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Next World of Warcraft Expansion: Warlords of Draenor

Posted by Soulskill on from the for-the-horde! dept.

JestersGrind writes with news that Blizzard has announced the next expansion to World of Warcraft, titled Warlords of Draenor. This expansion raises the level cap to 100 and introduces a new world/continent full of zones: Draenor. They're also introducing 'Garrisons,' player-built bases on Draenor that individual users will be able to customize and upgrade. Your garrison will have followers which you can send on missions, and you'll be able to invite other players over to visit and trade. The expansion will also revamp a number of aging character models. Blizzard is also making it so new and returning players can immediately boost one character to the current level cap (90), so they can immediately jump into the new content.

101 of 156 comments (clear)

  1. I guess I'll see by xevioso · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Do you still have to grind to get anywhere? If so, I won't be back.

    1. Re:I guess I'll see by JustAnotherIdiot · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Has there ever been an MMO where grinding wasn't a requirement?

      --
      What do I know, I'm just an idiot, right?
    2. Re:I guess I'll see by Nos. · · Score: 1

      I can't see how it won't. You'll grind for rep and some sort of currency (valor points or what have you) to get better gear to get into end game raids, to farm gear.

      It's lost it's appeal for me and I really doubt I'll be back.

    3. Re:I guess I'll see by X0563511 · · Score: 4, Interesting

      GW2 doesn't really do the whole "grind" thing - at least not with anything you actually have to do to advance.

      Hell, just hop in WvW and murder people. You can level up that way.

      --
      For large sets, this will be our guide even unto death, for the LORD will work for each type of data it is applied to...
    4. Re:I guess I'll see by twocows · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Experienced player here (since BC). It's WoW. Do you even really need to ask? The level grind is just one of many. Then you've got the grind to get LFR-ready equipment (right now that's not too bad, you just run around grabbing chests on the new 5.4 area and get free 496 gear). Then you grind LFR until your gear is good enough that people will let you in their flex raids, and then grind flex until etc. Also, there's a legendary questline that you need to grind. There was reputation grinding, and there still is a little, but that's mostly gone. Oh, and there are side grinds if you want to do stuff like max tradeskills or pet battles or whatever, same as always.

    5. Re:I guess I'll see by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      The only MMO I've played that didn't take excessive grinding to get to a decent level is Shadowbane. Unfortunately it was released with massive bugs (thanks Ubisoft) so there is no telling if a MMO that focused less on grinding and more on pvp and... world-building? (you could make your own cities buying buildings walls etc) would be viable. I think it had promise but what manager would approve trying to emulate that disaster even if it failed for other reasons.

    6. Re:I guess I'll see by Antipater · · Score: 2

      In Planetside, you started out with enough Cert Points that you could get/use any gun in the game at level 1. Of course, grinding out more levels allowed you to have more guns at the ready without re-speccing, but that certainly wasn't a requirement to win or have fun. And given that it was a PvP game, I'm not sure if "killing more people" really qualified as grinding anyway.

      --
      Everything is better with chainsaws.
    7. Re:I guess I'll see by AlphaWolf_HK · · Score: 1

      Every new expansion it's "Hey look, some new evil power has taken over and it's time to replace all of your raid epics with shitty mob loot and run fetch three gold clovers and a deer antler for this quest NPC about 200 times until you reach the new level cap. After that run heroics over and over again for 60 hours for the next two weeks, which are just scaled up versions of the regular dungeons you went into while leveling. And then you can start raiding to see a new twist on the same shit you did when the last expansion came out."

      I mainly played that game just for the PVP, but in wrath they really dumbed down the talent trees because they failed to balance arenas, and I heard that in MoP they REALLY dumbed them down, and meanwhile they've still yet to figure out that instant heals from 1% to 100% health with long ass CC chains where the objective is to make it so that the other healer can't do anything (either running out of mana or being put in a long CC chain) long enough for somebody to die isn't that fun, nor is grinding the same battleground 40 times to get an epic glove that fun either.

      For me it was about world pvp, but they killed that during cataclysm when they made the town guards cc you and then hit like nuclear bombs as evidently they didn't want you doing that either, even in a PVP realm where that's the whole point, so I just quit.

      --
      Careful with names containing L slashdot.org/~AiphaWolf_HK slashdot.org/~AlphaWoif_HK slashdot.org/~AiphaWoif_HK
    8. Re: I guess I'll see by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Eve. Just steal.

    9. Re:I guess I'll see by neorush · · Score: 1

      Darkfall tried this, the mechanics were just abused (their are no "levels"). So instead of grinding, people would macro their guy into doing the basic task to up that skill. On paper Darkfall looked awesome, it may have been implemented poorly, but I'm not sure there is a way to do it otherwise. If you're not grinding...how else do you make it hard to level up?...that is the question....

      --
      neorush
    10. Re:I guess I'll see by AlphaWolf_HK · · Score: 2, Informative

      Hell, just hop in WvW and murder people. You can level up that way.

      Sure if you just want to level up, and do so really slowly. However once you hit level cap, there's still a lot of grinding to do. You have to grind faction reputations, you have to grind heroic dungeons, you have to grind professions, and if you want to pvp you have to grind battlegrounds.

      WoW is a game full of chores, with you having an assload of chores to do each time there's a new expansion before you can start doing endgame content.

      --
      Careful with names containing L slashdot.org/~AiphaWolf_HK slashdot.org/~AlphaWoif_HK slashdot.org/~AiphaWoif_HK
    11. Re:I guess I'll see by s.petry · · Score: 1

      Do you still have to grind to get anywhere? If so, I won't be back.

      That's kind of a silly question isn't it? Progressive MMOs are all about the grind for enough gear to grind tougher mobs to get better gear to grind tougher mobs, etc... I enjoyed WoW early on, but don't feel like devoting that much time to a "game". If they ever get rid of the Flintstones graphics look I may go back and peek around, but no interest in the crazy cartoon look of the game as a time waster.

      --

      -The wise argue that there are few absolutes, the fool argues that there are no probabilities.

    12. Re:I guess I'll see by Luckyo · · Score: 3, Informative

      GW2 grind is souldcrushingly long and tedious, as the game not only has far more grind than WoW ever it, it does the grind in a massively boring way, just like GW1 did. You just repeat the same small subset of actions in the same place all over and over and over and over again. I absolutely love their art, which is by far the best in the industry, but gameplay was remarkably boring after a few hours with very little depth and grind was just soul crushing. And I say this as someone who played GW1 for years, where best form of farm was running two instances with a solo build that could be (and widely was) botted.

