Slashdot Mirror
How Putin Tried To Control the Internet (vice.com)
derekmead writes: In this excerpt from the recently published The Red Web, Andrei Soldatov and Irina Borogan describe how the Kremlin has been trying to rewrite the rules for the internet to make it "secure" as it is understood by Russia's secret services. "Vladimir Putin was certain that all things in the world—including the internet—existed with a hierarchical, vertical structure. He was also certain that the internet must have someone controlling it at the top. He viewed the United States with suspicion, thinking the Americans ruled the web and that it was a CIA project. Putin wanted to end that supremacy. Just as he attempted to change the rules inside Russia, so too did he attempt to change them for the world. The goal was to make other countries, especially the United States, accept Russia's right to control the internet within its borders, to censor or suppress it completely if the information circulated online in any way threatened Putin's hold on power."
Freedom and government are mutually antagonistic concepts.
Chas - The one, the only.
THANK GOD!!!
But this reads purely as propaganda.
"Putin is Lawful Evil, guys. He wants to control the Internet! He wants to rule over it, and over YOU, and you should hate and fear and oppose whatever he does because that's what's good for America!"
It may be largely true, maybe, that Putin believes that Russia should have domain over the Internet as it exists within Russia's borders, and there's certainly some precedent for that. Even sense. Nation-states exist to further their own interests, and the interests of their citizens.
The USA installs leaders in third world nations all over the globe based on the single, sole criteria of how loyal they are to the USA.
Russia does the exact same thing.
Great Briton did the exact same thing in the past.
The People's Republic of China will do the exact same thing in the future.
It's not news at all that governments seek to control the affairs of their citizens domestically and as much as they can internationally. This is the world of global politics. It's not different simply because it deals with the Internet; that's not to say it's necessarily good, or moral, or even wise, but that's how the game is played.
Check out my sci-fi book "Lacuna" at http://goo.gl/MVxX8
Instead of bickering like a bunch of little children about who can play with the toy - perhaps we could all learn to share.
Political correctness is really just herd psychology pushed by insecure people who desperately seek social conformity.
In Soviet Russia, the internet is searching you!
Nowadays, controlling the Internet is first controlling the social networks.
Unsurprisingly, both Russia and China rolled their own.
With Snowden's revelations about XKEYSCORE, Putin's suspicions were proved just about completely true.
Then you're a fool. The US wants to eavesdrop on everything said on the net, and that's bad. The Russians want to control what's said on the net, and that's worse.
Putin is a relic from the Cold War. The man is nothing but a ex-KGB thug, who sees things from a thoroughly anachronistic point of view. It's high time this fossil enters the history books and stays there.
never thought i would ever post that.
Wow Putin's troll brigade is out in full force. Dasvidanya Comrade.
Really? The US is far from benevolent, but it's far more benevolent than Russia in terms of censorship and dragging you off in the middle of the night to the gulag.
Wow that's a lot different then how the US is trying to control the internet. Yay for thinking out of the box!
Laws are rules for the court, but merely a bottom bar to hit for life. Think beyond laws in your actions always.
that Putin was for a very large part right in his assumptions. Funny way of writing an article.
ICANN is headquartered in the USA. Why not be suspicious?
Whatever method Putin tried to control the internet probably involved him not wearing a shirt.
The only thing necessary for evil to triumph is for it to be pitted against a slightly greater evil
Snowden vindicated all persons concernd about US imperial hegemony over the internet.
Putin seems quite sane in his criticism of US internet dominance.
"Vladimir Putin was certain that all things in the world—including the internet—existed with a hierarchical, vertical structure"
He really couldn't envisage a distributed, headless system like the internet _at all_?. How does someone with this much of an impediment to abstract thinking become the leader of the country? Or am I being naive because it happens all the time?
We're so lucky we have Great Leader Obama to protect us from Putin's Evil Plans.
Bah!! Bullshit.
Eavesdrop now under guise of national security, control later under the guise of national security. Not much difference. Given time, America is well on their way to the same shit.
If you're neither American nor Russian, neither of these is a good idea. And we trust neither of you in the long run.
But let's not pretend there's a fundamental difference.
Lost at C:>. Found at C.
He's not a troll, he's a likho. Putin would never employ inferior non-Russian mythological creatures!
The War of 1812... the good 'ol days when the federal government actually tried to save New Orleans.
