Slashdot Mirror
You Can't Bypass the UI Formerly Known As Metro On Windows 8
colinneagle writes with this excerpt from Network World: "The final build of Windows 8 has already leaked to torrent sites, which is giving the propellerheads a chance to dig through the code. One revelation will probably not sit well with enterprise customers: you can't bypass the don't-call-it-Metro UI. Normally, you have to boot Windows 8 and when the tiled desktop UI (formerly known as Metro) came up, you had to click on one of the boxes to launch Explorer. Prior builds of Windows 8 allowed the user to create a shortcut so you bypass Metro and go straight to the Explorer desktop. Rafael Rivera, co-author of the forthcoming Windows 8 Secrets, confirmed to Mary Jo Foley at ZDNet that Microsoft does indeed block the boot bypass routine from prior builds. He also believes that Microsoft has blocked the ability for administrators to use Group Policy to allow users to bypass the tiled startup screen. There had been hope that Microsoft would at least relent and let corporate users have a bypass, if only for compatibility's sake."
...Windows 8.
forcing a horrid (tablet/phone) UI on everyone!
DOING IT THE WINDOWS ME WAY!
Didnt we just cover this very thoroughly yesterday?
....Make people need you. - bill gates
And the way you make people need you is to not teach them to fish, but limit what they can do for themselves and make the rest so difficult that they have to need you.
There had been hope that Microsoft would at least relent and let corporate users have a bypass, if only for compatibility's sake.
Balmer! Its the guy that is wrong, yet again!
Hey KID! Yeah you, get the fuck off my lawn!
I hope it won't be that bad. If the Interface Formerly Known As Metro is as bad as the Ribbon, I'll struggle for a while to adapt, and then probably go back to the previous version or install Classic Shell. I don't mind experimentation with something new. Maybe it really is better. But I don't understand why Microsoft doesn't provide a "classic" mode for people who are willing to try, but eventually decide they like the previous arrangement better. How many of you stuck with the default theme for Windows XP? Anyone? Can you imagine if there was no way to change it?
And to not allow it or make it easy for enterprise users. That's just cruel. Is Microsoft *trying* to increase training costs for companies?
Even if this is true, how about Shell replacements? Will they block those too? If they do, this might indeed be a dark age for windows.
is why MS is so determined to force this issue. What's their payoff?
Metro-tweak-tool, please?
Check out my virtual machine: http://viuavm.org/
It's ridiculous to even think that Microsoft is following Apple by locking stuff down just because they think 'That Which Should Not Be Named' is the most efficient way to do things. Hell, even Apple only started to just merge iOS and Mac OS X and that too very subtly and slowly. MSFT has absolutely jumped right into it. It is going to be a disaster, no matter what.
As someone who actually has a copy of Windows 8, TFA and TFS are correct and the OP is wrong. Microsoft has removed the previous methods of booting straight to the desktop.
Or they can just ... not install Windows 8, and stick with Windows 7, which'll be even faster on the new, more powerful hardware.
There's always another way, you know.
Hyperbole: I use it liberally!
I can understand why Microsoft decided to remove that option, though I disagree.
They want to the users to give Metro a fair try by living with it for a while. It is different enough where most people only see it once until they set an option to get rid of it. I've been using Windows since 3.0 and the first thing I do at a new job is get rid of the XP theme and set things up to look classic.
I think this is a mistake for Microsoft. Forced changes without easy options to go back angers users. Ubuntu and Unity are in a similar situation. Between Microsoft and Canonical trying to promote a tablet desktop on non-tablet PCs I think Apple and the KDE will be the winners.
On my formerly Ubuntu box at home the change motivated me to give the KDE and Kubuntu a look for the first time in years. Luckily I really like it and am now unlikely to go back to Ubuntu and Unity(or GNOME )
It's called Windows 7. You can expect it to be a lot more popular in the enterprise then 8.
-- "So they told me that using the download page to download something was not something they anticipated." - Bill Gates
While I admire the desire to be really creative and shit and try to come up with a cool "new" interface, functionality still remains one of the key desirable attributes for a user interface. We can thank Apple and all the Apple wannabe copycats for useless, ridiculous new ways of doing things that are less accurate and more time consuming by design. Who said that dragging page after page of stacked thumbnails as if they were pages from a book is an improvement over a plain old list? Especially when the constraints are so narrow that you often end up "dragging" two at a time. Want an example? Here, go look for a specific picture on this site. Have fun. Oh it looks cute. It's not functional. You will waste time waving your mouse back and forth trying to get the picture you wanted. A UI is supposed to be something that helps you, not something you have to fight with.
Now I'm not saying this is how (formerly known as) Metro is going to work, I haven't used the beta, and I've only seen a couple screen-shots. But I understand that Microsoft is going for the "smart phone" look and feel, and that means lots of big colorful buttons you have to drag everywhere, and crap like this. And considering what they've done with "Ribbons" when they obfuscated their "Office" suite - and I'm talking about the 2007 version, I refuse to "upgrade" and see what else they managed to fuck up, I can't imagine this UI will be better. I remember an argument in the late 80's about how computers hadn't really lived up to their promise of greater productivity in the office. Well Microsoft, I guess we'll have to congratulate you for lowering the bar even more...
Seven puppies were harmed during the making of this post.
