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Australian Consumer Watchdog Sues Apple Over iPad Marketing
Fluffeh writes "Australia's competition regulator will today take iconic technology giant Apple to court for advertising its new iPad tablet as featuring '4G' speeds — which are not supported on Australian telecommunications networks. One of the key features of the new iPad is support for 4G speeds, however, the 4G speeds which the new iPad supports will not be available in Australia, with Apple's technical specifications page only listing it as supporting the 700Mhz and 2100Mhz spectrum bands, neither of which are being used by Australian telcos to provide 4G services. The case may be a bit shaky, though, as Apple does state in the fine print: '4G LTE is supported only on AT&T and Verizon networks in the US; and on Bell, Rogers and Telus networks in Canada. Data plans sold separately. See your carrier for details.'"
It's like the release of the Ipone 4GS in the US -- the ads focused on SIRI, but when people complain, Apple then says "It's BETA". That's misleading and frankly dishonest, but probably legal in the USA.
This appears to be just the same: advertise 4G, and in the small print, point out that you will probably never get 4G. It's dishonest.
The real "Libtards" are the Libertarians!
* When it does. Not when it does not, shut up and pay already.
Fuck systemd. Fuck Redhat. Fuck Soylent, too. Wait, scratch the last one.
The article says that the fine print may make the case shaky:
The case may be a bit shaky, though, as Apple does state in the fine print: '4G LTE is supported only on AT&T and Verizon networks in the US; and on Bell, Rogers and Telus networks in Canada. Data plans sold separately. See your carrier for details.'"
But why can the fine print supercede what's in the main ad? How can an ad for a 4G device in Australia be legal if that device will never be able to work in Australia? They can list the 4G for USA and Canada on the specs page. As another example, if an ad screams "Unlimited 4G data!!!" in large print, they shouldn't be able to write "Unlimited plans subject to data caps that we won't reveal to you and throttling back to speeds slower than 2G speeds" down in the fine print. If it says "Unlimited" in the large print, then it really should be "Unlimited". Fine print shouldn't be able to contradict the main body of the ad.
ABC's Media Watch mentioned this as part of a larger look into media coverage of the new iPad release. Summary doesn't quite make clear that 4G is available in Australia, it's just that the iPad won't support it.
Australia does have 4G and is a '4G area'. Australia uses different bands to what the iPad supports.
Although, Apple still advertise it as the '4G iPad' on the Australian website.
Australia DOES have "4G" but not the "4G" that the iPad makes use of
Apple claims HSPA+ and the other higher speed protocol popular in AUS is called 4G by "some", which is true. It's not LTE but it is "4G'. They claim 4G not LTE gents.
We do have 4G here in Australia, it's just on a band that the Apple iPad doesn't support.
Read The Fine Print!
If I had a company that made the relevant toys, could I advertise them as "5G", or even "6G"?
Who decides what qualifies?
Sheesh, evil *and* a jerk. -- Jade
Australia DOES have a 4G network, it being actively promoted at the moment by Telstra. The problem is that Telstra use 1800Mhz for LTE. Also, I read that the fine print about only working on US/Canadian networks was only added two days ago.
Apple sues Australian telco's for not offering the right 4G frequency band.
Aussies travel, whether the iPad can support 4G or not, is important to a businessman traveling. So it's fine to quote something the iPad can do even if the Aussie telcos can't do it yet.
What bothers me is the idea that the radios aren't dynamic and can't support software frequency changes. Aren't we in the 21st century?
Non impediti ratione cogitationus.
If Ferrari advertises their cars as having a top speed in excess of 200MPH, do we think they ought to be sued because the roads in my country can't handle it and limit the top speed to less than half of what the car is capable of? Sounds nuts now, doesn't it?
The Crux of the matter here is that 4G is available in Australia, Apple just can't be bothered making the iPad compatible with the Australian Network, yet advertises as if it were, that is false advertising in anyones book.
You never catch me alive
Australia does have 4G. Telstra have been supplying it over the last few months. Of course it's only in select areas but it is planned to be expanded in the near future. Check this coverage map to see all the 4G locations http://www.telstra.com.au/mobile-phones/coverage-networks/our-coverage/mobile-broadband/?red=/mobile/networks/coverage/broadband.html
If they advertised it as "will let you play Angry Birds" and some quadriplegic would then sue because he can't play?
