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CRTC Unveils New Wireless Code To Protect Canadian Customers
FuzzNugget writes "The CRTC has unveiled a code of conduct that brings many positive changes for Canadian wireless customers, most notably:
1.) Carriers must provide the option to unlock a cell phone after 3 months for subsidized phones within the contract period, or immediately if the device was purchased outright.
2.) Contracts are now capped at two years, and cancellation fees are limited to the amount of the subsidy.
3.) Carriers can no longer charge outrageous data overage and international roaming charges. Without explicit consent from the a customer, such charges are capped at $50 and $100 per month, respectively."
1.) Carriers must provide the option to unlock a cell phone after 3 months for subsidized phones within the contract period, or immediately if the device was purchased outright.
2.) Contracts are now capped at two years, and cancellation fees are limited to the amount of the subsidy.
3.) Carriers can no longer charge outrageous data overage and international roaming charges. Without explicit consent from the a customer, such charges are capped at $50 and $100 per month, respectively."
I hope the U.S. follows.
Since the previous contract lengths were generally 3 years, i think that phone costs are going to increase because providers can't guarantee you'll stay as long with them. But I still like the move to cap it at 2 years, because the lifetime of smartphones (if you want to stay semi-relevant) are becoming shorter and shorter.
I am going to predict that this is going to be a devastating blow to their profits. Back when BlockBuster instituted "No Late Fees" I knew they were doomed. Basically they were profiting on bad luck and stupidity of which people are never short. So then BB had to profit from providing a quality service. Doomed!
How many people are suckered into overpaying in all kinds of creative ways. The locked phone for instance must keep many people from switching carriers. So I don't see the big three going bankrupt but I do see their profits taking a bigger hit than even they see coming in that they have probably fooled themselves into thinking that they are making profits in ways other than taking advantage of bad luck and stupidity.
IT IS ABOUT FUCKING TIME.
Rampant corporate misbehavior has so desensitized the public that weak half measures are applauded. The chance your carrier will break into your house, light your dog on fire and crap on your carpet has been somewhat reduced. Rejoice!
Sudden outbreak of common sense, eh?
I'll take your minimum data plan, please.... -sets up wireless hotspot-
Currently though the telco in Brazil is likely charging Rogers/Bell/Telus $1.50 for the $50G of data and Rogers/Bell/Telus turns around to charge the customer $50,000. Joking aside, the code does not say the telco couldn't cut you off after you incur so much roaming fees.
Bell, Telus and Rogers announced a new unlock policy. You now have the option to unlock your smartphone, provided you pay the price of the phone.
I don't believe the code allows for them to charge for unlocks so nope unlock in 3 months voila.
Bell, Telus and Rogers announced that you can now get the iPhone 5S and the Galaxy S5 for $300 on two years, or $10000 outright. That's a subsidy of $9700.
You have the option to cancel anytime, provided that you refund Bell, Telus or Rogers that $9700 subsidy they were so kind to give you in the first place.
I'm pretty sure its apple that sets the unsubsidized price, you know since they're the ones that make the phone and set the actual price they sll it at.
Bell, Telus and Rogers announced new roaming rates of $100/bit. Use 1 bit of data and reach the cap. Service is disabled once you reach the cap.
Bonus: 50% discount on national roaming.
That kind of directly goes against the mandate so seems they'd get in trouble for that.
With the way things are now in the US, it might be a good idea to buy Canadian phone service and "roam" in the US.
Actually, with the actions of T-Mobile lately, it's almost as if they were anticipating this. There are no cancellation fees... no more contracts. If you decide to stop being a T-Mobile customer, you just have to pay for the phone you bought through them if you haven't already.
The roaming and overage charge caps are new though.
If "brazil telecom" charges exhorbitant roaming fees to the canadian carriers and provides no mechanism to cut users off when they reach their roaming limit then the canadian carriers need to either negotiate a better roaming deal with "brazil telecom", or stop enabling roaming to "brazil telecom" by default.
note: i'm known as plugwash most places but i screwd up registering that here somehow in the past and now can't register
They'll just shut off your data roaming once you hit the cap.
This may sound like a stupid question to some...
When going to Europe, I would get a burner phone as it was cheaper than paying roaming/data fees. Since they must now unlock the phone (in my case, an iPhone), does that mean that when I now go to Europe all I need to do is buy a SIM card/service from a local cell provider and stick it in my iPhone and it will work?
