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The Magic of Pallets

HughPickens.com writes Jacob Hodes writes in Cabinet Magazine that there are approximately two billion wooden shipping pallets in the holds of tractor-trailers in the United States transporting Honey Nut Cheerios and oysters and penicillin and just about any other product you can think of. According to Hodes the magic of pallets is the magic of abstraction. "Take any object you like, pile it onto a pallet, and it becomes, simply, a "unit load"—standardized, cubical, and ideally suited to being scooped up by the tines of a forklift. This allows your Cheerios and your oysters to be whisked through the supply chain with great efficiency; the gains are so impressive, in fact, that many experts consider the pallet to be the most important materials-handling innovation of the twentieth century." Although the technology was in place by the mid-1920s, pallets didn't see widespread adoption until World War II, when the challenge of keeping eight million G.I.s supplied—"the most enormous single task of distribution ever accomplished anywhere," according to one historian—gave new urgency to the science of materials handling. "The pallet really made it possible for us to fight a war on two fronts the way that we did." It would have been impossible to supply military forces in both the European and Pacific theaters if logistics operations had been limited to manual labor and hand-loading cargo.

To get a sense of the productivity gains that were achieved, consider the time it took to unload a boxcar before the advent of pallets. "According to an article in a 1931 railway trade magazine, three days were required to unload a boxcar containing 13,000 cases of unpalletized canned goods. When the same amount of goods was loaded into the boxcar on pallets or skids, the identical task took only four hours." Pallets, of course, are merely one cog in the global machine for moving things and while shipping containers have had their due, the humble pallet is arguably "the single most important object in the global economy."

250 comments

  1. Like many inventions ... by BarbaraHudson · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Like many inventions, it's obvious with hind-sight. But palettes also required improvements elsewhere, such as factory floors that were reasonably level and solid, capable of supporting stacked palettes, and eventually racking.

    --
    "Transparent" is a shit show that trades on every stereotype going. A man in drag is NOT a transsexual.
    1. Re:Like many inventions ... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      And standardized shipping containers. They make everything else happen.

    2. Re:Like many inventions ... by Hognoxious · · Score: 1, Insightful

      Even without them, it's easier to shift palettes than individual boxes.

      --
      Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
    3. Re:Like many inventions ... by gatkinso · · Score: 1

      That was the whole point of the pallet - no standardized container.

      Forget the article - do we no longer even bother to read the summary?

      --
      I am very small, utmostly microscopic.
    4. Re:Like many inventions ... by gbjbaanb · · Score: 4, Insightful

      but isn't the pallet a standardised container - albeit without walls and a top?

      Its standard width, and length means it fits into standardised holes in warehouses and can be moved with standardised vehicles. The shipping container is no different except it has walls to keep stuff together.

      the point I take is that its the standardisation that matters. True in so many areas.

    5. Re:Like many inventions ... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

      Yes, I liked how palettes went from 16 colors on the Commodore 64, to 4096 on the original Amiga, then we had True Color and 24 bit and all that jazz.

      But what does this have to do with shipping pallets? Your comment has left a bad taste in my palate.

    6. Re:Like many inventions ... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      The pallet also has sides and (part of) a top. These days it's polyethylene wrap.

      Spent a few too many years loading and unloading trucks all night.

    7. Re:Like many inventions ... by SternisheFan · · Score: 1

      They're also quite easy to chainsaw up into firewood, dry enough to burn well.

    8. Re:Like many inventions ... by Euler · · Score: 2

      Yeah exactly, which came first? The pallet is virtually useless without the fork. I wonder if the fork jack was invented first, but people got tired of the lower row of boxes in every stack being punctured. :p Some innovative person somewhere thought about it and realized the need for a frame to support the stack of boxes over the forks. But how did they decide to call it a pallet?

    9. Re:Like many inventions ... by Euler · · Score: 1

      I would say a very loose standard. There are a variety of pallet dimensions. Sometimes you get stuck moving a pallet that the hand jack can't fit into.

      At least forklifts have more articulated and usually thinner tines that can be adjusted to fit pretty much everything.

    10. Re:Like many inventions ... by cascadingstylesheet · · Score: 3, Informative

      Like many inventions, it's obvious with hind-sight. But palettes also required improvements elsewhere, such as factory floors that were reasonably level and solid, capable of supporting stacked palettes, and eventually racking.

      Very true.

      "Humans passing things hand over hand" is actually a pretty cool "invention", when you think about it. Amazingly adaptable.

      We sure couldn't get pallets down the hatch of a submarine. Instead, everyone lined up, from the pier down to where we were stacking the cans.

    11. Re:Like many inventions ... by wagnerrp · · Score: 1

      Just make sure they're not chemically treated before tossing them in the fire.

    12. Re:Like many inventions ... by Deadstick · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Instead, everyone lined up, from the pier down to where we were stacking the cans.

      Time was, surface vessels got their fuel the same way: all the enlisted plus the ensigns passing sacks of coal.

    13. Re:Like many inventions ... by iggymanz · · Score: 1

      they burn a little too well, remember at a friend's apartment we suddenly had roaring flames coming out the top of the chimney with just a few pallet boards. we doused that in a hurry, "stack fire" in a 200 unit apartment building wouldn't be good.

    14. Re:Like many inventions ... by wagnerrp · · Score: 1

      It takes time to build pallets. It takes time to break apart, resort, and rebuild pallets. It costs money to repair and replace the pallets themselves. Pallets require extra ceiling space to actually pick them up and put them into a truck or container, resulting in wasted volume in that truck or container. The logistics industry is quickly moving away from pallets for everything but long term storage.

    15. Re:Like many inventions ... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      All that's happening is that a piece of corrugated cardboard is substituting for the pallet. Boxes are still being moved onto trucks in square blobs.

    16. Re:Like many inventions ... by ShanghaiBill · · Score: 1

      And standardized shipping containers. They make everything else happen.

      They didn't make pallets happen. Pallets were widely adopted during WW2. Standardized intermodal shipping containers were first used in the mid-1950s, and were not widely adopted until the 1960s.

    17. Re:Like many inventions ... by Jeremi · · Score: 2

      . But how did they decide to call it a pallet?

      I'm not sure about how that was decided, but I will note that an older definition of the word was "A temporary bed made from [straw] bedding arranged on the floor, especially for a child". Perhaps they envisioned the wooden frames as temporary beds for products to rest on?

      --


      I don't care if it's 90,000 hectares. That lake was not my doing.
    18. Re:Like many inventions ... by nitehawk214 · · Score: 1

      You need some standardization. Trucks and train cars need to be a certain width for the pallets to fit. Forklifts and pallet jacks need to be somewhat standard to fit the pallets.

      Granted it doesn't have to be terribly precise, but there has to be some kind of coordination.

      It reminds me of that old joke about why the Space Shuttle (and now SLS) design is influenced by the width of a horses ass.

      --
      I'm a good cook. I'm a fantastic eater. - Steven Brust
    19. Re:Like many inventions ... by nitehawk214 · · Score: 2

      Interesting. I bet you also needed to employ some interesting storage techniques because of the cramped quarters.

      Reminds me of this scene.

      --
      I'm a good cook. I'm a fantastic eater. - Steven Brust
    20. Re:Like many inventions ... by gl4ss · · Score: 2

      the shipping container is just one large box like pallet.
      why is it so hard for people to see that?

      anyways, either are an improvement over moving sacks..

      --
      world was created 5 seconds before this post as it is.
    21. Re:Like many inventions ... by TWX · · Score: 4, Informative

      The logistics industry is quickly moving away from pallets for everything but long term storage.

      Really?

      Last I saw, they're moving to flatter, sturdier, permanent-use molded plastic pallets that have integrated RFID and compartments for things like GPS and batteries, that are meant to be used for many years. Sure, pallets take some vertical space, but the amount of space taken is small compared to the ability for one person to move close to two tons of cargo single-handedly across smooth floors with no more than a jack.

      --
      Do not look into laser with remaining eye.
    22. Re:Like many inventions ... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

      I drove a semi and I can tell you the volume wasted by pallets is nothing compared to the orders. I hauled ONE bad 55 gallon drum of fucking juice 980 miles because the seller did not want the buyer to dispose it out of fear the buyer might keep it. What was wrong with it? En route it got knocked over on it's fucking side after a bad pallet broke. The return trip was around $1300..

      Most of the time my trailer was not stacked to the max except food run.

    23. Re:Like many inventions ... by wagnerrp · · Score: 1

      Sure, pallets take some vertical space, but the amount of space taken is small compared to the ability for one person to move close to two tons of cargo single-handedly across smooth floors with no more than a jack.

      That requires one person and one hand truck or fork lift to shuttle each pallet of two tons of cargo back and forth. It's cheap, but it's very low throughput, and it doesn't scale up to high throughput well. If you need high throughput, you're going to use conveyor. You use pallets for storage, for items that cannot be conveyed, or for things like LTL receiving where you can't keep the trailer, and don't want to hold up the driver while you hand unload.

    24. Re:Like many inventions ... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You know what invention is even more magical? The wheel.

    25. Re:Like many inventions ... by Hadlock · · Score: 2

      The Ford Transit was designed specifically to hold two euro-size pallets. Apparently the american pallet is about 30% larger than a euro pallet, but the euro-pallet is a lot easier to get up narrow stairways common in the ultra-dense cities of europe, south america, india, china etc and the smaller size allows the vehicle to get down streets and alleyways that a standard UPS van might not be capable of.

      --
      moox. for a new generation.
    26. Re: Like many inventions ... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You whippersnappers! In MY time we used to load fuel into the ship the RIGHT way: we would scoop up the fuel with our bare hands and splash it down the line! While having a smoke! Barechested uphill in the snow BOTH WAYS! And we LOVED it gawddammit!

    27. Re:Like many inventions ... by LordLimecat · · Score: 1

      The shipping container is different in that it can be hooked up to a truck and driven off.

    28. Re:Like many inventions ... by GNious · · Score: 2

      For as long as I've been working, the size of a EUR-pallet has been pretty fixed at 1200x800x144mm - sure, there are some variations, but the base-size still applies.
      There are some unofficial half-sized pallets, usually molded plastic, designed to fit 2 in the space of one EUR pallet.

      Outside of Europe? You still see EUR pallets, or cheap pallets made to ca the same size (but inferior quality).

    29. Re:Like many inventions ... by Chris+Mattern · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Time was, surface vessels got their fuel the same way: all the enlisted plus the ensigns passing sacks of coal.

      In the US Navy, they made a contest of it, too, starboard watch against port watch. If you made the ship list enough (because you filled the coal bunkers on your side so much faster), your side got extra leave.

    30. Re:Like many inventions ... by cascadingstylesheet · · Score: 2

      Interesting. I bet you also needed to employ some interesting storage techniques because of the cramped quarters.

      Reminds me of this scene.

      You bet correctly.

      For example, supplies like flour and lard came in tall rectangular "cans" (metal containers with a pry-off lid). We would strap those to the deckplates and then just walk on top of them.

