Slashdot Mirror
Techrights Recommends An Apple Boycott
walterbyrd writes with a quote from an article at Techrights: "Given the latest actions from Apple we cannot help recommending that people buy nothing from Apple. Boycott the company for being a threat to the IT landscape and also to common sense."
More from the article: "...Apple has been working hard to embargo — not just sue — the competition. Apple disregards the notion of fair competition..."
Could this be any more biased? Why is Slashdot posting this crap?
The article claims that "Apple fan sites celebrate Apple patents," but all he does is link to one site, Patently Apple. That site exists to track Apple patent applications "in search of future features and secrets," as the site puts it. It's not celebrating patents; it's just reporting on them in hopes of predicting upcoming product plans.
It also repeats the old troll meme about PARC, claiming that "Apple disregards the notion of fair competition, which takes a lot of nerve for a company that built itself on knockoffs (e.g. Xerox PARC)." Overlapping windows and pulldown menus did come from PARC, but Apple is the one who invented the File-Edit-View-Window-Help standard menu layout, the phrase "cut-and-paste," and several other common GUI paradigms that are taken for granted today. Not to mention that many of those Xerox PARC employees went on to work on the Macintosh project at Apple!
If we're throwing around knock-off accusations, Android used to look like this until the iPhone came out, and then Android suddenly started looking and behaving a lot more like iOS, right down to the pinch-zoom gestures that originated with the iPhone. For crying out loud, Samsung outright stole Apple's icon artwork and used it in their stores. TechRights, of course, ignores all this. It's no surprise at all that Apple is going to try to hinder competitors' efforts to ride the coattails of its design work. It went through this before with Windows in the 1980s and only lost its court case against Microsoft because of a previous licensing agreement.
Obnoxious Android fanboyism has reached a fever pitch. Android fanboys are now officially more annoying than Apple fanboys. They've adopted this idea that they are freedom fighters and that their tribe is under threat from evil. It's embarrassing and is a resurrection of the worst elements of the desktop Linux movement from 10 years ago.
Exploring the rest of the site, it calls itself "a progressive site which supports software freedom and advocates digital diversity through standardisation." Most of its stories are anti-Microsoft, pro-Linux, and present a one-sided view of tech news that's intended to rile up its readers (not unlike Slashdot, to be honest). It also claims to be against monopolies but says nothing about Google's monopoly in web advertising nor the fact it's using its monopoly revenues to pump a new market with a free product (Android), just like Microsoft did with Windows and Internet Explorer in the 1990s. For some reason, Android advocates
For crying out loud, Techrights' Twitter account is called @boycottnovell. Boycott Novell is associated with Roy Schestowitz, an infamous Usenet troll who spams the advocacy newsgroups with pro-Linux news links and used to astroturf Slashdot with multiple accounts.
If nerds on Tech Rights and Slashdot want to boycott Apple, go ahead. None of them were using Apple products anyway--they are Linux advocacy sites. Apple wouldn't even notice.
Can we get some actual tech news? Or is Slashdot forever lost to its current role of flamboyant baiting for ad views? Ugh.
Are boycotts ever really effective anymore? There's too much clout huge companies carry with their flashy advertising to reach consumers that are willing to break principle. People are not principled enough to rigourously hold to boycotts. I tell people not to bother with them, and focus on positive buying instead of negative buying. Don't avoid buying what you don't want to support, try to actively spend your available spending money with people and companies who support your vision of the world.
Oh You POS
Yes, it's easy to say "don't buy this product", but then what to buy? Certainly, I wont buy a windows phone. I don't like Android, hated the CarrierIQ story, and think that Google is as evil as Apple. What's remaining? Looks like I'm going to keep using my n900, let's hope it doesn't fail on me.
Apple behaviour is pretty disgusting and, I'd join the embargo 'BUT' damn I've always found their gear to be overhyped and overpriced and basically always gone else where. I'll think you'll find that this is pretty much the trend with the majority of computer geeks.
For what it's worth I vow never to buy an Apple product ;D.
Chaos - everything, everywhere, everywhen
What about the other patent/IP assholes, such as Microsoft, Sony, and Oracle? Why target just one?
Table-ized A.I.
A "boycott" won't do any good. There are enough fanboys out there together with people who doesn't know any better to keep them afloat indefinitely. People who do know better already go for the better options.
Apple is asserting its patent rights.
This is how the system works. Ask T. Edison.
Ask GoDaddy
Shouldn't people already have their own opinion on that topic anyway?
In my case, I initially started avoiding Apple products in the pre-iPhone days because I wasn't satisfied with their products (MP3 players without an easily accessible repeat function, overpriced tech for glorified shadow copies, bad memories of the whole Mac OS 9 clusterfuck).
After that their business practices just cemented my decision to never buy any Apple products again.
The purpose for patents is not to protect the invention any more. It's to protect against ANY invention. And that's not what patents are for.
Help stamp out iliturcy.
This article is 100% troll.
Apple is as much a producer as anyone, and there are lots of arguments to be made that they are for more producers currently of innovations in hardware and software than many other companies.
I find the patent activities Apple is engaging in absurd and evil also. But the whole industry is doing the same thing all over, Apple's actions just get elevated above others because it brings page views and Apple Haters push an anti-Apple agenda whenever possible.
The solution is not to boycott Apple, for that helps no-one - the solution is to continue to battle absurd software patents however it is possible to do so.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
I don't use apple products because I don't believe in their "walled garden" philosophy. I was a big fan of apple back in the old hypercard and basic days when apple wanted to bring their users CLOSER to the computing experience and really make their users more powerful.
But apple has done a complete 180 on that and won't ever come back to it. so for that reason, I won't buy their products. It isn't a boycott.
People need to stop thinking anyone gives a damn what they think about anything. Because the reality is that in the real world people just don't care. Corporations don't care. Politicians don't care. Your next door neighbor doesn't care. And they have every right to not care.
That said, you have the same right. So rather then trying to get some frothy public action thing together with promises to buy again if they change their ways. Just quietly buy what you believe in and let the marketing people figure out why sales dropped. Nothing preachy or pretentious. Just buy what you believe.
Apple products make lots of people happy. Good for them. They're welcome to it. I won't be one of them and wish one and all well.
I've decided to stop wasting my time responding to AC trolls/sockpuppets... so if you want a response from me... login.
I used Apple all through the 90's in the 'dark days', had an iMac, then switch to using windows and IBM Thinkpads (when they were still American) for about eight years. Tired of the windows mediocrity, maintenance issues, viruses and Trojans I finally switched back to Apple. Got a Macbook, iPhone, iPod. Life couldn't be better. Apple is ubiquitous and has a store in pretty much any country in the world. Their prices have fallen and are fairly competitive, while also maintaining an edge on competition by offering superior customer service and user experience. As long as Apple offers their superior product designs, user experience, and customer service, I'll be using them for the foreseeable future. Who really cares about competition? All of Apple's so called competitors (Samsung, HTC, others) as) are all non-American Companies anyway have clearly stolen/copied many aspects of Apple's technology. All of this is besides the point as Apple doesn't have a monopoly over anything, if you don't like them don't buy it. Simple as that. We're not talking about Microsoft who used their dominance over operating systems to keep their 90% lead in the world.
Your comment was posted in a rounded rectangle. Please stop that you are violating Apple's patents.
AccountKiller
Apple behaviour is pretty disgusting and,
Thats like getting mad at some fellow at gettysburg because he fired his rifle.
Everyones firing off shots, I think its a bit much to go after Apple like theyre the sole bad actor in the IP wars.
It's amusing that you think the "Haters" will just not let people use what they find suits them best, when that is precisely Apple's strategy (not letting people just use what they find suits them best) and the reason the majority of "Haters" exist.
I suppose that's why it's awesome that iOS is open-source
Actually it is (check out Darwin sometime).
and a thriving community has grown up around modifying the sources to leave out bullshit like CarrierIQ
Unlike Andorid the shell of a CarrierIQ system that shipped with iOS was never enabled, and did not contain a key-logger or any of the other items that made CarrierIQ objectionable to start with. The hint that remained was removed in iOS5.
But my all means bring up CarrierIQ again and remind the world that Android is shipping with active key-loggers in many phones.
Let me know how those custom iOS roms are working out.
Actually, pretty well.
iOS is far easier for the technical user to customize and hack than Android thanks to the use of Objective-C in applications.