It's better to burn out than to fade away
According to TFA on this point:
2. Cap on data roaming charges
i. A service provider must suspend national and international data roaming charges once they reach $100 within a single monthly billing cycle, unless the customer expressly consents to pay additional charges.
ii. A service provider must provide this cap at no charge.
I would hazard a guess that in this case, most telco's would suspend service once you've reached $100 in charges. Either that, or your consent to pay more will be found as part of the conditions in your next contract.
Frink: Nice try floyd, but you were designed for scrubbing, and scrubbing is what you shall do.
"Contracts are now capped at two years"...
(sigh)
My contract is 2 years old next month.
I still have a year to go, and boy do I have grievances.
File under 'M' for 'Manic ranting'
A lot of Americans are complaining about their American telecom service. But aren't American monthly phone and data plans far far better than Canada?!
Canada is way more fucked on the telecom regulatory/monopoly end than the US will ever be...
If the monthly fee for a cell phone costs any more with a phone you've bought outright vs one you are getting as part of a contract plan, don't bother locking yourself in with them at all.
File under 'M' for 'Manic ranting'
I don't believe the code allows for them to charge for unlocks so nope unlock in 3 months voila.
Yes, it does allow them to charge and doesn't place any limitation on that charge.
1. Unlocking
i. A service provider that provides a locked device to the customer as part of a contract must
a. for subsidized devices: unlock the device, or give the customer the means to unlock the device, upon request, at the rate specified by the service provider, no later than 90 calendar days after the contract start date.
upon the advice of my lawyer, i have no sig at this time
There is a cap except if you agree to a higher charge. This just stops them from automatically charging you outrageous fees based on fine print rather than explicit consent.
In your Brazil example, you'd have a teeny cap, then a window would pop up, "From this point on, Brazil charges $700/Gigabyte. Do you accept?"
Dirty Harry: "Well, do ya...punk?"
(-1: Post disagrees with my already-settled worldview) is not a valid mod option.
The CRTC has opted to not make this retroactive to existing contracts, so if you're currently on a contract, you're still screwed until it ends, and you've got to wait out the entire preexisting term and can't use the new 2 year cutout.
upon the advice of my lawyer, i have no sig at this time
The code (http://www.crtc.gc.ca/eng/info_sht/t14.htm, section F.1) says: "A service provider that provides a locked device to the customer as part of a contract must for subsidized devices: unlock the device, or give the customer the means to unlock the device, upon request, at the rate specified by the service provider, no later than 90 calendar days after the contract start date."
So that basically leaves the telcos to charge whatever they want to unlock a device.
International carriers typically don't report for a month or two until after you've travelled, so there's no way to know what the roaming charge will be. The Canadian carrier will have to eat anything over 100 bucks, expect that to be passed onto the customers.
I think roaming should disappear - period. When I am in Europe - my Canadian SIM comes out and my Euro SIM goes in done. Everything is via Data now anyway. I am truly surprised that voice is still built into the phone - mobile companies should be providing SIP services to their customers and then that SIP service can be used from anywhere .. home phone .. overseas .. wherever.
After i was charged for almost $500 from Bell, i said, NO MORE. Now i avoid talking with any canadian, because as you know, no matter what you do (send/receive SMS for example), you will be charged something outrageous.
You are missing the point. If BELL could charge you only $50 max for example, no matter what you do, it means that once you spend more than $50, your service will be frozen, until next billing cycle.
.....expressley....
Which means that it cannot be part of the standard contract. You have to explicitly require, and agree to this new provision....
Canada is way more fucked on the telecom regulatory/monopoly end than the US will ever be...
Fascinating. Perhaps you could expand on that a bit? Verizon had a "special" 700Mhz spectrum LTE that is incompatible with AT&T and Canadian 700Mhz LTE whereas in Canada, the CDMA carriers all switched to HSPA+ back in late 2009 rather than waiting for a CDMA compatible iPhone. So even back in 2009, Canadians could get an iPhone or other HSPA+ smartphone on a choice of several carriers whereas Verizon customers had to have a special CDMA version and then they managed to screw up LTE with compatiblity by having LTE handsets that used CDMA for voice.
Jesus was a compassionate social conservative who called individuals to sin no more.
I'm pretty sure its apple that sets the unsubsidized price, you know since they're the ones that make the phone and set the actual price they sll it at.
Apple sets the price in their Store. The carriers can charge whatever they like in theirs, with or without subsidy.
