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Tech Leaders Speak Out Against Trump Ban on Transgender Troops (axios.com)
Technology executives, including Facebook CEO Mark Zuckerberg and Google CEO Sundar Pichai took to social media to voice their displeasure over President Donald Trump's latest stance on transgendered people in the military.
"I am grateful to the transgender members of the military for their service," Google CEO Sundar Pichai said.
Apple CEO Tim Cook said, "We are indebted to all who serve. Discrimination against anyone holds everyone back."
Brad Smith, Microsoft President and Chief Legal Officer said, "We honor and respect all who serve, including the transgender members of our military."
Salesforce said it "believes in equality for all. We support and thank all U.S. service members, including transgender Americans."
Facebook CEO Mark Zuckerberg said, "Everyone should be able to serve their country -- no matter who they are."
Veteran entrepreneur Max Levchin urged support for transgender people across party lines. "Trans kids, soldiers etc need our support today and to know they are valued & respected regardless of politics. Let us not be divided."
Uber told news outlet Axios, "We owe the deepest debt of gratitude to all those who volunteer to serve in the US Armed Forces and defend our values. These patriotic Americans deserve to be honored and respected, not turned away because of who they are."
Twitter CEO Jack Dorsey said, "Discrimination in any form is wrong for all of us."
"I am grateful to the transgender members of the military for their service," Google CEO Sundar Pichai said.
Apple CEO Tim Cook said, "We are indebted to all who serve. Discrimination against anyone holds everyone back."
Brad Smith, Microsoft President and Chief Legal Officer said, "We honor and respect all who serve, including the transgender members of our military."
Salesforce said it "believes in equality for all. We support and thank all U.S. service members, including transgender Americans."
Facebook CEO Mark Zuckerberg said, "Everyone should be able to serve their country -- no matter who they are."
Veteran entrepreneur Max Levchin urged support for transgender people across party lines. "Trans kids, soldiers etc need our support today and to know they are valued & respected regardless of politics. Let us not be divided."
Uber told news outlet Axios, "We owe the deepest debt of gratitude to all those who volunteer to serve in the US Armed Forces and defend our values. These patriotic Americans deserve to be honored and respected, not turned away because of who they are."
Twitter CEO Jack Dorsey said, "Discrimination in any form is wrong for all of us."
The policy this is reversing has only existed about a year. Why are people acting like there was a trans brigade charging the shores of Normandy?
You say discrimination is wrong yet you actively censor things you don't like. Also don't you have a couple of sex discrimination lawsuit up against you?
"I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it" ~ Evelyn Beatrice Hall
All that stuff he said last fall about LGBT rights was just him being "all things to all people", which he might've even stuck with if everything had gone well.
But nothing has gone well. Now he needs his base to back him, especially if he fires Sessions and Mueller.
And only a fool would care if s/he/? made the stockholders money.
Post may contain irony: discontinue use if experiencing mood swings, nausea or elevated blood pressure.
Well based on the reasoning from the article earlier today, they'll never get funded.
In debates about Christianity, there are two groups: those looking for answers, and those looking to just ask questions.
I think this may be the most irrelevant /. submission ever.
Perhaps one of the eleven or so recruits that this will affect was a nerd before joining up.
Based on the 40-50% suicide rate they'll never get funded.
One of the great thing about our country is that they are allowed to voice their opinion, whether you care to hear it or not.
Pot
Sorry, don't like it? Leave.
Kettle
In debates about Christianity, there are two groups: those looking for answers, and those looking to just ask questions.
People with mental illness were already prevented from joining the military before this so this is really no change. A group with a 40 percent suicide rate and people expect us to put guns in their hands? I can see post transition and post operation trans participating but while make a transition is just too crazy. Also in my life 99% of every trans person I have met is or was addicted to drugs.
So the US military will cease to be the target of more progressive social experiments for a few years. End of the world stuff right there; the virtuepocalypse is upon us!
Maw! Fire up the karma burner!
Body change don't affect your DNA, or its expression (assuming no external hormonal therapy), so really, that's more of a mental disorder than anything else...
When a major policy change is announced, Silicon Valley has to prove their devotion.
Twitter supports and protects racists - by smearing their critics with the "Hate Speech" label.
Agree. Why should tech CEO's or celebrities be a better source of general political ideas than Joe Sixpack? Opinions are like assholes: everyone has one. If they comment on technology as it intersects politics, then they can be considered subject matter experts; granted a biased one, but at least it would directly involve their field.
If military generals commented on this topic, it would be newsworthy because they have experience with military crew interaction. But if the military generals commented on say the iPhone's UI, their opinion is no more valid than Joe Sixpack's. (PS, yes, the Orange Man is a jerk.)
Table-ized A.I.
If that's the case, then why do we always see left-wingers resorting to censorship ("moderation") here, at reddit, and at so many other online discussion forums? Left-wingers only support freedom of speech when you're saying what they want to hear. Otherwise they want to silence you. We don't see this hatred of free speech from non-left-wingers.
wait until $trump_decision != '';
foreach $personality ( @leftwing )
{
send_to_twitter( $personality . " is outraged at Trump for " . $trump_decision );
}
What's passive aggressive. This is a major point of contention.
I don't give a rat's a$$ about who one marries, who one f**ks, how one dresses. Do what you want.
But the military cares about suicide rates. It's a problem. Add to that the well document FACT that transgendered people commit suicide at a far greater rate than the average person (whether or not they have had surgery) and they (the military) have a good reason to be concerned.
Whether they should or should not prevent transgendered people in the military is another issue. It is not, however, a bullsh!t consideration.
If you're scared of your govt then you need to further restrict its powers
Vote 3rd Party in 2016 and beyond
They've spent years and years in the military!
"The average reporter we talk to is 27 years old......They literally know nothing." - Ben Rhodes
I am a Vet and a SGT. They already serve. They are in the service and are part of the human race. Ignorance is not bliss. Trumps myopic perspective ignorant at best and bigoted at worst.
Seriously.
As someone who spent seven years in active service, and trained many soldiers in Canada, worrying about someone's sexual orientation or whatever was dead last on my concerns. As in never spent a moment thinking about it, or caring about it.
Are we sure he's sane?
