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Trump Ups Ante on China, Threatens Duties on Nearly All its Imports (reuters.com)

U.S. President Donald Trump warned on Friday that he was ready to slap tariffs on virtually all Chinese imports into the United States, threatening duties on another $267 billion in Chinese goods on top of $200 billion in imports now primed for levies in coming days. Reuters: The moves would sharply escalate Trump's trade war with Beijing over his demands for major changes in economic, trade and technology policy. China has threatened retaliation, which could include action against U.S. companies operating there. Hours after a public comment period closed on his $200 billion China tariff list, Trump told reporters aboard Air Force One that he was "being strong on China because I have to be."

"The $200 billion we are talking about could take place very soon depending on what happens with them. To a certain extent its going to be up to China," Trump said. "And I hate to say this, but behind that is another $267 billion ready to go on short notice if I want. That totally changes the equation." [...] The $200 billion list, which includes some consumer products such as cameras and recording devices, luggage, handbags, tires and vacuum cleaners, would be subject to tariffs of 10 percent to 25 percent. Cell phones, the biggest U.S. import from China, have so far been spared, but would be engulfed if Trump activates the $267 billion tariff list.
Further reading: Apple says Trump's China tariffs are going to hurt the company.

326 comments

  1. Ah Trump, doing what only a Republican can by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Because if anybody else opposed free trade and globalism, the Party of Responsibility would have a fit.

    I'm sure we needed Herbert Hoover again.

    1. Re: Ah Trump, doing what only a Republican can by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I like how they calculate removing egregious incentives for shit products as a tariff

    2. Re: Ah Trump, doing what only a Republican can by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Sort of like how a reduction in corporate tax is called corporate welfare. They're not being given any money, they're just being allowed to pay less.

  2. Covfefe by nwaack · · Score: 4, Funny

    Trump then went on to mispronounce the word "anonymous" multiple times and walked off stage.

    1. Re:Covfefe by Tough+Love · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Looks a lot like aphasia. At least temporarily, Trump lost the mental capacity to pronounce that word. Not the ability to recognize the word, because he caught himself and tried to pronounce it again, making exactly the same mistake again. Clearly not his dentures or a dry mouth, two theories that were advanced after a previous similar episode. No, it is clear that some wires are crossed inside Trump's brain. Considering who it is, this should be a medical emergency.

      Watch his videos and you will notice a number of more subtle, but substantially similar events. And sometimes he completely loses track of the logic of a sentence he is trying to construct. These events seem to be increasing in frequency. That is my unscientific observation. This really needs to be assessed properly and scientifically by medical professionals, except not this guy.

      --
      When all you have is a hammer, every problem starts to look like a thumb.
    2. Re:Covfefe by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      There are other factors that may contribute to this single symptom. The evidence available does not come anywhere near the threshold for diagnosis.

      The guy clearly doesn't get enough sleep and you can see the severe consequences of that in his daily performance. At best he's operating at reduced efficiency. Some of the symptoms of sleep deprivation include:

      - confusion, memory lapses or loss
      - development of false memory
      - increased stress hormone levels
      - irritability
      - temper tantrums in children
      - violent behavior
      - mania
      - symptoms similar to: attention-deficit hyperactivity disorder, psychosis, depersonalization disorder

    3. Re:Covfefe by Tough+Love · · Score: 1

      None of those symptoms even remotely resemble Trump's failure to pronounce a simple English word after two attempts, failing in exactly the same way each time. It was not a memory lapse because he clearly realized that the pronunciation was wrong. I have seen him do similar things on multiple occasions, actually. How about "Russiar"? On the second attempt he got it right. That was then, this is now.

      I have been sleep deprived on occasion, and I have seen many other people sleep deprived. Odd behavior can result, but I have never seen anything as extreme as this.

      --
      When all you have is a hammer, every problem starts to look like a thumb.
    4. Re:Covfefe by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Let's all agree the orange fuckstain is retarded, mean-spirited and amazingly incompetent.

      numbnuts

    5. Re:Covfefe by Tough+Love · · Score: 1

      True, but on top of that, does he exhibit evidence of neurological pathology? And are these incidents becoming more frequent, and/or more severe?

      --
      When all you have is a hammer, every problem starts to look like a thumb.
    6. Re:Covfefe by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Hello Doctor. Please tell us what condition might plague Nancy Pelosi?

    7. Re: Covfefe by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Nice whatabout.

    8. Re:Covfefe by humptheElephant · · Score: 1

      And what does Nancy have to do with anything? She's not the president.

    9. Re: Covfefe by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yeah - she's not important at all. Good point.

    10. Re:Covfefe by quenda · · Score: 1

      If you look at an old interview of Trump, you see a man far more coherent:

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?...

    11. Re: Covfefe by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "mean-spirited"

      There's a sale on mirrors at Target...

    12. Re: Covfefe by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Soros-funded propaganda operatives can easily be detected by their use of certain inelegant neologisms - in this case "whatabout" as a noun.

    13. Re: Covfefe by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Nice that you don't care whatabout. As long as you only throw stones at those you disagree with, those you disagree with will only ignore you. Those that are neutral and independent are not blind.

    14. Re: Covfefe by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      No one who's not a libbie loonie who would never have voted for Trump anyway cares a f about what you say. Trump is doing the job 100 times better than the guy before and he will be easily reelected.

    15. Re: Covfefe by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You are a waste.

    16. Re:Covfefe by blind+biker · · Score: 1

      That wasn't slurring words. I have had a bad concussion years ago and slurred my words in the following weeks. I still slur my words sometimes - obviously, the concussion has caused permanent damage to my brain - so I have learned to recognize it in others. I especially recognize it with MMA fighters after some cases of KOs. Daniel Cormier, after being KOd by Jon Jones, was clearly slurring his words but the MMA community stayed silent on this, probably because they wanted to protect the sport.

      Anyhow, what i have seen in that clip about Trump at that press conference about the Middle East peace process, is not slurring but rather some weird issue with his teeth.

      But I would appreciate a link to Trump's aphasia in what the GP was referring to about Trump mispronouncing "anonymous".

      --
      "The agriculture ministry is not in charge of Gundam" - Japanese ministry official.
    17. Re:Covfefe by Plumpaquatsch · · Score: 1

      If you look at an old interview of Trump, you see a man far more coherent:

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?...

      "After we destroyed the statues, we had appraisals done, and they weren't worth very much" - Oh, Donny.

      --
      Of course news about a fake are Fake News.
    18. Re:Covfefe by Tough+Love · · Score: 1

      what i have seen in that clip about Trump at that press conference about the Middle East peace process, is not slurring but rather some weird issue with his teeth.

      It was clearly not an issue with his false teeth. He mispronounced the word twice in a row while pronouncing similar words immediately before and after correctly. It is clearly an issue with his brain. Whatever the issue is, it has a variety of effects, including slurring and including losing the ability to perform the sequence of actions necessary to pronounce just one certain word. Whatever you call that. It's like somebody scooped out a teaspoonful of the part of his brain that formulates speech. Personally, I think that his brain is partially necrotized, for whatever reason. Probably not a concussion. Maybe something growing in there.

      --
      When all you have is a hammer, every problem starts to look like a thumb.
    19. Re:Covfefe by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      No, it is clear that some wires are crossed inside Trump's brain. Considering who it is, this should be a medical emergency.

      Yeah. Where did the second wire come from?

    20. Re: Covfefe by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Pointing out that the orange shitstain is mean-spirited is just stating facts and not mean-spirited.

      You fucking pathetic Trumpanzees. At least you will be Putin's problem when you flee after our house is cleaned and you traitorous rats chased away.

      numbnuts

  3. Ok, this isn't funny anymore by rsilvergun · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I don't know about the rest of /. but my wages have not kept pace with inflation. Cheap foreign goods has been the only thing that's kept my head above water. Now, you can argue that my wages will start climbing as a result of this, but a) that's not going to happen right away and in the meantime it means big inflation I can ill afford and b) it's not likely to happen since even if the factories come back they're likely to be modern factories heavy on automation, meaning few jobs.

    Tariffs are good at protecting an existing business, but you have to have a business to protect for a tariff to work. The US has manufacturing and we were already doing a good job of protecting it. We've doubled out manufacturing output in the last 40 years (while cutting the workforce by 1/3 due to automation, I might add). Broad tariffs at this point are just closing the barn door after the cows got out.

    --
    Hi! I make Firefox Plug-ins. Check 'em out @ https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/youtube-mp3-podcaster/
    1. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      If, and I mean if this happens, its going to hurt and hurt bad. Sorry to say that but if this ever happens (which I don't think will), it will take 10 years or longer before things settle. The chicken will come to roost after decades of cheap prices for everything we use today. Basically China was our drug dealer; we are hooked and now it may be time to face rehab which isn't going to be fun and probably put more in the poor house before all said and done.

    2. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Did you ever stop to think that the reason your wages haven't kept pace with inflation is... wait for it... cheap foreign goods? Cheap foreign goods have decimated US manufacturing and annihilated millions of jobs. These people all compete for the remaining jobs. Companies have very little incentive to raise wages ... in fact, some people consider themselves lucky to have a job at all. But hey, at least when you need a new toaster it's pretty cheap.

    3. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Funny

      Yes, I believe he did think of that, because he said "Now, you can argue that my wages will start climbing as a result of this, but..."

    4. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by liquid_schwartz · · Score: 4, Interesting

      I don't know about the rest of /. but my wages have not kept pace with inflation.

      This trend is very true, well documented, and has been happening since the early 70s when wages became decoupled from productivity. This has happened regardless of which party is in power so it's not a D or R issue. It's a free trade / taxes / mass immigration issue. Trump is a symptom of rage at the establishment, as is Bernie. He's actually pretty benign compared to how it will go if things don't improve. Just as people now think of Bush II more fondly based on Trump, Trump himself is likely going to be thought of more fondly than what's down the road. I expect in my lifetime to see someone make a political career out of the rage from not one banker in jail. Until the guillotines come out don't expect it to get better. The 1% have it too good and the expense of too many.

    5. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Two possible results: China doesn't blink, or China blinks.

      In the former case prices go up in the US, business declines in the mid- to long-term, people get laid off and unemployment rises here. In China some of the sales are made up by selling to other parts of the world, but not enough, people lose their jobs and unrest increases, and China probably develops a more nationalistic and militaristic nature. Not good for anybody concerned.

      In the latter case, the question becomes how does China blink, and do the changes benefit anyone (given the current nature of our economy) other than giving Trump short-term bragging rights? What does Trump actually want China to do, anyway?

    6. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by jon3k · · Score: 2

      I don't know about the rest of /. but my wages have not kept pace with inflation.

      You should really consider changing jobs then, because my salary has continued to increase far, far faster than inflation. I'm assuming you work in tech, of course. We struggle to find decent candidates and have to pay absurd sums to get qualified people. I've given several pay increases and promotions to keep staff this year alone. They say wages are stagnant but I can tell you that's not the case in tech from everyone I'm talking to and my (anecdotal) experience. Unemployment right now is unbelievably low and people are desperate for talented employees. Start talking to recruiters and consider moving to an area where your skills may be more in demand or look for remote work.

    7. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by misexistentialist · · Score: 1

      Blame the central bank, which has been acting to increase the rate of inflation for many years now because it claims prices aren't going up fast enough; a fixed 10% isn't much while the Fed is hard at work making prices double, triple, quadruple, etc.

    8. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by gtall · · Score: 5, Informative

      Close to 8 years of easy Fed interest rates, deficit spending, and under Trump, even more deficit spending...now to the tune of $1 Trillion per year, and every year, now that he and the Republicans have paid off their cronies in industry with their tax cuts.

      Basic Keyesian economics, dump that much money into the economy and there would have been something seriously wrong if the economy hadn't boomed. So enjoy it while the bill hasn't yet come due, because when it does, every one of us will suffer.

    9. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      1) The tax breaks given to corporations allowed them to do stock buybacks that drove up the stock market price, artificially inflating the economy while making sure that the gains primarily went to the wealthy.

      2) They've rolled back most of what few reforms were put into place after the real estate crash, allowing more subprime bullshit to be packaged up and sold with ridiculously understated risks, helping push the stock market up even further.

      Bubbles always look like a booming economy right up to the point where they burst and the country goes into a recession.

    10. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0


        Now, you can argue that my wages will start climbing as a result of this,

      That's highly unlikely. At best this might bring a couple jobs back. It's also likely to kill more jobs. But I can't see anyone really having rising wages because of this. Why would a company suddenly start paying more to its workers just because of some positive trade policy they get?

    11. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by ShanghaiBill · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Now, you can argue that my wages will start climbing as a result of this

      No, you can't argue that. As Americans replace jobs designing smartphones with jobs sewing t-shirts, wages will go down, not up.

      High tariffs mean higher prices and lower wages.

      Every complex problem has a solution that is simple, obvious, and wrong. Protectionism is one of those solutions.

    12. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by MightyMartian · · Score: 1

      It's going to be Chinese robots versus US robots in a few decades, and it will literally be rage against the machine. Perhaps the time will come when Americans are ready to accept that automation is changing the world, not trade deficits. It is literally fighting a 20th century war with 19th century ideas while progress ignores the whole goddamned thing.

      --
      The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
    13. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by DigiShaman · · Score: 3, Informative

      You need not worry. If we put a 15% tariff on them, the Chinese government will simply devalue the Yuan (as they always do) so as to maintain steady employment within China. That's the biggest fear of the CCP, mass unemployment WITHIN China.

      So net change = we will be paying more in the single digit percentage points. Just remember, somebody has to buy their crap. It's just that China has more to lose by not exporting.

      --
      Life is not for the lazy.
    14. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by ShanghaiBill · · Score: 1

      It's a free trade / taxes / mass immigration issue.

      Actually, according to many economists, it is a technology issue.

    15. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Cheap foreign goods have decimated US manufacturing and annihilated millions of jobs.

      US manufacturing is doing just fine and is as big as always. I simply doesn't employ as many people as the comment you replied to pointed out. It is all fun and games to blame others for our problems, but if we honestly want to find a solution we have to be realistic and stick to the facts. Automation killed US jobs.

    16. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Plus, it further proves that Trump doesn't care about foreign workers.

    17. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by MachineShedFred · · Score: 2

      Third possible result: Congress tells him what he can go do with himself on the trade war and kills it.

      This, of course, won't happen because the halls of Congress are filled with feckless us-versus-them morons that are too busy with publicity stunts and blaming the other guys to actually do anything useful.

      --
      Slashdot still doesnâ(TM)t support Unicode after it was added to the HTML standard in 1997.
    18. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Your keyboard to $DEITY's ears... I have a day of interviews for a new position with a different company on Monday, and I could use the 15% raise and a nice signing bonus to offset the declining-value vesting stock instruments I'd be leaving behind...

    19. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Increased revenues from increased sales due to protectionist policy, causing more income to be distributed to employees to retain talent.

      No, I don't actually believe that horseshit either.

    20. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by Ol+Olsoc · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Now, you can argue that my wages will start climbing as a result of this

      No, you can't argue that. As Americans replace jobs designing smartphones with jobs sewing t-shirts, wages will go down, not up.

      High tariffs mean higher prices and lower wages.

      Every complex problem has a solution that is simple, obvious, and wrong. Protectionism is one of those solutions.

      As Trump has turned the Republican partyy into the party of tariffs and protectionism, next up is a Nixonian re-implementation of wage and price controls. The freeze on Federal employee wages at a time when unemployment is low is merely testing the waters for the next phase. As the Republican party shifts it position to whatever it is that Trump wishes, and obeys his every move, ordinary citizens do not understand that any money coming in from tariffs is not for them.

      Am I wrong? Perhaps. But we shall see shortly. Trump is reinventing the Republican party as we speak, and they lack the intestinal fortitude to oppose him. I would not be terribly surprised if we nationalize industry soon, and Mitch McConnell and Paul Ryan will smile as they sign the law.

