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Steve Ballmer's Big-Time Error: Not Resigning Years Ago

Nerval's Lobster writes "Any number of executives could take Ballmer's place, including a few he unceremoniously kicked to the curb over the years. Whoever steps into that CEO role, however, faces a much greater challenge than if Ballmer had quietly resigned several years ago. Ballmer famously missed the boat on tablets and smartphones; Windows 8 isn't selling as well as Microsoft expected; and on Websites and blogs such as Mini-Microsoft (which had a brilliant posting about Ballmer's departure), employees complain bitterly about the company's much-maligned stack-ranking system, its layers of bureaucracy, and its inability to innovate. Had Ballmer left years ago, replaced by someone with the ability to more keenly anticipate markets, the company would probably be in much better shape to face its coming challenges. In its current form, Microsoft often feels like it's struggling in the wake of Amazon, Google, Apple, and Facebook." In an interview with ZDNet, Ballmer said his biggest regret as CEO was in how Windows Vista was developed. Opinions are divided on both the nature of his resignation and what it will mean for Microsoft. While the stock price is up, BusinessWeek and others suggest the purpose of the transition is to find somebody better able to anticipate future trends. That would certainly lead to more organizational changes within Microsoft, something employees suffered through just last month. Ben Kuchera at the Penny Arcade Report points out that this could mean Microsoft will try to re-enter markets it has abandoned. He asks the company to "stay the hell away from PC gaming."

357 comments

  1. Vista by bonch · · Score: 4, Insightful

    In an interview with ZDNet, Ballmer said his biggest regret as CEO was in how Windows Vista was developed.

    The aftermath of Vista is precisely when he should have resigned. CEOs of other tech companies have resigned for lesser debacles.

    1. Re:Vista by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      The aftermath of Vista is precisely when he should have resigned.

      I think they could have sold a rock in those Windows boxes and people would still buy it (especially as this rock would come bundled with desktops and laptops). And those who dislike buying a rock instead of software would just wait for "Windows: The Less Crappy Release" as people have with Windows 7

      The bigger concern is with markets where they have competition, i.e. XBox, Tablets, etc.

    2. Re:Vista by ackthpt · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Not so much how it was developed, but that it was released before it was really ready and a log of people were conned into buying Vista Ready PCs which had a crappy inferior Intel chipset unable to fully support. Microsoft knew and still proceeded. I still have the PDF with all the emails.

      --

      A feeling of having made the same mistake before: Deja Foobar
    3. Re:Vista by Man+On+Pink+Corner · · Score: 4, Insightful

      This. Ballmer had one job: don't fuck up Windows.

      He failed at the modest task which was his charge.

    4. Re:Vista by Lumpy · · Score: 0

      And that is another problem. Microsoft has become Intel Whores and set the "requirements" so low that if you buy the lower end hardware for that OS you end up with a pile of crap. They need to tell intel to shove it in their arse and say that Windows 8 requires quad i5 or higher.

      --
      Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.
    5. Re:Vista by ackthpt · · Score: 4, Funny

      This. Ballmer had one job: don't fuck up Windows.

      He failed at the modest task which was his charge.

      Ballmer could have been in a coma and done better.

      --

      A feeling of having made the same mistake before: Deja Foobar
    6. Re:Vista by roc97007 · · Score: 2

      This. Ballmer had one job: don't fuck up Windows.

      He failed at the modest task which was his charge.

      Twice.

      --
      Oliver's law of assumed responsibility: If you're seen fixing it, you will be blamed for breaking it.
    7. Re:Vista by yuhong · · Score: 0

      On the technical reasons, I wrote before that "the big difference between plain D3D9 with XPDM and D3D9Ex with WDDM BTW is that WDDM allows multiple apps to use the GPU at the same time. With XPDM, if another app tried to use the GPU, the other app would receive a lost device error on the next DirectX call. The missing "hardware scheduler" in the i915 probably refers to the hardware needed for this."

    8. Re:Vista by ackthpt · · Score: 1

      This. Ballmer had one job: don't fuck up Windows.

      He failed at the modest task which was his charge.

      Twice.

      What's the rule? Every other version of Windows you should avoid?

      --

      A feeling of having made the same mistake before: Deja Foobar
    9. Re:Vista by spire3661 · · Score: 3, Informative

      Just no. Intel's cheapest x86 chip is the Celeron 1610. It is unbelievably powerful for its cost and TDP and runs Win 8 perfectly. I have it in several DVRs recording 4 HD channels per. It even compresses to mp4 at about double realtime(takes 1 hour to compress a 2 hour movie). You would do better by mandating SSDs for Win 8 than forcing an i5.

      --
      Good-bye
    10. Re:Vista by Jane+Q.+Public · · Score: 3, Interesting
      Just no. Hints:

      * This conversation was about PAST tech. Not today.

      *Your DVRs don't just have Celerons, they ALSO have support chips and GPUs, which are likely doing almost all of the work.

      "You would do better by mandating SSDs for Win 8 than forcing an i5."

      True enough as far as it goes. But you'd do FAR better by just mandating Linux instead.

    11. Re:Vista by spire3661 · · Score: 1

      Its a CPU/GPU combo chip and cost $35, retail. Video compression is all on CPU, Celerons dont have Quick Sync. I was refuting the OP's claim that Win 8 needs an i5 minimum.

      --
      Good-bye
    12. Re:Vista by Jane+Q.+Public · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Ballmer simply didn't have the proper vision.

      His (going up) career was always following visionaries who DID have the vision, while he handled the nuts and bolts of business.

      His (going down) career mistake was in thinking he could handle the vision part. That was pretty obviously "NO" from the start. His SECOND biggest mistake was in failing to snare someone else who did have it, to run new product development.

      Let's face it. Gates was a greedy, selfish, often dishonest businessman. But he had vision that Ballmer does not.

    13. Re: Vista by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      i have a few 5300 dual cores running windows 7 and windows 8 and centos.
      i am pretty sure you are clueless.
      ssd's combined with terrabyte drives have pretty much doubled the life of a lot of pc's. it back to power savings. i just don't spend two days compiling kernels like i used to.

    14. Re:Vista by Jane+Q.+Public · · Score: 1

      If you say so. I didn't locate a Celeron with embedded GPU when I looked before replying, but I will take your word that is what it is.

    15. Re:Vista by dbIII · · Score: 3, Insightful

      CEOs of other tech companies have resigned for lesser debacles

      Jobs was kicked out just because the Mac sales were initially a bit slower than expected. I've got no idea what they expected because schools and universities seemed to fill up with those early Macs pretty quickly.
      Meanwhile Balmer has been spending years trying to prove that MS is too big to fail by destructive testing.

    16. Re:Vista by spire3661 · · Score: 3, Informative

      No need to take my word when citation is so easy.

      http://ark.intel.com/products/71072/Intel-Celeron-Processor-G1610-2M-Cache-2_60-GHz

      Its not on the spec sheet, but it has a 6 EU (execution Unit) Intel GPU, roughly equal to Intel HD2500. Not spectacular, but i played Bioshock:Infinite on it at 720p/low and got 33 fps in the benchmark.

      --
      Good-bye
    17. Re:Vista by Jane+Q.+Public · · Score: 1

      Cool. I just didn't know you could get Celerons with embedded GPU. I did look, but not at any length.

      Having the right hardware can make a big difference. I remember a few years ago when I dual-booted my MacBook Pro into Windows and was getting 64 fps in EQ II, when my hardcore-gaming brother-in-law was only getting a bit over 30 on his "gaming" PC.

    18. Re:Vista by i.r.id10t · · Score: 1

      A lot of those were donated

      --
      Don't blame me, I voted for Kodos
    19. Re:Vista by ackthpt · · Score: 2

      A lot of those were donated

      What rubbish is this? Apple's educational pricing set the standard for others to follow. The logic was get these into schools where students will learn on them and they will expect to use the same systems when out in the real world.

      --

      A feeling of having made the same mistake before: Deja Foobar
    20. Re:Vista by ackthpt · · Score: 2

      On the technical reasons, I wrote before that "the big difference between plain D3D9 with XPDM and D3D9Ex with WDDM BTW is that WDDM allows multiple apps to use the GPU at the same time. With XPDM, if another app tried to use the GPU, the other app would receive a lost device error on the next DirectX call. The missing "hardware scheduler" in the i915 probably refers to the hardware needed for this."

      +1 Informative!

      You got it, it wasn't about the CPU, but the 915 chipsets which Intel was still trying to clear from inventory, or they'd eat them as they came back from OEMs

      --

      A feeling of having made the same mistake before: Deja Foobar
    21. Re:Vista by cusco · · Score: 1

      He also had organizational and management skills that Ballmer doesn't. Under the latter the corporate bureaucracy has exploded with multiple new layers of utterly useless management. Programmers should make up the bulk of staff in a programming company, not managers. And where did Ballmer get enough coke to make him think that their employee review system was a good idea?

      --
      "Think about how stupid the average person is. Now, realise that half of them are dumber than that." - George Carlin
    22. Re:Vista by hambone142 · · Score: 1

      Ballmer had a second chance to correct the "Vista problem". His "solution": Windows 8 Yesterday Hewlett-Packard commented that the lack of interest in Windows 8 effected their revenue on PCs FWIW. Whether it did or did not, it remains a piece of excrement, similar to the Vista introduction.

    23. Re:Vista by real-modo · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Where did you get the curious notion that Microsoft is a programming company?

      Skype, Exchange, SQL Server, MS-DOS, Dynamics, Sharepoint... Good software and bad, Microsoft bought it. It doesn't know how to make mass-market software. The partial exceptions are Word and Excel, and the Windows NT OSes. With NT, Microsoft tried to learn how to make an OS via their JV with IBM on OS/2. History suggests that Microsoft's learning was...less than thorough.

      Microsoft is better characterised as an IP licensing company which does some software development (and, under Ballmer, hardware development) as a promotional activity.

      I totally agree about their employee review system, though. The flaws in that ought to be obvious to any non-autistic person, sociopath or not.

    24. Re:Vista by hairyfeet · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Really? Vista was at least fixable and a LOT of its problems came down to Ballmer kissing Intel's behind and allowing the "Vista capable" bullshit to let Intel unload that warehouse of 9xx garbage chipsets they had piled up.

      For me it would have been when Zune shit browned all over the stage and playsforsure was killed for Zune market which promptly puked and died. Playsforsure was frankly growing like fricking mad since it gave users an alternative, instead of having to buy every single song they could have "all you can eat" for a low monthly fee, think about how MSFT could have used that to become Netflix before that company was even a thought, but nope! Ballmer shut down a fricking GROWING market so he could rip off iTunes BADLY. Right then he ass should have been punt kicked like a 30 yard field return.

      The truly sad part? We could debate this all damned day as there is so many "WTF is he doing? Is he on crack?" moments under Ballmer that any CEO that wasn't Bill's little buddy would have gotten a pink slip any time between a decade ago and now, letting Vista get shoved out the door so poorly finished, X360 RRoD, the piles of money wasted on Zune,Kin,Sidekick,buying Yahoo Search and that ad company they had to take a multi-billion dollar write off on, BEING TOLD FOR A FUCKING YEAR THAT WIN 8 IS GARBAGE BY EVERYONE THAT TRIED IT yet not only ignoring that and putting out a half assed product he honestly thought would compete with iOS and Android but blowing several billion trying to sell that turd with ads....fuck I could go on all damned day.

      It has been obvious since the days of the shit brown squirting Zune if not earlier that he lives in a bubble surrounded by yes men. Frankly the only real hope MSFT has now is that they get an actual engineer with a fucking brain that actually uses the products for other than tweeting twits for shits, because if God help us that Larson girl that was responsible for Win 8 and the charms fuckbar gets the big chair? Might as well close it down and give the money back to the shareholders, its done. I mean when I saw server 2K12 and saw the AOL 96...err I mean Metro UI slapped on A SERVER OS!!?? I knew that the marketing droids were running the shop, any engineer that had actually used a server OS would have said "Wow that is fucking retarded!" and been done with it, the fact that they didn't just shows why Ballmer should have been canned ages ago.

      BTW is it just me or am I picking up a the board fired my ass vibe in his letter? The way he talks about when he would have rather stepped down certainly sounds like he isn't stepping down by choice. To me it sounds like the board took a look at the figures, saw Win 8.1 getting roasted over the fire like Win 8, and said "either you retire or we fire your ass, pick one" and he tried to save face while letting the insiders know he isn't happy about it. If that is the case? I'll be happy to buy the board a beer, its about damned time!

      --
      ACs don't waste your time replying, your posts are never seen by me.
    25. Re:Vista by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      On the technical reasons, I wrote before that "the big difference between plain D3D9 with XPDM and D3D9Ex with WDDM BTW is that WDDM allows multiple apps to use the GPU at the same time. With XPDM, if another app tried to use the GPU, the other app would receive a lost device error on the next DirectX call. The missing "hardware scheduler" in the i915 probably refers to the hardware needed for this."

      There is no "hardware scheduler", there's a software scheduler.

      In XPDM, the whole video driver sits inside the kernel and does basically whatever the hell it wants with only a little help from Microsoft's DX broker that converts user space D3D calls into a direct function call against the driver.

      In WDDM, the video driver is split into 2 pieces. One piece is the minidriver that runs in the kernel underneath the thumb of a massive controller written by Microsoft that takes care of everything and simply feeds a stream of "draw X", "load shader bytecodes Y", "flip buffer to screen" into the minidriver. The main driver that does all the smart stuff is a DLL that runs in user space and communicates indirectly with the kernel mini-driver via a broker.

      The scheduler you mentioned is written in software and is part of Microsoft's code. The user driver feeds command streams into the kernel and Microsoft's code switches between command streams using a scheduling algorithm. The problem with i915 is that WDDM drivers are required to fully implement the D3D9Ex feature set (which includes Shader Model 3) at a minimum, which the hardware simply did not support (it only had Shader Model 2 and was damn slow as well [i915 relied on software/CPU emulation of part of the GPU pipeline]).

    26. Re:Vista by yuhong · · Score: 1

      Shader Model 3.0 is not required for WDDM.

    27. Re:Vista by LinuxIsGarbage · · Score: 2

      +1 Informative!

      You got it, it wasn't about the CPU, but the 915 chipsets which Intel was still trying to clear from inventory, or they'd eat them as they came back from OEMs

      And I think they still had a ton of inventory. i910 was released in late 2004, "Vista Capable" bondoggle started in 2005 and came to a head with the release of Vista in early 2007 as consumers realized Intel had sold them a dud chipset.

      Yet sales of i915 continued. In Q4 2007 EeePC and classmate were released, with a Celeron-M coupled with an i915. These were on the market until at least mid-2009, though they had other Celeron-M models as well.

    28. Re:Vista by trparky · · Score: 1

      How many times have people AND the computer OEMs told Microsoft that Windows 8 and the ModernUI is absolute trash? Multiple times. You'd have to have been completely brain dead to not hear the complaints about it! But no, Ballmer must have had his fingers surgically implanted in his ears for the shouting over MetroUI was very loud yet he couldn't hear it. And now, here comes along Windows 8.1 and we have more MetroUI bullshit shoved down our throats.

      GET IT THROUGH YOUR FUCKING HEADS MICROSOFT! METROUI IS FUCKING GARBAGE! GET RID OF IT!

    29. Re:Vista by datavirtue · · Score: 1

      I run Windows 8 on a Core 2 Duo 2.00GHz Lenovo Thinkpad with 2GB of RAM and it smokes Vista and XP. It also performs better than my brand new Dell Latitude i3 2.4GHz with Windows 7 Pro.

      --
      I object to power without constructive purpose. --Spock
    30. Re:Vista by smash · · Score: 1

      Vista was actually fine if you had half recent hardware of a sane spec to install it on. The BIG issue with vista was the marketing clusterfuck and lack of driver support. But hey, i went through the lack of driver support for a while with Windows 2000 Professional. The OS itself was pretty solid. The fact that Windows 7 and 8 are mostly vista at their core is testament to that.

      --
      I run: Windows, OS X, Linux, FreeBSD. Just because you have a hammer, doesn't mean everything is a nail.
    31. Re:Vista by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Amelio and Spindler spring to mind.

    32. Re:Vista by hairyfeet · · Score: 1

      Sorry but you are wrong, you just got lucky on the hardware is all. I HAD to deal with it on dozens of systems and I can tell you that unless you got REAL lucky on the hardware (like WinME on that fact) you were in for a WORLD OF PAIN from Vista.

      I mean here is the specs for my own personal PC at that time which in 2007 wasn't bleeding edge but sure as hell wasn't a slouch, 3.6GHz P4 with HT, 4Gb of RAM, dual 400GB HDDs, one of which Vista killed by thrashing BTW, and first a GeForce 7600GS and then when everyone blamed the shitty performance on Nvidia drivers I switched to an X1650 PRO and it was STILL deep fried ass. It would have "senior moments" where it would just hang for several seconds, sometimes when it wasn't even running anything, and no it was NOT the hardware as I had an XP X64 set up in dual boot and it ran great. It would lose network shares and refuse to see them without a reboot, the network would slow to a crawl during file transfers for no damned reason i could ever find, it was just a hot mess.

      And I'm sorry but you are wrong, not only does Windows 7 use a NEW CORE that has had serious tweaking but unlike Vista its memory management wasn't broken, it didn't have senior moments, its just a great OS. win 8 sadly is Vista to the bone, you wouldn't believe how many times I've been paid to do a refresh my PC because Win 8 shits itself over time. Oh and as for Win2K? You must have not known where to look as I had 2K from RTM until the release of XP X64 (skipped XP, never cared for it) and I didn't have a bit of trouble with drivers. I'd say it would be in the top 3 best OSes by MSFT, right up there with Win 7 and XP X64.

      --
      ACs don't waste your time replying, your posts are never seen by me.
    33. Re:Vista by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Vista was actually fine if you had half recent hardware of a sane spec to install it on.

      The people who had to lay out for all new peripherals might disagree with you. And the Vista ready computers, you know - the ones that almost didn't work? I got to work with systems that had both of those problems at the same time. NO, There isn't much of anything "actually fine" about Vista

      There are no apolgetics allowed any more. Vista was a shithouse fire, and Windows 8 is yet another. Just like in Vista, I'm spending a couple hours a day trying to figure out how to make it work as one thing after another breaks. The W8 patch cycle promises to break people's computers as often as their old updates did.

    34. Re:Vista by hairyfeet · · Score: 1

      See my post above AC, after using every hack and trick on the net Vista STILL thrashed a new HDD to death, and its "senior moments" caused countless failed burns and network transfer failures. Honestly I hadn't seen THAT much bullshit with a MSFT OS since WinME and when you compared it to the rock solid stable XP X64? No comparison, Vista was a flaming pile of shit. It got to the point when somebody with Vista walked into my shop I automatically said "my condolences" because I KNEW that their problems were all traced back to Vista and sure enough, put on XP and tada! The system ran fine.

      As for how to fix Win 8? Use Start8 and combine it with "disable charms registry" and if its a laptop grab the generic synaptics touchpad driver (any other touchpad and you are fucked, just disable it and use a wireless mouse) because the generic driver has an option to disable ALL swipe gestures, otherwise even after start8 and the reg hack if you move your touchpad too quickly you'll have your work interrupted by that damned "charms" bar. Yeah about as charming as a punch to the scrotum.

      --
      ACs don't waste your time replying, your posts are never seen by me.
    35. Re:Vista by Zoromo · · Score: 3, Informative
      Another just no. You are continually referring to a current CPU released in 2013. Which has no relevance whatsoever to the point the poster above you are replying to makes:

      Not so much how it was developed, but that it was released before it was really ready and a log of people were conned into buying Vista Ready PCs which had a crappy inferior Intel chipset unable to fully support. Microsoft knew and still proceeded. I still have the PDF with all the emails.

      Vista was released on Jan. 30/2007. Intel at that time had CPUs available and released with integrated graphics tech that could not actually handle the video performance needed for fully running the versions of Vista installed on them. Despite the fact PCs were sold with those CPUs and came with the "Vista Capable PC" label. That's the problem.

    36. Re:Vista by davidbrit2 · · Score: 1

      I don't fully disagree with you, but I don't think it's fair to lump SQL Server in there. They've done so much development on it that it has almost nothing in common with Sybase anymore, save for a few object names.