When you stop and think about it it's pretty dumb to have to install a custom ROM when you can just have system tweaks do whatever sets of modifications to the system you are really after. It means you can much more easily track official OS updates.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
If Apple decides that it is time to stop innovating their products (or successfully copying and integrating other people's designs in them, as some see it) and start suing and doing other dirty tricks instead, they would have already lost more than half the battle. Trying to squash competition has never worked well in the long run, and trying to squash it with dirty tricks has worked even worse.
Apple cannot realistically threaten the rest of the industry long term. They aren't that big, their products aren't that pervasive and they simply cannot afford a wide enough product range to compete with everyone. Even if they could become the new Microsoft, in a decade or so everyone would have been tired enough of them to switch to something else.
Besides, boycott may be counterproductive -- Apple left on its own can well generate more bad will than Apple pestered by boycotts. So, instead of recommending a boycott, inform your readers about the problems Apple is creating and help them make informed and rational decisions about their purchases. And if they decide Apple is good for them, then let them have it -- it is their choice, after all.
Your comment was posted in a rounded rectangle. Please stop that you are violating Apple's patents.
Interestingly, this was one of Steve Jobs' early contributions. There was famously an argument when they were designing the first Macs (having licensed the windowing system from Xerox PARC) - he insisted on including rounded rectangles in the design. His head designer (whose name I forget - Parkhurst?) could not figure why he wanted rounded rectangles. Jobs took him outside, and showed how every rectangular road sign was a rounded rectangle.
Which shows that all things old are new again. It's worth noting that nobody ever patented rounded rectangles on road signs - it was just a useful design, not a 'world-shaking invention' in the world view of that time.
It's easier to be a result of the past, but more fun to be a cause of the future! http://www.spacefinancegroup.com/
when that is precisely Apple's strategy
You seem to have forgotten that Apple is only suing Samsung, not other tablet makers.
You can always tell the haters by the way they distort reality in any way possible (or frankly impossible) to make Apple the worst in any given comparison.
Apple is blocking choice for no-one. Haters like you have claimed that for some time now even though Apple was one of the big players heavily pushing HTML-5 and shipped the very first Intel macs with Bootcamp. Foes of choice indeed!
Few companies have done as much for interoperability as Apple has done over the years. Apple is after all the company that broke the music industry of the DRM habit. Yet you would ignore that accomplishment and belittle them for things they have not done.
and the reason the majority of "Haters" exist.
Since Apple Haters have been around long before the Samsung lawsuit your expiation of origin leaves much to be desired.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
I already don't own any Crapple products from the manufacturer, and the one Crapple product I do own is a eMac that I pulled out of a dumpster.(I hate it when technology is wasted, so I took it). However, I will never purchase any product from that company. So I guess I've been boycotting Apple for the last 15 years.
Get your free Dropbox account with 2 GB Free storage!
That's why an iPad looks like a scaled-down flatscreen TV ... And yes, Apple should have full rights to protect their greatest creative investment and one of the landmark inventions of the century: the rectangle with round squares! Next: the iWheel. It looks like an iPad. But it has no corners! Amazing!
What you've stated doesn't even rise to the level of anecdotal evidence, let alone "proof".
Incidentally, I've been telling people Apple was just a weaker form of evil than Misro$oft, for YEARS, and now people are starting to pull their heads out of their iAsses and smelling the crAp somehow for the first time.
I've been boycotting crApple since they introduced the Mac. They are the perfect example of capitalism gone mad. Private ownership is supposed to spur invention, not stifle it. That's the point. Apple should be broken up, buried up to its nostrils in shit and left to rot forever. Halleluiah! Then I wouldn't have to put up with iEverything iEverywhere. It's fucking iAnnoying, especially when they pay producers of TV shows to do product placement, and it becomes painfully obvious that what looks like a half-way decent show is little more than a subtle barrage of advertising messages to buy Apple's fetid products. Disgusting. It would be nice to see someone do something that isn't copying them though, but they've done to the userspace between users ears what Misro$oft did in computer space in the eighties, programmed them to expect a certain interface, then get pissed when other people make similar interfaces in response to market pressure. Apple corp. is clearly still scarred from that brush they had with oblivion before Gate$ bailed them the fuck out. That's why they act the way they do, and will continue to as long as users continue to tell them they're okay with crApple doing this sort of thing.
A boycott could be the only way to get their fucking attention, but most crApple sycophants (users) are too brainwashed by now, so good luck with the boycott. I've been boycotting them for DECADES. No change so far.
Joe Average will stop reading that article halfway the summary. It doesn't do a good job explain why an Apple boycott would be called for to a public that is immensely pro-Apple. Targeting non-Apple users with this is pointless since they won't buy Apple anyway, so your core audience is Apple users.
And if an Apple user starts reading this at all (which is not a given - the title alone might scare him away) he will be going into it with "my Apple products all work, are easy to use and look nice; I don't want to use Windows / Android / &c.". The writer has a formidable uphill battle to fight and he doesn't even try. You won't get people to boycott a company they dearly love if you yourself apparently don't even care about the issue.
This article teaches us some important lessons in article writing:
1) Mind your audience.
2) Write clearly.
3) Get your argument in quickly.
4) Hook the reader long enough to get the support for your conclusion in there.
Who run Bartertown?
Seriously though I don't use Apple products anyway so I guess I'm already there.
DRM
Funny as Apple/Jobs pushed music labels to release their music DRM free
Locking hardware to software
They also do that with a reason and not the "evil" they want to rape our babies kind of thing. With Apple they are so obsessed with user experience (and they don't suck at it) that they want to control every aspect. And hate that vertical approach but it works for them. If I look how different the experience is between my android smarthphone and iPad I find it hard to criticize them.
Pushing of proprietary standards
Hilarious. You are aware of the fact that they favored pushing HTML5 instead of the proprietary stuff like Flash. You are aware they are on of the driving force like open standard as OpenCL.
Being the middle-man
Because bandwidth, processing cost, support are all free.
Being secretive about developer revenues
Can you tell me where apple advertises with the fact that IOS is as lucrative. Can I tell you something as a developer who also built mobile applications and also have android devices. If the IOS market is so bad, you don't want to know which graveyard the Android market is.
As someone calling bullshit on the fact that Samsung didn't copy icons or look and feel. Look at KIES, look at the use of sunflower as an icon for the photo picture. Not like the telephone symbol as a photographer I never seen the sunflower as a mental model for a photograph.
For me people may buy and boycott what they want but damn there is so much FUD these days on sites like slashdot it isn't even funny anymore.
you are shitting me right? 128k Mac from 1984 pissed you off how?
But unique products?
Before the iPhone there was nothing really like it.
Before the iPad there was nothing really like it.
They are not wholly new inventions but they are a leap beyond what was before them.
Good products? Good quality? Good support?
Sales figures (and Consumer Reports) say yes to all of them. You merely claim they are bad while ignoring that everyone else is far worse (Generally, there are some exceptions).
Anecdotally, good support is 100% YES. Because instead of helping friends/family with technical issues as I had to do in the bad old Windows Days, I can simply have them ask first for an answer at a genius bar in an Apple Store. That works 99% of the time. It has saved me COUNTLESS hours of frustration. So nice to be off that merry-go-round.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
What part of consumer electronics involves storing design information as DNA, RNA, or really any nucleic acid.
Somethings Apple may be fighting in court may be "theirs" but the problem is that they seem to be fighting everything. The Android style notification bar seems to have found its way to iOS. There are things that may be worth fighting for and things that may be too stupid to defend.
There is a problem in the federal judiciary in the United States aging as there has been a confirmation crisis running for nearly a decade as our current president and his predecessor have faced increasing opposition to their picks to the federal bench. Not all of this crisis is a legalistic crisis though.
The sad thing for the Android ecosystem is that manufacturer insistence on dumb shit like HTC Sense, MotoBlur, and all of the other custom skins are both aggressors in the look and feel area while mostly being despised by consumers who care. There are plenty of examples of prior art for rounded corners on rectangles littering the countryside on American roads. Beyond that things get murkier.
http://www.aaronrogier.net
For the most part the vast majority of the mobile patent wars have been about extracting licensing agreements between vendors.
That was true, but that pact was broken when vendors starting deciding RAND patents in various standards did not apply to Apple and they were allowed to shake down Apple for extra money above the payments the rest of the industry was making.
So if we are truly going to try and nip problems with agreements forming, Apple is not the company to go after (remember in the Samsung suit they even offered to sell a license to Samsung for use of some the patents they had, which Samsung declined).