      WoW felt like a game of LoL in terms of speed of character progression in comparison to GW2.

      As for WvW, you either don't understand how it works and bought arenanet's lie about scaling, or are intentionally misrepresenting the facts. Sure, you get boosted to maximum level but without gear, you're a useless dead weight. It gives you levels but without all the stats that come from level-specific gear, meaning one properly geared lvl80 can easily drop 5-7 scaled up low level guys and not break a sweat in the process. Done that myself several times on a warrior and elementalist before quitting the game.

      Imho if you want to get into GW2, stick to PvE, go through the storyline once and quit. Because once you have done so, you enjoyed all the enjoyable content that game has to offer. Rest is simply about monetizing the wealthy min-maxers who can't be bothered to grind for months of redoing same easy instances for gear tokens, AoE bot the events for karma or botting gold.

    13. Re:I guess I'll see by Luckyo · · Score: 2

      He's talking about GW2 world vs world mode. He's also either ignorant or lying about its mechanics, as scaling in that game only scales your level and base health, and in that game vast majority of stats at maximum level come from gear that requires maximum level and is massively more powerful than even gear that requires one level less than max, much less the crappy starter gear.

      A decent player in exotic lvl80 gear can easily take many low level scaled up people and never break a sweat.

    14. Re:I guess I'll see by X0563511 · · Score: 1

      What do you mean have to? You don't have to do any of that shit.

      --
      For large sets, this will be our guide even unto death, for the LORD will work for each type of data it is applied to...
    15. Re:I guess I'll see by X0563511 · · Score: 1

      I dunno, I function perfectly fine in WvW with a level in the 10s or 20s. I don't expect to lead the pack or run around in a 3 person squad and succeed, but I can certainly function fine with the larger mass. I even get kills!

      --
      For large sets, this will be our guide even unto death, for the LORD will work for each type of data it is applied to...
    16. Re:I guess I'll see by Fjandr · · Score: 1

      Depends on your definition of "grind." If you mean killing the same things over and over to get anywhere, there are a numbers of MMOs without a grinding requirement.

    17. Re:I guess I'll see by Luckyo · · Score: 1

      Oh, you can grind it perfectly fine. All you need to do is find the zerg, pretend they're NPCs and sit next to them occasionally throwing in AoE to tag necessary stuff. Congratulations, you now know why botting is rampant in GW2 WvW. It makes no sense not to bot it. It's good income of gold and karma and actions of individual players and most squads are largely pointless in the large scheme of things. So just relax, turn on your favorite botting software and go do something fun while it grinds karma and gold for you for months.

      In fact, that describes the entire game very well. The best way to get value out of GW2 is to simply treat everyone in the game as NPCs, including other players. The game is built on the assumption that you will do so by making communication all but pointless. The appropriate solution to most problems is to just zerg objectives with "N"PC zerg.

      And of course, there's the whole pay to win aspect of the game, as you can effectively everything including the legendaries in the game by simply paying money to arenanet.

    18. Re:I guess I'll see by Luckyo · · Score: 1

      Should be "effectively buy everything" in the end. I'm sleepy...

    19. Re:I guess I'll see by Greyfox · · Score: 5, Funny

      I'm currently writing an MMORGY where grinding is the ONLY requirement! Level cap's 69, armor types are Latex, Leather and None, no questing (just grinding!) Only weapon you can equip is a whip! It's going to make ONE BILLION DOLLARS!

      --

      I'm trying to teach myself to set people on fire with my mind... Is it hot in here?

    20. Re:I guess I'll see by neiras · · Score: 1

      Timeless Isle.

    21. Re:I guess I'll see by painandgreed · · Score: 1

      I'm currently writing an MMORGY where grinding is the ONLY requirement! Level cap's 69, armor types are Latex, Leather and None, no questing (just grinding!) Only weapon you can equip is a whip! It's going to make ONE BILLION DOLLARS!

      Not buying it until it supports riding crop as a weapon.

    22. Re: I guess I'll see by Opportunist · · Score: 1

      At least as long as you don't bother with mining or PvE, or any other activity that makes ISK.

      --
      We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
    23. Re:I guess I'll see by Opportunist · · Score: 1

      With blackjack and hookers?

      --
      We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
    24. Re:I guess I'll see by painandgreed · · Score: 1

      Has there ever been an MMO where grinding wasn't a requirement?

      Considering that people use "grinding" for whatever game play that prevents instant gratification, probably not.

    25. Re:I guess I'll see by Barlo_Mung_42 · · Score: 1

      You can probably pay cash to skip most of the grinding.

    26. Re:I guess I'll see by Opportunist · · Score: 1

      Erh... how else could you possibly keep the game running?

      They have to do that. It only works that way that the gear you so painstakingly raided for, weeks after weeks, that you accumulated over months of game time becomes utterly worthless with the next expansion because the first green random drop from some trash mob blows the snot off your "epic" gear. Yes, it sucks for the long time player, but it is the only way to keep the game going. Simply because it's the only way they could possibly attract new players. Consider this: The game is close to a decade old. Now imagine you'd have to climb your way ALL the way through ALL the content so far. Let's for a moment assume that it was even still possible. NOBODY would bother to start a new character or even start playing altogether, simply because they would see that not only are they at least 5-8 years behind the current content, the chance to get the necessary groups together for those level 60 raids are slim to zero. But mostly, who would like to start playing a game, knowing that they'd have to play with some dedication for YEARS to finally be "allowed" to play the current content?

      So they have to fastpass new players where older ones had to use the winding road and do sub- and prequests for various raids, or allow them to bypass the raids altogether.

      Something similar applies to them practically disallowing town raids. Most servers have a, let's say, lopsided balance. In other words, it becomes rather difficult for one side to even get their quests done sensibly if their quest NPCs are constantly being killed.

      --
      We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
    27. Re:I guess I'll see by Greyfox · · Score: 1

      If you've watched any of the MMOs, you know how to play that game! We'll release the riding crop a month after the initial release as a $10 DLC. Ha ha. Ha ha ha! Muahahahahah!

      --

      I'm trying to teach myself to set people on fire with my mind... Is it hot in here?

    28. Re:I guess I'll see by Cammi · · Score: 1

      Never had to grind to get anywhere. You were only playing it wrong.

