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Rackspace: SOPA "Is a Deeply Flawed Piece of Legislation"

hypnosec writes "Cloud-based hosting service provider Rackspace has joined the ever expanding list of companies that are opposed to the U.S. Stop Online Piracy Act (SOPA). In a blog post, Rackspace CEO Lanham Napier said that the controversial bill, which will get its final vote before the House Judiciary Committee, will do more harm than good, punishing innocent users in the process. 'The SOPA bill, as it stands, is a deeply flawed piece of legislation. It is bad for anyone who uses the Internet, including Rackspace, the more than 160,000 business customers that we serve, and the tens of millions of retail customers that they serve. It is bad for job creation and innovation,' Napier wrote."

213 comments

  1. Flawed? by BronsCon · · Score: 4, Funny

    No shit?

    --
    APK quotes people (including myself) without context and should not be trusted. Just thought you should know.
    1. Re:Flawed? by BronsCon · · Score: 2, Funny

      I was going for funny, but redundant works, I guess.

      --
      APK quotes people (including myself) without context and should not be trusted. Just thought you should know.
    2. Re:Flawed? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

      Flawed? No, shit!

      Fixed that for you.

    3. Re:Flawed? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Not sure why Hollywood is pushing for SOPA. Why bother? Aren't they are the ones who told us the world is gonna end in 2012? Don't they believe their own propaganda?

    4. Re:Flawed? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      I disagree. "Flawed" implies it was supposed to be something other than what it is. SOPA is not an accident: it is an intentional "fuck you."

    5. Re:Flawed? by BronsCon · · Score: 2, Funny

      Intentional, international, or both?

      --
      APK quotes people (including myself) without context and should not be trusted. Just thought you should know.
    6. Re:Flawed? by jersacct · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Let's not give detractors too much credit. "As it stands", as quoted by Rackspace's CEO, implies that a simple revision of the legislation would make it okay.

    7. Re:Flawed? by SJHillman · · Score: 1

      A lot of really crappy legislation, even stuff like the DMCA and SOPA, could be turned into good if revised. The problem with most of the legislation is that it's too broad, like firing buckshot into a group of hostages to take out one terrorist. If the legislation was fine-tuned into a sniper rifle then it might be okay. When it comes to laws, it's usually better to have a law that's too narrow to get the fringe or weaker cases than one that's too broad just so you can mop up the gray areas.

  2. Nearly all laws are by reboot246 · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Most all laws over the last few decades have been deeply flawed in some way. That's what you get when you elect idiots.

    1. Re:Nearly all laws are by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Or rather, that's what you get when your politicians can make promises of intent without any fear of being held accountable once elected.

    2. Re:Nearly all laws are by reboot246 · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Tell me about it! My Congressman is Spencer Bachus, one of the biggest crooks and liars in Washington. We're probably going to vote him out next year, but whoever replaces him will probably be just as bad.

      I say "probably" because we have a lot of idiot voters, too.

    3. Re:Nearly all laws are by Nadaka · · Score: 3, Funny

      On the bright side, you could always get someone worse.

    4. Re:Nearly all laws are by ColaMan · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Oh they're not idiots.

      They're very smart.

      It's just that they have different goals to what you would like.

      --

      You are in a twisty maze of processor lines, all alike.
      There is a lot of hype here.
    5. Re:Nearly all laws are by 0123456 · · Score: 1, Insightful

      Most all laws over the last few decades have been deeply flawed in some way. That's what you get when you elect idiots.

      No, it's what you get when you let a bloated central government interfere with every aspect of your life.

      Central planners almost always fsck up, even when they're acting with good intentions; when they get something right it's almost always by chance.

    6. Re:Nearly all laws are by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      True, but the person who replaces him will not get to be the chair on any committee of any importance. It takes years of seniority, helped by having a incredibly safe district, to get the important positions before you can become a Grade A crook in DC.

    7. Re:Nearly all laws are by deblau · · Score: 5, Insightful

      That's what happens when Congress is in the pocket of big business. Any good business person will tell you that you need recurring revenue. Congress does it through sunset provisions: "Oh, that law you really like is expiring soon? Well, maybe I can get an extension passed, but it'll cost lots of money to advance that ahead of extensions that other people want." It's really a racket.

      --
      This post expresses my opinion, not that of my employer. And yes, IAAL.
    8. Re:Nearly all laws are by JustinKSU · · Score: 4, Informative

      My Kansas Senator is proposing an alternative: http://moran.senate.gov/public/index.cfm/news-releases?ID=4a3d7f95-6208-445f-9e25-2f290a334938

      I haven't seen any detailed legislation, but assuming it does what it says it does, it would be nice if those against SOPA could put some weight behind this approach instead.

    9. Re:Nearly all laws are by JustinKSU · · Score: 1
    10. Re:Nearly all laws are by Osgeld · · Score: 1

      they are con-artists who are jerked around by the balls by big money, and too fucking stupid to notice

    11. Re:Nearly all laws are by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      See Hanlon's Razor.

      When politicians in a position of leadership are known for their continued repetition of failure, rather than a record of general social improvement and progress, it is safe to conclude that ineptness is winning the hand.

    12. Re:Nearly all laws are by Sloppy · · Score: 5, Insightful

      That's what you get when you elect idiots.

      Who is the greater idiot: the idiots or the idiots who vote for them?

      Let's not for a moment pretend we have anyone other than ourselves to blame. Everyone says they hate SOPA, but talk about voting against the SOPA parties and suddenly you're a wacko and 90+% people start listing reasons they plan to support the people who enact it.

      --
      As copyright owner of this comment, I authorize everyone to defeat any technological measure which limits access to it.
    13. Re:Nearly all laws are by similar_name · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Tell me about it! My Congressman is Spencer Bachus, one of the biggest crooks and liars in Washington. We're probably going to vote him out next year

      Well, he's only won 10 times in a row, maybe the 11th is the charm. He received 75% of the vote in the primary in 2010 and hasn't been challenged in the general election the last 4 times. Good luck.

    14. Re:Nearly all laws are by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It would help if other parties had more than a snowball's chance in hell of ever being elected in the U.S.

    15. Re:Nearly all laws are by BlueStrat · · Score: 1, Insightful

      Most all laws over the last few decades have been deeply flawed in some way. That's what you get when you elect idiots.

      No, it's what you get when you let a bloated central government interfere with every aspect of your life.

      Central planners almost always fsck up, even when they're acting with good intentions; when they get something right it's almost always by chance.

      This.

      It's sad and ironic that so many that are invested in the entitlement society suffer selective blindness when the all-too-predictable results of such central planning & control manifests, and call for even more central planning & control to "fix" the problem of too much central planning & control.

      Strat

      --
      Progressivism (aka US 'Liberalism'): Ideas so good they need a police/surveillance-state to enforce.
    16. Re:Nearly all laws are by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      That's true for only some. There are plenty of idiots* in government too & the ones with different goals are all to happy to abuse those idiots.

      * Doesn't mean they have to be stupid about everything. But a lot of them are arrogant to the point of stupidity:

    17. Re:Nearly all laws are by Skal+Tura · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Lesser evil does not make evil good.
      If it bears any resemblance to SOPA it's just as evil.

    18. Re:Nearly all laws are by JustinKSU · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Lesser evil does not make evil good. If it bears any resemblance to SOPA it's just as evil.

      Stopping piracy is not evil. But the methods to do so can be.

    19. Re:Nearly all laws are by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "the SOPA parties"
      You DO realize firstly that this is a bipartisan law and secondly that ALL political parties are corrupt, correct?

    20. Re:Nearly all laws are by Sloppy · · Score: 2

      Ok, let's begin that list I was talking about. So.. reason #1 for supporting SOPA is: your candidate has only a snowballs' chance in hell of being elected (probably because you've decided to not vote for him).

      --
      As copyright owner of this comment, I authorize everyone to defeat any technological measure which limits access to it.
    21. Re:Nearly all laws are by Sloppy · · Score: 1

      Reason #2 for supporting SOPA: All parties are corrupt.

      Thanks people, let's keep these intelligent pro-SOPA arguments coming. They are most compelling!

      --
      As copyright owner of this comment, I authorize everyone to defeat any technological measure which limits access to it.
    22. Re:Nearly all laws are by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You said: "Let's not for a moment pretend we have anyone other than ourselves to blame. Everyone says they hate SOPA, but talk about voting against the SOPA parties and suddenly you're a wacko and 90+% people start listing reasons they plan to support the people who enact it."

      Well if you only look at the surface this is true. We elect supposedly anyway for politicians to understand what is good/bad and legislation has become so complicated (just look at the deficit) document that I swear no one really understands it (if you want to take a less voluminous piece of legislation be my guess) it has become impossible to vote for or against almost 80 percent as it is so complicated and frankly there aren't enough hours in a year to read it all. Throw into this mess the partisanship that has brought Washington to its knees its a wonder anything gets done. I don't know if there is a single fault you could point your finger at (But I invite you to try). I don't know if there is a simple answer either.

    23. Re:Nearly all laws are by drb226 · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Stopping piracy is not evil.

      Maybe it is. I don't have the philosophical finesse right now to think of a way to support the statement "Stopping piracy is evil", but I imagine a somewhat convincing case could be made for it. In any event, "stopping piracy" should not be immediately and universally recognized as a Good Thing.

    24. Re:Nearly all laws are by drb226 · · Score: 1

      [they are] too busy rolling in cash and pretending to be important to notice

      FTFY

    25. Re:Nearly all laws are by drb226 · · Score: 2

      whoosh

    26. Re:Nearly all laws are by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Oh, you actually think politicians write or even understand the bills they support?

    27. Re:Nearly all laws are by Patch86 · · Score: 1

      They would have a bigger chance if people voted for them. Not voting for a party because they don't stand a chance is a hiding to nothing.

      Not saying I don't understand the mentality, mind. It's like the Prisoner's Dilemma; just because you know you're trapped into making the wrong decision, it doesn't mean you're able to pick the right one.

    28. Re:Nearly all laws are by thePowerOfGrayskull · · Score: 1

      You realize that "party" and "parties" can in fact refer to individuals and groups of individuals in a non-political fashion, correct?

    29. Re:Nearly all laws are by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Its very important to distinguish what looks like elected idiots from elected Trojans, with a purpose.
      SOPA is a part of that purpose. to block competition and to funnel the benefits of the net into the 1% and
      it even has a much greater purpose than that its real purpose is propaganda. The 1% must cut off the
      uncontrolled access to the net. The real purpose of SOPA is to place a drivers license department between
      one's access to the net and the public that can view what the unlicensed information provider posts or puts forth.
      SOPA amounts to war against freedom and the first amendment. It is much, much more than stupid legislation,
      it is a declaration of war against freedom itself.

    30. Re:Nearly all laws are by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yeah. Instead of doing the hard work of coming up with a good, reasonable, pragmatic approach, let's just do the usual slashdot thing...

      Get waaaay out there, on on the tiniest branch of reason, in a philosophical pissing contest. I mean, the most radical and impractical approach you can manage. That way we have a completely unusable argument that ends with, "See! We should encourage piracy!", that will win exactly zero converts outside of this forum and effectively keep us from contributing anything useful to the debate.