By boycotting Apple you would send a message that this shit is not on
Boycots against any company are foolish because it's a very poor way to send any message. The signal is lost in a vast sea of noise of purchases. As noted, Apple isn't even the most egregious player here....
The real thing to do is to attack the power that patents have over foolish aspects of computing they should not. Even if you could succeed against Apple other companies would continue to abuse them the same way. It's not even like Apple is a company with pure patent troll play as we are seeing these days.
Attack flaws in the patent system and you wipe out ALL bad abuses of patents across ALL companies.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
There are more reasons to boycott apple. For example, - DRM. Download music from iTunes, and you can only play it on a limited number of computers (try it and you'll find out).
iTunes music hasn't been DRM-encrypted since 2006. You can play it on an unlimited number of computers (try it and you'll find out).
Pushing of proprietary standards. Many apps developed today could just as well be developed using open standards, e.g., HTML and javascript. Instead of aiding the further development of these standards, they are sucking developer power into their own eco-system and make the apps, that would otherwise be available to everyone, only accessible to their own customer-base.
Apple co-developed WebKit, the open source renderer which made the modern HTML/Javascript web app environment possible. The first iPhone only ran web apps--the App Store was a response to consumer demands. Apple has been one of the loudest voices pushing for HTML5 adoption in browsers and devices. They also make their own services (iCloud and iWork.com) available as web apps. There are many reasons to dislike Apple, but do your research first.
The ghost of the reality distortion is stronger in this one than any I have seen.
Well all I am doing here is telling you what will actually help the problem.
Talk about reality distortion - your solution to the Hydra is to cheerfully attack only one head while ignoring the others snaking towards your back.
And yet, you would claim I am the one who is blind...
Attack Apple exclusively and ignore the other blatant evils all around, yes I can see why that makes perfect sense... ...to an Apple Hater. With patented Apple Hater Tunnel-Vision (tm)!
The really funny thing is, the Apple Hyrda head will never even notice you are trying to hurt it. I mean, you could have at least had the intelligence to target a head that you could have made an impact.
Sigh. So sad to see such a willful disregard for the industry as a whole! That is the real problem, people like you thinking a single company is an issue instead of a system that practically mandates abuse...
I'll let you have the last response since I doubt any of your reply will make any more sense, and indeed I anticipate the froth level to be quite high.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
The Typical Mac User
Get your free Dropbox account with 2 GB Free storage!
If you want to be a fanboi, at least become one about something that matters - maybe people in your life? But devoting energy to things like this article proposes is simply a waste of precious time. A computer is a computer; a phone is a phone. You get one and you use it. It's not like any of them are particularly special. I don't see anyone obsessing over their toaster like this...
That is all.
Pretty suspect you can't even point out one thing that is a "lie"
The "stole icons" claim with the AllThingsD link is a well-known lie. That's just one, I'm sure you can find more.
Required reading for internet skeptics
I have been boycotting Apple for years now, what have you guys been up to?
not to mention environmental issues. They are known as the lease green company http://9to5mac.com/2011/11/16/apple-addresses-environmental-concerns-with-audits-of-15-suppliers-could-impact-future-components-and-contracts/
Download music from iTunes, and you can only play it on a limited number of computers (try it and you'll find out).
Nope, been unencrptyted now for many years (and with iTunes Match Apple will even give you a nice 256kb DRM-free audio file of everything you ever ripped from a CD).
So that was totally wrong.
Locking hardware to software.
This was a particularly amusing error because you almost had a point! If only you had reversed it.
But in fact Apple does not lock hardware to software at all. Apple, for example, shipped bootcamp with the first Intel Mac.
Pushing of proprietary standards.
Like the industry standard HTML5?
Or the industry standard video codec h.264?
Or forcing the music industry to drop DRM?
Apple has not pushed proprietary standards since AppleTalk.
Being the middle-man.
I can download music from anywhere and load it on an iPhone.
Free apps pay nothing to Apple.
I can put any number of PDF's on a iPhone, or read Kindle books with which not one cent went to Apple...
"A" middle man? Sure. THE middle man? Not even close.
Being secretive about developer revenues.
Good good man, Apple is the only company that trumpets loudly how much they are paying developers! There is nothing secret about it whatsoever.
Is it hard to find out how much any one developer makes? Yes, unless they tell you. You are claiming that I should simply be able to ask Apple exactly how much money every app made, and you are claiming that breathtaking invasion of MY privacy as an App developer is LESS EVIL?
How about you tell us how much you make. Or are you being secretive?
And, if you google around, I'm sure you'll find many other reasons to dislike Apple.
Indeed you will, each of them more baseless than the last.
The sad thing is there are perfectly valid reasons to be be upset with Apple, why can't people complain about them more often in a wider forum?
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
I've been a geek or at least a pretty advanced quasi-geek for many years now. The first Apple product I bought was the 3GS. It was one of the first well thought out designs as far as I found smart phones / portable computing devices to go. I got it, hacked it and spent most of my time with SSH shells than tapping but as the thing gets older the deterioration of performance and brutal software upgrades make me say, screw it. I have been lurking since waiting for a phone with decently advanced hardware and open. I am sick of these stupid games played by these companies and they look at me like they are shocked, stuff it. I am more than willing to wait for a more advanced Raspberry PI type device half of what is coming out in the next 6 months. Hell a dual core SoC with decent GPU acceleration and decoding / encoding hardware would be great with a decent honed OS, 1GB of RAM would make me feel warm and fuzzy all over.
So I'm with you buddy. I would be more than happy to auntie up some cash with others to get something like that off the ground, that way I can finally just sit back and laugh rather than jumping to patch the next version of the OS just so my device works properly. Hey if everyone on this site ponied up $50 we could get a solid real piece of hardware that would actually make it to be an antique rather than just somehow disintegrating after the next model comes out.
Don't worry I'll buy another one.
A loop, by its nature, continues. If that didn't make sense, start reading this sentence again.
You can't easily modify the base OS. HUGE difference.
That's exactly what much of Cydia does for you. Many things there are components that modify the base OS. That's what I mean my having the power to easily modify parts of the system instead of needing to replace the whole OS. Code injection is far more powerful since you do not need to replace wholesale. I don't have to choose which mod to download, I can just download system enhancements that I feel would be useful.
If you think about it, it's really dumb to have to root your device to get the software you'd like onto your own computing device
Its' even more stupid to basically ship a rooted device and make it easy for users to install viruses.
Protection against which is the step before you even install apps in this Android Setup guide.
To quote:
Now itâ(TM)s time to load those apps like Angry Birds, right? WRONG!!!!!
It is time to install an anti-virus and anti-malware program.
Oh yeah! That is SO much better for non-technical users.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
On the first point, since Android is open source and I can't download all of that source either I see no reason why the partial codebase of iOS does not qualify.
Where can I download Moto-Blur?
the second is at least a questionable claim, given that language preferences vary so much.
That has nothing to do with it. The fact is Objective-C make code injection incredibly easy, which means it's much easier to hook into and modify specific parts of existing applications.
It's not about language preference, it's about a specific side effect of iOS software being written in Objective-C.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
Funny, this has been my position since about 1984 and has never changed, nor is it likely to ever change. Zero iDevices are allowed in my house, nevermind purchased for myself or a family member.
Note this does not make me a Moronsoft fan either - I use their stuff because its 90% of the market, though I switch to using Linux wherever possible.
Okay, I'll admit that the article is very high in troll content but, as someone who has spent plenty of money on Apple products over the last 6 years, let me add that I'm getting more and more disgusted with their behaviour and I won't buy anything else from them for the foreseeable future.
That said, let me add more reasons to strongly dislike (if not boycott, let alone hate) Apple :
All apps on the Mac App Store will be required to run in the so-called App Sandbox
Apple sues but loses design lawsuit against Spanish tablet maker (producing a tablet nothing like the iPad)
Apple is using patents to undermine the development of Web standards and block their finalization
Apple has given valuable patents to a patent troll (which is using them to sue top technology companies)
And, last but not least, I don't know whether to laugh or cringe about this one:
Apple threatens 20-seat restaurant that sells only drinks, sandwiches and desserts because it's called AppleADay
RT.
Well we don't let people use certain hazardous chemicals, even if it suits them best, because it's bad for the rest of us. Similarly we charge more tax on inefficient cars because while they might provide some benefit to the owner they have a negative affect on the rest of us.