-- Tigger warning: This post may contain tiggers! --
Or... he has some superbad news he needs to distract from (1), ergo... the CrazyTweet defence.
(1) They have 20 hours to pass a black-box healthcare bill by Thursday
Well, I suspect that group oversees a disproportionate part of your economy.
And, seriously, you're of the belief that the average person in the population is as capable as the average individual running large entities? My problem is that Joe Sixpack is a moron.
That's just like, your opinion, man.
Those who advocate genocide deserve every protection afforded by law, and none afforded by common human decency.
But the military cares about suicide rates. It's a problem. Add to that the well document FACT that transgendered people commit suicide at a far greater rate than the average person (whether or not they have had surgery) and they (the military) have a good reason to be concerned.
Why them particularly? And do you have a citation that says that the suicide rate and/or other health outcomes are equal or worse for transgender persons in the military as opposed to the general population?
Those who advocate genocide deserve every protection afforded by law, and none afforded by common human decency.
because they're seen by the common folks as "gods", and not the assholes they truly are (not that I have anything against assholes, they have they uses... once a day).
I also like, "I may not agree with the religious message on your bumper sticker. But I will defend your right to stick it."
This space unintentionally left blank.
Agree. Why should tech CEO's or celebrities be a better source of general political ideas than Joe Sixpack? Opinions are like assholes: everyone has one.
Because these particular assholes have agendas and PR images. Everything they do publicly is to bolster their PR image and further their agendas.
Their agendas include gaining wealth and gaining power, not helping the common man. In fact, screwing the common man is a common tactic.
More proof that technology != biology in competency.
SJW: a person who perceives an injustice, and while correcting it, commits a greater injustice.
You can use quotation marks all you want. He was elected. He is the current President of the United States of America.
You don't have to like it, but lets face i t- the "vocal minority" has been dictating the nation's policy and direction for decades.
No that's projecting your issues not the military's it has nothing to do with hatred.
per my other post:
As a former Army combat grunt It has nothing to do with "mental illnesses" there's plenty of non-sexual problems with people on the front line it's more about not needing the SJW bullshit that comes along with it.
I'm not going to treat you any differently than the rest of the assholes getting shot at with me and nearly all of the B & T'ers I've meet can't help but push there issues at everyone around them.
Hell my best friend at the time was gay but he didn't advertise or act any differently when the uniform was on. There's allot of that in the US military it's the ones that can't act like a normal soldier that has real problems.
Did you ever stop to think that maybe... perhaps... it is ostracizing crap like this that leads transgender people to commit suicide?
So is there any evidence that the suicide rate among the transgendered is significantly different than other enlisted? Military suicides are massive in the US armed forces, and that was true before we started allowing openly transgendered people to join the military.
"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
(not that I have anything against assholes, they have they uses... once a day).
You're just not imagining enough uses for assholes. You can use them all day, with practice and care.
"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
Strategic PR
In this case, "Virtue Signaling"
When Fascism comes to America, it will call itself Anti-Fascism, and tell you to give up your guns.
This has NOTHING to do with any type of policy other than hatred. Everyone needs to stand up to the clueless, out of touch, orange douchbag
I bet the irony of this message is completely lost on the author.
The Military limits and even abrogates many rights simply due to the nature and mission of the organization.
We can't have people or missions endangered because of some SJW position.
The Generals have declared that is a danger.
The military doesn't pay for breast implants, they shouldn't pay for trans surgery. If they want to argue that they have to because it's a medical condition, then discharge them. People are discharged due to medical conditions all the time.
When Fascism comes to America, it will call itself Anti-Fascism, and tell you to give up your guns.
Suicide rate for trans is around 40%. Before or after surgery.
Clearly the desire to be what you not is a symptom of something and not the something itself.
When Fascism comes to America, it will call itself Anti-Fascism, and tell you to give up your guns.
The rate remains the same regardless of how supportive their environment is.
When Fascism comes to America, it will call itself Anti-Fascism, and tell you to give up your guns.
Trans suicide rates are between 40-50% https://williamsinstitute.law.... https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/p...
The normal rate of suicide in the military is no where near the 40% suffered by Trans people.
See Train0987's post above for citations.
When Fascism comes to America, it will call itself Anti-Fascism, and tell you to give up your guns.
You could have said 1 year after the end of the segregation/miscegenation laws the same thing. Length of existence of a policy is not a good argument for or against or for its validity. The only valid argument I see are : 1) are the TG folk mentally fit enough ? 2) are the TG folk physically fit enough. (2) is answered already by exam at the start and (1) should be answered with time and possibly exams, or study on TG psychology/psychiatry. But nothing about time a policy existed makes for a valid argument.
C. Sagan : A demon haunted world:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0345409469/
visit randi.org
I am speaking out against Tech companies lack of good documentation on how to use their shit!
HEY YOU! With the facts! Stop that! This is slashdot, and a post that is bashing trump, we are allowed to make up anything we want and get +17 Insightful for it!!
--Highdude702 (don't want to undo mods)
Not a one of those "tech leaders" has ever served in the military so they have no bases on which to state their option on the subject.
I see... Your opinion is that others shouldn't express their opinions. So why did you bother expressing yours again?
Trump is Trash and so are the people who support him
Thats not an argument
And I'm happy for you that you have no idea why that might be, but I did ask for some specific citations, not the first vaguely applicable paper to hand.
Those who advocate genocide deserve every protection afforded by law, and none afforded by common human decency.
If the military cared so much about suicide rates you'd think they would do a lot more to help all those veterans committing suicide, who are homeless, can't find jobs, or get medical care. Hell, we just had a veteran here die because he was so depressed from lack of medical care and couldn't even afford food that he used what he said was a bomb and took hostages in a bank.
The only thing necessary for evil to triumph is for it to be pitted against a slightly greater evil
The suicide attempt rate among transgender persons ranges from 32% to 50% across the countries. Gender-based victimization, discrimination, bullying, violence, being rejected by the family, friends, and community; harassment by intimate partner, family members, police and public; discrimination and ill treatment at health-care system are the major risk factors that influence the suicidal behavior among transgender persons.
See Train0987's post above for citations.