Only as of now it made no sense to charge more than Apple. With the new code it will.
In fairness to the cellular provider, as a consumer you have a duty to test this yourself before you lock into a contract. Ask your friends, or better yet, get a loaner phone. Also, most providers will let you cancel within the first few days without penalty, at least here in Canada.
2.) Contracts are now capped at two years, and cancellation fees are limited to the amount of the subsidy.
Bell, Telus and Rogers announced that you can now get the iPhone 5S and the Galaxy S5 for $300 on two years, or $10000 outright. That's a subsidy of $9700.
You have the option to cancel anytime, provided that you refund Bell, Telus or Rogers that $9700 subsidy they were so kind to give you in the first place.
They did cover off this dodge, at least:
G->2.->ii) When calculating the early cancellation fee,
a) the value of the device subsidy is the retail price of the device minus the amount that the customer paid for the device when the contract was agreed to; and
b) the retail price of the device is the lesser of the manufacturer’s suggested retail price or the price set for the device when it is purchased from the service provider without a contract.
"I love animals! Some are cute, others are tasty, what's not to like?" - Betsy Schroeder, Jeopardy contestant
Bell wouldn't shut off your plan in general, only roaming. Your basic plan would continue in full force and effect if you were in your home network's coverage area.
Here's their mandate on prepaid cards:
J. Expiration of prepaid cards
1. General
A service provider must keep open the accounts of customers with prepaid cards for at least seven calendar days following the expiration of an activated card, at no charge, to give the customer more time to “top up” their account and retain their prepaid balance.
In my opinion, prepaid phone cards should be considered the same as gift cards: they should never expire, they can only be used up by the customer. They essentially represent a cash transaction, same as a gift card.
The only difference is, there may be some *slight* cost to the provider to keep that phone number active in their system (I can't right now think of what would cost them money, exactly, but there might be). To cover those costs, the provider could be allowed to deduct a very small 'Idle' fee from the prepaid balance for each month that the user does not use their prepaid minutes. I'm talking 50 cents or a dollar per month, something like that. That way, if Grandma wants to have an emergency cell phone, she can buy $50 worth of minutes and use them up over the next three or four years, not worrying about having to try to add minutes to her phone in an emergency because the old card expired...
"I love animals! Some are cute, others are tasty, what's not to like?" - Betsy Schroeder, Jeopardy contestant
Interesting.
But still, nothing stops the carriers from making an arrangement with Samsung so that the "retail price" be $10000 outright or $300 on 2 year.
Other than the carriers, only Apple and Google sell phones in Canada. So the suggested retail price could be anything. If the carriers can get their bloat on the phones, they can surely choose the suggested price too.
My bet: no contract prices will continue to go up.
I can't see where it says that the carriers have to comply with this code under penalty of law...am I missing something?
I can definitely see that being able to claim that your company complies with the Code would be a great advertising feature, but what's to stop them from saying "that's nice" and continuing on with business as usual?
As per the wikipedia article on the CRTC:
Regulation of telephone service
The commission currently has some jurisdiction over the provision of local landline telephone service in Canada. This is largely limited to the major incumbent carriers, such as Bell Canada and Telus, for traditional landline service (but not Voice over Internet Protocol (VoIP)). It has begun the gradual deregulation of such services where, in the commission's opinion, a sufficient level of competition exists.[11]
The CRTC is sometimes blamed for the current state of the mobile phone industry in Canada, in which there are only three national mobile network operators – Bell Mobility, Telus Mobility, and Rogers Wireless – as well as a handful of MVNOs operating on these networks. In fact, the commission has very little to do with the regulation of mobile phone service, outside of "undue preference" issues (for example, a carrier offering a superior rate or service to some subscribers and not others without a good reason). It does not regulate service rates, service quality, or other business practices, and commission approval is not necessary for wireless provider sales or mergers as in the broadcasting industry.[12] Moreover, it does not deal with the availability of spectrum for mobile phone service, which is part of the Industry Canada mandate, nor the maintenance of competition, which is largely the responsibility of The Competition Bureau.
So...they're expanding their mandate?
Hmm...interesting times.
"I love animals! Some are cute, others are tasty, what's not to like?" - Betsy Schroeder, Jeopardy contestant
I read somewhere that the 2-year limit actually applies to existing contracts, too. Might be worth checking out.
So Sasktel has the best coverage by far, but Rogers/Fido/etc. have the better plans for low usage.
