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D&D Movie on The Way
A lot of people have been sending the story at Wired about Dungeons and Dragons, the movie. There's a strong emphasis on how the movie will be based on the rules systems, which seems strange to me. I'm not sure how to visually represent a number system for people - but we'll see. It should be out in October of 2000.
Actually, elves are only taller than humans in the Dark Sun campaigns... in the regular D&D worlds, a male elf averages between 5'0" and 5'5".
01101100 01101001 01101110 01110101 01111000 01110010 01110101 01101100 01100101 01110011
While maybe the concept sounds good... I'm just afraid it will turn out to be some uber-campy mess... But then again, I tend to think that I have repressed bad memories about the dern cartoon.
I'm also of the herd that beleives a Forgotten Realms/Dragonlance movie would be good... I mean why not use some of the uber-Matrix-effects on creating the charector Drizzt Do-Urden from the realms???
Hrmmm Methinks we should have another Slashdot Poll... Does Anyone here still play AD&D or D7D alot?
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I'm to lazy to spllcheck
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http://thepoliticalgeek.com/blog/ Politics for Geeks.
these kinds of things always make me giggle. mostly because the big AD&D player in MY family was always my little brother - the same one that's in his second year as a Christian Ed. major. for that matter, he's also the one who plays all the "kill 'em 'n' nuke 'em" video games and listens to Metallica. it's just too bad that so many people equate Christian with being close-minded...
A few replies saying in essence "your GM wasn't creative enough, etc." Sorry folks. I've been GMing for twenty years in a dozen systems. The only way to get a halfway plausible, realistic or internally consistant D&D game is to ignore some of the rules, add your own, or both. This is no big deal, every halfway bright GM does that in any system. However, the story was about a movie intending to "follow the rules". I was just pointing out that if they follow the rules too closely they'll be destroying realism.
Let's put it another way. What possible difference should it make what rules they use, or whether they use any rules at all? Take the same story line, characters, etc., but film it twice, once using D&D rules and once using RM (or RQ or anything else) rules. What kind of difference would you see? If the producers tried to stick with any sort of plausibility, there should be ZERO differences.
A Government Is a Body of People, Usually Notably Ungoverned
As for 3rd Ed., it sounds a hell of a lot like WotC is just changing stuff in order to make it just different enough to get people to buy a new Ed.
I mean, who wants to play a game where idiot PC's can have a Halfling Paladin/Mage/Psionicist?
I don't. :)
2nd Ed is good enough for me thank you very much
_______________________ I am the eggman, wooo! _______________________
Moslems, in my mind, are very often the most violent, evil people around (I'm going on the numbers here, I'd wager that almost all of the Middle Eastern terrorists aare Moslem).
Jews, in my mind, are very often the richest people around (I'm going on the numbers here, I'd wager that a lot have money).
It's amazing the sort of intolerance some people have. Somehow Christians are the worst people around in the minds of several of the inhabits of /. for some reason.
Any other group, and you'd have screams, shouts and lawsuits.
If you want to know how that got started, there is an excellent report at The Gamer's Realm. I highly recommend this to anyone who was told that D&D was "evil" or "satanic" in their youth.
BTW Patricia Pulling died earlier this year IIRC.
I read the internet for the articles.
Marlon Wayans is going to be in the movie, this is just how I pictured D&D! Looks like they are following the rules of political correctness.
After all, all D&D players are Satanists or so the radical religious zealots would have us believe. I wonder what these same folks think of Unix and Linux with it's spawning daemons, zombies, magic cookies, and the like? I wonder myself; but then I stop because I figure that the thing is, a lot of those zealots out there don't know enough about Unix and linux to know that there _are_ daemons, cookies, etc, etc...
There are lots of Christians out there who _would_ love to see a movie like this, (re: me), and I'm all for that magic and stuff. I don't believe it's real, but I enjoy imagining it so. I realize this'll also probably get rated Flamebait, but, so be it.. it's a dirty job, but somebody's gotta do it.
Insert mind here.
It will be called ... Judge DM!
Reporter: Today on Judge DM, Male Human Figher Hack is suing Female Dwarf Elf Slash Dott for failing to act on her alignment. Mage will be Slash's defending rules lawyer.
[...]
Slash: I want the roll!
DM: You can't handle the role!
I do have the Silmarillion handy, and *nowhere* does it mention pointy ears, and the elves certainly did *not* interbreed with man. There were only two - Luthien and Arwen.
CAUSE CHRISTIANS SUCK!! HAHA!
Richard O'Brian and Tom Baker!! WOOHOO! :)
I cant wait to see this one! It doesnt matter to me if its cheesy or not... But then again, im a Rocky Horror fan and Tom Baker is my favorite doctor, so my judgement may be tainted somewhat O:)
Check out my homepage at ralph.cx
Cybie! aka Ralph Bonnell
Elf stature is based on the setting, not the game system. Therefore you find elves of different heights depending on which fantasy world you, ahem, "visit."
Elves from Tolkein's Middle Earth are tall and wiry, and never need sleep.