Okay, I found the post and well... I'm just starting to dig into the second citation and it is fucking garbage. I had to look at that one because the first site never actually responds. Hmm, with the power of google I found it on scribd. I'll look at that in a minute, but let's talk about the second paper first. Its most relevant sources do not exist. Not just a simple 404, I googled for the ones which they claim directly support the headline and there's nothing, nada, zip and zilch. And the other papers which they claim generally support their claim... don't support their claim. It is a garbage citation and we can safely wipe our asses with it.
The first citation is of generally higher quality, even though the study it is based upon includes only about 6,500 valid respondents when there are about 1.5 million transgendered people in the USA, and only 75% of those were transgendered people (the rest were other people who describe their gender in complex terms.) Further, it counts suicide attempts, not suicides. The study does not say what you guys want it to say. In particular, it says that the suicide rate among trans respondents was only slightly higher than the rest of the respondents in the study. If you're not going to ban gays from the military, there's no real justification for banning the transgendered.
Whoops, I actually read the citations! Guess I wasn't supposed to do that.
"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
The Command-in-Chief is also spouting a lot of nonsense without having any military qualifications. I put a lot more faith in what seasoned commands and veterans have to say on the matter than what gas bag right-wing politicians and arm chair leftist techies have to say.
“Common sense is not so common.” — Voltaire
commanders*
“Common sense is not so common.” — Voltaire
Military generals have commented on this topic. They hated being pawns of Obama's social agenda and didn't like the idea of being forced to have mentally ill soldiers serve in order to satisfy some stupid concept of political correctness. It's been shown time and time again that mixed gender forces are less effective than all-male forces.
But that's not politically correct, so the military is forced to accept being less than they could be in order to satisfy some left-wing agenda. I doubt they're going to say it explicitly, but most generals are thrilled with Trump letting them off the hook for Obama's terrible, terrible decision.
What an ill chosen homily. Everybody does not have an arsehole. Think about it.
No, your children are not the special ones. Nor are your pets.
Comment removed based on user account deletion
The edge is off the charts.
Proud neuron in the Slashdot hivemind since 2002.
Comment removed based on user account deletion
^exactly, this is so obvious.
So you think that just because they are incompetent suicides, that the attempt doesn't count.
That's not even vaguely close to what I said, and if that's the only interpretation of my comment that you can imagine as valid, then you're being a disingenuous douchenozzle and there's no point in talking to you any further.
"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
Same argument was made about gay people serving. Turned out not to be an issue.
The US military spends 10x as much on Viagra as it does on gender reassignment.
const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
You really have never been in the field, have you?
The only time anyone cares about which restroom is which is when you're in some comfy place that isn't in the field.
It's not high school, junior.
-- Tigger warning: This post may contain tiggers! --
Have some Spam-flavored Macadamia Nuts, Teriyaki Spam and Hot & Spicy Spam for your whine.
"The Generals have declared that is a danger."
The generals have very much NOT declared that it a danger.
The study from 2016 said it was no problem. The current study is not complete yet.
Meanwhile, the military is prohibited from selecting who it sees fit.
I suppose you are a straight white male, in which case, this disqualify you to be discriminated against.
The Russia Investigation being itself a Red Herring from Hillary's death toll or Sander's corruption.
Add to that the well document FACT that transgendered people commit suicide at a far greater rate than the average person ...
Comparing against "average person" (assuming whole population either including or excluding transgender people) is in absolutely no way a valid comparison. In this case men in age military service versus transgender of same age should be compared (ignoring biases introduced by all men versus those that join the military, etc).
According to CDC suicide for men all ages is "just" 2.5% while for ages 15-34 is between 16-20%. And suicide rates for men are much higher than for women. So "average person" rates are extremely misleading.
When you are sure of something, you probably are wrong (search for "Unskilled and Unaware of It").
The first citation is of generally higher quality, even though the study it is based upon includes only about 6,500 valid respondents when there are about 1.5 million transgendered people in the USA
It's hard to discern your point here -- are you suggesting that kind of sample size is way outside the norm for a study like this, and that it therefore may have significantly skewed the results? This actually seems like a fairly healthy sample size, and the p-values throughout the study reflect that.
Further, it counts suicide attempts, not suicides.
Again, your point is unclear. You can't possibly be saying that we shouldn't pay attention to a massively disproportionate rate of suicide attempts simply because some of them weren't successful.
The study does not say what you guys want it to say.
Whether or not anybody "wants it to," here's what the study actually says (emphasis mine):
The prevalence of suicide attempts among respondents to the National Transgender Discrimination Survey (NTDS), conducted by the National Gay and Lesbian Task Force and National Center for Transgender Equality , is 41 percent, which vastly exceeds the 4.6 percent of the overall U.S. population who report a lifetime suicide attempt , and is also higher than the 10-20 percent of lesbian, gay and bisexual adults who report ever attempting suicide.
Fuck me with an unfinished plank sideways, is that an actual thing?
Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
In your case it was justified.
Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
You're so full of shit. Post-surgery suicide rates are close to the general population. Also, Trump is an idiot - there are already 2,500 transsexuals serving in the military, and 1,500 in the reserves, and it hasn't had a negative impact. He's spouting nonsense to take take the heat off of "the Russia thing", Sessions, and the failure of the senate to repeal Obamacare outright, with 9 Republicans joining the Democrats.
He's a lame duck.
"Transparent" is a shit show that trades on every stereotype going. A man in drag is NOT a transsexual.
While I wouldn't go so far as to call them phonies, it's rather ridiculous to ask the CEO of a large company for his thoughts on any such policy. They are not going to provide their personal view, but rather the line that their position, board, and shareholders expect them to. In fact, this is the reason, other than the CEO, most companies and politicians have communications teams to speak on their behalf, to make sure they don't say anything out of line (regardless of what they think).
Some people may have the courage to challenge orthodoxy, but a CEO almost surely won't.
The " U.S. National Transgender Discrimination Survey " is a piece of shit, with poor methodology, huge selection bias, and they even admit that because the survey only had a budget of $3,000, they couldn't get a representative sample.
Any study based on that is doubly a piece of shit.
Anyone stupid enough to cite it is triply a piece of shit.
"Transparent" is a shit show that trades on every stereotype going. A man in drag is NOT a transsexual.
+5 Insightful, really?