Therefore it makes perfect sense to get annoyed when people buy Apple products because it funds legal shenanigans that have a negative affect on us.
Plus "Posted from my iPad" does make you look like a bit of cock. Posted from my Panasonic Let's Note.
const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
Pushing of proprietary standards
Hilarious. You are aware of the fact that they favored pushing HTML5 instead of the proprietary stuff like Flash.
No, Apple is pushing its own version of HTML5 and, as a matter of fact, Apple is using patents to undermine the development of Web standards and block their finalization.
RT.
effect
I'll sometimes put "Posted from my iPhone" when writing forum posts from Ubuntu. It's fun to watch haters rage and froth as their neckbeards chafe. It's especially funny when I get flamed for it even when the user agent string contradicts the faux sig. (yes, yes, I know you can spoof a string.... just like you can spoof a sig)
Nothing, but it's also not wrong or illegal or morally wrong to point it out either.
The gate swings both ways.
Some of the Apple haters on here are just embarrassing, and are doing more to hurt their "cause" than help it. I mean, it's their choice to define themselves by hating a company, but much of the vitriol is getting silly. I may not be a personal fan of Android (although I have used some good Android handsets and can see why people like it) I'm not frothing about how Samsung and Google are some sort of Machiavellian evil for making things that people want to buy.
I think a lot of it stems from a feeling of sour grapes, that in the era of declining Microsoft dominance they were sure that "their" time (of Linux! On the Desktop!) would come, and that instead of year on year growth for Linux desktop/laptop marketshare, the eroded Windows share went to Apple instead, and then the entry into the phone market (predicted to be a *massive failure*) and the re-ignition of the tablet market (again, predicted to be a massive flop) was just rubbing salt in the wounds.
Certainly, Apple is no angel and has done some stupid things, but in the mind of an Apple Hater - defining themselves by their assured belief that Apple can Only Do Evil(tm), they forget many of the positive things Apple has done for the industry and consumers at large since its return from the brink of death.
Wow, you got +4 insightful for those "factually challenged" statements. Slashdot really has gone to the dogs.
Nice troll if that's what you were going for though. Barely even one truthful statement in any of that, but presented as if you'd actually looked it up and checked your statements. Bravo.
This is exactly the tactics that Apple are using. The lawyers of nokia many many times tried to cross-licence with apple, as apple seems to be totally fine using others IP with a free hand. No ball, until it went to court. Many courts in many countries. When it's stupid and logical things like multi-touch, then this court-based stifling of innovation and usage is killing the industry slowly.
Except that Apple are actively stiffling cross-licensing, while freely using others IP without paying until dragged to court. Nokia is a perfect example. Nokia's lawyers tried many times to get Apple to cross license. No deal.
I agree that there anti-competetive tactics are pretty disgusting and it's a shame they are smearing Samsung. Reality check: how many other companies given the same amount of power Apple wields would not use it in the same way? Purchase your phone based on what features are important and forget all the hype.
"We are just a war away from Amerikastan. When god vs god the undoing of man." Dave Mustaine
Apple can't have the Shit Head of the Year award for DRM. That was a Microsoft started thing. Back in 1999 with the realease of Windows 2000. It was even roomered that they wanted to put DRM directly into the NTFS security of the OS. They droped DRM after it started locking people out of the music they bought, errr legaly riped from CD, and caused a huge stink. Yea I see your point about the the software. If would be nice to see the Mac OS on some PCs. Though then again, that would start to unravel their spotless support record. In regards to the poverty of the software developer. Look at the AdultSwim games. Free to everyone but IPhone users. Just because it is ported to run on an IPhone that costs $1.99. To witch Williams Street sees none of that. Long live the Apple name. I guess you already said that. Sorry. It is a sad day when this is the best we can come up with. Makes me wish for a Fallout style nucular war, so we can start over and do it right this time.
To fear death, my friends, is no other than to think oneself wise when one is not, to think one knows what one does not
If that were the case then they would just be seeking damages and a licensing deal. They are not, they are actively seeking to ban those devices on what are really quite flimsy patents and design patents. For Apple this isn't about fair play or seeking a fair deal, it's about market domination and obliteration of the competition. Heck, Steve Jobs even stated that his goal was to destroy Android.
So one has to wonder - will a boycott have a significant effect?
To prevent this day from getting worse, I'll just read ERROR as GOOD TH
If you take many laptops, and chop off the keyboard, you get something that looks a lot like an ipad; black surround, few/no screws, round corners. About the only thing missing is the bezel flush with screen, but some laptops do that and it's not like it wasn't an existing idea from touchscreen phones - including ones that predate the iphone. There were already tablets going this way - such as the joojoo that predated the ipad, and looked a lot like what the ipad eventually launched as - but what was lacking was a suitable touch based OS that scaled to a 10" screen size with only soft keyboard, which is why so many of the pre-ipad tablets were windows+ rotaty hardware keyboard based.
What apple proved is that people would be happy with what was basically an oversized phone, rather than a scaled down laptop, which was really the only revolutionary bit of the idea - other tech companies thought people actually wanted at least netbook levels of function. As it turns out - and I have an android transformer which I love, so take from that what you will - browser, email, twitter, facebook and some games was all that most people actually wanted from a tablet.
But that apple owns the idea of a flat black rectangle with rounded corners and a speaker on the front is just nuts. When you look at what samsung did for the german injunction - basically wrap more of the silver surround onto the front - it just shows how ludicrous it is.
Remember kids, it's all fun and games until someone commits wholesale galactic genocide.
And, if you google around, I'm sure you'll find many other reasons to dislike Apple.
General arrogance, e.g. "You're holding it wrong." And the "We don't care, we don't have to, we're Apple" attitude as highlighted by the B&W G3 Rev.1 UDMA data corruption issue; apple's fix was buy an IDE PCI card, or buy FWB Toolkit (note the "buy" in both solutions, should be no problem for Apple customers who love throwing good money after bad) and slow down the disks with corruption by putting them in PIO mode. Apple deleted this document when they folded the old TechInfo Library into the new Knowledge Base. Documents before and after it made it, but that one went away... because it made them look like the arrogant assholes they are. These are my pet reasons why Apple can't have my money... But there are many more.
"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
Apple isn't always suing because they want to do so, but because they are forced by the law to sue others.
Do you really believe this, or are you getting paid? If you're getting paid, I can understand your circular logic, but otherwise you're just being a big fucking idiot right now. Apple files for bogus design trademark and receives it. Apple aggressively attempts to utilize bogus trademark elements to prevent competition. You claim that Apple has been forced to do this. This is inherently bogus.
Personally I would even make it so that if the patent holder does not try to negotiate in 2 weeks when the product have come to same market, and if they dont get agreement in 1 week, they have only 5 days time to sue abuser.
So if the competition brings out the product from another country while you are in the middle of national holiday, you just lose your shit? Are you trolling or just stupid?
"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
- DRM. Download music from iTunes, and you can only play it on a limited number of computers (try it and you'll find out).
Strange enough, I can make unlimited copies of songs downloaded from iTunes, and they play on any number of computers, iPads, iPhones etc. etc. etc. There is obviously the small detail that at some point you are committing copyright infringement, but you can make more copies legally of music that you download from iTunes than from a CD that you buy, and in practice you can make the same number of copies.
And unlike other companies who shut down their DRM servers when they stopped using DRM with the effect that their customers lost their music, Apple let me upgrade all 128 KBit DRM music to 256 KBit AAC as part of iTunes match.
If you work in the computer industry or study computer science, buying Apple products is not in your interest: the company creates almost no jobs in the US and it supports almost no CS research. That is in addition to Apple's monopolistic practices and their abuse of the patent system. All Apple ever does is "steal" (Steve Jobs's own words) the best ideas they can find, market the hell out of the products they build around them, and charge a premium for them.
Yes.
Help stamp out iliturcy.
The DNA thing is suppose to be an analogy ... you know the company has design, usability and innovation engrained in its culture....
Gold :)
I agree with your statement 100%. I've never purchased an Apple product and never will.
Really? They're trying to "undermine the development of Web standards and block their finalization" by coming through with the list of patents that they have which they believe might cover aspects of the standard a full month *before* the deadline to do so?
Given that the time span to do so was 2-4 months, with nobody actually in the know caring enough to say, specifically, what the particular range of time in this instance was, bringing the list in in 50-75% of the allotted time is difficult to seriously characterize as trying to "undermine the development of Web standards and block their finalization".