    31. Re: Like many inventions ... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Cool. What did you get for capsizing it?

    32. Re:Like many inventions ... by Computershack · · Score: 5, Informative

      It takes time to build pallets. It takes time to break apart, resort, and rebuild pallets. It costs money to repair and replace the pallets themselves. Pallets require extra ceiling space to actually pick them up and put them into a truck or container, resulting in wasted volume in that truck or container. The logistics industry is quickly moving away from pallets for everything but long term storage.

      Actual truck driver here. No they're not or at least in Europe they're not. You can load a pallet onto a truck with just a couple of inches clearance, enough for the skids on the pallet not to slide along the floor. What actually determines pallet height and therefore wasted space in a truck is the racking at the warehouses. Its the spacing between the shelving on the racking. Rented pallets is the model used the most with Chep being the largest player in the world. Most large companies won't accept goods unless they're on Chep pallets, that's how well they're built and how well designed the rental system is. You don't need to worry about the time it takes to build pallets or repair them because Chep take care of that. You merely send one of your trucks in to a Chep factory en-route back to load up 300 pallets or get Chep to deliver them and collect the damaged ones.

      --
      I only please one person per day. Today is not your day. Tomorrow isn't looking good either. - Scott Adams
    33. Re:Like many inventions ... by Computershack · · Score: 5, Informative
      Thank you for demonstrating you have no fucking clue about haulage or logistics. The vast majority of goods are transported palletised. You can unload 3,000 cases of palletised goods far faster than two or three people stuck in the back of a semi-trailer can put them on a conveyer belt. It takes a warehouse 20 minutes to unload a full 26 pallet load semi-trailer, it takes 2hrs to unload 1500 cases on a conveyer belt. I should know, I've spent 20 years as a trucker.

      Please stop commenting about something you don't know shit about, you're just embarrassing yourself.

      --
      I only please one person per day. Today is not your day. Tomorrow isn't looking good either. - Scott Adams
    34. Re:Like many inventions ... by Computershack · · Score: 1

      I would say a very loose standard. There are a variety of pallet dimensions.

      Unless they're specifically made for a specific product they're either 40"x48", 48"x48" or Euro 1200x800.

      --
      I only please one person per day. Today is not your day. Tomorrow isn't looking good either. - Scott Adams
    35. Re:Like many inventions ... by TrentTheThief · · Score: 1

      You've missed a more basic requirement for pallets: Pallet trucks and forklifts.

      ---

      This post brought to you by the letter 'W' in LGBTtW (Lesbian, Gay, Bi, Transgender, transsexual, Who Cares?) ;-)

    36. Re:Like many inventions ... by drinkypoo · · Score: 1

      Seems to me like you're both right and both wrong, because pallets aren't going away, but I can see more conveyors being used to move pallets. You're more right than he is, though, because pallets aren't going away.

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    37. Re:Like many inventions ... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Why chainsaw them?

      Every outdoor party among highschool and college kids all throughout the 70s, 80s and 90s was warmed by a bonfire of burning pallets.

      You dont chop it up, you throw the whole damn pallet into the fire.

    38. Re:Like many inventions ... by shortscruffydave · · Score: 2

      Out of curiosity, how are the pallets packaged? Are they tehmselves bundled onto a pallet? (genuine question)

    39. Re:Like many inventions ... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      And where is this happening? Nowhere. Call up a carrier and ask about the shipping rates for palletized vs nonpalletized freight. Most US carriers won't even accept nonpalletized freight.

    40. Re:Like many inventions ... by jcorno · · Score: 2

      the euro-pallet is a lot easier to get up narrow stairways common in the ultra-dense cities of europe, south america, india, china etc and the smaller size allows the vehicle to get down streets and alleyways that a standard UPS van might not be capable of.

      The narrow streets I get, but how do you move a loaded pallet up a stairway?

    41. Re:Like many inventions ... by Hillgiant · · Score: 2

      Yes, actually. There is a niche in the logistics business of moving pallets from where they are unloaded to where they are loaded. Also, as others have indicated, there are cottage businesses associated with refurbishing and recycling damaged/end-of-life pallets.Some are just stacked. Fancy operations will strap them into pallet sized cubes.

      --
      -
    42. Re:Like many inventions ... by wagnerrp · · Score: 1

      You can unload 3,000 cases of palletised goods far faster than two or three people stuck in the back of a semi-trailer can put them on a conveyer belt. It takes a warehouse 20 minutes to unload a full 26 pallet load semi-trailer, it takes 2hrs to unload 1500 cases on a conveyer belt.

      That's only relevant if the driver and truck has to stay with the trailer. In a major distribution network where it's the same company on both ends, that does not apply.

    43. Re:Like many inventions ... by sudon't · · Score: 1

      Right, and don't forget, everything in the shipping container is on pallets. At least, you hope it is. Unloading a container, or a trailer, goes by pretty fast if everything is palletized. Takes hours when stuff is not.

      --
      -- sudon't

      Air-ride Equipped

    44. Re:Like many inventions ... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I live outside Europe, South America actually. And in this part of the world, we use 1200 mm x 1000 mm as our standard pallet size. And yes, the standardization is enormously beneficial to logistics operations.

    45. Re:Like many inventions ... by wagnerrp · · Score: 1

      And where is this happening?

      Anywhere you're shipping freight between two of your own facilities.

    46. Re:Like many inventions ... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      ... two trips over one,

      and speed is everything.

      we deliver to one customer that schedules in 15 minute increments, if you're late by 15 minutes, and they're having a busy day, you just made a dry run. Timing is tight on these, and getting stuff off the truck and where it needs to go in 20 minutes, i imagine that's important.

    47. Re:Like many inventions ... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yes they do. A nice 5-10 foot flame for about 3-5 minutes and then it is gone. I have a reliable legal source of pallets and a square fire pit in my yard that we hang out on occasion. In the US at least, the non chemically treated pallets are stamped/branded with a "HT" for heat treated on the side. That stamp seems to be accurate but occasionally I come across HT pallets with repaired treated pine boards attached.

      I've used full pallets and pieces for projects around the yard and house. Busting them down without completely destroying the wood is a challenge and an art in itself.

    48. Re:Like many inventions ... by wagnerrp · · Score: 1

      ... two trips over one,

      Unless the previous trailer just waits around until the next one is dropped off.

    49. Re:Like many inventions ... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Nobody in the US is moving away from pallets, that's for damned sure. Sure, there are improved kinds of pallets, but the idea of a pallet isn't going away anytime soon.

      Entire storage buildings have been built around pallets with a very specific maximum stack size. They call it "high cube storage", and pretty much every distribution warehouse has an area of HC. It's "high" because the maximum pallet stack size is the distance between shelves, and the shelves go to the ceiling of the warehouse. It's "cube" because the stack-height of the pallets are generally just a few inches shorter than their shortest platform dimension, making them "eyeball-cubical" (they're not exactly mathematically cubical, but close enough). The larger and fancier HC facilities are nearly fully automated. Automated forklifts retrieve cubes to a handling area where humans can access the cube's contents. They also store finished cubes from the handling area back into the HC warehouse.

      Nobody bothers to rent pallets here, though. They're basically considered a throw-away by the sender. You don't expect them back unless they're the ultra-fancy RFID ones or some kind of special purpose-built container (and in those cases, you arrange for the return trip so your recipient doesn't have to think about it too much). Basic wooden pallets are simply put to use by the recipient in the same way you might re-use a cardboard box. Shippers buy crap-tons of pallets with the understanding that they'll never come back. They also re-use pallets that they receive their materials on. It's sort of a "gentleman's agreement" situation in that regard, and the price is undoubtedly built in to the price of the goods being shipped. And damaged wooden pallets make great firewood. The fiberglass ones are less than stellar in that regard.

    50. Re:Like many inventions ... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I work for a logistics company. Our clients are US manufacturers and major retailers, some with thousands of locations. I assure you, intracompany freight is palletized. There may be a handful of exceptions, DC shipments to older stores that don't have loading docks (K-Mart), but it is not very common.

    51. Re:Like many inventions ... by Eunuchswear · · Score: 1

      We sure couldn't get pallets down the hatch of a submarine.

      Some of the HCSD minicomputers were specificaly designed around the size of a submarine hatch.

      --
      Watch this Heartland Institute video
    52. Re:Like many inventions ... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Most of the time, the difficulty moving a pallet with a pallet jack is caused by damage to the pallet.

    53. Re:Like many inventions ... by Deadstick · · Score: 1

      There was something like that in 19th-century fire departments. Their wagon had a storage tank and two pump/hose assemblies: one to suck up water from the nearest river, and one to spray it. The outflow pumpers tried to empty the tank, and the inflow pumpers tried to overflow it, with bragging rights hanging in the balance.

    54. Re:Like many inventions ... by wagnerrp · · Score: 1

      My visibility may be skewed for only facilities with conveyor systems, but every high volume distribution center I've seen either does fluid loading, is in the process of transitioning to fluid loading, or is seriously considering fluid loading, rather than pallet loading.

    55. Re:Like many inventions ... by DanielRavenNest · · Score: 3, Informative

      > It reminds me of that old joke about why the Space Shuttle (and now SLS) design is influenced by the width of a horses ass.

      Two horse's asses. Wagons were sized according to the width of two horses, and roads were in turn sized to fit the wagons. When underground mining got serious, the mining wagons were just converted outdoor wagons, still pulled by two horses. Then they started putting rails under the wagons, to allow moving heavier loads with less friction. Rail lines began to be used outdoors, pulled by horses at first, so the rail spacing continued to be suitable to the width of two horses. One engines replaced horses, the rails stayed the same width. Go look at train tracks today, you will see they are the right size for two horses to fit.

      The Solid rocket boosters for the Space Shuttle were shipped by rail from Utah to Florida, and thus had to fit on railcars on the standard rail spacing. In turn, the size of the boosters set the lift capacity of the rocket, and thus how big the Shuttle Orbiters could be. Finally, the Space Station modules had to fit in the Orbiter, so the Space Station's design is dictated by the width of two horse's asses.

      I may have been responsible for this analysis about 30 years ago at Boeing. I was both designing launch vehicles, and had a hobby interest in the history of technology. It is also possible it came up in a USENET discussion on sci.space back then. I don't remember any more.

    56. Re:Like many inventions ... by n7ytd · · Score: 1

      NPR's Planet Money had an interesting episode about pallets and CHEP pallets this summer: http://www.npr.org/blogs/money...

    57. Re:Like many inventions ... by SternisheFan · · Score: 1

      Just so you can fit the pieces into a standard fireplace/ stove etc. Got a bonfire going? Go nuts!

    58. Re:Like many inventions ... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Pallets require extra ceiling space to actually pick them up and put them into a truck or container, resulting in wasted volume in that truck or container. The logistics industry is quickly moving away from pallets for everything but long term storage.