      Meanwhile, "the other guys" will continue to offer up evil, though seemingly practical shit like SOPA.

    31. Re:Nearly all laws are by JustinKSU · · Score: 1

      Stopping piracy is not evil.

      Maybe it is. I don't have the philosophical finesse right now to think of a way to support the statement "Stopping piracy is evil", but I imagine a somewhat convincing case could be made for it. In any event, "stopping piracy" should not be immediately and universally recognized as a Good Thing.

      I'm not philosopher, but one of the reasons our society works is that there is general agreement that we own the product of our labors. In many cases we transfer that ownership to our employers for exchange of a steady income. If piracy were widespread and accepted, there would be many talented folks who would not expend the effort to create software, music, movies, etc. because they would get nothing tangible in return.

      You could argue that we should all work for the good of society as a whole, but in the real world communism doesn't work. The important thing to do is find a balance between capitalism and individual rights. The creator should have the choice of whether they want to give it to everyone or charge 99 cents on then Android market. When it comes to stopping piracy I don't understand how anyone can be against creators having ownership and control over their creations.

    32. Re:Nearly all laws are by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Stopping piracy IS evil. Piracy exists right now, because the system is broken and peoples needs must be satisfied one way or another.

      Look at smuggling. There were a lot of stupid laws that made certain products impossibly to obtain or prohibitively expensive, so, if there's a market to fill, people are going to fill it. It no longer happens today (not on the same scale) simply because the laws changed, and the system started working again.

      If they really think finding and punishing people is more important than updating their economic system to the 21st century, then go for it, it's not like some idiots haven't tried something similar 90 years ago.

    33. Re:Nearly all laws are by drb226 · · Score: 1

      I'm not philosopher, but one of the reasons our society works is that there is general agreement that we own the product of our labors. In many cases we transfer that ownership to our employers for exchange of a steady income. (...) When it comes to stopping piracy I don't understand how anyone can be against creators having ownership and control over their creations.

      I have two problems with this. 1) Individual creators don't really stand to gain much by stopping piracy. It's mostly the entities to whom the creations are transferred to, meaning individuals are (typically) benefited indirectly at best. 2) our society, for the longest time, did *not* put a price tag on culture. Music, knowledge, the arts. The industry worked by means other than preventing sharing. Pay extra for an authentic original painting, or for a live performance of music, or a play. Pay composers beforehand to support their ability to create, instead of restricting other composers afterwards. Then when easy copying via the printing press came along, we invented "copyright" so that a few presses could monopolize on certain materials...and it went downhill from there. The original intent was to secure a limited, opt-in monopoly over copyrighted works for the author, but this has essentially ballooned into an unlimited, opt-out monopoly over copyrighted works for the MAFIAA. I can maybe support granting a limited-time monopoly over original work, but no man is an island; that "original work" belongs largely to the human race.

    34. Re:Nearly all laws are by JustinKSU · · Score: 1
      You make some really solid points.

      Individual creators don't really stand to gain much by stopping piracy. It's mostly the entities to whom the creations are transferred to, meaning individuals are (typically) benefited indirectly at best.

      1. This is a choice (albeit usually a steady income is chosen over trying to market and distribute material yourself.
      2. I wouldn't marginalize the indirect benefit. Actors still get paid well.

      our society, for the longest time, did *not* put a price tag on culture. Music, knowledge, the arts

      That may be true. But piracy is not just culture items. What about software? As a software engineer it would be nice to create an Android app and sell it and not have to worry about one person buying it and then everyone else getting it for free. I deserve (maybe) more than 99 cents for the effort I put into creating the game. I agree with patent reform (the current state of software patents makes me more scared to create that Android game than piracy) and reducing copy-write limitations (great video about the history of it). 28 years is plenty for me. If people still want to buy version 1.0 of my software after 28 years, then the masses can have it!

      ps. I appreciate your time in having this constructive debate.

    35. Re:Nearly all laws are by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Perhaps you all should take a look at this TED talk by Johanna Blakley Lessons from fashion's free culture http://www.ted.com/talks/lang/en/johanna_blakley_lessons_from_fashion_s_free_culture.html

      If nothing else it shows you how the world is not really dominated by IP and fear of Piracy. But the Music and Movie industries would like to convince you they are.

      They are relics from a 20th Century Business Plan and the really need to shape up for the 21st Century.

  3. and yet it will probably pass by s1d3track3D · · Score: 1

    yes, we all know it's bad, and yet it will probably pass

    1. Re:and yet it will probably pass by erroneus · · Score: 5, Insightful

      I don't know. We said the same thing about the AT&T buyout of T-Mobile. We all knew it was bad for competition. We all knew AT&T was lying to the government about it. And even when the truth leaked out, AT&T and various government people continued to push for it. It looked really bad. But there was LOTS of talk. It became very high profile. The added light and notice the issue got eventually killed the deal.

      People need to continue shouting from the rooftops about SOPA.

      One thing I have yet to see talked about is how laws like DMCA and the proposed SOPA continue to increasingly put police and government powers in the hands of non-government people... people who aren't otherwise accountable for their actions. It's a huge violation of government trust.

    2. Re:and yet it will probably pass by Ihmhi · · Score: 1

      Your defeatist attitude aside, we're in an age where the citzenry has never been more empowered - the Internet age.

      We can look up nearly any piece of information (for free!) in seconds. Incidentally, this also includes things like political donations and congressional voting records. If this passes, we are going to lose one of the most important checks we have on the government - knowledge of what they're doing.

      Backroom deals are quickly becoming a thing of the past in the age of the Internet and citizen journalism. We can't lose this fight - we have a real chance to turn the tide and get our country cleaned up.

    3. Re:and yet it will probably pass by Ihmhi · · Score: 1

      If it's at the point that the government is not listening to the will of the citizenry anymore, then it is time to remove the government - peacefully if possible, but forcibly if necessary.

    4. Re:and yet it will probably pass by Merk42 · · Score: 1

      Good luck with that

  4. PR opportunity by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Interesting

    I highly doubt Rackspace would have come out and said this if it wasn't for what GoDaddy is going through. If GoDaddy's public stance on supporting SOPA was supported by the IT/tech/informed community, I suspect Rackspace would be shouting, "hey, we support SOPA too!!!"

    Maybe I'm a bit bias since I have had few positive experiences with Rackspace over the years?

    1. Re:PR opportunity by sd4f · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I think it's just free publicity, like just look, they got on /.

    2. Re:PR opportunity by king+neckbeard · · Score: 2

      GoDaddy apparently had a material benefit in SOPA. It doesn't matter whether or not Rackspace is shitty, this cuts into their bottom line. Anyways, I'm glad they've publicly come out against it. We need all the help we can get in making sure that SOPA doesn't pass, and even if this is nothing more than lipservice PR, it's lipservice PR that makes SOPA appear less supported.

      --
      This is my signature. There are many like it, but this one is mine.
    3. Re:PR opportunity by the_B0fh · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Actually, if you're on Google Plus, you'll have seen that the CEO of RackSpace have been fighting SOPA for quite some time now.

    4. Re:PR opportunity by CanEHdian · · Score: 1

      GoDaddy apparently had a material benefit in SOPA.

      Shouldn't that be "has"?

      By the way, Dump GoDaddy Day (or "move you domain day") appears to be still on for tomorrow, Dec 29 2011. And... even Danica Patrick isn't able to stop it!

      --
      When the copyright term is "forever minus a day", live every day like it's the last.
    5. Re:PR opportunity by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Speaking as someone who works at RS, you have no idea what you're talking about.

      We employees have been running calling campaigns and such for months against SOPA, and there has been extensive discussion internally all the way up and down the org chart regarding what a terrible price this will exact on the Internet. I'm surprised it took Lanham this long to go public with what has been a long running sentiment here, expressed directly to our senators and representatives, rather than in press releases.

      Amusingly that very reluctance to make grandiose announcements has lead you to accuse Lanham of the same, but if you knew anything about him (look up some YouTube videos or something) you'll see he's one of the most earnest, no-BS people you'll ever meet. He's been campaigning against SOPA on a personal level for months.

    6. Re:PR opportunity by Patch86 · · Score: 2

      If companies want free publicity by being sensible and opposing draconian and disastrous laws, I'm all for it. Sounds like a good use of the /. front page to me.

    7. Re:PR opportunity by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      FWIW, Rackspace CEO Lanham Napier has been speaking out against this legislation for a few weeks now, and has had discussions with Rep. Smith, who's just a douchenozzle about it and won't budge. He's asked his employees to write in to the congressman, since Rackspace is in his district. It's not about publicity, it's really a bad piece of legislation for Rackspace, so he's been working hard to oppose it.

  5. Ugh by rwven · · Score: 5, Insightful

    The most hilariously annoying part of this bill is that there's not a single sane citizen of this country who, when properly educated on the bill's impact, would vote for such a thing....yet the lunatics running this country will probably pass it right on through since they're in the chokehold of the industries and power mongers which DO want it.

    If it's possible to lose any more faith in the people at the top, I certainly will if this is passed. I'll also cast opposing votes against any representatives who vote for it, regardless of party affiliation.

    1. Re:Ugh by vlm · · Score: 5, Interesting

      I'll also cast opposing votes against any representatives who vote for it, regardless of party affiliation.

      Since both of the big parties are owned by the same people, I assume that you will only vote 3rd party from now on?

      Voting D or R is throwing your vote away. The only valid way to vote is to vote for a 3rd party candidate. Or an "extremist" D or R... The only R I would currently consider voting for is Ron Paul and the only D I would consider voting for, if he runs for anything, is Feingold.

      --
      "Science flies us to the moon. Religion flies us into buildings." - Victor Stenger
    2. Re:Ugh by h4rr4r · · Score: 4, Interesting

      What is wrong with kucinich?

      I can't bring myself to vote for Ron Paul. I do not believe he can keep himself from forcing his religious views on others once he gains some power. While I know he did not write it, putting your name on racist newsletters does not speak to his good judgement either.

    3. Re:Ugh by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      The aristocracy is quite sane. They simply have different values than you do, as a result of their position of being a whole lot richer and more powerful than you ever will be.

    4. Re:Ugh by h4rr4r · · Score: 1

      I attempt not to. It is hard to avoid though. In this case his beliefs are way out and center. To me that means he is more likely to let them sway his decisions.

    5. Re:Ugh by vlm · · Score: 1

      What is wrong with kucinich?

      He's 99% sane and logical, but that last 1% is crazy anti-gun nut, weird anti-free speech last century pre-internet era fan of the fairness doctrine, and even worse he's an anti-nuke nut. I suppose he's probably more sane, more often, than I am, on average, so as much as some of his beliefs really stink, I would certainly vote for him as a distant 3rd choice after RP and Feingold, if RP and/or Feingold were not on the ballot.

      The sad part is if the other D's and R's were sane rational statesmen, he would not be worth considering, but, of course, they're not, which places him as one of the best choices, which is the sad part.