    37. Re:Vista by Shirley+Marquez · · Score: 1

      He was refuting the reply that said that Microsoft should specify an i5 as the minimum system requirement for Windows, not the original post.

    38. Re:Vista by DickBreath · · Score: 1

      > Jobs was kicked out just because the Mac sales were initially a bit slower than expected.

      Uh, No.

      As I seem to remember it, Jobs was holding back the Mac. He insisted that the Mac never have everything that the Mac II was. No slots. No color. No external monitor. No large memory..

      In Steve Jobs world the computer, monitor and floppy drive must be a single appliance like component.

      That idea didn't make economic sense then, and it doesn't make economic sense now. That computer becomes obsolete quite fast. But once it is, there is still a lot of economic value left in the other integrated components (monitor, floppy/CD drives, etc).

      These are the reasons Steve Jobs was let go. He was too stubborn. It is ironic that his NeXT computer was everything that he denied to the Mac.

      --

      I'll see your senator, and I'll raise you two judges.
    39. Re:Vista by McKing · · Score: 1

      Windows 8 actually isn't that bad. If you knew me in person, you would be totally suprised. I've been a big Linux user and anti-MS person for years. Had to use Windows 7 for the last few years at work, and for the last few months have used Windows 8 as my primary workstation. To me it seems like (other than the Metro start page) Windows 7 with a few cleaned up features like the new Task Manager. The amount of time I spend using any of the Metro UI: less than 1%. I don't even notice it any more, since I just hit the Windows key and type the name of the app I am looking for. I mostly spend my time in Remote Desktop into various 2008 and 2012 servers.

      I use the same apps I always have (RDP, Outlook, Office, etc..) and I really don't see what the big deal is that the Start menu is now a Start page. To me it seems like they stole the Start page idea from Gnome 3.

      --
      If only "common" sense was actually that common...
    40. Re:Vista by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Dude, first of all, if I had a company, I would hire you. You would fit in perfect with my group it is exactly what we have been saying since seeing Win 8 the Fucked version; damn near verbatim, squirts & all. Unfortunately, we do have a few green behind the ears admins here who actually installed that piece of fuckWare Server 2012. I can't wait for that ass clown decision to squirt brown matter all over their careers. "Oh wait MR Ceo, I'll have that serverService up & running as soon as I can make my way through this fuckWare charmBar interface"... God damn assholes.

    41. Re:Vista by Life2Death · · Score: 1

      AC you remind of a a fellow I knew who, as I last heard, was working on the Video stuff at Crapple and didnt like music...Adger is that you?

    42. Re:Vista by Life2Death · · Score: 1

      Actually Microsoft purchased the people who did any of the development awesomeness like Word or Excel.
      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_Word

      Lets not forget Hyper-V and other fun things.

      I am not sure but the only thing Microsoft really came up with was Windows 95's GUI, which they didnt license or buy, but stole. Some netcode was even from BSD.

    43. Re:Vista by kaatochacha · · Score: 1

      I dunno. I'm still running vista on a 6GB RAM old Gateway, with a quad core AMD processor, I can't remember precisely which one.
      I've never had any serious issues with it.
      I may have lucked out on the hardware working correctly, and I know for the time 6 GB was pretty heavy, but still.

    44. Re:Vista by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You're both wrong. Jobs was pushed out because he began butting heads with John Sculley, Apple's CEO. The reason Jobs wasn't CEO to begin with was simply that despite being a cofounder and clearly a very important person for Apple's future, early investors and/or Apple's board felt that Apple needed professional, experienced management which a kid in his early 20s simply could not provide. They even got Jobs to agree and go along with that. By all accounts I've read, Jobs was a major part of the process of hiring Sculley, and worked well with him for a while. But eventually Jobs began to feel like he was ready to take over, pushed for more control, and lost the ensuing power struggle. When you lose that kind of fight, the company's board of directors shunts you off to a powerless, responsibility-free position so you can no longer challenge the winner. And if you're someone like Jobs, you respond to that by resigning and creating a new company (NeXT).

      The "Steve lost his job over slots" meme is just a self-serving folk story which exists only to reinforce geek narratives about what does and does not make a good computer. See, even Steve Jobs lost his job over this!!!

  2. $20B the value of Steve Ballmer leaving by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Ballmer resigned. Stock went up 7.29% in a big jump of about $20B in value.

    So Microsoft without Steve Ballmer is worth $20B more than a Microsoft with Steve Ballmer.
    That is the legacy of a great man.

    Steve Ballmer the -$20B man.

    1. Re:$20B the value of Steve Ballmer leaving by methano · · Score: 4, Insightful

      But at the same time, Steve Ballmer without Microsoft is worth more than Steve Ballmer with Microsoft. And that makes his decision a good one for him, financially.

    2. Re:$20B the value of Steve Ballmer leaving by BitZtream · · Score: 0, Troll

      Only if you're a moron.

      Change is why the stock jumped, not because of the man involved.

      Microsoft is declining, almost any change in management will spark a stock jump as people become hopeful that a new person my have insight to stop the decline and return to a growth period.

      Blaming the price jump on Ballmer specifically just shows you have absolutely no understanding of people playing the stock market.

      --
      Persistent Volume manager for Kubernetes - https://github.com/dwimsey/openshift-pvmanager
    3. Re:$20B the value of Steve Ballmer leaving by BasilBrush · · Score: 3, Informative

      Just because you disagree with his opinion doesn't mean that you can speak for "the people playing the stock market". All of which have their own set of opinions that are not the same as yours.

      I suggest that far more investors than you imagine know who the CEO of Microsoft is, and blame him in particular for it's disappointing performance. But that's just my opinion.

    4. Re:$20B the value of Steve Ballmer leaving by mrscorpio · · Score: 2

      How did the stock due after Gates left? And Jobs at Apple?

    5. Re:$20B the value of Steve Ballmer leaving by Jeng · · Score: 4, Insightful

      So what you are saying is that if Ballmer was an awesome CEO who made good decisions that the stock price still would have jumped as much as it did?

      --
      Don't know something? Look it up. Still don't know? Then ask.
    6. Re:$20B the value of Steve Ballmer leaving by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You're the moron. Not all change is good. If you're good for the company and you leave, the company's stock will drop.

      They haven't even announced his replacement, and yet it drops. Go figure.

    7. Re:$20B the value of Steve Ballmer leaving by methano · · Score: 1

      Your comment is an odd one. Are you saying that the change in stock price was unrelated to Ballmer's resignation?

    8. Re:$20B the value of Steve Ballmer leaving by SerpentMage · · Score: 4, Insightful

      actually you are the moron. I actually trade the market and know the market. When change happens the market does not always react the way that it does. Often if the CEO leaves in this manner the stock DROPS! The stock market does not like change in a winning company. The reason why Microsoft went up is because Microsoft is a value trap and the stock market has determined that Ballmer is indeed a dud! In fact look at the stock price during Ballmer's reign, its neither up nor down. It just sucks. Thus the GP is right.

      --

      "You can't make a race horse of a pig"
      "No," said Samuel, "but you can make very fast pig"
    9. Re:$20B the value of Steve Ballmer leaving by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      do the same calcuation for AAPL stock after Steve Jobs' departure and you'll see how much he was (is) worth...

    10. Re:$20B the value of Steve Ballmer leaving by FacePlant · · Score: 1

      I'm not so certain that the market is as rational as you give it credit for being.

      --
      My Heart Is A Flower
    11. Re:$20B the value of Steve Ballmer leaving by nnnnnnn · · Score: 1

      Who is to say the guy replacing him is any better? Look at Steve Jobs' replacement, a supply chain guy. As if Apple was successful because of their supply chain. If that were the case, Walmart would have been the top mp3 player/phone/tablet maker a long time ago.

    12. Re:$20B the value of Steve Ballmer leaving by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      AAPL stock is up about $100 since he croaked and they now pay a respectable 2.5% dividend so I don't know what you're trying to say...

    13. Re:$20B the value of Steve Ballmer leaving by thegarbz · · Score: 1

      Any change is a good change? So I suppose that Apple's stock wiped $10bn off the company's value the day that Steve Jobs resigned is also unrelated.

      almost any change in management will spark a stock jump as people become hopeful that a new person my have insight to stop the decline and return to a growth period

      Oh right sorry you were actually agreeing with the GP then. Balmer = bad, Balmer resigning = good, stock = going up, and the company as a direct result is more valuable without him. So are you one of those "morons" too?

    14. Re:$20B the value of Steve Ballmer leaving by khallow · · Score: 0

      When change happens the market does not always react the way that it did.

      FIFY. I know most of us are used to the perfect grammer and sintax of the vast majority of Slashdot postings, but sometimes the unwashed masses manage to sneak pst the gatehouse.

    15. Re:$20B the value of Steve Ballmer leaving by I'm+New+Around+Here · · Score: 2, Funny

      When change happens the market does not always react the way that it did.

      FIFY. I know most of us are used to the perfect grammer and sintax of the vast majority of Slashdot postings, but sometimes the unwashed masses manage to sneak pst the gatehouse.

      Why do you have to bring Outlook into this conversation? What did Outlook ever do to you, anyway?

      --
      If you think I voted for Trump because of this post, you're wrong. I voted for Dr. Jill Stein of the Green Party. Again.
    16. Re:$20B the value of Steve Ballmer leaving by oztiks · · Score: 1

      Why not? FaceBook reporting nothing profits causes the company to be worth close to $100bn. A lot of what the market reflects is flavours of the month, FaceBook's potential is realised to be possible even if by a small margin so every man and their dog pours their superannuation into a company that has a fraction of the asset base of say Google but expects it to be bigger within 5 years.

      Microsoft stating that Balmer is going to leave will drive profits even further. Depending on how the news will spin it. Don't forget MSFT lost about 11% last quarter so some of that can just be reclaimed losses after the Surface "brainfart" that took place.

    17. Re:$20B the value of Steve Ballmer leaving by ChrisMaple · · Score: 1

      Fatty meat isn't worth a whole lot. Maybe $2 per pound.

      --
      Contribute to civilization: ari.aynrand.org/donate
    18. Re:$20B the value of Steve Ballmer leaving by Known+Nutter · · Score: 1

      Then cut the figure in half to correct for market insanity.

      Ballmer is the -$10b man. Still one hell of a legacy, no?

      --
      Beware of the Leopard.
    19. Re:$20B the value of Steve Ballmer leaving by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      He used Office365.

    20. Re:$20B the value of Steve Ballmer leaving by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      That's because you're a nincompoop.

    21. Re:$20B the value of Steve Ballmer leaving by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Assuming you ignore all the decisions he made when MS was a company of roughly 5 people.

      Morons abound here on slashdot.

    22. Re:$20B the value of Steve Ballmer leaving by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      And so, Ballmer waves one final goodbye to all of his fans.

      (Yeah, well; so I did it in MSPaint. It just would have been immoral to have done it in Photoshop.)

    23. Re:$20B the value of Steve Ballmer leaving by khallow · · Score: 1

      You missed "grammar". And it should be "Your a moron".

    24. Re:$20B the value of Steve Ballmer leaving by khallow · · Score: 2

      What did Outlook ever do to you, anyway?

      It got onto my work PC desktop. Every time I read email, I stick another pin in the Outlook doll.

    25. Re:$20B the value of Steve Ballmer leaving by I'm+New+Around+Here · · Score: 1

      Ahh. Touché.

      --
      If you think I voted for Trump because of this post, you're wrong. I voted for Dr. Jill Stein of the Green Party. Again.
    26. Re:$20B the value of Steve Ballmer leaving by smash · · Score: 1

      Actually a large part of why apple is profitable is due to their supply chain. Yes, it's boring non-sexy shiny stuff, but there's a reason apple offer very limited customization and it is largely due to getting economy of scale so they can increase their margins.

      --
      I run: Windows, OS X, Linux, FreeBSD. Just because you have a hammer, doesn't mean everything is a nail.
    27. Re:$20B the value of Steve Ballmer leaving by Dracos · · Score: 1

      What did Outlook ever do to you, anyway?

      Nothing to me, as I've managed to completely avoid using it. That is, until I began implementing parts of the iCalendar and vCard RFCs. Outlook's support for these standards is per capita worse than HTML support in any version of IE. In a month I had managed to implement better recurrence rule support than Outlook ever had.

    28. Re:$20B the value of Steve Ballmer leaving by vakuona · · Score: 1

      And this was the brilliance of Steve Jobs. He could handle the egos (it helped that he had the biggest one). He could handle warring parties within Apple. Very few execs left when he was in charge. The most important ones I can think of who left were Fadell, Rubinstein and Johnson. In reality Fadell and Rubinstein's jobs were done by the time they left (the iPod could as well have been on autopilot) and Ron Johnson was just a marketing guy. Apple products sell themselves.

      Tim Cook makes sense. He comes across as even keeled, and as a supply chain guy, he is rather less interested in specific bits of the kingdom unlike, say, a Scott Forstall. Steve Jobs was a once in a lifetime kind of person, and it would be difficult to find someone potentially as abrasive who would command the respect he needed at Apple to implement a new vision. Tim Cook is doing fine. Anyone other than Jobs was going to be a downgrade.

    29. Re:$20B the value of Steve Ballmer leaving by Life2Death · · Score: 1

      Actually their Android Hisense Wal-Mart only tablets are cheaper and comparable to the best of breed that Google can bring to the market, and they sell both profiting off of themselves and others. Win for them!

    30. Re:$20B the value of Steve Ballmer leaving by jkonrath · · Score: 1

      MSFT stock went from 56.125 on 1/14/00 (the day Ballmer took charge) to 49.125 on 1/28/00, and has not broken the 40s since then.

      AAPL was at 381.82 the week (9/30/11) before Jobs' death ( on 10/5/11) and went as low as 369.80 two days after his death, before jumping back up to 422.00 by 10/14/11. Aside from the 11/25/11 363.57 price, it has remained above the price it was at his death since then.

  3. Gotta get RMS as CEO by smittyoneeach · · Score: 4, Funny

    Which 'splodes first: RMS, or MS?

    --
    Get thee glass eyes, and, like a scurvy politician, seem to see things thou dost not.--King Lear
    1. Re:Gotta get RMS as CEO by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Can't spell RMS without MS.

    2. Re:Gotta get RMS as CEO by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      That would be GNU/M$, thank you.

  4. Amazon/Facebook? by cod3r_ · · Score: 2

    What challenges do those companies pose for MS?

    1. Re:Amazon/Facebook? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Nerval's Lobster is full of shit as usual.

    2. Re:Amazon/Facebook? by vux984 · · Score: 2

      amazon is easy: cloud computing, cloud storage etc. Microsoft's Azure stuff has lot less mind share, and is generally behind.

      facebook? I dunno... ownership of the account. Most heavily used Single-signon gateway. (Surprised gmail and hotmail/outlook didn't get there first... microsoft tried 'passport' years ago after all. Or maybe Facebook as more valuable web portal or competitor for advertising?

      Personally I just wish Facebook would get myspaced and the sooner the better, or better still for 'social networking' sites as a category to just burn itself out.

      xkcd pretty much nailed it:
      http://xkcd.com/1239/

    3. Re:Amazon/Facebook? by jon3k · · Score: 1

      I'd say two areas: tablets and cloud computing.

    4. Re:Amazon/Facebook? by Anarchduke · · Score: 1

      Funny, I've recently started using myspace again. It has transformed itself into a place for content producers and things seem to be going well for it.

      --
      who prays for Satan? Who in 18 centuries has had the humanity to pray for the 1 sinner that needed it most? ~Mark Twain
    5. Re:Amazon/Facebook? by vux984 · · Score: 2

      Precisely. Its useful to some people, like any other website -- including slashdot.

      But every brand under the sun isn't begging me to "like", it and idiots i barely know aren't asking me why i don't have an account because they want to spam me with their life. Its not getting integrated into apps and games.

    6. Re:Amazon/Facebook? by smash · · Score: 2

      Facebook is becoming a platform. Games are made for it, people use it to chat, send messages, etc. So long as a device runs facebook, there's a massive market there for it, whether it runs windows, linux or whatever. Microsoft don't want that - they want people to use services dependent on windows.

      --
      I run: Windows, OS X, Linux, FreeBSD. Just because you have a hammer, doesn't mean everything is a nail.
  5. "Stay away from PC Gaming" Really? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    The only reason I run Windows at home at all for is gaming, Stevesie is clearly trippin'

    Maybe they should take him to that "farm" out in the country where he can "roam free" with other useless CEOs a little sooner?

    1. Re:"Stay away from PC Gaming" Really? by maxwell+demon · · Score: 1

      What he probably means is that Microsoft should not try to produce its own PC games.

      --
      The Tao of math: The numbers you can count are not the real numbers.
    2. Re:"Stay away from PC Gaming" Really? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      So... he did one thing right at least. Windows 8 is better than people think, the same as was Vista, W7 is built in the grounds of Vista. The new Metro UI is a game changer for Windows and even with 8.1 it isn't still finnished, it's huge project for a huge market, probably with 8.2 or W9 will start thinking about Metro UI the same as with W7 vs Vista.

    3. Re:"Stay away from PC Gaming" Really? by MightyMartian · · Score: 5, Insightful

      My prediction is that by Windows 9, Metro will be an optional (and thus ultimately destined to be scrapped) feature.

      --
      The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
    4. Re:"Stay away from PC Gaming" Really? by bazorg · · Score: 1

      Please do keep your slashdot username active. I will be in touch 5 years from now to check on this.

    5. Re:"Stay away from PC Gaming" Really? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Slashdot basement dwellers tend to vastly overemphasize the importance of PC gaming. The entire PC game market could disappear and it would make barely a blip in Microsoft's revenue.

      Even the idea of owning a desktop PC (especially with huge red fans and bright blue LEDs) is considered ridiculous by most people in year 2013.

    6. Re:"Stay away from PC Gaming" Really? by 0123456 · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Slashdot basement dwellers tend to vastly overemphasize the importance of PC gaming. The entire PC game market could disappear and it would make barely a blip in Microsoft's revenue.

      Even the idea of owning a desktop PC (especially with huge red fans and bright blue LEDs) is considered ridiculous by most people in year 2013.

      So:

      1. Businesses aren't buying desktop PCs because Windows 8.
      2. Consumers aren't buying desktop PCs because they're 'ridiculous'.

      Then who's buying those desktop PCs, other than gamers?

    7. Re:"Stay away from PC Gaming" Really? by Stormwatch · · Score: 1, Flamebait

      On the contrary, I hope they insist on it... further harming themselves.

    8. Re:"Stay away from PC Gaming" Really? by Man+On+Pink+Corner · · Score: 1

      Better cash in those BallmerBucks(tm) soon. They won't be worth much in a few months, and you'll have nothing to show for your shill posts except for a vaguely dirty feeling.

    9. Re:"Stay away from PC Gaming" Really? by Lumpy · · Score: 3, Informative

      "Windows 8 is better than people think"

      No, n o it's not. I have yet to find a SINGLE person that says "OMG Windows 8 is so much better than Windows 7!! I get calls constantly from friends and others asking how they can install windows 7 on their new laptop. They do NOT want windows 8, and the morons that run Microsoft refuse to listen to the bulk of the customers.

      But then they also ignored everyone with Windows Phone and Surface... their other two utter failures that are not selling.

      --
      Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.
    10. Re:"Stay away from PC Gaming" Really? by Lumpy · · Score: 3, Insightful

      windows 9 will come with the new Windows BOB interface as default.

      Honestly, they can no longer design anything. They jumped the shark 5 years ago and have been living on rerun royalties ever since.

      --
      Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.
    11. Re:"Stay away from PC Gaming" Really? by MightyMartian · · Score: 2

      Frankly, I think by Windows 9, the Start Menu will be back. It will be a Metro-ized smart Start menu to be sure, but nevertheless it will return.

      --
      The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
    12. Re:"Stay away from PC Gaming" Really? by Lumpy · · Score: 0

      Nobody really. Most people are buying laptops.

      --
      Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.
    13. Re:"Stay away from PC Gaming" Really? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Nothing like sweeping generalizations with no basis in fact...

      Oh wait, I forgot this is an AC on /.

      Now take your laptop and jam it sideways up your arse

    14. Re:"Stay away from PC Gaming" Really? by Nyder · · Score: 1

      Slashdot basement dwellers tend to vastly overemphasize the importance of PC gaming. The entire PC game market could disappear and it would make barely a blip in Microsoft's revenue.

