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Student Expelled From Indiana High School For Tweeting Profanity
First time accepted submitter OopsIDied writes with the story that high-school senior Austin Carroll of Garrett, Indiana was recently expelled after tweeting profanity from his own home, writing "Supposedly the school has a system which tracks students' social networks after they have logged in at school. Although the tweet was done at home at 2 AM, the school decided that such behavior was unacceptable and that the most fitting punishment was expulsion. He did use a school computer, but it was set up to use the school network even when used outside the school because the school claimed the tweet was associated with the school's IP address." As usual, TechDirt has some biting commentary about the expulsion. But Hey, at least they didn't throw him in jail.
They can enforce the rules as they wish (just like employers). Student should have used a private ISP, instead of the government-owned school network.
My AC stalker: " I personally agree with your posts most of the time, but that won't keep me from modding you troll"
Sounds like the school is really behind. They need to get themselves in gear and expel the 90% of the student body that says "fuck" on a daily basis in the halls, in the cafeteria and on the buses.
Posted from work (but using my own proxy thanks).
They can enforce the rules as they wish (just like employers). Student should have used a private ISP, instead of the government-owned school network.
Perhaps. But should a high school student have been expected to know this?
Maybe they should have opted for jailing him for life. After all, isn't tweeting "fuck" an incitement to the masses to commit rape?
Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. - Voltaire
Using profanity in the halls, cafeteria, and buses is safe, because such incidents are not visible to parents, school board members, or the general public.
Twitter, however, is visible to the whole world, so anything undesirable must be just as visibly punished.
On the one hand, i've said it over and over again, giving punishments for writing on the bathroom stall door (aka twitter) is stupid. Will always and forever be stupid.
However, if he used the school's network/computer to do such, I can kind of see some punishment is appropriate.
I think expulsion was a bit much, some detention would have been just fine, but ahh well.
What do I know, I'm just an idiot, right?
Unfortunately, there seems to be an increasing frequency of reports of punishments for online posting. The precedent has been set, and there's no rioting against it. It seems rediculous to me, but this is going to continue for some time until some lawsuit strikes it down.
All issues of who own what aside, honestly, who gives a fuck what the kid said unless it was like...death threats? Seriously...why would you expel someone for using profanity in the first place? A stern talking to, perhaps, but expulsion for this? Good lord.
"Those who would sacrifice essential liberties for a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." - BenF
Right, it was also their network with their IP address.
No man is an island, But if you take a bunch of dead guys and tie them together, they make a pretty good raft.
Schools loaning computers are still a relatively uncommon thing. These kids are being given an opportunity to learn to use a tool that will greatly increase their future opportunities. Encouraging the kids to use it wisely is a good thing. How many reports have we seen about an employee misusing equipment and getting into big trouble, including a ruined reputation through reports in the press.
Sure kids are in rebellion and think that they can do anything they want. They have not yet understood that gifts come with strings. They think that by taking a computer they are doing the school a favor. That education is favor they do for their parents and a favor that society gives to them. Sure, it is cheaper than jail, but we are more than willing to pay for and put them in jail.
That said expulsion might seem a bit harsh, but we really don't know what else this kid has done or not done.
"She's a scientist and a lesbian. She's not going to let it slide." Orphan Black
Carroll says he doesn't think he should be punished by the school for what he posts on his own time and on his own computer.
I can see how this would be acceptable if it were a school computer, but his own computer from inside his home?
That's just fucked up.
R I D I C U L O U S
Sent as ripples into the electromagnetic field. No single photon has been harmed in the process.
Of educators, lawmakers having no idea what the internet is. "Hmm, since he said it from our address, it's like he's speaking for the school. The whole internet is going to thing we use bad language. It reflects poorly on me!"
It was their computer he was using at home at 2:30 AM? I'd say read the links (the top FA doesn't include that tidbit), but this is /.
Vote monkeys into Congress. They are cheaper and more trustworthy.
he tweeted somethign along the lines of "fuck is one of those fucking words that can be used fucking anywhere in a fucking sentence"
-Clio
Karma: Bad (mostly from not giving a fuck)
Blog: http://clintjcl.wordpress.com
How about the United States of China
How about death penalty?