    29. Re:I guess I'll see by Karzz1 · · Score: 1

      Do the timeless isle "Treasure, Treasure Everywhere" achievement.

      --
      Beware of he who would deny you access to information, for in his heart he dreams himself your master.
    30. Re:I guess I'll see by AK+Marc · · Score: 1

      Well, the blackjack is broken...

      --
      Learn to love Alaska
    31. Re:I guess I'll see by BaldingByMicrosoft · · Score: 1

      Mmm hmm:
      http://www.eveonline.com/

    32. Re:I guess I'll see by Miseph · · Score: 1

      So... Second Life? Why?

      --
      Try not to take me more seriously than I take myself.
    33. Re:I guess I'll see by Zynder · · Score: 1

      Forget it then!

    34. Re:I guess I'll see by TheLink · · Score: 1

      I haven't played GW2, but regarding GW1, other than the silly unlock skills and gear for PvP bullshit, very little grinding is _required_ even in PvE.

      You want the fancy armor - yes you grind. But the fancy armor has the SAME STATS as the armor you don't really need to grind for. It just looks nicer (or not depending on your tastes).

      You can play and experience all the story content including the elite areas just as well without the fancy armor. Having the fancy armor doesn't help you do better at all.

      If you want to play the grinding game and grind for consumables, fancier armor, weapons, titles, yes GW1 allows you to grind, but it's silly to then complain about the grind right? I haven't needed to grind for consumables so far.

      The only exception I can see is if you want stuff like a 7 requirement 16 armor shield... Then yes you may need to grind to get that. That said I got one and kept it through sheer luck - I was a noob when I got it - and kept it without knowing the value of it :). You don't actually need it though. Player skill, teamwork and tactics matter far more in PvP than having rare gear like this.

      For GW1 they don't need the grinding because they've already got the money upfront from the players! They don't need gameplay that "compels" them to come back every day. They do need enough people around so that players have other players to play with, but that's about it.

      GW1 can be boring if you do the same thing over and over again. But the game doesn't actually force you to do that. You can use some rather weird builds for fun. I currently use a hero ele rit as a healer and a necro as a illusion mesmer :).

      --
    35. Re:I guess I'll see by AlphaWolf_HK · · Score: 1

      Erh... how else could you possibly keep the game running?

      Do we really need endless faction reputation? Do we really have to recycle dungeons to give "something to do"? Do we really need "kill some bird things and get three of their feathers and put them in my hat" quests? Especially the ones where the feathers only drop from one out of every 20 mobs? Cata they said they would end that but there were still plenty of them. Also, you know something is wrong with battlegrounds when people would rather bot them than actually play.

      Something similar applies to them practically disallowing town raids. Most servers have a, let's say, lopsided balance. In other words, it becomes rather difficult for one side to even get their quests done sensibly if their quest NPCs are constantly being killed.

      That's really not supposed to matter according to their own rules ("if there's a pvp solution available") and I'm actually talking about the neutral areas. The servers are so dead that neutral areas are pretty much the only place to even find somebody. And I didn't do raids, I would gank solo - raids were still just as easy because you get a proper tank to hold them while everybody else nukes.

      --
      Careful with names containing L slashdot.org/~AiphaWolf_HK slashdot.org/~AlphaWoif_HK slashdot.org/~AiphaWoif_HK
    36. Re:I guess I'll see by Luckyo · · Score: 1

      I have bad news for you. All commercial games' main point is to get as much money as possible.

      It's just that GW2 goes it in exceptionally user-hostile way of pure pay to win by selling you in game money for real money, and allowing in game money to buy the best, most rare gear in the game (legendaries).

    37. Re:I guess I'll see by Luckyo · · Score: 1

      Unfortunately they didn't see it that way in GW2. Hence the entire problem with massive grind and pay to win selling in game currency that can buy essentially everything including the legendaries for real money.

      They chose to monetize all of the progression, which brought in game currency inflation to hilarious heights as everyone and their grandmother has to bot for gold if they're not grinding materials required for legendary.

    38. Re:I guess I'll see by Clsid · · Score: 1

      I tried a lot to like GW2, with its fancy graphics and good pvp, open world progression, no level requirements for a lot of stuff, but to be honest, in my case it just wasn't as fun as WoW. To the point where I actually started playing WoW again, and one of the things that really shine are the professions, even if you play WoW solo the game delivers in a very simplistic manner one hell of an experience.

    39. Re:I guess I'll see by citizenr · · Score: 1

      Has there ever been an MMO where grinding wasn't a requirement?

      Eve Online

      --
      Who logs in to gdm? Not I, said the duck.
    40. Re:I guess I'll see by AK+Marc · · Score: 1

      World building is a grind. Every game is a grind. You are supposed to enjoy the grind. Or change games.

      --
      Learn to love Alaska
    41. Re:I guess I'll see by gl4ss · · Score: 1

      it's not the grinding itself that sucks.. life's a grind.

      it's grinding the same fucking content that sucks,which is why I quit wow.

      --
      world was created 5 seconds before this post as it is.
    42. Re:I guess I'll see by roscocoltran · · Score: 1

      GW2 grind is souldcrushingly long and tedious, as the game not only has far more grind than WoW ever it, it does the grind in a massively boring way, just like GW1 did. You just repeat the same small subset of actions in the same place all over and over and over and over again. I absolutely love their art, which is by far the best in the industry, but gameplay was remarkably boring after a few hours with very little depth and grind was just soul crushing. And I say this as someone who played GW1 for years, where best form of farm was running two instances with a solo build that could be (and widely was) botted.

      What are you talking about ? All my guild was unanimous when they said that the leveling in GW2 was the coolest one they've seen in a MMO for a long time. And that was the same for me. The levels came to me like nothing, I just traveled in a beautiful world and I even posted scrrenshots, a thing that I never do usualy. And one day I was 80.
      But nothing stops you from camping a place and doing the same stuff if you want to, just like IRL.

      GW2 was the most refreshing MMO I've played in a long time.

    43. Re:I guess I'll see by TheLink · · Score: 1

      I don't play GW2 (sure seems more like WoW[1] than GW1, so not going to bother at least for now), but from what I see the GW2 players can't even agree whether there's inflation or deflation.

      http://www.guildwars2guru.com/topic/76265-inflation-out-of-hand-or-alright-for-now/
      https://forum-en.guildwars2.com/forum/archive/jubilee/Do-you-notice-inflation

      As for massive grind, if you want to max level and get the best gear etc ASAP, I can see how you'd have to grind in GW2 (and I don't like games like that). But given your complaint about grinding in GW1, maybe your playing style also tends too much towards grinding? If you really do enjoy blowing your way through to the end game and getting all the "best stuff" then do so by all means (some really do- even compete to be the first to hit max etc), but you don't seem to find that fun. So in GW2 is it possible to relax and play through the content without grinding? In GW1 it was possible. OK GW Prophecies was more grindy, but Factions was almost "sneeze and gain a level" ;)...