      Even the idea of owning a desktop PC (especially with huge red fans and bright blue LEDs) is considered ridiculous by most people in year 2013.

      So:

      1. Businesses aren't buying desktop PCs because Windows 8.
      2. Consumers aren't buying desktop PCs because they're 'ridiculous'.

      Then who's buying those desktop PCs, other than gamers?

      Gamers build their own machines.

      --
      Be seeing you...
    15. Re:"Stay away from PC Gaming" Really? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Exactly. I just dropped $1200 on a really high-end gaming rig...precisely to avoid the next round of consoles. Glad I'm part of the ridiculous crowd.

    16. Re:"Stay away from PC Gaming" Really? by roc97007 · · Score: 1

      > The new Metro UI is a game changer for Windows

      True, but probably not in the way you meant.

      --
      Oliver's law of assumed responsibility: If you're seen fixing it, you will be blamed for breaking it.
    17. Re:"Stay away from PC Gaming" Really? by roc97007 · · Score: 1

      My prediction is that by Windows 9, Metro will be an optional (and thus ultimately destined to be scrapped) feature.

      Or rather, "Windows" will split into Mobile and Desktop, which is what they should have done in the first place. Simply going back to the classic interface across the board and trying to convince us "forget Mobile 6, you really do want a Start button on your phone" would be just more of the same bad decisions. The GUI is not the OS. Execs should have that tattooed on their foreheads, backwards so they can read it in the mirror.

      --
      Oliver's law of assumed responsibility: If you're seen fixing it, you will be blamed for breaking it.
    18. Re:"Stay away from PC Gaming" Really? by Falkentyne · · Score: 0

      The only reason I run Windows at home at all for is gaming, Stevesie is clearly trippin'

      Maybe they should take him to that "farm" out in the country where he can "roam free" with other useless CEOs a little sooner?

      That wasn't a quote from Steve Balmer it was from Ben Kuchera...

      Ben Kuchera at the Penny Arcade Report points out that this could mean Microsoft will try to re-enter markets it has abandoned. He asks the company to "stay the hell away from PC gaming."

    19. Re:"Stay away from PC Gaming" Really? by the_B0fh · · Score: 1

      Who is in charge of Metro?

      Remember, the last truly hated interface - Microsoft Bob - the project manager in charge ended up marrying Bill Gates...

    20. Re:"Stay away from PC Gaming" Really? by yuhong · · Score: 1

      And I think that will probably be good enough. For example, would you rather open a Metro app or spit out the unknown file type message?

    21. Re:"Stay away from PC Gaming" Really? by bhartman34 · · Score: 3, Insightful

      I had Vista when it first came out. I never thought it was total crap, but it was more cumbersome than it should've been. They screwed up the user rights. Not every little thing you do should have required UAC. Plus, while I didn't have this problem, they should've done more with hardware compatibility.

      The way Microsoft has positioned Windows 8 is just moronic, as far as I can tell. One version for the desktop, one version for tablets, and don't mess with the frigging Start Menu. Seriously, how hard would that have been? Now you've got millions of users for whom Windows 8 is a joke, because they don't have touchscreen monitors on their PCs, and worse, they put out two different versions of Windows 8 for tablets, one of which is just slightly less useful than a Cracker Jack toy.

    22. Re:"Stay away from PC Gaming" Really? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      5 years? Really? With Microsoft on a "once a year" cadence for OS delivery, it is a long shot bet that Windows 9 will take 5 years. It is possible that next year will have a Windows 8.2, but it is just as likely that Oct. 2014 gives us Windows 9.

    23. Re:"Stay away from PC Gaming" Really? by dyingtolive · · Score: 1

      This situation is founded upon the theory that there may be a Metro app worth opening. From my own brief experiences with Windows 8, they were all focused around getting as far out of Metroland as possible.

      --
      Support the EFF and Creative Commons. The war is coming, and they're supporting you...
    24. Re:"Stay away from PC Gaming" Really? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      ...

      1. Businesses aren't buying desktop PCs because Windows 8.
      2. Consumers aren't buying desktop PCs because they're 'ridiculous'.

      Just to clarify, in number 2 it is the consumers that are ridiculous, right?

    25. Re:"Stay away from PC Gaming" Really? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Our company buys lots of Windows 8 machines and we just put the the Start menu back by installing "Classic Start". It's no biggy.

    26. Re:"Stay away from PC Gaming" Really? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Less known is what happened to the lead developer on Microsoft Bob. Like Melinda, he also did OK for himself, what with starting Valve Software and all.

    27. Re:"Stay away from PC Gaming" Really? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      they can no longer design anything

      Microsoft could do something truly revolutionary and design NOTHING. Keep the UI from XP. Just improve performance and keep fixing bugs until security is rock solid and performance is at the theoretical and practical max for any CPU it runs on. I'd pay for that upgrade. I'd happily pay $30/yr for patches to XP after EOL.

      Just as with many web sites, there is a pressing need in this business to FIRE the designers. I know that hurts; because there are a lot of nice people making money doing that. I still have some loose connections to people like that, and I really hate to hurt them; but it's true. They've done their jobs. Anything past that is actually hurting.

    28. Re:"Stay away from PC Gaming" Really? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I have yet to find a SINGLE person that says "OMG Windows 8 is so much better than Windows 7!!

      That's not what he said. He said it's better than people think it is, not that it's better than 7. Since most people think it's shit, it doesn't take much to be better than that.

      Now, there are definite improvements in Windows 8, but it's understandable that people don't see those because of the humongous issues it has. Windows 8 tried to integrate the desktop UI with a touch UI, and failed miserably. The two aren't integrated in Windows 8, they're segregated. My hope is they'll manage to actually integrate them in Windows 9.

    29. Re:"Stay away from PC Gaming" Really? by Qzukk · · Score: 2

      Honestly, a metro menu would probably have been the right way to go about it. You push a button and a smartphone-sized menu of tiles pops up without blocking the rest of the screen. Someone can then expand it to full screen (blowing the minds of everyone who ever complained that they have 10 pages of apps on their phones and can never find the one they want) or just scroll through it on the menu. They'd even have tie-in possibilities to push winphone: "make your windows phone your start menu and control your pc!" "run your metro apps on your PC or your phone!" etc. Cheesy, but marketable.

      --
      If I have been able to see further than others, it is because I bought a pair of binoculars.
    30. Re:"Stay away from PC Gaming" Really? by N0Man74 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Eh, after using it a while, it's kind of a toss up. Windows 8 actually does have a few nice features, and I am able to do some things far easier than I can do in Windows 7... However, there are some changes that were mindbogglingly stupid.

      The thing is, the the much maligned Start screen isn't really as bad as people make it out to be. I believe people are just using it wrong. In their defense, I don't think Microsoft makes it clear to their users how it should be used, and how it works best if used differently than the old Start Menu worked.

      I think many people just haven't figured out that it's ok to remove apps from their Start Screen and customize it just be their favorites. Unlike the Start Menu, the Start Screen still allows you to easily access lesser used programs through the search charm or through the All Apps button. There's no reason to have some huge cluttered mess of everything you have installed on the Start Screen like the average Start Menu has.

      Though, most Windows 8 metro style apps are rubbish. Only a few seem to be worth using instead of a standard Windows version, and I find that metro apps don't handle multiple monitors in a way that really makes sense.

      I don't care for it enough that I want to bother upgrading my home machine from Windows 7 to Windows 8, but I don't hate it enough that it would bother me if I picked up a laptop that had Windows 8 pre-installed.

      On the other hand, over the last few years I've found the number of reasons for sticking with windows to be slowly dwindling, and I might consider using Linux for more than VMs and toy machines.

    31. Re:"Stay away from PC Gaming" Really? by spire3661 · · Score: 1

      NO one is saying Win 8 is bad. What we are saying is that they need to get their dick out of our face. Dont force Metro, give us the choice to run it like Win7 and BAM most of Win8 hate disappears. They had to have Metro at all costs, and it clearly cost them.

      --
      Good-bye
    32. Re:"Stay away from PC Gaming" Really? by cbhacking · · Score: 1

      So... you are supporting the GP's point?

      Your family and friends are people, presumably. They think that Win8 is bad (or they wouldn't want to get rid of it). They also are technologically somewhat incompetent, or they wouldn't have to call you for help. That pretty much rules out any option that they know how good the OS actually is; "I don't like it" doesn't make software bad, even though it may make it unsuccessful.

      Strip away the UI, and you've got an OS with lower RAM usage, faster startup and resume times, better security features (new exploit mitigations, AppContainer sandboxes, etc.), the ability to share users with other machines (as opposed to user "bob" on machine A being completely different from user "bob" on machine B, even if it's the same person), better task management, support for tracking data usage (and limiting it, on per-usage connections), and both a built-in store (regardless of whether you like the store or not, it's an advantage when you consider the following...) and the ability to install your own software, even old software.

      The UI is a mixed bag. Better multi-monitor support and some cool theme stuff, but also lots of downsides. The Start screen doesn't bother me - I don't launch my programs via hunt-and-peck any more than I type that way - but I get that many people do; fortunately there's no lack of ways to put back the classic Start menu for those who insist on launching programs the same inefficient way they've done since 95. They aren't baked into the OS, no, but at least some of them are free downloads.

      --
      There's no place I could be, since I've found Serenity...
    33. Re:"Stay away from PC Gaming" Really? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      I hate to be the cynical one, but exactly how many OSs has MS produced on that "once a year" cadence? Sure, they say that's what they'll do, but then they also said they would revolutionize filesystems with WinFS.

    34. Re:"Stay away from PC Gaming" Really? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Gamers build their own machines.

      Like the Jedi and their lightsabers?

    35. Re:"Stay away from PC Gaming" Really? by dbIII · · Score: 1

      Strip away the UI, and you've got an OS with lower RAM usage

      Do that and you are inviting comparisons with versions of operating systems from up to a decade earlier that perform better. MS Windows has two selling points - the libraries that let you run the programs that run on MS Windows and the familiar MS Windows GUI. Everywhere else it's an open and unashamed effort at catch up to whatever cool features everyone else has done.
      Your argument also falls over if the user wants to do little else other than MS Office on XP and doesn't use a lot of memory - such a situation still outperforms win8 with startup and resume times and general performance.

    36. Re:"Stay away from PC Gaming" Really? by dbIII · · Score: 2

      No, more like building a sandwich. It's very easy to do now.

    37. Re:"Stay away from PC Gaming" Really? by valnar · · Score: 0

      No, Windows 8 Metro is unintuitive. Also, trying using it through RDP or under VMware. Where's that blessed corner?!

    38. Re:"Stay away from PC Gaming" Really? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Win8 is growing faster in the pc gaming arena than anywhere else. The steam hardware survey shows that it's got healthy growth. I'm not surprised, because it's actually lighter on resources and faster for games than Win7. A different looking "start" screen that in reality functions the same way is really a very minor annoyance.

    39. Re:"Stay away from PC Gaming" Really? by MrNiCeGUi · · Score: 1

      The Start Menu allows you to do exactly the same thing: customize the apps displayed and access the rest via search. You can even delete the shortcuts from the All Programs view, and since they're only shortcuts the programs themselves won't go anywhere.

      In my opinion Microsoft got so many things right with Windows 7 that it's baffling that the same company could get so many things wrong in Windows 8 just three years later.

      Also they kind of missed the point of rapid iteration of releases, that it allows you to make the changes gradually and in small steps and get feedback all the way.
      There was no reason to make 8 so glaringly different to 7 and split their user base.

    40. Re:"Stay away from PC Gaming" Really? by LinuxIsGarbage · · Score: 1

      Indeed there are improvements. I spend all my time in Desktop, have classic shell, and it's great. My dad got a new Windows 8 laptop. I set it up with Classic Shell, booting straight to desktop, and he's very satisfied with it.

    41. Re:"Stay away from PC Gaming" Really? by Lumpy · · Score: 1

      "I believe people are just using it wrong."

      Yet all of you people Crucified Apple for saying that people were holding the phone wrong....

      --
      Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.
    42. Re:"Stay away from PC Gaming" Really? by smash · · Score: 1

      I just built a gaming PC 2 weeks ago, and got Windows 8 because i couldn't be bothered chasing drivers for new hardware on the old OS. Sure, I could, but I couldn't be arsed. I usually run a mac these days. I've been running 8 on and off since the beta at work.

      Having spent a good amount of time with it now.... I'm still pissed with the start screen. It is pointless on a desktop, not customizable enough, metro apps don't do anything useful, whenever i try to play a video with double click it wants to open in metro, despite me perhaps wanting to run in a window. Hot corners can stay, they're half decent, at least on a single monitor.

      Other than that, my file copy performance between it and FreeNAS has gone to absolute shit via SMB.

      All in all? Serves its purpose as a game loader. It's a shitty OS, despite some technical improvements in the kernel, the UI just gets in the way.

      --
      I run: Windows, OS X, Linux, FreeBSD. Just because you have a hammer, doesn't mean everything is a nail.
    43. Re:"Stay away from PC Gaming" Really? by smash · · Score: 1

      No, the reason it is growing in the gaming community is because people are buying new hardware and either getting windows 8 by default, or (like me) just buying a copy of 8 to stay current and get most of the drivers for my hardware built into the OS. Nothing to do with resource consumption - anyone with a gaming PC has plenty of RAM and CPU anyway, the difference between 7 and 8 is precisely FUCK ALL when running games on a decent gaming rig.

      --
      I run: Windows, OS X, Linux, FreeBSD. Just because you have a hammer, doesn't mean everything is a nail.
    44. Re:"Stay away from PC Gaming" Really? by toddestan · · Score: 1

      My prediction is that everyone will love the Windows 9 interface, despite it basically being Windows 8 with a few tweaks here and there. Kind of like how everyone oohs and aahs over Windows 7, despite it being just like Vista.

    45. Re:"Stay away from PC Gaming" Really? by datavirtue · · Score: 1

      I launch programs by hitting Windows key typing part of the name and smacking the ENTER key. Every time I see someone hunting through a start menu on Windows 7 I tell them to STOP right there. They jump back from the PC and I show them the proper way to start a program and they thank me several times. It works great. I love the start menu.

      --
      I object to power without constructive purpose. --Spock
    46. Re:"Stay away from PC Gaming" Really? by hjf · · Score: 1

      You clearly don't know many rich people with versionitis.

      I went to install this IP camera for some rich guy and he was using windows 8 and IE. I asked him if he didn't have any other browser, like Chrome or FF and he went "wowwww... okay, if this camera doesn't support a STANDARD browser like IE then i don't want it!"...

      LOL.

    47. Re:"Stay away from PC Gaming" Really? by PhxBlue · · Score: 1

      Which I don't get, because Microsoft has actually done pretty well in the PC gaming arena. Age of Empires, anyone? Freelancer?

      --
      !#@%*)anks for hanging up the phone, dear.
    48. Re:"Stay away from PC Gaming" Really? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It has always been easy.

  6. Also, not breaking up the company by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Informative

    Long ago (around the first IE anti-trust lawsuit installment) I heard the argument that breaking Microsoft into separate companies along the OS, Backofffice, Office, Database, and Internet (this was before XBox) areas would be best for the company's overall innovation and net profit. Ballmer never did that, either.

    The theory was each element would be more free to do what it needed to do for itself, without the weird requirements to interconnect with the software and rules of the other groups, and as separate companies more of an "invisible hand of the market" could guide decisions instead of management. Collaboration and interoperation would still be allowed and encouraged because the sub-companies would all be wholly-owned subsidiaries, but management control would not span any two of them.

    This break-up theory would address a number of things Ballmer seems to have said he was trying to fix over the years.

    1. Re:Also, not breaking up the company by jon3k · · Score: 1

      The integration of those products was Microsoft's greatest strength. Remember when EU made them unbundle the browser because it was a competitive advantage?

    2. Re:Also, not breaking up the company by Life2Death · · Score: 1

      I wish they'd share more, each app has its seemingly own interface. IE would have been market domination extreme if they had the Visual Studio pinning and tabs (and it had IE in those tabs, and i used it as a browser to prove my point) basically it was like Firefox or chrome is today before its time. Windows doesn't look like office doesn't look like Visual Studio doesn't look like SQL doesn't look like Exchange meaning no team is on the same page with the GUI which is total failsauce

  7. IS THERE NOT A LAW AGAINST PANDERING !! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I mean, come on !!

    MORE of that SNOWDEN !!

  8. Question is when by onyxruby · · Score: 5, Insightful

    The question isn't if he should have been let go years ago, the questions are when he should have been let and what the hell took so long? Defenders like to point out that Microsoft has become more profitable and larger under Steve Ballmer. Ballmer had disaster after disaster at the helm of Microsoft, imagine what the stock would have done /without/ all the disasters the Ballmer created?

    Personally I'm of the opinion he should have been let go after the fiasco that was Vista.

    1. Re:Question is when by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      After? Vista was a fiasco well before it was released. When they took the Longhorn codebase and shitcanned it and started over, that's when they should have shitcanned the CEO along with it; it's only the flagship fucking product. This was as early as 2004.

      The ridiculous, unprecedented gap between the XP release and the Vista release will be looked back on as the point where MSFT hit the iceberg.

    2. Re:Question is when by onyxruby · · Score: 0

      The only purpose of the gap was to wait out the DOJ decree requiring oversight of any released operating systems. It's been a while, however as memory serves Vista was released within months of the DOJ decree expiring.

    3. Re:Question is when by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      The only purpose of the gap was to wait out the DOJ decree requiring oversight of any released operating systems. It's been a while, however as memory serves Vista was released within months of the DOJ decree expiring.

      Anyone who lived through it on the Windows team will tell you that is not, in any way, true.

    4. Re:Question is when by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Yes, that huge gap between XP and Vista really froze enterprise IT and they figured out they didn't need Microsoft's latest-and-greatest.

      Now most enterprise desktops are a shitpile of barely maintained 10 year old software. Very few people care about MS's newer technologies, most MS-oriented corporate developers couldn't run them even if they wanted to. The PC is a dead end, and that's largely Vista and Ballmer's fault.

    5. Re:Question is when by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      I know, right? Least hypothesis here:

      a) Microsoft sabotaged their flagship product so that the Bush DOJ wouldn't investigate them for something that they never really cared much about in the first place, or
      b) The Windows team was absurdly mismanaged between 2000 through at least 2007.

      I'm going with B.

    6. Re:Question is when by rvw · · Score: 1

      Ballmer had disaster after disaster at the helm of Microsoft, imagine what the stock would have done /without/ all the disasters the Ballmer created?

      I've read that resigning resulted in $20B stock raise. I bet that you can multiply that by 5 if he had left MS 5 years ago, and roughly that could apply to any number of years (like 7 years would result in 7x20 etc).

    7. Re:Question is when by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Now most enterprise desktops are a shitpile of barely maintained 10 year old software.

      Truest thing ever spoken on Slashdot.

      Sent from my craptastic Windows XP machine at work.

    8. Re:Question is when by UnknowingFool · · Score: 1

      Well if AdQuantive and Surface RT never happened, that would like $8B more dollars MS would have today.

      --
      Well, there's spam egg sausage and spam, that's not got much spam in it.
    9. Re:Question is when by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      He's been a disaster because bitches like you are going to blame him for anything that goes wrong. He's the George Bush of the tech industry. If a Linux server in Antarctica got hit by a meteorite you fucks would find some way to blame MS and more to the point Ballmer.
       
      I'm not heralding him as anything great. He's not but the endless bashing of the guy for things he couldn't possibly have had anything to do with has soured me more towards the wanna-be geek crowd than it has Ballmer.

    10. Re:Question is when by number6x · · Score: 2

      I'm currently using my own Linux laptop at work, and connecting to the corporate infrastructure through citrix. Once agai, yhe help desk has my work issued XP laptop in for parts replacement. Last week it was software issues. This week the hard drive (my guess is the software issues were caused by the hard drive.

      They have had my machine an average of 4 days a month fro the last 6 or 7 months. That is pretty par for the course with this old hardware and software.

      Management is finally implementing the upgrade they have spent 2 years planning. The help desk is overjoyed. Windows 7, here we come.

      Of course I will have my linux laptop ready for when I need it again.

    11. Re:Question is when by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      ::cough::

      Except the 1200+ Windows 7 boxes in my organization.

      Maybe some of you have craptastic IT depts...but not all of us do.

    12. Re: Question is when by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      He is building that giant magnet in his secret volcano lair.