Sent as ripples into the electromagnetic field. No single photon has been harmed in the process.
I'm sure you've all heard this before, but it bears repeating here:
...fuck is the only word referred to as 'the f word... It's the one magical word. Just by its sound can describe pain, pleasure, hate and love. Fuck, as most words in the English language is derived from German ...the word fuieken, which means to strike.
Perhaps one of the most interesting words in the English language today, is the word fuck. Out of all the English words that begin with the letter 'f'
In English, fuck falls into many grammatical categories:
As a transitive verb for instance.. John fucked Shirley.
As an intransitive verb... Shirley fucks.
Its meaning is not always sexual, it can be used as...
An adjective such as... John's doing all the fucking work.
As part of an adverb... Shirley talks too fucking much.
As an adverb enhancing an adjective... Shirley is fucking beautiful.
As a noun... I don't give a fuck.
As part of a word... absofuckinglutely -or- infuckingcredible.
And as almost every word in a sentence... Fuck the fucking fuckers.
As you must realize, there aren't too many words with the versatility of fuck...such as these examples describing situations such as:
Fraud: I got fucked at the used car lot.
Dismay: ahhh fuck it.
Trouble: I guess I'm really fucked now.
Aggression: Don't fuck with me buddy.
Difficulty: I don't understand this fucking question.
Inquiry: Who the fuck was that?
Dissatisfaction: I don't like what the fuck is going on here.
Incompetence: He's a fuck-off.
Dismissal: Why don't you go outside and play hide and go fuck yourself...
I'm sure you can think of many more examples.
With all these multi-purpose applications, how can anyone be offended when you use the word. We say use this unique, flexible word more often in your daily speech.
It will identify the quality of your character immediately.
Say it loudly and proudly: FUCK YOU!
Waiting for ad.doubleclick.net...
When you use your company laptop or company phone, all bets are off w.r.t. freedom of speech and privacy. Even if its on your own time and/or off company property.
So lets leave those company phones and laptops at work after quitting time. And bring your own phone for use during lunch breaks. If they need to contact you 24x7, they can pay you 24x7, time and a half after 40 hours, of course.
This kid got a tough lesson. But at least he didn't lose a job over it.
Have gnu, will travel.
Remember kids, wiretap laws and the Bill of Rights don't apply to you when you're enrolled in school.
Anyone agreeing with the school here really needs to read TFA (specifically the TechDirt article). Apparently he Tweeted while at home, and the school had a system set up that tracked all Twitter logins, recording all Tweets on those accounts. The kid must have logged in subsequently to posting the Tweet, and their spy system picked it up.
I mean, what the fuck. The school is literally spying on its students' private accounts. I bet their system picked up Direct Messages too, all in the name of anti-bullying. I really hope this kid calls the ACLU and gets this shut the hell down. This is a huge violation of his and the other students' rights. If he had posted the Tweet from the school it may have been slightly different but still an overreaction. This is outright wiretapping, unauthorized use of an account, a declaration that students' private lives are subject to the school's rules... what the hell is going on here?
It's better to vote for what you want and not get it than to vote for what you don't want and get it.
- E. Debs
Funny how the same issues seem to come back over and over again, just like the Swearing Police. ;)
Under normal circumstances, school children stand far more chance of actually offending people when they swear at school than if they swear it tweets.
Can someone please help me dig up George Carlin now? He's spinning in his grave so fast, we could use him as a form of renewable energy!
Kan you see what I did there?
Had he said the same thing in the hallway, at worst he'd have been told to shut up.
But because he "spoke" through a computer, he deserves explulsion?
The school's policies are seriously screwed up.
Sorry, in the vernacular of the students, "seriously FUCKED up!"
I do not fail; I succeed at finding out what does not work.
Phone 260.357.4114
press 3 for the principle's office
but in most of the rest of the world
Oh? If true, I wouldn't want to be there.
As long as you are not referring to reproductive organs, sexual conduct, you can say "fuck" all day long. The words in question ARE NOT obscene, and therefore protected under the first amendment. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Obscenity "In short, freedom of speech means the freedom of fucking speech, you ignorant cocksuckers." Ruth Bader Ginsburg.