      --
      The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
    21. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by Howitzer86 · · Score: 1

      No one is really concerned about the debt until Republicans make a fuss. I'll give them credit here. But if they don't care anymore, should we?

      The US Dollar is the world reserve currency, so that affords us some margin of safety right? What's the worst that could happen?

    22. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by fluffernutter · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I, for one, am tired of the "wait for your wages to go up because of this" game. We have been doing this dance since the Regan years.

      --
      Laws are rules for the court, but merely a bottom bar to hit for life. Think beyond laws in your actions always.
    23. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Bullshit. Data or GTFO.

    24. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by fahrbot-bot · · Score: 2

      It's going to be Chinese robots versus US robots in a few decades, ...

      And to keep costs down, the US robots will be made in China.

      --
      It must have been something you assimilated. . . .
    25. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by fahrbot-bot · · Score: 1

      This, of course, won't happen because the halls of Congress are filled with feckless us-versus-them morons that are too busy with publicity stunts and blaming the other guys to actually do anything useful.

      The White House is full of people like that too ...

      --
      It must have been something you assimilated. . . .
    26. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by fluffernutter · · Score: 1

      Yeah, I was really surprised Trump froze government wages. Not the way to convince people that the economy is red-hot.

      --
      Laws are rules for the court, but merely a bottom bar to hit for life. Think beyond laws in your actions always.
    27. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by MightyMartian · · Score: 1

      In a way, it won't matter any more. When even the robots are built by robots, it's going to come down to transportation costs. It's going to be a lot cheaper to have a robot manufacturing facility in Michigan building robots for the mid-west, to be shipped via driverless trucks or whatever other automated transportation system, than to put them on a slow boat from China. It's not going to make American manufacturing jobs come back, but it will mean at the very least the manufacturing is more localized to take advantage of supply chains. And of course, you'll have millions of Chinese factory workers raging against the machine just like folks in Western rust belts are these days. It's already happening as some manufacturing in China migrates to India, where they work even cheaper than the Chinese. But once you all but cut out the worker on the factory floor, it simply becomes a problem of "what's the cheapest way to get my widget to market".

      --
      The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
    28. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by alvinrod · · Score: 2

      Deficit spending has been occurring under every president for years now. It doesn't matter which of the major parties you elect, because they're going to spend like crazy and the electorate really doesn't seem to care as long as the spending gets put towards whatever programs or sectors they like.

      The only real way out of it is to massively grow the economy so that overall tax revenue increases without additional increases in spending. The first half is possible, but have you ever known a government that doesn't grow like a cancer? You'd realistically need a constitutional amendment to disallow deficit spending outside of lawfully declared war (which we really don't do anymore so most of our military adventurism wouldn't cut it) if you wanted any chance of that happening.

    29. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      nah shortly all their citizens will be better educated than yours and expect to be middle class, they don't value 'feedumb!;' as much as your average maga knuvkle dragger though.

    30. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by ShanghaiBill · · Score: 1

      As a free trade supporting fiscal conservative, I would love to see a realignment in American politics. I have recently heard some of my liberal friends saying tariffs and subsidies are bad, just because Trump supports them, and they ignore the fact that Bernie advocated the same dumb policies.

      If the Democrats can combine social tolerance with sensible economic policies, and the Republicans can concentrate all the stupidity into one party, that would be wonderful.

    31. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by tlhIngan · · Score: 1

      Tariffs are good at protecting an existing business, but you have to have a business to protect for a tariff to work.

      No, tariffs are lousy at protecting existing business, unless the competition is unfairly cheating. If you use a tariff to protect business, all you're doing is giving CEOs another yacht because why compete? If they can now raise prices because of the tariffs, they will.

      It's why tariff relief is generally only given to countries found to be dumping.

      Ask any homebuyer how the 20% tariffs on Canadian wood is helping them. All it's done is resulted in US wood producers raising their prices to make extra profit, at the expense of homebuilders and other businesses who use that wood.

      It even lead to one of the strangest rants by Trump when he complained about high wood prices - as it was Trump who imposed the tariffs and forced wood to be more expensive. The other option is stall out the economy - if wood gets too expensive, then people don't make houses and the economy slows down.

      Tariffs are only good when a competitor is dumping trying to bankrupt your local industry. Like Saudi Arabia tried to do by dumping tons of oil on the market causing oil prices to plummet so they could buy up oil wells and refineries. In that case a tariff would've helped protect those industries from being bought out.

    32. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by Dare+nMc · · Score: 1

      I think Alibaba just helps you find a friend in China now. IE find a $25 bluetooth headset and basically add it to your wishlist. Then you send a $25 "Cash Gift" to your new friend through Ali, now if your new friend likes your Gift, and low and behold he has a brand new bluetooth headset he has never used, and sends it to you as a gift. Well it was a gift, so no tariff.

      Never new I had so many Friends...

    33. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      In regards to your suggested solutions:
      For points 1 and 2, Republicans recently made huge increase to the already ridiculously large military and added a freaking Space Force.
      For point #3, Republicans cut taxes for the corporations, making the deficit worse.
      For #4, they are so brazenly corrupt they don't even bother to hide it like Democrats. e.g., Scott Pruitt.
      Now Democrats have contributed to these problems but I don't understand how you can claim Republicans are better? They're literally taking the existing problems and making it worse.
      I've always wondered why people keep saying less government is better, as if WHERE the parts are shrunken don't matter. I'd rather people talk about making it more efficient rather than smaller.

    34. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by Darinbob · · Score: 1

      It won't recover really. While tarriffs are active, China will look for other trading partners, new supply chains, and so forth. When tarriffs are lifted, China is not going to suddenly abandon this and go back to how things were.

    35. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by Dare+nMc · · Score: 4, Informative

      My understanding is, while every president increased the debt, deficit spending was decreased during the administrations of: "Bill Clinton (reduced from 280Billion to 18 Billion)"; and "Barack Obama (reduced from 1.6T to 700 Billion; Stimulus act passed and enacted by Bush.) Let see the deficit went way up most significantly under the administrations of "Ronald Regain from 144 billion to 255 billion", "Donald Trump (700 Billion to 1.2 Trillion) Bush 43 (400 Billion to 1.6T) Bush 41 (255Billion to 347 Billion)
      Carter did increase from 78 Billion to 90 Billion, pretty insignificant comparatively to the other increases.
      Granted, The Democrats mostly had Republicans in charge of the house when they brought down the deficit. Reagan had democrats in the house; But the biggest increases were when we had Republican in control of both houses and the presidency.

      Of course economy is a big contributor to some of those changes also.

    36. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by Darinbob · · Score: 1

      Both parties have seemed concerned over the debt at various times, and both parties have completely ignored the debt at other times.

      Right now Republicans don't seem concerned about the debt and are putting their fiscal conservative sides in the freezer for now so that their social conservatives sides can run rampant. This is why you need more than 2 parties (ideally should have 4 or more). When one's view about abortion is a key indicator about how one feels about economic policy, then it's clear the system is screwed up.

    37. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If I owe you a thousand bucks and I can't pay, it's my problem.

      If I owe you a trillion bucks and I can't pay, it's YOUR problem motherfucker.

      Let's be clear who's wearing the pants, and it's not the Chinamen.

    38. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by Ol+Olsoc · · Score: 1

      Yeah, I was really surprised Trump froze government wages. Not the way to convince people that the economy is red-hot.

      There are others who need that money more. And we all know who they are.

      --
      The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
    39. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by Ol+Olsoc · · Score: 1

      As a free trade supporting fiscal conservative, I would love to see a realignment in American politics. I have recently heard some of my liberal friends saying tariffs and subsidies are bad, just because Trump supports them, and they ignore the fact that Bernie advocated the same dumb policies.

      If the Democrats can combine social tolerance with sensible economic policies, and the Republicans can concentrate all the stupidity into one party, that would be wonderful.

      True, Republicans are pretty tolerant......

      --
      The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
    40. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by Joce640k · · Score: 3, Informative

      I assume you're referring to the $1 trillion per year that Trump is borrowing from the US citizens to 'boost' the economy.

      https://eu.usatoday.com/story/...

      (or did you think it's his genius policies that's doing that?)

      --
      No sig today...
    41. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by ClickOnThis · · Score: 2

      You need not worry. If we put a 15% tariff on them, the Chinese government will simply devalue the Yuan (as they always do) so as to maintain steady employment within China. That's the biggest fear of the CCP, mass unemployment WITHIN China.

      Interesting strategy. Not only would that keep their exports attractively cheap, but it would also increase the cost of imports, thereby acting as a de facto tariff.

      Of course, currency manipulation has not helped China make friends, in the current US administration or previous ones.

      --
      If it weren't for deadlines, nothing would be late.
    42. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by liquid_schwartz · · Score: 1

      It's a free trade / taxes / mass immigration issue.

      Actually, according to many economists, it is a technology issue.

      These would be the same economists that push free trade, so they are as objective as CNN or Fox News. These would be the same economists that banished *generations* of middle class and said opps (citation below). The same economists who watched world economies crash then bailed out banks and nobody else? Oh yeah, forgive me for not considering them much. 2 points I'd make, one common sense and the other more math based. The common sense approach is that you can't have billions of dollars flow to China and have tens of thousands of factories in the US close and say that the US wasn't impacted. For free trade all benefits flow to those importing (hint Wall Street not Main Street). The math aspect is that when you look at papers that study both technology and trade impact both are factors *but* technology tends to be more piecemeal add ons while free trade is whole factories closing.

      Citation:

      https://www.bloomberg.com/view...

    43. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Don't worry my friend. By that time Democrats will be in power and take the blame for the failing economy. When they fix things we can then come back to the GOP and let the good times roll again.

    44. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by RhettLivingston · · Score: 4, Interesting

      It is funny that wage growth is suddenly considered a problem in the last decade. We are rich.

      Between 1979 and 2007, the bottom 90% of the US only saw a total of 16.7% wage growth. From 2007 to 2016, the bottom 90% grew another 4%.

      If you look at the 90th to 99th percentile, you see wage growth of 56.9% over the 1979 to 2007 time frame, and another 7.9% since.

      It is only when you look at the top 1% that you see wage growth of 156.2% from 1979 to 2007 and -2.9% since.

      So, 90% of us can legitimately complain about wage growth sucking since 1979. It has been much less than 1% per year. But this is only a problem now that the top 1% have fallen from their routine 4% per year wage growth that we have a problem?

      Whatever. Cry me a river. Why does it seem that the media only represents the elite?

      Recent wage growth trends look more like a slight downpayment on an income distribution correction to me. 90% of us would be vastly happier if we simply returned to a 1970's income distribution without any change in the overall total income. Over 40 years, that bulk of our nation has only recently crossed a total of 20% gain. The rest of you, especially the top 1% who have grown by 311% over those same 40 years, are welcome to at least show enough shame to shut up if not to lobby for change.

      data

    45. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by RhettLivingston · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Exactly. For 90% of us, wage growth has been anemic, less than 1% per year on average, for 40 years, and cheap foreign goods have been a saving grace only in the last 15-20.

      Instead of blaming wage issues on cheap foreign goods, they should be blaming the necessity to shift to cheap foreign goods on the wage issues. After 20 years of increasing income inequality, the 90% of us getting nowhere could no longer afford American quality and had to just buy what we could afford. That resulted in the last 20 years of increasing imports of cheap foreign goods.

      Now, instead of fixing the inequality problem so that we can afford to buy American, they want to just force us back? It won't work because we simply don't have the money. I have some choice feelings about that kind of strategy.

    46. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If inflation can stay at 0% wage growth would be unnecessary.

      It is this insane desire to grow the economy infinitely that is fucking us over.

      numbnuts

    47. Re: Ok, this isn't funny anymore by Type44Q · · Score: 1

      We have been doing this dance since the Regan years.

      We sure have; we've been exporting our industries overseas in a 'race to the bottom' since the 70's and while this trade war is better late than never, the mouthbreathers who're pointing out that "they're not seeing the benefits yet" might want to look up the term "delayed effect."

    48. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by ShanghaiBill · · Score: 1

      Your citation is paywalled.

    49. Re: Ok, this isn't funny anymore by reboot246 · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Not only have we been exporting jobs, we've also been importing cheap labor. Don't believe the figures on the number of undocumented workers. There are millions more than that - just wait until the next census to see for yourself.

      I've personally seen jobs that used to be good-paying jobs go away because illegals undercut the wages - electrician, plumber, carpenter, mason, etc.. Yeah, those are considered blue collar jobs, but they used to be pretty good career choices with a good income.

    50. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I assume you're referring to the $1 trillion per year that Trump is borrowing from the US citizens to 'boost' the economy.

      https://eu.usatoday.com/story/...

      (or did you think it's his genius policies that's doing that?)

      I just looked at the debt graph. Obama inherited a recession, and spent to try to get out of it, but the deficit was falling towards the end of his presidency. He also inherited some unpaid for tax cuts from Bush that he kept most of.

      Trump inherited a great economy, and he cut taxes as you mentioned, mostly on the rich and corporations. It is as you mentioned, acting as stimulus, though the targeting is suspect IMO.

      If you cut taxes to stimulate the economy when your doing well, well, when do you pay your bills?

      The thing that worries me, is what if we hit another recession and have exhausted all our credit. The trade mess just adds to the problem, since if you have annoyed all your creditors, who is going to lend you money?

    51. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by RhettLivingston · · Score: 1

      Note that the wage growth numbers in my above post are "real" wage growth which does, in fact, mean that the 90% has seen 20% wage growth beyond inflation over the last 40 years (assuming inflation numbers reflect reality in respect to the cost of living of people at the lower end of the scale which is certainly debatable).

      So, we have actually succeeded in beating inflation across the board and are still making gains against inflation in all but the top 1% despite buying cheap goods from others.

    52. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Until the guillotines come out don't expect it to get better. The 1% have it too good and the expense of too many.

      We have seen how propaganda and lies, while not 100% effective, do a fair job at manipulating people into making choices not in their best interest, which causes negative outcomes, which leads to unrest and anger, which causes people to be easier to manipulate with propaganda and lies.

      Still chaos is not the solution. Vote. Maybe send some credible candidate a little money. Try to correct people when they spout lies with facts. Do what you can. Buy a credible newspaper subscription. Also remember local races. They are also important.

      I don't think there is any magic bullet to fix this mess. It is going to be a lot of hard work.

    53. Re: Ok, this isn't funny anymore by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Iâ(TM)ll just say this, Iâ(TM)m about as LEFT(the average Democrat looks like a far right Republican to me) as you can get, but Iâ(TM)m strongly in support of these tariffs.

      The Republicans and Democrats can take globalization and shove it up their ass. They GUTTED the blue collar middle class with cheap goods from China for over 25 years. Sure, inflation adjusted cost of living on average didnâ(TM)t go up, but if you look at the cities, where anyone who wants a reasonable career MUST live in the global economy, cost of living has gone up in multiples.

      Letâ(TM)s develop a reasonable, self sustaining domestic economy(we have all the resources we need), then look at efficiency while protecting actual people.

    54. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I don't know about the rest of /. but my wages have not kept pace with inflation. Cheap foreign goods has been the only thing that's kept my head above water.

      Being on /. I assume you work in tech or some similar fairly-well paying job.

      If cheap foreign goods are the only thing that keeps your head above water, I suggest you take a hard look at your finances, likely with the assistance of a professional.

    55. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If you are having such a hard time hiring people, your work conditions suck and/or the pay isnâ(TM)t that great anyway.

      At minimum, the current staff is covering for multiple vacancies.

    56. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The US manufacturers more products now than ever before, it just takes significantly fewer people to do so.

    57. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by acrimonious+howard · · Score: 1

      This. For 20 years, Republicans have been using the good times to pay off the rich with tax cuts. That's when you're supposed to be saving up to have a rainy day fund for the bad times. Clinton actually balanced the budget, and Obama got a giant recession we were trying to get out of. Flame all you want, but Democrats are now the party of fiscal responsibility.