    13. Re:Question is when by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      How much of the increase in profits was due to simply raising the prices of Microsoft products and licensing fees?

    14. Re:Question is when by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      > Maybe some of you have craptastic IT depts...but not all of us do.

      Oh, yeah?

      Well, my situation is pretty much like yours and I'm in constant fear about when we'll start using Weight.

      This after an important country (Germany) having warned against it, no fscking less.

      Feeling well supported now? (sarcasm)

    15. Re:Question is when by BonThomme · · Score: 1

      I guess Steve has time to post on /. now...

  9. Stock up 10% by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Will the SEC investigate who the big "winners" were today?

    1. Re:Stock up 10% by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Ballmer himself made a cool billion dollars off of the jump. I guess that's gotta take the sting out of the insult, huh?

    2. Re:Stock up 10% by greg1104 · · Score: 1

      The big winners weren't today, they were the insider options trades that executed long before the news was public. See Who Knew What When for some of that. The SEC won't do anything, since some of those trades are likely to have high political connections. When Congress won't stop insider trading, no one in the SEC wants to rock that boat. They only take on little fish.

    3. Re:Stock up 10% by number6x · · Score: 1

      They'll probably arrest Martha Stewart again.

  10. Microsoft is hardly... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    ... the main culprit responsible for the state of PC gaming. The entire game industry shit on PC because it was easier to sell to console kiddies. Valve shit on PC with steam (and those who love it are defending sugar covered crap). Id Software shit on PC by farming out Quake 4 and not doing it themselves, not to mention enemy territory (which was overall a really bad rip off of battlefield).

    Then there is the dumbing down of games generally for the console audience. It was an industry wide trend. Everyone saw the success of Call of duty and the trend was to make games more like movies and less like games. If MS actually knew what it was doing it would have created something like good old games (www.gog.com) + best features of steam without the DRM and required integration/login with friends/tools/platform/IM/level editors and have community all in one place but without the giant middle finger that gabe gives gamers.

    The answer has been obvious for a long time, a platform like steam without steams obnoxious DRM and the ability to de-couple games from the mothership (i.e. OWN and modify them). Almost all STEAM Integrated PC games have suffered except a few with regards to mods and level editing.

    1. Re:Microsoft is hardly... by Stormwatch · · Score: 1

      Id Software shit on PC by farming out Quake 4 and not doing it themselves

      What? I like Quake 4. It's much more fun than Doom 3.

    2. Re:Microsoft is hardly... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "What? I like Quake 4. It's much more fun than Doom 3."

      You are in the minority, Doom 3 has a MC rating of 87, quake 4 - 81.

  11. AAANNDDD ... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    the good-bye gift to the world is the source code to MS DOS 6.22. AWESOME!
    (prolly not because it's tooo embarrassing?)

    1. Re:AAANNDDD ... by BitZtream · · Score: 1

      Embarrassing to who? It made them millions of dollars. If you find that embarrassing, you're the one with the issue.

      Businesses aren't in business to produce pretty code that you approve of, they are in business to sell a product people will buy and use, full stop.

      --
      Persistent Volume manager for Kubernetes - https://github.com/dwimsey/openshift-pvmanager
  12. Fat chance, Ben by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    As long as DirectX is a thing, Windows has an app store and the Xbox is binary compatible with the core OS, you're never going to escape Microsoft in gaming.

    1. Re:Fat chance, Ben by BitZtream · · Score: 1

      ... let me know at what point the Xbox becomes binary compatible with ... well anything really. Xbox ... nope. 360 ... nope, closest you get is 'managed code' which would be like calling Java native binaries. XBone ... nope, managed code is still as close as you get ...

      Remember, managed code is just prepared source code for the most part. It is not native, nor is it stand alone. It requires an interpreter ... which is ultimately written in actual native code, to get the job done.

      --
      Persistent Volume manager for Kubernetes - https://github.com/dwimsey/openshift-pvmanager
    2. Re:Fat chance, Ben by smash · · Score: 1

      WIndows will run the managed code the XBox One runs no doubt. So yes, it will be binary compatible.

      --
      I run: Windows, OS X, Linux, FreeBSD. Just because you have a hammer, doesn't mean everything is a nail.
  13. Stay away from PC Gaming? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Why? That's patently stupid. The XBOX is basically a PC! Free money!

  14. Not resigning is not HIS error. by briancox2 · · Score: 1

    Steve Balmer is a wealther man today for not resigning.

    Microsoft's error, on the other hand, is that they did not fire him.

    --
    We should learn what we need to know about issues, before we decide what we need to feel about them.
  15. At last by RevWaldo · · Score: 5, Funny

    Folding chairs throughout the northwest can breathe a little easier easier.

    .

  16. Never interrupt your enemy.. by Rob+Bos · · Score: 1

    when he is making a mistake.

  17. I'll do it. by dyingtolive · · Score: 2

    I volunteer. I'll take his place.

    --
    Support the EFF and Creative Commons. The war is coming, and they're supporting you...
    1. Re:I'll do it. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Indeed. Make sure to write in your portfolio "I can throw a chair real hard. Just ask the programmers."

    2. Re:I'll do it. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I volunteer. I'll take his place.

      Tim, the board is impressed with the way you treat employees at AOL, but there are many other fine candidates.

  18. Easy now by Impy+the+Impiuos+Imp · · Score: 1

    I have nothing to add.

    Apparently, just like him.

    --
    (-1: Post disagrees with my already-settled worldview) is not a valid mod option.
  19. Ballmer was fired by ErnoWindt · · Score: 5, Insightful

    No one takes a nearly $1 billion write down and lives to make more humongous mistakes another day. There's got to be a line somewhere, and Steve finally crossed it.

    1. Re:Ballmer was fired by SethJohnson · · Score: 3, Funny

      This is one of the most astute comments I have read about Ballmer's departure all day.

      Continuing in this direction, I wonder if the timeliness of his announcement was based on the need to begin production of Surface 2.0. Board of directors wasn't willing to throw good $billions after bad. They got rid of the guy who was signing the checks for more Surface investment and are about to follow HP's example and bring in a CEO that will shut down tablet development and the mobile OS.

      By no means am I agreeing with HP pulling plug on WebOS, but I do think Microsoft might be gearing up for more staggering losses than HP suffered if they continue with these products (Surface & WindowsRT). I expect to see WindowsRT open-sourced and tossed on the side of the road within weeks.

    2. Re:Ballmer was fired by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Its not that astute. Bill Gates + Ballmer stock collection > 50% of Microsoft stock. They can tell the board to suck it, along with all other stock holders. That is one of the reasons I never bought any myself because its a huge company run by two guys that don't seem to notice the obvious. It still will be so don't expect too much to change unless Gates is no longer willing to stick up for his buddy.

      Either:
      A) Ballmer finally realized he couldn't fix anything there
      B) Gates finally got sick of his company and legacy being a laughing stock of the tech industry

      I'm betting it is B. I'm sure the board and other stock holders were ready to kick him to the curb years ago.

    3. Re:Ballmer was fired by drawfour · · Score: 1

      You're an idiot. Gates + Ballmer combined own less than 10% of the company.

    4. Re:Ballmer was fired by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Confirmed: http://blogs.seattletimes.com/microsoftpri0/2013/07/22/who-are-microsofts-largest-shareholders/

  20. They lost the trust of major business partners by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    With their brutal monopolistic behavior from 1985-2000.

    Not customers, who happily continue to buy MS Windows, Office and Visual Studio, but partners such as PC OEMs, handset vendors, telecoms and application developers. Everyone said "We won't get fooled again."

    Also, the "architecture" they devised to make Windows so complex for anyone to successfully clone, also became a 2000 lb boat anchor when they tried to change direction. They're stuck with the old codebase for compatibility. Even if Ballmer and Gates had both left, they would have to deal with this part of the problem. It'll be up to a new guy now.

  21. Most ironic by Lucas123 · · Score: 2

    The retirement announcement impacted Microsoft's stock value so much that Ballmer's now worth about a billion dollars more than he was on Thursday. A MarketWatch story even said Ballmer could buy himself 27,000 gold watches for retirement based on the difference in stock price. Ouch. Talk about not being missed.

    1. Re:Most ironic by asmkm22 · · Score: 2

      Market fluctuations are pretty normal when a CEO as visible as Ballmer was leaves, gets fired, or dies. In almost every case, it's a temporary improvement or downfall, before swinging back in balance after a few weeks.

      20B is a lot though, and obviously investors have been very happy with the news, but he *is* still in charge right now, and we still don't know who is going to replace him. That very well may create enough doubt in the coming months to cancel out "The Ballmer Effect."

  22. Microsoft Abuses Gamers by tuppe666 · · Score: 1

    What he probably means is that Microsoft should not try to produce its own PC games.

    What he should mean is how Gamers where shit on by Microsoft over the Xbox One, and bringing that same madness to the PC market, would probably be a bad thing. Not that I can tell, the penny arcade report was pretty offensively a love fest to Microsoft Nasty Practices at announced. I found the way they have discussed the second hand games particularly offensive.

    1. Re:Microsoft Abuses Gamers by cbhacking · · Score: 1

      If you actually read the link, what he means is "Windows is already great for gaming, but Games for Windows Live was a travesty. Just keep the OS system demands low, and if you want to be *really* awesome, publish some of those cool console franchises on the PC." Win8 has lower demands than Win7, which was lower than Vista, while any consumer OS pre-Vista can't even use the amount of RAM found in a budget POS these days. Between Steam, Humble Bundles, and GOG, there's really no need for a new game distribution mechanism at the moment (although the Windows Store arguably qualifies as one anyhow).

      He's not saying "we want gaming on Windows to go away", he's saying "stop fucking with it; it works and you'd probably just make it worse." While this is a policy I'm not generally a fan of - down that road lies the risk of stagnation - he has a valid point: the gaming world is generally happy with Windows just doing what Windows does (right now, and in recent years); nothing more is needed or desired at this time. Aside from DirectX, every time Microsoft has tried to have some significant influence on PC gaming, it has generally gone poorly.

      --
      There's no place I could be, since I've found Serenity...
    2. Re:Microsoft Abuses Gamers by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      How was anyone shit on? The things you complain about were announced, and then when sufficiently negative opinion surfaced, were reversed before ever being released. Are you damaged by that? How exactly?

      I won't even get into the fact that to folks with a hint of objectivity and context, the new model for distribution and sharing is not necessarily a bad thing. But for people in their 30s and 40s with too much muscle memory, it's better to think in terms of last century's model for distribution than this century's. You don't bitch about not being able to share your ipad games when you buy digitally. I was actually pretty excited about taking my games with me everywhere just by signing in, but then people like you went and fucked it up for me. Thanks.

  23. Struggling with a near monopoly. by gallondr00nk · · Score: 1

    In its current form, Microsoft often feels like it's struggling in the wake of Amazon, Google, Apple, and Facebook

    Microsoft still has 90% of the desktop operating system market share in one form or another. It can afford to make a lot more mistakes yet, desktop machines aren't going anywhere.

    1. Re:Struggling with a near monopoly. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      There are actually quite a few people who would argue that yes, they are in fact going somewhere.

      Families before may have needed 2-3 desktops to satisfy the family. Now they need 1 desktop and a couple tablets.

      Workstations aren't going anywhere, but enterprises are very slow to upgrade, and are more and more moving away from the latest windows to either "why do I need to upgrade" or Macs or in some more rare cases linux. Why get a windows PC when I have an iPad and iPhone, I may as well get an Apple PC instead as my workstation. It can do everything MS can.

      Serverspace Linux has already eaten Microsoft's lunch several times over.

    2. Re:Struggling with a near monopoly. by BitZtream · · Score: 1

      No, it doesn't, and hasn't for a few years now, and every day OSX takes more away from it.

      --
      Persistent Volume manager for Kubernetes - https://github.com/dwimsey/openshift-pvmanager
    3. Re:Struggling with a near monopoly. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      > desktop machines aren't going anywhere

      Yes they are. Consumers are already abandoning PCs for tablets, and they're not coming back. Corporations would love to virtualize PC apps and stick them in "the cloud" somewhere and stop worrying about upgrade dependancies and all that crap.

      Technically people still might have a "PC" on their desk but the OS will be a very dumbed-down limited version of what they currently use.

    4. Re:Struggling with a near monopoly. by sjames · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Microsoft's problem is that a great many of those desktops are XP. They haven't made any money on them for a while now. What matters to MS today is how many people are upgrading or buying new today. Their problem is nobody wants Windows 8 or Windows phones. That and their customers are starting to wonder if with all of the interface changes it wouldn't be any more disruptive to go with Mac or Linux when they have to upgrade.

    5. Re:Struggling with a near monopoly. by BasilBrush · · Score: 0

      Microsoft still has 90% of the desktop operating system market share in one form or another. It can afford to make a lot more mistakes yet, desktop machines aren't going anywhere.

      Wrong on both counts.

    6. Re:Struggling with a near monopoly. by MightyMartian · · Score: 2

      Basically that's where we are. The bulk of our workstations are Vista Pro, good enough to support most of the newer GPO features found in Server 2012, good enough to run Office 2010, Photoshop and a few other oddball apps we use. In fact, when we had one die recently, I went and bought a refurbished Dell box with Vista Pro on it for something like $120 with shipping. Even XP would work, though it lacks some of the GPO support that we use now, but the fact is that most of our XP boxes have died or been given away, so it's really going to be much of an issue when they finally shut down all support.

      And therein lies the problem. Five or six year old hardware is good enough for almost all business use. There may be some compelling reasons to upgrade the backoffice stuff, and indeed, we're moving away from our Server 2003/Exchange 2003 network to Server 2012/Exchange 2010 (not going to Exchange 2013 because we can't do a direct migration from Exchange 2003). I can't foresee any other major upgrades in the near future. At some point I suppose we'll have to go to a newer version of Windows for the workstations, but by that point we will be looking at Windows 9, and possibly, if other desktop/notebook options like Chromebooks show sufficient promise, we may even consider walking away from Windows for at least some of our staff.

      It ain't 2000 anymore, and Microsoft isn't the "must-have" it once was.

      --
      The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
    7. Re:Struggling with a near monopoly. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yeah, OSX with its huge 7% share is really nipping at MS's heels.

    8. Re:Struggling with a near monopoly. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      every day OSX takes more away from it.

      This is what Macfriends actually believe!

    9. Re:Struggling with a near monopoly. by vux984 · · Score: 1

      Wrong on both counts.

      Cite? I'm seeing Apple hitting barely 10% in the US. (And its much lower everywhere else), and that includes home pcs. The enterprise is far less accepting of Apple (because it doesn't integrate as well, and crucial applications like... accounting are still missing... )

    10. Re:Struggling with a near monopoly. by stewbacca · · Score: 1

      If you don't think iOS is stealing from Microsoft's (and Apple's) OS market, you are delusional.

    11. Re:Struggling with a near monopoly. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Last I checked it was ANDROID that was stealing all the marketshare.

    12. Re:Struggling with a near monopoly. by Anarchduke · · Score: 1

      I believe the both counts reference was talking about
      1. It can afford to make a lot more mistakes
      2. Desktop machines aren't going anywhere

      While I think they are technically true, A lot of average consumers aren't interested in buying a bulky desktop system to replace the dying one when a tablet or laptop will suit their needs just fine. Power users, gamers and other enthusiasts aren't a significant part of the desktop market.
      And while Microsoft still has some leeway, their comfort zone is rapidly shrinking. They need to make major changes in how they do things or they will end up in the like the dinosaurs of the La Brea tar pits. Thrashing around and screaming as they slowly perish.

      --
      who prays for Satan? Who in 18 centuries has had the humanity to pray for the 1 sinner that needed it most? ~Mark Twain
    13. Re:Struggling with a near monopoly. by vux984 · · Score: 1

      While I think they are technically true, A lot of average consumers aren't interested in buying a bulky desktop system to replace the dying one when a tablet or laptop will suit their needs just fine.

      Agreed.

      Power users, gamers and other enthusiasts aren't a significant part of the desktop market.

      Also agreed. They are a small but important market. (Not to mention profitable.)

      But businesses are a huge part of the desktop market. HUGE. So my parents aren't replacing their old tower... big deal.. the business down the street just rolled out 8 new desktops. The bank I deal with just ordered over 100. A small dentists office practice just ordered 3 desktops. Another company I work with is finishing its Windows 7 rollout, and has new desktops arriving by the pallet.

      The old windows tower in the kitchen or basement or home office may be dying out in homes that lack a gamer/power-user that wants more than a laptop, but the desktop isn't going anywhere yet.

    14. Re:Struggling with a near monopoly. by dbIII · · Score: 1

      The bulk of our workstations are Vista Pro

      Erk!

      Exchange 2003

      Oh fuck! Somebody keep the guns away from this guy before he goes postal!

    15. Re:Struggling with a near monopoly. by Blaskowicz · · Score: 1

      It's just like Windows 7 without the funny squares.

    16. Re:Struggling with a near monopoly. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Linux? Are you serious? 99% of those will go to mac, the rest who actually know what Linux *is* might go that route, but it requires more knowledge of what a computer is, how it works and what it does to cope with it. I'm a Debian user for the last ~8 years and even now I get "Why does your computer look like that?", I tell them "because its not running windows" and they look at me as if such a thing were impossible...Linux has a small desktop user base for a reason and as much as I love using it and that it has helped me immeasurably in my career, I'm not some kind of idiotic zealot who believes things which are demonstrably false.

      Linux on the desktop will never pull big figures until it is somehow made commercially viable as is the case with Android.

    17. Re:Struggling with a near monopoly. by sjames · · Score: 1

      Linux is a perfectly viable choice for an enterprise where the end user doesn't set up or maintain the system anyway. For about half the users, you might as well give them linux, they won't know the difference anyway. Ask them what OS they use at work and they'll tell you some people use Firefox and some use IE.

    18. Re:Struggling with a near monopoly. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Actually a lot of them are. A crapload of old PC's have been recycled in the past few years, replaced with phones and tablets. A lot of companies have embraced light wireless tablets for their employees (usually ChromeOS). Its so much easier to maintain: employees log in, are productive, everything goes to the network, if they walk out, nothing walks out with them. You are right that desktop machines can't go anywhere, and that's some of the problem. People want to be productive portably, and microsoft has tanked on the phone and tablet. You are correct that they have an illegal predatory monopoly on desktop computers, but look at Dell, Asus, Acer and HP's PC sales. Compare that with Samsung, Sony, LG, HTC and others. Clearly desktop PC's are as popular as home phones, and smart phones and tablets are as popular ...cell phones! Ask any sales rep. whether he would rather give up the desktop computer or the smart phone. Go ahead. Try and take away one, and then the other. She will ask you to remove the old desktop thing, but will try to claw your eyes out if you make a grab for the smartphone.

    19. Re:Struggling with a near monopoly. by real-modo · · Score: 1

      In phones, yes; in tablets, iOS is still the alpha gorilla.

    20. Re:Struggling with a near monopoly. by real-modo · · Score: 4, Insightful

      See, the thing is, America, or rather the OECD in general, isn't interesting any more. PCs have penetrated everywhere they're going to, the population isn't growing any more, and all that's left is replacement. And there are all these annoying parasites and egg-robbers around (Google mail and docs, the various office apps for iPads, web-based workflow like Yammer, the BYOD wave, etc., etc.)

      In the OECD, it's death by a million cuts for Microsoft. The slow decay back into the swamp. Not so slow, if they mess up Active Directory.

      The computing market growth is in Asia. (To a lesser extent, also in Latin America, and Real Soon Now, Just You Watch, in Africa.)

      And what are the Asians buying? They're buying el-cheapo 800x600 (or worse) TN panel 512MB RAM ARM-cored tablets running Android, made by Coolpad/Yulong and a million no-name backstreet factories on razor-thin margins.

      Microsoft can't compete with that: its business model is high cost rent-seeking.

      When Asians finally have high-enough incomes and want to go up-market, they won't want to buy something that's been perceived as a loser for the last couple of decades (as will be Microsoft's case by 2020), they'll want either what they already use (Android, or possibly Tizen by then), or new and shiny, and preferably made in their own country.

    21. Re:Struggling with a near monopoly. by cyber-vandal · · Score: 1

      Because you can buy a Windows PC for a lot less than a Mac perhaps? And don't give me this shit about Macs only being slightly more expensive. We just replaced all the laptops for our field staff at a cost of £600 per laptop. Where can I buy a new Apple laptop for that price?