      [1] For example: gear makes a significant difference and so grinding for gear makes a significant difference in how well you do. Not merely how stylish you look while you are kicking ass or getting your ass kicked ;).

      --
    44. Re:I guess I'll see by seanvaandering · · Score: 1

      Has there ever been an MMO where grinding wasn't a requirement?

      Eve Online

      You've got to be kidding. Unless your running around space in a pod, how do you gain the skills to get a decent ship? How you do get ISK to afford such a ship? Completing quests or mining ore or begging in newcomer channels is a grind in itself.

    45. Re:I guess I'll see by seanvaandering · · Score: 1

      Don't forget that if your done the Legendary questline, you'd have your cape and be grinding Ordos for 559 Warforged gear every week, plus killing a celestial every week for your 553 normal PVE/PVP gear drop.

      Right now that's all my toon is doing - daily grinds for the Shaohao reputation gain (for the mount that costs 100,000 timeless coins), a dungeon and scenario here and there for the 80+50 daily valor and the quest weeklies. I valor cap by Sunday normally, and spend about 2-4 hours a week in game. Anything more and i'd sound like all the haters in here and act all burnt out, but i still love the game and will be there on day one, ready to level my three 90's to 100's.

    46. Re:I guess I'll see by alexgieg · · Score: 1

      Erh... how else could you possibly keep the game running?

      They could have a level scale for every different content. Let's say you start a character at "snow region" and does all its content, thus becoming a specialist at surviving there. You'd be a "snow specialist level 10". But your knowledge doesn't transfer to deserts. Or forests. Or dungeons. Or alien worlds. Or dream dimensions. Etc. etc. etc. So whenever you want to experience a specific new content you start that kind of content at level 1 and have to progress to become proficient at that.

      Then comes a new forest expansion. It could extent the "forest" range to 20 or whatever. So you create a new player and want to experiment the new content, you go to the original forest region, get to 10, then sidestep directly to the new expansion, continuing from 11.

      Alternative options: do it based on creature types, or magic types, or whatever really.

      In short, there are ways to make things works so that you can expect to experience old content and new content without having to advance through 80 levels of unrelated stuff or being jumped to level 90.

      --
      Conservatism: (n.) love of the existing evils. Liberalism: (n.) desire to substitute new evils for the existing ones.
    47. Re:I guess I'll see by Opportunist · · Score: 1

      Oh yeah, and then deal with the whining on the board "why did you create content for X and not for Y, nerf X" ... "So create a Y" ... "But I wanted to play X!" ... whine, bitch, troll...

      --
      We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
    48. Re:I guess I'll see by citizenr · · Score: 1

      Eve Online

      You've got to be kidding. Unless your running around space in a pod, how do you gain the skills to get a decent ship? How you do get ISK to afford such a ship? Completing quests or mining ore or begging in newcomer channels is a grind in itself.

      There is no grinding, skills accumulate over time.
      You can buy ISK straight from CCP = no need to run stupid missions.

      --
      Who logs in to gdm? Not I, said the duck.
    49. Re:I guess I'll see by Luckyo · · Score: 1

      Interesting. I was playing since the start, and I remember seeing first half assed AoE event botters when I hit level 10 just a couple of days after release. And there was a LOT of them withing just days after that. Because leveling in PvE, once you got your basic "priority order" was incredibly boring. Hell I played an elementalist just to make it at least challenging. With warrior, it was literally charge in, activate hundred blades, run to the next mob, charge in, activate hundred blades...
      So people just botted everything. I still remember coming back to the undead 80 zone on my second character, only to see that a good half of the zone was event AoE botters.

      I did appreciate the art, and it kept me playing long enough to get two characters to lvl80 just because I loved the views. I leveled by going in opposite directions (first character to the south, second to the north). The rest of the game was incredibly grindy and mediocre, except for combat system which was just bad because everything was about AoE and spamming hundred blades.

    50. Re:I guess I'll see by Luckyo · · Score: 1

      There is deflation of real money currency and inflation of in game currency, because there are less and less players willing to pay for the real money currency, and more and more botters grinding in game currency.

      And really, no. Unless by relaxing you mean botting the game. Because a lot of people ended up doing just that. Put their character up with an AoE macro on a known event boss spawn spot with many others and just leave the game farming your exp, gold and karma. There was a lot of that within days of release, which says a lot about the monotony of the gameplay.

    51. Re:I guess I'll see by Luckyo · · Score: 1

      WvW was never a competitive environment. It was a place to zerg for gold, karma and EXP. I was a part of a guild that had very active WvW group for a while, and we did manage to turn quite a few battles around with surgical strikes at certain sites in game, in the end, the mode was mostly about zerging and it was the zerg, not us determining the victory. If our zerg sucked or was too small, it didn't matter if we were awesome or sucked.

    52. Re:I guess I'll see by AlphaWolf_HK · · Score: 1

      Dude, do you know anything about the faction reputation system now? It's SO MUCH easier, they include numerous methods to gain rep, which can vary by faction, and they even have a system where you can boost other characters on your account once one gets to exalted.

      The problem isn't that it is too hard, the problem is that doing it necessitates repeating the same content time and time again to where you have already gotten tired of doing it, only to have to repeat it 500 more times after you've already realized how much you hate doing it.

      People like going back to older dungeons, modified with newer experiences. Hard to imagine, but for some people, that's a plus, not a negative.

      Which is fine I guess, only that you have to repeat that same experience multiple times every week for the next 18-24 months until a new expansion hits.

      Plenty yes, but plenty of variety too, as anybody who has played MOP knows, there's other choices like say the Paragons in Dread Wastes, or the Grummle escort in Kun-Lai, or the story quests in the Jade Forest.

      One of the things I remember the most about leveling alts was the fact that you pretty much had to go questing (even with the heirloom gear.) There was a point where BG's leveled faster than questing, but only at certain levels, and even then it was nerfed. That is aside the point though, the key word is "have to" as in it is a chore rather than something you "want to" do. A game shouldn't be "have to's" but rather "want to's". WoW has far too many "have to's".