    58. Re: Ok, this isn't funny anymore by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You donâ(TM)t understand. This move makes every other country competing against China 25% more competitive. The next factory goes from China to Vietnam. China has the factories because companies profited from China slave labor, and shipped that back to the USA. While this may also temporarily weaken the US, the problem was that China is has built a massive submarine feel, Intercontinental ballistic misiles, advanced laser weapondry, etc. But when a foreign company wants to sell in China, instantly, the Chinese forget free trade and will imitate you if not outright prohibit you from entering you, or sign into horrible tech transfer where you basically forego you company IP for a temporary relief. No more!

    59. Re: Ok, this isn't funny anymore by adrn01 · · Score: 1

      Do note that one of the first bills Nancy Pelosi pushed through the House was a repeal of the tax break US companies get for moving manufacturing out of the US and adding a tax break for returning a factory to the US -- and the Republicans in the Senate filibustered it.

    60. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by Archfeld · · Score: 1

      I can't argue with you on that fact, but I'd point out that the average US consumer happily buys a toaster that is $.10 cheaper because it is made in/assembled in China, or Malaysia or where ever the cheapest labor is from. Buy American made, do without the cheap imported crap.

      --
      errr....umm...*whooosh* *whoosh* Is this thing on ?
    61. Re: Ok, this isn't funny anymore by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Iâ(TM)d say that person tries to buy cheap not because asian manufacturing is fancy (it is not), but to make ends meet. As simple as that. Now, you can be a proud american poor worker.... or you can manage to get by...

    62. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by AmiMoJo · · Score: 1

      Do you think Trump understands that Americans pay the tariffs? I honestly think that he thinks China pays.

      Margins are already razor thin in China, so they aren't going to lower their prices.

      --
      const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
      SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
    63. Re: Ok, this isn't funny anymore by golodh · · Score: 1
      Hmm.

      You realise that "importing cheap labour" would not be profitable if employers paid decent minimum wages and "illegals" would never get work unless employers are happy to employ someone who can't show an ID?

      And that the plain fact is that it's a lot easier to squeeze a superior work/wage ratio from people who are illegal (and thus truly desperate for their job) than from an average US-born Joe? And that illegals usually are the hardiest and most motivated segment of the population? What's not to like for an employer?

      Razzing on "illegals" and "foreigners" is popular, but probably not the root cause of US wage problems.

      In addition, just compare the number of jobs replaced by automation (30% of the workforce) with the number of "illegals" and "imported cheap labour" (get your estimates from reputable republican wall builders). You'll realise that imported labour can account for no more than about 5% of jobs.

    64. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Productivity, in real terms, has increased much more than 20% in the last 40 years. If people are more productive, then it takes fewer people to produce value, so there can be downward pressure on wages, but this can then lead to downward pressure on aggregate demand at those prices. If a greater proportion of the productivity gains had been realised as wages then buying domestically-produced products would be easier for people. Given that has not been the case, then cheap imports have been required, and have also flattered inflation statistics. But from a rational perspective, if a CEO can fill his factories, restaurants or offices for $X/hr, then paying $kX/hr where k > 1 is unlikely to happen, not least because a company still paying $X would become more competitive. It's hard to see a solution here.

    65. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by bmimatt · · Score: 1

      Why is this ^^ not modded at least 'informative'? WTF?

    66. Re: Ok, this isn't funny anymore by AmiMoJo · · Score: 0

      If people could afford a fully documented, accredited electrician I'm sure they would prefer that over one whose work might cause them all sorts of legal/code troubles.

      Like American made goods people will pay more for quality, but only if they can afford it. Low wage growth is the problem, not immigration.

      --
      const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
      SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
    67. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by AmiMoJo · · Score: 1

      Most people don't care about wage disparity very much. They care that they can't afford to raise a family on a single income any more, that healthcare can bankrupt them and that half of them are one pay cheque away from homelessness.

      --
      const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
      SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
    68. Re: Ok, this isn't funny anymore by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If youâ(TM)re worried about inflation, just think what would happen if China started selling off some of the US government debt they hold. Iâ(TM)m sure culturally that the Chinese can stomach economic hardship a lot more than Americans. The US has surrendered control by running such a large deficit. The creditors always get the final say.

    69. Re: Ok, this isn't funny anymore by WindBourne · · Score: 1
      --
      I prefer the "u" in honour as it seems to be missing these days.
    70. Re: Ok, this isn't funny anymore by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Kudos!

    71. Re: Ok, this isn't funny anymore by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Russian bots / GOP Trumptsars, same thing

    72. Re: Ok, this isn't funny anymore by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It's going to depend on the range of electrified driverless trucks. If you are out of range, you'll have to have a human or diesel truck.

    73. Re: Ok, this isn't funny anymore by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Did you forget the words to go along with your links?
      Are you agreeing with him?
      Because it seems you are pointing out that he is right.

    74. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      No. Globalization killed them. Unfettered Capitalism. Greed. Make Greed Great Again!

    75. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Cheap luxuries don't keep your head above water, they keep you entertained. Pretty much everything from China is luxury.

    76. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by ebvwfbw · · Score: 1

      So you were for Sam Adams paying a 40% tax when the european companies pay 30%? How about the 1920s steel mill that was fired back up instead of building a new one in India? Know what you're thinking - no, it IS up to date. Keep running into that leftist propaganda shit to move stuff out of the US. What about Canada's big tax on dairy products from the US? The unfair tax on US cars? Goes on and on and on.

      Other nations have been beating the hell out of the US for decades with their unfair taxes. Politicians don't care because they have no clue. Takes a businessman to know what's what.

    77. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by ebvwfbw · · Score: 0

      That's just it, it's not the 1%. It's the leftist trying to destroy the US.

      Here, let me let you in on some things you don't know. If you are a US citizen, you ARE in the top 1% of the world. Just being a citizens. That is, even our poor live better than 99% of the rest of the world. That's according to the Washington Post in 2016.

      The left keep putting in stupid laws/rules/regulations to screw us. That's why SF is a toilet. That's why Seattle is going down hill. That's why Detroit is a post apocalyptic movie set. That's why we have racial problems that we never had under GW Bush. Obama pushed black people back at least 50 years, probably 60 years.

      Want to become a third world toilet? Keep voting for Democrats. You too can be one of the people shitting on the side walk.

    78. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by RhettLivingston · · Score: 1

      Which means they should care about wage disparity. On average, over $7100 per year of income per worker has shifted from the bottom 90% to the top 10%. That's a lot of money that they could be using for family expenses.

    79. Re: Ok, this isn't funny anymore by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      So make them legals then and solve the problem instantly.

    80. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yeah, I was really surprised Trump froze government wages. Not the way to convince people that the economy is red-hot.

      There are others who need that money more. And we all know who they are.

      And we all know who will get it instead.

    81. Re: Ok, this isn't funny anymore by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Obama didn't do anything to black people, white people panicking about "losing their comfort" made things worse. "Obama hurt black people" is one of those racist code phrases.

      Being rich by global standards doesn't in any way mean that people don't deserve the same relative pay that they had he 60s. Productivity has soared, we should all have 20 hour work weeks that give us full benefits and livable income. We don't because people like you can't handle how incredibly bad the policies of your politicians are.

      We don't because of you. This is your fault. You are to blame for this. You. Your choices, and your deluded views.

    82. Re: Ok, this isn't funny anymore by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      They only outsourced to China because it was cheaper than robots. If it hadn't been China it would have been robots. There is no reality in which jobs would have stayed with people, because every corporation that is publicly traded is required to maximize profits over everything else.

      This won't bring back US jobs, it will just replace people in China with robots here. And, no, the 500 jobs that are created to maintain the robots won't offset the losses. There is no going back

    83. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Mate, the Chinamen OWN your pants. And they'll be confiscating them shortly the way things are going.

    84. Re: Ok, this isn't funny anymore by MightyMartian · · Score: 1

      I think it's cute you imagine in a few decades anyone will be using diesel.

      --
      The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
    85. Re:Ok, this isn't funny anymore by dyslexicbunny · · Score: 1

      I'm pretty convinced the wage freeze is just to get the good people out of government. When that happens, we're going to be super fucked.

  4. We got us an internet tough guy here by PopeRatzo · · Score: 4, Funny

    Trump's not going to do shit about China. They're laughing at him and they know all they've got to do is wait now. It won't be long.

    Plus, any further tariffs will be written on one of those pieces of paper his staff has been snatching off his desk to keep him from fucking up completely.

    --
    You are welcome on my lawn.
    1. Re:We got us an internet tough guy here by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Funny.

      Trump wont win the primary.

      Trump will never be president.

      The republicans can't win the house and senate.

      Upcoming conservative SCOTUS candidates can't get confirmed.

      Trump can't change the tax structure without immediately destroying the economy.

      Relations with North Korea will only get worse, not better because of Trump.

      Trump will never impose tariffs.

      And now:

      Trump's not going to do shit about China.

      Do me a favor, tell me what the lottery numbers wont be?

    2. Re:We got us an internet tough guy here by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Shockingly, Trump's China strategy seems to be working. I didn't think it ever would, but China's economy is feeling quite a sting over all of this. I bought into a 3x leveraged inverse China ETF, and so far it's been full of win. If the Chinese government didn't mind a bit of humility, they would have bowed to some of the demands by now.

      Of course, the US is getting hurt by it as well, just not as bad as China. Nobody ever won a trade war. All parties come out of it worse off than before it started.

    3. Re:We got us an internet tough guy here by Darinbob · · Score: 1

      I guarantee that whatever lottery numbers I choose will not be a winner. If I do win then I'll publicly say I'm sorry and pay you $100 (or the first person I meet who claims to be an Anonymous Coward).

    4. Re:We got us an internet tough guy here by PopeRatzo · · Score: 1

      Funny.

      Trump wont win the primary.

      Trump will never be president.

      The republicans can't win the house and senate.

      Upcoming conservative SCOTUS candidates can't get confirmed...

      Remember?

      Obama's gonna take all our guns

      Obama will crash the economy

      Obama will invade Texas with Jade Helm

      Obama will build FEMA camps for white people.

      --
      You are welcome on my lawn.
    5. Re:We got us an internet tough guy here by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I was quoting you.

    6. Re:We got us an internet tough guy here by taustin · · Score: 1

      There's nothing shocking about it. China's economy has been a house of cards for several decades. The only reason it looks sustainable is that all of the information outsiders see on it is fiction (or propaganda) written by the government. But they can't keep that up any more, and when it cracks, it will collapse. And they know it. They only hope they have of winning is to bluff, and convince Trump to blink (which isn't going to happen, because he understands it as well as they do). They can't keep their house of cards from collapsing until he's out of office.

      But they do need to play tough guy for a while first, to keep their own people from catching on. Eventually, Trump will throw them a bone - something he never actually expected - of a concession, and they'll cough up 99.99% of everything he's been demanding.

      As much of a clown as he is, on this subject, he's on track, and he's got China by the balls.

    7. Re:We got us an internet tough guy here by MtHuurne · · Score: 1

      From the way he handled North Korea and the EU, it will probably go like this:

      1. Act tough and threaten them.
      2. Meet with their leader.
      3. Announce he struck an awesome deal.
      4. Very little actually changes.
  5. The nightmare continues by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I grew up with the nightmare of WWIII.

    Now this as adult with kids.

    There is no rest for the weary.

    1. Re:The nightmare continues by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "an ultra paranoid helicopter parent" would be worried about the smallest of things.

      I think WWIII is the complete opposite of that.

    2. Re: The nightmare continues by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Fear mongering by the Fake News.

    3. Re:The nightmare continues by Darinbob · · Score: 1

      A helicopter parent sounds like it wasn't an easy birth.

    4. Re:The nightmare continues by Megol · · Score: 1

      The rotor unfolds after birth. Miracle of nature.

  6. Uah by thegarbz · · Score: 4, Insightful

    So much economic stupidity. At least he gave tax breaks to businesses and bailed out the industries he's nearly killed as he taxed the hell out of their supply chain.

    1. Re:Uah by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      > he's nearly killed as he taxed the hell out of their supply chain.

      Wat? When did he do that because the first thing he did, was deregulate. I don't remember him taxing (which the president can't do anyway) something to near-death. I think you mean when he added tariffs to foreign goods.

    2. Re:Uah by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Bailing out businesses doesn't help as it ends up putting stress on the tax base. Think of it like this. I export $20,000 to China a year, trump institutes trade war which eliminated $15,000 of that, then gives back $15,000. Where did that $15,000 he bails me out with come from? Taxes. That results in an increase in the taxes we all pay. Now I might get back more than the taxes increase on me, but if you factor in all the costs for every time this is done it ends up economically hurting me more than it helps and many in the industry understand that and so are against this trade war in spite of the government bailing them out.

    3. Re:Uah by Altus · · Score: 4, Informative

      Tariff: A tax or duty to be paid on a particular class of imports or exports.

      putting a tariff on the good a company imports to do business is very much taxing their supply chain.

      --

      "In America, first you get the sugar, then you get the power, then you get the women..." -H. Simpson

    4. Re:Uah by gtall · · Score: 5, Interesting

      I'm sorry, which industries has he bailed out? Coal? Natural gas and renewable are still eating their lunch. Steel and aluminum? I fail to see the boom except is CEO's blowing smoke in Trump's direction, although he very much likes and believes it.

      In the meantime, he's helped tanked the farming and ag business. His tariffs are being paid by every industry and customer reliant on those imports. And now that inflation is taking off and given the eye-watering deficits and debt, the interest rates will continue to rise. That is tanking the rest of the world's economies. And sooner or later, they won't be able to afford American exports because of the dollar's strength and their own currencies weakness. See Turkey for a preview.

    5. Re:Uah by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "Think of it like this. I export $20,000 to China a year, trump institutes trade war which eliminated $15,000 of that, then gives back $15,000. Where did that $15,000 he bails me out with come from? Taxes. "

      In other words, China gets that tax money.

    6. Re:Uah by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Ah, if only there was some way to avoid import taxes. If only.

    7. Re:Uah by Ol+Olsoc · · Score: 1

      Tariff: A tax or duty to be paid on a particular class of imports or exports.

      putting a tariff on the good a company imports to do business is very much taxing their supply chain.

      Tariffs are not taxes any more, They are gifts from Dear Leader

      --
      The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
    8. Re:Uah by fahrbot-bot · · Score: 1

      Tariff: A tax or duty to be paid on a particular class of imports or exports.

      putting a tariff on the good a company imports to do business is very much taxing their supply chain.

      Tariffs are not taxes any more, They are gifts from Dear Leader

      As is the $1.2 Billion bailout to farmers hurt by his tariffs. Our tax dollars at work people, brought to you by "trade wars are easy to win" Trump and the "bailouts are bad", "smaller government is good" Republicans.

      --
      It must have been something you assimilated. . . .
    9. Re:Uah by Darinbob · · Score: 1

      In the meantime our agricultural customers will figure out new supply chains and by food from somewhere else. By the time the tariffs are lifted the customers will have new suppliers and the market will have to slowly rebuild itself.

      Meanwhile, the $billions set aside to compensate farms won't count for very much at all once spread around evenly. It's like when I was laid off and I got unemployment insurance that amounted to about $350 a week, which wasn't much of a compensation.

    10. Re:Uah by Ol+Olsoc · · Score: 1

      Tariff: A tax or duty to be paid on a particular class of imports or exports.

      putting a tariff on the good a company imports to do business is very much taxing their supply chain.

      Tariffs are not taxes any more, They are gifts from Dear Leader

      As is the $1.2 Billion bailout to farmers hurt by his tariffs. Our tax dollars at work people, brought to you by "trade wars are easy to win" Trump and the "bailouts are bad", "smaller government is good" Republicans.

      My guess is that the Democrats will have to come in and clean up the mess that the children made. If you study the political and financial history, you will see this often happens.

      --
      The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
    11. Re:Uah by Ol+Olsoc · · Score: 1

      In the meantime our agricultural customers will figure out new supply chains and by food from somewhere else. By the time the tariffs are lifted the customers will have new suppliers and the market will have to slowly rebuild itself.

