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Apple, Google, and Amazon's Quest For One Remote Control Is Futile
smaxp writes: "If the cable and satellite live television providers were to comment on the latest Amazon Fire TV or reports of the new Google Android and Apple TVs, it would likely be in the voice and character of Charlton Heston: 'We will give up our remotes when they are pried from our cold dead hands.' Amazon's Fire TV and the rumored Google Android and Apple TVs excite and then disappoint. At first glance, it looks like cable and satellite television are about to be outflanked and the eternal struggle with the TV remote and set-top box will be solved with an intuitive interface to search both live television and archival content from streamed online video companies such as Netflix. Sadly, it isn't so. The cable and satellite companies that provide live television have made sure this won’t happen, because putting Amazon in the forefront would make live television providers’ brands less relevant. Amazon would then also have a wedge to pry its way into the live television ecosystem."
We will give up our remotes when they are pried from our cold dead hands.
Somehow, I just cannot hear Mr. Heston using the passive voice to say that.
What part of `yes no` don't you understand?
Post Frist
From the headline, this looked like customers were rejecting some new, ugly, TV remote app that Apple, Google, and Amazon each had released a variant of.
From the summary, this looks like cable & satellite TV providers have the gall to want their name on the program search menu, which deeply offends Apple, Google, and Amazon.
At this rate, I suspect the actual linked article is a rather bland study of the inter-penguin behaviors of a group of rockhopper penguins during a 4 month observation that was initially proposed because the researcher thought the penguin-keeper at the zoo was hot.
Pretty much solves the problem. Hook up an HD Home Run Prime, you get 3 recorders, ability to play any media you want, netflix, hulu, probably more but I don't use any of the other services.
One remote
One UI
No cable company box rental, (they have to give you ONE cable card at no cost if you don't use their crappy box).
Extenders to allow a shared DVR experience using Xbox 360.
The problem you keep running into is you're using devices from a specific content provider, of course they are going to do everything they can to make sure THEY get top billing. You have to use equipment from someone who doesn't sell you the content if you want to actually get something that doesn't suck and doesn't lock (or try very hard) you into one content provider.
TiVo is another such example, though I don't know how well it integrates netflix and the like as I haven't used one since the first model was produced.
-- BitZtream
I know this isn't what you meant by "not wanting to give up our remotes," but am I the only one annoyed by Amazon for going with a bluetooth remote? I've already got a PS4 that won't work with my damned Harmony universal remote. I'll be damned if I'm adding another device that won't!
SJW's don't eliminate discrimination. They just expropriate it for themselves.
This is complete and utter rubbish. It may not be time now, but that doesn't mean that it won't happen. Media is converging, we are beginning to see a move away from traditional broadcasters towards creators dealing directly with the end users. It's going to take a little while before its possible, but it will happen.
The evidence? Youtube for one. The production values are increasing, more content providers are releasing via YouTube and surviving on the advertising revenue generated from there. WWE for another, they're in the process of going direct to customer, cutting out the middle man. More content providers will go this way once there is a reliable revenue stream.
If content providers go this way they will want their content to be available across all of these devices to maximise their reach. Perhaps it'll go the way of gaming, with the manufacturers paying for a small subset of exclusives initially but will that be sustainable in the long term? It's doubtful.
You may think me a tired, old, cynic. I'd have to disagree about the tired bit.
has anyone other than the raspberry pi people ever seen or used this protocol?
stop reinventing the fucking wheel for no other reason than the existing wheel isn't proprietary enough
All it says is that the cable and satellite companies won't let them. No content or analysis.
Really, most of us carry a computer in our pocket 99.9% of the time that dwarfs the entire Apollo space program, and nobody can figure out how to remotely control a plethora of network media devices in 2014?
Seriously?
-Styopa
I still think that Google lost the opportunity with the TV when selling the "Motorola Cable Box" unit to Arris: http://www.pcmag.com/article2/...
They had the opportunity on their hands to transform that unit and give a different kind of life to cable box subscribers.... too bad they didn't have vision for that.
I use my Samsung Galaxy S4 to control all of my devices (TV, DVD/Blu-Ray, DVR/Sat Box, Surround Sound, Roku, etc...) If only someone would make it so we can all control our living rooms by a smart phone app... Oh wait... :)
"I think you know what I'm talkin' about, Mr. President; We're gonna kill us a mummy!" - Bruce Campbell as Elvis Presley
There was one at our house. Well, lets be honets, it was me. As the youngest, I was told to change channels (only 2 to choose from on OTA broadcast so it was a binary selection), wiggle the rabbit ears, adjust volume, turn the TV on or off, move the TV stand a little to change the viewing angle, etc.
Now my kids have it lucky. I just make them find the remote controls :)
Don't blame me, I voted for Kodos
for live TV i usually only watch sports and i know which games are on which channels and at what times
my wife will watch some reality shows and she knows when they are on as well
for netflix i have profiles and lists set up
HBO Go i have a list as well
for premium movies i will rent from itunes or vudu. netflix is usually crap for a decent movie so i don't even bother searching for it
i don't know why anyone would sit down and search for a specific show playing live or on a streaming service. anyone who watches a show on TV knows the times that its on or will go to the cable provider's on demand service to watch it if they missed the last showing. or they will have it in their Hulu queue
I just assumed this was about positioning trojan spyboxes in everyone's living rooms in a contest to become the most valued data collection agency! Boy, am I relieved to hear it's just about entertainment! The face value version of this story sure is less scary than the real one.