    22. Re:Struggling with a near monopoly. by temcat · · Score: 1

      Vista runs fine since ages (at least since SP1, and we're at SP2 now.) I got Vista with my laptop, and I see absolutely no point in upgrading. It does its job fine.

    23. Re:Struggling with a near monopoly. by dbIII · · Score: 2

      I still have a Vista machine haunting one subnet and it consumes far more time to keep it fed and running than anything else. Initially it needed command line bullshit and registry voodoo just to get it to see a server that was running a different MS operating system, and even now it still has hiccups every now and again (network browsing issue last week that win7 and even fucking XP machines had no trouble with).

    24. Re:Struggling with a near monopoly. by smash · · Score: 1

      The desktop operating system market is nothing like the percentage of computing devices that it was in 1985. Mobile and cloud services are a much larger percentage of the market now, and Microsoft is trailing badly in mobile.

      --
      I run: Windows, OS X, Linux, FreeBSD. Just because you have a hammer, doesn't mean everything is a nail.
    25. Re:Struggling with a near monopoly. by smash · · Score: 1

      Sounds like you have shitty hardware or shitty drivers (or something else awry on that box), I ran vista between 2006 and 2009 just fine without any command line bullshit or registry hacking.

      --
      I run: Windows, OS X, Linux, FreeBSD. Just because you have a hammer, doesn't mean everything is a nail.
    26. Re:Struggling with a near monopoly. by smash · · Score: 1

      No its not. Applications and user interfaces get deprecated every 18 months or so. Linux might be cheap or free, but re-training your staff every 18 months because some dick head decided to completely change the UI and/or scrap all the desktop apps you were using is not.

      --
      I run: Windows, OS X, Linux, FreeBSD. Just because you have a hammer, doesn't mean everything is a nail.
    27. Re:Struggling with a near monopoly. by smash · · Score: 1

      Give it 12-18 months and I think you'll see the desktop market starting to dry up some more. Tablets are just starting to get interesting, if you think the tablet market right now is the finished product, then you're in for a bit of a surprise. Most office users could get by with a tablet today with a bit of a compromise (lets give them a VGA adapter and a keyboard for use at the desk). The next couple of generations of tablets are going to be a lot more powerful.

      --
      I run: Windows, OS X, Linux, FreeBSD. Just because you have a hammer, doesn't mean everything is a nail.
    28. Re:Struggling with a near monopoly. by sjames · · Score: 1

      I'm going to need a citation on that one, because I've been using Linux since the '90s and haven't seen anywhere near the amount of that that MS and Apple have done.

    29. Re:Struggling with a near monopoly. by dbIII · · Score: 1

      shitty drivers

      Microsoft ones :(
      Admittedly the command line bullshit and one of the registry hacks was needed to get network access to a legacy NT4 server but Microsoft stuff is supposed to be Microsoft compatible without such weird workarounds.

    30. Re:Struggling with a near monopoly. by DaChesserCat · · Score: 1

      Give me a tablet with a Tiling Window Manager, so I can have multiple apps on-screen at the same time, with voice recognition that works and I'm gone. I would, no longer, have any need for a desktop or laptop computer.

      I would like some more screen real-estate, though. A 7-inch tablet just doesn't cut it for me, and my eyes are too old to handle uber-high-resolution on a small screen.

      Ubuntu already has the tiling window manager, but Android and iPad do not. And the voice recognition stuff is using desktop equipment. Yes, tablets are getting very interesting but they aren't ready to replace the desktop just yet. Another 12-18 months, though, you may be right.

      --
      ... by the Dew of Mountains the thoughts acquire speed, the hands acquire shakes, the shakes become a warning
    31. Re:Struggling with a near monopoly. by smash · · Score: 1

      The only driver that i didn't have out of the box when first running Vista was for my WIFI adapter, and the microsoft (well, windows update provided) driver which was released 6 months later worked fine, albeit at 54 megabit on my 108 megabit card.

      --
      I run: Windows, OS X, Linux, FreeBSD. Just because you have a hammer, doesn't mean everything is a nail.
    32. Re:Struggling with a near monopoly. by smash · · Score: 1

      Also - i'm guessing the registry hacking was something to do with enabling NTLMv1 connections? I believe they're disabled by default in vista onwards because they're quite insecure. MS usually/used to get hammered (well they still do because plenty of people still run XP from 11 years ago) for being insecure out of the box. They fix that with vista and get hammered for that too.

      --
      I run: Windows, OS X, Linux, FreeBSD. Just because you have a hammer, doesn't mean everything is a nail.
  24. Actually, A Golden Opportunity For A Go-Getter by assertation · · Score: 1

    Yes, Ballmer is leaving behind problems to clean up, but how often does an executive get the chance to inherit the power & reach of a company like Microsoft...and the chance to turn it in a direction s/he wants?

    I'm sure more than a few talented high power types will be eager to apply for Ballmer's spot.

  25. The sad thing is that... by dgatwood · · Score: 3, Insightful

    ...Microsoft's future directions are so obvious. Microsoft needs to"

    • Spin off its apps division, because trying to keep Windows/Windows RT as the only mobile platform for Office A. results in fewer sales of Office, and B. is a crutch that partially prevents the OS team from feeling like they have to be the best. In short, the "synergy" only holds both teams back.
    • Radically redesign the RT UI without all the bright pastel buttons that make it look like it was designed for children.
    • Stop trying to unify Windows and Windows RT (though providing the ability to run RT apps on the desktop in a window would be fine) because it just pisses off both communities.
    • Take steps to gain developers on RT by creating better development tools that make it brain-dead simple to build both an RT and native Windows UI for an app and by providing an RT runtime for iOS and/or Android and/or vice-versa so that developers can rework their code once and target both RT and an OS that they're going to target anyway.
    • Give away all those extra Windows RT tablets to developers in exchange for a promise to deploy their app on the platform.

    • Deprecate and remove a metric f***ton of API from Windows, no matter who it breaks.
    • Make Windows RT hardware that is significantly better than an iPad, without compromises. This means that there must be models with built-in cellular service, for starters. The rear camera must be at least as good as the 5 MP iPad rear camera. The battery life must be as good or better. And so on. All of these things are currently significantly worse on the Surface RT; even the iPad Mini has a better rear camera. Yet the price wasn't dramatically cheaper. The only thing it wins on is the number of CPU cores, and that's just not a feature you can sell.

    And so on. All of these things are obvious to a casual observer. Why they aren't obvious to Microsoft is beyond my comprehension. It is as though they have been managed by somebody who has been on vacation for the past decade, left to continue doing what they have always done, in the vain hope that somehow their previous offerings will become relevant again. They won't, and the longer Office is managed under the same bozos, the more likely it is to become completely irrelevant in the same way Windows has in the mobile space.

    --

    Check out my sci-fi/humor trilogy at PatriotsBooks.

    1. Re:The sad thing is that... by dgatwood · · Score: 1

      Sigh. Punctuation fail. My bad.

      --

      Check out my sci-fi/humor trilogy at PatriotsBooks.

    2. Re:The sad thing is that... by sjames · · Score: 0

      They also need to quit nickle and dimeing their customers by selling a major feature in their commercials as an extra.

      Next, they need to be more realistic. They are not seen as a cool company and never will be. They do not have enough cool to attract developers to their walled garden with it's many rules and regulations. Apple managed that, but that's Apple. Metro/Windows 8 don't have enough market share to let that be the needed incentive either. Developing Metro apps is mostly downside at this point. If they make the tools free and loosen their grip enough to allow sideloading, they might get a trickle of apps out there. They keep yelling "NO! It's OURS" and the rest of the world is saying "fine, keep it!".

    3. Re:The sad thing is that... by roc97007 · · Score: 1

      > All of these things are obvious to a casual observer. Why they aren't obvious to Microsoft is beyond my comprehension.

      I don't think the decision makers at Microsoft are stupid. I think that they have other goals than the ones represented by the (very reasonable) actions you outline.

      Microsoft is grimly determined to continue to make the bulk of their money via OS sales, in a time when the big players are giving away their OS. Everything is predicated on that. They are grimly determined to have one single graphical interface on every type of device. And they are grimly determined to make up in marketing the shortcomings in their business strategy.

      --
      Oliver's law of assumed responsibility: If you're seen fixing it, you will be blamed for breaking it.
    4. Re:The sad thing is that... by stewbacca · · Score: 1

      I have a simpler analysis of the decision makers at Microsoft. They never consider "just make good stuff that people want to buy" as a plausible business model.

    5. Re:The sad thing is that... by roc97007 · · Score: 1

      That works.

      --
      Oliver's law of assumed responsibility: If you're seen fixing it, you will be blamed for breaking it.
    6. Re:The sad thing is that... by fast+turtle · · Score: 3, Interesting

      On the Deprecate lots of API's, MS really needs to do the same thing Apple did with OS X - include a nice VM that handles the NT/XP apps while completely killing compatibility in the core OS.

      They've started on this path with the XP Mode in Win7 Pro for corporate use, so why in hell not simply take it to the next level and offer it to everyone with Win9?

      Another element they'd better address is not allowing Intel to push anything like the god damn Vista Ready crap. Set the hardware specs to require 4GB or better memory, dual core or better CPU and forget about netbooks. Decent hardware is out there for pretty fucking cheap and if they'd simply stick with some mid/upper range specs, companies would know it'll cost em to upgrade but Acer/Dell/HP and all the other OEM's would be happy as it means increased hardware sales with better margins then the current race to the bottom. This is why OEM's are abandoning MS in droves right now. The OS is not pushing Hardware as much as it did a decade ago. Hell anything with a 2.4Ghz HT P4 is good enough to run Win7 yet that same chip makes one hell of an improvement over the 800 Mhz P3 requirement for XP.

      --
      Mod me up/Mod me down: I wont frown as I've no crown
    7. Re:The sad thing is that... by dbIII · · Score: 1

      I thought most of their money came from MS Office?

    8. Re:The sad thing is that... by Blaskowicz · · Score: 1

      XP Mode was really XP in a VM, meaning it will get unsupported and EOL very soon just like the standalone Windows XP is. It's not a real solution because keeping it means supporting the entire XP codebase forever, so I don't see the gains much.

      As for netbooks, let us have them thanks. Besides low end hardware is dual core, comes with 4GB and uses less power. When the current gen of Atom will be phased out it will be impossible to buy bad x86 hardware (even then they're mosly fine, the worst is the bad driver support for its GPU)

    9. Re:The sad thing is that... by roc97007 · · Score: 1

      My understanding (which may be incorrect) is that most of their money comes from Windows, with Office a close second. But you can see where both revenue streams are at risk. They're competing against free. It's not like you can make it up in volume...

      --
      Oliver's law of assumed responsibility: If you're seen fixing it, you will be blamed for breaking it.
    10. Re:The sad thing is that... by cyber-vandal · · Score: 1

      Deprecate and remove a metric f***ton of API from Windows, no matter who it breaks.

      They did that with Vista and 7 and that led to a much extended lifetime for XP. To do that again would be really really stupid. Their whole business depends on backwards compatibility, that's why it's been so damn hard to dislodge them on the desktop, taking a technological shift in the end to make inroads, and even then the desktop is going to be around for a long time yet.

    11. Re:The sad thing is that... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      On the Deprecate lots of API's, MS really needs to do the same thing Apple did with OS X - include a nice VM that handles the NT/XP apps while completely killing compatibility in the core OS.

      Microsoft are already doing that.

      There's a slow burning project by the Windows Core team that is refactoring the kernel and all the core DLLs to remove as much shit from them as possible and shift it outwards into on-demand libraries. They aren't killing the API, which would be incredibly dumb since backwards compat is the only thing Windows does almost perfectly rather than "not completely terrible", but they are making it so that the internals are less of a spooky-action-at-a-distance clusterfuck.

      The results are already visible in Windows 7, 8 and Server 2012. This project is what enabled the creation of Windows Server Core (The version with no GUI) since they managed to squeeze a lot of bullshit out so that not everything is implicitly dependent on the GUI system any more. Eventually this should make Windows a lot more efficient since all the relevant subsets of legacy crap will only be pulled in when someone actually tries to use a legacy API instead of everything being loaded by everyone always.

    12. Re:The sad thing is that... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You kind of can. Even if consumers had no initial bias other than cost between Windows and not-Windows, if they sell at a low enough but above-zero price, and then set things up so that a manufacturer/retailer can charge to sell a device with crapware pre-installed, the net dollar cost of Windows to the middle-man company and the consumer can actually be negative while the price charged by Microsoft is positive. This is a trick that pretty much only works with massive scale.

    13. Re:The sad thing is that... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Because businesses don't have the mentality you have. They want something that works and works well for years.

      You want breaking changes every OS upgrade move to Mac OS.

    14. Re:The sad thing is that... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      >> Give away all those extra Windows RT tablets to developers in exchange for a promise to deploy their app on the platform.

      That would be great. I've been wanting to do a game app with robotic mutants (a merging of liposuction machines and Angry Chairs) chasing Baller around.
      Every time they bump into him he deflates some with a gurgling farting sound. Think of it as a fart app with a higher calling. Microsoft Bob can pop up cheering the players progress and giving the score..

    15. Re:The sad thing is that... by smash · · Score: 1

      I see it as a lot simpler: Scrap hardware. They aren't a hardware company. Provide better integration for other platforms into AD. Sell their applications on other platforms. The desktop market is getting commoditized and being eaten/cannibalized by tablets as well. There's no avoiding this - don't fight it, let it happen. However, in terms of server/enterprise network admin tools, microsoft has quite a useful collection of stuff. Focus on management tools for other platforms via AD, and sell apps on whatever platform people want.

      --
      I run: Windows, OS X, Linux, FreeBSD. Just because you have a hammer, doesn't mean everything is a nail.
  26. They should appoint Elops by Aviation+Pete · · Score: 4, Funny

    would be good for Nokia to get rid of him and Microsoft will continue it's journey into irrelevance. Double Bonus!

    --
    You know it's time for the next revolution when your rulers' names end with roman numerals.
    1. Re:They should appoint Elops by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Shush. Elop's not finished his work at Nokia. He's trimmed a lot of fat from the stock price (up to 85% market cap removed). He's shifted Nokia's debt to junk status. He successfully killed in-house operating systems in favour of becoming a commodity manufacturer of an operating system few people want to buy, and which saw Nokia's market share in near enough all segments decline. I want to see Elop's finale. Short of announcing Nokia's plan to have its board devote its time to masturbation in public parks, I don't see how he can make things any worse than they already are. Nokia was in decline before Elop lumbered in and started randomly pulling out wires and turning over tables. At a minimum, we could say that on boarding a car heading towards a cliff, even switching off the engine might not have saved it, but Elop hammered down the gas and began whooping wildly as the car accelerated to its inevitable doom.

  27. Revolution In Cross Plaform Gaming by tuppe666 · · Score: 2

    ... the main culprit responsible for the state of PC gaming. The entire game industry shit on PC because it was easier to sell to console kiddies.

    Actually there is a revolution in PC Gaming. I should say gaming in general driven by an army of small indie gaming outfits. That amongst a multitude of pleasant surprises a move to DRM Free, Ethical Pricing, Cross Platform (Linux/Mac and Android), they have started putting the "Game" Back in Gaming with interested untried genres themes and inventive and challenging gameplay...rather than the usual tired franchises.

  28. I for one by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Welcome our new Window-less future.

  29. Former MS employee here by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Interesting

    I use to work there and can relate to much of what the article says. It's a good place for a well paying stable developer job but definitely not for innovation. There is a group think there that has saturated the company, and if you are not with the prevailing group think people are dismissive of you and you stop getting invited to the meetings where strategy is discussed. I'm not bitter... The wife and I just started having kids at the time, so I certainly didn't make an effort to rock the boat--I just quietly did what I was told and took the paycheck because I had more important things going on in my life than trying to fight company politics and business tactics.

    A while back, a slashdot commenter made the observation that Microsoft has a generation of leadership now that has never experienced the realities of running a business that faces the risk of failing and going under. I think this is true and it has negatively affected the company. I don't claim to be a rock star developer, but I saw a lot of smart and visionary developers at Microsoft. Unfortunately, however, being a leader and visionary wasn't rewarded--being a fun guy to have scotch and cigars with was the way to climb the ladder.

    1. Re:Former MS employee here by swb · · Score: 3, Interesting

      I suspect that it isn't that they haven't faced the risk of going under, it's that they are too worried about going under and losing what they have and therefore unwilling to do anything that risks their current holdings.

      I don't know if anyone has written it, but I suspect there's a great PhD thesis to be written studying the relationship between employee stock ownership, stock options and company innovation and risk taking.

      I would wager that as more of the leadership has stock and options in otherwise successful companies, the more risk averse they are and the more willing they are to resist innovation because it threatens what they have (or may soon get).

      For unsuccessful companies or those not successful it probably has the reverse motivation -- the stock isn't worth anything until they are successful, so the risk is not innovating.

    2. Re:Former MS employee here by microbox · · Score: 1

      I would wager that as more of the leadership has stock and options in otherwise successful companies, the more risk averse they are and the more willing they are to resist innovation because it threatens what they have (or may soon get).

      Interesting idea, but would like to point out that Jobs had almost all his wealth in apple stock. He was one of a kind, I suppose, believing in his hubris and leading the world along. So it worked for him.

      --

      Like all pain, suffering is a signal that something isn't right
    3. Re:Former MS employee here by smash · · Score: 1

      Yeah but Jobs wasn't so concerned amount the money, despite having a shitload of it. He genuinely seemed to just want to make and sell cool shit. The money was made to enable the company to invest in the next round of cool shit.

      Making cool shit was the aim, getting money for it was a side-effect of that.

      Microsoft have it backwards. If they make things people want, the money will take care of itself. Yet they seem focused on lock in and how to best screw over the customer.

      --
      I run: Windows, OS X, Linux, FreeBSD. Just because you have a hammer, doesn't mean everything is a nail.
    4. Re:Former MS employee here by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I would wager that as more of the leadership has stock and options in otherwise successful companies, the more risk averse they are and the more willing they are to resist innovation because it threatens what they have (or may soon get).

      That is the rhetoric of business school which is accepted in the real world. Enron and other companies took insane risks because their managers had so much ties up in stock options which they wanted to maximise. (I initially had coma down when spelling companies. Some day someone will finish that word for companies with vegetables for management.)

    5. Re:Former MS employee here by swb · · Score: 1

      Enron was a trading company in many of the same ways that investment banks, hedge funds, are trading companies. Risk is how you make money.

      Microsoft is a products company -- they make products people buy, so for them risk is "Will people buy this?"

  30. Game Engines by tuppe666 · · Score: 1

    As long as DirectX is a thing, Windows has an app store and the Xbox is binary compatible with the core OS, you're never going to escape Microsoft in gaming.

    DirectX isn't the selling point it once was...It doesn't run on Android for a start, That is half your potential market...In money terms a much greater market Increasingly game engines with the promise develop once publish everywhere are what games are developed in. The xbox is not as big an influence as you think it is, and definitely not as much as Microsoft thinks it has after the backlash from games being treated badly by Microsoft, going to the loving arms of Sony.

  31. Microsoft needs to be loved again by erroneus · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Okay, so I'm a clearly-labelled "Microsoft Hater." I haven't always been this way. I got really comfortable with Win3.11 and then Win95 came out I experienced a level of computer excitement I haven't had since I started using OS-9 level two. (I am still quite fond of OS-9 though... just been a very long time.) I loved what Microsoft did. The advancements were terrific and long-awaited and all the precious knowledge I had acquired and accumulated over the various versions of DOS and Windows still applied so I was still relevant and loyal.

    But then Microsoft started souring things. They tried to take over Java... tried and failed. They started pulling some extremely dirty stunts with their "partners" and such to the point it harmed so many other out there. I couldn't see those immoral acts without my opinion changing about the company behind the products. Some people just saw money and work. I have always seen more and I can't unsee it. When I see an OS user interface or go over source code or anything that goes into the design and engineering of such systems, I don't just see objects, I see ideas and what people were thinking when they put it all together which invariably results in a sense of knowing something about the people behind the creation of all of these things. For me, it was pretty easy to tell when something was a cludge or if real planning and design work went into things or how much respect one party had for another when parties worked together on a project. To me all of those things were the human element of what came together in creating these things. I may be pretty unaffected by fine art, but when I saw what when into computing back in the earlier days, I found myself quite moved by some of the things I saw. It was my world.