      Meanwhile, the $billions set aside to compensate farms won't count for very much at all once spread around evenly. It's like when I was laid off and I got unemployment insurance that amounted to about $350 a week, which wasn't much of a compensation.

      There will be a few particular agribusiness that will get the overwhelming majority of the money.

      This will start out to be a double hit on the taxpayers, but do not fear, The modern Republican party will simply allow the wheels to fall off, as they claim that trillions of dollars added to the deficit don't mean a thing, and perhaps the resulting inflation caused by this endless printing of more money will work out really well.

      --
      The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
    12. Re:Uah by thegarbz · · Score: 1

      In the meantime our agricultural customers will figure out new supply chains and by food from somewhere else.

      And you get to pay more as a result. Don't forget that.

    13. Re:Uah by thegarbz · · Score: 1

      No that was my point. Farming specifically. He bailed out the ag business which he nearly killed himself in the process.

  7. Attention John Kelly by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    It's time to put some whiskey on this toddler's gums and put him to bed

  8. Time to quote Einstein, as trite as it seems by mykepredko · · Score: 4, Insightful

    "Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results."

    Isn't it time to look at a different tool for changing the relationship between the US and China? I can't imagine this hurting anybody but the US consumer - AND I suspect that it could be a boon for other countries looking for lower cost goods for their economies.

    1. Re:Time to quote Einstein, as trite as it seems by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Einstein didn't say that. Also, the apt idiom is "doubling down", which pays off if you're lucky or right.

    2. Re:Time to quote Einstein, as trite as it seems by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      There was a different tool. It was called the TPP. It would have significantly strengthened the relationship with the US and every pacific rim country aside from China and Russia. Thus China would have to negotiate with a dozen countries instead of one fucking dipshit who will fall over himself praising China's tech industry the day after China approves a $500M loan for a trump branded resort. Instead US influence is decreased, China's is increased and our best idea now is to tarrif the shit out of our own consumer dependent economy...and then borrow $billions from China to bail out our industries who suffer most! Why!?! Oh yeah cuz Obama. Good a reason as any I suppose. 25% across the board price hike at Walmart ain't going to affect me.

    3. Re:Time to quote Einstein, as trite as it seems by Howitzer86 · · Score: 1

      I can't imagine this hurting anybody but the US consumer

      No, it hurts the Trump agenda too.

    4. Re:Time to quote Einstein, as trite as it seems by Darinbob · · Score: 1

      TPP did have flaws. But they weren't unsurmountable flaws, and politicians across the board eventually decided that they would re-investigate it to remove some of those flaws. Free trade means more money for everyone, only Trump doesn't believe that. When Republicans were pushing back on Trump claiming that the tariffs would cause harm, it was not because they were the mainstream elite or dupes of mass media.

    5. Re:Time to quote Einstein, as trite as it seems by dryeo · · Score: 1

      The worst flaws of the TPP were introduced by America, or rather American corporations, in the form of IP shit. Now that same shit is being put into NAFTA and a bunch of people who hated that IP shit in the TPP now love it in NAFTA.

      --
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverted_totalitarianism
  9. Wrong approach by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Tariffs are costly in the short term because US citizens will have to pay many of them until alternative sources are available.

    Tariffs are costly in the long term because uncompetitive suppliers will exist as a result.

    Requiring goods sold here to comply with our labor and environmental laws would have most of the same benefits and fewer costs than the tariffs.

    If the goal is to punish the Chinese government for being the scum of the earth, I suggest sanctions instead.

    1. Re:Wrong approach by olsmeister · · Score: 1

      Tariffs are costly in the short term because US citizens will have to pay many of them until alternative sources are available.

      That's fine, us citizens just received a massive tax cut. Oh wait...

  10. eBay by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Go to eBay / Aliexpress and order all the cheap Chinese stuff you want right now, because it might not be available tomorrow! This is Trumptown, unfortunately. :-(

  11. China will bend the knee. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    They know they need their largest market of consumers for cheaply made crap.

    You watch. If you can see thru your TDS that is.
    You should get that treated. It's going to kill you.

    1. Re:China will bend the knee. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      TDS is about people in favor of Trump, so not sure why you brought it up.

    2. Re:China will bend the knee. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      They know they need their largest market of consumers for cheaply made crap.

      Must be why they are still willing to lend us money to buy it from them.

    3. Re:China will bend the knee. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You are 100% completely wrong.

      Get smarter.

  12. Good by sexconker · · Score: 2, Interesting

    I'm fine with buying less shit from China, or paying more for what I actually do need to buy (from elsewhere or from China when necessary).

    It ultimately means China gets less of US money. A lot less. It's China who loses here, not the US. The US is hundreds of billions in trade deficit to China. China has far, far more to lose in this game of chicken.

    China can end it all now if they just agree to one simple thing. Fair trade. If China doesn't like the tariffs and restrictions they can get rid of the same exact tariffs and restrictions they impose on us, and poof, we reciprocate.

    1. Re:Good by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      LOL. Enjoy the taste of Trump's cock while you pay higher prices on nearly everything you dumbass

      Trump supporters are dumber than cattle. Just the way he likes 'em.

    2. Re:Good by Dixie_Flatline · · Score: 4, Interesting

      But trade deficits aren't inherently bad. It's not like the US is paying China a bunch of money out of its tax coffers. The trade deficit merely represents the money flowing between people and companies located in different countries. Seriously, just google 'understanding trade deficit', and nearly every single article is about how trade deficits aren't a good indicator of economic performance in and of themselves, they're just a metric of trade. And I'm not talking about left-leaning publications, I'm talking about everyone. Forbes, investment news, economists—virtually everyone agrees that a trade deficit in the right circumstances can be very good.

      https://www.nationalreview.com...
      https://www.forbes.com/sites/d...

      Really, the only person that doesn't get that is Trump.

    3. Re:Good by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I'm fine with buying less shit from China, or paying more for what I actually do need to buy (from elsewhere or from China when necessary).

      And just who the ever loving fuck do you think you're going to get it from?

      Trump has started trade wars with Europe, China, Canada, Mexico, Asia ... and is in the process of openly pissing off everyone. You're rapidly running out of friends.

      China has far, far more to lose in this game of chicken.

      China also has deeper pockets and cash reserves, and America is far more dependent on China than they realize. They've got a huge cash reserve of your money and treasury bills.

      Fair trade.

      Tell you what, America can stop it's farm subsidies and stop bitching about similar subsidies other countries have. What's that? No? Then you don't want free trade either.

      So here's a little reality check for you ... the rest of the world is losing patience with your President, and losing any feelings of friendship towards the US. We can no longer separate your asshole president from your idiot citizens who parrot the dumb shit he says.

      So, please, by all means, piss off your friends and allies. Just don't go stomping around blustering about how we have to listen to you or give a fuck your your interests.

      Because we're all fine with buying less shit from America or giving a fuck about what Trump thinks.

    4. Re:Good by gtall · · Score: 1

      Ah, the Trump argument of using the Big Stupid Number, in this case, the balance of trade. Your understanding of that is right out of the 1800's, like your hero, the alleged president.

    5. Re:Good by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "It's not like the US is paying China a bunch of money out of its tax coffers."

      Sure it does. China retaliates and puts soy tariffs on, so, to be able to compete with Brasil, farmers lower their prices accordingly, making losses and get billions of bailout by Trump.

      He could just give that tax money directly to China.

    6. Re:Good by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You lefties just don't get it. It's fine that you're fine with buying less from China. But when you use the government to fuck with the economy -- to make you buy less, even the most stable genius has no hope of picking things as well as market forces do. You central economic planners simply have no chance. The Soviets eventually learned this and the Republicans are going to learn it some day too.

      Hopefully the voters will learn it sooner. We need to kick the Republicans out of government until they veer more to the right. At least become as conservative as the Democrats. That's not asking much.

    7. Re:Good by Ol+Olsoc · · Score: 1

      I'm fine with buying less shit from China, or paying more for what I actually do need to buy (from elsewhere or from China when necessary).

      It ultimately means China gets less of US money. A lot less. It's China who loses here, not the US. The US is hundreds of billions in trade deficit to China. China has far, far more to lose in this game of chicken.

      China can end it all now if they just agree to one simple thing. Fair trade. If China doesn't like the tariffs and restrictions they can get rid of the same exact tariffs and restrictions they impose on us, and poof, we reciprocate.

      So are you now a socialist? You do not believe in the free market or supply and demand? Funny how conservatives have almost overnight become believers in Keynesian economics. Just like Nixon did.

      With Tariffs, it is a direct admission that you cannot compete, therefore must put artificial Taxes on other's products to artificially make them cost more.

      Elimination of anyhing resembling a free market, anti competitive tariffs, and taxes. The Republicans inch toward socialism and eventually communism.

      --
      The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
    8. Re:Good by mattmarlowe · · Score: 0

      Trump has started trade wars with Europe, China, Canada, Mexico, Asia ... and is in the process of openly pissing off everyone. You're rapidly running out of friends.

      What friends to begin with?

      Europe --- Maybe the UK and Poland at some point, but the UK is obsessed with its own problems and Poland is hostage to the EU. The EU has never been a friend of the USA. The USA helped it rebuild after world war 2 and payed for its defense for 70+ years. That's hardly friendship. NATO? No one in the USA has ever expected the EU to provide any meaningful support if the USA got into a major war with another super power. It's always been a one way agreement where the USA protected the EU from the USSR and that's it. Anyone who says otherwise is just repeating propaganda.

      China -- has been saying internally that they planned to replace the USA as the leading superpower and its military has been preparing for conflict with the
      USA for the last 10-20 years. It's also been stealing all the technology it can and looting American companies who want access to its consumer market. The population has become increasingly nationalistic and has always been somewhat xenophobic.

      Canada -- I wouldn't say has ever been a friend, more of an easy going business contact next door.

      Mexico -- No, never a friend, more like the neighbor next door that constantly needs help and sends you their problems. Yes, some of dreamed of NAFTA being the opening move towards a North American Union, like the EU -- But the cultures are just too different.

      Asia -- Strangely enough, One could argue that we have had a real friendship with Japan, South Korea, Philippines, and modestly Australia. The last president destroyed the Philippines relationship. South Korea and Japan are good enough, but both are primarily interested in the USA protecting their independence from a militaristic China and North Korea and Trump has been doing what he can to maintain and build those relationships.

      Basically, the existing world order is a result of Americans concentrating on sacrificing its own interests and building world wide prosperity in order to prevent a repeat of the two previous world wars. It's allowed the defeat of the USSR, and the rise of a new multipolar war with several prosperous economic-geographic regions (Asia, Europe, Russia, Middle East). The regions are eager to get the benefits of super power status while letting America continue to bear the overwhelming cost of maintaining a new world order that benefits them. Trump has said enough and asked to re-negotiate. Of course, negotiation is divisive....but ignoring the issues and throwing the can down the road will not improve matters either.

    9. Re:Good by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      So here's a little reality check for you ... the rest of the world is losing patience with your President

      I love the gall of people who believe they cab speak on behalf of the world. Esp. lovely considering the tone of this post.

      PS You might've noticed that nationalism/far-right stuff is getting a wee bit more popular in Europe. Something something imitation is the sincerest form of something something.

    10. Re:Good by Dorianny · · Score: 1
      Hurting the U.S by selling their T-bill holdings at below-value would cost China a fortune. It is a double-edged sward that will cut into them as much as into us.

      The rest of your comment is spot on. Trump is basically pissing away all the hard-earned friendships and good-will the U.S has gained from WW2-forward and willfully relinquishing its status as a global-leader

    11. Re:Good by sexconker · · Score: 1

      But trade deficits aren't inherently bad.

      Have you looked at the US economy lately?

    12. Re:Good by sexconker · · Score: 1

      Argue against it. The long running imbalance has destroyed the US economy. We have extreme wealth disparity in the US because of it.

    13. Re:Good by sexconker · · Score: 1

      I'm fine with buying less shit from China, or paying more for what I actually do need to buy (from elsewhere or from China when necessary).

      It ultimately means China gets less of US money. A lot less. It's China who loses here, not the US. The US is hundreds of billions in trade deficit to China. China has far, far more to lose in this game of chicken.

      China can end it all now if they just agree to one simple thing. Fair trade. If China doesn't like the tariffs and restrictions they can get rid of the same exact tariffs and restrictions they impose on us, and poof, we reciprocate.

      So are you now a socialist? You do not believe in the free market or supply and demand? Funny how conservatives have almost overnight become believers in Keynesian economics. Just like Nixon did.

      With Tariffs, it is a direct admission that you cannot compete, therefore must put artificial Taxes on other's products to artificially make them cost more.

      Elimination of anyhing resembling a free market, anti competitive tariffs, and taxes. The Republicans inch toward socialism and eventually communism.

      Are you a retard? (Yes, you are.)

      I'm fine with a free market. We do not have a free market. Trump wants a free market. China ALREADY imposes huge tariffs and restrictions on OUR SHIT. We are merely returning the favor in kind.

      If you want a FREE MARKET ask China to drop their tariffs and restrictions against us. The US will then reciprocate and our tariffs and restrictions against China will be dropped.

      If you think that China can go without US goods for longer than the US can go without Chinese goods, you're a fool. They're on the wrong side of the balance sheet for this game of chicken.

    14. Re:Good by Ol+Olsoc · · Score: 1

      Are you a retard? (Yes, you are.)

      U mad Bro?

      I'm fine with a free market. We do not have a free market. Trump wants a free market.

      Punitive tariffs an protectionism and paying some of those hurt by it with Tax money is now a free market?

      Your ideas are intriguing, I would like to sign up for your newsletter.

      I have this ideaThat having sex with women will turn them into virgins. Your insights of how things that were once socialist and anticompetitive in nature now being the path to the free market shows us that we can indeed engage in sex with women and turn them into virgins.

      Whoo Hooo! this is great! Oh Frabjous Day!

      You think I am mentally challenged? Dood!

      --
      The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
    15. Re:Good by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      So here's a little reality check for you ... the rest of the world is losing patience with your President, and losing any feelings of friendship towards the US. We can no longer separate your asshole president from your idiot citizens who parrot the dumb shit he says.

      So, please, by all means, piss off your friends and allies. Just don't go stomping around blustering about how we have to listen to you or give a fuck your your interests.

      Last time a militant nation was pushed into a corner with that rhetoric and policy we all know what happened. NAZIs rose to power. Except this time the country being pushed into a corner has 5000 nuclear weapons.

      Instead of brandishing hatred while sucking down American money and technology, how about reciprocating before it's too late.

      If you choose to not "give a fuck your your interests [sic]" you just might get the same in return.

    16. Re:Good by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Trade wars with everyone... but Russia.

    17. Re:Good by dryeo · · Score: 1

      Canada -- I wouldn't say has ever been a friend, more of an easy going business contact next door.

      I guess that is your attitude and why you never bothered to thank us for taking in 6700 Americans into our homes on 9/11. I guess that is why we had the largest trading partnership, but you guys just aren't happy with only $20 Billion surplus on $675 Billion of trade. I guess that is why we have been your ally for longer then anyone else. I guess that is why you have the Jones Act and the 25% tariffs on light trucks. I guess that is why you're pissed that we're your largest importer of steel and are now willing to sacrifice 80 American jobs to take one Canadian job, because we're not importing enough steel.
      Anyways it is nice to know how Americans consider their oldest friend as being nothing but a business contact and next time your true friends the Saudis blow up some buildings, perhaps we'll just sit back and wait for a business interest in helping.

      --
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverted_totalitarianism
    18. Re:Good by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I'm not American nor Chinese. So you, America, drop your farm subsidies that hurts my country. What Trump has done is made me lose patience with America's hypocritical bullshit. I'll now vote for people in my country who will give America a big fuck-you.

      America's dominance is based on other countries being complicit in maintaining the global status quo. When they vote in Trump to upset the status quo, then they're also condemning America to a weakened position. They can do that if they want, but in the next Afghanistan scenario, America will be there on its own.