Cloudiot: A person who does not see offsite storage as a way to lose control over access to his or her own data.
My Samsung Bluray Player already controls all of the mentioned content with one remote.
"We absolutely support your ability to have one remote control for everything... so long as it's produced by us and we lease it to you for a nominal monthly fee." -- Every programming provider ever.
The problem is not that 'nobody can figure out how'. The problem is that '*everybody* can figure out how' in their own little proprietary way. The x86 ecosystem of incredibly interchangeable components is sadly the exception rather than the rule of how businesses choose to operate.
XML is like violence. If it doesn't solve the problem, use more.
They screwed up the CEC control protocol so bad that nothing is compatible. They had a chance to spell out the CEC and then DEMAND that in order to use HDMI they must fully support CEC.
TV and device makers are all ran by major retards that think they need to have special "secret" command codes. and it's complete BS. a LG tv set should be able to control any HDMI device hooked up to it.
The blame lies at the feet of the idiots that Designed HDMI. They are the ones that need to be beaten with a sack of hot doorknobs.
Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.
I think that anybody that want to make a revolution and change the TV devices needs to focus first on the "Catalog of Contents".
Content is King! they said, but nobody focus on giving content. I think that an interesting thing to really out phase the regular broadcast TV network services and make a full Internet-TV reality is to start building a catalog of Live TV. Like YouTube, UStream, but that people can create their own Live TV channels and with an easy manageable EPG standard and that broadcasters little and big are free to put their signal on that catalog.
Everybody says that On Demand TV is the future, but they forgot about "Live TV" and local broadcast. The two ideas "On Demand" and "Live" need to merge.
Oh good, an article bemoaning policies in place by increasingly irrelevant television operators. This is me using Netflix and not caring.
Speak for yourself.
I gave up cable television years ago. I'm currently running a fileserver serving a combination of my own ripped media (300 seasons of TV-on-DVD/Blu, 600 or so films, a handful of purchased digital content) and a ton of pirated stuff. I live in a jurisdiction where this isn't illegal, and if I lived in a jurisdiction where it was illegal, I'd use a proxy and pirate anyway. My fileserver streams to AppleTV2s in every room with a TV. Each is hacked to run on XBMC, and I use a python script to synchronize play information between them. I have python scripts that automatically move downloaded files to the appropriate folders, I use ShowRSS to automatically pirate my TV, and I use a python script to scrape new release films from Rotten Tomatoes and pirate this too. I occasionally subscribe to Netflix, but only as a discovery mechanism and my use is rare. My tech-illiterate retirement-aged mother can use my TV just fine because it has an intuitive UI.
I don't say this to brag. Anyone can pirate, it's nothing to be proud of. Quite the opposite. I mention it because anyone can pirate. If you want to give up cable and satellite, give up cable and satellite. Pay for what you want to, let the companies deal with the consequences. I've actually never heard of a satisfied cable customer. "From our cold dead hands"? Of course not. It's a buyer's--or pirate's--market. Do what you want to do.
But they charge a monthly fee for what I presume is guide info and updates. One of the downsides is the Amazon app doesn't have access to the Prime features and there really aren't that many apps available. If I could put a cablecard in my Roku and attach a external drive to record shows to I would prefer that over my Tivo.
Isn't this iPhone thing you speak of the remote control for your TV?
Why oh why is it just Apple, Google and Amazon battling it out? Honestly Sony and Microsoft have a huge leg up on these guys already. And then there are the other 'small' companies out there that tried and failed, like Samsung. Sorry but why is this crap being posted? It's barely an article.
Once again, the invisible hand of the broken market pokes consumers in the eye.
I'm not surprised that the cable and satellite TV companies want to their branding and interface in front of Amazon and the like. But I thought the point of these boxes was so that eventually you don't need the cable and satellite TV companies and get everything steamed over the internet to the set-top box. Cable and satellite TV companies can't control the interface if you don't use their services.
Android/Apple App for each device.
Use your stupid phone/mp3 player.
Done in one.
With music, Apple had enough of a stranglehold over online sales that music companies had to relent and come to their senses with things like removing DRM.
It also meant they would sell through anyone, because they want to erode Apple's dominance of music sales.
Well either because the video guys were paying attention (ha!) or sheer blind luck, there's simply no one major player in online video distribution. So for any provider of content they are free to wind their way through one distributor, through a handful of selected distributors, or even just none attempting to create value through scarcity.
That's why you are going to see very few rational actions in the space anytime soon, because every video company can pursue whatever crazy idea springs to mind as there's no one clear path that the industry follows. It's every company for themselves, providers and distributors.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
A Sony DS3 w/ thumb keyboard connected to an HTPC running Xubuntu.