    Microsoft slowly destroyed my world and all the things I loved about it. Microsoft started out making really cool things but when they really started getting big, they were increasingly about destroying others and less about creating cool things. If you want to understand why a Microsoft hater hates, I think my case is pretty clear by now.

    And a new Microsoft could also rekindle all the new and cool things all over again. Sure, it may not be a "wise business decision." Most cool things aren't. But I think we're all ready for something really new and cool. We aren't going to get it from Apple. Google and Android is pretty much levelled off already as far as I can tell. A new Microsoft holds an opportunity within itself to recapture the love and awe it once had. So why haven't they done it already?

    We know why... I just wish they would.

    1. Re:Microsoft needs to be loved again by 0123456 · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Microsoft started out making really cool things

      Like what? DOS?

      Microsoft were always the cheap, crap option. DOS over Unix, Windows over Unix or Mac. I can't think of a single 'really cool thing' they've ever done.

      With Android already owning the cheap, crap niche in the mobile space and Apple owning expensive and cool, Microsoft have nowhere to go.

    2. Re:Microsoft needs to be loved again by phantomfive · · Score: 1

      They tried to take over Java... tried and failed. They started pulling some extremely dirty stunts with their "partners" and such to the point it harmed so many other out there. I couldn't see those immoral acts without my opinion changing about the company behind the products.

      FWIW they were probably always like that, think of the Dr DOS situation. I remember them doing some dirty things with Lotus 123 too, but my memory isn't as good on that point.

      And really, maybe they had no other choice for success other than playing dirty. They were essentially just a contractor for IBM. If they hadn't made an effort to take over the business of their client, they would probably be in the same situation as Symantec today. And that might have made the world a better place.

      --
      "First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
    3. Re:Microsoft needs to be loved again by yuhong · · Score: 1

      My personal favorite is the MS OS/2 2.0 fiasco (notice the mention of DR-DOS in the end): http://yuhongbao.blogspot.ca/2012/12/about-ms-os2-20-fiasco-px00307-and-dr.html

    4. Re:Microsoft needs to be loved again by erroneus · · Score: 2

      No, you're right... they were kinda dirty from the get-go, but I didn't know it yet at the time. Looking back, I see things differently than I did. I was attempting to reflect what I liked about Microsoft at that time more than to create an evaluation on them. My evaluation of them is as it is today -- they are dirt and screw up everything they try to do. I mean seriously. What the hell is Sharepoint supposed to be?! I get that business all over uses it and all that, but geez! It's web but it isn't? It's just another way of Microsoft showing they haven't learned anything from all of their failures.

      Anyway, I once loved Microsoft. All they need to do is start over.

    5. Re:Microsoft needs to be loved again by RR · · Score: 1

      Microsoft started out making really cool things

      Like what? DOS?

      Microsoft were always the cheap, crap option. DOS over Unix, Windows over Unix or Mac. I can't think of a single 'really cool thing' they've ever done.

      PCs were cheap, crap devices back then. DOS made them easier to use, but the real exciting products were BASIC and Excel. 640kB of RAM was never really enough, but it was certainly easier to get work done using it with DOS than with a complicated multi-user operating system.

      For all its failings, Windows did provide an enormous amount of compatibility. Binary programs run on computers from all vendors, and DOS programs can still run on Windows 8, probably. Personally, I think closed-source software is hostile to users, but even open-source software was hard to run on the dominant Unix systems of the time. Back when Windows was released, Unix was sort of crap, too.

      I think there is a potential for Microsoft to make cool stuff. You can't build such a huge company without having some good ideas in there. I just think it's unlikely for Microsoft to get them out there.

      --
      Have a nice time.
    6. Re:Microsoft needs to be loved again by TeknoHog · · Score: 1

      I feel like saying something general about the topic - I'm way past Ballmer peak :-P

      I'm an amateur theatrician. To me, the difference between Linux and Windows is like that between doing amateur theatre and buying a DVD movie. You can try and judge the quality of the end product, but the main difference is participating in a community vs. being at the mercy of a faceless giant.

      As for the 'really cool things', the same analogy applies. The bleeding edge does happen in the amateur scene, and a lot of it does trickle down to the commercial sphere with a few years' lag. Personally, I don't have much love for prepackaged cool with a price tag.

      --
      Escher was the first MC and Giger invented the HR department.
    7. Re:Microsoft needs to be loved again by 0123456 · · Score: 1

      Back when Windows was released, Unix was sort of crap, too.

      Uh, no.

      Us Unix workstation folks laughed at Windows users when it was first released. It was a cheap, crap, toy windowing system compared to Sun workstations and the like.

      It was only with Windows 95 and NT that it started to look comparable to the Unix alternatives, at a much lower price.

    8. Re:Microsoft needs to be loved again by stewbacca · · Score: 1

      Blasphemy! Microsoft has made lots of really cool things, like Songsmith!

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3oGFogwcx-E

    9. Re:Microsoft needs to be loved again by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      What about "Bob" ?

    10. Re:Microsoft needs to be loved again by cbhacking · · Score: 1

      It may surprise you to know that for several years, Microsoft had one of the most popular distributions of Unix... ever heard of Xenix? Hell, there are probably still systems running it somewhere out there.

      NT, not DOS/9x, was Microsoft's answer to the Unix world; a multi-user OS with advanced networking and security features, remote access, a portable architecture, preemptive multitasking, and so on. NT is 20 years old (just barely younger than Linux, if you count from kernel 0.0.1 vs. the initial NT retail release).

      --
      There's no place I could be, since I've found Serenity...
    11. Re:Microsoft needs to be loved again by phantomfive · · Score: 1

      I mean seriously. What the hell is Sharepoint supposed to be?!

      Good question.

      --
      "First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
    12. Re:Microsoft needs to be loved again by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      >>Microsoft started out making really cool things
      >Like what? DOS?

      And didn't they get DOS by a defaulted contract with Seattle Microcomputer?

      After Mr. Gates stopped paying them it was hard for Seattle Micro to pay others to help them meet their contract obligations.

    13. Re:Microsoft needs to be loved again by dbIII · · Score: 1

      I really can't understand how they ignored the key feature of the web from 1992 - being able to link. Dragging huge files into a database instead of just a link to them is somewhat braindead.

    14. Re:Microsoft needs to be loved again by phantomfive · · Score: 1

      Maybe because there's no real competition? Microsoft doesn't improve things unless they are losing customers (or customers are complaining).

      --
      "First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
    15. Re:Microsoft needs to be loved again by Princeofcups · · Score: 1

      Like what? DOS?

      Microsoft were always the cheap, crap option. DOS over Unix, Windows over Unix or Mac. I can't think of a single 'really cool thing' they've ever done.

      Word for Macintosh? Not that Office afterthought crap, but the original.

      --
      The only thing worse than a Democrat is a Republican.
    16. Re:Microsoft needs to be loved again by 0123456 · · Score: 1

      It may surprise you to know that for several years, Microsoft had one of the most popular distributions of Unix... ever heard of Xenix?

      Yes, but the Xenix machines I saw were still a joke when put alongside a real Unix workstation. Did it even have a GUI?

    17. Re:Microsoft needs to be loved again by luis_a_espinal · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Back when Windows was released, Unix was sort of crap, too.

      Uh, no.

      Uh, yes. I was there too, I saw how workstations were. They were more powerful obviously, but they were equally more expensive. Even before Windows 3.0/3.1 came, there was already a commercial ecosystem of spreadsheets, word processors and database systems that, though simple and primitive, provided a good ROI for the little investment you had to put in for the non-technical masses. Right in their work places. That. Was. A. Computer. Revolution.

      No workstation system of the time had that. Computing power and windowing systems mean shit if platforms cost you an eye and a kidney while providing no productivity tools for the common non-technical person.

      Us Unix workstation folks laughed at Windows users when it was first released. It was a cheap, crap, toy windowing system compared to Sun workstations and the like.

      But since they were meant to be development or backend workhorses as opposed to office/home productivity tools, they were crap for what the general-case world needed the most, all the while we workstation guys were laughing with history giving us the bird while passing by.

      It was only with Windows 95 and NT that it started to look comparable to the Unix alternatives, at a much lower price.

      Again, just focusing on the windowing-system factor, you are missing the point. Even though you still had to rely on collaborative multitasking, Windows 3.0/3.1 was already well versed running in protected mode with which to run multiple DOS-based or Windows-based business applications or multimedia (rudimentary but effective at the time.)

      We all thought workstations were the shit. And they were... on a very narrow niche market. They were the corvettes that could take you from 0 to 60 in 5 seconds, but that can only go in a straight line. PCs with Windows 3.0/3.1x were the dutiful Toyota Corollas that could un-glamorously take the common working man to the grocery store and other vital places around your neighborhood.

      To use a workstation, you needed to be a fucking programmer or engineer. To use a PC and do things you needed or enjoyed, all you needed was one or two manuals bought from your local bookstore. That's why the former was crap, regardless of niche-specific computing powah!

    18. Re:Microsoft needs to be loved again by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Microsoft started out making really cool things

      Like what? DOS?

      Microsoft were always the cheap, crap option. DOS over Unix, Windows over Unix or Mac. I can't think of a single 'really cool thing' they've ever done.

      Microsoft Flight Simulator. 2004 was the pinnacle. They fucked it up with FSX. If you've never played around with the addons and customisations you don't know what you're missing. Still the best flight sim around today unfortunately. I say so because they killed it, the brain wrecked motherfuckers.

    19. Re:Microsoft needs to be loved again by ShoulderOfOrion · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Uh, yes and no. Unix wasn't crap back then, but the Unix vendors were everything Microsoft is today. Outrageous software licensing terms and fees, incredibly expensive hardware, and a big business mentality. I was there too. Microsoft and the IBM PC / PC clones (one did not exist without the other) in the early '80s were like a Linux vendor is today--a breath of freedom for those who wanted to use these incredible new machines without onerous restrictions. I was one of the engineers at my company that made the decision to buy MS/PC, not Sun, at the time. As Luis says, you could do so much more with Microsoft and the PC, because the Microsoft ecosystem wasn't a walled garden in those days like the Unix systems were. Borland, AutoDesk, EA, etc. etc., would never have happened if Sun had 'won' the desktop.

      Somewhere along the way, though, a funny thing happened. GNU/Linux opened up the Unix world (which was always the better development environment) while at the same time Microsoft slowly became the 800-lb gorilla that built the very same walls the old Unix vendors had erected in their day. Realistically, there is no compiler but VS for Windows today. No office suite but MS Office. Huge $$$$ MSDN subscription fees. Without competition, easy entry, and love from developers, innovation suffocates and dies. Happened to Unix then, and it's been happening to Microsoft for the past decade.

      Personally, both Microsoft and the whole industry would have benefited from a Microsoft breakup a decade ago. It took a breakup of AT&T to get digital communications out of the 300 baud era, and AT&T is hardly the worse for it today. As long as Microsoft remains the large behemoth it is today it will never go anywhere, unless it lucks into the same kind of corporate leadership that IBM found when it totally re-invented itself.

    20. Re:Microsoft needs to be loved again by smash · · Score: 1

      Ahem. Shortly after DOS, the Amiga came out with a full 32 bit pre-emptive multitasking kernel, flat memory model and a graphical user interface all running in under 128k of RAM.

      --
      I run: Windows, OS X, Linux, FreeBSD. Just because you have a hammer, doesn't mean everything is a nail.
    21. Re:Microsoft needs to be loved again by smash · · Score: 1, Funny

      The amiga cost less than a PC and did more. Unfortunately commodore couldn't market water in the sahara.

      --
      I run: Windows, OS X, Linux, FreeBSD. Just because you have a hammer, doesn't mean everything is a nail.
    22. Re:Microsoft needs to be loved again by smash · · Score: 1

      In terms of dirty, it all started with microsoft fucking IBM.

      --
      I run: Windows, OS X, Linux, FreeBSD. Just because you have a hammer, doesn't mean everything is a nail.
    23. Re:Microsoft needs to be loved again by david_thornley · · Score: 1

      Cost less? I remember looking at the Amiga and being really, really impressed, but couldn't justify spending the money. We went with Macs when we had to leave the Z80 world.

      --
      "When you have eliminated the unacceptable, whatever is left, however improbable, must be the truthiness" - Holmes
    24. Re:Microsoft needs to be loved again by smash · · Score: 1

      Yes, cost less. Mine cost $799 australian for an A500 in 1989 (i got into the market quite late). Comparable price PC at the time would have been a 286 with VGA and no sound card running DOS 3.3 or 4. Meanwhile I had full 32 bit pre-emptive multitasking, 4 channel stereo sound, plug and play, etc.

      --
      I run: Windows, OS X, Linux, FreeBSD. Just because you have a hammer, doesn't mean everything is a nail.
    25. Re:Microsoft needs to be loved again by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Ahem. The Amiga 1000 had 256KB RAM and it was almost universally held to be a ridiculously insufficient amount. The original Mac was the one which managed a GUI in 128KB.

      Which also wasn't enough. In fact, it took genius level programming tricks to squeeze a GUI OS and a single application of any interesting size into 128KB, and the tricks required were pretty much exactly what led to it being hard to add preemptive multitasking and protected memory to "classic" MacOS.

      AmigaOS wasn't immune to self-limiting 1980s shortcuts/mistakes either. For example, the AmigaOS "kernal" used lots of linked list internal data structures and documented them as a form of API. This made lots of OS implementation details difficult to change, and also made it practically impossible to add any form of memory protection or private virtual address space. Applications depended on being able to walk and even modify data structures owned by the OS and other processes. (Why'd they do it? Well, it was great for low-overhead IPC...)

      Also, the original Amiga GUI was... bad. Beyond bad. Downright awful. And early AmigaOS was notorious for crashing a lot. Neither of these deficiencies were adequately addressed for years.

      Just throwing some reality out there. ex-Amiga fanatics often have some blinders on about where the system really stood with respect to its contemporaries, tend to think the tech involved was much more impressive than it actually was, and gloss over the importance of good implementation.

    26. Re:Microsoft needs to be loved again by Life2Death · · Score: 1

      Working, legit office for Linux as binaries.
      Working, legit office for android and iOS
      Paid-for RDP app for Android and iOS

      Fix the suck that is SharePoint

      Put the innovators back on top and cut the drunk managers out of the company. Shed the dead drunk weight.

  32. We don't know that by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    What would have happened if Blamer wasn't in charge will never be known. For all we know, they could have put someone in charge who would have divested out of the OS and Office businesses and put everything into the mobile and gaming consoles - THAT would be a disaster.

    MS is still extremely strong and profitable in corporate IT stacks and Balmer was smart in strengthening that business.

    We _I_ think he made a mistake was investing in consumer (mobile and other tech) technologies. He should have concentrated on the business/corporate IT stacks and to hell with the consumer devices. Because as we are starting to see, the consumer devices (tablets, phones, etc ..) are becoming increasingly commoditised and the margins will start going into free-fall or market will plummet - as I predict will happen with Apple.

    We shall see but I think the next CEO will probably turn MS into a business services company - leveraging their software - in other words, going all "IBM" and "Oracle".

    1. Re:We don't know that by MightyMartian · · Score: 2

      It seems the next logical step to me. I think at this point it's going to be hard in the long term for Microsoft to compete in the consumer world. I don't think the PC will ever go completely away in the consumer world, but the day of everyone having a desktop (and a little later a notebook) running Windows is dying, and dying very rapidly. Tablets and smartphones are rendering the PC pointless. We have a notebook and a netbook at home, and the netbook only gets used when I'm on business trips, and then only in the hotel room at night when I need to do some longer emails (my Nexus 7 and iPhone are the email workhorses the rest of the time). The notebook only gets used when my wife wants to type out a long letter or when I need to do some coding or correspondence at home (not that I like coding on it, terrible fucking keyboard). Seriously, there was like two weeks where neither computer even got turned on. I have a Nexus 7, my wife has a Kobo Arc, and pretty much all our recreational computing are on those two devices.

      And while it's anecdotal, a growing number of people I talk to are the same way. PCs have their place, but with decreased usage, the frequency of replacement is dropping off the map. Even five or six years ago, most of the people I dealt with were gifting their old desktops and notebooks to Aunt Mildred or Grandpa Joe and going and buying a new one. Now, having three or four year old PCs is considered perfectly fine.

      --
      The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
    2. Re:We don't know that by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You and the GP made the best comments so far. MS needs to focus on the enterprise market and drop all the fluff.

      IMO the PC is here to stay so also IMO MS should focus on server and desktop OSes...not that they don't suck nuts, but they have made a pretty healthy living from their core business to date.

  33. Peter principle meets innovators dilemma by sjbe · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Microsoft often feels like it's struggling in the wake of Amazon, Google, Apple, and Facebook.

    That's because Microsoft has basically been a monopoly for so long they lost whatever entrepreneurial spirit they once had. For two decades now Microsoft has been about protecting Windows and Office which to this day remain their big money makers. It's really hard to blow everything up when you are making billions in profit every year. Balmer is a classic example of the and the company seems to be a case study in the innovator's dilemma.

    Worse the company has to fight against the law of big numbers as well. There simply aren't that many projects available to you that are going to move the needle for a company like Microsoft. Microsoft brought in around $77 billion in sales last year with a profit of $21 billion. That means for them to grow just 5% a year they will have to essentially build a company that sells nearly $4 billion each year and next year the hurdle is even higher. To do that while maintaining a 27% net profit margin is absurdly difficult.

    They have the bankroll to survive but it is not at all clear how they will find another opportunity remotely as profitable as Windows/Office. It's also not clear if Windows/Office has a long term future. Short term, nothing is going to hurt them but long term things are quite unclear. There are some serious competitive threats to Windows/Office out there. I think Microsoft management is aware of the problem and I think they are equally mystified about what to do about it. The fact that they offered over $30 billion for Yahoo speaks volumes about how empty of ideas they have become. (It speaks bigger volumes about how stupid Yahoo management was that they didn't take the deal) Even when they get the direction right (Surface Pro is a sound concept - integrating tablets and PCs) they tend to screw up the execution. They even tend to screw up when they try to buy their way into a market. It's taken them so much money to make Xbox competitive that I doubt they'll ever actually recoup the investment. Microsoft might be able to grow through acquisitions though I'm not sure they have the culture for it. I really don't see most of their acquisitions thriving. Anyone think Microsoft is going to do anything amazing with Skype? Didn't think so.

    Frankly I think whoever takes over the reigns next is not going to have an easy time of it. I'm not ready to say Microsoft is doomed but turning that ship around is going to be a herculean task.

    1. Re:Peter principle meets innovators dilemma by Areyoukiddingme · · Score: 1

      Anyone think Microsoft is going to do anything amazing with Skype?

      If they could just manage to reimplement some of the features Messenger had in the Skype client, that'd be amazing... Messenger had some serious warts, but it had some very clever features too, and Skype looks old and lame for lack of those features. But Skype is all about voice and video chat, so it's bad at text chat. Messenger started out as text chat and got voice and video added later.

      Sadly, I just described exactly why it won't happen, so for the people I talk to who insist on using one of these services, I'm stuck.

  34. Anticipate? by Quila · · Score: 0

    They need someone who can create new trends, as happened with Apple.

  35. They didn't miss the boat by Solandri · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Ballmer famously missed the boat on tablets and smartphones

    Microsoft didn't miss the boat. They inadvertently helped create the very circumstances which led to them being excluded from the current tablet and smartphones we have today.

    Back in the PDA days, it was a two-player game: Palm vs WinCE (later renamed Windows Mobile to get rid of the awful abbreviation). As with Netscape vs IE, Microsoft competed its heart out until it won, then dropped the ball. After Palm was more or less vanquished, Microsoft rested on its laurel. Windows Mobile pretty much went nowhere (and some would say it even went backwards with Microsoft trying to foist the Windows Desktop interface paradigm onto it). Everyone could see phones and PDAs were going to converge (and those who couldn't should've gotten a wake-up call from the Blackberry), but Microsoft made no real effort to add phone capabilities to Windows Mobile. So in the end PDA features ended up being added to phones, instead of phone capability being added to PDAs. And when PDAs went away, so did Windows Mobile.

