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Australian Icebreaker Tries To Get Through To Stranded Antarctic Research Ship
The shipload of researchers and tourists stuck in the Antarctic ice are still stuck. A Chinese icebreaker, the Xue Long, or Snow Dragon, has gotten tantalizingly close but was hampered by "unusually thick ice." Now, an Australian vessel, the Aurora Australis, will attempt to rescue the 74 people aboard the MV Akademik Shokalskiy.
I believe in Darwin
I love how the NYT and BBC reports on this story completely neglect to mention that the stuck ship is full of climate scientists out to gather global warming evidence. Just a complete oversight I'm sure. Also: consensus.
Yea and Ice breaker should do one thing and do it well oh and be a file.
Repeal the 17th Amendment TODAY! Also Please Read http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/right-to-read.html
...They're just FUCKED, man!
Web cam for Aurora, hopefully will be on when they are getting close http://www.antarctica.gov.au/webcams/aurora '
I thought that allmost all the ice had melted away...
Everything I write is lies, read between the lines.
The good ship "Paul Ryan", which will anchor safely off the ice pack and send them pictures of the sailors aboard enjoying fine meals and swimming pools to give them incentive to break free of the ice on their own! We do these people no favours, killing them with kindness by "helping" them out of the jam they got themselves in. We can't have these ships oppressing us with their pleas of imminent personal disaster. ...and you thought that this one topic surely couldn't be dragged into American political crank-fests. My next post: how all this relates to gun control.
Some Antarctic ice thickening after massive Arctic ice thinning, is still a net global climate change; with plenty of potential ramifications --- most likely highly negative ramifications; when it comes to world climates: climate change = potential extinctions.
Naturally, the appearance in the middle of the summer of ice so thick that the icebreakers of multiple polefaring nations cannot penetrate it is proof of anthropogenic warming. You criticize our teachings in any way, and we will beat you to death with our sacred hockey sticks in the East District of Texas. Meanwhile, our last hope is to send in Chuck Norris with a shipload of thermite.
Risking a whoosh: South - penguins, North - polar bears. The northern ice extent has been receding dramatically over the past decades. Economically, it can be a boon, what with the Northern Sea Route and the Northwest Passage opening up, but the hapless animals will eventually have to suck it up and go extinct.
I am aware Antarctica is one of the coldest places on earth, yet when I lived 60 degrees away from the equator in Alaska it never got down to 7F (the degree in which salt water freezes) by summer. It would not even hit freezing until September or October?!This is not 90 degrees on the dead center of the geographic south pole or anything and is surrounded by water which moderates the climate.
The ice should be rapidly melting?!
http://saveie6.com/
Risking a whoosh ...
Relax. Comments as idiotic as AC's make a dull thud, not a whoosh.
Hey AC: Want to hang out with like minded people giggling inanely until they wet themselves? http://wattsupwiththat.com/2013/12/29/saving-the-antarctic-scientists-er-media-er-activists-er-tourists-trapped-by-sea-ice/#more-100034.
No polar bears in the Antarctic.
Penguins: Yes
Polar bears: No
I hope they don't get eaten by the polar bears
rewriting history since 2109
At least no one on board the MV Akademik Shokalskiy is sick or injured. Hopefully they have enough supplies to last a few more days.
Seriously, it's pretty easy to see extent values on the web. Antarctic is 1.5 million sq. km over average. Arctic is 0.6 million sq. km under average right now. Net = .9 million sq. km over average.
A boatload of CAGW scientists can't engineer their way out of the ice in the middle of the summer in the Academik. An extra half a million square miles of ice that's not supposed to be there. Stuck about 3500 miles south of Darwin. Awards all around.
I love how the NYT and BBC reports on this story completely neglect to mention that the stuck ship is full of climate scientists out to gather global warming evidence.
Just like you are vaguely hinting that locally colder than usual weather somehow is evidence that the climate is not changing. Do you have any conception of the difference between climate and weather?
ROFL!