/. was a place where facts and nuance too precedence over bias and politics. Sadly, this place has changed.
The Generals have declared that is a danger.
Is there data to back this up or could it be just the bigoted opinion of a few jerks? The same things were said about blacks, gays, and women.
The military doesn't pay for breast implants, they shouldn't pay for trans surgery.
If paying for trans surgery was the issue then POTUS could have ended the military's policy of covering that procedure. There are about 15,000 trans people in the US military. If ALL of them had surgery (which they won't) at 100k a pop it would amount to 1.5 billion which is 0.1% of the cost of the F-35 program. This isn't about cost or "unit cohesion", this is about bigotry - just like it was for blacks, gays, and women.
I've always appreciated that
So how much support do you think they will get from a bunch of Jar Head grunts?
Nowadays? Plenty, because everyone knows someone who is trans, or knows someone who knows someone who is. No need to go through 6 degrees of separation a la Kevin Bacon.
"Transparent" is a shit show that trades on every stereotype going. A man in drag is NOT a transsexual.
There are already 2,500 trans troops in the services, and 1,500 in the reserves. This is just Trump throwing shit at the wall to distract from his failures.
"Transparent" is a shit show that trades on every stereotype going. A man in drag is NOT a transsexual.
Last year, then defence secretary Ash Carter cited a study by the RAND Corporation think-tank that said there were about 2,500 active-duty service members and 1,500 service members who were transgender.
Where were the riots, the mutinies, the refusals of people to work alongside them? Oh, right - they didn't happen.
"Transparent" is a shit show that trades on every stereotype going. A man in drag is NOT a transsexual.
That Trump's ban on transgendered people in the military is a blessing for pacifists! They will only need to declare being transgendered (most possibly, pre-op) to avoid draft. How would the army verify that you are not transgender?
One of the great thing about our country is that they are allowed to voice their opinion
Yeah, tell that to Trump supporters in Portland. These days, being a Republican in a blue state can cost your your job, your friends, your property, your personal safety, even your life if you're not careful. It's part of what has driven me and many others away from the modern left.
SJW: Someone who has run out of real oppression, and has to fake it.
No, you fucking conspiracy theory dipshit.... it's called reality. I get it, you fucking moronic imbecilic partisan fucks don't have even a passing relationship with reality, but please, for once in your life, pull your head out of your ass.
https://icontherecord.tumblr.c...
What are you... some anti-American traitor, or just a stupid fucking idiot?
Fascism: An authoritarian and nationalistic right-wing system of government and social organization. See also: NAZI's
As a vet, the ONLY thing i gave a shit about in a foxhole was the guy next to me could fucking shoot. These piece of shits like Trump are worthless dickwads who have never served this country a day in their life.
Fascism: An authoritarian and nationalistic right-wing system of government and social organization. See also: NAZI's
I can't stand Trump, think he's already the worst President in our history, but I have no problems with this decision. I'm an army brat, I was in ROTC, went to basic, had all the training to be a military officer (just never signed up), and I know 1st hand and personally of people being either kicked out or prohibited from joining for all kinds of medical issues, some of them ancient history, some of their mildly debilitation. The idea that someone is going to physically alter their body in extremely intrusive fashion that requires all kinds of lifetime medical and even surgical regimens to maintain them and the military is supposed to 1.) pay for it 2.) make concessions for the other commitments to that surgery; is a real head scratcher.
My only problem is Trump obviously did it as another one of his twitter shiny bauble, public debate distractions.
I swear to God...I swear to God! That is NOT how you treat your human!
Their opinions hold no more weight than the Hollywood airheads that jump on the liberal bandwagons.
To protect the USA by being able to kill people and break things anywhere on demand as quickly and efficiently as possible... Not to be some social or environmental experiment.
This whole LGBT* being allowed in the military debate looks more like a social experiment than being about the military's primary mission to me. It's about as pointless as using renewable "green" fuel to power a long range bomber on a thermal Nuclear strike. You are really concerned about CO2 emissions when you are dropping a nuclear bomb?
IF some idea or policy doesn't enhance the military's ability to kill people and break things, then it's a bad idea or policy for the military. There should be no arguments about the military that is not about how to fulfill it's purpose with the most efficient, most accurate and quickest way possible, with perhaps a thought about if we can actually afford to do without it based on cost. Full Stop.
"File to fit, pound to insert, paint to match" - Aircraft Maintenance 101
I don't know anybody who is trans. You keep saying that BS that hoping the majority of people like me will feel like the oddball. Just aint true though.
Everybody in SF, Manhattan, and Miami Beach probably know someone. Those are not military recruiting hotbed though, so my guess is most soldiers are more like me.
That's why!
Progressivism: Parasites helping parasites to help themselves - to other people's stuff.
These two statements appear to contradict eachother. Either people who are not combat ready do not get into the military or you do not get to stay home because of a combat ready weakness. Which is it?
File under 'M' for 'Manic ranting'
As far i know, this was done to stop people from joining the army, getting a free sex change operation and leaving the army.
Trump tried the saner "just block pentagon from paying for sex surgeries" approach first, and it got blocked, so this is the end result.
... and how you start cleaning the dog shit (which is insulting for dog's) in front of your own door ? for example, the mile long "pay-for-play" activities of the Clinton, or the "generous" Qatar's donation to the "Foundation" ?
When you start pointing out other's shit, the least you can do is ensure you're not in it up to your eyebrows yourself.
Twitter CEO Jack Dorsey said, "Discrimination in any form is wrong for all of us."
Yet he's happy to do it when it can hurt conservatives.
Twitter supports and protects racists - by smearing their critics with the "Hate Speech" label.
100% of the service people are ready for combat theater deployment. You don't get to stay home because you have a combat ready weakness.
These two statements appear to contradict eachother. Either people who are not combat ready do not get into the military or you do not get to stay home because of a combat ready weakness. Which is it?
You've changed the first statement from "ready for combat theater deployment" to "combat ready." The former statement means "know they can be ordered to, and are expected to pack up and go, when needed". The latter means "ready to deal with it when they get there." Sadly, not everyone who knows they are expected to go are ready to survive the result.
both my wife and myself have to work with them with a smile. we like our paychecks and assets just like you do.
Not been a draft military is what the US military cares about.