    Microsoft was a major driving force behind the Tablet PC. The Tablet versions of Windows were actually pretty good, especially the handwriting recognition. But where they erred was they wanted to make sure every tablet sold was also a copy of Windows sold. So they focused on making sure tablets were high-end PC notebooks which converted into the tablet form factor. While companies were ok with buying a $2500 tablet, regular people weren't. The immense popularity of netbooks should've been a wake-up call that there was a huge untapped market for a small, (relatively) cheap consumption-only device. But Microsoft did its best to steer manufacturers away from these low-end devices which didn't use Windows (and in fact killed off the Linux-based netbooks by making "Starter" versions of Windows). So tablets were relegated to high-end high-cost devices.

    When you manipulate a market like this and steer people away from the direction the market wants to go, you create a lot of invisible pent-up demand. Apple managed to latch onto that demand with a tablet which neither used Windows nor Intel CPUs. Microsoft (and Intel) only have themselves to blame for trying to steer the market in a direction more favorable to themselves, rather than producing what the market wanted. That may have worked in the 1980s when computers were predominantly bought by businesses who could justify their high price by the additional profit they'd help generate. But once people began buying them for home use, the market became much more price-sensitive. I mean what was the point of buying a $2500 tablet PC, when you could buy a $800 laptop and a $500 iPad?

    1. Re:They didn't miss the boat by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Microsoft didn't win the browser war; they forbid OEM's from pre-installing Netscape, then Firefox. If you didn't play ball with MS on what software was pre-loaded you got charged full retail price per copy. A $100 in the consumer space is a lot of money to uneducated buyers.

    2. Re:They didn't miss the boat by chavez+chiu · · Score: 1

      Everyone could see phones and PDAs were going to converge (and those who couldn't should've gotten a wake-up call from the Blackberry), but Microsoft made no real effort to add phone capabilities to Windows Mobile. So in the end PDA features ended up being added to phones, instead of phone capability being added to PDAs. And when PDAs went away, so did Windows Mobile.

      Not true, they were definitely the leader in PDA + Phone space. Granted the experience was pretty crappy (e.g. before people came up with multi-touch, swipe scrolling etc and you had to hack yourself through if you want any form of customization), they were the best PDA phone offering in the market in early 2000s. IIRC trying to hack these babies and run Linux (HarET bootloader) on them etc was what got xda-developers started.

    3. Re:They didn't miss the boat by chavez+chiu · · Score: 1

      Everyone could see phones and PDAs were going to converge (and those who couldn't should've gotten a wake-up call from the Blackberry), but Microsoft made no real effort to add phone capabilities to Windows Mobile. So in the end PDA features ended up being added to phones, instead of phone capability being added to PDAs. And when PDAs went away, so did Windows Mobile.

      Not true, they were definitely the leader in PDA + Phone space. Granted the experience was pretty crappy (e.g. before people came up with multi-touch, swipe scrolling etc and you had to hack yourself through if you want any form of customization), they were the best PDA phone offering in the market in early 2000s. IIRC trying to hack these babies and run Linux (HarET bootloader) on them etc was what got xda-developers started.

  36. The inevitable. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I'm sad to see Balmer go, he has been giving MS what it deserves. Enterprises don't innovate, they buy companies or products that do and then extract the value out of them. MS is a red giant headed for a black hole. That's physics. It's inevitable.

  37. Was anyone else thinking this earlier today? by atari2600a · · Score: 2

    If the new guy can make 8.2 POSIX compliant, maybe license a better FS from Oracle or some shit, & BRING BACK THE DESKTOP METAPHOR, their problems are 80% solved! Don't get me wrong, Metro CAN work under the right circumstances, but it should be either an extension of or maybe even just a meta representation w/ some HTML5 thrown in for liveliness. (oh yeah, fix IE too) Ballmer said himself DEVELOPERS DEVELOPERS DEVELOPERS (& blew out his voice box trying to get his point across) when windows essentially supported any language or programming environment. then he drops a heaping pile of Windows 8 on us & gives us a single SDK? Oh but you can go back to the Desktop & program on anything you want. Just don't expect to run on RT.

    1. Re:Was anyone else thinking this earlier today? by atari2600a · · Score: 1

      *extension of the existing API

  38. Personally, I regret to see Ballmer go by Mister+Liberty · · Score: 1

    Never seen such a wonderful job of visonless fuck up, rear guard battles,
    and monumental undisruptive monopoly read we'll sing this song till death
    do us part thank you.
    Sorry to see him go,

    Thanks. Mr. Liberty
      -- Linux since 1991 (floppies).

  39. "more keenly anticipate markets" by acroyear · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Who are they kidding?

    Rule #1 for a large company: you don't anticipate markets with an eye to joining or ruling them. You kill them before they can start. If you can't do that, you play catch-up, or you use legal weight to try to stop them.

    They were behind on phones and tablets in 2010 just like they were behind on the internet in 1995. They got *lucky* in 1995 that they could buy their way into it (at great expense: giving away IE and then all of the legal fees involved for the anti-trust cases in just about every country in the world...).

    They simply couldn't get that lucky now 'cause everybody knew they would try and so could out-innovate knowing that was the one thing they could do that M$ couldn't (and never could, not since day one...).

    Large companies, unless you're Apple (willing to sacrifice one generation of customers for another), or Google (able to get most of the products to drive eyeballs back to your core income stream), simply don't innovate. They simply don't try to take over businesses they aren't already in (except by buying their way in, a-la Oracle). Microsoft had all the brains in the world but would NEVER have actually let them create a new product line if it ever put Windows or Office at risk. Never. Just like Xerox could never market the desktop workstation because the paperless office was a threat to their copier business.

    Microsoft simply would never have been able to compete here. Ever. Internally they couldn't muster it, externally the other companies knew how to handle them.

    --
    "But remember, most lynch mobs aren't this nice." (H.Simpson)
    -- Joe
    1. Re:"more keenly anticipate markets" by stewbacca · · Score: 2

      Large companies, unless you're Apple (willing to sacrifice one generation of customers for another),

      Exactly this. Microsoft just keeps piling on layers of code to existing legacy code in fear of losing that Microsoft Word 4.0 user, at the expense of everyone else.

    2. Re:"more keenly anticipate markets" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      ...Microsoft had all the brains in the world but would NEVER have actually let them create a new product line if it ever put Windows or Office at risk. Never. Just like Xerox could never market the desktop workstation because the paperless office was a threat to their copier business....

      Xerox guessed completely wrong on this as paper piled up higher than ever with the advent of the PC, it is evident that Microsoft's strategy is about as sound.

    3. Re:"more keenly anticipate markets" by dokebi · · Score: 1

      unless you're Apple (willing to sacrifice one generation of customers for another)

      This is seems actually the best way to fight innovator's dilemma.

      --
      In Soviet Russia, articles before post read *you*!
    4. Re:"more keenly anticipate markets" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You left out the example of Kodak inventing the digital camera, but failing to market or improve it. It threatened their film business. They were a blue chip stock for over 90 years, and were de-listed at least 7 years ago. I think they filed for bankruptcy over a year ago. No one ever thought they could ever fail. But that would never happen to m$.

  40. Not only have we passed peak oil.. by TeknoHog · · Score: 1

    ..but also Ballmer peak.

    --
    Escher was the first MC and Giger invented the HR department.
  41. Amazon is more than generic cloud computing by default+luser · · Score: 4, Interesting

    They have a much richer set of offerings and ecosystem for end-users as well.

    Despite years of trying, Amazon has done what Microsoft STILL could not: make solid inroads into the music market dominated by iTunes. And every item you purchase on their site (electronic or not) ends up in your cloud player collection, making it a very attractive deal.

    And Amazon has the entire e-book market locked-up, an impressive competitively-priced competitor to Netflix (Microsoft has no such offerings), and don't forget the successful Kindle/Kindle Fire tablets to enjoy all that content on!

    Even though it's not the standard on Android, I have a feeling more people make use of the Amazon App Store than Microsoft's Windows Phone Store. Microsoft can only wish they had made all these right moves years back, instead of letting everyone gallop ahead of Win Mobile.

    --

    Man is the animal that laughs.
    And occasionally whores for Karma.

    1. Re:Amazon is more than generic cloud computing by spire3661 · · Score: 1

      Lets pile on the fact that Microsoft's device to deliver music, movies and such starts at $500 + $60/year. MS is really on the wrong side of the equation now. I cant wait to watch the next few years unfold.

      --
      Good-bye
    2. Re:Amazon is more than generic cloud computing by hibiki_r · · Score: 1

      Amazon is doing well in many ways, but as a competitor to Netflix? No way. Their movie selection is downright anemic, and the TV selection. while better, isn't really all that great. I'd take HBO.Go over Prime Instant Video in a nanosecond. A pity that you need to pay for cable to get it.

    3. Re:Amazon is more than generic cloud computing by dkf · · Score: 1

      Amazon is doing well in many ways, but as a competitor to Netflix? No way.

      Which market are you in? Amazon are the incumbent in some (which lets them get a much better selection of content there).

      --
      "Little does he know, but there is no 'I' in 'Idiot'!"
  42. MS logic: Make it more useless? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Lets remote sysprep.exe and telnet.exe, require .NET layer to stick it to our competition.

  43. Ballmer Going? Quote Pat Benatar on this one... by Jeremiah+Cornelius · · Score: 1
    --
    "Flyin' in just a sweet place,
    Never been known to fail..."
  44. Mobile was obviously the future by EmperorOfCanada · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Mobile was 100% obviously the future 10 or more years ago. If Microsoft had any idea what was going on it would have relentlessly pursued mobile for the last 10 years. Yet everything they did was always a bit off. Windows CE and friends were bizarre experiments on how to annoy developers. Things like Vista were just symptoms of a company that didn't seem to understand that to thrive they need to win hearts and minds, not just strong arm people into complacency. Take MS Office. Most people would be completely happy with office 2000 or maybe something older. Most people would be happy if XP were to have just been kept up to date. I am not saying Windows 8 is bad so much as for most people just don't care. Even things like the Metro interface could just be larded onto XP if that were something desired.

    Just about the only MS thing that I have wanted in years was an XBox. That is pretty poor output for the last decade. But if we go back in time MS did put out useful products one after another. Windows 95 was a huge leap, 98 another, NT 2000 was fantastic, and XP after a service pack or two was solid. But then it sort of went wrong. .Net had so much potential, Vista was a hot mess. The new Windows servers along with MSSQL had such complicated licensing that Linux was the only way for me.

    Now just about the only MS products that I use (until I can find a secure replacement) are Skype and my XBox 360. Even the XBox One isn't catching my attention. I feel pity for anyone with a MS phone and when I hear people using MS servers I just wonder what has kept them away from Linux.

    So quite simply prior to Balmer MS was doing some interesting things. But during the entire time Balmer is there they have done almost nothing interesting. Boring has continued to make them bags of cash because so many companies out there were unable or not interested in switching. So where Balmer has been shockingly lucky is that there has been no real competitor to MS Office. Google docs has been making some inroads, and some people compromise with the various OpenOffice products but the simple reality is that once you get complicated with your documents these other product begin to show their incompatibilities. In a business environment it is just not worth futzing with the software when the MS product can be so readily purchased. But my long standing theory is that if someone comes out with a solid word processor/spreadsheet then MS is then going to begin to die.

    The one that I had hopes for was Apple's iWorks product but that seemed to have been abandoned 4 years ago plus they never ported it to other platforms. Now if they opensourced iWorks for the world to build on then something exciting might happen.

    So my prediction on MS's future is based upon Balmer's replacement's relationship with the Office Division. If the replacement comes from the Office division then MS is dead. But if the replacement recognizes that office is a cash cow but that the company can't rely upon it for ever then there is some hope. If the replacement comes from their R&D division it will probably be exciting even if completely crazy.

  45. Knives are out. by tuppe666 · · Score: 1

    I am not sure why the Knives are out. He saw the end of anti-trust in Europe when it clearly wasn't deserved. He bought out ISO during the OOXML destroying the reputation of a standards body in the process. He kept the threat of Linux creeping in on netbooks by killing them with Intel(Admittedly leaving a vacuum for tablets). He managed the Xbox 360 failing with red rings, and painted its third place as a success story(Live truly was one). He got Nokia to take all the risks and consequences, as a cost in European jobs, Hardware Reputation from European Manufacture on a wink and small change. There is a smell of failure over Microsoft Bing; Surface (and yes both kinds), Office 365, Metro everywhere, Windows 8(Phone, Desktop, Tablet)...and its deserved because they are all pretty crap, and saying otherwise has not fooling real consumers, but there is a desire evolve its static product line with these products, reinvent...and there are some good (great perhaps!?) ideas in places. The competition was(And is) simply better...and first...and

    The bottom line is although not perhaps a nice man(not telegenic certainly), he did successfully preserve the monopoly on the Desktop through abusive means...Micro$oft still take a 70% Gross Margin, His only real failing is not catching the (now) larger computing market(with its own products, or software sold to OEMS) which includes mobile, when it was both obvious...and they had products in the area years before, but how much of that is really Steves Fault, Unless compared to the mythical ghost of Steve Jobs(He was the second coming). I can't see anything changing with his departure.

  46. Elop a viable replacement by tuppe666 · · Score: 2

    would be good for Nokia to get rid of him and Microsoft will continue it's journey into irrelevance. Double Bonus!

    Ironically it wasn't that long ago Elop was a serious name in the hat as a replacement for Balmer. Ironically as well Nokia is now worthless even to Microsoft, after the damage done by selling their phones on the back of Microsoft Product Exclusively. I personally thought it was one of Balmers better moves was to get Nokia to take all the risks. If Windows Phone had been a better product things might be different today.

    1. Re:Elop a viable replacement by microbox · · Score: 1

      If Windows Phone had been a better product things might be different today.

      AFAIK, the phones were great, but the competition was steep and the brand was poisoned.

      --

      Like all pain, suffering is a signal that something isn't right
  47. CEO Quote of the Year by xdor · · Score: 2

    "I don't have time to spend actually even thinking about what comes next."

    Steve Ballmer — CEO, Microsoft

  48. I'm going to voice an unpopular opinion... by Metabolife · · Score: 1

    With Steve Ballmer at the helm, sure they had Vista, but they didn't fuck everything up. Granted that it probably would have been difficult to sink the ship, and he could have been doing worse than anyone else in that position... but Microsoft is still alive and competing in its bread and butter OS market and now the console market. What would a great CEO have done differently?

    1. Re:I'm going to voice an unpopular opinion... by chrismcb · · Score: 1

      What would a great CEO have done differently?

      Pretty much everything.

  49. how exactly was it a mistake??? by sribe · · Score: 2

    He held on to an extremely high-paying job for which he was abjectly unqualified. He got paid hugely for fucking up year after year. Now, tell me exactly how it was a mistake on his part to hang on to that job???

  50. Let's see on googlefight! by rsborg · · Score: 1

    Which 'splodes first: RMS, or MS?

    Multiple Sclerosis wins!

    --
    Make sure everyone's vote counts: Verified Voting
  51. RMS as CEO by Myria · · Score: 1

    There are already enough viruses on Windows; it doesn't need the GPL.

    --
    "Screw Sun, cross-platform will never work. Let's move on and steal the Java language." - Visual J++ Product Manager
    1. Re:RMS as CEO by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It'd be a good virus, kind of like the E. Coli in your gut that produces vitamin K. You do like not spontaneously bleeding to death, right?

  52. Videos unavailable on mobile by tepples · · Score: 2

    the day of everyone having a desktop (and a little later a notebook) running Windows is dying, and dying very rapidly. Tablets and smartphones are rendering the PC pointless.

    There are a lot of things that one can't do without a desktop or laptop PC. These include the free version of Hulu, the free version of Spotify, videos on YouTube that say "The content owner has not made this video available on mobile", or creating a nickname, Page, or ad on Facebook.

    my Nexus 7 and iPhone are the email workhorses the rest of the time

    Did your Nexus 7 get upgraded to Android 4.3? If so, did you have to root it to rename Vendor_0a5c_Product_8502.kl in order to keep using a Bluetooth keyboard?

  53. Genres that aren't so touch-friendly by tepples · · Score: 1

    DirectX isn't the selling point it once was...It doesn't run on Android for a start, That is half your potential market

    For a game designed with a keyboard or an Xbox 360 Controller in mind, I don't see how Android is so relevant. Only a few Android devices come with a controller, such as the Xperia Play phone and the OUYA console. The rest have only a touch screen, which isn't so ideal for genres that aren't point-and-click. Or are people really willing to buy a $40-$60 clip-on controller to play a $3 game?

  54. Windows RT == locked Windows 8 on ARM by tepples · · Score: 2

    I expect to see WindowsRT open-sourced

    I don't. It's almost the exact same code as Windows 8 as I understand it, just with some settings flipped to require that applications be signed by Microsoft and that devices refuse to run any other OS.

    1. Re:Windows RT == locked Windows 8 on ARM by cbhacking · · Score: 1

      Precisely. What we *might* see is what (I think) should have been done from the beginning: RT is "unlocked" for use basically as a standard Windows OS. Yes, native applications will need to be recompiled (.NET apps work fine), but that isn't too hard; the dev tools (Visual Studio and friends) already support doing that. They could sell desktop software through the Windows Store (just like they do on x86 Windows!) and, if they wanted to be really daring, could even create (or have created/ported) a compatibility layer for running Android apps. Bluestacks for Surface Pro is pretty popular. Something similar for RT could easily make it "the OS that has the advantages of both Android and Windows" - solving the app ecosystem problem, the "usable as either a tablet or laptop, but not good as either" problem, and the "can't replace my old laptop *or* my Android / iOS tablet" problem.

      It really is the same code, though. Jailbreak it (which is done using standard Windows debugging and scripting tools) and it's just Windows 8 with a few legacy features removed, recompiled for ARM, and with wholly unneeded lockdown.

      --
      There's no place I could be, since I've found Serenity...
    2. Re:Windows RT == locked Windows 8 on ARM by smash · · Score: 1

      Windows RT is a dead platform, even if microsoft didn't fuck it up. Intel have pulled out the stops with haswell, and future x86 power consumption will be even better. Within 2-3 years there will be little point in bothering to run with ARM.

      --
      I run: Windows, OS X, Linux, FreeBSD. Just because you have a hammer, doesn't mean everything is a nail.
  55. Log into a PC to create your Page by tepples · · Score: 1

    Consumers are already abandoning PCs for tablets, and they're not coming back.

    They will when they frequently see things like "The content owner has not made this video available on mobile" (YouTube) or "You'll need to log into a desktop computer to create your Page" (Facebook) or absolutely nothing playable (Albino Blacksheep, Newgrounds).

    1. Re:Log into a PC to create your Page by smash · · Score: 1

      This is happening less and less, and the services not catering to tablet users will get left behind.

      --
      I run: Windows, OS X, Linux, FreeBSD. Just because you have a hammer, doesn't mean everything is a nail.
  56. irony of windows 8 apis by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    despite how superficial and thus lame the integration of touch into the os experience is, the win 8 apis are actually the best around for developing graphically demanding multi-touch applications, i.e., better than mac, ios, android. c sharp is a better language than obj c or java. they use the graphics card in really small ways.

    alas, this has not so far resulting in good products from microsoft. steve ballmer, we will not miss you. we hope your successor is better. soon!

  57. Valid Retirement planning: by jafac · · Score: 1

    Step one: Get into a position where, politically, you know that it is impossible to be fired.
    Step two: Purposely fuck over the company's stock over a period of years, by making shitty decisions.
    Step three: On the basis of the company's de-valued stock, re-negotiate a higher number of options for your retirement package.
    Step four: Announce retirement, watch your retirement package's value skyrocket. . .

    --

    These are my friends, See how they glisten. See this one shine, how he smiles in the light.
  58. Android Consoles. by tuppe666 · · Score: 1

    For a game designed with a keyboard or an Xbox 360 Controller in mind, I don't see how Android is so relevant. Only a few Android devices come with a controller, such as the Xperia Play phone and the OUYA console

    ...and I own both. You left out GameStick; Mojo by mad catz; Nvidia Shield; GamePop; A range of tablet consoles from JDX; Archos Gamepad...and this is before heavyweights Amazon and Google both rumoured to step into the ring. That is only for games "designed" or Playstation Controller first, those designed for screen input first will obviously have even less of a problem.