I love how the NYT and BBC reports on this story completely neglect to mention that the stuck ship is full of climate scientists out to gather global warming evidence. Just a complete oversight I'm sure.
On Twitter, Documenting an Antarctic Journey and a Countdown to a Rescue
Four embedded videos from the expedition team. Including a seven minute introduction to the project.
Being serious here, since they are stuck in an ice pack, is it stable enough to get as close as possible then drive out to rescue them? Sure, you will lose the ship as its crushed into oblivion, but you will save the human lives.
No, i haven't seen overhead pictures, thus the question.
---- Booth was a patriot ----
multiple polefaring nations
That is an awesome phrase. Really opens up my vocabulary. Just think, the United States is one of only two great lake faring nations. What must those Alpsfaring nations think of us?
The Antarctic Sea Ice Extent is currently more than two standard deviations greater than the 1981 to 2010 average according to the NSIDC.
http://nsidc.org/data/seaice_index/images/daily_images/S_stddev_timeseries.png
Not what one would expect in a warming climate. Or maybe it is ... ex post.
Antarctica Sea Ice Reaches Record High: Doesn't Refute Global Warming
http://guardianlv.com/2013/09/antarctic-sea-ice-at-record-high-doesnt-refute-global-warming/
What's the volumetric difference?
Also why use ice area/volume as a standard of the global temperature?
How about them Hockeyroos?
Seriously, anyone thought about rescuing them using helicopters? Rescue the people, worry about the ship later...
I've got better things to do tonight than die.
Also why use ice area/volume as a standard of the global temperature?
"His name was James Damore."
Arctic (and Antarctic) scientists used to deliberately let their ship be frozen in over winter. Some guy on the ship was interviewed on NPR a couple days ago.. they have months of food, water, and fuel. It's more an inconvenience than a problem right now.
The last of the hapless crew having survived through cannibalism will die. Thus the un-happy fate of the 'anthropocene' "researchers" will end. A nasty tale on a nastier fallacy of Anthropogenic Global Warming.
... Aurora Australis hasn't been reporting its location since Christmas day.
The latest reported location for that vessel was recorded at 2013-12-25 07:33:00 (UTC), while it was at the latitude/longitude of: -65.78115 / 109.8082, with speed and course of 13.8 kn / 4Â, according to http://www.marinetraffic.com/en/ais/home/centerx:109.8082/centery:-65.78115/zoom:8/oldmmsi:503043000/olddate:lastknown
Muchas Gracias, Señor Edward Snowden !
So-called 'scientists' keep claiming that the sun is a source of heat, but when I get closer to the sun by climbing mountains it gets colder.
Explain that, eggheads.
Seriously, anyone thought about rescuing them using helicopters?
That has been thought of, and is being considered as the last resort.
The Chinese ice breaker, the Xue Long (Ice Dragon) has a chopper on board, and the vessel is only some 7KM away from the Russian vessel.
Muchas Gracias, Señor Edward Snowden !
I have seen articles by two different scientists in my local paper... one alleging that our recent floods were proof of global warming... the other claiming proof of global warming in the decade-long drought.
Rain, snow, ice, drought, wind, hurricanes, no hurricanes, tornadoes, no tornadoes, heat, cold, record highs, record lows -- ALL proof of global warming.
In fact, it doesn't matter what the weather does. Global Warming (TM) is real because it makes weather change, and the weather is changing, so Global Warming (TM) is real.
And remember, kids, God never lies, but he put dinosaur bones here to test your faith. He can't lie to you because He's God.
That I'm right, and you don't like it, doesn't mean I'm a troll.
The penguins ate all the polar bears in the Antarctic.
Be afraid. Be very afraid. :-p
Climate scientists on their way to study Global Warming, get stuck in the ice. They must have kicked a puppy to have karma that bad.
... perhaps because for years deniers have been looking for observations that buck the trend.
Yes Virginia - Polar Bears can swim and run on the ever thickening Ice!
I'm sure they can
But I'm also pretty sure they cant swim all the way to Antarctica .