That's ridiculous. You're cherry-picking an extreme corner case, and one that requires anything to be modified extensively to be anywhere near useful. For anyone with reasonable expectations (which is a phrase used in Australian consumer law) it's fine for playing Angry Birds.
Even if you don't have a 4G network in Elbonia or Australia, doesn't mean the device isn't/doesn't deliver on the marketing (it'll do 4G where such networks exist, US and Canada).
Except that it's being advertised with this feature in Australia to Australians. What it can do in other parts of the world is totally irrelevant to Australian consumers and the ACCC.
Blank until
... then, maybe. The target of the advertisement matters in cases such as these.
Prediction for end of Universe #42: Fencepost error in Quantum_bogosort.cpp
With all their money in the bank, Apple couldn't afford to produce market-specific ads for different countries?
I hope they get their asses sued into the ground for penny-pinching in such a fashion. Given the profitability of the damned things, they sure as hell can afford to use regional advertising!
I do not fail; I succeed at finding out what does not work.
Update to this story: http://www.smh.com.au/digital-life/tablets/apple-offers-refund-for-misled-ipad-4g-buyers-20120328-1vxpy.html
Any phones sold as 4G in Australia are LTE phones.
We don't have that problem that US has.
Those phones you see like 'MyTouch 4G' or whatever actually have an entirely different name in EMEA and Australasia.
If they advertised it as "will let you play Angry Birds" and some quadriplegic would then sue because he can't play?
No, obviously otherwise no-one would be able to advertise anything without specifying whether it's applicable in infinite amount of use cases.
It's clear that if the device is a 4G device and you don't live in a 4G area
Wrong, instead of just jumping on the apologist bandwagon and making erroneous statements that make you look like an idiot how about checking the validity of your statements? Australia has 4G, the iPad is incapable of working on the available band so should not be sold as a 4G device in that country.
Even if you don't have a 4G network in Elbonia or Australia, doesn't mean the device isn't/doesn't deliver on the marketing (it'll do 4G where such networks exist, US and Canada).
But there is a 4G network in Australia, the ipad just isn't capable of utilizing it.
I have the verizon ipad 3 in the US. Verizon LTE is pretty impressive where I live. I can't imagine what real 4G would be like....
Anti-competitiveness is 2nd nature to AU's de facto monopoly - Telstra.
While Apple is no angle in that department, there are 4G standards, &
Telstra's 4G doesn't seem to adhere to them, in AU.
ACCC should have a justifyable go at Telstra for not offering more compatible 4G,
so that 3rd parties can compete with them in the area of distribution of hardware,
IMO.
maybe we could start actually prosecuting people for war crimes?
it seems like you can kill millions of people and get away with it, but if your advertising is misleading, oh my god, the consumer watchdogs will sue you.
maybe if someone could figure out you can 'consume' warfare, then maybe we could have a 'consumers reports' test.
i am not sure what the 'product' is here though. freedom? government itself?
The Crux of the matter here is that 4G is available in Australia, Apple just can't be bothered making the iPad compatible with the Australian Network
Actually the fault for incompatibility lies with Telstra who chose a different band in full knowledge that it would be incompatible with the rest of the world, presumably for their own anti-competitive strategies. This is not to excuse Apple, whose advertising in the Australian context certainly appears unlawful (enough for the ACCC to take action, and they tend to know their consumer law).
The crux of the matter is that Apple just can't be bothered making their advertising appropriate for Australian consumption.
Googled "Apple Revenue": US $108.249 Billion US dollars (September 24, 2011)
Googled "Australia GDP": US $924.840 Billion US dollars (2009)
If you are a troll, not bad.
Otherwise, go away.
The Commerce Comission (equivalent of the ACCC in Oz, or the US FTC) in New Zealand is also considering the same action against Apple (and there are exactly zero 4G networks here)
Commerce Commission investigating Apple iPad 4G adverts after Complaint
If they advertised it as "will let you play Angry Birds" and some quadriplegic would then sue because he can't play?
If they advertise to quadriplegics the 'fact' that they could and quadriplegics can't, then they would be in breach of the law. Whether the "some quadriplegic" could then sue, is a question of standing. Remember it isn't some iPad purchaser suing here, it's the ACCC.