I had the same problem with a manager back when the Internet was new and we were beginning to use it where I worked. He called me in one day and wanted to know exactly WHO ran it and how they could be reached if necessary. When I explained that there was no one person, organization or country that ran it an how it was a network or more or less independent networks he really couldn't get his head around that at all. I guess it was kind of mind blowing for him coming from a background in SNA ( IBM System Network Architecture). I guess I got off easy. I sure as hell wouldn't have wanted to be the one that gave that news to Putin.
How is this a Putin thing? Many if not most other governments are trying different approaches to pretty much the same goal (e.g. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/..., https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...).
Judging by the number of cat videos.
Have gnu, will travel.
So the Russian government doesn't have any clue about the internet and wants to control it and control what content may and may not be published.
*sniff* I never thought that I'd live to see the day when the Russkies embrace our culture!
We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
Really the one to "trust" is the one with less power over you. Better to be spied on by a country that your government wouldn't piss on if they were on fire than their allies or worse, your native government.
The best country to on spied on by (if forced to pick one) would be North Korea as they are a pariah state.
You can take the boy out of the KGB, but you'll never get the KGB out of the boy.
I need a wheelchair van for my son. Help me get the word out. https://www.gofundme.com/wheelchair-van-for-jj
See my subject, & you're definitely 'Forrest' vs. this bigmouth http://tech.slashdot.org/comme...
* :)
APK
P.S.=> What's the matter? Cat got your tongue?? Or is the data I used vs. your accusations proving TOO MUCH for the trolling unskilled in computing likes of you??? Yes... apk
how-putin-tried-to-control-the-internet (In Russian)
In short: Russian govt (Comms Ministry and Comms Supervision: Minkomsvyaz and Roskomnadzor) had performed a simulation of disconnect of Russia from the global Internet this spring. They have found that Russia is still connected, and they could not understand by what means it stays connected. They think that the problem is in lots of small providers (up to 11000 Internet providers licenses total) that have satellite links abroad.
Full Disclosure: I live in Russia. And I am quite glad that the experiment failed.
I'll just leave this here.
You have to click the sorting cell, or if you are too lazy, here's a spoiler:
USA #2
Russian Federation #11
Of course this only includes countries we can know these numbers, North Korea isn't #1 as their numbers are not known
"If you have nothing to hide, you have nothing to fear." - Every fascist, ever
The same? There has not been a single misdeed done by the US in the last 100 years, that USSR/Russia or China has not exceeded with gusto in the last 50.
You, spoiled Westerners, simply don't realize, how deeply evil your opponents are. After moving to the US, I was flabbergasted, for example, over people sincerely comparing Senator McCarthy (responsible for several dozen people losing their jobs) with Beria (responsible for several million people losing their lives).
The US — under the internationally-celebrated moron named Obama — may have been sponsoring "moderate terrorists" in Syria in the last couple of years, but the USSR/Russia has been sponsoring — arming and protecting — the very Assad regime for decades.
And note too, how reluctant Russia is to bomb the real assholes in today's Syria — the ISIS. So reluctant, one may be forgiven for suspecting, Russia had a hand in ISIS springing into existence in the first place...
"The same" my tail.
In Soviet Washington the swamp drains you.
That's a nice list you put together — omitting only defense from the external enemies as a legitimate undertaking for any government. But why is the same government, which is supposed to be involved in the above-mentioned tasks, is also involved in providing healthcare, education, food and shelter and other "welfare"?
Now, of course, you did not mean to say, your list is exclusive, but I find it strange, that you listed the things, on which the government spends the smallest portions of its budget... One would expect a post like yours to put the biggest appropriations first...
In Soviet Washington the swamp drains you.
Every bit of control over the Internet, that the US surrenders, is the bit, that governments like China and Russia pick up.
In Soviet Washington the swamp drains you.
So, the NSA is really the hero we need but not the hero we deserve? A silent guardian, a watchful protector, a Dark Knight?
To go further on the path of tightening the screws, having laws that limit the rights and freedoms of people, attacking the news media and organizations of civil society, is a destructive path with no future.
-Mikhail G.
I am fucking tired of your articles telling us who is bad and what to think.
Just shut up. We've got brains.
Incarceration isn't the same as disappeared.
Lawyers are allowed. Visitation is allowed.