By who? Under what conditions? With what verification?
So this is what basementfaring people are like.
Good to hear from a real climate scientist that knows their shit instead of a software developer telling every expert on the subject on the planet that they have got it wrong. Oh wait - looks like I got that backwards.
This sort of shit is not funny any more and just makes the people spreading it look like morons. They don't seem to understand that their arguments against expertise are undermining themselves unless they are also mediocre at what they do. To the above poster - I suggest leaving it to the entertainers and idiots in politics instead of indirectly shooting yourself in the foot.
Ambassador de Sadesky: There were those of us who fought against it, but in the end we could not keep up with the expense involved in the arms race, the space race, and the peace race. At the same time our people grumbled for more nylons and washing machines. Our doomsday scheme cost us just a small fraction of what we had been spending on defense in a single year. The deciding factor was when we learned that your country was working along similar lines, and we were afraid of a doomsday gap.
President Merkin Muffley: This is preposterous. I've never approved of anything like that.
Ambassador de Sadesky: Our source was the New York Times.
At least the Parent had the BALLS to say it...
That's why I am posting this anonymously
That's pretty funny David Miller, 52 Centennial Blvd., Saratoga, UT.
It's often common to refer to ships by the flag they sail under, but the research vessed Aurora Australis was actually designed and built by the Finns, so you could say it's a Finnish vessel, which kinda makes more sense than an Australian ice-breaker. And it's not a true ice-breaker, but another research vessel that happened to be in the vicinity; consequently at the time they, too, have been forced to back off. In a twist of irony (in the ironic sense of irony, I guess) the MV Akademik Shokalskiy is also Finnish-built, so it's actually a case of a Finnish research-vessel trying to save a Finnish research-vessel. Though right now it sounds like they're pretty much preparing to abandon ship and fly the crew to safety on the Chinese Snow Dragon once weather allows.
... perhaps because for years deniers have been looking for observations that buck the trend.
Strange, when I was a kid, we called looking for observations that counter a scientific theory "science".
-- "Government is the great fiction through which everybody endeavors to live at the expense of everybody else."
It may indirectly help Linux grow on the desktop, because of the increased visibility of penguins during this operation. Maybe 2014 will be the year ?
You know..like free advertisement, like when they use Macbook Pros in TV series.
This may have something to do with the difference between the Artic and the Antarctic. Increased temperatures have two different effects: they cause ice to melt; but they also increase evaporation of surrounding seawater, which increases moisture content in the atmosphere, which increases snowfall and hence the accumulation of new ice.
For some reason (possibly because the Antarctic is on land, so it can't melt from underneath?), the first effect dominates for the Arctic, and the second effect dominates for the Antarctic. Take a look here (and search down to the plot under the text "Antarctic Sea Ice Extent"). The long-term trend, over the last three decades, is for Arctic ice to shrink and Antarctic ice to grow. This story, which relates to unusually thick ice in the Antarctic, is entirely consistent with this trend.
Is it trapped forever? Will the ice crush it and cause a nasty little fuel spill? Or is the ship's hull strong enough that it will just be frozen in place either forever or until it can be salvaged?
winter just started in the northern hemisphere ( had a nice 75 degree day last week in va. havn't seen a frozen creek in years) doesn't that mean that summer just started in the southern hemisphere? not the "middle" of summer.
I believe that means "Nautical Miles" as in maritime measurements
I think you're proving his point. Was that your objective?
Huh...what?
Global Warming, I thought all of the ice was unusually thin and melting? These must of been pretty dumb scientists. :-P
If the earth became a ball of ice. It would still be blamed on global warming. The only possible thing that could disprove global warming is if the earth suddenly went through a 10 year period of zero temperature change in any region. That is about the only thing that could disprove Global Warming.
And if that happened, we'd have a much worse concern than global warming.
None of those issues mentioned are due to global warming. Rather, they're due to overfishing. And have been a significant problem even during the 70's when cold had people talking a mini ice age.