They're following the rules of the standards organization to which they belong, and doing so well before the deadline.
I honestly like Apple's hardware, well their laptops anyways. Yey MacBook Air!
I've never liked iOS ever since they introduced it without cut & paste. I'm cool experimenting with Apple's user-interface tweaks, like launchpad or whatever, but damn if dropping cut & paste didn't scream "you are not our target market". Apple has introduced cut & paste but damn if they haven't always lagged behind on critical features.
I'm currently using an N900 because I love the integration of VoIP with GSM and IM with SMS. I'm buying an Android soonish because only Android provides a full range of open source cryptographic options. See the Guardian Project.
Imho, the reprehensible behaviors of our governments over the last decade has made encrypting our communications a moral imperative. I.e. I've nothing important enough to keep secret, but damn if I'm not gonna make their lives harder by making my unimportant information inaccessible to them.
The Christian religion has been and still is the principal enemy of moral progress in the world. -- Bertrand Russell
It's a shitty analogy then. The beauty of DNA is instructs the creation of proteins exactly. In nature advancement happens when mistakes get made trying to copy DNA. Sometimes it results in some sort of advantage like resistance to a disease, while other times it is cancer.
You are right that there is something going on in culture that is problematic. Namely most smartphones and tablets on the market are small iterations of the same hardware with some differences in the polish. The problem isn't why are these interfaces starting to share some details. The problem is that there may be three firms actually manufacturing smartphone hardware and the firms marketing the hardware are fighting to create distinctions in the icing rather than the core product. Even Apple is guilty of this mentality to a degree with so much of its hardware being made by the firm that assembles Xboxs (that and iCloud being hosted on MS Azure).
The most prominent recent example is the Amazon Fire and BlackBerry PlayBook being essentially the same hardware with differing operating systems and storage capacities.
http://www.aaronrogier.net
if only I had mod points to give you, AC. The system that allows this to take place is the problem, not the soulless corporations that are all suing each other out of fiduciary responsibility (otherwise known as "whatever isn't forbidden is mandatory") /. is that they used a big fat polarizing keyword: "Apple". Dvorak figured this out years ago: when you need readers, bash Apple. You'll either get the haters or the fanbois or maybe even both, and the tasty, tasty pageviews that line the wallet.
TechRights thanks you for providing the page views, Apple Haters. The only reason this article made the cut on
bah.
The only Apple product I use/own is iTunes, and guess what, I don't need it for anything. It is uninstalling now.
Silence is a state of mime.
When the definition of "copy", "look like" and "iOS-alike" is as broad as Apple's, then yes, it is literally the only way to design a tablet.
Posted from my Leapfrog LeapPad.
For me, Apple gets no money because walled gardens suck. They do have great products and great content, but I've never taken a liking to their products since the days of my senior thesis in '90-'91.
http://www.lawdit.co.uk/reading_room/room/view_article.asp?name=../articles/11000-ad-Apple-Samsung-Patents.htm
Apple stole the "slide to unlock", minimalist design and other features from existing devices. Then they had the balls to sue companies like Samsung over these features that Apple didn't even own or create. BAU for the new evil empire.
"A plan fiendishly clever in its intricacies"- Homer Simpson
Boycott will likely have very little affect, of course product recommendations and mocking victims of marketing will have a very significant affect. Just having a quick squizz around the mobile market and some interesting newer players are cropping up http://www.huaweidevice.com/worldwide/productHomeAction.do?method=index&directoryId=5000, http://www.lg.com/us/mobile-phones/view-all-phones/view-all-phones.jsp and now http://techcrunch.com/2011/12/09/panasonic-mobile-oled-europe/ back in the market.
What is really hotting up the mobile phone market is their ability to be very good remote controls for pretty much every thing in the house, which makes them entry level for the digital home, from unlocking doors, open the garage door, adjusting air conditioning, controlling the TV etc. etc.. Companies with a full range of electronic and electrical products are going to start pushing real hard.
Chaos - everything, everywhere, everywhen
I don't see how this is a "troll". It's no worse than the OP.
Meh. The real geeks know that suing people over writing code with trivial patents that should have never been applied for and should have never been granted is the real farce here. Apple has ushered in a new era in coding. A new day when you cannot sit down in from of your computer and write useful code without worrying about Apple suing you with an army of lawyers. Their attack on open source and free software is despicable. Their egregious behaviour in the marketplace with their "all your code are belong to us" brigade. Real geeks know that all Apple did was chopped the keyboard off the laptop form factor and they are claiming that as a new invention. As a geek I cannot in good faith support Apple's products. I don't care if they have commercial Unix or not. Those who will trade their freedom for a little convenience deserve neither.
No.
The public-private partnership has transcended from trend to religion. Obama/Gingrich/Romney-Care illustrates that. If only Hilary-Care happened.
http://www.aaronrogier.net
The iPhone release, the App Store introduction, the iPad release... This is nothing.
http://www.aaronrogier.net
I attribute it to one of two things: jealousy or schadenfreude. They're either jealous because they can't afford an Apple product, or they're one of those people that just detest success, like those Yankees haters. It's not the Yankees' fault that they've won a number of World Series over the years.
I suppose that if you were familiar with the history of the Edison and Westinghouse companies, you would know that Thomas Edison was no stranger to dirty tricks (to be fair, neither was Westinghouse). Edison's company was hired to produce the first electric chair, and they chose to use Westinghouse AC generators for this purpose. Edison went around demonstrating the lethality of AC power by putting on public displays of animal electrocution using AC generators, always sure to mention that Westinghouse was using AC power and he was using DC power. Edison himself was opposed to execution, but accepted to contract to produce the electric chair for the specific purpose of demonstrating that AC power could kill human beings.
Perhaps you want to pick a rich industrialist who was a decent, friendly individual that did not pull underhanded tricks to claw his way to the top? I just cannot seem to think of any...
Palm trees and 8
I admit, this is a bit old, but on Page 6 of this HTC Incredible manual, it tells you exactly where NOT to put your fingers because it'll interfere with reception.
http://member.america.htc.com/download/Web_materials/Manual/HTC_INCREDIBLE(Verizon)/100421_IncredibleC_VZW_English_Safety-and-Warranty.pdf
Everyone wants you to hold your phone some particular way. :/
Wow, which /. are you reading? At the top, there's this comment that's currently rated +5, informative:
"Apple behaviour is pretty disgusting and, I'd join the embargo 'BUT' damn I've always found their gear to be overhyped and overpriced and basically always gone else where. I'll think you'll find that this is pretty much the trend with the majority of computer geeks.
For what it's worth I vow never to buy an Apple product ;D."
I don't even understand which bit counts as 'informative'. The Apple haters are out in full force with their mod points, too.
I was perhaps your biggest fan. But an Apple boycott is not how you come back to us unless they've done something dire and they haven't.
Come back and let us beat down your trolls. That would be better than this.
If you can't do that, at least make the issue SOPA and PIPA. That we can get behind. Apple's not going to do it because their fans really don't give a darn about what us geeks think.
Really? Over-generalize much?
I've been an Apple fan since 1976, and I care very much about Our Rights Online.
I also have just one thing to point out regarding Jobs' claims that Android became popular by becoming a nearly direct clone, (UI and form-factor-wise at the very least), of iOS devices...
Except it's not infringing, it's allegedly infringing. These bans are a case of sentence before verdict.
When or if, in the fullness of time, infringement is proven then the damages will reflect that. More sales = higher damages. But it doesn't work the other way round; Samsung & HTC won't be able to claim back their lost sales caused by Apple's barratry.
Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
You can pry my MacBook from my cold dead hands.
Fix the patent system. If you want to boycott companies that 'abuse' it then you'll end up boycotting all technology companies. Good luck with that luddite strategy. Every mobile phone maker is suing every other mobile phone maker. This is a systemic problem, not a localized one. If any of these companies try to take the moral high ground they will be put out of business. We should attack the root of the problem, the patent system, rather than the end result of the problem.
If Apple was nothing but a patent troll then I would understand the argument. But if Apple was nothing but a patent troll they wouldn't have any products to boycott.
"From the depths of my skeptical and rationalist soul, I ask the Lord to protect me from California touchie-feeliedom."
I've never bought any Apple gear either, but have recommended it to many MS-Windows using friends who are techno-clueless and want to get away from Microsoft. These people don't care about tech ideology and Apple offers a better "just works" product than Microsoft.