The new equipment is expensive and heavy. Every US solider has to carry a lot of equipment.
Water, ammo, body armour, batteries, communications all adds up when running around a mountain.
The enemy grew up in such conditions and does not carry as much equipment.
The enemy has a wrist watch, a commander has a handheld radio. Their clean water is a stream. Their food is total support from all local farmers. Their heavy body armour is their faith.
The only way for the USA to keep winning to get every US solider near special forces fit just to be ready to fight.
So the US mil has to be very selective to ensure all the years of work put into any individual results in a very fit person who can carry a lot and then fight.
The US takes the fight to the enemy in harsh conditions over days. All that weight and ammo has to be carried all the time without any slowdowns.
If the US wanted a draft army they would have to do a Switzerland.
Sit around in the bunker with everything ready. All weapons systems just waiting for the command.
The esprit de corps of sitting in a civilian truck and been driven to a bunker. Driving a civilian truck full of mil supplies and ammo to the bunker.
A Maginot Line draft is easy for a nation thats not going to war. The US is always at war.
When at war you need the best. People who are fit and have always been fit. Well fed and able to carry all their kit for hours in any conditions.
That cant be fixed with politics. Only years of exercise in full heavy kit makes for a strong solider.
The US mil wants to win wars again. Not to have to slow down to a Vietnam like draft politics again.
Domestic spying is now "Benign Information Gathering"
Or, they could just read the note. There's usually a note.
I've provided a few citations for why that might be in another post:
https://apple.slashdot.org/com...
Given that 62.7% have an identifiable mental comorbidity, and 81.4% have a personality disorder, I think there's a very, very high probability that the high suicide rate comes from mental illness rather than societal pressures.
I am calling bullshit that you were a grunt, a grunt is an infantryman. No infantryman says "combat grunt" .
Agree. Why should tech CEO's or celebrities be a better source of general political ideas than Joe Sixpack?
Because leaders of massive companies have more experience managing large workforces than joe sixpack working for the man. So their opinion of the impacts of diversity in the workforce are somewhat relevant to the discussion (and it is a discussion, we need more discussing and less ramming down throats)
The anecdote of 1 TG cannot lead to a suggestion of anything whatsoever. Statistic do not work that way. But with respect to suicide , that was what the point I was hinting at with peer review - you also have to look at why the suicide are done BTW and whether the reason of those are likely to happen in military situation (training camp, combat etc...). It could be that properly studied , we find that the situation leading to those suicide is unlikely in military and make TG even better soldat (unlikely but could be - the point is not to act on prejudice)
That still that does not make length a policy was alive a factor worth looking at, which was my point of contention.
C. Sagan : A demon haunted world:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0345409469/
visit randi.org
Yes. The person who you were responding to was doing just that. as are you.
Freedom of speech! Great, isn't it!?
It may be worth noting that Trump did not do anything. He simply tweeted something. I am fairly certain, that Trump knows the difference between a tweet and an executive order. That means he didn't decide to throw transgender people out of the military (lots of them are already serving), but decided to communicate about military and transgender.
There are a lot of theories on what Trump's tweets are supposed to achieve. One I found pretty interesting was this: Trump doesn't have a stake in decency or respect for the office of the president or integrity of the government or any of those things. But other people do. So they are forced to react. Because they care. Trump himself doesn't. He keeps people busy that way. And he keeps himself in the spotlight.
Given that 62.7% have an identifiable mental comorbidity, and 81.4% have a personality disorder, I think there's a very, very high probability that the high suicide rate comes from mental illness rather than societal pressures.
You don't have much conception of the societal pressures. Personally, I dealt with varying levels of depression from about age 8 until fairly recently, and it's been precisely the realization of how much of that was due to external pressures that has been key to ending that. One of the more punishing mental traps is the idea that you are somehow shameful or wrong for being who you are. That is just the tip of the proverbial iceberg, however. I mean, look at this forum; Slashdot is even one of the better-educated parts of the Internet.
As far as your studies go...oh boy. So the statistical error you're making is not considering or controlling for other confounding factors. Assault and various kinds of sexual and other abuse occur at a rate far higher than the general population, and these have well-documented effects on mental health. You're also interpreting a correlation as a causation, and specifically framing that causation in a manner which supports your prejudices when all evidence suggests the reverse. I also am forced to assume that you did not read anything of those studies beyond the abstract. You might have noticed that the one was published in "Psychiatry Journal", the other in "Medical Journal of Islamic Republic of Iran", and both of them were done in Iran. Even if there were some reason to believe that these were valid journals or good science, there's no justification for assuming that these figures correspond to conditions in the Western world.
So to repeat, I did ask for something other than the first paper that came to hand. And a minimum standard of politeness would involve reading it first.
Those who advocate genocide deserve every protection afforded by law, and none afforded by common human decency.
The sooner we build the B Ark the better.
Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
Two reasons Trump is coming out with this shit now:
1. Draw attention away from the Russia investigation.
2. Naked populism. Most Americans dislike LGBT, so he's throwing them a fucking bone. Gets their nubs hard knowing they're shitting on a minority.
Being manipulated quite so effectively by a narcissistic moron does not reflect well on you, but then neither did electing the odious cunt in the first place.
I do not want your cheap brainburning drugs. They are useless for work. And I am a working man today.
Yes, even Trump and Hillary are alowed to give their opinion about quantum chromodynamics or wether goto's are bad or if all methods should only have one exit point. However, that does not mean anyone would give them any value.
Well, notes are not necessarily telling the truth. They are not necessarily reflecting the reality. It is not because the author is now dead it is more credible. There is a lot of people committing suicide on false perceptions or just because of mental illness.
Achille Talon
Hop!
Um, this is a Trump success sweetie.
Stuff you hate isn't a failure. In fact, it's why we elected him.
This might actually be the right time to identify as an attack helicopter.
"So long and thanks for all the fish."
https://www.lifesitenews.com/n...
I don't have an answer but as the military has a major issue with sexual assault of females within their own ranks. I'm not entirely convinced that expecting females to accept penis or be accused of hate crimes is necessarily the best solution. Also http://www.military.com/join-a... is a damn long list, medical conditions are problematic for armies to deal with.