Given that there's already apps out there to let you run Android apps on desktop OSes, why not switch corporate systems to Android? (and yeah, I know this is a fruitless hope. blah blah installed base blah blah open source blah blah IT support blah blah).
I'm going to print this out, and after the election I'll fap to it over a soundtrack of bitter Republictears.
oh come on AC. Show us your true feelings. Even M$ shows everyone that yes you cant boot to a legacy desktop but using KB shortcuts you can remove the new desk for the legacy one. My guess is that your to afraid to let people really know who you are so you hide and pick away. Personally I hate /. decision to allow AC postings.
Go look at the M$ link in Cowboy Neal's post on this same subject strangely on slashdot.
http://tech.slashdot.org/story/12/08/09/1417210/cowboyneal-weighs-in-on-the-windows-8-metro-gui
You blowing smoke like a good liberal should.
"Remember, politicians and diapers should be changed often and for the same reason."
it will turn out that the final build of Windows 8 does have such restrictions.
But you will be able to remove said restrictions if you buy the Pro Gold Game of the Year Ultimate edition for $389 instead of the regular $89 "Vanilla" edition.
Seven puppies were harmed during the making of this post.
I feel like a police negotiator desperately trying to talk a man out of shooting his foot off.
Repeat after me Microsoft: The desktop market is not the smartphone market, and any attempt to ram it down reluctant consumers throats will turn it destroy what is still your biggest cash cow. http://waysofteaandfailure.blogspot.com.au/2012/08/the-many-problems-of-windows-8.html
This seems to me that it is going to be another massively under-adopted operating system. You'd think they would have learned their lesson from Vista. Don't force unnecessary restrictions on usability.
windows hate.....
...the year of the Linux desktop, because if this doesn't turn people away from Windows in droves, I don't know what will.
oh come on AC. Show us your true feelings. Even M$ shows everyone that yes you cant boot to a legacy desktop but using KB shortcuts you can remove the new desk for the legacy one.
That's a nice double standard. If that were Linux people would say "yes but if you have to follow cryptic steps from the knowledge base then clearly Linux isn't ready for the desktop. Users just want to get their work done not relearn a new interface!".
Maybe next year will be the Year of the Windows Desktop?
This is going to be a fantastic sales point...
...for Apple. It may also be what drives several former Windows-centric corporations into Linux.
All the world's an analog stage, and digital circuits play only bit parts.
That only works for a limited period of time. Eventually, they stop selling Windows 7, and eventually they drop support for it.
I use windows 7 and there are a lot of things you can't do on windows 7 that you could do in windows XP or Vista. For example, you could manually organize folders in windows in those operating systems. I mean, literally pick up folders and move them from one side of a window to the other. This is something I've gotten used to doing since windows 3.1. So I was deeply annoyed when window 7 disallowed it. Finally I found some registry hacks that would re-enable the feature.
Beyond that, there are full shell replacements for windows. I expect that using shell replacements might become more and more the thing to do on windows systems. On top of everything else, some of the shell replacements are much more configurable then windows shell meaning that if you want to hide features from users you can literally remove them from the GUI entirely.
A combination of those two factor should make more then a few companies look at shell replacements.
I've decided to stop wasting my time responding to AC trolls/sockpuppets... so if you want a response from me... login.
Why do people care?
As Windows is a proprietary operating system it's clear that users are not in control over it. So why don't you just switch to a Free operating system, which you can control, instead of being subjugated by it?
I don't have AC postings. I hate people replying to AC postings.
AC postings itself are easily blocked from view, but replies to them requires me to open them if I want to read the context (usually I just skip the entire thread, but it takes up valuable screen space).
Ignoring AC's starts by ignoring AC's.
In other words... "dammit ACs never post anything of value that's worth reading ... except for all those times that they do. Shit, why won't the whole world help me pretend this never ever happens?!"
Fucking people, not doing exactly what you'd like them to do with their own personal preferences. The nerve!
By the way your sig is hilariously ironic. ACs contributing useful posts at least once in a while is a "shade of gray" you don't seem to recognize. Maybe a logged-in user will reply to this and quote it so you can see the hypocrisy. Would that interfere with your cozy black-and-white world of "AC bad, pseudonym good"?
How long before something like XFCE is ported to Windows? I know KDE was almost able to run as the Windows shell a few years ago, maybe there's enough reason to make it happen now.
Yeah. After all, we were forced to go to Vista because support for XP was discontinued. Oh, wait. That's not what happened at all.
Windows 2012 doesn't boot to 'Metro' how hard can it be to change 8?
Well, almost. I've got Classic Shell installed on the leaked version of Win8 Enterprise N. What happens is that it'll load Metro for a fraction of a second and then CS takes me back to the old "desktop" environment complete with start menu.
So it's not a complete bypass but it's close enough for my purposes.
If, like me, you prefer the Win7 start menu's look to the default Win98/2000 look Classic Shell provides, there's a skin to make that possible.
Hail Eris, full of mischief...
E pluribus sanguinem
Yep, I was waiting for someone to notice that.
It's not even tagged Dupe on the main set of tags.
My first Journal Entry ever, in 8 years! http://slashdot.org/journal/365947/aphelion-scifi-fantasy-horror-poetry-webzine
This is the most ignorant, useless release of Windows 8 ever made. Change for change sakes it seems.