    19. Re: Good by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Good. We're sick of it anyway. Let China lead and see how that goes.

      After living in Asia I don't see it going very well. But I really couldn't give a fuck at this point and you wankers deserve what you get.

    20. Re: Good by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Hahahahahaahaha

    21. Re:Good by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If you want a FREE MARKET ask China to drop their tariffs and restrictions against us. The US will then reciprocate and our tariffs and restrictions against China will be dropped.

      The classical "but teeeeeeaaaach! They started!!!!", and just about as truthful as on the schoolyard.

    22. Re:Good by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      > No one in the USA has ever expected the EU to provide any meaningful support if the USA got into a major war with another super power.

      Europe was a launch pad for US nuclear attack on USSR and it supposed to be obliterated first. Short flight time to European part of USSR was very convenient. Your "protection" was based on US interests only.

      "No one in the USA has ever expected" - obvious BS.

    23. Re:Good by meglon · · Score: 1

      No. We have a wealth disparity in the US because cunts like you push an agenda to give the already wealthy even more money trough tax policy while hoping the wealthy will at least give you a reach around while they're fucking you up the ass. We have a problem because of stupid fucking cunts like you.

      --
      Fascism: An authoritarian and nationalistic right-wing system of government and social organization. See also: NAZI's
  13. Trump Only Knows One Thing by organgtool · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Trump only knows one thing: how to make threats until he gets what he wants. That childish behavior works really well against your parents and your sycophant "friends" but it's not a great strategy to use on the world stage. The previous tariffs are being blamed for the increased trade deficit this quarter and these additional tariffs will likely make that worse. It's like Trump is determined to erase any gains he can attempt to take credit for with the improved economy. Maybe the writer of the NYT op-ed can sabotage these tariffs.

    1. Re:Trump Only Knows One Thing by gtall · · Score: 1

      Re the writer on the NYT, I don't know if s/he is really in the alleged administration or just punking them. However, given the better sourced Woodword (sp?) book, it is fairly clear that few in the alleged administration have a high opinion of Fearless Leader. Battering and demeaning the hired help when the hired help can strike back is a completely different ball game than running a penny-ante company (and driving it into bankruptcy 4 times...6 depending upon who's counting).

      So it turns out the hire help doesn't like be treated like vermin, made to lie for Fearless Leader, being castigated in front and behind their backs, being demeaned, having their intelligence insulted, and not shown any loyalty by Fearless Leader...especially when Fearless Leader is clearly a imbecile with the maturity level of a 10 year and an attention span to match. What goes around comes around and now them chickens are coming home to roost, and they are an ornery, pissed off lot of his own making.

    2. Re:Trump Only Knows One Thing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Way to blame the victim!

      We have a clear case of a confused and incompetent elderly man being manipulated by the people around him to suit their own ambitions.

      Sad!

    3. Re:Trump Only Knows One Thing by fluffernutter · · Score: 3, Informative

      Honest question, how many of you feel threatened by Canada? That was the excuse he used to put tariffs on Canadian imports. Canada is a national threat. Some loophole from the 1960's. Piss poor way to show everyone he doesn't want tariffs. Then he complains when Canada reciprocates.

      --
      Laws are rules for the court, but merely a bottom bar to hit for life. Think beyond laws in your actions always.
    4. Re:Trump Only Knows One Thing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Americans in general think of Canada as non-threatening. That is exactly why he started trying to bully them. He is all about showing strength by picking on the weak.

    5. Re:Trump Only Knows One Thing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Trump only knows one thing:

      Reminds me of the "Obama only knows one thing" stuff I'd hear from super smart conversatives.

      Now the shoe's on the other foot with super smart liberals.

      Fun times, boys. Goes well with a nice red.

    6. Re:Trump Only Knows One Thing by rossz · · Score: 1

      Trump only knows one thing: how to make threats

      Congratulations. You've just learned government 101. The entirety of government power is based on threats. Most people pay their taxes not because they want to hand over a large percentage of their hard earned money. They pay their taxes because of the threat of being tossed in jail if they don't.

      --
      -- Will program for bandwidth
    7. Re:Trump Only Knows One Thing by meglon · · Score: 1

      It shows his lack of intelligence. I've never been able to figure out why anyone would consider Canada weak.... very polite, sure, but not weak. I guess some younger people have forgotten Juno Beach; walk softly, but carry a big stick kind of thing.

      --
      Fascism: An authoritarian and nationalistic right-wing system of government and social organization. See also: NAZI's
  14. The beatings will continue until morale improves. by Howitzer86 · · Score: 2, Funny

    "The sudden loss of access to previously affordable goods will encourage workers to be more passionate about their career. This will spur the economy further and reduce the gap between the rich and the poor." - government analyst probably.

  15. ?? Trump as most effective Climate Change Advocate by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Maybe Trump is the biggest Climate Change advocate ever ...

    The only surefire way we have seen in recent years to reduce emissions in a meaningful way is recession.

    This could start one so deep the recovery could take decades due to loss of trust in trade dealings with the US.

  16. Wait, MONEY, not FREEDOM? by mujadaddy · · Score: 1

    Why is this being framed as an economic issue, at all?

    The fucking point is to pressure them into treating their people better, not to affect the US markets.

    Since we're clearly not doing that, the rest is just theatre.

    --
    Populus vult decipi, ergo decipiatur...
    "Force shits upon Reason's back." - Poor Richard's Almanac
    1. Re:Wait, MONEY, not FREEDOM? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Because some of us are not an brain-washed imbecile like you who foams in the mouth shouting out Freedom..

    2. Re:Wait, MONEY, not FREEDOM? by mujadaddy · · Score: 1

      You don't know me.

      --
      Populus vult decipi, ergo decipiatur...
      "Force shits upon Reason's back." - Poor Richard's Almanac
  17. 2 more years of shit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    And then everything will revert back to pre-trump era while the US grovel on the ground to ask for forgiveness from their allies and trading partners.

  18. China is better than Africa, say Aspergers by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    During their lifetime, 9.4 out of 10 Aspergers will consider purchasing a Chinese or other Asian partner for a romantic companion.

    The reason? Black people are "just more ugly", according to scientists at Johns Hopkins.

    Research shows that most Aspergers have nearly zero chance of obtaining an attractive white partner, which is the gold standard of human beauty. In comparison, other races look like "a f***ing gorilla" and "Down Syndrome retards", leaving Aspergers with what seemed to be a straightforward decision.

    "It is the most logical choice", said one Aspergher. "And the price is amenable"

  19. Predicting the future by Okian+Warrior · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Trump's not going to do shit about China. They're laughing at him and they know all they've got to do is wait now. It won't be long.

    Plus, any further tariffs will be written on one of those pieces of paper his staff has been snatching off his desk to keep him from fucking up completely.

    People who can read minds and predict the future belong on late night cable TV shows, 900 number call-ins on billboards, and newspaper horoscopes.

    1. Re:Predicting the future by PopeRatzo · · Score: 1

      People who can read minds and predict the future belong on late night cable TV shows

      As St Augustine famously said, "You don't need to be a weatherman to know which way the wind's blowing."

      --
      You are welcome on my lawn.
    2. Re:Predicting the future by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Oh please. All thinking people know this is true.

    3. Re:Predicting the future by Ol+Olsoc · · Score: 1

      People who can read minds and predict the future belong on late night cable TV shows

      As St Augustine famously said, "You don't need to be a weatherman to know which way the wind's blowing."

      I thought that was Rudy Galindo?

      --
      The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
    4. Re:Predicting the future by ChatHuant · · Score: 1

      As St Augustine famously said, "You don't need to be a weatherman to know which way the wind's blowing."

      Heretic! It was "you don't need a weatherman to know which way the wind blows". Burn the witch!

    5. Re:Predicting the future by Darinbob · · Score: 1

      It shouldn't matter how you translate from the original Latin.

    6. Re:Predicting the future by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It shouldn't matter how you translate from the original Latin.

      Just because they held their talks in Latin in order to look smart does not mean that we don't have their secret preparation notes in English. And this time I even got the PDF metadata right.

  20. Obligatory Last Week Tonight clip by Plumpaquatsch · · Score: 2, Funny
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?...

    Alternative link for Canadians and Brits: https://www.youtube.com/watch?...

    And if thats TLDW for you, at least watch from 14:54 to see how Trump got his Trade with China expert.

    --
    Of course news about a fake are Fake News.
    1. Re:Obligatory Last Week Tonight clip by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Why are you linking propaganda masqueraded as comedy?

  21. This *is* the different tactic by Okian+Warrior · · Score: 1, Insightful

    "Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results."

    Isn't it time to look at a different tool for changing the relationship between the US and China? I can't imagine this hurting anybody but the US consumer - AND I suspect that it could be a boon for other countries looking for lower cost goods for their economies.

    No offense, but Trump's tactics *are* the different tool.

    Or would you rather go back to giving away our wealth to everyone and anyone worldwide?

    1. Re:This *is* the different tactic by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      No offense but, we weren't exactly struggling before. We had our issues, like the debt swelling and wage stagnation, but every measure Trump's implemented has exacerbated those issues. And we can add a stagnant-since-January stock market to the list.

      So was his plan to concentrate wealth more into the hands of the few, globally and domestically? Is that the only alternative?

    2. Re:This *is* the different tactic by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Or would you rather go back to giving away our wealth to everyone and anyone worldwide?

      Oh, please ... that is such bullshit it isn't funny.

      America hasn't been giving away their wealth, American corporations have been systematically outsourcing jobs to other countries to cut costs and maximize profits, and therefore shareholder value.

      The entirety of how the US measures its wealth is based on shareholder mother fucking goddamned value.

      Know what's happened in the process? Much of your populace is getting left behind as people in developing nations are happy to do the same job for less money. Guess what? There's your free market biting you in the ass.

      America hasn't been giving away it's wealth, it's greedy corporations have stripped jobs and production out of the US, shifted the money to the 1%, and average Americans have discovered that they're not part of that gravy train.

      The problem Americans haven't figured out isn't that "America is giving away her wealth", it's that the wealth isn't owned by the citizens, and the corporations and rich assholes who do own it are keeping ever more of it for themselves.

      Anything else would be socialism and evil right? Isn't this what you guys claim to want??

      America is a victim of the fucking system they've been foisting on the rest of the world for decades, the difference being in this Ponzi scheme the American people have figured out they're not on the winning side, because nobody gives a fuck about them.

      Don't blame the rest of the world for the fact that your own industries have gutted your economy and left you with nothing.

      America wants access to everyone else's markets, but is an incredibly protectionist economy.

      Boo fucking hoo, we're so upset for you. Because you know what, your Americas companies have been buying companies in our countries for decades, gutting them, and moving the jobs elsewhere.

      If you're looking for sympathy from the rest of the world, you're a couple of fucking decades too late. The problem is you guys actually seem to believe that you're entitled to a better life than the rest of the world.

      Enjoy the shithole country Trump is helping build for you, and ask yourself, just who is going to be left as your allies? Because the rest of the world is losing any interest in what benefits America if it comes at our expense.

    3. Re:This *is* the different tactic by Darinbob · · Score: 1

      How exactly did we give away our wealth to everyone and anyone? An analysis of the effects from NAFTA resulted in slightly more money per US resident overall. Even though some people lost jobs it was balanced by other people gaining jobs. It was not the huge sucking sound as predicted and most definitely not the worst deal ever as Trump likes to claim. We had a *great* trading relationship with Canada, and the few small areas of disagreement we had were not worth scuttling the entire relationship over.

      Trump's idea of a good deal is when one side is a loser, he does not fundamentally understand the concept of a win-win deal.

      People please use some thinking skills. Just because Trump says things were completely terrible and a disaster before he showed up does not mean you have to believe it.

    4. Re:This *is* the different tactic by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      I'll take the bait -- the vodka helps.

      America hasn't been giving away their wealth, American corporations have been systematically outsourcing jobs to other countries to cut costs and maximize profits, and therefore shareholder value.

      The two are not mutually exclusive; therefore, you have not invalidated his argument.

      The entirety of how the US measures its wealth is based on shareholder mother fucking goddamned value.

      Then why does the US brag about GDP n such?

      America hasn't been giving away it's wealth, it's greedy corporations have stripped jobs and production out of the US, shifted the money to the 1%, and average Americans have discovered that they're not part of that gravy train.

      Check it out -- in America, you can start your own greedy corporation and become fabulously wealthy; or, you can start a non-greedy corporation where you, as the CEO, will take a salary akin to the avg. worker. You are free to become the change you wish to see. Not to mention, you know, on average, Americans have a lot of money compared to the rest of the world, developed or not.

      Don't blame the rest of the world for the fact that your own industries have gutted your economy and left you with nothing.

      If the current American economy is considered gutted and leaves people with nothing, I can't even imagine your idea of a "healthy" American economy. We'd need about a million moons because everyone would buy one. The strongest economy in Europe is Germany. Guess which economy produces more value. Guess which average citizen has more money, even after adjusted for cost of living. My guess is your guess is wrong.

      If you're looking for sympathy from the rest of the world, you're a couple of fucking decades too late.

      Seriously, what makes you think America is looking for sympathy?? If anything, Trump and his policies are a big "fuck this -- enough!" to much of the world.

      Enjoy the shithole country Trump is helping build for you, and ask yourself, just who is going to be left as your allies?

      Americans seem to like America. Remember when the people said theyd leave if Trump got elected? Just how many left? (hint: it's statistically negligible).

      Others seem to like America too. If you're very rich and Chinese, and looking to leave China... you're likely coming to America.

      Eh I'm boring myself. More vodka time.

    5. Re:This *is* the different tactic by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Because they want more, more and more. They want all world to give, for america to take (even if only wealthy are actually taking).

  22. Small Business Owner by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    I import various parts from China. One that was affected in the first round of tariffs this year were ball bearings. I import these because I do the product assembly in the USA. I have gotten quotes for similar bearings from US manufacturers and they were 8x the cost of similar bearings from China so going with US suppliers isn't an option.

    The crazy thing is if I had my product assembled in China then I wouldn't need to pay the tariffs today. Anyways I have had to raise my prices by 5% to handle the cost of these tariffs and seems likely I'll be raising my prices more just to cover my increased costs.

    It's been stated by the US government that you can apply for exemptions from tariffs. I'm not sure how likely it is big companies will do this, but I know for small businesses that isn't an option unless it gets very simple which would eliminate the whole purpose of the tariffs.

    I don't really care whose fault any of this mess is, but I think we should acknowledge it's a mess and work towards free trade. That just doesn't seem to be the direction we are headed today.

    1. Re:Small Business Owner by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Free trade = extra profits for those who benefit from slave labor and trashing the environment

    2. Re:Small Business Owner by joelgrimes · · Score: 1

      Serious question - could you get your bearings from anywhere besides China? I don't mean a U.S. supplier, necessarily. I mean anywhere but China?

      80% of the world isn't China - it seems there must be manufacturing elsewhere. If not, then don't you think that's a highly vulnerable position - for the country and for your company - and we should do something to reduce our dependency on them?

    3. Re:Small Business Owner by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Why do you hate America?

    4. Re:Small Business Owner by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yes, I probably could. But it is a significant amount of work to find a new supplier and vet them. These bearings are bought in batches of a few thousand. I need to decide the best way to spend my time. I'm still hopeful these trade problems will go away.

      It's even possible I could find a supplier in the US. I mean the manufacturing of these bearings is fully automated so it could be done in the US. I just couldn't find anyone and had guessed the margins for these less expensive bearings was too low to be interesting to US manufacturers. With the extra 25% profit I'm sure margins would be high enough, but it would be a big risk to spend years and millions on tooling to make these sorts of bearings when there is a thread the tariffs could go away. As I said, it's a mess on all sorts of levels and doing quick tariffs without exhausting other avenues. I like a nice slow government that takes times to discuss the pros/cons of changes and gives businesses/people time to adjust. Even if I don't agree with things at least I have time to prepare then.