      Well, yeah, they don't have a perfect way to detect bots. People choosing to let a bot do their work for them isn't proving something is itself bad, just that there are lazy people out there who will do anything for gain at minimal expense to their own time.

      The problem isn't that there are lazy people, the problem is that the game isn't fun enough to make the pursuit of the reward in itself a reward. It would be like creating the game Half-Life where you didn't want to play it, rather going through it was a chore you have to do just to get to the end just to see the g-man talk. The ending of half-life was actually kind of lame, but it was the play through itself that made the whole thing worthwhile. That is what a game should be, and that is what WoW currently is not.

      --
      Careful with names containing L slashdot.org/~AiphaWolf_HK slashdot.org/~AlphaWoif_HK slashdot.org/~AiphaWoif_HK
    53. Re:I guess I'll see by gajop · · Score: 1

      This.
      Also PvE was extremely disappointing, because as they broke the "holy trinity" (healer/tank/dps), most of the content was trivial, and the stuff that wasn't eventually got nerfed so everyone could do it.
      There weren't any real raids either.

    54. Re:I guess I'll see by antdude · · Score: 1

      When are the public beta and official releases? :P

      --
      Ant(Dude) @ Quality Foraged Links (AQFL.net) & The Ant Farm (antfarm.ma.cx / antfarm.home.dhs.org).
    55. Re:I guess I'll see by fractoid · · Score: 1

      [Disclaimer - it's been months since I last played GW2 as anything but "log on, run around, look at the new pretty things, and log back off."]

      The biggest problem with WvW is that players don't like being outnumbered and don't like being on the losing team. This results in players hopping between different PvP areas until they find one where their side has flooded the place, and sticking around there. This effectively adds a massive slippery slope mechanic to the PvP and guarantees that you will either be in a huge zerg with few-to-no opponents around, or you will be one of a scant handful being roflstomped by a flood of enemy players.

      The small group PvP arenas are pretty good. My biggest criticism (which may well have been fixed by now) is that there didn't seem to be any concept of a global queue, and so you have to quit out of your game periodically as players dropped out, and try and get in a more populated game.

      --
      Rampant carbon sequestration destroyed the Dinosaurs' tropical paradise. I'm here to help repair the damage.
  2. TL;DR: Time Travel by OverlordQ · · Score: 3, Funny

    TL;DR We ran out of ideas so here's some Time Travel to fuck up canon even more.

    --
    Your hair look like poop, Bob! - Wanker.
    1. Re:TL;DR: Time Travel by Moheeheeko · · Score: 1

      As I understand it, the time travel was to unfuck all of Metzen's lorerape.

    2. Re:TL;DR: Time Travel by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      As long as the time-swimming keeps the current hot Dranei, and the MMO players never have to even think about their Warcraft 3 model.

      (Alternately, that would be the best anti-player trolling, if the historic Dranei NPCs were the ugly things with the big mouths full of needle-teeth)

  3. I wanna upgrade! by Impy+the+Impiuos+Imp · · Score: 5, Funny

    > The expansion will also revamp a number of aging character models.

    I hope it has a butt slider so I can make my Draeni mini-cowgirl's booty more properly Kardashinesque.

    --
    (-1: Post disagrees with my already-settled worldview) is not a valid mod option.
  4. Re:Still stealin... by Moheeheeko · · Score: 2

    any 'new' feature added to WoW since BC has been a feature plucked from other mmo's, the transmog was taken from Aion

  5. Re:Still stealin... by Kidbro · · Score: 2

    And I'm sure EQ stole nothing from MUDs....

    --
    May we live long and die out
  6. Re:Still stealin... by sandytaru · · Score: 1

    At least the "Garrisons" are different from FFXI's Garrison, which was one of their very first group events and no one has done it since 2004. (18 people defending a fort from an attack... at an arbitrarily low level cap. Sure, let's force level 75s to drop to level 20 for this event!) It's a shame, too, since Garrison was the only source for the mannequin body parts required to have your own mannequin inside your Mog House.

    --
    Occasionally living proof of the Ballmer peak.
  7. I won't be back by acehole · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I played from launch up until just after BC came out and returned shortly just before CATA was released and left shortly after never to return.

    The game I loved is long dead, the soul was sucked out of it. You once knew all the people on your realm and could make 'friends' and contacts. Once they introduced the cross realm instancing it all stopped.

    The 40 mans were great fun and it was a sad day when they announced they were being removed from game. There were just things here and there that they streamlined the game for but it just well... didn't feel right.

    Purples used to mean 'epic' then part way through BC and most of WotLK it became the new green.

    Sorry Blizzard, you won't get me back.

    --
    Be you Admins? nay, we are but lusers!
    1. Re:I won't be back by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Purples used to mean 'epic' then part way through BC and most of WotLK it became the new green.

      I know what you mean about epics. I'm was a somewhat casual raider but epics were fun upgrades and hard to get back in BC and even Wrath. You'd shit your panties if you played right now. They added an area in Pandaria called the Timeless Isle that is pretty much a re-gearing zone. It's like an Oprah special: "You get a purple, and you get a purple, and you can have ANOTHER purple!" Open a chest, get a purple. Kill a boss (there's like 50 on the island respawning all the time), get a purple. Complete quests to get currency, buy purples.

    2. Re:I won't be back by Brian+Feldman · · Score: 1

      The magic's gone since they started seriously dumbing down the game at the end of TBC.... Have only done a trial period or two since then, totally unimpressed. Final Fantasy XIV is it now, unless that goes in a direction that is clearly upsetting to me. I am pretty damn nostalgic for old WoW memories, though. You can never go back.

      --
      Brian Fundakowski Feldman
    3. Re:I won't be back by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I never understood the "dumbing down." The game mechanics are better now than they have ever been. There are more abilities to juggle, more decisions to make about when to use them, and more complicated situations than ever existed in Vanilla or BC.

      I hear people say things like the game is dumbed down because purples are easier to get. That the color of the text of an item could possibly have any value to the mechanics of the game is completely absurd.

      Clearly there's more content for casual players now. That does not mean the game is dumbed down. The only thing I can get out of all this is that some people felt a sense of elitism because much of the game's best content was reserved only for people who spent their entire life playing and they felt special for getting to see it.

      Let me give you an example of how far the game has come: I have played a Rogue since beta. Originally, as a combat rogue you would stand behind the enemy, spam backstab, keep slice and dice up, and eviscerate in between.