I recently tried installing it on my netbook with a resolution of 1024x600 (the typical netbok resolution) and I cannot run a SINGLE metro apps because my resolution is not at least 1024x768. What is that bullshit? The apps can scale at all? They expected this to be on some older devices that supported it, so why the limitation? I know future Surface devices will have to meet a certain standard, but why throw compatibility out the window? Why not an 800x600 resolution minimum? That way you'll know everyone within a reasonable time period (not the short time period of 2 years ago where my netbook sits) can use the full features.
There reasoning I think is so app developers don't have to cater to tons of resolutions, which is fine. FOR A MOBILE DEVICE.
They expect Windows 8 to be used on Desktops but completely cripple usability.
It's true I only really use the start menu for searching programs and rarely go straight to the icon itself. But the search is even worse in Windows 8! I hit the WinKey and start typing. I type in "device" looking for the Device Manager. Nothing. There are some metro quicklinks for installing hardware and whatnot, but not the Device Manager. Not until I search "device m" does it show up. Meanwhile in Wndows 7, I type just "d" and there it is, as well as everything else that starts with "d".
Now the sad part is, I would use it if it still had the start menu. It runs wonderfully on my netbook. It scrolls smooth and everything is snappy.
But it's useless. The XP I ran before worked better.
And all this crap they're giving to corporate users is hopefully gonna hurt them. It'll run terrible, it'll *feel* terrible. Maybe they've just decided to give this area to linux like Apple has and just focus on consumers. Well that's fine and dandy but the Apple user experience on a laptop or desktop is not in any way horrendous, while Metro leaves me feeling frustrated.
Can't wait for Windows 9 now. Its sure to be good.
Anything of substance to add moron?
No? Thought not.
http://www.businessinsider.com/obama-unemployment-rate-2012-6
Oh, wait. That's not what happened at all.
It kind of did. Windows 7 is really Vista Service Pack 3. Which Enterprises are moving to. Windows XP has two years of support left.
If you hate the UI changes in Windows Vista, which Windows 7 kept, and you don't like Metro, then you are kind of screwed.
The year of the linux desktop comes closer with the lock down of proprietary systems.
That only works for a limited period of time. Eventually, they stop selling Windows 7, and eventually they drop support for it.
But by then Windows 9 will be out fixing the Metro problem and/or Mac and/or Linux migrations will be viable options.
Any insufficiently advanced magic is indistinguishable from technology.
Yeah yeah, I'm primarily a Windows guy and have actually been damned pleased with Win 7.
But this does appear to be in their usual cycle of releasing garbage first (ME, Vista) just to make some fairly decent release soon following (XP, Win 7).
As a Windows admin I don't even bother with the first releases of their seemingly usual 2 part deal. Not even worth it.
Not that they're going anywhere, but 2013 is going to be a bad year for MSFT.
I feel like a police negotiator desperately trying to talk a man out of shooting his foot off.
Why would we ever waste police resources on this kind of person?
If he wants to shoot somebody ELSE'S foot then by all means, send in the police. That would be a crime after all. But as long as it's his own foot he's shooting, the only response should be "bad call, bro".
You need to get a little more angry, I can't fap just yet.
If they can force a version without media player (N versions) and browser choice screen, then they should be able to force an interface choice option.
I think they just try an experiment. Who cares that one version is disliked by users, this has happened so many times already anyway. They still sell the previous version and they'll make a next one after that in which they'll do what the users want again, like Windows 7 was (disclaimer: posted by someone who has not actually used Windows since the XP version so may have no idea what he's talking about).
Am I alone here? I think it is pretty cool. I hear a lot of "change for the sake of change" being bad around here, but why is staying the same for the sake of staying the same a good thing? One of the biggest draws (for me) to Linux was that it was something new and different. Why are people suddenly so set in their ways that anything remotely different from their crufty old UI is instantly the worst thing ever? What happened to the spirit of "new and cool"? Maybe Metro isn't for everybody, and maybe it won't last, but it is certainly different and, dare I say it, kind of fun.
First it's called Metro. Now its the UI formerly known as Metro. I hope they don't change it again to a symbol that doesn't exist on the keyboard.
Congratulartions, you've been nominated for the False Dichotomy Slashdot Comment of the Month Award. We'll contact you shortly with more information.
Ezekiel 23:20
It's a shell game.
"Like the look of the Metro Interface? Well it's right here in one of these shiny boxes! That's right, ooh shiny. Sick and tired of the Metro Interface? Well one of these boxes here has the NotMetro Interface! That's right, just what you asked for. No, no sir, no shell game here, just good fun. What's that? Oh, you wanted an actual shell? That's right here inside one of these boxes, inside the NotMetro Interface, inside the NotDOS prompt! Something for everyone! Step right up!"
With this move Microsoft will wait until everyone upgrades their XP to W7 before releasing new desktop OS.
I just fucking love how fucking stupid and deranged leftie hippie retard obama bots are and how they are going to be foaming at the mouth and flopping on the ground in seizure after election day.
as Windows XP still holds half of the market. Enterprises are still getting around to rolling out Windows 7. Those companies are not going to touch a brand new operating system to begin with, especially one that makes such a radical departure.
any OEM that does the lock down will not only lock them self's out of the web sever market but the desktop and laptop Enterprise market as well.