      I do really like his outlook on foreign military misadventure, and as a prez he's probably got a heck of a lot more impact as CinC on that, than he does in trying to eliminate the 1st amendment on /. when discussing politics, or trying to shut down all the nukes which would basically perma-blackout the country.

      I'll give you that both Kucinich and RP are nutty about things they would have little control over and could never implement from the executive office, but both are pretty reasonable about the stuff they actually could do.

      --
      "Science flies us to the moon. Religion flies us into buildings." - Victor Stenger
    6. Re:Ugh by king+neckbeard · · Score: 1

      Separating his personal views from his political philosophy is Ron Paul's thing, though.

      --
      This is my signature. There are many like it, but this one is mine.
    7. Re:Ugh by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Are you illiterate or something? The OP stated "I do not believe Ron Paul [not *anyone with a religious ideology*], can keep himself from forcing his religious views on others once he gains some power". That's the OP's opinion about Ron Paul and how he would handle newly attained power.

    8. Re:Ugh by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Ron Paul has disavowed those letters. Isn't the saying "Actions speak louder than words" mean anything? especially if you cannot prove that those where his words. And as much as he believes his faith, he always votes for the Constitution and freedom first. There are many things to judge a person's ability to uphold an office, personal matters of theirs (ex. religion) are not one of them, and things they did when first starting out to be a politician (ex, let a ghost writer or an untrustworthy person write letters under your name) is most certainly not one. You do not get angry at a child for earnestly learning to play the piano or scold them for their past ability to play.

      Also, atheist here.

    9. Re:Ugh by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Contrary to popular tripe, a President does not run our nation. So without a doubt, the most extreme notions of Ron Paul are only worth discussing if you're an idiot. This basically leaves controversial stuff such as deregulation. Which is ironic in that he claims we need more deregulation when in fact, industry is extremely deregulated already and we can draw a directly line between deregulation and rampant fraud which caused this world economic downturn. The flip side of that is, there is a lot of sanity that does come out of his mouth.

      Of the candidates known so far, Paul is the only option. Which is not to say its my preference.

      And if you EVER supported Cane, please kill yourself. You'd be doing the gene pool and this current generation of humanity a huge favor.

      Beyond that, the gp is absolutely right. Voting convention D or R is absolutely a vote for morons and is begging to maintain the status quo of literal theft, graft, murder, and money laundering which permeates Washington today.

    10. Re:Ugh by Ethanol-fueled · · Score: 5, Insightful
      The problem is that, for a variety of reasons, American presidential candidates are obligated to be Christian and are kinda stuck pandering to religious morons - The clout of the shadowy Family and attendance of their National Prayer Breakfast is a good example.

      Many of us believe in a god, or (like me) are outwardly atheist, but many of us who don't believe in a god claim a religion or denomination for reasons of family history(and, more specifically, the risk of being ostracized or written out of the lucrative will for angering the more traditional elders).

      Ethanol-fueled, where is this rant going?

      Religious people want censorship. The internet's free flow of information is anathema to their shackled minds and irrational fear of truth.

    11. Re:Ugh by h4rr4r · · Score: 1

      I flatly do not believe that. Perhaps he is capable of that, but I don't think so.

      I would vote for near anyone as the lessor of two evils. I voted for Obama to keep fascist grandpa and hillbilly barbie out of power. Had McCain run the 2008 campaign as he did the 2000 race I might have been convinced to select him as the lessor of two evils.

    12. Re:Ugh by OutSourcingIsTreason · · Score: 1

      In the year 2000, there were 10,000 Floridians who thought that Al Gore wasn't liberal enough, so they voted 3rd party for Ralph Nader instead. As Rick Perry would say, "Oops."

      --
      "Fascism should more properly be called corporatism because it is the merger of state and corporate power." -- Mussolini
    13. Re:Ugh by Nadaka · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Or you can go by his actual record. Where he has intentionally attempted to subvert the us constitution and remove the oversight of the supreme court over religious based state laws. If it had passed, states would have been free to violate individual civil liberties by endorsing specific state religions.

      Yes. Ron Paul is an anti-constitutionalist, anti-libertarian (he only cares that the federal government is neutered, he loves the idea of the individual states violating peoples rights), a hypocrite, a liar, a theocrat and anti-American traitor.

    14. Re:Ugh by h4rr4r · · Score: 1

      I did not claim otherwise. He allowed them to be printed with his name on them. Either he showed poor judgement in putting his name on such filth, or he never read it and showed even worse judgement.

      Personal matters are something to judge someone on., when the odds are they would impact their performance in the task at hand.

    15. Re:Ugh by vlm · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I don't think you get how this works.

      Two candidates are proposed, both owned by the same corporations planning to support identical policies.

      You apparently really hate the marketing message the R people used, but that doesn't mean they would have done anything different.

      Oh sure, they would have attended twice as many prayer breakfasts, and half as many MLK parades, but I'm not thinking the end result would be any different.

      Standard /. car analogy is its like getting all emotional about cars because the Saturn was a really nice car but the commercials suck so you bought a Toyota which is also a really nice car and thinking its important that the Toyota tv commercials don't suck as much.

      --
      "Science flies us to the moon. Religion flies us into buildings." - Victor Stenger
    16. Re:Ugh by jamstar7 · · Score: 3, Insightful
      Of course this bill will pass overwhelmingly. It's an attempt to centralise and monopolise a decentralised and antimonopolistic service. Those who bought and paid for this bill won't be satisfied until the only way to get any kind of content off the net is after you pull out your credit card. Forget about content creation, if you're not a big buck studio, you won't have a seat at the table anymore.

      And don't scream too loudly if any of your ideas are ripped off by Big Bizz to make a buck off of. The true citizens of the US (multinational corporations) have certainly gotten their money'sworth this time. Until an individual can amass the cash that a multinational can, their voice does not matter.

      --
      Understanding the scope of the problem is the first step on the path to true panic.
    17. Re:Ugh by king+neckbeard · · Score: 1

      His record seems to confirm it. He's been very open about ending the war on drugs, and allowing pretty much anything at the federal level.

      --
      This is my signature. There are many like it, but this one is mine.
    18. Re:Ugh by h4rr4r · · Score: 1

      I honestly cannot take any of the Republican candidates seriously. Cain might be one of the worst in your eyes, but Perry executed an innocent man, Gingrich is clearly pandering to the worst rightwing fascist fringes, and the rest make their entire debate arguments out of lies and faslehoods.

    19. Re:Ugh by h4rr4r · · Score: 1

      I don't think it goes quite that far. They are both bought and sold to the 1%/corporatists/whatever but outside what those folks want they are a little different.

    20. Re:Ugh by h4rr4r · · Score: 0

      I find that very interesting. Do you know what bill this was? I would like to read more about it.

    21. Re:Ugh by CanHasDIY · · Score: 4, Interesting

      I can't bring myself to vote for Ron Paul. I do not believe he can keep himself from forcing his religious views on others once he gains some power.

      1) Wouldn't being a congressman for 30+ years qualify as "some power?" That said, you would think if he was going to abuse it he would have done so by now.

      2) Paul is the only candidate who rabidly (or seemingly at all, for that matter) adheres to the concept that the U.S. Constitution is the supreme law of the land; in that, the Constitution guarantees religious freedom. Paul also abhors the concept of "executive privilege," i.e. the practice of letting the President do whatever he wants and civil liberties be damned, so it therefore stands to reason that Ron Paul would honor the Constitution and thus not impose his ideals of religion on the masses.

      3) There are more people involved in the American legislative process than just the President; contrary to modern belief, there exists a system of checks and balances that, when honored and followed, prevent unconstitutional legislation from becoming law. I know it's pretty passe these days to talk about responsible governance in accordance with the Constitution, but that is exactly the ideology Paul embraces.

      As for the accusations regarding RP and the "racist newsletter," I say meh; I didn't get sucked into the whole "Jeremiah Wright hates America So That Means Obama Does Too" non-story, and I intend on patently ignoring this one as well.

      Cheers!

      --
      An enigma, wrapped in a riddle, shrouded in bacon and cheese
    22. Re:Ugh by Ethanol-fueled · · Score: 2

      Yes. Ron Paul is an anti-constitutionalist, anti-libertarian..., a hypocrite, a liar, a theocrat and anti-American traitor.

      ...and still the best of the bunch. I will probably vote for him knowing that he won't win - but this time I will vote to send the message that I'm sick of the establishment's shit. I lost every bit of Hope and Change in mainstream candidates after Obama's reign.

      We aren't going to be productive by votes, the system is too powerful and manipulative to allow that. We're gonna be productive by Sacking the traitors from within.

    23. Re:Ugh by h4rr4r · · Score: 1

      1) More power more corruption. He also seems happy to let states ban abortion for instance. I believe that interferes with personal freedom.

      2) I don't believe that. I might be wrong.

      3) It seems these days checks and balances are a thing of the past. For recent examples see the bailouts and middle east adventures.

      Obama did not let Mr.Wright print his name on those rantings. Being seen with crazy people is quite different than putting your name on their musings. Either he agreed with this filth or he never read it. Neither speaks well of him.

    24. Re:Ugh by jamstar7 · · Score: 1

      What is wrong with kucinich?

      Other than he's a total loon?

      He did some crazy shit as mayor of Cleveland back in the day.

      --
      Understanding the scope of the problem is the first step on the path to true panic.
    25. Re:Ugh by h4rr4r · · Score: 1

      And Ron Paul is not?
      He thinks gold, which is a commodity, is the same thing as money.

      Please do elaborate about this "crazy shit" that kucinich did as mayor of Cleveland. Should at least be good for a laugh.

    26. Re:Ugh by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Exactly, its call federalism and is what this country was founded on. Have few laws at the federal level and let the states manage themselves. If you don't like the way your state is going, likely there will be another you can move to which has a more favorable climate to you. As it stands, we've let the nanny state form and every "crisis" requires a federal law, which is bullcrap.

    27. Re:Ugh by Nadaka · · Score: 5, Informative

      One of them is the "We the People Act": http://www.independentamericanparty.org/2011/09/1949/ That is strait from the horses mouth.

      See section 3. It boils down to forbidding the US supreme court from hearing cases on the constitutionality of state laws based on religion, abortion or sexual orientation discrimination. If it were in effect, each state could ban abortion in violation of roe vs wade or make homosexuality a felony. States could ban atheists, muslims, jews, mormons, catholics or even protestants from serving in public office without federal challenge among many many other backwards theocratic and anti-constitutional edicts.

      I believe he has at least one other proposed law with similar effects.

    28. Re:Ugh by h4rr4r · · Score: 1

      That does seem to be pretty terrible.

      I wonder why that is not brought up by the media.

    29. Re:Ugh by mrchaotica · · Score: 1

      ...and still the best of the bunch.

      What, in your opinion, makes Ron Paul better than Jon Huntsman?