    5. Re: Small Business Owner by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      So first you claim US companies are 8x cost, then you claim they don't make them at all.

      And this is the whole point, to make you consider US manufacturers.

    6. Re: Small Business Owner by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You didn't read my comments closely enough. I said "similar bearings" were 8x the cost. Then I said US doesn't make "these bearings", by which I mean the same bearings. In the US the bearings I could find had higher ABEC ratings and some other differences. Which basically means they were higher quality than I needed.

      Maybe in the future you should ask for clarification rather than making assumptions and accusations.

  23. Where is half a TRILLION going? by llZENll · · Score: 2

    So assuming all the tariffs are enacted, where is the 467 billion spent? Because if you say to support K-12 education, SS, or the environment then great, if you say to buy more billion dollar warplanes and to start a star wars program, then FU.

    1. Re:Where is half a TRILLION going? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

      every penny of that 467 billion is being spent on Dear Leader's ego. It's a small price to pay for such an exquisitely rare, delicate, and gilded of egos. I hear there may be one or two more out there, but I never saw one. No Collusion! Let me tell you, though, the ego that you're going to be getting... means that I'll be very happy on tv. That means more ratings. The happier I am, the more ratings I get, which means I'm worth more. And let me tell you, once all of that happiness trickles down to you dumb southerners, you'll be happier too - thus you'll get better ratings, and make more money. That'll really make those 17 angry democrats even more angry. And the more angrier they get, the less happy they'd be... so they'd get less ratings and make less money. It's win win win lose draw win. I like drawing. I make the best drawings. I colored that flag better than all those kids. Those kids are losers, let me tell you about losers. Losers have fragile egos. Not an ego like mine, mine is huge. An ego that big can't be fragile because it's big. Have you seen those photoshops of my inauguration? Ya, big like that. Bigly big. Big bigly. Happy.

    2. Re:Where is half a TRILLION going? by ghoul · · Score: 1

      Its already spent. The 1.5 trillion dollar tax cut for corporations. A tariff is just a National Sales Tax.

      --
      **Life is too short to be serious**
    3. Re:Where is half a TRILLION going? by ghoul · · Score: 1

      Thats scarily real

      --
      **Life is too short to be serious**
    4. Re:Where is half a TRILLION going? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Whenever Trump goes to stay at one of his properties, the Secret Service has to accompany him, and therefore require lodging. He can choose what they have to pay for the privilege of protecting him; they don't get to negotiate and don't get to refuse, so they have to agree to whatever he wants and ultimately send the bill to the federal government.

      It looks like he's planning to spend that 467 billion on golf, because that way he gets to pocket it.

  24. Re:Should be getting better soon by GrumpySteen · · Score: 2, Insightful

    If you want people to look at the government report, link to the government report, not fucking Breitbart.

  25. I like this for non-economic reasons by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Capitalism likes to sweep problems under other national rugs. We regulate ourselves with worker protections and environmental standards, but then we're happy to buy cheaper stuff from places that lack those protections and standards. Sweat shops, child labor... easy to shrug about it and enjoy your cheap electronics, shoes, whatever. Not happening where it affects me directly.

    Not so easy to shrug and ignore CO2 emissions. Leaving aside political and economic considerations:

    China is hell on the environment.
    "China — which already emits more carbon from burning fossil fuels than the United States and Europe combined..."
    Source: https://www.nytimes.com/2018/01/25/business/china-davos-climate-change.html

    Container ships are hell on the environment.
    "The shipping industry generates more than 2% of global CO2 emissions but that's projected to increase rapidly."
    https://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-43701631

    Manufacturing stuff that doesn't have to chug across the ocean on ships using fuel that burns like asphalt sounds like a pretty good idea.

    Requiring our trading partners to take some precautions against soiling the shared environmental bed sounds like a good idea.

    So... yeah, I'm pretty happy about anything that slows down the dirty manufacturing and shipping that's going on. I just wish there was more of that motive baked into these tariff discussions.

  26. ABSOLUTELY CORRECT Mr. President... apk by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    See subject: After I saw President (for life DICTATOR) Xi Ping & his "you know who" DAVOS pals (who have no armies but are TRYING to 'use' the Chinese as one, but are going to be UNPLEASANTLY surprised when they get a HANNIBAL & ROMANS scenario from it) say he was going to "Destroy the USA, it's economy & Trump".

    * HEY, CHINK MOTHERFUCKERS? FUCK YOU!

    APK

    P.S.=> You + Your "IMF" puppeteers? Will end up FERTILIZER motherfucker & in my lifetime? I will SEE you BOTH "uncreated"... apk

    1. Re:ABSOLUTELY CORRECT Mr. President... apk by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Fuckin A! Host File Engine is the most anti-chink shit bitch ever. You think your chink protection is good? Wrong stupid niigger, use motherfucking Host Engine.

  27. Hypocrites by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I find it interesting that all of you crybabies that are crying about the tariffs being raised on foreign goods coming into the US are perfectly ok with all of the tariffs that foreign countries place on US goods in the name of protecting their own.....

    Fucking hypocrites.

  28. You're a retarded faggot apologist Okie by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Trump could literally suck Putin's dick on live television and you'd pretend he's being tough on Putin's aggressive manhood, fuck you apologist faggots to death. You are nazi garbage defending nazi garbage as it fails, period. Hang, traitor.

  29. Re:Should be getting better soon by olsmeister · · Score: 2

    I suggest you read this article if you think wages are outpacing inflation.

  30. Hey ORANGUTANG, get this... apk by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Be GLAD I'm not president: I'd do what McArthur wanted (he was VISIONARY 70++ yrs. ago): BLOW THEM TO HELL - why? Ok: President (for life DICTATOR) Xi Ping & his "you know who" DAVOS pals (who have no armies but are TRYING to 'use' the Chinese as one, but are going to be UNPLEASANTLY surprised when they get a HANNIBAL & ROMANS scenario from it) say he was going to "Destroy the USA, it's economy & Trump".

    * Between ourselves (who could SMOKE China easily, especially navally, which is WHY they stole (all they KNOW how to do is STEAL the slanteye FUCK mongoloids) naval plans for the Pacific on our submarine fleets etc.) & RUSSIA?

    THEY HAVE NO CHANCE... & their "allies" (jews in davos)? They're worse... quote George Washington father of our country:

    "They (the Jews) work more effectively against us, than the enemy's armies. They are a hundred times more dangerous to our liberties and the great cause we are engaged in. It is much to be lamented that each state, long ago, has not hunted them down as pest to society and the greatest enemies we have to the happiness of America." - George Washington

    APK

    P.S.=> I promise you ALL this: In my time on this planet, before I leave (as well all do)? I will see them BOTH destroy themselves (all scumbags do) - how? THEIR BULLSHIT is totally UNSUSTAINABLE (mere illusion)... apk

  31. You're against free trade? by Okian+Warrior · · Score: 0

    I'm sorry, which industries has he bailed out? Coal? Natural gas and renewable are still eating their lunch. Steel and aluminum? I fail to see the boom except is CEO's blowing smoke in Trump's direction, although he very much likes and believes it.

    In the meantime, he's helped tanked the farming and ag business. His tariffs are being paid by every industry and customer reliant on those imports. And now that inflation is taking off and given the eye-watering deficits and debt, the interest rates will continue to rise. That is tanking the rest of the world's economies. And sooner or later, they won't be able to afford American exports because of the dollar's strength and their own currencies weakness. See Turkey for a preview.

    Steel and aluminum were national security issues. Specifically, there was one remaining foundry in the US capable of making steel plates, and you need those to make ships. We can't depend on other countries for war materiel, reference the English blockade of nitrates against Germany in the 1910s.

    (Typical quote: "This meant that during the fifteen years preceding the outbreak of WWI, Germany became deeply dependent on obtaining goods from foreign merchants in order to keep its society stable and productive.")

    Also, it's not hard to google the effect of steel and aluminum tariffs, and it's universally lauded in the cities where the foundries are.

    Most of your argument is a simple prediction, with no modeling or rationality - simply saying "this bad thing will happen". He also hasn't "tanked" anything - I don't know if you've noticed, but the economy is doing great.

    Normalizing tariffs, bringing the tariffs into parity with those of other nations, is a step towards free trade. Either by having commensurate tariffs or getting rid of tariffs altogether.

    I don't know why anyone would be against that.

    1. Re:You're against free trade? by Dixie_Flatline · · Score: 4, Insightful

      This is largely bullshit. They certainly INVOKED the spectre of national defense, but the steel and aluminum tariffs are being applied on all steel and aluminum, not just stuff used for defense. And the tariffs even apply to countries like Canada, who aren't shipping sub-standard metals. If the goal was to curb dumping of low-grade metals onto the market, it's not doing its job. The number of American companies applying for exemptions from this absurd tax is orders of magnitude higher than what the government was prepared to deal with. In many cases, US companies literally can't get the steel they need from ANY American provider. How is THAT good for anyone, let alone national defense?

    2. Re:You're against free trade? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      US companies literally can't get the steel they need from ANY American provider. How is THAT good for anyone, let alone national defense?/quote

      It's good for the American providers if demand outpaces supply.

      How much does demand outpace supply?

    3. Re:You're against free trade? by thegarbz · · Score: 1

      Steel and aluminum were national security issues.

      No they weren't. Steel and aluminium were DECLARED national security risks to get around the fact that this tariff would never have made it through his own government otherwise and this stupidity needed to be exempt from any other treaties and from challenge by the WTO which doesn't think very highly of the idea.

      If supply of materials is a national security issue for defence the answer isn't to apply tariffs on the entire industry but rather to produced fixed contracts of supply to keep your critical suppliers open and in house. The interests of national security could easily have been achieved without every person in America paying more for metal in completely un-national-security related products.

      Also, it's not hard to google the effect of steel and aluminum tariffs, and it's universally lauded in the cities where the foundries are.

      No shit Sherlock. Here have $20. Are you going to complain I gave you $20? Meanwhile in every other city of America where the foundries' customers are they are universally criticised.

       

      He also hasn't "tanked" anything - I don't know if you've noticed, but the economy is doing great.

      Your ignorance on the international economy is to be lauded, and then laughed at. You're right, the GP hasn't noticed that the international economy is doing great. He won't either since that is just Trump level wishful thinking. Economies are performing under expectations on every continent of the world (except Antarctica).

      Normalizing tariffs, bringing the tariffs into parity with those of other nations, is a step towards free trade.

      Never go full retard man.

    4. Re:You're against free trade? by DNS-and-BIND · · Score: 1

      Then maybe we need to start new American providers? Thus creating good lives for our people, and a secure source of steel for generations to come? Seriously, can people not see second-order consequences? A tremendous demand has just been created for American-made steel. Is this not what the US government is supposed to do? Give us an advantage and take care of our own?

      --
      Shutting down free speech with violence isn't fighting fascism. It IS fascism!
    5. Re:You're against free trade? by Highdude702 · · Score: 1

      Well now you're just being Xenophobic, we great privileged Americans need to help all other nations in the world no matter the consequence long or short term! /s(I think that's how this works?)

  32. Do we have to bomb Schweinfurt again? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    https://ww2db.com/facility/Schweinfurt_Ball_Bearing_Factories/

  33. Sun Tzu's advice by hey! · · Score: 3, Interesting

    If you completely surround an enemy, his soldiers will fight bravely. If you leave them a path to escape, they will run away.

    This is actually a pretty good time to put some trade pressure on China. They've reached the end of an era of explosive growth and the transition to something more sustainable is bound to put pressure on them. A trade war can really hurt them right now (as it can hurt us as well).

    This is a time to have your exit strategy worked out. If we have a shrewd and accurate idea of what we can feasibly walk away with, we could do quite well out of a little trade saber rattling. The thing is if we don't have an exit strategy, we can hurt our own economy and give the Chinese regime a legitimate scapegoat for its own problems.

    So this is a test of the president's acumen. Does he have the brains to know when to walk away from a conflict?

    --
    Post may contain irony: discontinue use if experiencing mood swings, nausea or elevated blood pressure.
    1. Re:Sun Tzu's advice by fredrated · · Score: 1

      " Does he have the brains to know when to walk away from a conflict?"
      Do you pay attention? This moron doesn't have the brains of a turd floating in a toilet.

    2. Re:Sun Tzu's advice by hey! · · Score: 1

      It was a rhetorical question.

      --
      Post may contain irony: discontinue use if experiencing mood swings, nausea or elevated blood pressure.
    3. Re:Sun Tzu's advice by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Except it won't work. Our trade balance with China may go down a little bit, but those surpluses would simply shift to other nations. Already as is, China is building tons of factories in SE Asia and Africa. So overall the US total trade balance with all nations will remain the same.

    4. Re:Sun Tzu's advice by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      " Does he have the brains to know when to walk away from a conflict?"
      Do you pay attention? This moron doesn't have the brains of a turd floating in a toilet.

      You are thinking of "brans" rather than "brains". Easy mistake to make. Particularly since there is so much brown in Trump's grey matter.

  34. Re:The beatings will continue until morale improve by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    That is so fucking funny. If I had heard that one before, I lost it.

  35. TPP looking mighty good right now by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    complete unsubstantiated guess... but i'd venture to say that China has a lot less to lose than the US stands to gain from this slap fight we're in

  36. Re:Should be getting better soon by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Just because we're having unexpectedly bigger than expected pay increases doesn't mean everyone is helped. Only the average is helped. Overall, most people have had their lives destroyed by Trump and now make less. I know my life is shit now that Trump has hurt the tech industry, and it's hard to find a job. My of my friends with CS degrees have lost their jobs under Trump. So fewer people are driving to jobs now that traffic is less worse in the Bay Area.

  37. Do you have a problem with fair? by Okian+Warrior · · Score: 1

    So here's a little reality check for you ... the rest of the world is losing patience with your President, and losing any feelings of friendship towards the US. We can no longer separate your asshole president from your idiot citizens who parrot the dumb shit he says.

    I hear what you're saying - you would like your country to pay for your defense from Russia.

    I think we can arrange that.

    Real friends don't leech off of others, they abide by their obligations.

    We're only making the tariffs fair and even. Trump has said repeatedly that he would welcome getting rid of all tariffs on both sides. He's said that directly to Merkel, using those exact words. Her response was to laugh.

    Eliminating all tariffs seems fair.

    Do you have a problem with fair?

    1. Re:Do you have a problem with fair? by Dorianny · · Score: 2

      The U.S doesn't keep bases in Europe out of good will. It does because we want Russia to know that a potential war will be fought at their borders and very far away from ours

    2. Re:Do you have a problem with fair? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Eliminating all tariffs seems fair.

      When put super simplistically by a moron, sure, it sounds fair. The reality is, it's anything but.

      In this case "fair" would enable larger US industries (many of which are subsidized, like every product with corn in it) to flood the markets of other countries, and undercut the domestic industry and put them out of business. They would and have done so, so don't pretend that won't happen.

      In your stupid definition of "fair", American multinationals will buy foreign companies, steal the IP/profits, and shutter the company leaving people out of work and often without pensions. You may think it's OK to do that, but we sure as fuck don't think it's "fair".

      In your stupid fucking definition of "fair" means that US IP laws are foisted on the rest of the world, while the US ignores the laws of other countries which say "you can only call a product this if it's from there". So, you know, champagne, parma ham, parmesan cheese .. wait, how about other countries make whiskey and call it bourbon??

      Awww, that's right, you don't want fair, you want an advantage.

      Your and Trump's definition of "fair" (which is idiotic and demonstrates a lack of fucking understanding of economics) deems "fair" to be "we will come in and destroy you, and then you will be beholden to us". The rest of us aren't buying it.

      Do you have a problem with fair?

      Fair is fucking great. Fair doesn't include the ability for the lion to tell the mouse what is for dinner.

      What people want is equitable trade where foreign companies don't ruin domestic industries of trading partners by buying them up, undercutting them, offshoring the jobs or dumping cheaper subsidized goods.