Not many political rivals are killed in the USA. Can't say that in Russia.
The USA already has complete control over the internet! Slashdot readers are a bit more well informed than that.
FTA - "The United States, however, never warmed to the idea—the US government never attempted to control content on the internet"
Let's see how easy this statement is to disprove...
-The FBI requires ISPs to install back doors into the telephony infrastructure:
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/united-states-of-secrets/
-Videos record FBI agents directly interfering with servers:
http://redtape.nbcnews.com/_news/2012/05/11/11647813-the-fbi-took-and-mysteriously-returned-their-server-heres-their-story?chromedomain=usnews
-FBI and Police resist FOIA requests regarding Stingray devices:
http://epic.org/foia/fbi/stingray/
-The NSA builds the largest spy datacenter in the world:
http://www.wired.com/2012/03/ff_nsadatacenter/
-The police create fake social media accounts, sometimes using real people's identities:
http://money.cnn.com/2014/12/24/technology/social/fake-facebook-accounts/
-The NSA has taken over the TOR network
http://www.nbcnews.com/technology/how-nsa-got-anonymized-tor-users-8C11339814
Need more examples?
"The Russians want to control what's said on the net, and that's worse".
Er, any evidence?
I am sure that there are many other solipsists out there.
should not be required. Power (and the powerful) routinely demand control. The more dictatorial the power holders are the more of a threat they pose to freedom. And the more the people "yearning to be free" need anonymity, or at least the option of anonymity.
Mandatory real identities are a threat to freedom on a worldwide basis. The powerful love mandatory real identities. That is why we must resist them.
It never ceases to amaze me that he's got a group of shills for Slashdot. I had no idea we were so important.
"When you have eliminated the unacceptable, whatever is left, however improbable, must be the truthiness" - Holmes
> Americans ruled the web
Yes, more precisely the NSA.
> it was a CIA project
Yes, more precisely NSA.
> accept Russia's right to control the internet within its borders
This line is so obvious there can be no question about it. When in Russia, it is necessary to obey the laws which Russian Duma imposes. Laws apply to companies, people, animals, plants and electrons alike. Don't like it, don't come to Russia or if already inside, become a "refusenik" and leave Russia for good.
When Putin replaced Yeltsin the times when Russia could be pushed aside or into a corner ended.
In Soviet Russia you control internet.
That you write this here just shows how impressively successful US propaganda is. Things like US incarnation complex, Guantanamo or rendition program simply don't exist. Or if they do, then only in some strange, far away countries that hate us for our freedom.
> lots of small providers (up to 11000 Internet providers licenses total) that have satellite links abroad
Satellites, especially geo-stationary type of sats, don't work well for Russia, since a lot of her territory is located over 60deg latitudes north. That means dishes would need to point straight towards the south to see the sats, thus staring into the centre of our galaxy and picking up a lots of powerful noise. (There is supposedly a very big black hole there, hiding under a massive accretion disc that spews not just RF but also X-rays). This is why the russian comms sat system (Molniya) uses a highly elliptic and highly inclined orbit.
The disconnection problem of sat-based net links is easy to solve when you are the world's no.1 rocketry power and also have a BIG chemical laser battery at your disposal at the Shari-Sagan test base. On the other hand, the other countries and the insurers won't like that kind of a smokey solution.
By the way, I'm pretty sure Russia could jam sat links non-destructively with the power of a top notch solar storm or two, but that kind of secret capability is of course not disclosed in peace-time.
If all else fails, Russia could simply pull the plug on all electricity supplied to civilian consumers. Pretty hard to hand-crank a sat-dish comms based ISP with a dynamo and gen-sets soon run out of fuel.
Effects in GCHQ (...) Now major part of business - 5% of Operations
Propaganda, Deception, Mass messaging, Pushing stories, Alias development, Psychology (quotes from the EFF slides, punctuation is mine)
While I do think controlling the content of the Internet is wrong, and I'm glad the Russians can't do it, it seems wrong to criticize those who wanted to do it in self-defense from people who is actually controlling it, specially without mentioning that and pretending they were paranoid.
VICE is utter propaganda. Just read their "articles" on Ukraine, Syria or Putin. What a worthless feel-good publication.
US incarnation complex
Wow, things have evolved in strange ways since I last learned about the US government.
You need to install an RTFM interface.