      --

      "[Regarding the 'cloud,'] ownership was what made America different than Russia." -- Woz

    30. Re:Ugh by ChodaBoyUSA · · Score: 1

      Not taking either side of the debate, but you know that is how it used to be, right? The states could have a state religion and, unfortunately, discriminate against whomever they wished. Some argue that by allowing the Federal laws to overrule the state's laws, the states have lost much of their independence. We are the United States, as in many independent states that have united together. Like so many other topics, this one is not so "cut and dry" as it may seem. IMHO, Paul and Kucinich are lunatics, so no vote (or soup) for them.

    31. Re:Ugh by Nadaka · · Score: 2

      Probably because until now he never had a shot at being the republican nominee. Ron Paul has a few good traits that have really stood out quite well in recent debates (mostly due to the majority of his competition being clinically retarded). But the really scary horrific shit, like his views on states rights, theocracy and foreign policy take some digging to find. Now I also believe his more well known economic policy is also scary horrific shit that will ruin the country, but that seems to be in vogue right now with most republicans.

    32. Re:Ugh by Nadaka · · Score: 2

      The states are "less independent" because states don't have the right to take away the liberties enshrined in the bill of rights from US citizens? Cry me a fucking river. It absolutely is cut and dry. Independence of the individual is the noble ideal of libertarianism, not independence of the state. And a federal government that protects the rights of its citizens from the trespasses of states is more libertarian than one that can do nothing as its people are enslaved one territory at a time.

    33. Re:Ugh by thunderclap · · Score: 1

      You do realize that if you actually read the federalist papers. he fits in with them. He is simply a founding father 200 yrs later. What amuses me is people are scared of Pat Robertson decrees while ignore the fact that the Muslim mullahs in Dearborn, MI are far worse and are as devout in their religion as he is. If I actually thought he had a hope pf winning I would vote for him, just to see the insanity. It would be no worse than now.

    34. Re:Ugh by element-o.p. · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Yes. Ron Paul is an anti-constitutionalist, anti-libertarian (he only cares that the federal government is neutered, he loves the idea of the individual states violating peoples rights), a hypocrite, a liar, a theocrat and anti-American traitor.

      Really? You think that because he maintains the position that the powers of government not enumerated in the Constitution are reserved for the states, Ron Paul is anti-Constitutionalist, a hypocrite, a liar and a traitor? Even though I can see how you might think that refusing to support a bill that might, in fact, be Libertarian and even good for the country on the basis that it requires the federal government to usurp a power that it does not legally have as being entirely a Bad Thing, I find it consistent with his philosophy of government, and even a Good Thing. There is a mechanism in place to grant power to the federal government that the Constitution does not already grant: it's called a Constitutional amendment. If the law really is that good, pass an amendment. If the amendment doesn't pass, then there's a pretty good chance that the value of the bill has not been adequately established. If the failure to pass such a bill means that individual states pass bad laws, well, at least it's easier to change a local government than a federal one. Furthermore, if a state law truly sucks that bad, it's far easier to move to another state than to another country. Depending upon where you live and where you move to, you might not even have to quit your job to move (even though I would...it's a heck of a commute to Alaska from anywhere else).

      --
      MCSE? No, sir...I don't do Windows. Yes, I am an idealist. What's your point?
    35. Re:Ugh by Nadaka · · Score: 1

      The amendments have already been passed. The 14th for example, and it included the due process clause that under incorporation protects the rights of people from being infringed from the states. And Ron Paul does not agree with it.

      Section 1. All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws

    36. Re:Ugh by element-o.p. · · Score: 5, Interesting

      Religious people want censorship. The internet's free flow of information is anathema to their shackled minds and irrational fear of truth.

      Stereotype much? Yes, there are "religious" people who do -- and have done -- some pretty crappy things throughout history. There are "religious nutcases" who are certainly the "shackled minds" that you mention above. There are also those who claim religious affiliation (for more than purposes of securing a position in a will) who don't fit that mold -- those who are vocal Libertarians, who love science and technology and who abhor censorship. I am one. So are a number of my friends. Kindly refrain from confusing us with those who truly are as bad as you claim, 'kay? Thanks.

      --
      MCSE? No, sir...I don't do Windows. Yes, I am an idealist. What's your point?
    37. Re:Ugh by ChodaBoyUSA · · Score: 1

      Unfortunately, not everyone agrees whether the U.S. Constitution protects things like homosexuality from discrimination. Although Congress shall not establish a religion, the states are/were free to do as they liked. Again, there is that slippery slope. If you allow the Government to interfere to control certain things, you are opening the door for the Government to control EVERYTHING. I sure don't have the solution.

    38. Re:Ugh by cheekyjohnson · · Score: 1

      there's not a single sane citizen of this country who, when properly educated on the bill's impact, would vote for such a thing

      I've seen people that claim that because they think that piracy is bad, and this bill's stated intention is to stop piracy, that the bill is good. And then when told that this bill is likely not going to stop piracy and is not the 'right' way to go about solving the supposed problem, they say, "Then what should we do? We have to do something to combat these little thieves!"

      Of course, I'm sure you don't think these people are "educated"...

      --
      Filthy, filthy copyrapists!
    39. Re:Ugh by nedlohs · · Score: 1

      So money isn't a commodity?

      There seems to be demand. There seems to be no qualitative differentiation - the $20 bill in my pocket printed in 2010 is perfectly fungible with the $20 bill printed in 2011 in your pocket, or with two $10 bills.

      There are futures exchanges and currency exchanges.

      So what is it aboue money that isn't the same as a commodity? And hence would make it ludicrous to think that a commodity could used as money?

    40. Re:Ugh by Mashiki · · Score: 1

      Religious people want censorship? What kind of fucking crack are you smoking? And how did your bigoted filled post get to +5 insightful. If you said special interest groups want censorship I'd cut you some slack, and say carry on. But by and large, in the west, even the US, the majority of religious people don't want any more censorship than anyone else. If what you said was true, you'd hear the masses of Christians screaming over the desecration of various holy idols and the like. You don't.

      Because if you did, you'd see what Christians doing what Muslims do. Rioting, burning down the buildings of other denominations, and cutting off the heads of unbelievers. Free flow of information is anathema...right. Ignorance of the real world can not be substituted by wikipedia.

      And before some nutbar atheist(I really don't mind atheists, it's the nutbars that bug me) gets it in their head that I'm Christian, I'll head you off at the pass. I'm a Reformist-Jew.

      --
      Om, nomnomnom...
    41. Re:Ugh by Ethanol-fueled · · Score: 1

      People like you are a minority, an edge case. And your brains are mushed enough to the point that you're too afraid of the big papa establishment to really be useful. You're just now coming out of the closet, but are too afraid to admit that your parents lied to you about the invisible sky-daddy.

      You're every bit a religious minority as I am - only I'm afraid to break the rules to get my point across. You're busy listening to Mat Kearney and Kings of Leon and all the other feel-good crypto-Christian payola garbage to really influence change. Either that or you smoked more than your share of dope and are embracing Baha'i or Zoroastrianism, in which cases your minds are doomed to black holes of sitars and patchouli oil.

    42. Re:Ugh by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      And the result is that a federal statute would conflict with the constitution... which would, if challenged, be .. haha .. heard by the supreme court. If no one challenged it, I would hazard a guess it would be because no state abused any person's rights (wouldn't that be nice ..). And no statute can remove the supreme court's ability to hear cases.

      I mean, the legislature could pass a bill that declares that the sky must be silver and no other color ever. But since the legislature doesn't have that power, the bill that it passes is meaningless.

    43. Re:Ugh by jamstar7 · · Score: 1

      He made sure Clevelanders had a municipal-owned electric company. Nice idea in theory, but in practice, the entire infrastructure got closed down, and Muni Light has zero power plants. Muni Light now gets 100% of its power from Cleveland Electric Illuminating Company, which supplies a large portion of the North Coast.

      In theory, like I say, a good idea. But what happens when the grid has problems? The lack of inhouse generating capacity helps improve air quality in Cleveland at the expense of being hostage to CEI.

      He also knuckled under to George Forbes after fighting getting Cleveland wired for cable for a decade, until City Council, lead by George Forbes, passed an ordinance declaring the low income neighborhoods would be wired for cable first.

      --
      Understanding the scope of the problem is the first step on the path to true panic.
    44. Re:Ugh by king+neckbeard · · Score: 2

      The notion of more or less regulation is a fallacy. The ideal we should be striving for is smart and effective regulation. The shallow mindset you are advocating is how we end with such an awful mess. We end up having strong regulations when it comes to keeping competition out and weak regulation when it comes to controlling the non-competitive markets the aforementioned regulation creates.

      --
      This is my signature. There are many like it, but this one is mine.
    45. Re:Ugh by wizkid · · Score: 2

      He thinks gold, which is a commodity, is the same thing as money.

      For most of the time the USA has been in existence, our money was based on the gold standard. This means that we had a gold reserve to back up our money. Gold is sold as a commodity, yes. So what! This has nothing to do with the fact that when we dumped the gold standard, and went to the Federal Reserve to maintain the value of our dollar, we set our selves up to be in the situation we are now with politicians managing the money supply . We no longer have anything worth a shit to back up the dollar, and now the dollar isn't worth a shit. I agree with Ron Paul. When we dumped the gold reserve and went to the F.R. system, we set our system to fail soon as we got the wrong person handling the F.R. And now the value of the dollar is .... Well, go out and try to buy some stuff. The best thing we could do is to phase out the F.R. and go back to the gold standard.

      --
      I take no responsibility for what I say. Even though I'm never wrong :)
    46. Re:Ugh by wizkid · · Score: 1

      Not all religious people want censorship.

      Just the stupid ones.

      --
      I take no responsibility for what I say. Even though I'm never wrong :)
    47. Re:Ugh by crdotson · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Ah, but you're offensive, arrogant, and statistically speaking probably not as smart as me! And yet I believe in God, so why don't you just let me as long as I'm doing you no harm? Instead of trying to "convert" me, by being an asshole -- has that ever worked for you, by the way?

      Save your anger for the religious nutcases who are actually causing harm. If I choose to "delude myself" because it makes my life more enjoyable, it's really not your problem. I'll make you a deal -- I won't tell you who you can marry or what drugs you can take if you don't tell me what to believe, or not believe. OK?

    48. Re:Ugh by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      All religious people are morons. I'm not even trolling, it's just that you can't not be a moron while believing in deities for which there is no proof at all. Faith, they call it.

    49. Re:Ugh by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Regarding 1...

      That would be the correct Constitutional answer to the quandary of abortion. Speaking of "penumbra" of implied rights is not very good for a statutory legal system.

    50. Re:Ugh by nanamin · · Score: 1

      I'd mod you up if I had mod points right now. I'm a Thelemite, which is a religion that doesn't require belief in a god or the supernatural, and many of us are atheists. As it stands, I can't go anywhere without some Dawkins or Hitchens type atheist telling me that I'm "delusional" for being religious. Every time a news article mentions religion, a bunch of atheists have to chime in about how destructive "religion" is. At this point, at least where I'm standing, it's worse than Christians who try to force their views on people. Honestly, if it weren't for religion, any philosophy or political ideology (even democracy, capitalism, etc) would be used to justify the same fucked up things that a tiny minority of people use religion to justify.