  59. Ballmer (has) a hard nut to crack by Chompjil · · Score: 1

    He's leaving, but too soon, his pride would have been hurt if he left after vista, you know....kinda like what Cartoon Network's old President did after ATHF prank on Boston

    --
    People once told me 68K ram was all we needed,
  60. So yes, Ballmer was a bit of a train wreck by gatkinso · · Score: 1

    But don't count Microsoft out. They are in much better shape than Apple was BJS (Before Jobs Second coming). Take a wait and see attitude. I still an eager to see them embrace Linux... or at least acknowledge it exists... or at least include a ssh client....

    --
    I am very small, utmostly microscopic.
    1. Re:So yes, Ballmer was a bit of a train wreck by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Very different situation. Apple was pretty close to being broke and irrelevant.

      Microsoft is experiencing the kind of malaise we see in oil producing countries that never made a serious effort to diversify. All is good while the petrodollars roll in but what happens when the wells run dry or prices drop low enough to threaten the social security that comes from sales of oil? What will Microsoft do if they lose their Windows and Office cashcows? Most likely they won't any time soon, so for the time being they can continue to flit around like some bored rich housewife - opening little boutiques and selling homemade junk over the Internet, without worrying that pretty much everything she tries is actually a net loss and will probably remain that way.

      That is Microsoft - a bored housewife of a millionaire, who will indulge their strange and expensive whims.

  61. Here's how they COULD survive by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    Interoperability and Openness with best solution on the market vs Walled Ecosystem.

    Let's look at the state of the art circa 2013. Terabytes of storage everywhere locally : cloud a nice option for distributed storage of personal data that you need to be able to access in different locations to the home or office, with automatic backup as part of the service but far too expensive to be an all or nothing choice due to limited / too expensive internet access everywhere you go.

    Processor power incredible, only an issue for home users these days if you are forced to work with an OS that gets more bloated faster than Moore's Law (e.g. Vista)

    Answer : A Slim ultra fast OS that runs virtual machines that support as much software as possible from whatever OS / language, combined with a massive permanently free giveaway of the best development tools on the planet to support this. Virtual Server / PC architecure to achieve this (how quiant that an ultrapowerful PC these days doesn't offer this out of the box). Android style app permissions to limit what installed native software can do (no I don't want to check for updates / send you ANYTHING unless I tell you to IF I feel like it, which I won't by the way), One version of this OS (No Home, Enterprise, etc editions) which can also run headless to minimise the UI bloat, and a big price cut for home users, offset by increased license fees for the enterprise users who would buy this in bucketloads.

    Do this, you might have a chance. Keep going the way you are now, and Android Home / Enterprise Edition, which does everything OSX and current windows does, along with the increasing dominance of Linux on servers in the datacentre will finish you off in the next decade.

  62. True, but Jobs came to an Apple... by Radical+Moderate · · Score: 2

    that was on its last legs. He could do anything he wanted because the company had little to lose. MS is still an 800 pound gorilla with a byzantine bureaucracy,turning that ship is a Herculean task. Of course, with their cash and income streams they're not close to being dead yet, so there's more time and room for error. But their failure to admit their mistake with Metro does not bode well, a culture of denial doesn't breed success.

    --
    Never let a lack of data get in the way of a good rant.
  63. Re: "Windows 8 is better than people think" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Don't know about other people, but I kept trying to find some cool factor that would make me like Win8 with the screwy tiled interface. Never did. Could tolerate it on my Win2012 Server mostly because I don't have to touch it every day (thankfully). But dang, what does a server need with ringtones? A GUI is dubious enough... And the 12 hour migration of a simple six machines AD domain was just unbelievable. It was quicker to type it in again... made me long for the days of paper tape... I can believe the groupthink problem -- sounds like management spends so much time staring at their own navels that they have forgotten who the customer is.

  64. "If you see a stylus, they blew it" -they did miss by SuperKendall · · Score: 2

    Those words were from Jobs. Jobs was just as prone to being wrong as anyone, but those particular words carry a lot of insight. It was not Jobs being dismissive of competitors - it was from direct experience with the Newton.

    The Tablet versions of Windows were actually pretty good, especially the handwriting recognition.

    No, sorry, they actually sucked quite a lot. Really good handwriting recognition is like being pretty darn good at finding land mines. It's a fine skill if you need it but few people are willing to follow you to where the skill is useful.

    Microsoft missed the boat because they didn't build a Tablet - they built a PC with a touchscreen and called it a tablet. They were unwilling to fully commit to touch for input.

    Even now with the Surface RT they have the same issue. It's nice for those that want a stylus - like artists. It's even more useful because they spent a lot of time building a fantastic keyboard. But for anyone but a tiny minority what Microsoft has built - again - is not a tablet. It's a PC with a touchscreen, this time much more literally.

    Apple managed to latch onto that demand with a tablet which neither used Windows nor Intel CPUs.

    It is insane to think that is why Apple has succeeded. It has NOTHING to do with processor or OS, neither thing most people care about even slightly.

    --
    "There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
  65. You talking to me? by tuppe666 · · Score: 1

    If you actually read the link, what he means is "Windows is already great for gaming

    Let me just stop you there. Windows has been an awful place for gaming. Its console ports, watered down challenges, Short Gameplay, Multiplayer focused, DRM ridden, Paid add-ons. etc etc Thank the Lord that Cross platform (indie) gaming is back.

  66. Consistency by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    At least the guy is consistent.
    Late to smartphones, late to tablets, late to...
    He had to resign 1 decade to late.

  67. For some odd reason... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    This reminds me of the '80s guy episode of Futurama.

  68. he who weilds the lickable hilt by epine · · Score: 1

    could out-innovate knowing that was the one thing they could do that M$ couldn't

    Did you buy that four-digit ID on eBay? You've combined Microsoft's favourite word into the same sentence with the most geriatric of all derisions.

    Microsoft innovated a metric butt unit, but very little of this advantaged the end consumer. They innovated business methods more so than technologies, especially the business method of crossing the legal and ethical line and getting away with it long enough to sip fine Champagne with one foot on Netscape's corpse while confined to the corner of the room wearing a pearl-crusted dunce cap. Vlad the Impaler tips his hat.

    Speaking of Vlad, are you man enough to tell Vlad he can't innovate? To his face? Do you wish to wear the outcome of that assertion? Just because he's never much bothered to tweak the recipe for making Damascene steel or grafted on a lickable hilt (one that actually looks attractively lickable)? No, he just sits there thinking "no matter the sword, they all bleed the same way". Admittedly that's not the hallmark of innovation as celebrated among the proletarian ranks, but it works the gutters and coffers just fine.

    One would think given his methods that more of the population would elect to somehow slip between his masochistic fingers. And yet they didn't. That's not what happened. Tell me it doesn't take innovation to become that sadistic and not have your entire empire relocate itself to the next valley over. Are your heirlooms and golden geese locked away in a proprietary chest for which only Vlad possesses the master key? You might have suspected something sooner, but you really liked the gaily-painted wooden wheels and the decorative hollow horse head. Steve never managed to sell that, yet somehow Bill was manning triple shifts under the lash to slake demand.

    Wolfram Alpha just made me this nice chart in under sixty seconds and a permanently shareable link. Innovation, or just trying harder to please because you catch more flies with honey than vinegar? [when lacking Vlad's henchman army]:

    appl msft profit over time

    Microsoft had Apple's number for pretty close to twenty years, and without ever suffering cardiac arrest. Apple is cool like Lance: it's amazing what one can achieve sans so many testicles when clad in relentlessly promoted, well-branded apparel. Apple burned through five heart-lung machines before they regrew their permanent hair, but what flowing fleece it was.

    Tell me what company in their right mind would deliver innovation to the end-user riding on top of a such a long, gracefully ascending line? Yeah, it faded a bit over the past five years. But Microsoft had it coming. Boy did they have it coming. A hectare of discarded Champagne bottles began to cultivate a mirulent strain of black mold. And right in their own back yard, less than a stone's throw away. Dang, what a mess to have to clean up.

    Apple's time is coming, too. The migrant consumer is already beginning to scout valleys even further afield. People only pay through the A$$ for so long before they wise up, unless they're fleeing from fresh horrors of ruthless innovation in the sprawling valley of the damned.

    A kinder, gentler Microsoft won't do anything to help Apple sustain its insanely high profit margins. At the same time, a return to form of the old ruthless Microsoft could turn into an expensive tactical nightmare, with the Koreans nipping at their other flank.

    Much depends on the new Khan. Personally, I hope their first agenda item is to take a giant bite out of Oracle's rapacious backside. Later they release M$inx in a master stroke of branding genius with all the tedious and uncool APIs of XP's cooling corpse completely open sourced and unencumbered. Just think, you can continue running your old copy of Turbo Tax 2005 all the way to the n

  69. MS did fine as a publisher by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I'd be happier if many titles from ms that went xbox only came out for pc. "Stay the hell away from PC gaming" is a stupid and short-sighted comment. I can't really argue with perhaps MS feature-freezing DirectX and embracing OpenGL.

  70. Hindsight by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    How could Steve Balmer have known, that he should have retired? Only in hindsight.

  71. Not just Ballmer by jjohn_h · · Score: 0

    If Microsoft wants to desinfect themselves they need to remove Gates and Ballmer from any influential positions.

    1. Re:Not just Ballmer by lpq · · Score: 1

      IMO, you are wrong on 2 counts.
      1) in thinking that bill gates still has any position of influence in the company; and
      2) thinking he shouldn't (at all).

      Bill Gates was NOT a saint, by any measure (no matter how much he "philanthropicizes" after the fact, much of his gains are ill-gotten to begin with (MS did bad things during his tenure). BUT -- he appeared to be the only visionary in the company in upper management.

      Several of his plans fell through -- many of those failed in *execution*, something had begun turning over to Ballmer long before his retirement. Ballmer is business oriented only. Ballmer would be happy being the next IBM that is the backbone of companies everywhere and never having another consumer customer -- they want and want and don't pay nearly as well as corporations can be bilked.

      Bill had more (anyone would have more than Ballmer) focus on appealing to consumers while still supplying the staples needed by business. His surface, which Ballmer killed, MS home-server -- another flop.

      Win8 was Ballmer's parting "gift" -- getting rid of the desktop that caters to personal computer users -- and converting it into a large button filled panel that would be perfect for limiting flexibility and allowing companies to create single-task appliances that can be used by children.

      Gates wasn't a saint -- but he was orders of magnitude better than Ballmer for the PC-market.

    2. Re:Not just Ballmer by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      IMO, you are wrong on 2 counts.
      1) in thinking that bill gates still has any position of influence in the company;

      Er, what planet are you on? On mine, Bill Gates is Chairman of the Board. The leader of the group of people which almost certainly just pushed Ballmer out the door (out-of-the-blue "resignations" in executive ranks are generally polite faces on board-level firings). And this was done with BillG's assent, because if he was not fine with it he would have resigned his chairmanship or something.

    3. Re:Not just Ballmer by lpq · · Score: 1

      Just because someone has a token CoB title doesn't mean they really do much of anything or influence anything (doesn't mean opposite either).

      My impression is Bill has been off doing his own thing outside of
      MS, -- the company rather markedly changed directions and operations
      after Bill left. I haven't seen a reversal.

      As to your idea that the was "out of the blue"... there has been talk of him stepping down on the MSforums for the past few years.

      If he was fired, why would ask him to stay on until they find a replacement? You are jumping to conclusions.

  72. the trouble is that they keep changing the UI and by A+Pressbutton · · Score: 1

    back when it was win 95 or NT, the was no large established ecosystem that relied on a API and any changes to the UI were clearly better. 20 years later there are billions of users all dreading the thought of something different - and win 7 counts as different. there are hundreds of thousands of developers all thinking the same. your customers don't want change - but you only make money if you change. the only thing stopping MS becoming altavista is that MS enables so many critical businesses processes using VBA and until processes change, that won't change.

  73. Re:Obvious by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Hey! I'm an autistic sociopath, you insensitive clod.

  74. Xbox One by Prehensile+Interacti · · Score: 1

    I strongly suspect that the pre-order numbers for the Xbox One have just made their way through to board level action. We're hearing from everywhere that they are terrible. I don't think Ballmer had enough political capital to survive another disastrous product launch after Zune/Vista/Surface/Win8 et. al. and so had to go.

  75. Google vs Microsoft by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Clear proof of leadership failure: While Google is working on self-driving cars, Microsoft is busy trying to prevent people from being able to sell Xbox One games.

  76. Ballmer by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Maybe, it's time for Ballmer to find a new CEO. That not to say he is or has been unsuccessful. He has managed one of the largest companies in the world, and he managed it went Bill Gates was in charge. Much of what Ballmer is managing is the legacy of Bill Gates. Much of what he's managing is his own legacy. Microsoft is a technical company. It's a software company. It's transitioning from a software company to a software, hardware and services company. They're trying to catch up the Apple business model. The biggest question is not is Microsoft successful. It's a tens of billions of dollars behemoth, and it's stock values is worth hundreds of billions.

  77. Strength in numbers; input and genre by tepples · · Score: 1

    and I own both

    It's about how many other people own both.

    You left out GameStick; Mojo by mad catz; Nvidia Shield; GamePop; A range of tablet consoles from JDX; Archos Gamepad

    Assuming that by JDX you mean JXD, maker of the S5110 gaming tablet: What are the sales figures for these product lines? I'm occupied this weekend, but I'll make a note to ask for these brands in both Best Buy stores in my area this week and get back to you. But I suspect the answer will be "look for them online", which doesn't help gamers become aware of these devices' existence in the first place. Something not sold in stores isn't likely to build up an installed base big enough to convince the big players that a port is worth the investment. It's the same reason that few to no commercial games were made for the GP32, GP2X, Wiz, and Caanoo.

    and this is before heavyweights Amazon and Google both rumoured to step into the ring.

    Anything official yet, as of late August 2013?

    That is only for games "designed" or Playstation Controller first, those designed for screen input first will obviously have even less of a problem.

    How would you recommend designing a Mega Man or Castlevania style platformer or a Street Fighter or Mortal Kombat style fighting game "for screen input first"? I tried playing Tetris on my aunt's iPhone and I couldn't see how one could achieve anywhere near the TPM that one can get on, say, Tetris DS. Then I tried playing the demo of Pixeline and the Jungle Treasure on my first generation Nexus 7 tablet, and the controls were so uncomfortable and gave so little feedback as to the position of my thumbs that I wished I had an NES controller to phone adapter. I couldn't even make a jump near the beginning of the second (or third?) level because of this. Platformers in Nesoid had similar problems. So ultimately, as I see it, the input method for which a game is designed first should depend on the genre. But well-known devices that ship with a gamepad have historically had far higher barriers to entry. In fact, some people have told me that it's actually the other way: the genre should depend on the size of the company, and indie developers should keep their ideas for games in gamepad-centered genres to themselves and make games in point-and-click genres until they're big enough to qualify for a Sony or Nintendo license. But I'm open to evidence otherwise.

  78. Re:Vista, CEOs and company vision by bbsalem · · Score: 1

    I am wondering about Tin Cook of Apple. I don't see the stream of new vision that we got from Jobs. Am I wrong about that?

    Balmer strikes me as a more typical CEO, businessman, lost in the day to day, lost in the details, not minding the vision and the future of the company, and not repairing the fraud that is Microsoft. The whole idea that Microsoft gets to O.E.M its OS on X86 systems should have been put a stop to by regulators long ago. It is the only reason Microsoft has the market share it retains, that and because it has a captive market, it doesn't believe in educating its users as to the effective and safe use of software. Every time its business partners, Norton and Symantech get to nag you, uninvited, to buy their security products, creates a huge hole for hackers. he very idea that an entity that you don't allow in can get in to try to sell you something that should have been shipped with the base OS invites exploits.

    Microsoft has missed the boat and I realize that the mobile technology it has missed is poised to totally replace the desk-side computer, notice I didn't say desktop, and by that I mean that the low power chips needed for mobile with the memory sizes and storage capacity of desk-side boxes of as recently as three years ago can totally make the traditional desk-side box obsolete and permanently so. A set-top box the size of your palm coupled with a USB hub to connect your existing peripherals, already exists, and it doesn't run Windows, at least not well. It runs Android, or IOS, or Linux. In this time of concern about government snooping and closed platforms, FOSS and Linux may become the premium, and Windows left to legacy systems. Microsoft would then decline or go out of business, and maybe that is what it deserves. Oh, I know how conservative American businesses are. I'm not saying that they will ditch their Windows Servers, but Microsoft may be relegated to supporting legacy systems and not leading change and new adoption, which is a huge market, especially if the software for it is open sourced. I can't say that I feel sorry for Balmer and Microsoft; maybe they have screwed their customers long enough, too long anyway.

  79. He's retiring everywhere by argherna · · Score: 1

    Except in Nebraska...

  80. Left behind in favor of what? by tepples · · Score: 1

    This is happening less and less

    Citation needed that the big three record labels are placing fewer and fewer copyright claims with the PC-only option on YouTube. I'm still seeing this error message for a lot of videos on my tablet. And the mobile versions of Hulu, Pandora, and Spotify already either charge more or cap mobile use or both.

    the services not catering to tablet users will get left behind.

    Sounds reasonable. So in the post-SWF era, what replaces Newgrounds and Kongregate as a hosting service for web games created and uploaded by users? And what replaces Facebook as a platform for hosting a page about an organization or topic on a social networking site?

    1. Re:Left behind in favor of what? by smash · · Score: 1

      Maybe i'm using different youtube content to you, but i haven't run into an inability to play anything on youtube on my ipad for 9 months plus now. Maybe its all good since google put out the youtube app? As far as a replacement for facebook goes.... uh... facebook? They have a number of mobile apps. Web games, not sure, don't play them; but there are plenty of proper tablet games for both Android and iOS that are promoted via facebook.

      --
      I run: Windows, OS X, Linux, FreeBSD. Just because you have a hammer, doesn't mean everything is a nail.
  81. Good riddance to Ballmer & (hopefully soon) to by durval · · Score: 1

    Good riddance, Ballmer, and don't let the door hit your fat butt on your way out.
    Also, I hope MS itself doesn't take too long to follow you out of History's door.
    Psycho CEO of a dishonest company selling crappy products, no one will be sad to see any of you go (except perhaps the suckers that invested in your stock).

    --
    Best Regards,
    Durval Menezes.
    I have never met a computer that didn't like me.
  82. Blocked from search by tepples · · Score: 1

    Maybe i'm using different youtube content to you, but i haven't run into an inability to play anything on youtube on my ipad for 9 months plus now.

    Videos blocked from viewing on Android are also blocked from search in the YouTube app for Android, and I think the YouTube app for iPad works the same way. But if you search for videos through Google Search, or someone shares a link to a video with you, you may end up on a "not available on mobile" screen. Does this play?

    As far as a replacement for facebook goes.... uh... facebook? They have a number of mobile apps.

    According to Facebook's own help pages, Facebook still doesn't let mobile users create a nickname or create a Page, whether through the mobile web or the mobile app.

    there are plenty of proper tablet games for both Android and iOS that are promoted via facebook.

    True, but "plenty" doesn't help when the specific game that your friends are recommending to you is unavailable. As for bugging the developer of this specific game to port it to iOS, I thought it cost substantially more for tools to develop a game for iOS than for SWF. For one thing, you will likely have to replace your current computer with a Mac.

  83. At which brick-and-mortar store? by tepples · · Score: 1

    I imagine that a lot of people are going to want to inspect a device before they buy it, especially if the device takes user input. It's the same reason that the major console makers have their consoles on display in brick-and-mortar stores such as GameStop and the video game departments of Walmart and Best Buy: it makes the potential customers aware of the product and its capabilities and ergonomics. Sure, online-only sales are possible, but I don't see how an online-only strategy could attract a critical mass of customers to make the platform attractive to developers.

    So today I went to Walmart.com and BestBuy.com and put each of these products into its search box. GameStick, Mad Catz Mojo, Nvidia Shield, GamePop, and JXD came up with nothing relevant. Archos GamePad showed up on both Walmart and Best Buy, but only as "ship to store: 5 to 7 business days". Then I tried GameStop.com. It drew a blank on Mad Catz Mojo, GamePop, Archos GamePad, and JXD. GameStick had "Release Date 9/30/2013". Nvidia Shield showed up out of stock online and 100 miles away in PickUp@Store.

  84. Re:Vista, CEOs and company vision by ConceptJunkie · · Score: 1

    I am wondering about Tin Cook of Apple.

    I really want to make an Iron Chef joke here, but I can't think of one.

    --
    You are in a maze of twisty little passages, all alike.