Business customers, as a rule, run really old software. My software company still has customers with software that requires Windows XP, and won't run on anything later! Therefore, our company has to continue to support Windows XP if we want to continue to sell software to them.
Most business are starting to move to Windows 7 (bypassing Vista), but they won't use an OS that doesn't let them go straight to the "classic" desktop to run all their old software, which won't be updated for years to come. When Microsoft realizes the sheer numbers involved in lost sales because they wanted to be "hip," they'll see the light and shoehorn something in there to make the business customers happy.
Or you can remove the restrictions if you start switching your users over to ubuntu
No, they cannot.
With media players and web browsers, Microsoft entered an existing market and forced dominance by installing their product by default.
But there is no "MS Windows UI"-market. There are shell replacements, sure, but they are marketed as just that, replacements. The UI provided by Microsoft is the one true Windows interface as intended by the developers, so there is no market that needs to be regulated here.
However, I would expect the interface can be changed easily enough, simply by setting the registry entry for the shell that is loaded at startup back to 'explorer.exe', there just won't be a GUI checkbox for doing so.
"Are you idiot aware that this is a site for technology news?"
Are you idiot aware that I don't give a shit what you think?
Well now you know.
Thanks for playing.
I have 2 words for Windows 8. "New Coke." I'm sure on the laptop and desktop market it will be even less popular than Coca-Cola's forray into reformulating a new taste.
"Care about people's opinions and you will be their prisoner." ~~Tao Te Ching~~
If you hate the UI changes in Windows Vista, which Windows 7 kept, and you don't like Metro, then you are kind of screwed.
Not really, you can tweak 7 to make it look almost the same as XP.
"I'm not sure I like the fugnutish tone you used in your post!" -RogL (608926)-
There, that's just enough impotent rage to be fappable. Thank you good sir.
Translation: La la la... I can't hear you.
Where else do you apply this little theory of yours? There's a word for you, "bigot".
You know, there are sites that don't permit anonymous posting. Why don't you think of heading over there?
“He’s not deformed, he’s just drunk!”
Shut the fuck up.
What was the question???
There is always React OS :p
I am an ACCA student. Got a query on Accountancy/Finance? Maybe I can help!
Enterprise is having trouble rolling 7 out from xp and as a result a lot of devs where I wor k now have to have two laptops minimum (one wIth xp and one wIth 7) due to critical dev tools and corporate applIcatIons simply not working in 7. Due to the sheer cost (money, tIme, people, coporate polItIcal capItal) It would be to redevelop all that complete independence from xp Is not happenIng. After this headache you can bet they will be even less keen to take even a brIef glance at 8.
So any programs that run at boot time, i.e Disk Defragmenters, pagefile optimizers are screwed then?
Something tells me this version of Windows will turn out to be another Windows Me and be boycotted with similar effect.
I don't quite get the hate. Firstly (and my god I'm going to get modded down - look at my comment history, I'm not a shill, I'm just dull) the ribbon is a better interface than a hierarchical menu system. It (at least in office 2010 - I never gave 2007 nearly enough of a play around with) behaves delightfully in the presence of different screen resolutions (seemingly) intelligently choosing which functionality to highlight on the ribbon within the space available and which functionality to push down into a menu. It also exposes more functionality at the 'one click' level than 2003 ever did, which makes discovering functionality vastly easier. The only thing the ribbon _REALLY_ needs is a 'search' option which is available as a power tool (plugin, or whatever it's called) which really should be vanilla. Sure it's different and requires you to learn new things, but it's not hard to learn, the benefits in learning make it worthwhile and surely learning is fun??
I express the same general sentiment towards Windows 8. The Metro start screen is just a glorified task bar that is much harder to accidentally click on. The number of times I've accidentally clicked on (and thusly lunched) a bloated java program (Aqua Data Studo, I'm looking at you) whilst actually trying to bring up an already open program (at the very least) frustrates me. Launching apps from the start screen (I suspect is better - there is a distinction between launching and multi-tasking) and switching to the desktop on login is just not that big a deal. You get to work - boot your computer up, log in (and then if using Windows 8 click the desktop icon/tile) load up Matlab, SPICE, Quicken or whatever then hell you use and then blow 8 hours tooling around with that program. Seriously - how big a deal is one extra click over 8 hours? Also, being able to press the windows key and see whether any of the applications/tiles you're running have received updates is kind of neat. I can imagine that will be very useful for checking email/facebook (more bad karama)/rss feeds.
New things are neat, aren't they? Computers are cool. Learning how to tool around in different operating systems be they Windows, OSX, Linux, BeOS, OS/2 or whatever is fun, isn't it? Where did we all lose our joie de vivre? Windows 8 will seriously not alter the fundamental way you interact with your PC, it brings (aside from the GUI) nice new technologies to the table - so why the rabid hate Slashdot?
Why would we ever waste police resources on this kind of person?
Because most of the civilized world has public health care, and it costs less to talk him out of it than it would to fix it after the fact.
hate (cr)apple... I don't like the poor quality of their vastly overpriced hardware. I don't like that they try to lock customers into their walled garden where the only place to get software or upgrade hardware (without actually replacing a device) is from them. I don't like that they can't compete with Samsung, HTC, etc...except by trying to litigate their competiters out of the market using vague and frankly invalid patents. Patents that should never have been granted in the first place.