      Now, I have two main attacks with the way I have chosen to specialize, which actually makes a difference in play style instead of requiring a cookie cutter spec to maximize the numbers: I have sinister strike to push a 3-tier buff cycle forward and shuriken toss to deal more damage and combo points for energy. The first two tiers: 10% and 20%, can be extended by avoiding spamming sinister strike, while the final 30% buff is one time only before it resets. I have to balance moving the buff cycle forward with exploiting shuriken toss. I use adrenaline rush strategically to push the buff cycle forward faster and shadow blades to build combo points during the extensible mid-buff period in which I can use shuriken toss until the buff is about to expire and refresh it with sinister strike. I also have buffs like smoke bomb to shield my group from damage or tricks of the trade to boost damage or offload threat. Managing this wisely enables me to outdamage everyone I have played with, and a few missteps can push me far behind, so it's important to pay attention and play skillfully. That's just getting started with the rotation complexity and doesn't even factor in the complexity of boss battle mechanics.

      WoW has come a long way from its origins. The mechanics have been expanded and perfected to a degree that no other RPG, online or offline, which I have ever played has achieved. It includes content for all types of player, from casual to hardcore, and that is not to its detriment.

    4. Re:I won't be back by angel'o'sphere · · Score: 1

      Wow, rogues got balanced and "weakened" so you now need a brain to play a rogue?

      What about the other classes? Warlocks are unplayable right now ... you don't need any brain anymore. (Did not play since march) As far as I can tell that is for all classes now. Hit random DPS buttons and you win, in pvp hit a random crowed control button.

      There is no "game mechanics" that got improved. The whole game degraded from expansion to expansion.

      The only phase where it imho was a really good game was end phase vanilla (with the burning crusade extensions, new talent tree etc.) and burning crusade itself.

      After that phase all (well most) classes got retarded talents, e.g. hunters that can jump backward 10 or more yards every second ...

      --
      Cost free eBook I read (by iBook/Kobo/Amazon/ObookO/Gutenberg etc.): "The Green Odyssey" by Philip Jose Farmer.
    5. Re:I won't be back by seanvaandering · · Score: 1

      So?

      I'm a casual player...and i'm sure i'm Blizzards target demographic - sorry, but if all the elitists left tommorow, WOW and Blizzard would still be here and very viable based on our casual subscriptions.

      To tell you the truth about Timeless isle, I honestly appreciate being able to mail 496 tokens to my other toons and get them up to speed instead of having to log in and grind them in dungeons or whatever else - I simply DON'T HAVE THE TIME to spend in game getting everything leveled up. Some of us have real jobs with families and just can't commit to the time requirements anymore. Who cares if they're purple and "epic" tokens.

    6. Re:I won't be back by slickepott · · Score: 1

      Tried WoW under Linux earlier this year and "it works" but far from as it should. Full gfx-settings under Windows and no problems with current 25 man raids. Under Linux it tries to kill itself with lowest settings.

    7. Re:I won't be back by pyrr · · Score: 1

      Well, that's sad. WoW under Wine used to be extremely stable and run at substantially higher FPS than it ran on Windows. This included high settings, far viewing distance, and raids. That was back during WotLK, though.

      I haven't played much since then, much less participated in raids. Running poorly on Linux is a dealbreaker for me, if indeed things have declined substantially since I last logged-in. For a stale franchise that's well past its peak, it seems to me that improving Linux support might unlock some additional player base. If they did such a thing deliberately and well, I'd think about returning. But what do I know?

  8. Re:Still stealin... by ArcadeMan · · Score: 1

    First of all, bringing models "up-to-date" means more people will stop playing WoW because their computers can't upgrade their GPUs (laptops and Macs). I already try to avoid going to KungFuPandaLand because my frame rate drops too much, if their update means I only get 10-15FPS everywhere then I'll stop playing.

    Secondly, Blizzard has put the following things (sort of) in World of Warcraft:
    - Plants vs Zombies
    - Farmville
    - Pokémon

    And you're asking for something original?

    A lot of people are going to switch to FF XIV: ARR, it doesn't matter what Blizzard do at this point. They should work on Titan instead of adding insipid crap to their current game.

    --
    Get free satoshi (Bitcoin) and Dogecoins
  9. Re:Future expansions... by ArcadeMan · · Score: 1

    I'm waiting for the Eorzea expansion with the new nekocat race.

    --
    Get free satoshi (Bitcoin) and Dogecoins
  10. Fuck Metzen & Street by Sable+Drakon · · Score: 1

    Seriously... They seem intent on not wanting money with the way they're treating this franchise.

    --
    The Amarri pray for god, the Caldari pray for profit. the Gallente pray for peace, but the Minmatar pray their ships hol
  11. Re:Still stealin... by spire3661 · · Score: 1

    Actually the floor level of graphics is rising VERY fast. Pumping out upscaled 1080p will be trivial for pretty much any CPU once broadwell comes on the scene.

    --
    Good-bye
  12. Re:Still stealin... by ArcadeMan · · Score: 1

    Does Broadwell mean Iris/Iris Pro?

    --
    Get free satoshi (Bitcoin) and Dogecoins
  13. 5 man content by yoshi_mon · · Score: 1, Interesting

    Obligatory WoW history: Started a few months into vanilla, ended that version as a Naxx 40 raider 9/15. Progression cleared everything in BC save the Sunwell and burned out of hardcore raiding. Took some time off during Wrath but came back for the end and did a fair amount of casual raiding as well as "fleet" building. (I had one of every class and had them all to the level cap.) Played Cata on and off but at most just leveled the fleet to cap. And then Mists hit and of all the versions of WoW it has been the one I have played the least. I leveled only 3 of my toons to the cap, no raiding other than LFR, and then left the game.

    And a number of things really turned me off to WoW with the direction they took with Mists:

    1. Lack of 5 man content. This is huge. When leveling up I really do like questing but without some 5 man content every now and then to break things up it can get a bit tedious. And the lack of 5 man content in Mists while leveling was unlike any previous version of WoW. Without a decent amount of 5 man content, while leveling, I will never go back to WoW.

    2. Daily grinds. I am not at all interested in doing daily quests really at all. Sometimes I might feel up to them but the idea of doing daily quests is not fun to me at all. And then locking things behind those quests was just the last nail in the coffin.