All the big uproar over Apple's behavior is the realization that Apple/Jobs are the same kind of evil corporate overlords that Microsoft is with the same distasteful and evil business practices.
"I believe in Karma. That means I can do bad things to people all day long and I assume they deserve it." : Dogbert
I lot of people who used to think that godaddy suited them best, decided to take another look. Could the same thing happen to Apple? I come across people who are frustrated with iTunes, and don't see the point of a $150 Nano, when a $30 Sansa clip seems to do the job just as well.
Everyone is suing everyone else to get the cross licensing revenue. Once one company proves you can make money via lawsuit, It becomes the duty of all other companies to exploit this untapped revenue stream to increase shareholder value. A company is duty bound to use every advantage to the benefit of the shareholders. This includes lawsuits, PR campaigns, injunctions, and broken patent systems.
Personally I find the whole lawsuit, Intellectual property business distasteful, but it is the shape of things to come. If we had all this during the industrial revolution, we would be screwed.
What's funny about your comment is that Apple is the reason you think of a laptop looking the way it does.
Article X: The powers not delegated... by the Constitution...are reserved...to the people
From about 3 days ago? It was enough to get Godaddy to back off their SOPA support.
So yes, it seems that boycotts are still effective.
From that single website, the idea has progressed to slashdot, which still a lot of readers.
If you remember, the Godaddy boycott seemed to take off shortly after Godaddy SOPA's stance was reported on a single tech website.
For example, I'm sure Apple's $150+ iPod Nano is a quality product. But you can get a Sansa Clip, which is better in many respects, for $30; and not have to fight with iTunes.
Let's be honest, sure Apple makes some quality products, but for a lot of people, a lot of the appeal of Apple is a fashion statement. When Apple looks like a scummy IP troll, maybe Apple stuff won't be so fashionable. The high fashion world is finckle.
MLK, Ghandi, and more recently, the Godaddy boycott.
Boycotts can be extremely effective.
Someone really needs to mention that there is often an issue of FRAND (fair, reasonable, and non-discriminatory) patents. Companies that hold patents that they want to have adopted by a standards organization will usually agree to FRAND licensing of those patents. However, it appears this system is fraying around the edges. Companies, like Nokia and Samsung, will offer terms to some companies and then when dealing with Apple insist on cross licensing with Apple's patents that are not encumbered by FRAND terms.
Personally, I'm not convinced that patents have ever been an optimal idea for society going back as far as James Watt's steam engine. But given the reality of the legal system that is in place, I think it is rather dishonest for many of these companies to act as though they are victims when they are attempting to ignore that they had agreed to license in a non-discriminatory fashion.
So if we are going to start down this road, I think companies holding FRAND patents who have clearly failed to honor the terms as they had agreed, should be stripped of those patents. Also, instead of extending patents to ever new areas (business method, software, design) those "innovations" should be rolled back in recognition of what disasters they have become.
Boycots against any company are foolish because it's a very poor way to send any message. The signal is lost in a vast sea of noise of purchases. As noted, Apple isn't even the most egregious player here....
Where do you get your "facts" just make them up as you go? Boycotts have been proven to be extremely effective. And Apple is even worse than Microsoft when it comes to abusing the patent system to restrain free trade.
Anybody can see what is going on here. Apple does not want to compete in a free market, so Apple is trying to rig the system with a load of bullshit patents like rounded corners.
I get it. I see where you are going with this, but lets be honest. Whether it's Google, Microsoft, Apple or whoever...Patents are patents. You think Google, if the sides were switched, wouldn't do the same thing. If you say no, you're ignorant.
Excuse me, I think it is 100% apparent that Google would certainly not do the same thing. Whatever complaints you have against google, goolge has never been a scummy patent troll - which is more than Microsoft, or Apple, can say.
And yes, Virginia, Google could patent troll if they wanted to do so.
Please show the filed complaints of Apple v Amazon (kindle fire), Apple v Motorola (Xoom), Apple v Asus (Eee Transformer) or Apple v RIM (PlayBook).
Oh, I guess there is still plenty of tablets on the market that Apple isn't suing the manufacturers, because they are not blatant copies of the design. But don't let facts get in the way of your bias.
Slashdot still doesnâ(TM)t support Unicode after it was added to the HTML standard in 1997.
I've owned only one HTC phone, a Raphael, and it is a festering piece of shit. There is a known problem with the keyboard cable pulling out which can be solved with a piece of tape, but when they service the phones they just plug it back in and ship them out again. So HTC might not be the best example, at least not in my book.
"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
Besides, boycott may be counterproductive -- Apple left on its own can well generate more bad will than Apple pestered by boycotts. So, instead of recommending a boycott, inform your readers about the problems Apple is creating and help them make informed and rational decisions about their purchases. And if they decide Apple is good for them, then let them have it -- it is their choice, after all.
WTF?
The publicity from a boycott would only help generate bad will. And I mean help quite a lot. Consider the recent boycotts of BofA, and Godaddy.
People should understand that buying from is bad for everybody, because it promotes abusing the patent system to restrain free trade.
A boycott will not sway all Apple users, of course, but it might sway enough.
Godaddy only lost about 72K domains. As I understand it, there are about 45 million domains registered at godaddy. Clearly the boycott did not say *all* godaddy users, but it swayed enough.
Samsung. Reality check: how many other companies given the same amount of power Apple wields would not use it in the same way?
I don't see Google filing bullshit patent lawsuits all over the place.
Samsung is even bigger than Apple, but I don't see that kind of shameful behavior from Samsung. Samsung is only defending itself against an agressive patent scam company.
Google is not abusing the patent system in an attempt to restrain free trade.
Apple just does want to compete. We all know Apple's patents are pure bullshit.
Let's all pick on THE innovative company who is simply going after others for copying their intellectual property,
Apple is only innovative in it's ways to restrain free trade, because Apple cannot compete otherwise. Apple's patents, and lawsuits, are frivolous bullshit, and we both know it.
Every mobile phone maker is suing every other mobile phone maker.
By that you mean: other phone makers are trying to defend themselves against the Apple, and Microsoft, patent scam blitz.
Apple is 100% to blame for this. It is not fair to blame Samsung for trying to defend itself against Apple's aggressive patent scam.
Actually, Apple was like other companies asked to report which patents they owned that they believed would cover web standards, and then they told which patents these were. So people working on the standard have the choice of trying to convince Apple to license their patents, or to make sure that the standard can be implemented without infringing any patents. This is exactly the opposite of what Rambus did, which cost memory manufacturers hundreds of millions of dollars.
Why is this a problem all of a sudden? Monopolies do this all the time and it seems to be right in-line with Copyright trolling, Patent lawsuits and the RIAA/MPAA. It's the American way. Why bother with a 15% player when there are much bigger fish to go after?
I'm not an Apple fan, but If you're going to cry foul with Apple on this, then you ought to hold every other egregious bastardization of the legal system to the same principle.
Join the Slashcott! Feb 10 thru Feb 17!
Yes, and Samsung is a huge teddy bear in all of this, and Oracle is playing the part of Santa Claus.
Seriously, dont pretend Apple is alone in their shenanigans.
Apple's just as sleazy as lots of other companies who are out there fighting patent wars, but I do agree that in this case Apple is attempting to monopolize the market against what it sees as a serious threat. If it weren't for them actually having bullshit patents to wave around, the government would likely be chewing their asses up for their behavior.
I mean come on, they're suing over the act of making phone numbers and URLs in text messages clickable. This is in no way an original idea from Apple, they just got the patent on it first, since apparently nobody else thought this was worth patenting to begin with. I've even written code which does the exact same kinds of things, just because it's stupid to not add such a convenience for users. So why does performing this task inside a text message make it patent-worthy?
Just flush the entire patent library out already. Obviously 99% of them were passed by people with absolutely no understanding of technology or common sense. I could write some long detailed explanation of a particular way to submit a Slashdot comment, and I bet I'd get the patent for that too.
Meanwhile, it's always funny to see Apple fanboys out in full force claiming Apple is just protecting their company, even though if the opposite had happened and Microsoft or Samsung had forced the iPhone to stop being sold, it would be civil war.
What you expect from a flamewar? But what particularly bothers me is reading comments like "Apple is the leading innovator in the universe" (which is a lie) marked +5 Insightful or +5 informative. I can not decide which is worse: The ludicrous patent war or fanboys openly supporting the fraudulent practices of the Apple (a little more and it will process even Leonardo da Vinci for stealing their "innovations").