Any one of the things mentioned above would make me not want to buy their products, and recomment to anyone else not to buy them either. But I don't hate them. They are not worth that level of emotion, and I try very hard not to let emotion influence my buying decisions.
I know people freak out about Windows 8 very easily but why not just dual boot to Windows 7 and 8? That's what I do now. At first I found myself only using Windows 8 rarely. Now I find myself using it all the time and using Windows 7 less and less.
Just TRY IT. Quit bitching and try it. I've been using it for weeks, and once I got over the bitching, the start screen works just fine. You get used to it, and there are a lot of decent keyboard shortcuts.
Using 'Software #2' does not remove the limitations in 'Software #1.'
And so is the editor for accepting this. He wants to get an article accept on slashdot yet he insults technical people as "propeller heads" And "The interface formerly known as Metro" the "Don't call it Metro".
Somebody needs to hit this moron of a submitter in the face with a cluebat.
and/or Mac and/or Linux migrations will be viable options.
In other words, 2013 will be the year of the Linux (or MacOS) desktop?
Well if the Corporate world decides that Win8 is just too much drain on their workers productivity, you may see another Corporate holdout like the bypassing of that turd, Vista. If EVERYBODY is sticking to 7, MS is gonna be forced to keep extending 7 support, JUST like they're doing for XP... Not a heck of a lot of ways around it for them... Since most corps have volume licenses for 7 and image their own systems, which I'm sure they will do even on new systems that ship with 8, JUST like they did during the time OEMs were shipping Vista.. I lost track of the number of systems we recieved from Dell with Vista on them that we immediately reimaged to XP at my last job..
THANK YOU, Edward Snowden!! Americans owe you a debt of gratitude (whether they know it or not..)
It's like they're taking a .50 caliber rifle, loading it with explosive ammunition, and using a calibrated scope to shoot themselves in the most critical part of their foot.
In full-auto.
What's the deal? Don't they realize alienating customers this way is a bad idea? Even APPLE, king of "our way or the highway", gives users choices when they make changes like scrolling-direction.
Too bad this is from an AC.. despite that its great to see someone, even an AC, actually telling the TRUTH, vs all of the O-Bots that infest /. .. Of course, the O-Bots are gonna crank both AC and me down into -5 land, as that's how they roll... Obama, the definition of FAILURE, unless you consider success being taking the only remaining Superpower in the world and making a really good attempt in just under 4 years to turn it into USSR version 2... January 20th, 2013, THE END OF AN ERROR... O-Bots, mod me down... I care not!!
THANK YOU, Edward Snowden!! Americans owe you a debt of gratitude (whether they know it or not..)
Microsoft seem to screw up every alternate release of (desktop) Windows
2k good
ME bad
XP good
Vista bad
7 good
8 bad
Let's hope they keep up with the trend and windows 9 will be good.
Of course, the O-Bots are gonna crank both AC and me down into -5 land, as that's how they roll...
Hey dingbat, the only mention of politics in this entire thread comes from you and the AC above you, of course you should be modded down. This is as offtopic as it gets.
Windows 8 will be a really good product tied to a great service that is otherwise hampered by non-existant marketing and a competitor with brand strength that rivals a nuclear bomb?
If that was true, I'd have to give Windows 8 another look.
Maybe you got there but I still need a little more before I can let loose. Come on, guy, rage more. Don't leave me hanging.
Two laptops? Why? Windows 7 comes with "XP Mode" for these situations.
Granted this doesn't make you independent from XP but at some point there is going to have to be a rationalization between fixing the tools or opening yourself up to the risks associated with using an OS that the vendor does not provide security updates for after 2014.
Some of us are still on Windows XP SP3 as our primary image. We're only changing to Windows 7 SP1 in the next equipment lease swap (in about a year) because XP is reaching its EOL. Vista was never touched.
Corporate IT hates radical change because it is hard/expensive to support. End users get confused and need re-trained to use their computers (lost productivity since they're having issues figuring things out/spending time on the phone with the help desk); help desk gets raped (Leading to overtime); software engineering gets screwed trying to fix all the sudden bugs that appear from compatibility problems (which also kills end user productivity if the broken applications prevent them from working; and it rapes help desk again since they're the liaison between the software group and end users).
Any competent CIO isn't going to run a shop on bleeding edge software. The only Windows 7 systems we have in use at our company are either for executives (because they insist on getting what they want and they have their own personal IT support tech on hand anyways to support it), or members of IT for use in testing software and other items for the upcoming XP EOL (my main workstation is XP SP3, but I have a Dell Latitude running a mirrored environment on Windows 7 to check for issues between the two.)
To be honest, I see most corporate environments holding onto Windows 7 until its EOL (2020) since many are just now either getting around to going to Windows 7 or have just recently done so. Microsoft would like for corporate to upgrade every release of windows; but no CIO that values his job is going to bite on that.
"I feel like a police negotiator desperately trying to talk a man out of shooting his foot off."
"Press muzzle firmly against ankle joint and pull that trigger as many times as you can!"
"This post is an artistic work of fiction and falsehood. Only a fool would take anything posted here as fact."