By the rest of the world do you mean "The USA" or by the rest of the world do you mean "The rest of the world" ?
Because in Europe, Australia, and Asia 1800 is the standard frequency, with 2600 and 800 being also considered.
In the USA it's 700 and 1700/1900.
The US & Canada isn't the "rest of the world," dude. We (the US and Canada) the ones who chose different bands from the actual rest of the world. Apple shouldn't be advertising 4G in Australia if it can't deliver 4G to Australia. It's entirely deceptive.
Plenty of historical precedent. They got Al Capone for cheating on taxes...
So since when is "the rest of the world" Canada? The frequency Telstra has picked (1800MHz) looks to be common across Asia and Europe... It's only North America where that doesn't figure.
But not to worry, I'm sure Apple will release the iPad 3S in a few months featuring exactly the same crap as the iPad 3 apart from the wireless chipset that supports 4G in the real rest of the world.
I don't therefore I'm not.
See comments above: Only the US and Canada are using those frequencies for 4G. The frequency Australia uses at the moment is used in "the rest of the world".
Also, if you really want to lay blame for Telstra using what you call the "wrong frequency", blame the ACMA for allocating that band for analog television signals.
They cannot all be 3G since EVDO has a maximum 2.45 Mbit/s to 3.1 Mbit/s. EVDO either has to be demoted to 2.5G or HSPA+ and above has to be considered de-facto "4G".
To me, if the typical speed of HSPA+ in some markets is "higher" than LTE 4G in other markets then that means that HSPA+ is 4G effectively.
Jesus was a compassionate social conservative who called individuals to sin no more.
IOW: give Apple a decade or two :)
A successful API design takes a mixture of software design and pedagogy.
The ACCC is going to be very wary of Apple now that they have, in recent times, sought to deceive the Australian courts and the Australian people in two separate incidents; the Samsung Galaxy Tab photo-manipulation and now deceptive ads... they're going to have to tread verey carefully from now on here if they want to continue to sell their products. If they don't adhere to our fairly stringent consumer protection laws, they could face restrictions on imports of their products; possibly an outright ban if it goes far enough.
Go us :D
Apple shouldn't be advertising 4G in Australia if it can't deliver 4G to Australia. It's entirely deceptive.
That's what I said.
As far as the "rest of the world," using something other than 1800, I stand corrected. My bad.
The things your learn when you post wrong stuff on slashdot. Obviously I allowed my recent altercation with Telstra, whom I'm "forced" to use because of connectivity, to cloud my judgement. I'll just take my tin-foil hat off now.
I suppose when USB 4.0 is released on MOBOs across the market, consumer watchdogs will be crying for relief if it's incorporated before any conceivable device will support the new standard.
It's not 100% clear that the regulator will have a case on the specific point mentioned-- it is factually correct that the iPad connects to 4G networks. Whilst on one level you might argue that this is playing on public ignorance as far as the *domestic* market is concerned, the iPad is clearly also a product specifically designed with travel in mind. So advertising on the basis of a feature that works somewhere internationally, albeit not domestically, could be argued to be legitimate and that it is up to the consumer to recognise that some features will be relevant specifically to international use.
[If you do decide that this advertising is misleading enough to censor, then you also have the problem of where you draw the line. What about a camcorder advertised as having a "500x digital zoom", but only a ~500 pixel vertical resolution?-- like 4G connection compatibility in Australia, the feature advertised is technically useless but the claim is still arguably technically accurate. If a computer is advertised as having a quad core processor, is the onus on the consumer or the advertiser to be aware/point out that little software will actually benefit from all 4 cores...?]
On the other hand, you could perhaps get into a semantic argument about whether "around the world" is a misleading label for what actually amounts to "the USA and Canada".
In Australia it is illegal to post big "feature*" advertising where *feature doesn't work. Fine print is not good enough. This is clearly misleading or deceptive advertising. Apple will lose.
If they advertised it as "will let you play Angry Birds" and some quadriplegic would then sue because he can't play? It's clear that if the device is a 4G device and you don't live in a 4G area, there's nothing the device can do about it. But roam with it and you will get 4G speeds. Even if you don't have a 4G network in Elbonia or Australia, doesn't mean the device isn't/doesn't deliver on the marketing (it'll do 4G where such networks exist, US and Canada).