      I'll disagree with that, but I suppose it all depends on what you're shipping. I've been in shipping for the last 35 years and what we ship (around 2,000lbs per unit), for the most part we max the truck out on weight long before we cube out on volume. Overseas shipping containers typically do not use pallets because of international treaties, not considerations on weight or volume. I will definitely agree with you on the costs of repair however.

    59. Re:Like many inventions ... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If you need high throughput, you're going to use conveyor.

      We produce loads to ship. Most conveyor systems I am accustom to convey palatalized loads to the warehouse. The warehouse uses a computerized index rack system to store each palatalized load until a truck wants to pick it up, and then a human operated forklift drives the palatalized load into the truck. If you are thinking of a conveyor system that is manually hand loaded by a lumper, people advanced from that technology 50+ years ago.

    60. Re:Like many inventions ... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Out of curiosity, how are the pallets packaged? Are they tehmselves bundled onto a pallet? (genuine question)

      If you are talking about pallets arriving from a supplier (such as CHEP) they arrive as stacks. In truck box or flatbed each stack is usually 20 high.

    61. Re:Like many inventions ... by RockDoctor · · Score: 1

      Yeah exactly, which came first? The pallet is virtually useless without the fork.

      I would suspect the fork - as an adjunct to the portable crane. It is still very standard practice to move items of machinery around in the workspace by picking them up between the tines of a fork lift. Some fork tines have a hole pierced in the tip of each tine for looping soft rope or a chain through. And I've seen load spreaders and specialised barrel lifts which work in essentially the same way as a set of fork lifts still in use on construction sites. I suspect that the crane modifications came first - as many factory floors have a crane of some or several sorts, and they can use the same adaptors - and the pallet then co-evolved with that.

      When I first started working on industrial sites in the latest 1970s there were still several different sizes of pallet in use, and from certain advertising (e.g. for vans : "our bed is wide enough for a EuroNorm pallet") I suspect that there are still several nearly interchangeable sizes still in use. (The EuroNorm is TTBOMK 1m in dimension with a few cm handling leeway on either side. I wouldn't be surprised to find that a USian pallet is one Edwards-nose-fingertip (three Roman feet or a "yard") on edge. That's a nearly 30% difference in volume.

      --
      Birds are not dinosaur descendants;birds are dinosaurs, for all useful meanings of "birds", "are" and "dinosaurs"
    62. Re:Like many inventions ... by virtual_mps · · Score: 1

      Apparently the american pallet is about 30% larger than a euro pallet

      Interestingly, the same seems to be true of the american palate.

    63. Re:Like many inventions ... by virtual_mps · · Score: 1

      Of course, this old urban legend ignores the reality of different rail gauges. There maybe some link there, but it's pretty darn tenuous.

    64. Re:Like many inventions ... by Hognoxious · · Score: 1

      Try reading in context. The assertion I replied to was that without shipping containers pallets would be useless. Clearly bollocks, since pallets existed before shipping containers and I've seen pallets being unloaded from vans that were small enough to fit several in a shipping container.

      --
      Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
    65. Re:Like many inventions ... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The word you're looking for is palletised.

    66. Re:Like many inventions ... by nitehawk214 · · Score: 1

      The width of two horses asses is directly proportional to the width of one horses ass, so I am still correct. :)

      --
      I'm a good cook. I'm a fantastic eater. - Steven Brust
  2. and they make big bonfires, too by turkeydance · · Score: 2

    that can be seen from Space!

    1. Re:and they make big bonfires, too by __aaclcg7560 · · Score: 1

      Used to have bonfires at the California beaches. After too many people lost a foot from stepping on smoldering pallets covered with sand, the state made open bonfires illegal and the department for parks built fire rings to burn wood in designated areas. You could not longer burn a whole stack of pallets. If you broke the pallets down and remove the nails, you could tee-pee the wood inside the fire ring to burn.

    2. Re:and they make big bonfires, too by Immerman · · Score: 4, Funny

      >If you broke the pallets down and remove the nails...

      You're doing it wrong - break the pallets down by breaking them - a maul or sledgehammer will usually do the job nicely. Then burn them and drag a magnet through the ashes to collect the nails. Why go through all the effort of removing the nails when you're about to remove the wood?

      Of course given the number or lazy, irresponsible assholes in the world who would just leave the nails to wreak havoc on the next people to use the area I can't say I'd be surprised if the law required pre-extraction.

      --
      --- Most topics have many sides worth arguing, allow me to take one opposite you.
    3. Re:and they make big bonfires, too by __aaclcg7560 · · Score: 2

      Why go through all the effort of removing the nails when you're about to remove the wood?

      If you pull the nails out properly, you can reuse them again. Something I learned from my father. He always had a coffee can of odd nails he pulled from old pallets and other wooden debris. That's something he learned from his father during and after WWII to avoid wasting hard-to-get material.

    4. Re:and they make big bonfires, too by Damarkus13 · · Score: 2

      This is a terrible idea. First off, the time invested in carefully pulling nails of almost any sort quickly eclipses the cost of new nails. Second, the cheap wire nails (often clipped head nails) may work decently when fired from a pneumatic nail gun, but, unless you're quite competent with a hammer, good luck actually driving them into a 2x4.

    5. Re:and they make big bonfires, too by LynnwoodRooster · · Score: 1

      Many nails are made from steel with too high of carbon content, and are not magnetic.

      --
      Browsing at +1 - no ACs, I ignore their posts. So refreshing!
    6. Re:and they make big bonfires, too by CohibaVancouver · · Score: 2

      Then burn them and drag a magnet through the ashes to collect the nails.

      Where I live (Pacific Northwest) you can't drag a magnet through sand on a beach - It becomes covered in the sand grains that are ferrous.

    7. Re:and they make big bonfires, too by mengel · · Score: 1
      Actually if you know how to do it, pallets are easy to pull apart and de-nail.

      And you get usable lumber and nails to make stuff out of.

      Burning them is a waste.

      --
      - "History shows again and again how nature points out the folly of men" -- Blue Oyster Cult, 'Godzilla'
    8. Re:and they make big bonfires, too by Damarkus13 · · Score: 1

      Pallets should be used until they are no longer functional and then recycled for the organic matter and iron. Disassembling then for lumber and nails is inefficient and a waste.

    9. Re:and they make big bonfires, too by Daniel_Staal · · Score: 1

      One of the big advantages of pallets over boxes or containers is that they are cheap enough that shipping them back isn't something you need to worry about in many cases. Yes, if there's a load (or a regular truck) going back to where they need to be loaded it's often better to ship back and re-use, but if they are delivering something and there's no load going back any time soon, they are cheap and easy enough to take apart that they can be discarded and used for other purposes.

      --
      'Sensible' is a curse word.
    10. Re:and they make big bonfires, too by __aaclcg7560 · · Score: 4, Interesting

      And you get usable lumber and nails to make stuff out of.

      That's what my father did after he retired to a trailer park. One neighbor gave him old pallets to break down because the county dump charges a small fortune to dispose of them. He gave the usable wood and nails to a neighbor to build chicken coops and bird houses for sale. The unusable wood goes into a neighbor's wood chipper to make compost. The unusable nails are taken down to the recycling center. A win-win situation for everyone involved.

    11. Re:and they make big bonfires, too by Damarkus13 · · Score: 1
      The thing about both pallets and cardboard boxes is that there are companies that will pay you for them.

      By all means, if you want to pull pallets for at best $15 of materials, go for it. I have better uses for my time.

    12. Re:and they make big bonfires, too by bickerdyke · · Score: 1

      That's why for Euro-pallets, there is an exchange system in place: http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/E...

      --
      bickerdyke
    13. Re:and they make big bonfires, too by drinkypoo · · Score: 1

      Then burn them and drag a magnet through the ashes to collect the nails. Why go through all the effort of removing the nails when you're about to remove the wood?

      Of course given the number or lazy, irresponsible assholes in the world

      ...someone might actually try to carry out your plan, and then destroy their lungs with zinc from galvanized pallet nails from china.

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    14. Re:and they make big bonfires, too by drinkypoo · · Score: 1

      Many nails are made from steel with too high of carbon content, and are not magnetic.

      Steel with too high a carbon content to be magnetic is called stainless, unless it's over 4% and then it's called hypereutectic and it's very difficult to produce and nobody is making nails out of it, just like they aren't making nails out of stainless — especially not for pallets.

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    15. Re:and they make big bonfires, too by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "Used to have bonfires at the California beaches. After too many people lost a foot from stepping on smoldering pallets covered with sand, the state made open bonfires illegal..."

      And so ended 30 years of tradition.

      We used to steal so many pallets from behind grocery stores every weekend for parties that pallets became a valuable commodity - security guards were hired, fences and locks put in. A typical party on the beach on a Friday would use about 10 - 20 pallets.

    16. Re:and they make big bonfires, too by dargaud · · Score: 1

      wood chipper to make compost

      I don't think it'd make good compost as pallet wood is heavily treated with chemicals to make it flame retardant and resistant to insects, molds and humidity. If you manage to burn some (with difficulty), it burns with weird colors and smells.

      --
      Non-Linux Penguins ?
    17. Re:and they make big bonfires, too by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      the time invested in carefully pulling nails of almost any sort quickly eclipses the cost of new nails.

      Time is money only when you're at your job. Your time at home costs no money at all.

    18. Re:and they make big bonfires, too by Immerman · · Score: 1

      So I see how everyone else won, but what was in it for your father? Even if he sold the materials instead of giving them away he couldn't have paid himself much for his time.

      --
      --- Most topics have many sides worth arguing, allow me to take one opposite you.
    19. Re:and they make big bonfires, too by Immerman · · Score: 2

      No, you've got it backwards: Money is time. Specifically it's tokens representing time you've spent doing X for someone else, which you can then give to a third party in exchange for them spending their time to do Y. It's time that is the limited resource - you can get money lots of ways, but all the money in the world won't buy you a single day of additional time.

      --
      --- Most topics have many sides worth arguing, allow me to take one opposite you.
    20. Re:and they make big bonfires, too by Immerman · · Score: 1

      And? Who doesn't want a bunch of iron filings to play with? I remember "mining" my entire sandbox as a kid for them. Put the magnet in a bag or can first and it's easy enough to get the filings off.

      --
      --- Most topics have many sides worth arguing, allow me to take one opposite you.
    21. Re:and they make big bonfires, too by Immerman · · Score: 1

      Considering all the other toxic chemicals that a typical palette is treated with, I'm not sure the galvanized nails are the wort of your worries. I know welding is a BAD idea without a breather, but is a wood fire even hot enough to cause problems?

      --
      --- Most topics have many sides worth arguing, allow me to take one opposite you.
    22. Re:and they make big bonfires, too by Immerman · · Score: 1

      Well, once a slat or two breaks you're probably not going to want to use it as a pallet anymore, but the rest of the wood is still perfectly usable. If you can dismantle and de-nail a pallet in a few minutes as shown in those videos, then you're going to need an awfully high-paying job for it to be cheaper to buy new wood. To say nothing of the environmental costs: every reuse you get before chipping is that much less fresh lumber that must be harvested.