OK well I need another remote for the TV itself, but if I was using a PC monitor and separate speakers I wouldn't!
"When information is power, privacy is freedom" - Jah-Wren Ryel
Why not have one app per device You want to control?
Your phone could talk to the device(s) via the Internet, BlueTooth, WiFi, or IR.
Is it really that hard for Phillips, Vizio, ViewSonic, or anyone else to come out with 2 apps: one for Android and one for iOS to let the user control the device?
when they die.. wins!
01/01/01
Its also that you simply cannot get any two people/organizations to accept 'not invented here'. We can't even agree on how to fasten a windshield wiper to an arm or what pieces of plumbing should be used to screw something into a water pipe with.
Tivo actually eliminated my need for other remotes most of the time because it made the satellite box/cable box a slave to it. I liked that, because I was able to switch from directv to dish to comcast and get their new customer deals, plug in the box and my shows still recorded. The remote worked the tv well enough. Only problem I had was when I wanted to watch a dvd. Of course, after a bit the satellite/cable companies reduced them to using an IR blaster and then refused to fix little glitches that messed up show recording when an IR action failed.
If my google tv with the built in blu-ray player was still being updated and had apps for hulu and an amazon app that wasn't just a web browser, and if all the flash streaming sites hadn't excluded it from playing their content, that also was a pretty close universal/one remote product that even solved playing physical disks. In one remote I could control the cable/sat aspect, stream netflix, control the tv/audio equipment, and even browse sites.
Nobody will allow their content to be subjugated to middleware. Everyone wants their box to be the primary interface. No two companies will ever agree on the same things. Whatever compromise shows up will be a PITA for customers to deal with.
I said this in another thread... But in short, I bought a chromecast ($39), installed Plex on it, and gave my wife a tablet... She prefers it over the remote. She can browse content on the tablet, and then hit 'play', the TV is the remote display for the tablet. If the tablet had IR, she could lose the remote entirely but as it is, she still needs the remote to turn on the TV and set the Volume. In fact, she says I can remove the Acer Veriton that _was_ her Plex frontend (and the keyboard as well)...
Consumers aren't savvy enough to exert pressure, but if vendors would adopt and adhere to the industry's highest standard, then common mode interfaces would be possible. How about HDMI 2.0 CEC?
Area Man Constantly Mentioning He Doesn't Subscribe to Cable
the preceding comment is my own and in no way reflects the opinion of the Joint Chiefs of Staff
At first I thought they just hadn't heard of universal remotes, or programmable remotes...
I read the article, and wow, just some old fogey who thinks tech is moving too slowly for his tastes, and that live content providers lock-in with cable and satellite providers is unbreakable. My guess is that if the lock-in is so strong, and cable and satellite providers don't budge then the whole mess of them will go the way of the dodo in favour of new content providers that aren't so encumbered.
Hmm, the humour and sarcasm seem to have been be lost on you.
the current tv landscape has already been disrupted. It is only a matter of if networks and cable come kicking and screaming or become irrelevant. So far, looks like networks are choosing to become irrelevant.
I've not used one since I started modding my Emotiv headset, but you know what gets me is why in the hell have they not put them on Adam & Eve they'd be trillionaires overnight.
The basic premise of the argument is that live TV and satellite TV matter and they'll continue to call the shots.
And as long as the major professional and collegiate sport leagues have agreements with national and regional networks with blackout clauses, live TV will continue to call the shots.
The reality of the situation is that digital
Cable and satellite television are digital now.
on-demand services
Cable television offers on demand programming in addition to live programming.
Is there any such thing as a "standard" Bluetooth remote?
Yes. It's called an alphabetic keyboard. A lot of people use them to input text into tablet computers, and they make them for PCs too.
Sure the barrier to entry are lower and there is no subscription, but [YouTube] still control what you can and can not see, not to mention how you see it.
In what way? Point the web browser of your Android-based set-top device (be it Google or Fire) at any other website offering WebM or MP4 video, and should be able to display it.
Remote controls can be regulated. That's the civilized way to deal with such issues.
http://stephan.sugarmotor.org
So how does your tech-illiterate mother watch the ball game on your setup?
Seriously, these companies could easily solve this and with a dirt cheap solution.
I prefer the "u" in honour as it seems to be missing these days.
I want an app that controls vlc, netflix, hulu, amazon prime and youtube on my computer from my kindle fire. and monkey might fly out of my ass.
Nearly everything has a IP network interface of some kind in it and increasingly apps are available for them that allow WiFi remote control.
Sports.
It's the only sort of TV entertainment where the value of the product drops like a stone relative to the time since broadcast.
Game of Thrones? Awesome, can't wait, will download and watch it when I get some spare time.
Superbowl? I'm putting my life on hold so I can watch the broadcast in real time.
Live sports is the only sort of TV entertainment that is PIRACY-RESISTANT. That's where the money is, so that's where the content licensing battles will be fought.
No matter how much you try, there is always one button that each remote has, you need, and that cannot easily be duplicated on a universal. This is the same problem that we have with e-payment. A system that works for all cannot arise as each player wants to be the only game in town.