No -1 'ignorant moron' mod yet, huh?
The whole "let's lie boldly and then tell the truth in fine print" thing is old. It would be one thing if what they were saying was basically true, or true 95% of the time, and they needed to add some qualifications, which would be too long to fit in the main message, so they relegate them to the fine print - but this is not that.
If it doesn't support LTE in Australia, then the Australian site shouldn't say "Supports LTE!", it should say "Supports LTE (in USA only)", or something like that.
"Unlimited" internet plans with ports blocked, no public IP, and data transfer limits should at least say "Nearly unlimited web browsing - up to 5GB per month!". Then it would be clear (to people who understand the difference) that they are selling web browsing access, not internet access. (Thus, if things like Skype don't work, the consumer shouldn't bitch).
I see so much of this bullshit, and I don't think it fools anyone - it just makes us distrustful. Hell, there is a Steak-House nearby (Sizzlers) that has an "All you can eat" lunch special, but you are only allowed 2 plate-fulls. How is that all you can eat?! Nobody's that stupid, so they may as well just advertise it as "Two Plate Special", and then people would be able to decide whether it's a good deal it not without feeling deceived.
but seriously nobody mess with apple i bet apple makes more money then all of austrelia combined i bet they could buy austrlia then make a 1000 mile long and across swiming pole in the shape of the apple icon
Okay /. time for a -1 'semi-literate' mod.
The Danish consumer protection ombudsman has been making waves concerning the same issue as Apple in Denmark is also doing the same kind of misleading tactics. The problem however is that Apple is operating out of Ireland and might be able to squirm away from being held responsible for such despicable tactics. Hopefully, if a lot of consumers get burned by this behaviour, people will trickle away from Apple products...
MS, ALS, Aphasia ? http://globability.org - Me http://einarpetersen.com
...that's a bit tasteless, isn't it?
Angry Birds should be perfectly playable with a stylus.Not unlike the way a quadriplegic would type.
A consumer has a reasonable expectation that advertised features can be used in the place the product is sold. Australia DOES have a 4G network.
It is the same WiFi+4G model sold in the USA, and it will currently only work with USA 4G, AND with All/most Australian 3G networks, and I would guess that a firmware upgrade may fix the problem, in time. It isn't a dud, it's just not what people think when they first glance at it. The warning is plane sight when you go to buy on-line. I'm guessing that Apple will get a caution, and they will have to make the 4G conditions a bit more obvious. Meanwhile my local garage sells petrol cheap, oh, as I pull in the driveway I notice that I need a voucher to get the cheaper price, s_it happens.
There was an unknown error in the submission.
Australia's GDP in 2012 is $1.57 Trillion according to the IMF.
It's insane to compare a country with a company. But still, Australia does have 15 times the economy of Apple.
When Argumentum ad Hominem falls short, try Argumentum ad Matrem
I just saw a headline to the effect that Apple was offering a refund to anyone who feels that they bought an Ipad under false pretenses. This is in effect calling the bluff of anyone expecting a reduced price for their Ipad.
"If you don't like it, just hand your Ipad back and do without."
http://feeds.reuters.com/~r/reuters/businessNews/~3/qGNPMiKwDTo/us-apple-australia-idUSBRE82Q06Y20120328
"Apple Inc will email all Australian buyers of its new iPad to offer them a refund, a lawyer for the company said on Wednesday, after the nation's consumer watchdog accused it of misleading advertising over one key aspect of the product."
I am guessing exactly zero buyers will return their iPad. Basically, Apple's saying - Fuck you please! Don't like it, give it back - there are plenty of people around the world who'd sell their grandma for an iPad right now.
For ads in Germany, Apple already had to remove the 4G stuff ...
That's exactly right. Samsung and HTC have managed to make their 4G devices actually work in Australia, why can't Apple?
I swear that when the new iPad was first released the disclaimer only said something like, "4G not available in all areas". The Wayback machine doesn't have data for something so recent - is there anything else available?
This is the way to go Mr Cook.
Slashdot, fix the reply notifications... You won't get away with it...
Apple is not the deficient party here. Their device is capable. Perhaps Apple should sue the Australian Telcos?