      Trying to save the nails though... that probably doesn't make sense unless you're pretty impoverished. Nails are cheap and iron is easy to recycle.

      --
      --- Most topics have many sides worth arguing, allow me to take one opposite you.
    23. Re:and they make big bonfires, too by __aaclcg7560 · · Score: 2

      Besides helping his neighbors and making $60 per month at the recycling center, he had something to do in his retirement.

    24. Re:and they make big bonfires, too by drinkypoo · · Score: 2

      Considering all the other toxic chemicals that a typical palette is treated with, I'm not sure the galvanized nails are the wort of your worries.

      That's a valid concern, but in theory pallets are marked so that you can identify what they're made of, and some of them are just made of untreated wood. I would imagine that this mostly applies to domestic-only shipments.

      I know welding is a BAD idea without a breather, but is a wood fire even hot enough to cause problems?

      Yeah, zinc vaporizes right around a mere 500 degrees, you can easily exceed that by burning a stack of pallets. Whoops! Been to that bonfire already.

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    25. Re:and they make big bonfires, too by LynnwoodRooster · · Score: 2

      Not always. Going to a 1018 grade steel (0.18%) essentially renders the steel non-magnetic (you lose about 97% of the permeability of decent magnetic steel). Not stainless (still low enough carbon to rust easily), but very weak in terms of magnetism. I design and build audio transducers for a living, and work with various grades of magnetic (and non-magnetic) steel daily. Getting much above 0.15% carbon content or annealing the steel, and you lose a lot of the magnetic properties (permeability goes to pot) that allow for easy harvesting.

      Using a magnet to sift out your nails is not a surefire approach to keeping them off of beaches.

      --
      Browsing at +1 - no ACs, I ignore their posts. So refreshing!
  3. The Box by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Informative

    "The Box: How the Shipping Container Made the World Smaller and the World Economy Bigger is a non-fiction book by Marc Levinson charting the historic rise of the intermodal container (shipping container) and how it changed the economic landscape of the global economy."

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Box:_How_the_Shipping_Container_Made_the_World_Smaller_and_the_World_Economy_Bigger

    1. Re:The Box by able1234au · · Score: 1

      Thanks Mark

  4. More job loss by ArsonSmith · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Think of the dock works who lost their jobs due to this "marvelous" invention. It's this efficiency and automation we have to fight against or nobody will have a job again. /sarcasm

    --
    Paying taxes to buy civilization is like paying a hooker to buy love.
    1. Re:More job loss by Kohath · · Score: 5, Funny

      Solution: a pallet tax. The money from the tax will go to ... well, nevermind where the money goes. We need to tax these job-killing pallets now!

    2. Re:More job loss by Opportunist · · Score: 2, Funny

      Ok, who left the door open and let the union guy in?

      --
      We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
    3. Re:More job loss by Crashmarik · · Score: 1

      Pretty sure lots of the people that would have come back from the war to do that work, wound up getting an education, and becoming lawyers and bureaucrats.

       

    4. Re:More job loss by The+New+Guy+2.0 · · Score: 1

      Think of how expensive everything would be if all the pallets didn't exist requiring extra workers at the ports...

    5. Re:More job loss by roman_mir · · Score: 3, Insightful

      yes, that is what the parent post said and was specific to use sarcasm tag for people who he knew wouldn't get it to accent the point that ignorant luddits should in principle be against every labour saving innovation that people come up with, not just the most obvious (machines, computers, robots), but everything we do. Everything we invent and innovate is a labour saving device somehow. To stop that would be to give up on the idea of humans changing environment to improve our circumstances. Luddits want to stop progress, be it computers and robots or pesticides and pallets. The parent comment was pointing it out, not complaining about it.

    6. Re:More job loss by PPH · · Score: 1

      Give them a rifle and send them to the front lines.

      --
      Have gnu, will travel.
    7. Re:More job loss by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Well, the world was a different place then, there actually *were* jobs that the "works" [sic] could go to. You know, the kind of jobs now outsourced...

    8. Re: More job loss by rickb928 · · Score: 1

      It continues to be difficult to outsource unloading goods at ports. Reducing the job count, yes. Shifting jobs to the break bulk warehouses, yes. Even to the retail shelves. But eliminate?

      --
      deleting the extra space after periods so i can stay relevant, yeah.
    9. Re:More job loss by Shakrai · · Score: 1

      The same guy who missed the "/sarcasm" tag at the end of the GP's post?

      --
      I want peace on earth and goodwill toward man.
      We are the United States Government! We don't do that sort of thing.
    10. Re: More job loss by peragrin · · Score: 1

      A warehouse that needed 10 burly guys can now get by 2-3. Heck many can get by with one or two full time and 1-2 part time. Said business can easily shift tens of millions of dollars of equipment annually.

      The same is holding true in the front office needing only 1-2 people for accounting.

      --
      i thought once I was found, but it was only a dream.
    11. Re:More job loss by ArsonSmith · · Score: 2

      ...and becoming lawyers and bureaucrats.

      You've convinced me. remove my /sarcasm tag

      --
      Paying taxes to buy civilization is like paying a hooker to buy love.
    12. Re: More job loss by ArsonSmith · · Score: 1

      And even with this job reducing tech they are still able to find a need to ship millions of dollars of equipment annually.

      --
      Paying taxes to buy civilization is like paying a hooker to buy love.
    13. Re: More job loss by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Which raises the question of why those other 7 need to work at all anymore, except to satisfy some social model...

    14. Re:More job loss by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Or tax the corporations and high-income earning individuals to help pay for a negative income tax or a guaranteed income.

    15. Re:More job loss by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It's OK. They got their jobs back stacking stuff onto pallets. They aren't very good at it!

    16. Re:More job loss by dryeo · · Score: 1

      Yet the machinery that the Luddites were protesting led to 3 or 4 generations of chronic unemployment with hanging as the solution for kids stealing a loaf of bread, poor houses that were total hell and all kinds of other horrors. The only saving grace was the new world where people were encouraged to go and steal some land from the people that were already there.
      Things were good though if you were smart enough to be born into the right class, lots of servants, work was something you'd never actually do and it was called a golden age.

      --
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverted_totalitarianism
    17. Re:More job loss by Kohath · · Score: 1

      The cost of means-tested benefits is already about $60k per beneficiary household. There's no need for more taxes. If we stripped out all the overhead, we could easily guarantee a $50-60k income without spending another dime.

    18. Re:More job loss by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "Or tax the corporations and high-income earning individuals to help pay for a negative income tax or a guaranteed income."

      And so you create a whole class of people whose income depends on the income of the rich - meaning the rich will be even more protected from competition in order to keep the money flowing. Yeah, real good idea dumbass.

      When/if the top 1% are responsible for 90% of the income, only a fuckwad would be blind to the incentive for the rich calling the shots.

    19. Re: More job loss by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      "They eliminate jobs and replace them with nothing."

      That has been the argument against automation for over two centuries, any significant evidence of it has yet to reveal itself. At the beginning of automation/mechanization most people lived to about 35, there was little if any access to medical help no plumbing and poor nutrition. As recently as the beginning of the assembly line people were living to about 50 in markedly better conditions with moderate access to medical care, some plumbing and much better nutrition. At the beginning of the computer age people are living into their 60s/70s quite regularly, wide access to medical care, most have central air/heat, starvation is virtually non-existent. I am sure there is some point where automation/mechanization becomes a detriment to human society as a whole, but if the past two hundred years are of any indication that point is much further down the line than we generally predict.

    20. Re:More job loss by Opportunist · · Score: 1

      Damn those unions, lazy fucks. In my time, if you forgot a /sarcasm tag, you were fired! And if they could as much as hint that you stole it, the firing was done out of a cannon!

      --
      We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
    21. Re:More job loss by david_thornley · · Score: 1

      That's about the US median household income. The reason it works as means-tested benefits is that we don't allow just everybody to get those benefits. It would probably be cheaper with laxer (cheaper) enforcement and somewhat more cheating, but there's no way we can pay everybody that money.

      --
      "When you have eliminated the unacceptable, whatever is left, however improbable, must be the truthiness" - Holmes
    22. Re:More job loss by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      [citation most certainly FUCKING needed!]

    23. Re:More job loss by slew · · Score: 1

      Think of the dock works who lost their jobs due to this "marvelous" invention. It's this efficiency and automation we have to fight against or nobody will have a job again. /sarcasm

      You may have meant it sarcastically, but since the 60's, longshoremen have acquiesced to the use of efficient containerization in exchange for a royalty payment to compensate for lost job opportunity... You can read about the on-going fight about this here

      Of course, jobs have been lost, but the folks that still have jobs are being compensated quite well for the time they took to process the container, almost as if they actually stuffed and stripped the cargo (what packing/unpacking is called in maritime transport lingo) w/o actually doing so...

      This has less to do with pallets, but advent of multi-modal shipping containers.

      FWIW, having worked in a warehouse for a production line, I can say that even material handling w/o pallets is basically a non-starter. The line expediters in our warehouse worked with unpacked material and the inventory tracking and special transport handling that went along with that is easily on par with simply just discarding the partial pallet storage that was left in its wake. It isn't just shipping that relies on the magic of pallets...

    24. Re:More job loss by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Something like what I posted here: http://hardware.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=6464467&cid=48644229

    25. Re: More job loss by roman_mir · · Score: 1

      Modern "labor saving" inventions do no such things. They eliminate jobs and replace them with nothing.

      - precisely.

      Labour saving means exactly that: eliminate as much work as possible, that's why it's called 'labour saving' and not 'labour creating'.

      That was my point and you are not even aware that you are making my point while you are making it, are you? Labour saving device means labour reducing device.

      As an employer, if I can buy/build a machine that will reduce necessity for a job or fully eliminate a job I just acquired/built a machine that does what I am talking about: saving labour.

      Saving labour is exactly what our civilisation does, the very first thing we did (fire, wheel, spear...) was already labour saving and everything we do today (computers, robots, cars, planes, tall buildings, factories, food processing...) it's all also labour saving.

      It all saves labour, as in it reduces the labour needed or even eliminates labour altogether and it is all a good thing, that's what we want and need, otherwise we wouldn't be able to make more money by doing it, we would be making less money by doing it if it wasn't what we wanted and needed.

    26. Re: More job loss by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Labour saving means exactly that: eliminate as much work as possible, that's why it's called 'labour saving' and not 'labour creating'.

      so how does your favorite invention - slavery - fit in to this? is it labor saving when it eliminates a paying job and replaces it with indentured servitude?

    27. Re: More job loss by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      so how does your favorite invention - slavery - fit in to this? is it labor saving when it eliminates a paying job and replaces it with indentured servitude?

      No no no, slavery replaces paid labor with unpaid labor. You aren't actually saving or creating any labor.

      What slavery does though is lead to more people suffering and dying. Death is the ultimate labor saving mechanism. The dead are permanently removed from the labor pool.