    3. Oversimplification. I get that the old talent trees were often just cut and pasted from EJ. But it is a lie to say that they did not make the game simpler by turning them into what they are now. The fact that you can no longer get them wrong shows that lie. And that goes for a lot of other things that they have done in the game as well such as spell downranking, stat simplification, and such. After playing Skyrim a lot lately I look back on my early play and think man I was doing that wrong but now I learned. I don't necessarily want Eve's learning curve but what they have now is not a curve at all.

    --

    Really, I know what I'm doing...Ohhhh, look at the shiny buttons!
    1. Re:5 man content by meta-monkey · · Score: 1, Insightful

      But the thing is, only bads ever got their talent builds wrong. They still won't know how to not stand in fire, but at least now you don't have to worry about them showing up in your LFR group with points evenly distributed in every tree.

      --
      We don't have a state-run media we have a media-run state.
    2. Re:5 man content by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Interesting

      1. 5-man content is the bane of all MMOs. It is the singular type of content that forces people to do things in a way that they don't want to do, which is any or all of the following: (a) group with strangers, (b) rely on less competent players for individual progress, (c) waste time waiting for a viable group to form. 5-man content is the reason why many players disregard MMOs completely as a viable genre, whether they realize that as the cause or not.

      3. There should never be a way to build your character "wrong". If that's possible, then what it means is that your talent trees are full of cruft, or simply unbalanced in a way that there is only a handful of viable builds when the choices are supposed to be limited only by the available selections. Oversimplification would happen if they simply removed all the minor choices and left you with (for example) three buttons, one for each viable build. That's effectively how it used to work, you had to press 31 buttons in order to generate the 1 build in that tree that everyone else was using. That's just bad design that can only be loved by min-maxers. Same goes for spell downranking, which was one step short of being an exploit. There should be no reason to use an inferior version of a spell. Doing so just means that you screwed up the design somewhere, and again only a min-maxer would look at this and think that using lower-version spells to spam throwaway conditions on opponents was a wonderful way to optimize a build.

    3. Re:5 man content by slickepott · · Score: 1

      Well instead of five man dungeons we now got LFR with 25 people. So 24 strangers which are often crap and can get away with it too since it's LFR difficulty. So if they don't want to meet people in a game then I suppose an MMO is the wrong place to be to begin with.

      And regarding talent trees I find that the MoP solution just makes the game far more boring. I don't feel enough of a different from the choices I make. They could just give me some fixed talents and I probably wouldn't notice. Was it with Cata they locked so you had to spend enough points in one tree to open another? That was the start of making it worse with talents. :)

      Using lower ranks of a spell however was not that interesting.

    4. Re:5 man content by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Interesting

      You're not up to date on this at all then.
      Blizzard acknowledged that their idea of grinding dailies in MoP was a mistake. They removed it. Way too late... but they did remove it.
      I agree with you that the lack of 5 man content is a bit disappointing.

      As for a one time copy-pasting of talent trees from the EJ website into the game being a meaningful measure of skill is absurd. There are less skills, sure, but you can actually CHOOSE which skill you want since they are all similarly powerful in each tier. Which you choose is a preference which you are not penalized for - and for heroics, it's often a good idea to swap them for various bosses as the optimal skills for each encounter vary.

      As for this simpler nonsense - it really has to stop. The game used to be fairly easy. The trick was to find 40 players who did not stand in fire, understood their rotation, and occasionally did something like dispell or stack. That easy mode has long been gone. Current tier bosses are basically undefeatable if everyone in the raid doesn't know in advance know all the mechanics - the transitions, the various debuffs, the kill priority orders, and everything else involved in every phase of the fight. The days of patchwerk are long gone and a single mistake from any player in the raid will often wipe the raid.
      The mechanics are so unforgiving that LFR is harder than normal these days because people like you know nothing of the fights and are forced to be carried by the people who do.
      The heroic modes are so bloody hard that there are only 64 of some 25,000 guilds (i.e. about 1,100 people of the 7+ million subscribers or 0.015%) beating current content. Even the world first type guilds with all their gear and amazing players can and do wipe on current heroic content (e.g. Dark Animus). As you are someone who has not raided in the last 2 xpacs (for LFR is NOT raiding), I would be obliged if you quit spreading this unfounded BS about things being simpler.

    5. Re:5 man content by slickepott · · Score: 1

      Seems like you got some of the problems at least.

      I didn't like the idea of LFR to begin with but I guess there is a point to it. However what we get now from Blizzard is four levels of the same RAID, from LFR to Heroic and no new instances at all since release. They got a few scenarios though but I honestly hate them and they're not the old five mans in any way.

      And daily grinds are indeed crap. I hate dailies and then they make them mandatory over time. At least they make them too important. I'd love to have normal quests I can run around and finish off instead. I can't pretend dailies are real content. It's all just Blizzard being lazy, just as with not creating five man dungeons.

      And talents as I wrote in a reply to one of your replies. I can't really feel they make a difference at the moment. Also being lazy I suppose.

      Blizzard got too lazy.

    6. Re:5 man content by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

      I don't feel enough of a different from the choices I make.

      As opposed to WoW before Mists, where you noticed a difference from your special-snowflake talent build in the form of (sometimes-dramatically) lower DPS? The "muh unique build" argument never had any credibility in a game where the measurement of performance is objectively quantifiable.

      Meanwhile, Team Fortress 2 fans complain about new weapons making the game's classes too customizable.

      Back in my day, you played video games because you wanted to have fun, not because you wanted to complain.

    7. Re:5 man content by yoshi_mon · · Score: 1

      Translation: Can't back up your talk with anything other than AC posts. And your lack of running anything other than MC during vanilla leads to your lack of understanding of how WoW was not always ezmode.

      (Big hint: Very few guilds got into Naxx40. It was not easy. AQ40 was not easy either. Getting Twins on farm was a big deal.)

      --

      Really, I know what I'm doing...Ohhhh, look at the shiny buttons!
    8. Re:5 man content by slickepott · · Score: 1

      The measure is also having fun. Didn't say things were perfect before because they weren't. But I do think it got even worse removing choices.
      You still notice difference if you gem incorrectly, should we remove that too?

      And you can still complain and have fun. ;)

  14. oh boy. by Xicor · · Score: 1

    i wonder how they are going to ruin this expansion like they did the last two. i also wonder how many million players they will lose this year.