Can we throw everyone in jail who believes people should be punished over non-objective criteria and concepts?
Employers are going to have to get over it, because practically everyone will have similar histories.
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Perhaps, but you don't get rid of racism by removing opportunities for education. This isn't going to stop people from being racist, it will just make them internalize it and express it even more viciously in their private lives.
Now, if this individual is an impediment to good order in a school, it may be tactically necessary to remove him to prevent strife, but as an impediment to racism, such a punishment would be ineffective. The vocal racists likely are not the ones you really need to worry about. I know a number of people who would never swear or utter a racist epithet in public who are perfectly happy to countenance nuking the Middle East and turning it into a parking lot. Some of them even vote Democrat and call themselves liberals. Not to mention their opinions about blacks or asians or whatever. People shouting "niggerfaggot" in public are just the tip of the iceberg.
Education is the only way of decisively defending against racism, and in this case, I feel removing that opportunity and throwing a kid in with the other miscreants in the alternate school/holding tank for expelled students is not going to help that issue.
I wonder if they'd expel him for writing profanities with a pencil from school on paper he got from school as well?
=================
Unix is very user friendly, it's just picky about who its friends are.
It was commentary on the unique qualities of this magical word that can fill various parts of speech. Shakespeare uses naughty words in creative ways all the time, and that stuff is required!
...and stories like the assistant principal at a Lower Merion PA school district spying through the webcam on student issued laptops (remember that?), I have to say one thing about student-issued laptops:
Laptops are cheap enough. Use your own. Treat the school issued one as toxic. Refuse it.
They are simply too dangerous to even turn on.
And those in authority wonder why they are distrusted.
--
BMO
They seem to ignore that the environment where they live has rules set and enforced to ensure stability.
You mean like pointless, arbitrary rules against 'profanity'?
School's computer = school gets to set policy. Violate policy = school infraction. If my employer gives me a laptop and I VPN in then post obscene crap on Twitter, I'm not sure I'd feel justified in complaining if they fired me. Assuming the policy was written down and provided to me beforehand.
Expelling a child does impact them later in life more than being fired.
Democracy Now! - uncensored, anti-establishment news
Now, if as per HuffPost, he did it on his own time using his own equipment; then the school is way out of line.
I'm a consultant - I convert gibberish into cash-flow.
Didn't we just have a news item about offensive speech?
I can see being upset about speech that causes actual damage, such as promoting drug use, bullying another student, provoking specific violence ("I'm going to kill you tomorrow, Danny") or posting private information.
Offensive speech? Obscenities? It's a stupid idea to start regulating this stuff, as there will be a lot of it.
Ah, but then there will be the few that don't and you'll need to decide if they planned for the future or if they're just anti-social luddites who can't find the any key.
Phone 260.357.4114 press 3 for the principle's office
Sue the school for "not intruding" into the personal lives of every other cussing student. Why did they open themselves up to liability of enforcing students private speech? How many have been victim to one of their students on a rant in a public place, virtual or real, where nothing was done?
One of the only ways to get past this undesired practice of intrusion into personal life by the schools is to hold them accountable and show them what they stepped in with their new practice. They enforced their whim in an area they should not be intruding. It does not matter who owned the pipes used by the punished. If they want to play full time nanny, hold them to it for all students. They do not get to apply a policy to only a single student they have in their sights.
...when he found out he was expelled was probably "Fuck" so all the school is doing is encouraging his profanity.
Seriously though, this is happening more and more across the country. I don't understand how the school gets off thinking it is their job or right to police what kids say outside of school or what they do with their accounts or anything on the internet if they are not specifically mentioning the school. At the very most, he should have had the school issued laptop taken away. That's it. Sure if they are attacking a staff member directly they can go from there, but trying to stop anyone from cursing ridiculous at least, and most likely a constitutional violation.
"I hope you know how very lucky you are to know me, because I am so incredibly incredible."
They deserve each other. Everyone's got an acceptable use policy. Learn them. On the other hand the school needs to focus on what's relevant to their job and not social engineering everything else. I would hope, and I'm serious here, the school simply pulls the plug on their own network.
Even if the kid did post the tweet during school from a school computer using the school's network, do you really think expulsion is an appropriate punishment for writing "Fuck"?