      In a healthy free market following libertarian principles, there has to be lots of death underneath all the progress. Just like businesses are supposed to compete and rise and fall quickly, people's lives must also be cheap and expendable.

      This is why you don't see many libertarian societies. They all die off sooner or later. Usually sooner because less libertarian societies have no problem sweeping in and taking over.

      The moral of the story is if you're a betting man, bet on empire, not liberty.

    28. Re:More job loss by ArsonSmith · · Score: 1

      One man's /sarcasm tag is another man's political viewpoint.

      --
      Paying taxes to buy civilization is like paying a hooker to buy love.
  5. Wih-den Pal-its! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Obligatory.

    Wooden Pallets!

  6. 4 Days? by wisnoskij · · Score: 2

    I have hand loaded many of those standard sized shipping containers myself, with un-palleted materials, it takes two guys like 3-4 hours. And there is no reason that loading would be any faster than unloading.

    --
    Troll is not a replacement for I disagree.
    1. Re:4 Days? by Noah+Haders · · Score: 1

      its the union regulations that slow it down.

    2. Re:4 Days? by oodaloop · · Score: 3, Funny

      You can unload 13,000 cases of unpalletized canned goods in four hours, the same amount of time it takes anyone else with pallets? That's pretty fucking amazing, I must say.

      --
      Tic-Tac-Toe, Global Thermonuclear War, and relationships all have the same winning move.
    3. Re:4 Days? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Perhaps boxcars are larger than shipping containers?

    4. Re:4 Days? by BarbaraHudson · · Score: 4, Informative

      I have hand loaded many of those standard sized shipping containers myself, with un-palleted materials, it takes two guys like 3-4 hours. And there is no reason that loading would be any faster than unloading.

      You can unload 13,000 cases of unpalletized canned goods in four hours, the same amount of time it takes anyone else with pallets? That's pretty fucking amazing, I must say.

      A boxcars-worth (86' - 13,000 cases) of anything won't fit into a standard shipping container (20') or even a double-length container (40').

      --
      "Transparent" is a shit show that trades on every stereotype going. A man in drag is NOT a transsexual.
    5. Re:4 Days? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The OP states 3 days, not 4, and there's a huge difference between an actual railroad boxcar and a standard 20 foot shipping container. I don't know what you put in that container, but I'll bet it wasn't 13,000 cases of canned goods. A case of 24 one pound cans is 24 pounds, times 13000 is 313,000 pounds. Two guys? 3-4 hours? I think not. That would be over 1300 pounds per minute continuously for 4 hours.

    6. Re:4 Days? by wisnoskij · · Score: 1

      Well I would question the 4 hours to remove a load of pallets from a container. They are only two wide, and what like 8 deep? You should be able to do that in like 30 minutes.

      --
      Troll is not a replacement for I disagree.
    7. Re:4 Days? by choprboy · · Score: 5, Insightful

      While the parent may be off a bit, the quoted article times are ridiculous unless you are counting "man hours" including transport to/from the railcar and stacking on a shelf. It is absurb to think that a single boxcar would be staged on a busy warehouse spur for 3 days of loading or that a modern palletised boxcar takes 3-4 hours to unload with a forklift/pallet jack (it takes about 30min or so).

      Long ago I worked a Target dock unloading trucks by hand. Depending on the store volume and the season, that would mean unloading between 3000 and 10,000 cases from 53' trailers each night, 5 to 6 nights a week. Unlike Walmart and some other stores, Target merchandise all came stacked in the truck except for a few bulk items (kitty litter/etc.), it is individually bulk-broke from the warehouse to restock each item depending on the previous days sales. (A large case count on an incoming truck always made us groan as it probably meant lots of deodorant/hair products which come in small 6 count cases.)

      A typical 6000 case trailer, including setup and teardown time, would take approximately 2 hours to unload. 2 people in the trailer placing boxes on a conveyor, 4 to 6 people pulling/sorting boxes off the conveyor and on to pallets for storarge or delivery to the floor. If you extrapolate that to a 13,000 piece count you get roughly 24 man-hours, or "3 days" assuming a single 8-hour shift.

      Likewise, I also worked a different warehouse job forklift loading 53' trailers. If all of your stock is pre-staged on the dock it takes about 15min to load a trailer. If you are pulling every pallet from the racks and transporting it to the trailer individually it will take 1 to 1-1/2 hours plus. Again, extrapolating that to an 85' boxcar you get roughly 3-4 hours.

      So.... the only way you get the articles quoted loading/unloading times is you are counting man-hours including transport/, not literal time as is implied.

    8. Re:4 Days? by wisnoskij · · Score: 1

      1300 p/m is a little high, but not totally off. I am not saying that those containers mentioned should only take 4 hours, but somewhere in that order of magnitude. I cannot remember the weight/number calculations I did all those years ago, but I ran a few numbers right now that makes 1300 p/m seem within a reasonable order of magnitude.

      I worked with 80 pound grain sacks, so that is a little over 15 sacks per minute. Over 2 guys, that is 1 every 8 seconds. Which, when the sack is handed to you, you walk only a few strides, stack repeat, is actually probably a doable hurried pace. With in shape, experienced, help that get tagged off every 15 minutes. We were probably working at about 1/2 to 1/4 that speed, but that does not make 4 days.

      --
      Troll is not a replacement for I disagree.
    9. Re:4 Days? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yeah, I used to work night shift doing this. It takes about 30 minutes, if that (15-20 normally) to unload 4-6 pallets from the truck, shuffle things around if necessary to balance the container for the next leg, and then another 7 hours to break down those pallets and stock them. This is also moving at a speed around 60-80 cases an hour, up to a maximum of around 120 on the craziest nights.

    10. Re:4 Days? by Jarik+C-Bol · · Score: 1

      You can put about 30 Pallets of goods into a standard semi trailer. I know, because I unload at least 3 of them a week, and it takes 5 guys about 20 minutes, and thats only because our arrangement is a bit retarded, with a better floor plan, it could be done in 15 minutes or less. Like other responders have noted however, a standard boxcar is much larger.

      --
      I've decided to Diversify my Holdings. I've divided my cash between my left and right pockets, instead of all in one.
    11. Re: 4 Days? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      On the truck.
      Off the truck.
      On to the train
      Off the train
      On the ship
      Off the ship
      Onto trucks.

      You only pay the hand loading at the beginning and end. You save it the middle steps.

    12. Re:4 Days? by nitehawk214 · · Score: 1

      Well the calculation would assume they were not using a motorized pallet jack, since it was comparing the 1920s

      But even then, it depends on how heavy the pallets are.

      --
      I'm a good cook. I'm a fantastic eater. - Steven Brust
    13. Re:4 Days? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It took me 30 minutes to move 16 pallets my first time unloading a truck at work. Mind you I had practice moving bottle bins which are the same dimensions but far less fragile. These days I unload a full truck (16 to 32 pallets depending on truck size) in around 10 to 20 minutes. It really isn't hard to do with a well oiled pallet jack as long as your not stopping every few feet, it is after all starting and stopping motion that's hard to do when your moving something that weighs as much as a small car.

    14. Re:4 Days? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      That does not make sense. I was a dockmaster for a long time. Depending on a number of factors, up to a maximum of 53 euro pallets can be placed in a legal trailer. If they are stacked and the smallest common pallet size, that number can quadruple. If the most common large size unstacked it is nearly cut in half (your figure of 30 pallets). I scheduled one man per trailer per ten minutes. Another fifteenish minutes for trailers to be swapped out depending on how slow the particular driver is. That gets everything off the truck and into a standard assembly area. After that, warehouse specialists that know precisely where everything goes take over and one man spends an additional 20 minutes to put those pallets where they belong.

      Five men 20 minutes to unload 30 pallets sounds like an operation that does not even have forklifts...or a union I suppose.

    15. Re:4 Days? by Computershack · · Score: 1

      You can unload 13,000 cases of unpalletized canned goods in four hours, the same amount of time it takes anyone else with pallets? That's pretty fucking amazing, I must say.

      What the hell? A standard 40' shipping container takes 24 pallets. You can unload/load 24 pallets in about the same number of minutes, even less if they're all stacked on the loading dock next to the ramp for the container. You're probably looking at an hour to unload 13,000 cases palletised.

      --
      I only please one person per day. Today is not your day. Tomorrow isn't looking good either. - Scott Adams
    16. Re:4 Days? by Computershack · · Score: 1

      It takes about 30 minutes, if that (15-20 normally) to unload 4-6 pallets from the truck,

      You'd be fired in most warehouses in the UK if you worked that slow. Shit I loaded myself with a pump truck on Saturday night and stuck 18 pallets on my semi-trailer in half an hour and that is with a forklift truck driver going into the warehouse and bringing them out to me one at a time. It only took them 30 minutes to unload and check 26 pallets I delivered to a Tesco distribution centre on Sunday morning.

      --
      I only please one person per day. Today is not your day. Tomorrow isn't looking good either. - Scott Adams
    17. Re:4 Days? by oodaloop · · Score: 1

      Here's a clue for you, boxcars and shipping containers are not the same size. Try reading.

      --
      Tic-Tac-Toe, Global Thermonuclear War, and relationships all have the same winning move.
    18. Re:4 Days? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I wasn't there back then but the conveyers you were using on an unpalletised load may also not have been in use back then. I imagine that walking into the boxcar, picking up a case (or ever placing a few into a cart or wheelbarrow), carrying that load out of the boxcar to a drop off point, then repeating that process would take quite a bit of time (all the time being the walking back and forth).

    19. Re:4 Days? by sudon't · · Score: 1

      “With a 40-foot container, it could take two lumpers four to eight hours to unload it, whereas on pallets, we could unload it in 30 minutes.”

      I've been on the other end of it - a truck driver - and that's about right. Seeing an unpalletized load would make my heart sink. I've sat anywhere from four to ten hours, waiting for unpalletized loads to come off. I have no problem believing it took days to unload a railcar by hand. I believe a railcar is approximately equal to four truckloads, so that could easily work out to three shifts.

      --
      -- sudon't

      Air-ride Equipped

    20. Re:4 Days? by sudon't · · Score: 1

      They were talking about a train car loaded with heavy canned goods. Wasn't the stuff you were loading pretty light? That's usually the reason something is not palletized - stacking pallets would crush the product. A railcar can be three to four times the capacity of a container, so I can easily see it going on for three shifts. I know I've sat up to ten hours waiting for my 53' trailer to be unloaded by hand. That was a record, for sure, but it never took less than four hours.

      --
      -- sudon't

      Air-ride Equipped

    21. Re:4 Days? by Jarik+C-Bol · · Score: 1

      Your pretty much spot on there. We use the hand pump 'Pallet Jacks', which I assume you know what are based on your experience, and all our pallets are the large CHEP pallets, the large iGPS, or similarly sized plastic pallets. A good portion of our Pallets are either to heavy to stack, or to fragile, so its generally a single layer, I didn't consider most other situations, where the trailer would be loaded 2 cubes high.