  15. solution: Don't make it hard to level up. by zippthorne · · Score: 1

    Make every improvement in skill in one area balance with a loss of skill everywhere else. Then you basically end up with two kinds of players - those who focus on maintaining a few abilities to very high levels (a system like this doesn't really need a max if done right, as you can't do one thing only without doing anything else. Even traveling can have a cost - you level your walking skill while everything else deteriorates.), and those who try to balance out the things they do so that they can always do anything at an average level.

    The balance of such a system would probably be pretty hard to get right. You want there to be advantages to going the specialist route, but not be so advantageous that no one wants to be a generalist. There should be drawbacks to either choice.

    --
    Can you be Even More Awesome?!
  16. Neat, now ditch the crap you added on by rebelwarlock · · Score: 1

    I'll be back when they fix the fucking talent point system ("hur hur, users can't keep track of more than 4 points total") and murder every last panda.

  17. Meta-monkey killed WoW by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    This guy right here is one of many that killed WoW. He is one of the Elitist Jerks. The massive drop in WoW subs is people like him quitting because the non-hardcore people got access to "his" gated content without having to play 57 hours a day like he does. It eats his ass, so all he can do is unsub, go play EVE, and bitch on the forums about all those shitty n00bs.

  18. Re:Still stealin... by angel'o'sphere · · Score: 1

    What the heck is "FF XIV: ARR"?

    --
    Cost free eBook I read (by iBook/Kobo/Amazon/ObookO/Gutenberg etc.): "The Green Odyssey" by Philip Jose Farmer.
  19. What are you smoking? by SmallFurryCreature · · Score: 1

    GW2 doesn't require grinding?

    Lets see, legendary items, how long would you say it takes to aquire one? Down to the nearest month.

    New crafted ascended weapons bould down to one item, you can only get from endlessly grinding either puzzles or dungeons. You need lots and lots of them. Crafting at first is easy but the last levels explode with weapons going from requiring ONE item to FIVE.

    Items you buy with Laurels cost 50 or so, you can get 1 laurel per day and another 10 per month. So 1 item requires at least a month. There are 5 sloths. Forget about it if you got multiple alts.

    Oh sure, you can fight with lesser items, you just die a lot.

    Levelling up in GW2 is easy, getting gear so you can compete with other players, that is the grind.

    It ain't all that bad a game and if you just play it for fun without aiming to be really effective, well you can have a blast.

    But pretending it isn't a grind heavy game is just plain silly.

    --

    MMO Quests are like orgasms:

    You may solo them, I prefer them in a group.

  20. Re:Still stealin... by Tridus · · Score: 1

    It's the re-release of the worst game from 2010, and possibly the worst MMO ever launched.

    They basically built the game a second time, only with a lot less suck.

    --
    -- "So they told me that using the download page to download something was not something they anticipated." - Bill Gates
  21. World of Warcraft: Shark Resurrection by Tridus · · Score: 1

    We jumped the shark. We used the shark as a jump rope. We beat the shark to death with pandaland.

    Now we need to go back in time when the shark was still alive so we can beat it to death some more.

    Why? Because some people will buy anything.

    --
    -- "So they told me that using the download page to download something was not something they anticipated." - Bill Gates
    1. Re:World of Warcraft: Shark Resurrection by jcoleman · · Score: 1

      HEY EVERYBODY! Look at this guy, he is cooler than World of Warcraft players and wants us to know that!

  22. Re:Hahaha by Tridus · · Score: 1

    And all the people you're fighting are already dead.

    This is a time travel expansion. Because reasons.

    --
    -- "So they told me that using the download page to download something was not something they anticipated." - Bill Gates
  23. That didn't use to be true by SmallFurryCreature · · Score: 1

    Classic MMORPG's got ONE fixed fee max out of you and that was it. And you knew it and they knew it. You payed 14.95 max per month, no more, no less and they had to lure you to keep playing with more content.

    The thing I find really most amazing about "F2P" is just how fucking expensive it is. 14.95 once a month will buy you NOTHING. A legendary item in GW2 could easily be half a thousand to a thousand euro's with no discount for buying more gold. Who is that desperate?

    As for playing just the story... the story is a grind too. "Hello, we are baking cupcakesto day, oh wait all the eggs spawned monsters, kill 5 waves of mobs!" "Hai there an entire army has marched on the enemies strong hold for a gloryrious do or die battle... oh you go in all alone and kill 5 waves of mobs please".

    To make matters worse, there is one mission where you accompany some sniper plant people who kill everything with one shot. WTF? Where were they before OR after?

    GW2 is a Michael Bay summer block buster movie. Enjoyable but when the next movie comes alone you will have totally forgotten about it.

    --

    MMO Quests are like orgasms:

    You may solo them, I prefer them in a group.

    1. Re:That didn't use to be true by Slider451 · · Score: 1

      The difference between the subscription and the F2P model, at least in LOTRO (Lord of the Rings Online): Subscription = rental when you stop subscribing, any content (mostly zones) unlocked by the subscription becomes locked if you haven't purchased it. Pay = own You only pay once and will always have access to the content as long as the game is available. Note that both models require you to pay extra for expansions.

      --
      Nostalgia isn't what it used to be.
  24. Re:Hahaha by b1scuit · · Score: 1

    Which is why it's now just a chunk of a planet floating around in some weird space.

  25. So a newbie gets a 100? by Toad-san · · Score: 1

    While my trusty well-worn characters, having struggled their way through Pandaria to a 90, must now somehow level even more?

    Sigh ...

  26. No thank you blizzard. by Kodack · · Score: 1

    They could have given people this as the last expansion and maybe the game wouldn't have started hemoraghing players in record numbers. Maybe it would have been fun to play a little longer, if only for nostalgias sake.

    Instead they gave us kung fu pandas...........

    Nothing at all about the gaming experience has changed. You will quickly level up to the new cap by questing. You will then hit a brick wall you need gear to get over and that gear will take you months of grinding to get it. You will feel a sense of accomplishment for a month or two and then a new dungeon will be released that lets everybody else get gear that's better for a trivial amount of effort. Everybody will get new abilities that look and act different, but still make every class the same and good luck finding a place on your spell bar to place them because every character has several dozen abilities all left over from vanilla and countless expansions.

    You WILL
    grind for gold
    grind for rep
    grind for points

    Same game, slightly different graphics, exact same play style.

  27. Re:Still stealin... by axl917 · · Score: 1

    EQ was built directly on DikuMUD code; to this day I still don't buy into the joint statement

    http://www.dikumud.com/Everquest/Sworn.aspx

    at all.