No. They don't usually leave a note. I have no idea why you'd think they do. Maybe you think it is so from consuming works of fiction? Fewer than 40% leave notes, with some counties being in the 15% range.
"So long and thanks for all the fish."
Counties... Not counties.
"So long and thanks for all the fish."
Holy shit a damn... Countries.
Ah, autocorrect favors counties. D'oh!
"So long and thanks for all the fish."
So, I just did some research, and even a trans advocacy sites indicate the rates don't drop significantly after gender reassignment surgery. They cite a study in Sweden. While it does help with the dysphoria, it doesn't do much to help with other issues. They still kill themselves at alarming rates.
And no, I don't have any prejudice, that I'm aware of, with trans people. I've spent much of my life in 'alternative lifestyle' groups. I am friends with multiple people who have gone so far as to transition.
"So long and thanks for all the fish."
A 2014 UCLA study, the Williams Institute therein, puts suicides at 42% and 41%, for males and females, respectively.
"So long and thanks for all the fish."
THIS!
Trans people can definitely do work in the tech sector. I might be interested in what "Tech Leaders" have to say about trans people in that setting. I don't care about what they have to say about this.
LK
"Hi. This is my friend, Jack Shit, and you don't know him." - Lord Kano
Why should tech CEO's or celebrities be a better source of general political ideas than Joe Sixpack?
What are you, a communist? The answer is unambiguous: because they have more money. We had a much-publicized supreme court decision on this very issue - having lots of money entitles your opinions to maximum visibility. This may seem unreasonable or unfair to a legal layperson, but lessor people are still allowed to speak in their tiny little voices, or to plug their ears if they don't like what they're hearing, so clearly we all still all have free speech and blah blah blah.
The point is: if you want a say in politics, you can have it. It's available to everyone, including Joe Sixpack, because this is a free country full of free people. Like everyone else, Joe just needs to spend a few tens of millions of dollars on lobbying and political campaigning.
>The military already evaluates every recruit Depending on their quota, recruiters are evaluating whether or not you have a pulse and can sign the dotted line. Lets be serious for a moment. The military's job is to kill people and fuck shit up, not be your social justice experiment test bed. Trans people are not "just like blacks and Mexicans", they are suffering form body dysmorphia - it's a form of mental illness. If you have a penis and think you are a woman inside, you are no more sane than someone who thinks they are really a unicorn, deep down inside.
Taxes are taxes, neither you nor I get a lot of say in how that money is spent.
>Is there data to back this up or could it be just the bigoted opinion of a few jerks? The same things were said about blacks, gays, and women. One of the things the military beats out of you is special snowflake syndrome. Transexuals are pretty much the spitting image of a special snowflake in denial of reality of basic biology. Just because they've managed to bring along a big part of the left into their collective delusions doesn't make it sound military policy to coddle them in the military ranks.
Statistically, trans people are the ones with "actual problems". And I would be happy to keep this to myself except that doesn't seem to free me from people trying to pass laws against my existence. If you retards didn't get so riled up by "perverts" then it wouldn't be a political issue at all. Trans people are nearly universally poor (and go ahead and tell me what you think about giving one a job), disorganized, and typically having some sort of ongoing health issue. The few transgender activists I know are struggling to get any attention from anyone, and I've never heard word one about legislation. Generally the struggle is to get people to acknowledge there's any sort of problem in the first place. Case in point: your post.
The difference between you and trans people is that no one cares about trans people. No matter what problems you might have, people will act like you deserve them. Medical issues? Meh. Shoulda thought of that before you were queer. Legal issues? Well, that's just what happens to "those people". Get raped or assaulted? You probably provoked it. And statistically all of those things happen at a rate far exceeding the normal population. I live in one of the safest corners of the queerest city in the US, and my friends are surprised that I don't carry mace.
We don't want anything from you. We're too busy "dealing with it". No one's asking people to stop abusing trans people, just maybe stop treating our lives like a political toy as well. I don't necessarily mind having to constantly worry about becoming a hate crime statistic, but enshrining prejudice in law is another level of violation.
Those who advocate genocide deserve every protection afforded by law, and none afforded by common human decency.
The only T guy I knew (we didn't know, then - that was his affair, not ours) made a great M career, and then transitioned gracefully to F - changed his (her) job to manage something more socially-sensitive, and is probably in line for a national award for community service just now. Nobody would know, unless the scarf slipped to reveal the 'adam's apple', and surely no one need care. I can't see that progress happenning well in any military environment, in any country at all.
Seen any statistics on what happens to trans people in every corner of this country? I'm sorry if you think that "Trump supporter" should be a protected class of idiot.
You're virtue signalling by posting that you don't like people virtue signalling about things you don't like (transgender people, it seems).
I don't know anybody who is trans. You keep saying that BS that hoping the majority of people like me will feel like the oddball. Just aint true though.
Everybody in SF, Manhattan, and Miami Beach probably know someone. Those are not military recruiting hotbed though, so my guess is most soldiers are more like me.
Just because you think you don't know anyone doesn't necessarily make it true. Also, you missed the part where you might not know someone, but you know someone who knows someone.
There's a huge incentive in the military to NOT reveal what's going on with your gender identity if it doesn't match your physical sex, so there are plenty who have not even tried to transition yet, same as everywhere else in real life.
"Transparent" is a shit show that trades on every stereotype going. A man in drag is NOT a transsexual.
Your post getting voted down to minus figures is not "censorship", it's just an indication that the majority of people voting on your comment think you're talking shit and rate your comment accordingly.
Also keep in mind forums are privately owned, and much like people have the right to kick you out of a restaurant if you start saying abusive things, they also don't have to tolerate you saying abusive things on the forum they have allowed you to register on. You're essentially a guest, given the privilege of participating in a community, and that privilege can be revoked for whatever reason its owners like.
Free speech means you can express your opinions in a public place without getting thrown in jail for dissent against the government.
You don't see silencing from right wingers? Rule VI on the Trump-Supporters-Only Safe Space wants a word: https://www.reddit.com/r/The_D...
If we take your figure of 0,1%, then there's damn good statistical odds that you either know someone or know someone who knows someone. You just don't know it. Why you seem to think that it has anything to do with working at a university is beyond me - it has nothing to do with it.