Why help an evil corporate citizen improve its product line?
If MSFT fields a version which kicks users in the yarbles with every mouse click, I support their right to do so!
"This post is an artistic work of fiction and falsehood. Only a fool would take anything posted here as fact."
There's an actual veep article now, presumably he's "contributing" to that discussion.
"Windows 7, which'll be even faster on the new, more powerful hardware."
8 definitely seems to be performing faster on my hardware.
I'm also confused as to how people think that Metro is the entirety of Windows 8. It's just the start screen replacement. The UI has been revamped, but it's much better than 7/Vista IMO.
But it does make those limitations a moot point which has the same utility.
I know it's flamebait, but damn funny!
Microsoft is determined to wreck Windows 8 I have nearly 100 programs in my start menu. I like them as a text list and not as a very long horizontal list of garish colored squares and not being able to close the programs once opened. They must have found out that people do not want tiles and would switch to the desktop so Steve Ballmer ordered the change just because he could.
Having messed around with the preview copy of the new Windows Server 2012, I was surprised to see that it boots straight into the 'desktop app' instead of going to the not-called-Metro Metro interface. Now surely there is no issue with Microsoft doing this for their servers, so why is it an issue for their client OS? After all, both are based off of the same system.
I'm thinking, as a consumer at least, that Windows 8 is not an operating system I want to use. Besides the pain in the ass Metro interface, the main issue is not being able to play DVD videos natively without buying extra software, something I don't need to do with 7, MacOS or even a Linux distro. Being at university without a TV and DVD player means I use my PC to play films, so that's a big killer for me.
If MS won't let me play with the OS the way I want, I will just stick with Windows 7. I don't play many games. I won't upgrade Office any longer. I don't use IE. I don't want my apps and files to be "in the cloud".
If IT can't implement a group policy to bypass the user interface formerly known as Metro, the CIO can implement a business policy to bypass installation of Windows 8.
Many businesses went this route with Vista, and are happy they did.
Knowledge is how to play a game, intelligence is how to win, wisdom is knowing what game to play.
Windows 8: it sucks and blows at the same time!
I wonder if the same people at MS who are insisting on Metro on the desktop are the same people who insisted on the desktop interface on WinCE phones. Maybe MS thinks touch monitors will take over on the desktop or tablets will largely outsell desktops.
No, no you can't. Microsoft completely and entirely destroyed the ability to customise your UI to the same degree in Windows Classic mode (in Windows 7) as you can in Windows XP. Do not tell me I'm wrong -- this is one of the top reasons I will not switch to 7. You obviously have not actually spent the time, sitting the two OSes side by side, and actually examined what Microsoft did. Do you want me to provide you actual videos + screenshots showing you exactly how they destroyed the customisation aspect for Windows Classic under Windows 7, because I will be happy to spend 80+ hours putting together a concise list of all the shit they fucked with or gimped "just for the hell of it"
Windows 7 therefore *intentionally* forces you to either use Windows Basic or Windows Aero, and for no justified reason except as another /. user described, "changed for change sake" -- which is exactly what Microsoft is doing to people with the Metro UI in Windows 8. Not to mention, there's a crapload of Windows 7 applications that drop you to Windows Basic mode when you try to run them (a great example of XSplit), which completely defeats the point of running Aero at all.
Microsoft's idea of innovation -- fuck choice, you will comply with our Indian developers' ideas of what "looks good" means.
Maybe "HKLM\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\Windows NT\CurrentVersion\Winlogon\Shell" can be changed to explorer.exe.. I don't know as I haven't tried it yet.
Stardock software is buggy as all get out. It really is bad when used on a dev machine since it screws the debugger, causing faults way down deep, that makes it unusable.
That's Stadock's "Windows 8 de-suck" tool. I haven't tried it yet because I haven't had a chance to try 8 but it sounds like it works well.
The thing that annoys me is if the OS just sucked period, ok no problem. It sucks, give it a miss, life goes on. However everything I've read says technically it is exceedingly good. Cakewalk tried out Sonar X1 on it and found an across the board speedup. This wasn't a recompile or mod for Windows 8, just regular X1d that we all use. Windows 8 just has better multi-threading, and better latency, which equals better performance for high end audio apps.
So it is a very good OS from the low level, crippled by a shitty UI. Not really a problem for me, I'll just replace the UI with Classic Shell or Start 8 or whatever (I do Windows support professionally so it is my job to learn it). However users will hate it, refuse to use it, and then decide 7 is the One True OS(tm) and we'll be fighting to get them to upgrade to 9 or 10 or which ever one next doesn't suck.
The programmers at MS must be all kinds of sour right now that their excellent dev efforts were screwed over by this shitty UI.
1) You have 100 employees who use MS Office. .docx docs and xlsx spreadsheets they are starting to receive? Yes.
Did they want a new interface? No.
Did they need one? No.
Do they have learn one to use the flood of
Do you have to spend money retraining them again? Yes.
Did a whole generation of macros become useless? Mostly
2) You have 50,000 employees (say, Seimens) using XP who must now upgrade to Windows 8.
Did they want a new interface? No.
Did they need one? No.
Do you have to spend money retraining them again? Yes.
Did a whole generation of software build around Windows XP become useless? Pretty much.