    51. Re:Ugh by the+grace+of+R'hllor · · Score: 1

      Yes, it would attempt to undo some of the damage you sustained when you lost your own civil war. (Slavery banned, yay, but at the cost of sovereignty of the States.)

      If a county does something you dislike, you can easily move to a different county. If a state does something you cannot agree with, you can move to another state with moderate ease. Leaving your country of residence, however, is a lot of harder. Instead of moving away, you could try to change the politics, which becomes harder the bigger government is. Name the last president who wasn't a millionaire (or equivalent, for his time).

      Think of this in the opposite. States could easily legalize marijuana and other drugs, they could allow gay marriage, and federal government wouldn't be able to stomp down on it.

    52. Re:Ugh by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Kindly refrain from confusing us with those who truly are as bad as you claim, 'kay? Thanks.

      How about... no?

      How about people keep on confusing you with those other people, until you do something about those people?

      Many religions speak of doing what's right and encourage its members to do so. Well, if those other people are doing something wrong in your religion's name, shouldn't you practice what you preach and fix that wrong?

      Don't play victim when it's your (religion's) own shortcoming that created the mess.

    53. Re:Ugh by FictionPimp · · Score: 1

      If a government is not allowed to control anything, why do you need a government at all?

    54. Re:Ugh by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Romney believes he has magic underwear yet we are suppose to believe he is sane...

    55. Re:Ugh by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Firstly, just to keep from getting ignored, I'm not a Ron Paul fan.

      However, you kind of answered your own question in #1. "He also seems happy to LET states ban abortion" [emphasis mine]. Exactly, he lets them. He believes the constitution and states rights overrule his personal believes. A perfect example is that he strongly against the death penalty. He thinks it is morally wrong. However, he believes each state has the right to decide for themselves.

      I don't know about you, but I prefer politicians that I agree less with, but truly represent the people, over politicians that I agree more with who represent themselves.

    56. Re:Ugh by Nadaka · · Score: 1

      No. It won't. The specific bill does not strip the administrative branch of any power and it does not prohibit the US supreme court from hearing cases on federal laws, or on state laws that are not being challenged on religious, reproductive or gender grounds. The "We the People Act" is specifically tooled as an instrument of oppression. The vast majority of states rights supporters want to use their power to strip people of their rights, not restore them. And Ron Paul is one of them.

      I grew up in a military family, I am not a Montanan, a New Yorker, a Mississippian, a Floridian, or any one of the other states that I have lived in. Letting states violate individual rights at will will do nothing but make America worse, one state at a time. I am an American patriot and I want to make things right for my entire country.

    57. Re:Ugh by James_Duncan8181 · · Score: 1

      I'll make you a deal -- I won't tell you who you can marry or what drugs you can take if you don't tell me what to believe, or not believe. OK?

      I'm not religious, but I love you for this comment. Let everyone stick to their own business, and a wall between personal affairs and the business of state.

      --
      "To any truly impartial person, it would be obvious that I am right."
    58. Re:Ugh by The+Evil+Atheist · · Score: 1

      How does a gold standard, with a limited supply, keep up with an evolving economy where not everything with value has a physical form?

      --
      Those who do not learn from commit history are doomed to regress it.
    59. Re:Ugh by element-o.p. · · Score: 1

      In other words, you are every bit as narrow-minded and bigoted as the people you despise. That's fine with me...if you have to look down on others who don't see things the same way you do in order to feel good about yourself, that's not my problem. But don't mistake your own prejudice for wisdom or enlightenment because it most certainly is neither of those things.

      --
      MCSE? No, sir...I don't do Windows. Yes, I am an idealist. What's your point?
    60. Re:Ugh by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Too bad the 14th amendment wasn't passed legally.
      To overcome the decision in Dred Scott, the so called 14th amendment was allegedly ratified at gunpoint and became a part of the constitution in 1868. An examination of the ratification by the several States shows various improper proceedings occurred which in effect nullifies the Amendment. "I doubt that there is a judge in full possession of all his faculties, would ever rule that the 14th Amendment was properly approved and adopted" State vs Phillips, 540 P 2d 936.

    61. Re:Ugh by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Wow, just wow. I have seen a lot of simple-minded stereotypes in my days on this earth, but this one takes the cake. Are you an "outwardly" atheist person (and by outwardly, I'm guessing you mean "loud-mouthed, petulant, annoying and rude to those who disagree with you") because you actually believe that atheism is the correct view of the world, or do you just hate religion? After reading your incredibly naive, inflammatory and condescending comments, I would bet money that it is most definitely the latter.

      And the fact that your comments are still getting a score of 4 says a lot about the Slashdot community and all of its "I'm better than you because I'm an enlightened atheist hypocrite" members as well. Shame on you, Slashdot.

    62. Re:Ugh by Nadaka · · Score: 1

      Of course I realize that. It does not matter. The founding fathers had no precedence or experience and did not fully comprehend the ramifications and intricacies of the government they were creating. We have more than 200 years of experience now that can be used to correct their shortcomings and mistakes and build a more free and more perfect nation.

      If you would vote for the American Christian Fundamentalist Taliban equivalent just to see the insanity, you are an enemy of America and its great ideals (something that the founding fathers didn't screw up that badly) just as surely as you would be if you voted for the Islamic Taliban. It would absolutely be worse than it is now.

    63. Re:Ugh by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Are you kidding? While he is a Christian he believes in the Constitution and hence the first amendment.

      "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances."

    64. Re:Ugh by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Ron Paul wants to get rid of the Post Office, legalize weed and heroin, and make all businesses self-regulatory.

      We know for a fact businesses can't self regulate; we had two terms of Bush in which rampant deregulation went in to effect and everything is a mess.

      We know for a fact drugs are a huge problem in America and giving the stoner pothead trash exactly what they want will not solve our problems. Look at the widespread abuse of OTC drugs by children who are seeking the high that potheads celebrate and advocate.

      And shit, we need the postal system. This Christmas has shown how fucked FedEx and UPS are with smashing packages and lying about it to avoid insurance claims.

      Ron Paul is no flip-flopper and he believes in his ideals. I admire that. He's also living in a fantasy America that never existed and his solutions have no application in reality. Nevermind that he'll never win; if he did win it would be a disaster.

    65. Re:Ugh by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It's not so much that religious people want censorship, although I'm inclined to believe from personal experience that they tend to be more amenable to it than the non-religious, and somewhat more so for US Christians.

      The real problem as I see it is that there is an incredibly vocal, toxic minority within US Christianity, and the majority of reasonable Christians essentially look the other way as the smaller group goes about its harmful activities. I have my own ideas about what might cause such apparent apathy (or perhaps even passive support), but those are based on anecdote and woefully subjective perceptions, so it's not much use to elaborate here.

      I haven't drawn similar conclusions regarding Jews, Muslims, or others, mostly because I just don't know enough to feel comfortable drawing conclusions - even I have some minimum bar for drawing conclusions from a jumble of anecdotes. I used to have a lot of Jewish friends as a kid, but I live in the midwest now where they are much less common.

      For the record, I'm an atheist, but of course I have plenty of Christian friends (hey, I'm in the midwest). Some of them are just as concerned as I am about the small portion of US Christians giving the rest of them a bad name, and arguably doing real harm in politics and policy. However, they don't actually speak up about it, collectively or as individuals; people like Charles Danforth are rare. I've never broached a discussion of their rationale for keeping quiet - even for close friends such subjects can be difficult. I have no doubt that they vote with such issues in mind, but often the worst political zealots are in another state or district, and sometimes the available choices leave much to be desired. I can speak up as an atheist all I want, but here in the midwest it just brings unwanted attention and some real risks. Further, the more extreme Christians would not heed anything I have to say anyway, nor would they likely listen to a Reformist-Jew (no snark intended). We need ordinary Christians to openly and consistently counsel those within their ranks, but that's just not happening nearly enough.

      - T

    66. Re:Ugh by element-o.p. · · Score: 1

      Don't be asinine.

      If you want to paint everyone who claims any kind of faith with the same brush, then you are every bit as delusional and ignorant as any racist, as any xenophobe, or as any other bigot who every existed. Are you a white guy? Congratulations, you are guilty of every evil that white people have ever perpetrated against any other minority "until you [personally] do something about those [other white] people". Oh...my mistake, you are of Middle Eastern heritage...can you say 9/11? Are you male? Then you are guilty of every rape, every abuse, every violent or discriminatory act that males have ever perpetrated against women until you do something about men abusing women. American? Guantanamo Bay, Bay of Pigs, Manifest Destiny...I could go on and on and on, but hopefully, you get the picture. See how that works? Prejudice, no matter how you try to justify it or sugar coat it, is IGNORANCE. Pre-judging any member of any group based on the actions of some other member of that group is stupid. Every person deserves to be judged on the basis of their own actions.

      --
      MCSE? No, sir...I don't do Windows. Yes, I am an idealist. What's your point?
    67. Re:Ugh by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Don't be asinine.

      Except I'm not. Don't call people asinine when they aren't being asinine.

      If you want to paint everyone who claims any kind of faith with the same brush,

      Except that's not what I want.

      What I want is for you take up the responsibility of maintaining/improving your religion's image. It's your religion after all, not mine or anybody else.

      What I want is for you not to show, not tell. Show people that you're different from the radicals, don't just tell them you are, and leave the radicals to continue doing their radical things.

      Prejudice, no matter how you try to justify it or sugar coat it, is IGNORANCE.

      I'm not justifying prejudiced. I'm not justifying anything. I'm just saying YOU shouldn't shrug off the responsibility of improving your own religion's reputation on to other people

      Don't just tell people to stop prejudice. Go actually do something to show how different you are from the radical people, and improve your own religion's rep. When that happens, other people will have no reason to be prejudiced.

      Asking other people to stop prejudice isn't gonna stop those other people from committing wrong things in your religion's name.

      Pre-judging any member of any group based on the actions of some other member of that group is stupid. Every person deserves to be judged on the basis of their own actions

      Exactly, and that's what I did: you made a post. I made a judgment on that post.

      My judgment is that you're shrugging off your responsibility as a member of your religion by being passive about those who use your religion's name wrongly.

      Again: most religions encourage you to do the right thing. So why aren't you doing the right thing and go do something about all those people who do wrong things in the name of your (not mine, not anybody else) own religion?

    68. Re:Ugh by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Read his second sentence again, then ask yourself who the retard is. (It's you.)

    69. Re:Ugh by Maritz · · Score: 1

      We know for a fact drugs are a huge problem in America and giving the stoner pothead trash exactly what they want will not solve our problems. Look at the widespread abuse of OTC drugs by children who are seeking the high that potheads celebrate and advocate.

      Unless you're an advocate of banning/criminalising alcohol, you're a hopelessly ignorant hypocrite. So of course I assume you are (in favour of banning alcohol) - a drug with many time the societal cost of cannabis. Incidentally, how's that policy of prohibition going? Winning the "war" at all are we?