If you have known 100 people in your life (and that's low) then there's a 1 in 10 chance that at least one of them is trans. If none of them are, and we apply the same conditions (each knows 100 people), then the odds rise to 90% that one of those people knows someone who is trans.
Not my fault you failed math.
"Transparent" is a shit show that trades on every stereotype going. A man in drag is NOT a transsexual.
Trump: "We will recall congress on the first day and repeal Obamacare." Wasn't that why you elected him?
Didn't happen the first day, nor the first week, nor the first month, nor the first season ... still isn't happening 6 months later. And now that the vote to repeal failed, they're looking at either a watered-down version or a bipartisan bill. So much for getting rid of Obamacare.
"Transparent" is a shit show that trades on every stereotype going. A man in drag is NOT a transsexual.
I won't deny that I've had personal motives to study it for decades, even before it hit public awareness. And my name has never been Bob (or any variant).
I don't hide the fact that I'm a male-to-female transsexual, because there's nothing to be ashamed of. And here, there's not really any stigma any more. Even if my birth certificate didn't now say I was born female, it doesn't mean that I would run into much in the way of problems.
I've never encountered problems using the women's bathroom, and ironically, even the latest Texas bathroom bill would require me to use the women's bathroom. That's what happens when you make it dependent on the birth certificate - you pass a stupid law, you just look stupid to the rest of the world. Again.
Even Estonia and Bolivia allow transgender individuals to serve in the military. Canada's military just tweeted that they are promoting the recruiting of transgender individuals. in direct response to Trump's proposed ban.
Why is it that the US military is, according to Trump, composed of people who can't adapt to change, either on their own or with training? 18 other countries have done so, with no problems. Additionally, there are 2500 transgenders currently serving in the US military, and plenty more who have served, including former Navy SEALS. Where were the problems all these years?
Trump is just throwing shit at the wall in an effort to distract from his screw-ups with Russia, Jeff Sessions, the failed vote to repeal Obamacare, etc.
"Transparent" is a shit show that trades on every stereotype going. A man in drag is NOT a transsexual.
Right now, answer: are you, or someone in your immediate family, or your church, RIGHT NOW volunteering to join the military to replace trans folk who will be forced to leave?
And if you have no one, then STFU.
Wrong. The military already issued an internal memo saying that it will be business as usual wrt transsexuals serving in the military. So suck it up.
"Transparent" is a shit show that trades on every stereotype going. A man in drag is NOT a transsexual.
Your panties are in an awful knot over the non-successes of this failed lame duck's non-actions.
Face it: You lost. You're lashing out trying to downplay the massive success of Trump in obliterating the liberal social engineering agenda. The Supreme Court appointment alone ruins your narrative. We win for the next 30 years.
You must be joking. I wanted Trump to win. For one thing, Clinton would have just continued the duplicity of the democrats, and she already has several wars to her credit. For another, it was obvious that Trump would destroy the republican party from within, especially the tea party faction.
Thirdly, I'm not an American, so I can give a less biased opinion. Your president is the idiot-in-chief whom nobody else respects (then again, a lot of people on his staff don't respect him either, so BFD).
"Transparent" is a shit show that trades on every stereotype going. A man in drag is NOT a transsexual.
Guess you didn't read the news. Trump lied again (no surprise there). The chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff denied any consultations between the military and Trump, and no other member of the joint chiefs has come forward to say they were consulted. Also, defense secretary Mattis wasn't consulted, even though he is the one who ordered a review of policy wrt transgenders last month, and that review is not yet complete.
Trump again lies to distract. Also, the generals who implemented the current policy are all still in their jobs: The military leadership who were consulted about the Obama transgender policy that was subsequently put in place, and is still in force as of today, haven't changed. The chiefs of staff of the Army and Air Force, the Chief Naval Officer, the Marine Corps Commandant and the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff are all the same as they were under the Obama administration.
None of them had a problem with the policy, so who did Trump consult? Maybe Russian general Valery Gerasimov? Or Russian commander-in-chief Comrade Putin?
Your claims of complaints being passed up the chain of command is denied by the military, so stop making up shit, loser. You wanted Trump, you got him, now be ready to be the laughing stock of the world and Putin's cockholster.
"Transparent" is a shit show that trades on every stereotype going. A man in drag is NOT a transsexual.
The experts disagree with you. So does most of the western world. But you're free to put it to the test - chop off your balls and then tell us that you are not in some way changed physically and mentally (in other words, not wholly the same person).
Also, I have never claimed either that it changes DNA or basic personality. If basic personality were amenable to change, there would be no need for transition, we would just change the person's personality. However, the many failed attempts, with tragic consequences, show that changing a person's gender identity is impossible, so we change the body to fit for the specific purpose of reducing conflict between the person's identity and body. Same as we would get glasses to fix near or far-sightedness, or various other medical treatments for other medical conditions - to help the individual function better in their environment.
You can't cure a mental disorder that doesn't exist - and transsexualism isn't a mental disorder. Then again, being in denial of that is a sign that you may be delusional.
"Transparent" is a shit show that trades on every stereotype going. A man in drag is NOT a transsexual.
Honest questions, not trying to judge the path you've chosen to take, and certainly not trying to upset you:
1) do you believe that the surgery and treatment you've gotten has made you a woman?
2) do you believe you would have committed suicide if you had not gotten the surgery and treatment?
3) if people don't accept you as a "real" woman (if you don't "pass"), do you feel mental distress?
My guess is you can probably see how your answers to those questions would guide my argument against transgender in the military - if it really is something that has been a source of serious mental distress in your life, possibly up to and including suicidal ideations, then it would be a disqualifying factor for military service. And on the other hand, if it isn't that serious, and you could have just as easily skipped the surgery and treatment, and you aren't distressed by people who misgender you, then military service, as your natural born sex, should be perfectly reasonable without any special accommodations for your own personal beliefs about what sex you are post-op.
Anyway, again, your path is your path, and I hope nothing but the best for you, but if you could honestly answer those questions, I'd appreciate it.
Just got an e-mail, was modded "Troll". At least some parts of Slashdot never change.
Let's not stir that bag of worms...