> this is the same guy who told me that my lending a friend a tape drive so he could back up his data during a virus infection would result in the virus infecting the tape drive and then infecting my computer when I hooked the drive up to my system (using a different tape entirely).
He was right. Maybe he had a friend working for the NSA who quipped while drunk? You see, it is now well-known from Snowden confessions that NSA and Unit 8200 created malware which was/is able to access and reprogram the EPROM (firmware) chip in hard drives, CD/DVD burners and some tape drives the same way you can reprogram (flash) the BIOS of a motherboard. Kaspersky Lab got hold of some binary virus samples last year, analyzed them and determined the storage device EPROM trick works and is able to spread rootkit type infections in a highly efficient stealthly manner.
How about The bloggers law
This post has been removed by DMCA
I had no idea we were so important
You had no idea because you asked the wrong question.
Just like, U.S.A likes to ask themselves "I have no idea why they hate our freedom!"
May be, there are more "shills" ("who did not share the same ideas with me"), because of they are not really shill, just more people waked up:
Amid Russian airstrikes, a Putin craze takes hold in Mideast - AP
http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/M/ML_MIDEAST_PUTIN?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT
1. Russians were (in various ways still are) bad in psy-ops. Internet, as a great medium for subverting Russians was (and still is), a threat to the regime. For better or worse for the Russians being subverted, is a separate question - but in that regard, the generals were correct. :)
2. Controlling the internet the Chinese way is certainly a way to mitigate the psy-warfare, but the cost is way too high. Not going to preach merits of free flow of information and discussion to the slashdot choir.
3. As Russians got better at waging this war, they realized there are ways to deal with this within the existing Internet framework.
Overall, the article is an anti-Russian and anti-Putin propaganda piece, which is not surprising nor remarkable (not that it matters much though, as it does raise a few valid concerns).
What is more important today is not what the article is about. The biggest potential problem with the Internet architecture is the possibility of the US cutting off Russia's access to it, should the relationship between the two countries degrade to that level. This is not a theoretical scenario; Apple and Google went as far as shutting off their services for a part of Russia, and that can be seen as a first step of cutting Russia off the network. This prompted the Russian Security Council (that really makes all high level decisions in the country) to consider providing an alternative system that can be switched to in case of things going down fast. I suspect this system, once live, may be seriously considered for switching over to, partly for the reasons outlined in the article, with the "rest of the internet" accessible through some sort of a government-controlled gateway. Which would be a loss for everyone, but what are you going to do.
It's called TPP, you can read the "IP" Chapter and find out who controls the Internet, all in the name of protecting the bottom line of huge Media Corps.
When the copyright term is "forever minus a day", live every day like it's the last.
Why did you write "The US" for one side and "The Russians" for the other side? Why didn't you write "The American people"? Or better: "The American government" and "The Russian government"?
"The Russians" as in the population of Russia surely don't want that.
butt hurt Americans trying the old slam campaign approach. Get over it. You sponsor some groups of terrorists...he's just gonna bomb all terrorists. Assad is the legitimate president whether USA likes it or not. That makes all armed opposition terrorist and USA a terrorist supporter. And USA is butt hurt now that it has been proven that it made less strikes against ISIS in a year than in 6 days of bombing Yugoslavia and that Putin hit more targets in a day than they did in a month. They even managed to blow up a hospital. And now the typical media propaganda attempt on all sites. Pathetic
/. has had much importance. Witness Obama shills here, every day.
The internet is run by someone at the top, but that "someone" is a number of computer programs, which talk about how to send data from computer to computer. These programs are neutral as to the recipients and contents of those data.
Freedom IS and ONLY IS anarchy. The jews that run the schemes are anarchists, in a tribe, while dupes follow bogus jew 'laws'.
But you know that, being a jew troll. Your twisted yammer is bs.The jews / jew trolls do what they can to demonize anarchy, just as with all their false flags.
Most people don't 'make governments', instead dupes go along with the jews and cons who do, and that is the problem, as people will see shortly with the chemtrail virus the jews have now sprayed. The only freedom is anarchy, defense freely self enforced and by making tribes.
Until people figure it out, the robbery and slaughter by the anarchists in teh jew tribe will continue.
thezog.info
wow, Putin is many things and is probably responsible for a lot of bad shit (just like Obama et al). But just WOW, this reads like it was written by someone who holes up in a bunker with their tin foil hat wrapped to tightly around their head.