      --
      I do not want your cheap brainburning drugs. They are useless for work. And I am a working man today.
    70. Re:Ugh by Coren22 · · Score: 1

      I am giving up 15 points of moderation in this conversation to reply to this, and will probably be marked flaimbait for it, but it is worth it.

      Abortion is not a personal freedom any more than murder, it is debatable that a fetus feels pain, or is intelligent; but you cannot debate if it is life, for if it was not alive, you wouldn't need an abortion.

      --
      APK likes to ask for responses to the same things over and over. Maybe he just likes the responses?
  6. Doesn't matter, the fix is in by elrous0 · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Obama and most of the Democratic Party are owned by the big Hollywood studios. The Republican Party is owned by big business in general. The only reason this hasn't passed already (without even a public debate) is that Google and a handful of other big players are fighting it. But even Google is a relatively small fish in this money game.

    As for those of us without deep pockets--well save yourself that stamp on a letter to your Congressman.

    --
    SJW: Someone who has run out of real oppression, and has to fake it.
    1. Re:Doesn't matter, the fix is in by vlm · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Democratic Party are owned by the big Hollywood studios. The Republican Party is owned by big business

      Those are two sides of the same coin.

      --
      "Science flies us to the moon. Religion flies us into buildings." - Victor Stenger
    2. Re:Doesn't matter, the fix is in by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Easy fix. Just do what we do in Canada. Make it illegal. Although golfing is still legal.

    3. Re:Doesn't matter, the fix is in by andydread · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Its unfortunate truth you speak unfortunately. Joe Biden is the biggest whore for Hollywood MPAA and RIAA in washington along with Orin Hatch and Berman from California. Just go look up his record when he was in the senate. one shudders....

    4. Re:Doesn't matter, the fix is in by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Google could kill this dead if they wanted to play dirty. Imagine all Google-owned services (Search and Youtube in particular) being replaced for a day by an explanation of SOPA urging people to call their respective congresscritters and tell them to send this thing where the sun don't shine. If the politicians are convinced voting for this thing is absolute political suicide they won't care how much campaign donations the MPAA gives them.

    5. Re:Doesn't matter, the fix is in by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Interesting

      But even Google is a relatively small fish in this money game.

      Actually, Larry and Sergei could buy all of the movie and music studios with their personal money. I'm not even saying Google could buy them (which obviously, it could), but I'm saying Larry and Sergei could.

      The entertainment industry is actually not that big, in terms of economic impact. They just have a huge soap box by virtue of what they do, so it appears they are bigger than they are.

    6. Re:Doesn't matter, the fix is in by TheGratefulNet · · Score: 4, Insightful

      yes - BUT - the R party is also owned by Big Religion.

      that is their permanent (until they decide to change this) handicap.

      there may be some small good points that the R's have but the fact that they sold their souls to the american taliban (christian right extremists) means I could never vote for any of them, on that principle, alone. the party is too tainted by that one controlling force.

      remove that force (it was not always embedded in the R point of view) and then we might have a valid 2 party system. but right now, we have a religious party, a whichever-way-the-wind-blows party and that's pretty much it. neither is worth voting for. both are owned by big business; just different ones.

      --

      --
      "It is now safe to switch off your computer."
    7. Re:Doesn't matter, the fix is in by king+neckbeard · · Score: 3, Insightful

      But Google is actually bigger than Hollywood. They just don't spend as much on lobbying because their business model is based largely on being left alone, while Hollywood's business model currently depends on having the government tell others what they can't do.

      --
      This is my signature. There are many like it, but this one is mine.
    8. Re:Doesn't matter, the fix is in by Evtim · · Score: 3, Informative

      If only that was true!

      Marxism is a textbook example of hijacking a big name by politicians. Marxism has never been implemented by any "communist" country. Only one village in China has ran on Marx's most important principle - "the means of production belong to the people producing the wealth" (i.e. the people working in a fab are the owners of the fab, they are the shareholders) and it was a resounding success (google "China richest village").

      Again - none of this self proclaimed hypocritical communist states ever implemented the most basic principle of Marxism. Marx was "communist" in exactly the same way Wagner and Nietzsche were "nazis" if you get the analogy.

      Supposedly educated people in the west have no clue of what Marxism is. People don't even know the basics that are described in the Wiki article. They are forever brainwashed to reject without a second thought anything that is "communist" even though Marx claimed that his socially responsible society will emerge first in a well developed western nation...

      And BTW, wasn't there an article on /. from leading economy researchers from the west saying "Marx was not wrong after all"?

    9. Re:Doesn't matter, the fix is in by drb226 · · Score: 1

      1. hate on religion
      2. hate on Rs
      3. acknowledge Ds also suck
      4. hate on governmental situation in general
      5. modded insightful

      I'm not disagreeing with what you said, but I am utterly confused at how it is considered "insightful".

    10. Re:Doesn't matter, the fix is in by drb226 · · Score: 1

      Actually, Larry and Sergei could buy all of the movie and music studios with their personal money.

      It would make me so happy if they did this.

    11. Re:Doesn't matter, the fix is in by bfandreas · · Score: 1

      How is demonstrably voting the way of your campaign money not corruption? How come charges aren't being pressed? In their position I don't even think this is merely corruption but treason.

      --
      20 minutes into the future
    12. Re:Doesn't matter, the fix is in by elrous0 · · Score: 1

      Because it's only "bribery" if you give it to them in $50,000 in a suitcase full of cash. Give that same $50,000 to them as a "campaign donation", or in paid ads that you've bought for them, and it's all perfectly legal. Such is the American political system.

      --
      SJW: Someone who has run out of real oppression, and has to fake it.
    13. Re:Doesn't matter, the fix is in by elrous0 · · Score: 1

      Actually, Larry and Sergei could buy all of the movie and music studios with their personal money.

      Uh, yeah...you're on crack. Comcast alone is worth about $120 billion. Of course, they could opt for the cheaper NBCUniversal at about $30 billion. And that's just the biggest two of the six major players in the media biz.

      --
      SJW: Someone who has run out of real oppression, and has to fake it.
    14. Re:Doesn't matter, the fix is in by elrous0 · · Score: 2

      But Google is actually bigger than Hollywood.

      No, they're not. Google is only worth about half as much as Comcast alone. Combine all the big media players and you're looking at something like $300 billion in muscle. If you include GE in that figure (who still own about half of NBCUniversal) and you're talking closer to half a trillion $.

      --
      SJW: Someone who has run out of real oppression, and has to fake it.
    15. Re:Doesn't matter, the fix is in by bfandreas · · Score: 1

      Hmmm. So if it looks like corruption, swims like corruption and quacks like corruption then it propably is a duck? Legislators are slippery as fish and every accusation that sticks to them needs to be hammered there with a nail.
      If it were only the US political system we could watch from afar with a bucket of popcorn. Although it has become much more ridiculous. The sheer amount of circus surrounding elections has reached monstrous proportions. Voted into office for 4 years, campaigning for 2 of them. Even the vote for the vote of who you don't get to directly vote for is a depressing affair. Has been for the last 16 years or so.
      Unfortunately emmigration is out of question because it's no better anywhere else.

      --
      20 minutes into the future
    16. Re:Doesn't matter, the fix is in by elrous0 · · Score: 1

      Voted into office for 4 years, campaigning for 2 of them.

      Heard a quote not long ago from a retired Senator that was something along the lines of "Being in Congress these days means you spend 20% of your time legislating, and 80% of your time fundraising."

      --
      SJW: Someone who has run out of real oppression, and has to fake it.
    17. Re:Doesn't matter, the fix is in by king+neckbeard · · Score: 1

      They are bigger than the studios themselves, which is generally what Hollywood refers to. The involvement of other players does make things a bit more difficult to separate, though.

      --
      This is my signature. There are many like it, but this one is mine.
  7. Corporate support is crumbling by cultiv8 · · Score: 5, Interesting
    Interesting paragraph in this article from politico:

    “The dynamic is clear. Once SOPA — and its Senate counterpart, Protecting IP Act, or PIPA — became high-profile among the Internet community, the lazy endorsements from companies and various hangers-on became toxic. And now, those supporters are scrambling, hollowing out the actual support for the bill. Suddenly, a bill with ‘widespread’ corporate support doesn’t have much support at all,” Dayden said.

    --
    sysadmins and parents of newborns get the same amount of sleep.
  8. Doublespeak/Equivocation by Midnight_Falcon · · Score: 1, Troll

    While Rackspace here says that SOPA is a flawed piece of legislation (jumping on the bandwagon after seeing the turmoil caused for GoDaddy in the blog and geekospheres), it leaves the door open for them to support future, similar acts when that becomes fashionable or serves to make them money.
    Coming out now and making a public statement in support would be suicide for their business, especially their cloud hosting business that has a lot more tech-savvy and SOPA-conscious customers than GoDaddy's services like wordpress hosting etc.
    But at the end of the day, if anyone sends Rackspace a subpoena or DMCA letter, they knee-jerk right into compliance and give what they want. They don't have a policy of fighting things like Twitter (which is of arguable utility), and have no history of using their legal resources to do anything but guarantee business continuity.
    Rackspace is not known a company with any strong moral, ethical or other principles, it's just out there for profit, and it says what is fashionable for profit at the time.

    1. Re:Doublespeak/Equivocation by vlm · · Score: 1

      it says what is fashionable

      Yet, as bad as you make it sound, its the closest that any non-corporate entity in the US will ever get to providing input to our leaders/owners.

      If the only voice we have is not philosophically consistent, at least it IS a voice against an otherwise our otherwise non-representative government.

      --
      "Science flies us to the moon. Religion flies us into buildings." - Victor Stenger
    2. Re:Doublespeak/Equivocation by Midnight_Falcon · · Score: 4, Insightful

      How about what Google is doing, paying lobbying groups and using lots of their resources to actively campaign against SOPA?

  9. What Would Happen... by IonOtter · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Serious question for consideration:

    What would happen if the "big players", such as Level 3, Verizon, Google and the like came out and said, "If you pass this legislation, we are turning off all of our equipment. We will back up our servers, send our customers their data, rip out the equipment, sell it for scrap, leave the wires hanging, sell our buildings and retire to the Caribbean. If you pass this, we won't be able to do our jobs, so we will simply quit and leave you with nothing to legislate. Good luck suing us, because you'll be back to typewriters, pens and wired telephones."

    Totally NOT going to happen, but as an exercise in thought, would it be possible?

    Could a company as big and powerful as Google hold the world hostage with nothing more than a power switch?

    --
    [End Of Line]
    1. Re:What Would Happen... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Could a company as big and powerful as Google hold the world hostage with nothing more than a power switch?

      No. As much as Slashdotters like to deify Google, it has no power in this way. If it pulls out, the name will be reclaimed by some wannabe search engine within hours. If it holds in and just keeps a page up of 'Due to SOPA, Google is dead,' it will be replaced in the public mind in less than a week.

    2. Re:What Would Happen... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Informative

      See, this is where the whole "the U.S. says corporations are people" meme falls apart. Level 3, Verizon and Google aren't people who can suddenly say "fuck this, we are going to the Carribean." They are nominally accountable to shareholders (who are people, or are institutions like CalPERS who help people) who would raise a metric shitfit if these businesses suddenly said "we are thriving now, we will probably still thrive after, but we think it is time to scrap everything." And that will land some decisionmakers in jail.