Let's go to the authority on transgenders in the military, since anything I say is nowhere near as relevant to what the Joint Chiefs of Staff have ruled. They decided to open up the military to transgenders after studying the issue. They are still the same Joint Chiefs serving as when the decision was made. Trump lied (so what else is new) when he implied that the current military was consulted. The head of the Joint Chiefs said he was only informed after the tweet. He also said that policy remains the same. and will continue to be the same until the Secretary of Defense both orders a change and provides implementation details.
And as we all know, the devil is in the details. Any attempt to dismiss the thousands of transgenders currently serving in the military is going to end up before the courts. Also, you might want to check out everyone in the military who says that as long as they can be depended upon like any other soldier, they really don't give a flying fuck.
As to your questions:
1. Surgery doesn't change the genetic makeup. However, genes are only a small portion of who you are. The most important part is between the ears, and in transsexuals there is sufficient evidence of physical differences that cross over to the opposite sex. Those differences can't be undone, and they affect your perception of who you are. So your brain is hard-wired to say "I am a woman." Fighting it is impossible. Changing it is impossible. The ill-advised attempts (and false success stories) have proven it. What we can change is the body - so why not? It's my body, my decision, same as abortion.
2. Suicide is an option for every single human being on this planet. I've made my decision that when life gets unbearable I will overdose on insulin - a quick, painless death - hopefully somewhere on the other side of 100. In the meantime, I have advanced medical orders that result in the withdrawal of all medical care except pain killers in the event that I am too far gone to take action myself - the form is supplied by the government and registered with the government. Same as we allow euthanasia. Death is a fact of life - but we hopefully have a choice in seeing that it's a "good death", not some long-drawn-out suffering. However, I also support the right of anyone to decide at any time that their life isn't worth living, and hopefully euthanasia on demand will be available to all who desire it.
I have had ptsd most of my life, with the accompanying recurring bouts of major depression, so suicide has sometimes looked damn tempting. It's something I have to be on the lookout for, especially since every episode makes the brain more likely to experience another episode. The only drug that seems to work is a higher dose of estrogen (estrogen is a powerful antidepressant in its own right, same as it also increases muscle mass, protects the heart and cardiovascular system, reduces the risk of stroke, makes blood vessels more flexible, and - from personal experience - makes you feel half your age. The best part is the purported risks have been debunked by better research).
3. I'm so open about what I am nowadays in part because of the wide acceptance I've received, just by being myself. Basically, I let everyone know that I don't mind if they tell others. Why should I? It's not like I should be ashamed of who or what I am. On the contrary, it's a tough row to hoe, and I'm proud of what I've accomplished in that respect. And there's the added bonus of other women thinking I'm a decade younger than I am because I don't look it. Hormones == good :-)
Those who don't accept it and make an issue of it in public, I take before the human rights commission. They very quickly see the error of their ways. Some argue that this is going overboard - I believe that ONLY legal action will result in permanent change - it tends to focus the mind and force people to justify their actions, or if unable, to at the very least keep their transmisogynist opinions to themselves. Holding people accoun
"Transparent" is a shit show that trades on every stereotype going. A man in drag is NOT a transsexual.
That's a comforting thought, isn't it?
-- Cheers!
Thank you for your detailed reply. My greatest sympathies for your distress pre-op, and any distress you have post-op when people still consider you a man. I can totally understand why people might still consider you a man, despite your surgery, but their minds, their choice - we can't force people to believe what you believe. Rather than label that "transmisogynist", I'd call that a difference in beliefs, with no malintent.
I think you make a good case for keeping transgender out of the military - the transgender journey is a serious and significant one, and cannot be minimized.
Good luck on the rest of your journey, may it be safe.
The big source of stress was ptsd, not being trans. ptsd, plus the events that lead up to it, and the accompanying anxiety and depressive disorders, are things that never fully leave you. Their effects have rippled through the decades until it finally got to the point where I had to seek professional help. Scary stuff, but fortunately a good therapist and a lot of hard work have had amazing results. Unfortunately, other problems continue to dodge me, in particular my crappy retinas.
But that's okay. And as for the people who don't accept me as a woman, that doesn't cause me any distress. I cause them distress by calling them out on it in from of everyone, and if an apology isn't forthcoming, going the legal route. Haven't had to do that since 2013, so I guess the message has been received.
I don't label people who honestly have a hard time accepting sex changes trans-misogynists - the term comes from two words - transsexual misogynist. Misogyny is the hatred of and contempt for women. Trans-misogyny is hate directed specifically at trans-women - and this site is full of examples. It reminds me that not everyone is so lucky as to have pretty much everyone accept them for who they are in real life. Then again, I am very open, so nobody needs to worry about walking on eggshells around me - just ask me questions and I give explanations, except for things that are none of anyone's business - in other words, things you'd never ask any woman in normal conversation.
"Transphobia" is a bullshit term. Trans-misogynists are not afraid of transsexual women, any more than homophobes who go around beating up gays and lesbians are afraid of gays and lesbians. It's hatred and contempt, not fear. And they revel in it. They embrace it. That's hardly a phobia.
Same as misogyny and misandry are not fear of women and men respectively, but a serious lack of respect and appreciation for the targets. It's self-destructive. For example, I'm fed up with all the people who keep posting memes targeting all members of the opposite sex long after they've gone their separate ways. Seriously, you split up a decade ago and you still do this shit? Your kids see it, your friends see it, your co-workers see it, employers and potential employers see it, potential partners see it ... kind of stupid unless you really, really intended to shoot yourself in the foot, in which case it's really stupid.
I'm fortunate in that I've seen it from both sides, so I get it. I just don't approve of it, from either sex.
Thanks.
"Transparent" is a shit show that trades on every stereotype going. A man in drag is NOT a transsexual.
Personally, I dealt with
The singular form of data is not anecdote.
As far as your studies go...oh boy. So the statistical error you're making is not considering or controlling for other confounding factors. Assault and various kinds of sexual and other abuse occur at a rate far higher than the general population
Aside from the fact that you were demanding citations earlier and then just feel you don't need to provide any yourself, if you actually read the second citation I gave, it specifically mentions that these conditions are found among those who haven't yet begun.
You might have noticed that the one was published in "Psychiatry Journal", the other in "Medical Journal of Islamic Republic of Iran", and both of them were done in Iran.
https://yourlogicalfallacyis.c...