Religion: The greatest weapon of mass destruction of all time
Actually, they can. In some jurisdictions, companies asking for bans must put up a bond to compensate the other company in case of lost profits should the verdict find that there is no infringement. One of the benefits of Apple having such a huge cash hoard is that they can offer such bonds, a luxury other companies don't have, and potentially one of the factors that make Apple so much more likely to ask for bans. http://theapplebites.com/apple-requests-potential-motorola-bond-16-billion-german-patent-case
Except that Apple are actively stiffling cross-licensing, while freely using others IP without paying until dragged to court. Nokia is a perfect example. Nokia's lawyers tried many times to get Apple to cross license. No deal.
So "We'll let you use patents from the FRAND GSM patent pool that even the smallest phone maker can use for a small fee if you give us full access to your all your patents" translates to "cross license" from Finnish?
Fandroids hate facts.
U mad bro?
So you're saying apple owns minimalism? They're the only ones who are allowed to create thin devices featuring a large screen and black sides around it? Would you exclude the galaxy tab if it had a handle on it? No, I doubt anything would satisfy you, or Apple for that matter.
One exception to this is if a patent is proposed as part of an industry standard that is required to comply with the industry standard (like LTE and other communications standards). In that case the owner of the patent agrees to FRAND licensing terms (fair, reasonable, and non-discriminatory).
That is at the core of some of these disputes. For instance Samsung holds some FRAND patents for LTE. They license it to some companies for a specific price. When dealing with Apple they refuse to offer the same terms but insist on cross licensing of Apple patents that are not FRAND encumbered. This violates the non-discriminatory part of their agreement. But if you are a huge company with access to expensive legal resources it hardly matters if you violate terms of your agreements. I suppose that is what lawyers are for. Of course in this case although Samsung is a huge business conglomerate, Apple is also a huge company with vast legal resources. So we get to watch a sumo match that is rolling out worldwide.
In a sense it is almost satisfying to watch huge corporations caught up in the "intellectual property" tar baby of their own devising. It offers a contrast to the usual bullying of smaller players which is probably the more common case though not as easily visible.
only problem is, is that IOS was out before android. So how can android phones look different before IOS if they didn't exist?
http://chimpbox.us
Boycott the companies that stole Apple's IP.
Where did you get the idea that cross licensing is "the right thing"? I'm glad that at least one of the leviathans is not playing the cross licensing game. Making cross licensing the normal course of events means that only large established corporations get to play the game. If you don't have a vast portfolio of patents, regardless of whether they are valid or even useful, means that new and possibly innovative entrants face a daunting prospect.
If only the smaller, less politically connected (i.e. no history of making repeated large political contributions) companies are subject to damaging legal proceedings what are the chances for patent reform? But if Samsung and similar titans are similarly vexed, maybe the politicians they own will do something about the ruinous patent system.
>>DRM
>>Funny as Apple/Jobs pushed music labels to release their music DRM free
Apple only did this because they couldn't compete with MP3's / vorbis etc....
They designed, and wanted to keep the walled garden but could not compete with openness.
The government which is strong enough to protect you from everything is strong enough to take everything from you.
Apple is over, they just haven't figured it out yet.
only problem is, is that IOS was out before android. So how can android phones look different before IOS if they didn't exist?
I have tried to parse the moebius-like timeline of the above comment; but I can't figure out what the antecedent of the the word "they" is in the quoted text. Can you restate that in English, please?
Alas, it's the same for me. I've never bought an Apple product and never will. Most people who would buy Apple products probably couldn't care less about how many people commit suicide in their factories in China or how underhanded they are in anti-competitive practices elsewhere. They are the model corporation (in the worst possible sense), yet I bet more than a few people in the occupy movement love to use Apple products.
Don't you mean making tablets that look like Crunchpads?
http://techcrunch.com/2009/07/04/crunchpad-prototype-coming-this-month-be-available-asap/
note the date
CUPS was developed long before Apple bought it. Have you ever tried doing something in CUPS on OSX that is easily possible on CUPS in Linux? CUPS on OSX is some kind of franken-CUPS.
Before Apple bought CUPS there was a CUPS aware printer driver available for Windows. That was great, one printer driver for just about everything. Sigh, that hasn't been updated since the purchase and the old driver no longer works with CUPS. Not exactly an advancement.
Only a geek would propose a boycott of a mass market consumer product the day after Christmas.
_____
To make a boycott of cabbage and potatoes succeed, you have to reach out to the buyers of cabbage and potatoes.
More than that, you have to be one of them.
Remember that you are trying to persuade these people that the boycott is more important to them than putting a meal on the table at a price they can afford.
If it is all about you and your causes, you will fail.
Download music from iTunes, and you can only play it on a limited number of computers (try it and you'll find out).
Nope, been unencrptyted now for many years (and with iTunes Match Apple will even give you a nice 256kb DRM-free audio file of everything you ever ripped from a CD).
So that was totally wrong.
Of course, iTunes, is NOT proprietary in any way, nor is the format of the information managed by it. Apple freely provides the necessary information for non-Apple programs/devices to do similar functions.
Locking hardware to software.
This was a particularly amusing error because you almost had a point! If only you had reversed it.
But in fact Apple does not lock hardware to software at all. Apple, for example, shipped bootcamp with the first Intel Mac.
So, your iGadget is not locked to software? You can freely connect it to another gadget which contains NO Apple software and actually move things back and forth?
Pushing of proprietary standards.
Like the industry standard HTML5?
Or the industry standard video codec h.264?
Or forcing the music industry to drop DRM?
Apple has not pushed proprietary standards since AppleTalk.
What about the mag-safe connector, the iPod connector, keyboard, etc? These are not proprietary? What about the standard USB?
Being the middle-man.
I can download music from anywhere and load it on an iPhone.
Without software from Apple?
Free apps pay nothing to Apple.
I can put any number of PDF's on a iPhone, or read Kindle books with which not one cent went to Apple...
"A" middle man? Sure. THE middle man? Not even close.
If Apple is not THE middle man, the please explain where you get the apps if it is not via Apple's store. Having only ONE store certainly places Apple in the middle.
With a brand as loved and popular as Apple's, a boycott by a few concerned geeks isn't going to even register as a rounding error on their profits.
If you want change, work to demand patent reform to prevent anti-competitive abuses of the patent system by not only Apple, but all tech companies existing and future. Apple is just the most recent poster child for patent abuse -- the problem is that the patent system is broken, not that Apple is "evil."
Apple is just leveraging the tools they see at their disposal to maximize profits. Any corporation run by an MBA team instead of an idealistic family founder does the same.
I do not fail; I succeed at finding out what does not work.
Glad to finally see people waking up from the illusion Apples shit smells good when in fact it smells just as bad as everyone elses.
Posted from my Infineon Phantom.
It's not a matter of just going after apple, it's more a matter of starting with the worst offenders and working down. Take out a general or two and the privates abandon the fight in droves.
All or nothing tends towards nothing. We can't afford to continue doing nothing forever.
I think there are 3 things going on.
1) Apple really and truly believes their interfaces were copied. I think if you look at interfaces before and after the iPhone, there can be little doubt that there was substantial copying of Apple's way of doing things, slide to unlock being a pretty clear example. For those that argue that all copying is the only way to do things consider how many interfaces were similar to Palm's stylus based interfaces.
2) Patents and restrictions are used to prevent products from being sold. Quite simply the laws are not functioning properly for technology.
3) The suits are going in both directions. For example the things Apple has been sued for by Samsung:
Samsung and Nokia sued apple for using 3G
Smiley faces input
Regulators on wireless speeds
Using Qualcomm chips (though this is dropped).
It's amusing that you think the "Haters" will just not let people use what they find suits them best, when that is precisely Apple's strategy (not letting people just use what they find suits them best) and the reason the majority of "Haters" exist.
How much can you hate something for what it doesn't do?
Is it impossible for you to like Apple's products for _WHAT THEY DO_?
Considering that the link you provided has plenty of responses saying the same thing, I'm pretty sure you know what he meant. Just in case, here it is in plain english. The article you linked to showed what Android devices looked like before the iPhone and iPad came out. History tells us that the iPhone came out before the first Android phone. Therefore there was no Android device that looked different prior to the first iPhone like the article claimed. In fact, the picture showed a series of Windows-based devices in the "before iPhone" pictures. It is therefore a bad article and shouldn't be used as a reference whether you're wrong or right.
