenses for their employers, maybe their employers would care.

  38. Re:Nuke the chip by Kuruk · · Score: 1

    Why is it full of RFID chips ? Err I mean popcorn.

  39. Re:Who? by Kuruk · · Score: 1


    <p>The last time I was in a super-luxury hotel they had a small shop by the lobby where you could buy hotel-branded towels if you wanted a souvenir of your stay. They were better quality than the ones in the rooms, and very reasonably priced -- I doubt they made a profit, but I bet they had less towels stolen because of it.</p></quote>

    They made a profit for sure. People happy to steal did anyway.

  40. Re:Nuke the chip by blair1q · · Score: 1

    All microwave ovens eventually become permeated with that aroma.

  41. Re:Sucks to be the cust. service reps at that hote by SleazyRidr · · Score: 1

    I remember one hotel I stayed in had quite a witty note in the room. Something along the lines of;

    "Lot's of people seem to like our towels, so we've decided to make them available in the gift shop for $10. If you don't feel like walking all the way to the gift shop, you can simply take the towels from your room, and we'll just charge the $10 to your credit card."