Always telling everyone else 'you need government', so the jew anarchists in the tribe are free to rape rob and kill using their fraud 'government' while YOU pay 'tax' to the Jew and pay the 'holocaust' fraud and follow jew 'laws' until they kill you.
thezog.info - see 'required reading upper left main page, see bottom half of list, coply articles from vnn. also leucter report at archive.org - holodomorinfo.com - don't follow any of the sites, just see pages.
Chemtrail virus. Wake up dummies.
Full Disclosure: I live in Russia. And I am quite glad that the experiment failed.
Failed? No, it provided a roadmap.
What Russia needs to do to control the domestic network is start consolidating/nationalizing the ISP sector so that you end up with half a dozen big ISPs which can then be controlled by the government directly or indirectly.
Next the network hardware market will need to be heavily regulated so that only approved entities can legally get access to the equipment necessary to establish satellite or radio uplinks.
With this in place the rogue uplink problem can be eliminated and Putin can have his control. So I'd look out for those things starting to happen, if they do you have 5-10 years of internet freedom left before the lockdown sets in.
sigs are hazardous to your health
The scam of 'government' is nothing more than cons writing up papers calling it 'law'. The JEW con 'government', 'republic' 'democracy' all of it opposite of freedom natural anarchy. The ONLY real means of self defense and dummies are going to see soon when dying from the VIRUS that was sprayed in the chemtrails. The fraud of 'government' is a proven fraud. There is no 'law'. All law is based on contract. The jew con 'constitutions' are NOT binding contract. There is no difference between parasite 'democracy' with scumbags 'voting' for more communist scum jew 'govt' to steal from other men, and 'republic' with false 'elected' men telling other other men what to do.
thezog.info
http://jewishcrimenetworkdid911.blogspot.com/
http://web.archive.org/web/20100825152627/http://jewishfaces.com/banking.html - all pages at top
holodomorinfo.com
newworldwar.org/chemical.htm - ignore notes at bottom, skip rest of site.
It is ALL a proven fraud. And a DEADLY fraud.
Chemtrail Virus.
I've always used both Britain and The British, or Ireland or The Irish when referring to governments. It tends to be pretty bloody clear from the context as to what/who you're referring to. Some people really seem to go out of their way to get annoyed...
You'll grow up, eventually. Until then, know that I read your post but really don't see any reason to give you a detailed reply. Look back, in twenty years or so, and marvel at the gibberish you typed on the internet.
"So long and thanks for all the fish."
That's quite a non-sequitur you have there, as it's clear from context that being dragged off to the gulag could be used as a form of censorship in Russia - seems to be much less common now than it was during the Soviet era, but still happening. In contrast, we in the US have a ridiculously high incarceration rate due primarily to convictions of non-violent drug offenders, with our excessively long sentences exacerbating the problem. Good luck finding instances where someone was successfully convicted solely for saying something politically controversial, or for some other proper exercise of free speech (e.g., excluding incitement of violence). In the US, if you piss off powerful political figures, they might make your life difficult, but you won't find yourself dragged off in the night by government goons and taken to some "American gulag".
- T
more anti Putin anti Russia propaganda,
Millions of bs distraction posts on the web are JEWS. This 'grow up' troll is JEW. Look at his post slobber 'don't see any reason to give detailed reply' because all he has is bullshit. The facts in the 'garbage troll bs' post are clear.
Copy the post and other post higher up above also that says 'garbage'. give links to everyone. The jews are lying scheming mass murderers, bullshit 'govt', 'media', millions of trolls on the web. Make your own tribes. see info post above.
Of course the JEW trolls don't want anyone to know the truth. They are behind all the 'law of the jungle' bs, all the bs like the post above 'no rights'. JOKE.
Natural law anarchism is EVERY right by mental physical ability. How it's used is mitigated by choice of the individual and to the extent individuals make tribes. The JEWS don't want anyone else to exercise free right anarchism because others would make their own tribes and stop the jew mass murder schemes. Instead, they want dupes following bogus jew 'law' until the jews slaughter everyone else which they've already killed one billion people, now the bogus 'usa' is next. Chemtrail virus. click show all comments slide bar over, see other 'jew' posts title 'garbage' or 'jew trolls'.
thezog.info