      Like I said, it would be much quicker if we had a better floor layout, and maybe quicker with a forklift, but for our operation, we have the manpower on hand for further tasks, so we use what we got, and its unlikely to change, especially in Texas, land of the 'no unions'.

      --
      I've decided to Diversify my Holdings. I've divided my cash between my left and right pockets, instead of all in one.
    22. Re:4 Days? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      bullpussy

  7. Pallet ecosystem by Livius · · Score: 4, Insightful

    People understood the usefulness of the concept when the first pallets were built nearly a century ago, but a pallet isn't helpful without lift trucks, cranes, etc. That's why adoption started slow and accelerated over time.

    1. Re:Pallet ecosystem by theycallmeB · · Score: 5, Informative

      Don't forget plastic stretch wrap: until they get wrapped up tight many pallet load are too dangerous to move more than a few feet and impossible to move over the bumps of a dock plate. Rope, tape, cargo nets and other options can kinda work but the modern pallet freight system would slog down without cheap, disposable (and recyclable) plastic wrap. (Aside: I have been witness to what happens when a Walmart store runs out of pallet wrap. It is... awkward.)

    2. Re:Pallet ecosystem by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      (Aside: I have been witness to what happens when a Walmart store runs out of pallet wrap. It is... awkward.)

      You'd hope someone would think to just go and unpallet a pallet of plastic wrap, but this is Wal-Mart we're talking about.

    3. Re:Pallet ecosystem by n7ytd · · Score: 1

      (Aside: I have been witness to what happens when a Walmart store runs out of pallet wrap. It is... awkward.)

      You'd hope someone would think to just go and unpallet a pallet of plastic wrap, but this is Wal-Mart we're talking about.

      Are you thinking of the food-grade plastic wrap that a Walmart might have sitting in the warehouse? That stuff is wimpy compared to the stretch wrap that is used on pallets. It would be like saying if they're all out of cardboard cartons, why not open up some Christmas wrapping paper or tissues and build a box, it's all paper, after all...

  8. could still use improvement by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Pallets are definitely a lot better than handling loose goods, but I'm surprised that they haven't been improved upon in the last few decades. They aren't really stack-able, goods usually have to be saran rapped to them, etc. I wonder why some kind of collapsible shipping container like pallet hasn't been widely introduced? You see something similar in manufacturing quite often but never in retail transit (unless you count the bins that returned pop cans/bottles are put in).

    1. Re:could still use improvement by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I wonder why some kind of collapsible shipping container like pallet hasn't been widely introduced

      Because pallets are cheap, easy to move with a forklift, and can be quickly and easily made to handle a wide range of loads, and racking systems are also readily available for vertical storage of palletized stuff.

    2. Re:could still use improvement by BarbaraHudson · · Score: 1

      A "collapsible shipping container like palette" would be harder to load and unload than a palette. And how do you accommodate over-high items? Or stuff that is over-wide?

      --
      "Transparent" is a shit show that trades on every stereotype going. A man in drag is NOT a transsexual.
    3. Re:could still use improvement by gbjbaanb · · Score: 0

      A "collapsible shipping container like palette" would be harder to load and unload than a palette.

      not really - a pallet with sides is still a pallet. Only now its easier to put stuff in that won't fall off the edge. You only need to put bars at the corners with thin material stretched between them. The only issue is cost, pallets are simple and cheap.
      TBH a pallet with sides is no different to a pallet with a box of stuff stuck on top of it, so I don't really see the need, but I understand where they're coming from.

      And how do you accommodate over-high items? Or stuff that is over-wide?

      charge extra for custom handling. Isn't that what the shipping industry would love :-)

    4. Re:could still use improvement by sumdumass · · Score: 2

      This already exists in sorts. Many pallets are shrink wrapped and have corners added that increase the rigidity of them. These corners are anything from wood slats, cardboard slats to other materials as needed/determined by the shipper to ensure the products arrive safely. Some are banded using metal or nylon straps and use tops that lock the products into place using their casing material as sort of walls.

      Most material is placed on the pallets in interlocking patterns that allow the weight of the level on top secure the layer below. This stabilizes the layers and sort of creates the same wall type thing. Add some shrink wrapping and it will take a lot of abuse before falling.

    5. Re:could still use improvement by blackest_k · · Score: 1

      There is, used in most supermarkets (certainly in the Uk in Ireland since the eighties at least) a system of aluminium cages. usually 3 sides to them and wheels like shopping trolleys. The bottom folds up and the sides fold to the back.

      picked and filled at the warehouse. dragged onto a truck dragged off at the supermarket emptied on the shop floor. empty trolleys back on the truck. Exceptions seem to be drinks slabs of coke and bottles. which tend to be palletized.

      for garden centres there is another system of shelved trolleys for plants often re-shelved for selling direct off the trolley. Plants need to be watered regularly and being mobile is useful.

      Clothing often is shipped on racks to avoid creasing too.

      pallets are great when shipping 1 product from a factory but not so good for 1 of this 2 of that ect. which is the case often from distribution centres.

    6. Re:could still use improvement by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Jesus Christ, the word is P A L L E T. It's the FOURTH FUCKING WORD IN THE HEADLINE. Are you not aware of copy + paste? It's been around for forty years!

    7. Re:could still use improvement by BarbaraHudson · · Score: 1

      Jesus Christ, the word is P A L L E T. It's the FOURTH FUCKING WORD IN THE HEADLINE. Are you not aware of copy + paste? It's been around for forty years!

      I'm in Quebec, you insensitive clod :-)

      Seriously though, I am, and the french word is palette. We kind of mix-n-match, which results in mistakes like this one.

      --
      "Transparent" is a shit show that trades on every stereotype going. A man in drag is NOT a transsexual.
    8. Re:could still use improvement by nitehawk214 · · Score: 1

      Plastic wrap. You can stack pallets obscenely high as long as you hit it with enough plastic wrap. High enough to hit the top of the shipping container or truck, at least.

      --
      I'm a good cook. I'm a fantastic eater. - Steven Brust
    9. Re:could still use improvement by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      What's french for fruitcake that cut his dick off?

    10. Re:could still use improvement by Buchenskjoll · · Score: 1

      Anonymous coward

      --
      -- Make America hate again!
    11. Re:could still use improvement by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You could be right as far as cheapness and versatility, but who says that a collapsible shipping container like pallet couldn't be moved by a forklift? Its never going to completely replace the simple pallet but for some products (canned/boxed foods, clothing, cleaning supplies, etc) and situations (warehouse to store) its got to be better than stacking a bunch of flimsy cardboard boxes on a few planks of wood and wrapping them with a role of disposable plastic.

  9. slashvertisement by Noah+Haders · · Score: 3, Informative

    there are approximately two billion wooden shipping pallets in the holds of tractor-trailers in the United States transporting Honey Nut Cheerios

    1. Re:slashvertisement by cold+fjord · · Score: 1

      So ... are you a Rice Krispies fan, or what?

      --
      much of left-wing thought is a kind of playing with fire by people who don't even know that fire is hot - George Orwell
    2. Re:slashvertisement by Hartree · · Score: 1

      He's just unhappy they aren't eating Quisp instead.

    3. Re:slashvertisement by PPH · · Score: 5, Funny

      Personally, I find either brand to be unpalatable.

      --
      Have gnu, will travel.
    4. Re:slashvertisement by CozmicCharlie · · Score: 1

      He's just unhappy they aren't eating Quisp instead.

      Would any of the "kids" here even know about Quisp? That was a long time ago...

    5. Re:slashvertisement by sconeu · · Score: 1

      I preferred Quake.

      --
      General Relativity: Space-time tells matter where to go; Matter tells space-time what shape to be.
  10. No love for forklifts? by Namarrgon · · Score: 2, Informative

    Arguably, pallets are just accessories for the machine that actually does the work. I'd like to see people unload a boxcar full of pallets by hand.

    --
    Why would anyone engrave "Elbereth"?
    1. Re:No love for forklifts? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      technically they're a combined system; a pallet is pretty useless without a forklift but a forklift is fairly inefficient without a pallet.

      No the real innovation is standardization of size to enable easy carrying; the pallet is just one piece of that. But they are damned useful. What I find fascinating about this is what really drove home the adoption of the pallet was the logistical constraints of World War 2. People love talking about the weapons like the tank or the decryption efforts like MAGIC that won the war, but the reality is that it was the massive logistical capacity and the organization by hundreds of thousands of clerks and logistics people that won the war. A tank battalion is no good if it runs out of gas or bullets or food, and how much of those you can provide determines the size of the army you can field. Innovations like pallets, frozen orange juice, block-based shipbuilding to make the Liberty Ships; all of that came out of WW2.

    2. Re:No love for forklifts? by WrecklessSandwich · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Even without a proper forklift, a simple manual hydraulic pallet jack will leave you much better off than an unpalletized load for all but the heaviest pallets.

    3. Re: No love for forklifts? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Used to move pallets with a hand truck all the time. No forklift required friend.

    4. Re:No love for forklifts? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      You have been eaten by a grue.

    5. Re:No love for forklifts? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Even then 4 men can lift 400lbs easily... so even 400 lb pallets with no machine would be ok.

    6. Re:No love for forklifts? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Which is just a slightly simpler machine that does the actual work. They still had to be invented.

    7. Re:No love for forklifts? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      400lbs would be a relatively light pallet load for most goods.

    8. Re:No love for forklifts? by Namarrgon · · Score: 1

      True enough - but that still looks like a (manual) forklift to me...

      --
      Why would anyone engrave "Elbereth"?
  11. The Magic Hospital Pallet by __aaclcg7560 · · Score: 3, Interesting

    I did a PC refresh job with another guy at a local hospital where the IT department stored old equipment inside a chain-link cage inside a warehouse-style storage room. This was also where construction debris from other parts of the hospital were dumped here.The place was a disaster area -- and our new work area.

    Since our first PC shipment wasn't expected for another three days, we spent that time cleaning up. Finding a pallet-sized box with low walls, we hauled out ten pallets of construction debris to the dumpster on the first day. We sorted and organized equipment to pallets on the second day. And, finally, we hauled everything out of the cage to sweep and mop the floor on the third day. Thereafter, people complained they couldn't find anything because we stacked everything on pallets. :/

    We eventually deployed 750 PC's and 1,500 monitors. Every two weeks we got 10+ pallets of equipment that filled our work area. A week of unboxing, a week of deploying. This became the rhythm of the project. All the old equipment (minus the labeled hard drives that we kept in case we needed to pull data) got boxed up on pallets for the recycler. On the final day of the project, we left the cage clean and empty than it was before.

    Later on I cleaned up an IT storage room filled with old equipment that no one have seen the floor in over eight years. That took six weeks of my spare time between tasks to clean up. Most of the old equipment ended up on pallets for the recycler. After I got the room completely empty, I had facility come in to mop and wax the floor.