Personally, I abandoned the whole smart-phone thing as a bad addiction, but I won't buy an iOS-based device for my house. My computer is too valuable to install iTunes on. That and they're over-priced.
Addlepated - punk & metal
THe only thing I'd add to this festival of Apple hate is that when the iPhone was first released, it was Samsung who sued first and wanted to ban the sale of the iPhone. I'm not going to pick sides, but if you really believe that Samsung or any Tech company is some open platform and free software angel that only exists to protect your privacy and sense of entitlement and not resort to dirty tricks then you are a very naive person. Yes, the patent system is a mess. Yes, companies abuse the system. Yes, customers suffer because of the actions of these companies. BUT; if you think only the companies you have a personal bias against are guilty of these actions, then you are mistaken and are also a pawn. If you want the system to change than you have to boycott it all. And if you are not prepared to drop all of your commercially sourced tech hardware and software then this talk of "action" is futile.
There is no security when liberty is sacrificed.
Actually, Apple was like other companies asked to report which patents they owned that they believed would cover web standards, and then they told which patents these were. So people working on the standard have the choice of trying to convince Apple to license their patents, or to make sure that the standard can be implemented without infringing any patents. This is exactly the opposite of what Rambus did, which cost memory manufacturers hundreds of millions of dollars.
This would seem very reasonable, but think about it: if Apple cares so much about open standards why wait until the last moment to reveal such minor details or, better yet, why not donate such patents for the sake of the common good, i.e. HTML5?
Yes, Apple is not a charity, blah blah blah. Bu then what's the point of supporting HTML5 and, at the same time, preventing useful features to be incorporated into the standard? As I wrote, I can't think of any other reason but laying the foundation for Apple version of HTML5. And just when I thought the days of "best view with Internet Explorer" where finally gone!
Also, last time I checked, it seems that you still need QuickTime to watch the trailers at trailers.apple.com, so excuse me if I have difficulties seeing Apple as a staunch supporter of open standards. Or could be that proprietary technologies are bad only when they're not Apple's?
RT.
I might agree--the problem is, who defines fair and reasonable?
In this example, I've said that if you want to use my patents, I get to use your patents. Others have agreed to this, also, so I have a group that has said, "Yeah. I get to use your patents, you get to use my patents, that's fair and reasonable."
Now someone else comes along and says, "No! You don't get to use my patents but I get to use yours!" Is that fair?
I don't see how fair and reasonable come in to this specific case. That has already been used to determine a price which is available to other customers. The non-discriminatory part of the obligation means Samsung (in this case) is required to offer that same price to Apple, i.e. not discriminate depending on the customer. If I understand what little I have read, Samsung refuses to accept that option from Apple so Apple has no deal to close until Samsung lives up to the FRAND obligation they agreed to in order to have their patents accepted as part of a public standard. I'm pretty sure this is also the case of Nokia's patents.
I'm not a fan of the patent system but I don't see how Samsung and Nokia are sympathetic actors when they are trying to weasel out of their FRAND obligations which largely provide the reason why their patents have worth. I am frankly baffled that people seem to assume that Apple is simply unwilling to pay a licensing fee for use of patents. What I believe Apple is refusing to do is be treated in a discriminatory fashion by companies with FRAND patents. How is that sinister?
Oh, a college boy, eh?
No, just someone with a vocabulary larger than 100 words.
Do you know the meaning of the expression, "cherry picking", when applied to arguments?
That's setting aside the contextual errors.
That little link you are so enamored of is ignoring a huge chunk of history. Leaving handles off is trivial. If we want to talk about handles, what Apple did with the clamshell iBook was innovative in a design sense.
All Apple did with the design of either the iPad or the iPhone was take the design the next logical step as technology improved.
And not everyone agrees that design patents were a good innovation. There was a time, you know, when they did not exist in the free country that was the US back then.
Computer memory is just fancy paper, CPUs just fancy pens with fancy erasers; the 'net is just a fancy backyard fence.
What did Apple "invent" that is worthy of a patent?
How about BofA boycott?
Funny, I thought both of those were fairly popular.
Apple chose to file all of those frivolous patents, and frivolous lawsuits.
That has already been used to determine a price which is available to other customers. The non-discriminatory part of the obligation means Samsung (in this case) is required to offer that same price to Apple, i.e. not discriminate depending on the customer.
The people who are using these patents are all inside a particular group that share patents. So, as I said I above, if I want to use your patents, I have to let you use mine. All of the people using these patents agree this arrangement. All members of the group get value from using each others patents. There is no discrimination going on within the group.
Apple is the company that doesn't want to join the group and share it's patents. Which is perfectly fine--Apple has that right. But they cannot claim that they should receive the same benefits as those who share their patents. Those patents from other people have value and those are part of the "fee" for using the patents. If Apple does not want to contribute their patents, then they should have to pay the equivalent cash value.
For example, if I join the local supermarket's "grocery club," I give them something of value--namely information about me and my shopping habits. They, in return, give me a discount on the groceries that I buy. What you're saying is that you should be able to get the same discounts but you shouldn't have to join the "grocery club" and give them your personal information.
The patents that are being shared are part of the value that Samsung is receiving for it's patents. If Apple doesn't want to share, then it falls to Samsung to come up with a cash equivalent.
The issue is that the competitive market breaks if one company prevents other companies from implementing equivalent capabilities in their own devices.
Although you could argue that's the purpose of patents, my understanding is that patents are intended to protect a specific way of doing something, not the idea of doing it. Software patents (which are primarily the ones being used) are inherently flawed in a number of ways.
Giving all of the control to one company inhibits progress by everyone else, slows the breakneck pace of innovation we're all enjoying and takes our toys off us. Why wouldn't there be a strong stance on this?
You might want to listen to Steve Jobs, 1994: http://youtu.be/CW0DUg63lqU
He was happy to steal other people's ideas and now Apple is upset that others are playing are playing on the playground as well.
Well put.
LOL
Why is it that when somebody blatantly steals design, form factor, user interface concepts or just blatantly copies Apple it's "fair competition" when the same practice anywhere else is obviously stealing? Why is it that Apple's innovations are public domain?
CarrierIQ was on iPhones as well. And on Symbian. CarrierIQ is OS independent and installed (mostly) on branded USA devices.
Yes, MeGoo was spared. But that is because MeGoo is
a) not branded
b) still born
And last not least: All Google-Experience Devices (Nexus and XOOM) come without CarrierIQ. So no need to place CarrierIQ and Google in the same sentence.
The purpose for patents is not to protect the invention any more. It's to protect against ANY invention. And that's not what patents are for.
Unfortunately patents have not protected inventions for a long time, they are designed to be used to exclude others from copying your exact methods and do not necessarily allow you to do something. "Law" Header -> "Effects" http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patent
No, it's not. The Apple artwork was used in a Centro Sicilia store in Catania, Italy. Samsung scrambled to replace the artwork after it was pointed out.
"Sufferin' succotash."
I'm just saying antenna problems aren't the exclusive domain of Apple. It's just that the iPhone is so popular and newsworthy that even non-newsworthy things make it to the news. :)
"A store not operated by Samsung used Apple's icons" is a BIG difference from "Samsung stole Apples Icons"
It's a lie.
Required reading for internet skeptics
You Google fanboys obviously enjoy circle-jerking each other into a frenzy but the rest of us find it disgusting.
Replace "Google" from the previous statement with a wildcard and you end up with an accurate description of most if not all of the sides in many Slashdot debates.
not to mention environmental issues. They are known as the lease green company
I don't think Apple leases hardware. IBM used to, but that was a while ago.
And if you meant "least green company", well, if you ask Greenpeace, it's more like fourth greenest company. (Then again, a lot of what Greenpeace rates highly is openness about policies and advocacy; Apple was, for a long time, not very open about its environmental policies and not much for advocating particular policies - the lowest-rated company on that list, RIM, was dinged for, among other things, not having explicit policies - "New to the Guide, RIM needs to improve reporting and disclosure of its environmental performance compared to other mobile phone makers.")
While what you say is true, Apple made design decisions which made the problem much worse than it needed to be, and then defended them stupidly, which is why Apple is and always will be known for "You're holding it wrong". The unbearable arrogance of Jobs. That's right up there with the PS3 is "probably too cheap" ... h0h0h0
"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"