I'm actually currently using the 7-11 Speakout plan.
Interesting.
But still, nothing stops the carriers from making an arrangement with Samsung so that the "retail price" be $10000 outright or $300 on 2 year.
Other than the carriers, only Apple and Google sell phones in Canada. So the suggested retail price could be anything. If the carriers can get their bloat on the phones, they can surely choose the suggested price too.
My bet: no contract prices will continue to go up.
I'm quite sure that Samsung would have to answer some hard questions if their MSRP for a device the US were listed at $700, say, but for Canada it's listed at $10,000...no, the bad press alone wouldn't be worth it, to them. They provide hardware, that's it. I'm pretty sure no single carrier is big enough to sway them to alienate their userbase that badly...there's a lot more than just phones at stake, for them, and they have a *lot* invested in appearing to be an economical and high performance choice when compared to, say, Apple (or even Motorola).
"I love animals! Some are cute, others are tasty, what's not to like?" - Betsy Schroeder, Jeopardy contestant
The Canadian government seems to hold near-monopolies in very high favour. The result is always that the customer gets screwed completely. The Telephone industry here is a great example.
"The first time I got drunk, I got married. The second time I bought a chimpanzee, after that I stayed sober" Arian Seid
Oh man, I'd be happy paying $700/GB at this point. A user of ours recently racked up $2000 in peru using less than 75MB.
When calculating the early cancellation fee,
the value of the device subsidy is the retail price of the device minus the amount that the customer paid for the device when the contract was agreed to; and
the retail price of the device is the lesser of the manufacturer’s suggested retail price or the price set for the device when it is purchased from the service provider without a contract.
If the carrier sets the price higher than apples then apples price takes effect, its whoever is lowest.
Ah you're right and it looks like the providers have decided on charges like $35, must be some hella cheap smartphones. Further they must specify that fee in the contract beforehand so its not like they're going to be able to promise you $35 then jack up the fee later, they have to tell you how much it will be then stick to it.
Carriers don't need to unlock phones for free. The policy says "unlock the device, or give the customer the means to unlock the device, upon request, at the rate specified by the service provider"
So all service providers need to do is specify that their unlocking rate is $1000 per device. :(
No the telecommunication monopolies here in Canada aren't here because the government wants them, rather the government needed them (and paid for them) to just get the service. Canada is a very WIDE country, with huge swaths of empty nothing. And we don't have a huge population to make wiring it up all that appealing (or profitable). It's expensive to do anything nationwide in Canada and there aren't a whole lot of local companies with deep enough pockets to pull it off.
What we really need to do is get rid of the Canadian content laws for telecommunication businesses
I've just started discussions on a new phone and provider. I don't understand the contract issues. Started with Rogers and they don't apply any penalty for cancelling a new contract and your only obligation is to pay off the outstanding amount owed on the phone that they subsidized. I assume this could be a "penalty" if they overcharged you for the phone but that cost is clear in the contract. Am I missing something?
Ok for Apple and Nexus devices. But all others don't have a "manufacturer's suggested retail price".
"1.) Carriers must provide the option to unlock a cell phone after 3 months for subsidized phones within the contract period, or immediately if the device was purchased outright."
I am not sure what this will accomplish. It will only give you the option to change, but this doesn't say that it will be financially reasonable.
"2.) Contracts are now capped at two years, and cancellation fees are limited to the amount of the subsidy."
I do believe the "subsidy" just quadrupled and the 2 year contracts now cost as much as 3.
"3.) Carriers can no longer charge outrageous data overage and international roaming charges. Without explicit consent from the a customer, such charges are capped at $50 and $100 per month, respectively."
You will be disconnected within 5min of entering international roaming and owe 100$, same with data fees, but 50$. However it will be nice not to be fearful that you can accidentally bankrupt yourself by some phone app or feature making your have a 20,000$ bill just by traveling outside Canada.
AFAIK Samsung doesn't list MSRP for their canadian phones. So the carrier can effectively decide the "value".
What? since when? where do you think the carriers get their unsubsidized prices from?
They decide themselves. A proof of that is that they don't all have the same prices for a given device.
And we don't even know the price they pay to Samsung or LG.
So the price points samsung announces come from the carriers? Your proof isn't proof, all it is is proof that the manufacturers have a MSRP and not a monopolistic contract demanding the carrier set the price. MSRP is just a suggested retail price.