    3. Re:What Would Happen... by CyprusBlue113 · · Score: 2

      No, because these are public companies, and their executives would be personally liable for the damage to the stock by this kind of action.

      --
      a handful of selfish greedy people are no match for millions of selfish, greedy people -u4ya
    4. Re:What Would Happen... by itchythebear · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Interesting thought, but as has been pointed out before, they don't actually care what happens to the internet. The Govt will fund a Govt only network (if they need it) and big media will finally not have to worry about people illegally downloading their "product" and can go back to charging 20 bucks for a CD and forcing television down everyone's throats.

      Yet more proof of how little our representatives care about us eh?

      --
      If what I just said sounded like a troll, it was probably just a failed attempt at humor.
    5. Re:What Would Happen... by itchythebear · · Score: 2

      they don't actually care what happens to the internet

      clarification: they == politicians

      --
      If what I just said sounded like a troll, it was probably just a failed attempt at humor.
    6. Re:What Would Happen... by Zocalo · · Score: 5, Interesting
      Well, since we're playing what if... In Google's case they wouldn't actually need to throw the switch, just have a search equivalent of the Black Out day Jimmy Wales proposed for Wikipedia. Let's say you are coming from a US based IP address. You go to Google and enter a search, but get... No results, just some ads down the side of the screen and a message saying something to the effect of:

      If enacted, SOPA and PIPA could be used to force us not to display links that might infringe copyright or face criminal sanctions. Since we can't determine that automatically, here's what is safe for us to display.

      Click here for what non-US based netizens (i.e. your competitors) would see via our non-US based "affiliates", or here for more info on these two acts currently under consideration.

      Needless to say, clicking the link would return the normal links, and second set of ads providing move revenue for Google, so there's an incentive there and the resultant uproar would be... entertaining.

      --
      UNIX? They're not even circumcised! Savages!
    7. Re:What Would Happen... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      their executives would be personally liable for the damage to the stock by this kind of action.

      The executive's job is not to do what is profitable, but to do what the shareholders want. Sure, that's nearly always the same -- but if the shareholders assembly decided to hold the world hostage, that's what the executives would have to do.

    8. Re:What Would Happen... by king+neckbeard · · Score: 5, Funny

      Yeah, the government and the studios don't care, but the public does. If the internet is shut down, Americans can't get their porn. And if Americans can't get their porn, they'll bring out their guns.

      --
      This is my signature. There are many like it, but this one is mine.
    9. Re:What Would Happen... by youn · · Score: 1

      That would probably be bing... their numbers have been increasing quite a bit

      --
      Never antropomorphize computers, they do not like that :p
    10. Re:What Would Happen... by harl · · Score: 1

      What would happen?

      Congress calls their bluff. They pass the bill. They know those companies are going to do no such thing.

      --
      I find being offended by me offensive.
    11. Re:What Would Happen... by DanielRavenNest · · Score: 4, Interesting

      That would not happen, but it would be possible to delist supporters of SOPA from search engines, and refuse them hosting, network connections, etc. If they are trying to destroy your business, there is no rule that says you have to do business with them.

    12. Re:What Would Happen... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Not if they say "Uh, hey, our business model became illegal when this legislation was passed" or otherwise demonstrate it's not them *them* damaging the stock.

    13. Re:What Would Happen... by jamstar7 · · Score: 1

      The Govt will fund a Govt only network (if they need it)

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ARPANETBeen done. Some of us have a short sense of history.

      And what they did before, they can do again, especially if it has the Disney(tm) logo on it.

      --
      Understanding the scope of the problem is the first step on the path to true panic.
    14. Re:What Would Happen... by Brainman+Khan · · Score: 1

      The chance of google shutting down for a day in protest against our government is probably the exact same chance of ICE or DHS taking googles domain name for linking to protected and terrorist links.

    15. Re:What Would Happen... by currently_awake · · Score: 1

      Spectacular public suicide might be all the rage in the third world, but here it's just seen as crazy. A better idea: All internet companies refuse to do business with companies that are pushing this madness. You could have a standard terms of service with mandatory disconnect for violations. Maybe net neutrality would gain some traction if suddenly you couldn't find any republican or democrat site. And nobody is going to build an independent internet JUST for them.

    16. Re:What Would Happen... by ogdenk · · Score: 1

      I doubt it... piracy was still popular before mere mortals could afford internet access. There were plenty of thriving BBS's back in the day.

    17. Re:What Would Happen... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      That would not happen, but it would be possible to delist supporters of SOPA from search engines, and refuse them hosting, network connections, etc. If they are trying to destroy your business, there is no rule that says you have to do business with them.

      Incorrect. Google is the current search monopoly (Don't argue semantics about Bing having ~15%, Apple's and Linux's existence didn't help MS with their ~5% share, the DOJ won't care). Antitrust law says that refusing service when you qualify as a monopoly is a violation of the law and can trigger a smack down.

      Quality of service, on the other hand, may work to avoid this — accept takedowns from random John Does without checking the validity and act lethargically slow with a maximum of legal hoops to accept counter filings.

    18. Re:What Would Happen... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Well, since we're playing what if... In Google's case they wouldn't actually need to throw the switch, just have a search equivalent of the Black Out day Jimmy Wales proposed for Wikipedia. Let's say you are coming from a US based IP address. You go to Google and enter a search, but get... No results, just some ads down the side of the screen and a message saying something to the effect of:

      If enacted, SOPA and PIPA could be used to force us not to display links that might infringe copyright or face criminal sanctions. Since we can't determine that automatically, here's what is safe for us to display.

      Click here for what non-US based netizens (i.e. your competitors) would see via our non-US based "affiliates", or here for more info on these two acts currently under consideration.

      Needless to say, clicking the link would return the normal links, and second set of ads providing move revenue for Google, so there's an incentive there and the resultant uproar would be... entertaining.

      Uproar? What uproar?

      Do not ever think that Joe Sixpack care anything about what happens in the Net.

      Unlike those of us who have frequent /. for ages, many people - Americans included - do not give a damn who control the Net, as long as they get to enjoy their daily porn-fix.

    19. Re:What Would Happen... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      What would happen if the "big players", such as Level 3, Verizon, Google and the like came out and said, "If you pass this legislation, we are turning off all of our equipment. We will back up our servers, send our customers their data, rip out the equipment, sell it for scrap, leave the wires hanging, sell our buildings and retire to the Caribbean. If you pass this, we won't be able to do our jobs, so we will simply quit and leave you with nothing to legislate. Good luck suing us, because you'll be back to typewriters, pens and wired telephones."

      "Atlas Shrugged" by Ayn Rand except due to the times the book was written, it was railroads and mining companies.

    20. Re:What Would Happen... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You do realize that google probably has lots of secrets on these congressman all over their servers. Congressman understand two things, money and blackmail. When one doesn't work, the other will. Pass SOPA all your dirty little secrets are blasted on every web page and search result. Congresscritters will be too busy avoiding prison or outright lynchings at the public's hands to do anything else. Or be proactive and do it immediately. Google gets the medal of freedom and congresscritters go where they belong.

          Then we extend the 4th amendment privacy rights to third party information collection that is about you and attach a death penalty to it. No business can keep information about you beyond actual transaction with no way to sign that right away.

  10. A nice change for Rackspace by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Informative

    I remember back in 2004 when Rackspace turned over entire hard drives to the FBI that contained data for Indymedia websites as part of a terrorism investigation. The FBI only wanted copies of logs, but Rackspace I suppose wanted to go the extra mile.

    http://jebba.blagblagblag.org/?p=175

  11. Politicians or Money by andydread · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Lets face it. The problem is money in politics. When the RIAA and MPAA come knocking with oodles of cash to help get congress critters elected how can they refuse? The only way to solve this problem and much of the problem with Washington is to thoughtfully and radically remove money from politics. Until that is done the politicians will just keep on promising the people and delivering to the corporations with the fattest wallet.

    1. Re:Politicians or Money by Endo13 · · Score: 2

      Which will never happen, because the people who could make that happen are the same ones collecting the money.

      --
      There is no -1 Disagree mod. Slashdot.org/faq defines mod options. USE IT.
    2. Re:Politicians or Money by phorm · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Money (cash)
      Promises of cushy jobs after your term is up.
      Fancy dinners/events
      etc
      etc
      How exactly would one go about removing it all from the equation. Block one way and they'll find another, and no politician is going to vote against his/her ability to receive favours...

    3. Re:Politicians or Money by CrimsonAvenger · · Score: 1

      The only way to solve this problem and much of the problem with Washington is to thoughtfully and radically remove money from politics. Until that is done the politicians will just keep on promising the people and delivering to the corporations with the fattest wallet.

      If that were done, the politicians would just keep on promising to the people and delivering to the corporations that own the most TV stations and newspapers.

      Or did you really think that "the media" is unbiased, in spite of them being owned by the same people you spend most of your time excoriating?

      --

      "I do not agree with what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it"
    4. Re:Politicians or Money by 0123456 · · Score: 1, Insightful

      The only way to solve this problem and much of the problem with Washington is to thoughtfully and radically remove money from politics.

      No, the way to fix it is to remove _POWER_ from politics. If government is limited to things that only government can do (e.g. courts, military, etc) then you don't need to worry about it making crazy laws that will destroy things it knows nothing about; if government interferes in every aspect of your life, you can guarantee it will fsck things up.

    5. Re:Politicians or Money by englishknnigits · · Score: 1

      Exactly. As long as someone has something valuable to offer, people will try to get it by offering valuable things in exchange. You aren't going to change that. If the government has nothing valuable to offer corporations/special interests then that completely resolves the issue. Trying to take money (in one form or another) out of politics without taking out the power is an exercise in futility.

    6. Re:Politicians or Money by pclminion · · Score: 1

      How exactly would one go about removing it all from the equation. Block one way and they'll find another, and no politician is going to vote against his/her ability to receive favours...

      They're doing it for money, so give them money. Raise their salaries by, say, 50 times. It's distasteful, but if it wipes out corruption, so what?

    7. Re:Politicians or Money by penguinbrat · · Score: 1

      I've been thinking about that subject lately, what would be very interesting, telling and very eye opening is for a bill of that nature to even get to congress/senate or even better for the people of the US to have a vote on it (is that even possible anymore?). If the it was out of the congress/senates hands to vote on it - it would only be up to the big media corps, to try and sway you on how letting the big corporations finance the government is best for YOU - no matter how you twist that around, even the biggest idiots/morons would be able to see how corrupt this government has become.

    8. Re:Politicians or Money by frank_adrian314159 · · Score: 1

      Raise their salaries by, say, 50 times. It's distasteful, but if it wipes out corruption, so what?