      What you and shitheads like you are advocating is a definition of "fair" where whatever US companies want is good, and whatever the fallout of that to everyone else is too bad. That's not "fair" to us, it just says "sure we're dumb enough to give you unrestricted access to our markets".

      Sorry, but if you want to discuss "fair", learn what it means. It's not some scenario in which the US gets to dictate terms, and drive the local corporations out of business.

      Mother fucking fair, like you have any fucking idea of what that is.

      What you are describing as "fair" is the crooks telling the victims that the robbery is "fair". Nope, sorry.

      America has no fucking concept of "fair trade", America and your idiot fucking orange president believe that "fair trade" means "winning at all costs". The rest of the world doesn't wish to play by your moronic definition of "fair".

      Fuck you and fair. You have no idea what it means.

    3. Re:Do you have a problem with fair? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      More correctly, Europe and Japan are occupied territories. It is the only reason they have been at 'peace' for this long, but in reality, it is a truce held together by an irresistible force. For this reason, the US is truly indispensable... to England anyway.

    4. Re:Do you have a problem with fair? by sexconker · · Score: 1

      In this case "fair" would enable larger US industries (many of which are subsidized, like every product with corn in it) to flood the markets of other countries, and undercut the domestic industry and put them out of business.

      Kind of like what China did to the US? Fair is fair.

    5. Re:Do you have a problem with fair? by dryeo · · Score: 1

      No, more like what the US did to Canada. Now that your trade surplus has dropped to only $20 billion, you're freaking out with the excuse that you need to dump your highly subsidized milk and put more Canadian farmers out of work.
      Wahh, wahh, we only have a $20 billion trade surplus with this country, lets throw some tariffs on them, it'll raise the price of a house for the average American by 20 grand, and those lumber barons can buy another yacht.

      https://www.foxbusiness.com/po...
      https://ustr.gov/countries-reg...

      --
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverted_totalitarianism
    6. Re:Do you have a problem with fair? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The US has nuclear weapons. Russia, or the USSR before them, would never attack the US until they decided to commit suicide.

      No, the US keeps bases in Europe because we're sorry sentimentalists that think that protecting our friends is the duty of good people. But friendship is a two-way street. When those friends constantly take advantage of you, and fail to keep their promises, and borrow money but never pay it back, and snipe at you behind your back, well...

      Maybe it's just time to move on. Surely the EU can manage to hold off Russia, a country a fifth the size, with 1/12th the economy?

    7. Re:Do you have a problem with fair? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Two wrongs don't make a right. Three rights make a left, though.

    8. Re:Do you have a problem with fair? by jareth-0205 · · Score: 1

      So here's a little reality check for you ... the rest of the world is losing patience with your President, and losing any feelings of friendship towards the US. We can no longer separate your asshole president from your idiot citizens who parrot the dumb shit he says.

      I hear what you're saying - you would like your country to pay for your defense from Russia.

      Oh fucking please. Right now the president's attitude to Russia makes it very questionable whether the US is a reliable defensive partner. He's publicly defending Putin to the world, denying his own governments findings about what Russia has been up to. The US is no longer a reliable member of NATO.

      The US military doesn't exist to protect anyone, it's ludicrously over-powered to do so and can role over any other country in the world. It exists because the US has a hardon for military power and it's politically impossible to do anything else but keep funding a large military.

    9. Re:Do you have a problem with fair? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      In all cases Russia was involved in conflicts recently (Georgia, Ukraine, Syria) it had significant support of local population. The idea that it would for some reason occupy Europe is ridiculous. You remember that there are former Soviet republics in Asia, right? They are not in NATO and somehow not occupied yet.

      USSR had ideological reasons to invade Europe, spread of communism. It wasn't a pure conquest for power, the idea was to liberate working class from oppression. And even these ideas were mostly abandoned in 1950s. These ideological reasons don't exist anymore.

      Europa outnumbers Russia ~4:1. I wonder how long this particular scarecrow will work.

  38. Re:Should be getting better soon by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Then why plant the seeds of recession in the midst of a return to growth?

  39. Out of curiosity by Okian+Warrior · · Score: 1

    Just because we're having unexpectedly bigger than expected pay increases doesn't mean everyone is helped. Only the average is helped. Overall, most people have had their lives destroyed by Trump and now make less. I know my life is shit now that Trump has hurt the tech industry, and it's hard to find a job. My of my friends with CS degrees have lost their jobs under Trump. So fewer people are driving to jobs now that traffic is less worse in the Bay Area.

    Out of curiosity, what's the difference between average and overall?

    Can you reconcile "most people have had their lives destroyed" and "fewer people are driving to jobs..." with a steady unemployment rate of 3.8%?

    I can reconcile those claims in three words:

    Trump Derangement Syndrome

  40. Winning? by ebusinessmedia1 · · Score: 2

    Trump believers think they're winning, even though they're losing. This is one sign of cultism.

    1. Re:Winning? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Trump believers think they're winning, even though they're losing. This is one sign of cultism.

      So the high GDP growth and low unemployment is considered "losing" ?

    2. Re:Winning? by kaoshin · · Score: 1

      Trump believers think they're winning, even though they're losing. This is one sign of cultism.

      Liberals proclaimed until the end of the 2016 election that Hillary Clinton was a lock for president and was winning over President Trump even though they were losing. Out of curiosity, did you also consider that a sign of cultism, or are you just a partisan hypocrite?

  41. Re:Should be getting better soon by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    > shows wage growth(*) at 2.9% last month

    Only because the rich are making more. For normal people, most of us have seen drops of 5-10% in pay because Trump has destroyed the economy. Companies are going bankrupt by his policies so they can't afford to pay as much. We have another pay cut scheduled at the end of the year, and I know at least two key people that are already looking for another job. Both said the offers they've received were shockingly low. I know I make less now than when Clinton was our ruler and with inflation, I make about half of what I made then because of Bush and Trump.

  42. Chink fucks even STOLE that from me... apk by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Who did it 1st: China or me? I did - dates are my proof http://theregister.co.uk/2017/... w/ the FACT China rampantly STEALS U.S. Intellectual properties & military secrets!

    * THEY, like their "DAVOS" allies? THIEVES (born thieves, known so thru ALL history)...

    APK

    P.S.=> There's only 1 DESTINY for thieves - FERTILIZER... apk

  43. from canada to china by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    HEY why dont you bring some of our stuff here....lets talk business .....haha and USA is not in TPP and wont be as long as they are trade warring on canada

    GET over it

  44. Re:Should be getting better soon by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Wrong. Actual real data shows income has dropped by nearly 5% since Trump started his attack on America. I know my pay has dropped by more than 10%, and we expect another pay cut any day now. If you look at real numbers instead of believing the numbers that the Trump junta makes-up, then you'll see real facts. All thinking people know that.

  45. spoiled brat by citylivin · · Score: 4, Insightful

    "but behind that is another $267 billion ready to go on short notice if I want"

    If *I* want.

    Not advisers, not the american people, I.

    "*I* am the state"

    me me me, I I I. He has all the situational awareness of a toddler.

    --
    As a potential lottery winner, I totally support tax cuts for the wealthy
    1. Re:spoiled brat by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      My toddler was more aware than this.

    2. Re:spoiled brat by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Have you ever listened to any of Obama's speeches? 'I', 'me', everything was about him. When he wasn't acting messianic, he was acting egotistical. George W Bush was modest in comparison, but he's the only President in the last 50 years that would even begin to qualify.

      It's almost as if people that think they can run United States are arrogant fuckwads. Even the ones that lose their elections.

    3. Re:spoiled brat by DNS-and-BIND · · Score: 1

      He's used to being the boss and this is how he talks. It's how any executive talks. He didn't say "I am the state," that is you using an absurd absolute, a logical fallacy. Remember when he moved the US embassy to Jerusalem? (Worst Hitler ever!) He said "This has long been an issue and I am now taking it off the table. Now we can make progress." Same deal.

      This also feeds into the advantage of being seen as erratic or unpredictable. Instead of us worrying about what they're going to do, now they're worrying about what we're going to do. Why wasn't it this way the whole time? The USA holds an overwhelmingly good hand internationally. Why did we let China rip us off on trade for decades without doing anything about it? Now they're a huge problem that will vex us long after Trump leaves office. At least he's trying to do something, Obama and Bu$shitler just sat and watched them leapfrog their tech levels and ruin the lives of our working class that depended on manufacturing jobs.

      --
      Shutting down free speech with violence isn't fighting fascism. It IS fascism!
  46. oh its gonna hurt buddy by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    hree is some more facts ....ya know them lads up0 north a ya ...they give power ( ya know that shit called electricity that powers your heat water, and internet and recharges your phones) to nealry 90 million in the usa ...add ot that we supply you wth 1 million barrels a oil that you sell back like 90K of it....

    then ad to fact you dont have enough aluminium to offset the amount we sell you , and not only could this get ugly it will destroy the usa .....YOUR man trump needs to go or your gonna see serious trouble times. and dont think canada will bend while you nitwits were whining aobut whatever and doing no to education....we made free trade deals with nearly 40 nations THATS RIGHT we dont fuckn need ya OHHHH YEA short term its gonna hurt but when dust settles you wont have jack nor shit to build or prepare all those lovely fucking military toys that require our resources....and in 15 years YOUR done for fuel....and if you think you can invade and take canada imagine what and whom would come to our aid when you do...and then its really over//// you wont be able to use a single nuke as the fallout will be horiffic for the north usa....

    1. Re:oh its gonna hurt buddy by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Oh please, we own you already. Our National Guard units would slaughter your full time army (I know; I've worked with those pussies).

      Keep acting like you have influence, oh little Canuckistani.

    2. Re:oh its gonna hurt buddy by taustin · · Score: 1

      Can somebody translate that into a language that actually has complete sentences, with capitalization and punctuation?

    3. Re:oh its gonna hurt buddy by Gimric · · Score: 1

      Geez, you guys won't be happy until the entire world hates you. I think maybe it's time to roll back those copyright extensions that the US foisted on us to protect US companies like Disney.

    4. Re: oh its gonna hurt buddy by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The last time you tried I seem to recall you got your pretty White House burned to the ground.

      I suppose you could try again. You'll be able to hear the lamentations of your women wailing into the night as the pile of bodies grows.

      Yes, in other words you're a chickenshit with the mind of a child and can safely be completely ignored.

    5. Re:oh its gonna hurt buddy by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      People have been hating on the US for years and now people are getting upset because the hate is being returned. Existing US trade agreements are one sided and favor the US trading partners. For years the US has been expected to sacrifice it's interests. Other countries are arguing that the existing trade agreements are fair and balanced. They are upset because Trump has the balls to publicly denounce the targeted trade agreements.

      Trump may be an idiot but he is shattering the status quo of domestic and international politics. Just the fact he was elected in the first place toppled the power brokers who spent millions of dollars on the democrat and republican campaigns. People that invest that much money to get a politician elected expect a ROI. When Trump won that investment was wasted. Trump went to chat with the NK leader because the last 60 years of diplomacy only led to a nuclear armed NK. When Trump and the NK leader were exchanging nuclear threats he was castigated for not using diplomacy instead of military threats. When the military threats stopped and Trump tried the diplomacy option he was castigated for going soft. But one thing was accomplished. There has not been any more missile or nuke tests in NK. That's more than his predecessors achieved. Trump has been accused of going easy on the Russians just by him having a meeting with another head of state. If the leaders of two countries in conflict cannot meet and talk to each other how will the problems be solved? Trump has kicked 200+ Russians out of the US. He confiscated over 20 million dollars of real estate owned by Russia. He has not eased any existing sanctions at all. And Trump is supposed to be doing Russia's bidding? For good or bad he will leave office having nominated and installed 2 new US Supreme Court judges which is an achievement most Presidents would love to accomplish. His new trade agreement with Mexico includes a requirement that any Mexican working on automobile parts that are exported into the US must earn a minimum of $16/hr. Manufacturers leave the US to lower their labor costs but the new agreement takes a big bite out of that practice. It is not a fix all solution but it is a damn good start. Canada is refusing to sign a new trade deal with the US because of one reason. The current agreement blocks the US from taking Canada to the WTO over government subsidized industries that unfairly manipulate prices in favor of Canada. And China will come around because they have no choice. As soon as China enters into an agreement to enforce US copyright and IP rights things will get better. Ultimately China and the US should not be enemies. China is the one country the US has never invaded. The US committed resources to China when they were being invaded by Japan. It wasn't much but the US was not a super power back then and pre-WW2 the US military barely made the list of the top 20 militaries in the world at that time. Chinese immigrants have been in the US since the 1800's. You can travel to any major city in the US and visit "China Town" sectors of the city. You can't swing a cat anywhere in the US without hitting a Chinese restaurant. Hell China is the US's most successful regime change operation in history. It started with Nixon's visit with Mao in 1972. China's transition from a poor communist state into a rich communist state has made a lot of people very rich in both the US and China. Commerce instead of bombs made China what it is today.

    6. Re:oh its gonna hurt buddy by AutodidactLabrat · · Score: 1

      Yeah,like the 1 million innocent Iraqis we murdered when we knew the WMD bullshit wasn't true died "unhated".
      Grow up, America has been hating for a LONNNNOGGGGG time.

    7. Re: oh its gonna hurt buddy by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The current agreement blocks the US from taking Canada to the WTO.

      It also prevents Canada from taking the US before the WTO, dumbass. If you don't think we prefer it that way, look up the "dolphin-safe tuna" dispute with Mexico.

    8. Re:oh its gonna hurt buddy by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The general view of trade agreements with the USA in the rest of the world is that they are very favourable to US corporations. So there is a profound disagreement on the quality of those trade agreements.

    9. Re: oh its gonna hurt buddy by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      US dumb

    10. Re: oh its gonna hurt buddy by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You're confusing 'hating' with 'not giving a shit'

  47. why by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    1st off it takes time for the bad bts to come in and he ofset shit with a 1.5 trillion tax break , wait for that reality to bite you when debts are called and you cant pay after all 85% is pwned by your 1%, also most of these tarrffs like steal you can and have capacity to spare , unlike the aluminium where you dont thats why he only dropped 10% , its cost canada 5% sales and we just upped price of that tarriff, so it works to like a 3 % tax increase while gvng the company tax relief from govt , add ot that the bail out cash and its rosey .....yup going perfect....

    it just wont last i say by next april you all will be 100% no longer talking about kardashians and MEETOO it will be fuckin drop trump, my hotdogs are 10 dollars each, not to mention as it goes on and CANADA gets with euro and tpp trade we may just divert more of that aluminium to other nations and your ability to war will be further diminished.

    notuce trumpy loud mouth has not said much about the EU lately he does and the agreement dies its game over

    300 million of you cannot trade war with the world YOU CANT

  48. Re:The beatings will continue until morale improve by Howitzer86 · · Score: 1

    If you enjoyed that joke, check this one out. The EPA quickly took it down as they found it quite embarrassing.

    As reported by Vox:

    “[The new fuel efficiency proposal] is anticipated to prevent thousands of on-road fatalities and injuries as compared to the standards set forth in the 2012 final rule,” the EPA wrote in a press release about the announcement. The EPA said the proposed changes would save 1,000 lives per year.

  49. Hilarous Irony for Google and Apple by Chissblue · · Score: 1

    Two companies that don't even need to appear before Congress because they are mostly Chinese owned now getting a dose of ethical edification. Perfectly fine with Korean, Japanese, and Taiwanese products.

  50. Breitbart is retarded nazi faggots like you, Okie by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    You need to get your head stuck in Putin's asshole better, you're slipping out weak traitor faggot.

  51. World Trade Organization by manu0601 · · Score: 2

    I wonder if WTO will survive that moves between US and China. Its rules were already seen as unfair by many poor countries, and now everyone sees they do not apply to big players.

  52. Re:Should be getting better soon by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    have been slow to adjust, but a recent report shows wage growth(*) at 2.9% last month (monthly increase, annualized for a year), which is higher than inflation.