At most, in the worst case, this was worthy of a verbal reprimand like "Don't fucking do that again!"
The idea is to enforce obedience; the content of the fucking rules is almost irrelevant. Not quite, though; it's necessary for them to be strict enough that many students wouldn't want to follow them, or it won't have the proper purpose of instilling discipline and respect for arbitrary authority.
Nanny State Industrial Complex. Beware!!!
As someone who has dealt with the enormity of school idiocy, let me just state that a quick call to the family lawyer will get all this straightened right out. If threatened with a law suit, the school will buckle. Also, if this is what constitutes an expulsion these days, I never would have made it out of grade school.
Would he have been expelled if he swore in school?
I've heard of cases where a student got detection where a prof caught a student swearing, but unless he was swearing a blue streak *AT* a prof I haven't heard of it resulting in expulsion.
In many cases cussing in school is overlooked unless it reaches a certain threshold...
It's not United States of China. China is FAR smarter than to chuck a future member of the workforce out of school because of a curse word. They need workers in order to continue climbing on top of the US and doing naughty things to us. Only arrogant, ignorant, decadent nations like our own could perpetrate stupidity like this.
Here's the original local story:
http://www.journalgazette.net/article/20120325/LOCAL0201/303259931
It appears the confusion all over the place here derives from the fact that there were two separate incidents. First, last year, he used school equipment to post a profane tweet and was suspended. Then, recently, he posted the above linked profane tweet, but it was from home, on his own computer, not on the school's network at all. They just saw it because they were examining his Twitter account because of the last incident.
Hopefully that clears up some of the confusion.
So they expelled the student who used the word "fucking" as a joke, but not the teens that are doing it and getting pregnant? What a wonderful example for the other kids, do it or shut up about it.
Even if they planned for the future, they probably aren't the type fit for a job. They are either actually squeaky clean, in which case they are probably very naive, or they are incredibly cunning, in which case they could be a real threat.
This is my signature. There are many like it, but this one is mine.
This reminded me of something Bigger, Longer & Uncut.
You can't handle the truth.
Its astonishing that you think that the student/school relationship is at all analogous to employee/employer.
Good-bye
Comment removed based on user account deletion
He ploughed her, and she cropt
Time to offend someone
You guys are missing the worst part of the story. This principal, Matt Smith -- mailto:msmith@gkb.k12.in.us -- is one of us. He's a nerd. He got a BS in math. Also, the idiots running their website don't know how to load a thumbnail image, instead of scaling a big one. How did the world come to this. Maybe this kid is actually a jock who picks on nerds, and Mr. Smith decided to get even with him out of some misguided sense of justice. Maybe Mattie here got too many wedgies in school.
You won't like it.
To a Lisp hacker, XML is S-expressions in drag.
I, am neither "naive" nor "incredibly cunning" in a dangerous way.
My real name doesn't appear anywhere online (not from my activity anyway- others may talk about me)- and I haven't signed up for any social networks- although I am very active on forums and blogs like this one.
As a kid on the old BBSs that were popular before the internet got big, my brother used to watch the forums for things I said that he could report to my parents to get me in trouble. Even though I used an alias- he knew what my alias was. I got in trouble too many times for things I posted online not to be carefull.
As a result- I learnt very early on to hide my real name (and even my alias where possible) from anyone who might want to track me for nefarious purposes. Now, I never use the same name on more than one place I comment.
"That's the way to do it" - Punch
There was a Supreme Court case, Layshock v. Hermitage, which was very similar to this one: high school senior posts offensive content outside of school, punished with banishment to an "alternative" school (where they send the special naughty kids). Layshock sued the school district and won, on the following grounds:
The only potential liability is the fact that his school laptop VPNed through the school, but because the tweet was in no way illegal (not even questionable... it's a diatribe on the word "fuck" for those who did not RTFA) there is NO CHANCE of legal liability by the school, barring some obscure law that requires schools to censor all outgoing bad words or something.
This student needs to sue his district. What they did to him is not right, and very similar cases have resulted in rulings in favour of students.