3) You have 1000 customers using your VB6 application. You employ 3 programmers
Did they want to learn new code? No.
Despite the promises, does their VB6 app work on 64-bit Windows 7? Yes, it just crashes every few minutes now.
Do they have to learn new code and then recode and then retest to keep their customers? Yes.
Microsoft's Motto? Who cares about how much you have to spend upgrading or training or re-developing, asshole? You'll eat our shit with a smile.
Or not, actually. Linux gets more usable each year, and android pad OSs aren't standing still either.
Please do not read this sig. Thank you.
I agree it has nothing to with what is loaded, but if you have no hardware drivers or cant boot XP at all, then its not what they get.
That day is coming ( if its not here already for many models )
---- Booth was a patriot ----
Why would we ever waste police resources on this kind of person?
Because most of the civilized world has public health care, and it costs less to talk him out of it than it would to fix it after the fact.
In in the US, I wouldn't give good odds on private insurance paying out on the medical bills for a deliberately-inflicted wound. So the hospital, EMT services, et al. have to absorb the expense (unless you can squeeze it out of someone who already has proven to be less than competent), thus it becomes "public health care" (a/k/a "socialized medicine") - paid for courtesy of our taxes.
It's cheaper to pay the taxes for socialized police services and nip the problem in the bud.
Even M$ shows everyone that yes you cant boot to a legacy desktop but using KB shortcuts you can remove the new desk for the legacy one.
Link?
Why would we ever waste police resources on this kind of person?
Because most of the civilized world has public health care, and it costs less to talk him out of it than it would to fix it after the fact.
Then... convince him to shoot himself in the head. One less psycho would save us all a bundle and not just financially.
Or since you sound like a bleeding heart type (the condescending "civilized world" is so high and mighty of you) who probably thinks we need to keep everyone around at all costs, I have another solution. Just exempt "intentional self-injury" from the health care system. Why should some dumbass who intentionally does stupid things get to burden everyone else? Oh yeah, he shouldn't. See these things are much simpler when you talk them out.
Either way - Problem solved!
Is there any real reason that you can't just use some type of virtualization solution? Seems more practical than having extra machines.
or 'Command Prompt'. I spent more time there than I have in a long time. Things that I didn't know how to do in the new Metro interface I was able to accomplish easily with cmd.exe. Another interesting thing I noticed while looking at an ad was that the Start Screen looks quite a bit like a PowerPoint presentation. Little squares with a clip-art style graphic and text. I didn't really notice it while using it until I saw it in that ad. Once seen though it was like okay, I see how they designed this thing now and why they like it so much. Those marketing guys simply LOVE PowerPoint.
Over the years, I've noticed that manufacturers release WindowsXP drivers that are totally broken. Even when XP was officially still supported, that didn't mean everything would work.
Needless to say, the problem is getting worse. Every time I update my ATI/AMD graphics drivers, I get a BSOD or some other massive problem. The old drivers work just fine with XP, and the new drivers work fine with Win7. Just because XP is still widely used doesn't mean manufacturers will give a damn about it.
But, hey, it could be worse. I could still be using my Mac.
Already waiting for Win9, after MS fails to get the tablet/portable/phone market they threw desktop users under the bus for and comes crawling back to us like they did with Vista/Win7.
Really, there's only one thing I want. Never force me into full screen mode. IS THAT SO F@$#ING HARD?
Yeah, yeah, I know, technically it's not, Ballmer-wise it is.
We'll talk later. Or we won't.
...if you delete twinui.dll. That gets you straight into the desktop (and kills off Metro), but it's not terribly useful as you don't get any taskbar buttons!
This is painting a "Bulls Eye" target right on Microsoft's flagship product. Strategically it will be looked back upon as one of the dumbest moves in history.
I mean look the less functionality in a "logon" page the less risk profile that someone will find a way to compromise it.
Now they're proving an official way to not only Advertise on the Logon page, but to grant those Applets called don't-call-me-metro Apps full control of the operating system. Doesn't anyone see a problem with.. oh wait.. wasn't it "Active Desktop"? In 1995
And they just recommended disabling the Gadgets bar in Vista - same thing again, only not quite as "bad" as this.
Only question is how far it will be avoided by Corporations, or how wide a birth Consumers will give it even if it comes preloaded. It will be worse than Vista, make Millennium Edition look inspired. Actually I think we should start a web clock now to see how fast the first "signed by Microsoft code signing certificates" malware winds up on the "Must logon screen" called don't-call-me-metro style App.
My guess is the app will have some sort of complicated "in app purchase" exception which will bounce the method so far along they don't bother to check the final result, and voila.. a million botnet zombies will be born.
Windows is no exception
95, 98, ME, XP, Vista, 7, WT8
didn't go for the obvious cheap shot with Windows Touch 8.. but will go for the more expensive.. can't touch this
I mean why release a tablet device with a picture of a keyboard and mouse? Duh.. Hello.. Anybody Home?
No Windows 8 is destined to break up the company.
As soon as Office appears on iOS or Android the Windows OS dead.
I just think Windows 8 will fail.
They pretty much have fail built into the business plan.
They have warned on earnings, said the risk is corporations will delay rolling out, that it requires new hardware with touch optimized input.
Its rather strategics like for the Xbox, we plan to eat the costs for as long as we can afford the pain, then we'll do something.