    Did you know gullible isn't listed in the dictionary? They changed the way wage growth was calculated last month. Sucker.

  53. That $1 trillion by rsilvergun · · Score: 1

    is from a tax cut for the rich. We literally just borrowed $1 trillion from China to give it to around 30,000 people...

    It's not Keyesian because none of it is trickling down. Keyesian is demand side economics. What we've been doing is good 'ole fashion voodoo economics...

    It's already biting us in the ass. Putting that much money in the economy with none of it making it to working class Americans is causing the supply side to over-rev. They've got too much money and not enough to do with it. Eventually they'll fuck up and cause a crash + recession. To counter that the Fed is going to use the only tool they have: Interest rates. They'll raise interest rates to slow down the economy, but that'll hit working class Americans hard in the form of inflation...

    Thing is, it'll be 8 years before the damage shows up. By then we'll have another Democrat in charge who'll clean up as much of the mess as he/she can and they'll take the blame for the bad economy. Look at Bush Jr's poll numbers. He's recovered completely and people like him now...

    --
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  54. Okie traitor faggot with anal fetish by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Lock this faggot up next to Trump Junior, let them rape eachother like civilized traitor faggots in prison.

  55. You're giving him way too much credit by rsilvergun · · Score: 1

    there was an interview with Ed McMahon where he talked about a Trump "negotiation" session. By the time Trump was done negotiating he'd given McMahon everything and got nothing in return.

    Trump went bankrupt for real several times. His banks wanted to try and recover as much as they could and Trump had a well known name & brand so they let him keep some money and go on playing the part of the rich man so they could try and use his brand to bilk people out of money. Worked too. But that wasn't Trump's idea, and the banks told him exactly what to do and when to do it.

    When that dried up he started relying on his Russian connections. Trump's neck deep with their mob and oligarchs. That's why he couldn't release his taxes. If you wanna see some fun times vote Democrat for the House in 2018 and watch as they subpoena his tax returns.

    --
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    1. Re:You're giving him way too much credit by meglon · · Score: 1

      That'd be the Frank Burns School of Negotiating.

      --
      Fascism: An authoritarian and nationalistic right-wing system of government and social organization. See also: NAZI's
  56. Re:Should be getting better soon by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Nice story bro, If you and your friends with CS degrees are doing bad in the current economy, you don't have much else than yourself to blame, your friends probably lost their jobs due to poor performance. It is a job seekers market out there right now in the tech industry. In the area I am in Tampa Florida, there is a glut of tech job listings. I have seen job listing with companies sit open for months because there is no one to fill them. The company I work for has tech job listings that have been up since Feb this year still unfilled. Everyone in the area that wants a job in tech already has one. Perhaps you should look harder, work harder, or relocate where the jobs are.

  57. Re:Absolutely by Nethemas+the+Great · · Score: 2, Informative
    I haven't smelled their heads ever, however, they generally are not trusted by the folks the OP is trying to convince. I would suggest referencing the following chart for reasonable sources. Hint: pick a source that skew towards minimal bias and sticks to reporting facts. Alternatively accepted are the folks at the GAO and other related government bean counters like the Bureau of Labor Statistics. On related note they're showing 3.9% unemployment, not 2.9%. Also, when you rule out the management types that 2.9% wage growth shrinks to 0.3%. See (August Employment Situation Summary

    In August, average hourly earnings for all employees on private nonfarm payrolls rose by 10 cents to $27.16. Over the year, average hourly earnings have increased by 77 cents, or 2.9 percent. Average hourly earnings of private-sector production and nonsupervisory employees increased by 7 cents to $22.73 in August. (See tables B-3 and B-8.)

    So, I guess unless you're a management type that inflation rate of 2.9%--the highest level since 2012--is probably going to hurt a bit. Given that this next round will effectively hit everything on the shelves of Walmart, things might get rather uncomfortable indeed for his voting base.

    --
    Two of my imaginary friends reproduced once ... with negative results.
  58. National Solitude by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Your whole argument is based upon, "The US has to go it alone!" Well, if that is true, then every single industry is a "national security issue". Every. Single. One. Including the buggy whip industry.

    Except it isn't true, and everyone knows it. Ever heard of NORAD? How about NATO? What about the Five Eyes? Also, since this is the intersection of trade and national security, there is the UN Security Council, NAFTA, the WTO, the EU, the erstwhile TPP, and many, many more.

    What do those have in common? The Trump Administration pissing all over every one of them. Pissing off friends and screwing up reliable national security arrangements.

    So who really, is responsible for the need to go it alone? Donald Dump. He and his merry band of Deplorables have conveniently created a need to go it alone in the world, so every industry is now a national security industry.

    "The Shoe Lace Industry has been So Unfair to America, So Unfair. But I tell you, the Gravy Train has stopped on shoe laces, I tell you that! MASLGA!!"

  59. We said that about the first round of tariffs by rsilvergun · · Score: 1

    and those went into effect. Trump has moved the overton window even further into the right. In America very few people vote consistently. About 20% in a mid term and 40% in a presidential election. About half of those people are hanging on Trump's every word. Yes, there are adults in the room, but they're terrified that overgrown toddler is going to turn on them in a primary or even a general election.

    And remember, the Republican party has very, very few people who genuinely care about the country. Even fewer than the Democrats. I think McCain was an asshat but I also think he cared about America. For most of those guys as long as their donation checks keep coming in and they can secure a cushy job after retiring they couldn't care less what happens to the country.

    --
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  60. Re:Absolutely by Nethemas+the+Great · · Score: 1

    On a side note, for those of you who are technical analysis style investors, you might notice that a most interesting chart pattern has been forming on the US inflation rate over the last few years.

    --
    Two of my imaginary friends reproduced once ... with negative results.
  61. The big takeaway from that for me by rsilvergun · · Score: 1

    was that we've doubled manufacturing while cutting the workforce by 1/3.

    --
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  62. this is probably trump's only smart move by WindBourne · · Score: 1

    Seriously, trump has screwed things up all around. This is one area, where at least he is keeping his promise to address this. W/O promised that they would get China to honor their treaties and WTO as well, but did nothing.

    --
    I prefer the "u" in honour as it seems to be missing these days.
    1. Re:this is probably trump's only smart move by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Except Trump is the one going outside the Treaty and wants to leave the WTO so he can go even further.

      Where has China gone against it?

    2. Re:this is probably trump's only smart move by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Trump dosn't like China so he puts up tariffs against everyone?

      Trump wants out of the WTO, but thats the one place he can go to target tariffs against China...

      Clearly he's a stable genious.

    3. Re:this is probably trump's only smart move by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Isn't Trump the one here actually violating WTO rules?

    4. Re: this is probably trump's only smart move by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Don't bother windbourne with facts, he ain't got time.

  63. Re:Should be getting better soon by ClickOnThis · · Score: 1

    Wages have been slow to adjust, but a recent report shows wage growth(*) at 2.9% last month (monthly increase, annualized for a year), which is higher than inflation. Unemployment is at about 2.9% and steady.

    (*)Yes, Breitbart.com, which always lies and never tells the truth and are a bunch of poo-poo heads that should be banned. Now dispute the actual numbers and the government report like an adult, or GTFO.

    You know, like a stopped clock, Breitbart just might be right now and then. And in this case, it appears they are.

    But I mean, c'mon. Breitbart? Their reputation is well-known. If you want to be taken seriously, provide some links to other sources, assuming you read any.

    Don't forget that the economy, from the point of view of the *people*, only started to get better about October of last year. Looking at the DJIA (or other leading indicators) shows we were out of the woods and back to health in 2013.

    Repeat after me:

    The stock market is not the economy. The economy is not the stock market.
    The stock market is not the economy. The economy is not the stock market.
    The stock market is not the economy. The economy is not the stock market.
    [...]

    --
    If it weren't for deadlines, nothing would be late.
  64. High taxing Republicans by Gimric · · Score: 1

    Tariffs are a regressive tax on US consumers, so the Republicans have cut taxes for the wealthy, and are about to increase the tax burden of everyone else. Got it.

    1. Re:High taxing Republicans by meglon · · Score: 1

      They've been doing that for the last 38 years.

      --
      Fascism: An authoritarian and nationalistic right-wing system of government and social organization. See also: NAZI's
  65. OKIE LOVES TO SUCK PUTIN'S COCK by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Listen to this blathering traitor wedge his head in Putin's asshole as if the orange traitor is responsible for any actual long-term growth! What a fucking FAGGOT you are Okie lol.

  66. Cuz u do it by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Because your side does it all the fucking time as well. Good for the goose, good for the gander, amirite? Furthermore, since you don't like the content of the message, you dismiss it as propaganda, but unlike propaganda, you can verify all the claims Oliver makes. The bullshit that your Breitbarts and World News Daily types spew out is simply made up, ergo propaganda.

    Now kindly fuck off.

    1. Re:Cuz u do it by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You started it!

  67. Citizens of world hegemon afraid of developing nat by poity · · Score: 0

    Members of a stable domestically reliant economy is afraid of an export reliant economy. LOL these comments.

    American1: "China has been taking advantage of us"
    American2: "Let's fight back while we have the muscles"
    American1: "Oh no no I'm too scared what if he punches me on the arm?"

    --
    your thin skin doesn't make me a troll
  68. The Communications Over Various Feeds Electroni by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    The Communications Over Various Feeds Electronically for Engagement Act (COVFEFE Act) is a bill introduced into the United States House of Representatives in 2017, during the 115th United States Congress.

    The bill would amend the Presidential Records Act to preserve Twitter posts and other social media interactions of the president of the United States, and to require the National Archives to store such items.[1][2]

    1. Re:The Communications Over Various Feeds Electroni by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      fuck off ivan

  69. It's not about trade by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Trade is just one of the tools in the new Cold War with China. The entire civilized world is waking up to the reality of how dangerous China could be with a new Mao, effectively emperor for life. Everyone hoped China would develop into a better place, but it just got worse. The criminals in charge became even more powerful and tightened their grip. It's not just the US taking this position. Every developed country is now working to defend against Chinese influence and economic growth. Personally, I hope Xi shows his true face and their entire economy collapses. The only way for China to get better is for things to get much worse first, clearing out the old princelings and their criminal offspring. Imagine the economic growth of the US and EU with high-tech manufacturing moving back home - it would be a new industrial revolution.

  70. Trade deficits not bad for SOME people by Kludge · · Score: 1

    But trade deficits aren't inherently bad... a trade deficit in the right circumstances can be very good...

    for some people.
    A trade deficit with China is very good for the people of China who get jobs from making goods. The trade deficit is very good for corporations and wealthy Americans who take those goods and sell them to Americans.
    However, the trade deficit is very bad for average Americans who get neither of those advantages.

  71. The threat on companies says it all. by WindBourne · · Score: 1

    China has already put major tariffs on all imports from America. Now they are threatening the American companies that operate there. Right there, is the reason why America, and even the entire west, should pull out of China. Yes, China is 1/6 of the population, but far better to work with other nations and bring them up than to go down this route.

    --
    I prefer the "u" in honour as it seems to be missing these days.
    1. Re:The threat on companies says it all. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Now they are threatening the American companies that operate there.

      I wonder why...

      Are you really too stupid to understand?

      You know at macro scales time isn't reversible.

    2. Re:The threat on companies says it all. by meglon · · Score: 1

      China has already put major tariffs on all imports from America.

      .... in response to Trumps trade war....

      Now they are threatening the American companies that operate there.

      .... in response to Trumps trade war....

      Right there, is the reason why America, and even the entire west, should pull out of China. Yes, China is 1/6 of the population, but far better to work with other nations and bring them up than to go down this route.

      ....i don't actually have to ask if you understand how fucking stupid you are, right?

      --
      Fascism: An authoritarian and nationalistic right-wing system of government and social organization. See also: NAZI's
  72. Wrong by WindBourne · · Score: 1

    Trump should not have fucked with trade dealing with Europe, nafta, and Latin America. However, all of these nations, combined with America, japan, and South Korea, manufacturer just about everything China does. As such, we can, and should, drop Chinese imports and instead switch back. Inflation may hit a bit, but far more likely, robotics will be used.

    --
    I prefer the "u" in honour as it seems to be missing these days.
    1. Re:Wrong by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yes, we are familiar with your stance on China.
      America should follow the rules for every country but China. Single them out, build a coalition of the willing and start turning the screws.

      Just one thing before I get my pitchfork.
      How does sending all the Chinese jobs to Europe, Latin America, Japan and South Korea help America in the slightest? Because it's cutting off the biggest external market there is, (which is also one of the fastest growing ones.) A lot of pain, but where's the gain?

  73. Tax cuts! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Don't worry Trump's tax cuts will make up the difference!

  74. 25th! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    We want the 25th! Impeach! 25th! Impeach!

  75. Protectionism doesn't work by nnet · · Score: 1

    Did you forget that protectionism hadn't worked before? Did you forget the 70s?

  76. Shovel the goods through a filter country by nctritech · · Score: 1

    There's no reason China can't just shovel the goods through some other East Asian country for a smaller fee than the tariffs cost and lie about the origin of the goods. Oh, see, this was "made in Thailand" so it's not Chinese, so no tariff. The problem with a trade war like this is that if China rebadges the origin of goods and the US doesn't, the US is guaranteed to lose. They already manipulated the snot out of their currency to pilfer the US infrastructure, so it would be zero surprise if they got around the tariffs this way. Ironically, shady stuff like that is what the tariffs are supposed to punish in the first place.

  77. Trae deficit bad for Democrats by ghoul · · Score: 1

    The Trade deficit means the Chinese businessman have a ton of dollars and they use it to buy property on th coasts driving cost of living up in Democrat areas while it also means cheap stuff is available in middle America driving cost of living low in Trump country.
    Lets close the trade deficit. Than finally I will be able to buy something in the Bay Area and middle America can get off its ass and work for a living.

    --
    **Life is too short to be serious**
  78. Re:Citizens of world hegemon afraid of developing by ghoul · · Score: 1

    A bully is really a coward at heart so why does this surprise you?

    --
    **Life is too short to be serious**
  79. Common man by NewYork · · Score: 1

    From Common man perspective China is offering Inexpensive and High Quality Products;

  80. Poor little guy... by Archangel_Azazel · · Score: 1

    "And I hate to say this, but behind that is another $267 billion ready to go on short notice if I want. That totally changes the equation."

    "If I want."

    Not if it makes sense. Not if it's in our best interest. Trumplethinskin just wants everyone to know how big and bad he is. Poor guy :(

    --
    Your mind is like a parachute. It works best when it's been opened.
  81. Look everyone racist APK is on full display by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Look everyone racist antisemite Alexander Peter Kowalski is still raging hard from getting his ass destroyed this week. Face it he is a loser who can't ever produce actual support so instead, like a fucking retard, will just repeat the same statements that have been shown to be false near countless times. Even APK's own mother can't stand him and she fled to poland leaving him the half of the duplex that she owned and he lived in the basement of. Now she is happily living out her retirement dream of not having to care for her retarded man child of a son. Alexander Peter Kowalski however ist still in that dumpy duplex and at age 54 has a roommate so that he can afford to pay the bills and eat. Someday his parents may stop regretting not aborting him but that grows ever more unlikely as his unending failures continue.

  82. Retard Alexander Peter Kowalski says retarded shit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    What the fuck is this retarded failure talking about? He must be really fucking mad that people keep exposign him for the retard, antisemite, racist, and failure he actually is. Alexander Peter Kowalski is just a weak little man who is washed up and never amounted to anything. I see his retarded ass also keep repeating the lie that the chines copied him and he has as his only proof some wild speculation on his part that he implemented a stupid simplistic obvious idea before the Chinese did. What he fails to understand is that it what he did was simplistic and obvious so it is much more likely that the Chinese came up with the same stupid simplistic obvious idea than copied it from a washed up has been nobody spammer who lived in his mother's basement until she fled to get away from him leaving him the half of the dumpy duplex they inhabited.