Lets here it for higher standards and higher morality. No i am not being funny i am quit serious. Ya i was a teen yes i cursed kids curse its nothing new, but the difference here is hes cussing publicly using school property where everyone can hear/see him not just being a part of a group of kids with no adults around. If i would have been caught cussing by my parents/teacher i ass would have been grass.
Jack of all trades,master of none
Few companies would care about simple profanity as long as it was his personal twitter account.
My brother is currently in highschool and they have a laptop program there too. I got a chance to inspect his laptop. Students are encouraged to use their laptops not only at school, but also at home. They're allowed to take them home, over spring break, over summer break, and they have a trade up program.
However, all traffic from the laptop is routed through their VPN, you can't even shut it off or edit any system settings. They have the OS completely restricted. If you install anything on the laptop without their permission, they reprimand you for it. They have unfettered access to the embedded webcam (I told him to put a piece of electrical tape over it and if anyone questions it ask why he needs to remove it) and they also have complete remote access abilities to monitor his laptop.
Honestly this is all pretty sick. A school isn't a business. While it may be appropriate for a business to protect it's assets and make sure they aren't being misused, the school is run by the government, which is in turn (supposed to be) run by the people. A simple reimage of the computer would wipe anything the user has done. As long as they don't physically break it then there shouldn't be any problems. Instead they are not only going out of their way to lockdown the OS (which prevents any sort of meaningful learning experience outside of a handful of software suites they deem worthy), but also patrol what their students do, which in turn opens up space for liability as well. Whatever happened to parents doing this sort of thing anyway?
If he didn't HAVE to use the laptop, and oh yes, they are required, to use the laptop in school, outside of school, and they can't buy their own, I would suggest him using the home computer. They are required to essentially funnel everything that is school related through the device. There aren't ways to access the in school programs outside of the VPN, like the drop box.
This is exactly how NOT to do a laptop program if you give a shit about the people actually using them.
There was a kid a few years back that got suspended ore expelled for writing a story about zombies taking over the school. Therefore I can only conclude that you are a threat to national security.
War doesn't show who is right - just who is left.
mmmm, a 5-year old laptop!
You are sidestepping the real question though.
Whis is this: why the fuck should a kid be expelled from school, for tweeting a single profane utterance, on accident?
At the most this warrants a stern talking to.
What a fascist state we live in.......
Earl was our best programmer.
Please see me in my office.
Sincerely,
Your boss.
I'm used to pointing people to quotes from the article linked, but this is the first time I've had to point to damn summary.
You must be new around here.
You surrender a lot of rights when you enter a school.
According to whom?
On top of that, yes you have free speech, but there are still consequences. I can't run into a crowded theater and yell "FIRE" and expect to get away scott free.
Ironic you used that example, since it's an example of why free speech restrictions are inherently flawed.
If a well meaning guy runs into a crowded theater and yells "FIRE", because there is an actual fire with smoke and flames and all......what's the practical difference between the outcome of this situation, and a similar one where a prankster does it for fun? Odds are people would get hurt in both situations, regardless of the person's intent, because yelling "FIRE" in a crowded room is a good way to panic people, especially if if there is an actual danger.
I wonder......was there a huge outbreak of "FIRE" pranksters in years past, which was miraculously solved by the introduction of these anti-freedom and anti-free speech laws?
The answer of course is no, because laws do not, cannot, and never will work to solve social problems.
Our society is gone fucking nuts--I mean, out of goddamn control when it comes to ridiculously over-harsh punishments for innocent things which merit a slap on the wrist if anything at all. It's totalitarianism, tyranny which has gone unchecked for far too long.
Our forefathers would weep with shame if they could see what we've become.
Cursing another person is not communication
That's where you're wrong, dumbass!
Common sense ain't as common as it used to be
If you were on BBSs before the internet got big, that would seem to suggest that you didn't grow up in a world with social networking. The same is true for me. I'm speaking more about those for whom the ubiquity of social networking overlaps with teenage stupidity.
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There are so many things wrong with what happened to this kid that I scarcely know where to start ranting but the most glaring is expulsion. Cussing in school was something that might get you a detention sentence to an hour of study hall after school for a day or two but expulsion for cussing is beyond sanity. There need to be some school employees fired for pulling this absurd crap.