      It won't. If anything, the 1% in this country have clearly shown that the old dictum "You can't be too thin or have too much money" is true. Give a Congressperson 50X, they'll take the money to make sure they have 51X. And, even if you raise it to 1,000,000X, they'll want that 1,000,001X they can get by taking bri... campaign contributions. Hell, people with tens of billions of dollars in this country don't stop looking for ways of making more. Why do you even think that your solution would come close to working?

      --
      That is all.
  12. It won't punish the users by houghi · · Score: 1

    The users of that law are the MAFIAA.All others are irrelevant.

    --
    Don't fight for your country, if your country does not fight for you.
  13. Something not mentioned.... by dcigary · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Rackspace is a large constituent of Lamar Smith's District 21 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Texas.21st.Congressional.District.gif) as they are headquartered in San Antonio, Texas. Having this large of an employer in his own district against the legislation should be a big wake-up call to Rep. Smith.

    --
    ...my Karma ran over your Dogma...
    1. Re:Something not mentioned.... by Insightfill · · Score: 1

      Having this large of an employer in his own district against the legislation should be a big wake-up call to Rep. Smith.

      There was a past interview with a Senator - I believe Chuck Grassley - who said in a TV interview that he would vote against his state's interests if the party said so.

      Party unity and marching orders over local needs.

    2. Re:Something not mentioned.... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Sadly, it wasn't.... (Posted AC for a reason)

  14. How to choose by DanielRavenNest · · Score: 1

    Vote for the guy who has taken the least in bribes, I mean "campaign contributions", from corporations. It's easy enough to find out how much from third party sites like http://www.opensecrets.org/

  15. It really is a matter of "when" by Turnerj · · Score: 1

    From the looks of it and from other comments about SOPA on the internet, one way or another this will be brought in. What can we actually do once it is brought in to get around the problems of the law? It sounds more than just changing your DNS information to still access the sites taken down. Wasn't the law talking about actually bringing down the business (ie. youtube for copyright)? Is it just a matter of "bringing down the business" is just blocking domain name resolutions of "youtube.com" or actually removing all youtube servers?

    1. Re:It really is a matter of "when" by Anguirel · · Score: 1

      Removing DNS and Search entries, I believe.

      What to do if it passes?

      Step 1: Just send SOPA takedown notices for every supporter's domain.

      Step 2: Find every supporter of this bill's website that supports comments. Have a friend in another country place a link to your own Anti-SOPA stick-figure comic in a comment. Use SOPA to get their domain removed.

      Step 3: Watch as Anonymous quietly hacks websites to innocuously add in a single small piece of infringing material. Use SOPA to get their domain removed.

      --
      ~Anguirel (lit. Living Star-Iron)
      QA: The art of telling someone that their baby is ugly without getting punched.
  16. Time for a do over? by redkcir · · Score: 1

    To bad the people who are voting on this are (A) morons who don't have a clue as to what it's about and/or to busy selling out their constituents to give a crap about the implications of it all. It really is time to throw all of them out and start from scratch.

  17. I must say... by ChodaBoyUSA · · Score: 1

    If nothing else, this sure is a lively discussion. :-)

  18. Constitution by currently_awake · · Score: 1

    Given that the constitution of the USA blocks this, and you can only override the constitution by amendment not laws, why would the supreme court follow such an illegal law?

  19. Morons. by unity100 · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Thats what happens when you wait to protect the very thing you live on - the internet. Those parties perpetrating sopa has been trying to pass some shit like this since early 2004. What have you done ? nothing. just kept on with your business.

    If you had had started lobbying as the datacenter/hosting industry back then, none of these would have happened. But this industry is not the only one to blame. There are search industries, device manufacturers, google, microsoft. Granted, some of the latter did some stuff about acta. But totally insufficient. Instead, everyone sat in their pretty and secure silicon valley bubbles, and behaved as if internet was untouchable. At least it seemed totally stupid to break it, and to the detriment of everyone. But hey ! here is something to break it totally for the benefit of a VERY small minority - so much that a few hands could count the number of those who will primarily benefit in the ultimate end.

    Now, what are you going to do ?

    1. Re:Morons. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Speaking not for the company but as someone who works there, we are hardly on a Silicon Valley bubble.

      In case you are unaware, we are headquartered in San Antonio, deep in the heart of Texas, and most importantly in Lamar Smith's backyard ( the chief sponsor of SOPA).

      Many employees lead a grassroots calling campaign against the bill, and a second campaign as the latest vote potentially neared. We're not a very political bunch, but we are doing our best to make an impact.

      I agree it's a shame we have such a hard time fighting the content industry and their entrenched lobbying organizations. Unfortunately we just don't have the deep pockets and corrupt sensibilities.

    2. Re:Morons. by drb226 · · Score: 1

      Now, what are you going to do ?

      1. Set up a website with ads
      2. get a few anti-SOPA stories on slashdot
      3. profit
      4. sell soul and become a politician
      5. more profit

    3. Re:Morons. by unity100 · · Score: 1

      so you basically sat until sopa was almost upon you. did nothing since 2004 until now ....

  20. hah. by unity100 · · Score: 1

    is to thoughtfully and radically remove money from politics

    thats a fairy tale in a capitalist economy in which some minority can command mountains of cash against the minority. there is no way to prevent backdoor dealings over money. observe what happens with bureaucrats - like the whore who just retired from fcc in order to take up a good paying job in a corporation she benefited. seemingly there was no cash transaction occurred when all the process was happening. but, what happened in the end ?

  21. Like I said once before by shentino · · Score: 2

    DNSSEC is unpopular with governments because it breaks censorship.

  22. This makes me wonder by RandomAvatar · · Score: 1

    Why people don't just create a wireless router that links with other wireless routers to create a type of wireless "net" that is able to access any computer that is connected to any of these wireless routers and also allows foreign access. We could call them citynets or townnets. All that would be needed then would be a similar type of communication between these city or town nets, perhaps even the current internet providers could provide them, that way if something like this does go through, there is a community that is able to still view the content, copy it, and spread it to other city and town nets with ease, and thus make it pointless to even bother with garbage like this bill.

    I may be no computer expert, and this is by no means a complete idea, but I do know enough that it is doable (public willing), we have the technology and enough intelligent people to figure out how to make this type of idea functional.

    1. Re:This makes me wonder by luther349 · · Score: 0

      there called wireless mesh networks and some got put up in the middle east when there governments had the bright idea to turn off there networks.

  23. The jack-boots they are a tromping by msobkow · · Score: 4, Interesting

    I know this is going to get voted down by offended Americans, but...

    After 9/11, the US government began dismantling support for Constitutional rights in favour of anti-terrorist security theatre. They invested billions in surveillance, security, police, staff, and computer systems. Yet despite that huge investment, they couldn't stop the domestic terrorism of the fellow in Texas who recently took out a half dozen people.

    They claim to have stopped a few terrorists over the years, but when they've presented the "evidence" against those who were planning attacks, it turned out that the attackers were using ineffective techniques that were unlikely to kill anyone (e.g. The underwear bomber.)

    Now they've stepped it up and officially denied the Constitutional rights of anyone the government deems a "terrorist", without having the nasty hassle of proving it to a judge and/or jury. They can just "hold" someone for years without charges or court cases while they "investigate".

    SOPA is just the next step of that change in American policy. Instead of championing the legal system, they want to be the arbitrary judge and jury over the world.

    Sorry, but the American government does not deserve that level of trust from the world when they can't even follow their own rules for governing a country.

    And don't get me started about the persecution of medical cannabis users south of the border and the denial by the US government that cannabis has any medical use.

    And yet some people can't understand why so many in the world hate the US and what it's done to their nations in the defense of "freedom" and "democracy." You can't go around invading people, ignoring their laws, ignoring your own laws, and expect to receive any measure of respect on the international stage.

    But I bet not ONE of the Congressmen who support SOPA have ever even thought about how this bad legislation is going to be received by the rest of the world.

    --
    I do not fail; I succeed at finding out what does not work.
    1. Re:The jack-boots they are a tromping by rrohbeck · · Score: 1

      The US have been semi-fascist for a number of years so it just evolves.

    2. Re:The jack-boots they are a tromping by Friggo · · Score: 1

      Commenting to undo a bad moderation.

  24. re by gracelily · · Score: 1

    Melon Wazi is talking what ,can't get it.oK?! http://www.jpzentai.com/ http://www.udreamybridal.com/jp/

  25. sopa by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    sounds like it is more like
      send our pay abroad
    as innovation and skilled jobs carry on declining in the us due to laws like this.
    - and being abroad i dont have a big problem with that

    if i was american i might not be so unconcerned

    1. Re:sopa by sigaar · · Score: 1

      You should be concerned. What happens in the US serves as a precedent for other countries. If it's OK to sweep up domains at some corporate entity's whim without due process, you can bet your bottom Pound/Euro/Rupee/Yen that a similar law will pass in your country in the not-too-distant future.

      --
      sigaar
  26. SOPA is not flawed. by master_p · · Score: 0

    SOPA will not result in censorship.

    SOPA will not hurt the economy.

    Under SOPA, if you run a legitimate site, a site that does not violate copyright, you will have no problem.

    Please stop with the hypocricy. The only reason you do not want SOPA is that you will no longer be able to download copyrighted material for no money.

    I am serious, this is not a troll post. While SOPA is the result of the lobbying of Hollywood and othe media owners, it is about COPYRIGHT INFRINGEMENT, not censorship.

    Thousands of web sites have based their business model on copyright violation. This is the unfortunate truth. I am a regular youtube visitor, for example, and I am usually entertained by videos that are usually copyright-protected. I recognize though that these videos are illegally available by youtube, because they are copyrighted and the publisher has not reached an agreement with youtube regarding these videos.

    People are also worried that sites where users post their comments, along with links will not be sustainable under SOPA. This is wrong. There are workarounds that can be used to circumvent the problem...for example, linking does not have to load the linked page directly...a link could be a downloaded text that ccntains the actual internet address to visit. Browsers could be automated to open these files and visit the addresses directly, without user intervention. In this way, a web page will not contain direct links to content, it will contain links to text which will contain the links to content, and thus the sites will not be restricted by SOPA.

    That is, unless SOPA outlaws linking at 2 or more levels...in that case, the whole internet would be illegal.

    1. Re:SOPA is not flawed. by KozmoStevnNaut · · Score: 2

      Mod parent -1 Horribly NaÃve for thinking that's all the Powers That Be will do once SOPA passes.

      --
      Eat the rich.
    2. Re:SOPA is not flawed. by obijuanvaldez · · Score: 1

      Thank you. I have actually read the entire bill and I really fail to see what all the hatred is about. That said, I tend to agree partially with Rackspace in that I don't believe the bill will actually be very effective to the end of Stopping Online Piracy but it could provide some modicum of relief for copyright holders, e.g. shutting down access to allofmp3 clones, etc. I would invite everyone to actually read the entire bill for themselves.

      But this is Slashdot. So, barring that I would invite everyone to at least assume that laws are not generally drafted by the specifically and only evil and stupid for a negative end. They are likewise not generally passed by the specifically and only evil and stupid for a negative end. And they are not generally to be enforced by the specifically and only evil and stupid for a negative end. That kind of shrill dialog only serves to dumb down any discussion.