  12. Invasive Species Introduction in Wood Pallets by Irate+Engineer · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Depending on where and how the wood in the pallets is processed, pallets can host invasive wood-boring insects. Locally we're having problems with the Asian longhorn beetle which is believed to have been introduced to Massachusetts via shipping pallets and crates. A lot of port cities and major shipping centers have seen outbreaks.

    There are plastic and metal pallet systems that should be used if shipping long distances.

    --

    Left MS Windows for Linux Mint and never looked back!

    Vote for Bernie in 2016!

    1. Re:Invasive Species Introduction in Wood Pallets by __aaclcg7560 · · Score: 2

      I've seen recyclable cardboard pallets that are good for moderate weight loads. They don't have the same life cycle as a wooden pallet, but they can be discarded with the cardboard for regular recycling.

    2. Re:Invasive Species Introduction in Wood Pallets by Strider- · · Score: 4, Informative

      This is why there are now standards for what wood can be shipped internationally. All wood packaging entering the United States (Pallets, Cable spools, crates, etc...) is supposed to be fumigated and treated to avoid this. This is one of the things that import inspections actually do catch.

      --
      ...si hoc legere nimium eruditionis habes...
    3. Re:Invasive Species Introduction in Wood Pallets by Immerman · · Score: 1

      Also plastic. Possibly not quite as recyclable as cardboard, but I suspect the service life would be much longer.

      --
      --- Most topics have many sides worth arguing, allow me to take one opposite you.
    4. Re:Invasive Species Introduction in Wood Pallets by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Some companies use pallet boards instead of full pallets to help avoid the problem - they're about an inch and a half thick, and sealed with polyurethane to keep the bugs out.

    5. Re:Invasive Species Introduction in Wood Pallets by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Most pallets in international trade are heat treated to kill pests without the use of chemicals. They are stamped with the IPPC logo, country of origin, and method of treatment (HT for heat treatment).

    6. Re:Invasive Species Introduction in Wood Pallets by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      This is why, when I was doing warehouse work that all of our 40' containers from the US weren't on palettes. usually on the order of 5-6000 boxes per container stacked floor to ceiling. The we're done that way so that we didn't have to get the fumigated. Not that the fumigation was 100% effective anyway, I'd occasionally find foreign spiders alive in the 20' containers that did come with palettes

    7. Re:Invasive Species Introduction in Wood Pallets by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Hell yeah the service life is longer. We use plastic pallets with corrugated plastic walls in the bottle machines. The glass bottles in particular are very heavy. Those pallets really take a beating and from what some of the truck drivers were telling me are in service for a very long time before they are recycled.

    8. Re:Invasive Species Introduction in Wood Pallets by jonwil · · Score: 1

      That's one of the reasons for the move away from wood to plastic pallets, I know of no bug that can live inside a plastic pallet. Plastic is also a lot more durable so you can use it a lot more times before it fails and needs to be disposed of.

    9. Re:Invasive Species Introduction in Wood Pallets by drinkypoo · · Score: 1

      In some cases pallets or even containers are just not allowed into certain ports after leaving certain ports, increasing the destruction rate. Better to just stop using wood. The plastics are very recyclable.

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
  13. Pallet comments by Beardo+the+Bearded · · Score: 3, Funny

    This comment was on a pallet.

    But the longshoremen were on break. Union rules, sorry.

    --

    ---
    ECHELON is a government program to find words like bomb, jihad, plutonium, assassinate, and anarchy.
    1. Re:Pallet comments by denzacar · · Score: 5, Funny

      I find your joke unpalletable.

      --
      Mit der Dummheit kämpfen Götter selbst vergebens
    2. Re:Pallet comments by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Hey pallet's just a matter of taste.

  14. Basement dwellers... by Earthquake+Retrofit · · Score: 2

    have long sung the praises of the lowly pallet which protects our stuff from the occasional 'water event' as we call them in the Northwest.

    --
    Fifty years of Yippie! 1968-2018
  15. Tool palettes in GUIs are pretty cool too by JoeyRox · · Score: 1

    Whereas the Microsoft Ribbon is an abomination.

  16. barrels were cool too... by patniemeyer · · Score: 1

    Just for the record barrels were probably equally revolutionary in their time. And the ability for a person to roll them before machinery was quite an advantage.

    1. Re: barrels were cool too... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Barrels are still cool.

    2. Re:barrels were cool too... by Derling+Whirvish · · Score: 1

      Just for the record barrels were probably equally revolutionary in their time. And the ability for a person to roll them before machinery was quite an advantage.

      And before that -- amphorae.

    3. Re:barrels were cool too... by ArcadeMan · · Score: 4, Funny

      Just for the record, barrels are a menace.

      Signed,
      Mario.

  17. Like many inventions ... by theronb · · Score: 3, Interesting

    And forklifts. The invention actually consists of two parts to be really successful - the second part being the forklift or pallet jack. Moving pallets by hand sucks.

  18. Good ol CHEP, happy memories of logistics job. by MegOnWheels · · Score: 1

    In the early 1990's CHEP got very aggressive about tracking its palettes and you had to make sure you had some on site so if a truck (lorry) dropped a load off and there were CHEP palettes you had some more to put on the back of the load for the return trip or you needed to keep some transfer palettes to unload CHEP ones onto.
    It was ok to a point but they were hard to keep track off, especially in a ad hoc logistics facility where old equipment was being stored.
    Once upon a time you buy a slab (box of stubbies) of beer for about 4 CHEP palettes so you had to keep them under lock and key or they would go missing (on Fridays). Remember that these things are rented and we used to have conduct census. Occasionally one would get completely smashed and you would repair it enough so that it could be returned.
    There was another company called LOSCAM, they had purple palettes and for a while you had to keep supply of those as well.
    The CHEP Palette was a well built thing and could take 1000Kg easily, the white wood ones this article refers to were single use only, sucked royally and yea you could only enter them from two sides..

    1. Re:Good ol CHEP, happy memories of logistics job. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The. Word. Is. Spelled. P A L L E T.

      It's the FOURTH FUCKING WORD IN THE HEADLINE. You don't even need to read the damn SUMMARY to see it!

      P
      A
      L
      L
      E
      T

      FUCK!

    2. Re:Good ol CHEP, happy memories of logistics job. by MegOnWheels · · Score: 1

      The. Word. Is. Spelled. P A L L E T.

      It's the FOURTH FUCKING WORD IN THE HEADLINE. You don't even need to read the damn SUMMARY to see it!

      P A L L E T

      FUCK!

      Thats nice dear, I will remember that spelling for later on..

  19. Feed 8 million GI, what about USSR? by manu0601 · · Score: 1

    Summary says:

    the challenge of keeping eight million G.I.s supplied—"the most enormous single task of distribution ever accomplished anywhere,"

    I wonder how USSR managed it, since they have an even greater amount of soldier deployed

    1. Re:Feed 8 million GI, what about USSR? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      In Soviet Russia, pallets distribute you.

    2. Re:Feed 8 million GI, what about USSR? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I wonder how USSR managed it, since they have an even greater amount of soldier deployed

      It's a lot easier to feed millions of soldiers when a lot of them go from a very abbreviated training period straight to a battle where they are then employed in human wave attacks. And when it came to urban fighting a lot of units were mobilized workers' militias, pulled straight from the factory floors, handed weapons, and led by thier foremen to the front lines, sometimes right outside their factories.

    3. Re:Feed 8 million GI, what about USSR? by wagnerrp · · Score: 4, Insightful

      They were defending their own country, rather than on the other side of an ocean.

    4. Re:Feed 8 million GI, what about USSR? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      They may have been workers, but as the soviet Union had compulsory military service all but the youngest of them had at least some military experience.

    5. Re:Feed 8 million GI, what about USSR? by manu0601 · · Score: 2

      They were defending their own country, rather than on the other side of an ocean.

      That remove the oversea transport problem, but moving food and supply to million of soldiers is still a challenge.

    6. Re:Feed 8 million GI, what about USSR? by Ogi_UnixNut · · Score: 1

      They did it the same way the Nazis did when they pushed in, via the railways. Railways stretched all the way across Europe. When there was no rail, it was done with trucks. To this day Russian rail network is a different gauge from the rest of Europe, to prevent an enemy easily moving troops and equipment into Russian territory.

      Russia is first and foremost a land power, unlike the UK (and then the US) which are maritime powers, and would do a lot of logistics via ships, ports, etc...

    7. Re:Feed 8 million GI, what about USSR? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      My guess involves 50 million bucket-brigade peasants that soon died in the harsh winter.

    8. Re:Feed 8 million GI, what about USSR? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      NO ONE on /. gives a fuck about those goddamned commies. Take your hippy liberal bullshit somewhere else, ya pinko bastard.

    9. Re:Feed 8 million GI, what about USSR? by manu0601 · · Score: 1

      via the railways

      But rail leaves intact the problem solved by pallets. If pallets have been critical for US army feed, how the USSR managed to do without?

    10. Re:Feed 8 million GI, what about USSR? by manu0601 · · Score: 1

      I assume your comment is a joke, but note anyway that "communist" and "hippy liberal" do not fit very well together.

  20. Oblig. by waynemcdougall · · Score: 1

    alt.fan.pallets

    --
    Recycle PCs and build a wireless community network www.hillsborough.org.nz
  21. that's crap by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    My buddy and I used to unload 22,000 cases in 4 hours. On skids it took 10 minutes (with power jacks). What kinda blowhards were unloading those trailers back in the 20's and 30's that 30k took days??!

    1. Re:that's crap by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      RTFA. Boxcars are not trailers, and are substantially larger. But yeah, multiple days is a little much. maybe a single full day.

  22. Pallets by nitehawk214 · · Score: 1

    While am no fan of Hugh Pickens, I do love pallets and logistics in general, and like this article.

    As my dad is a truck driver, as a kid I would go with him on trips and see the inner workings of the industry that literally keeps the country rolling. Most trucks would take on empty pallets in exchange for full ones they offloaded. But the trucks did not always go back to the same location that they made the pickup at. I asked him once what happens to all the extra pallets that end up at the receiving end? He told me that eventually some truck would come by and pick the old pallets all up to try to load balance. The pallet truck was always this old beat up truck that looked like it was on the verge of dying.

    But I asked him where new pallets come from, and he just smiled and said "obviously it is the pallet fairys."

    As an adult I once saw a truck filled with brand new wooden pallets while driving on the highway. Even the truck looked brand new.

    But now with the hard plastic GPS tracking pallets, I can imagine that the pallets themselves have some value and have to be tracked even when empty. Lucky for them they have GPS, I suppose.

    --
    I'm a good cook. I'm a fantastic eater. - Steven Brust
    1. Re:Pallets by nitehawk214 · · Score: 1

      Interestingly enough the article mentions iGPS. I saw a good number of their pallets (they have branding on them) at Costco the other day.