Heck, New England Cod has been in decline since before modern industry. Take the mismanagement of commercial fishing and multiply that by a population that is twice as big as it was in the 50's.
First off, it's not locally vague. It's been documented globally.
So here is the reason why Global Warming is bullshit science. It has zero ability to be proved.
Any big storm, earthquake tsunami, hurricane, tornado, snow storm, heat wave, drought = PROOF OF GLOBAL WARMING
But at the same time, GWA always decry local/regional not equal ...blah blah blah...you're such a stupid denier. Well you know what, we've shown major regional coolings. We've shown planetary coolings. Heck, we chould show you absolute proof. And you morons would still act the same.
Global Warming Alarmists are simply, religious nutjobs on par with well religious nut jobs and Apple fanbois.
Many of the warmists don't even realize that it is midsummer down there.
One of the funniest escapades in years getting stuck in the Antarctic sea ice in mid summer.
When it is colder than normal, sure it is weather not climate.
When it is hotter than normal - say with forest fires and droughts and with perhaps a tornado or two - then of course it is climate not weather.
But then, I'm sure you understand that.
A projection is.
In my definition, it is "if I have x, y, z, and it continues on path q, I can project that it will continue to do so with a given accuracy". But as soon as I open my big fat mouth and say that "q will be such", I've changed from a projection of a model to a prediction. And when ALL of those predictions are wrong and revised. You start sounding like the religious nutjob on the corner who keeps changing his sign reading the "End of the World is October 2011"
And yes, Newtonian physics fails at certain speeds. But at least Newton was able to replicate with a modicum of repeatability and prediction.
Something none of the GWA models have done. And we're not talking 1-2 years, but 1-2 decades of being off. That based on a mere 2-3 decades of seeming warming.
I'm not even saying the earth can't be warming. I'm just saying that those shouting it from rooftops have less accuracy than a JW.
A projection is.
In my definition, it is "if I have x, y, z, and it continues on path q, I can project that it will continue to do so with a given accuracy". But as soon as I open my big fat mouth and say that "q will be such", I've changed from a projection of a model to a prediction. And when ALL of those predictions are wrong and revised.
That's where I think you're mistaken; they don't say, "q will be such", they state something more like, "if q continues to be such, we expect ___ with an X% level of confidence" (ya know, like scientists tend to do).
I found this IPCC glossary:
Climate predictionA climate prediction or climate forecast is the result of an attempt to produce a most likely description or estimate of the actual evolution of the climate in the future, e.g. at seasonal, interannual or long-term time scales. See also: Climate projection and Climate (change) scenario.
vs
Climate projectionA projection of the response of the climate system to emission or concentration scenarios of greenhouse gases and aerosols, or radiative forcing scenarios, often based upon simulations by climate models. Climate projections are distinguished from climate predictions in order to emphasise that climate projections depend upon the emission/concentration/ radiative forcing scenario used, which are based on assumptions, concerning, e.g., future socio-economic and technological developments, that may or may not be realised, and are therefore subject to substantial uncertainty.
Finally, the IPCC projections are criticized for being, if anything, too conservative in their projections. Time and time again they've said X in Y years and in Y - Z years X is seen to be having an effect. And when something stupid does come out (Himalayan glaciers melting in 30 years), they correct it. Ya know, like scientists do.
Also, don't confuse media headlines with IPCC projections, just like you can't expect to see realistic scenes of IT in movies.
And please, check out the link a few posts above that points to the Ars Technica story where the comp sci prof has a look at the models - he was impressed - they're pretty good. Or, "all models are wrong, some are useful" and climate models are useful.
Delighted to hear it. Let me know when you come up with a better theory.
It appears that the attempt failed, at least for now.
https://secure3.aad.gov.au/proms/public/schedules/display_sitrep.cfm?bvs_id=19314
It appears the attempt failed, at least for now. https://secure3.aad.gov.au/proms/public/schedules/display_sitrep.cfm?bvs_id=19314