On the consumer side, they've removed Media player, disabled Aero, seem to be targeting a hardware platform that doesn't exist yet.
I think its clear this is a product your not really suppose to take seriously.
Well he said Dev Tools. If that includes debuggers, then they tend to use privileged instructions, for setting watch/breakpoints or messing with MMU settings and that performance can be severely impacted by virtualization. although that can be somewhat reduced depending on the support in the processor. Could be pricey having to give to your developers workstations with moderately recent Xenon CPUs.
Laissez lire, et laissez danser; ces deux amusements ne feront jamais de mal au monde. - Voltaire
I realize you already likely know this, but in case there are any who would prefer something that isn't Unity, you can install one of the other Ubuntu variants. I discovered I rather like XFCE, so Xubuntu is treating me very well.
# from http://xubuntu.org/upgrading/ ...
$ sudo apt-get install xubuntu-desktop
This wont sit well with IT. This is going to be another Win Me...
I'm surprised AOL hasn't sued MS for this http://tekblurb.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/wpid-Photo-2012-05-31-846-PM.jpg
I'm not repeating myself
I'm an X window user; I'm an ex-Windows user
I'm still waiting for Year of the Windows Desktop. They came close in 1993, but then screwed it up in 95, and never recovered.
Get used to it, idiots.
I have been using Windows 8 since the developer preview and am currently using Windows 8 Professional RTM and although the usual shortcut method has been disabled there are various other methods that do still work. Also many of the comments suggest Enterprises won't adopt Windows 8 because of Metro. Are people that Ant-MS that they think companies will forgo Windows 8 just because they have to make 1 additional click to get to the desktop as compared to Windows 7? I call BS.
1) You can boot directly to desktop (including on the RTM) using Start 8 http://www.stardock.com/products/start8/ which is free of charge.
2) You can also boot directly to the desktop (including on the RTM) using 4Desktop http://dm-moinmoin.deviantart.com/art/boot-directly-to-desktop-windows-8-307078343 also free!
3) If you don't want to install or use 3rd party software, simply just boot to Metro as usual and click Desktop, it's not like MS has removed the desktop completely, it's that they have tagged on another explorer for touch based devices and made that the default one. Ideally the thought is 1 OS could run on all devices in the future which if executed properly could create a revolution in the industry. Now this may not be the ideal scenario but to claim that Metro is crap so Windows 8 will fail is ridiculous. The Desktop is still there and can be booted to!
I have been using Windows 8 for a while as I said above and I have even on my own system only seen the Metro UI 3-4 times in the last 3-4 months. I still use Desktop Mode and it definitely performs much faster than Windows 7 and they definitely have updated their screen display code as it's very apparent that the Windows 8 desktop is sharper and smoother than the Windows 7 desktop by far.
Most of the comments on this article seem like they've been posted by Anti-MS Zealots and/or MacOS fanatics and I'm sure most of the comments have been posted by people who have never even used Windows 8 on a daily basis.
I am far from an MS Fanboy, I own an Iphone, Ipad, Sony PS3 and a second Android handset, but lies are simply lies as is unnecessary FUD.
As I see it, software OS'es aren't a normal product. With the anomaly that XP was where it was at for some 8 years, sure Win7 is cute, it seems like a natural option, but the Windows 8 hype is some of the most desperately aggressive I have ever seen, way more than Windows 7. It looks as if it were an attempt to blind rational decision making by screaming "stop thinking and open your wallet and buy this now!"
Except it's a bit like D&D, if Win8 is awesome, why would we buy Win7? The computer world is different from the emerging days of Win95 Win 98 Win 2000 WinXP, when vital new tech was being thrashed out. Comp processing power came of age, so we don't need that hardware upgrade as importantly as we used to. Not counting some potential wear on the HD, I have a 1.75 Terabyte Quad Core system from 2006 that will do anything I ever (currently) need. So the mood is different, these frenetic changes feel wrong. The UI-Formerly-As-Metro really bothers me. I'm not a tablet/phone guy.
This feels like the marketing of the Zune, which shared a lot of "let's get our favorite 12 analysts to pummel the blogosphere with it!" So I am trying to hold on to the "Post Win8 World" and by then we'll have the perspective, but not today.
My first Journal Entry ever, in 8 years! http://slashdot.org/journal/365947/aphelion-scifi-fantasy-horror-poetry-webzine
So much negativity....
I for one welcome our new metro overlord.
People hated the move from command line to GUI
People hated the gui change from windows 3.1 to 95. (Some rusted on 'geeks' continued to use Filemanager over windows explorer for years, even with the shitty 8.3 only support. Long file names? who needs that)
Gamers hated the move from 98 to 2000
People hated the move from 2000 to XP
Vista was a welcome change from primitive XP, but they waited too long to release which allowed too many people to get set in concrete.
etc etc etc
Yawn. guess what, you'll be used to it soon enough and some of you will actually start posting how much you like feature X.
One of the biggest and best things about IT is that is an ever changing environment, one of the whole reasons I got into it in the first place. If you dont like change, then you shouldnt even be on Slashdot posting about this article. you should be reading TheGoodOleDays.com or something.
XFCE on Ubuntu, aka Xubuntu 12.04, provides a nice desktop workflow for this developer.