      --
      I'm a good cook. I'm a fantastic eater. - Steven Brust
  23. They're helping us by Guspaz · · Score: 1

    I work for a large annual convention, and at our most recent event we took our first baby steps into using pallets. We got a bunch of plastic pallets and a pallet jack to move them.

    For us, it's about doing our load-in and load-out at the venue quickly. Before, we'd have one or two trucks doing the rounds between our storage space and the venue. The trucks would arrive, and then we'd load everything into the trucks one piece at a time (using boxes, at least), and then the trucks would go off and we'd sit on the loading dock waiting for them to return. With pallets, the trucks arrive, we stick the pallets in with the pallet jack, the trucks (very quickly leave), and then while waiting for the truck to return we're loading stuff onto pallets and wrapping it for the next truck. By the time the truck has returned, the pallets are ready to load.

    We're not fully converted to using pallets, but the first steps have already shown us how much extra speed we can get out of them, mostly just by letting our people work on loading the trucks before the trucks even get to the dock.

  24. Potatoes and Ping Pong Balls by nitehawk214 · · Score: 1

    Now THIS is how you unload that kind of thing.

    --
    I'm a good cook. I'm a fantastic eater. - Steven Brust
    1. Re:Potatoes and Ping Pong Balls by Neil+Boekend · · Score: 1

      'round here many potato trucks look like this. The bottom is sloped to the middle and in the middle is a built in conveyor belt. In the back plate on the bottom is a small door to let the potatoes exit.

      --
      Well, I might have a way, but it only works on a semi spherical planet in a vacuum.
    2. Re:Potatoes and Ping Pong Balls by nitehawk214 · · Score: 1

      I've also seen the tilt-trailer trucks. They seem to be a lot more efficient. But don't look nearly as awesome as flipping the entire truck upright.

      --
      I'm a good cook. I'm a fantastic eater. - Steven Brust
  25. Termites by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    True story: When working in Thailand, an American engineer noticed that all of the pallets were made of plastic. This seemed strange, so he asked. The Thai engineers said "What, you don't have termites in the US?" He said "Sure, but we don't place the pallets on the dirt, we only place them on concrete". The Thai engineers asked "You mean your termites can't just walk across a few feet of concrete?" The US engineer frowned and said "Well, I'm sure they could but they just don't." The Thai engineers laughed and said "Our termites are more... ambitious... than yours."

  26. economies of scale (pallet overtaken by container) by glitch23 · · Score: 2

    Although the pallet was great it was superseded, in my opinion, by the shipping container invented by Malcolm McLean who enabled economies of scale with his invention. I first head of him when Malcolm Gladwell spoke about him and told his story at TIBCO NOW conference last month. Here is the wikipedia page: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M...

    --
    this nation, under God, shall have a new birth of freedom. -- Lincoln, Gettysburg Address
  27. Major stat error in article by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    The author writes:
    "While it took about 55-60 days for a supply ship leaving from New York City to reach Liverpool, England, the trip from San Francisco to Brisbane often lasted four or five months."

    Shipping from New York to Liverpool took nowhere near this long. Liberty ships (not built for speed) routinely made the trip in 15-20 days - even allowing for anti-sub maneuvering and combat. I can't find ready information for the Pacific but I think the author has (at least) doubled the required time.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liberty_ship
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Convoys_HX_229/SC_122

  28. repatriation is the key... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    One of the biggest costs is repatriation of the pallet. Crack that and the pool becomes a lot more viable and cost effective.

  29. "Arguably" is the lazy writer's word for "not" by Art3x · · Score: 1

    the humble pallet is arguably "the single most important object in the global economy."

    The word arguably is "the lazy writer’s synonym for 'not.' For example: 'The Red Sox are arguably the strongest team in the American League East.'" --- Alex Beam

  30. three days to unload a boxcar conta by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Where they on?
    In the UK 3 people can unload a 40' container in 4 hours, no pallets, no forklift, just handballing.

  31. Pallet design a secret by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I worked for a pallet company that serviced Chicago and surrounding areas. Had to sign a release form that I would never disclose the design of their pallets.
    Never realized it was such a big deal? Then I began a career in transportation and discovered the vast differences in pallets. Chep pallets, specialty pallets, hard wood, soft wood, plastic. Some on a exchange, some are not.

  32. and once more the US system is incompatible... by Wdi · · Score: 1

    with what the rest of the world uses, because they insist on custom non-metric sizes. Just like paper. There are many more Euro pallets in use than US-sized ones.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EUR-pallet

    Though in this case, the US size may actually win in the long term, because standard containers are designed to accomodate US pallets optimally. The Euro variant does not fit as well. There is a slightly wider Euro container variant designed to play nicely with Euro pallets, but with ever increasing ocean-crossing container shipping, these are on the way out.

    One problem of the smallest variant of the US pallet (35 × 45.5 inch Milspec, 40 × 48 standard type) is that is does not fit trough standard European doors (which are 850 mm - Euro pallets are 800 mm, US mil pallets are 889 mm on the smallest side, standard type even larger).

  33. Excellent invasive-bug vector, too by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Unfortunately, pallets are also the major way that tree-destroying insects travel from ecosystem to ecosystem. Pallets are so cheap and disposable that nobody will spend the time/money to either sterilize them or replace them with a material that doesn't harbor insects.

    When you kiss goodbye to America's ash trees in about a decade (emerald ash borer), or any other tree species threatened around the world by invasive bugs, you can partly thank palletization of global trade.

  34. Re: CHEP pallets, I've got a story about those!!! by Helen+O'Boyle · · Score: 4, Interesting
    CHEP pallets...

    The Truckie above is right about CHEP pallets. These blue pallets with white lettering are ubiquitous in Australia, and there are a number of yards at which you can pick them up and drop them off.

    Because it's a rental thing and pallets aren't free to manufacture, there's a penalty if you don't bring them back. AND -- amazingly -- it is at least sometimes NOT on the people who picked them up, or loaded or unloaded them, but on the person who authorised the job with the contractor, who may not have ever even SEEN the pallets in question.

    Why would this happen? Because anyone can rock up to a CHEP yard with a bunch of blue pallets and receive back, in cash, the deposit for said pallets. Going pallet-hunting is apparently not an uncommon activity among Australian tradesman after a big night of drinking when the next payday is still days away. Most of us would have no reason to know this, and presumably the economy somewhat relies on this, but basically an unguarded CHEP pallet is like a $100 note (or whatever the deposit is... as I recall, it isn't a small number) sitting on the ground.

    So, a friend of mine, in charge of maintenance for a piece of public infrastructure, one day had some maintenance done. The supplies for this apparently came on CHEP pallets. He knows this not because he'd ever been TOLD about any CHEP pallets by the workers... but because one day CHEP sent him a bill for $4,000. He wrote back, don't know anything about your pallets, never seen 'em, don't have 'em, not paying this invoice. SOMEHOW this degenerated into a personal attack by CHEP on him, calling him at home, nagging him for these pallets he'd had nothing to do with. It went on for months. His management backed him on not paying the invoice, but that didn't help in the context of CHEP taking the dispute personal.

    One day he got sick and tired of this, and called up the contractors in the middle of the night. "Round up your mates, and round up a big-ass truck. We're going for a drive." And they drove around all night, picking up any blue pallet that wasn't nailed down. Final count it was something like hundreds of them, if I recall correctly. They dropped them off at CHEP. He used the funds to pay the CHEP invoice and pocketed the rest and told the contractors they better not ever say another word about this.

    Apparently in recent years, CHEP has begun to bar code pallets so they can track them, so I have no idea if they're still easy, untraceable currency as they were 5+ years ago.

  35. fork jack/lift by Firethorn · · Score: 1

    Not to bust your imagination, but to build on the idea I figure that the first 'fork lifts' were actually intended to move heavy equipment. Lots of generators and such have cuts in their support platforms to support movement by fork. Now, Initially I figure they moved equipment via crane and such, but moving industrial equipment without dealing with a huge high roof is a lot easier if you can come in from below, to to mention that you need a frame anyways even if you're using a crane - as equipment gets heavier the less likely any random point you might hook into will be able to support the equipment without damage. You just need less framing if you're doing it via clever cuts in the floor stand.

    Go back to the 'old days' on non-standardization, I can see a company that uses heavy equipment having some device, a sort of proto-jack, to move their equipment around, then deciding, hey, we can use this jack to help move supplies around! Perhaps with something more expensive/better built than modern pallets, which are built to be cheap.

    --
    I don't read AC A human right
  36. Relevant Planet Money Episode by cant_get_a_good_nick · · Score: 1

    Episode 545: The Blue Pallet

    If you don't listen to Planet Money, you should.

  37. Let us not forget ... by Rambo+Tribble · · Score: 1

    ... the forklift. Nor, methinks, the lowly carton.

  38. Cheerios are not hauled pallets by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Former warehouse worker for a Kraft warehouse here.

    Cherrio's, and all other cereals are not transported on wooden pallets. Lightweight, boxed items, are positioned on corrugated pads and use a special forklift attachment commonly known as a 'slip sheeter' to haul them around. This cuts down on the cost, weight, and logistics associated with moving products. Pallets are not used in international transport, as well. The containers for this are usually hand packed to maximize each shipping container's capacity.

  39. Slashdot's doing stories on palettes now by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    Aaaand I'm out. Have fun guys.

  40. Employee of the Century by almitydave · · Score: 1

    And the award for Best Employee of the 20th Century goes to...

    This inanimate wooden pallet!

    --
    my, your, his/her/its, our, your, their
    I'm, you're, he's/she's/it's, we're, you're, they're
  41. container royalty central collection fund by slew · · Score: 1

    Solution: a pallet tax. The money from the tax will go to ... well, nevermind where the money goes. We need to tax these job-killing pallets now!

    FWIW, the longshoremen solution is a container royalty central collection fund which is like a "tax" for intermodal shipping containers... The money from this "tax" goes to... the few folks that got to keep their jobs (to pay for lost employment opportunities).

    There isn't a specific pallet tax that I know of... Yet... (although there are often redemption-like fee associated with pallets)

  42. Pallets pallets pallets... by iq145 · · Score: 1

    OF COURSE! What on this entire Earth of ours could be more incredible and more complex and more powerful? Wow!

  43. /|\ DeVry business grad. by Hognoxious · · Score: 1

    You've still got a fairly expensive asset sitting idle.

    Then there's the extra labour to move one box at a time - with ladders. You might be eight feet tall, but most people aren't.

    --
    Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
    1. Re:/|\ DeVry business grad. by wagnerrp · · Score: 1

      You've still got a fairly expensive asset sitting idle.

      Perhaps, but look outside any active distribution center and you'll find acres of idle trailers. I know Walmart even uses them as long term storage.

      Then there's the extra labour to move one box at a time

      If you're already moving one box at a time, because you're building the pallet, you may as well move one box at a time directly into the container. That was the whole point I was trying to make. There is no extra labor. The container itself is the unit of transport, rather than the pallet.

      with ladders. You might be eight feet tall, but most people aren't.

      Large molded plastic step stools, actually.