Elves from TSR's Greyhawk (the orignal setting) and Forgotten Realms are short, about 4-1/2 to 5 feet.
The setting for the movie doesn't appear to be established, although it's TSR's policy that if you use the rules and don't explicitly declare otherwise, then you're playing in Greyhawk.
I can see the fnords!
I LOVE me some D&D. I think all gamers have sat around and wondered about what a movie like this would be like. What actors to play the parts and what not.. I think this guy has to have had a HEINOUS campaign going on to extract a movie from it. The fun of the game comes from, IMHO, the players, and the roleplaying. To many get wrapped up in stats and dice-rolling. If they can just keep the "numbers" on the back burner, then they should do alright. Hey ..at least they'll prolly get their money back on the film. I'm definately going to see it. I'm damn curious...
;)
Now if ILM would jump on getting a GraphicsFest movie like Dragonlance.....man.. =]
By the way.......Save vs. Death
you never lose in ure razorblade shoes......Beck-Hotwax
1) Elves are short in AD&D, being 55 (male) or 50 (female) plus 1d10 inches tall. That gives a max height of 65 inches, which is 5'5". Humans have a max height of 6'8", while Dwarves have a max height of 4'5". Seven-foot Elves are from J.R.R. Tolkien, not AD&D.
2) They certainly aren't using AD&D 2nd Edition dragons. As both 2nd Edition red and gold dragons are immune to fire, but gold dragons have a poison gas breath weapon as well, any red-gold fight between dragons of anywhere near the same size results in a scratched gold and a dead red. Furthermore, the golds have systematically chosen spells while the reds have fewer and haphazardly acquired spells, so that isn't an effective equalizer.
In short, any massive duel between a group of Gold and Red 2nd Edtiton dragons is a rout for the golds unless massively outnumbered to start with. So these are old-D&D, 1st Edition AD&D dragons, or possibly 3rd Edition (A)D&D dragons.
What about Clue? That was a movie based on a board game. It was actually really funny and quite innovative (The triple ending scene. Which always gets shortened when it's on cable. Bastards).
Anyway someone else mentioned that fantasy doesn't exactly translate well into movies. I have to agree with this (Look at Willow, UGH!), but I think that the guy making this movie has his shit wired tight. Or at least it sounds like that from the article. Basically what I saying is that I have some hope
Sorry if this is a dupe post. Getting timeouts.
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and a conjurer of conjugation, with a million hit points and maximum charisma.
-Martin Prince (Simpsons, seemed appropriate)
Pete
The sole purpose of the Internet is to get porn and bomb making plans into the hands of children.
ok, ok you got me on that one... My first boxed set was from 1981. (Typing before thinking strikes again)
I received the original little wirebound books as a present from a friend, they might be a reprint, but I got those around the same time.. but I would like to know if anyone has any info about the original book set, I believe there were 3?????
Meanwhile I'll root around in my attic to find all of the modules etc... Nothing better to do this winter than get my "library of the arcane" back in order. Not only that my 10 year old Nephew is showing a shine to RPG's mayhaps I'll show him how us "old-schoolers" did it
-- Life: Hate the Game... Love the cereal
For more on the Lord of the Rings movie, go here.
How do you pull an interesting plot out of a Drag & Drop protocol? :-)
* And remember, it's spelled N-e-t-s-c-a-p-e, but it's pronounced "Mozilla."
What about Clue?
Doh...forget about that. That worked well, but mostly because it didn't take itself seriously, imho. Fantasy based works tend to take themselves very seriously - something which (again, imho) does a nice job of scaring non-geek types away.
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that should read "Doh...forgot about that." I really should use that preview button more often...
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it doesnt matter weither thier ears are pointed or how tall they are.... no elf is anywhere as good as a dwarf... dwarves are the master race. the eppitiomy of evolution... besides beer is better than wine anyday
Maybe I'll see my favorite kick ass ranger in this flick. You know who I'm talking about.
www.alphalinux.org
It is amazing that it has taken this long, and maybe a good thing for a movie to come out. Will always remember the cartoon on Saturday mornings, and playing the two versions of D&D for the intellivision, and of course the role playing game......Hope they do it justice.......
Funny and I thought Perl == Paid employment recently located
I think that the movie should be based on one of the Dragonlance novels, not on the game, it would make a lot more sense. Of course, for all I know, that's what they are actually doing.
Of course, for me, the best D&D movie will always be Army of Darkness. There's a movie that captures the spirit of actually playing D&D, I think. Though I like the serious, dramatic stuff in the Dragonlance novels, it's not like playing real D&D and having your party-mates try to feed you to a gelatonous cube because you're the weakest character (and thus can fight back the least) and they hope it'll distract the cube long enough for them to escape. Sigh... I miss those good times....
Hmm... if their making a movie like that, that could be cool, too. I don't have high hopes for the movie though.
All the creatures will die, And all the things will be broken. That's the law of samurai. (Jubai, 1605)
As long as the Cavalier doesn't just carry around a magic shield and whine a lot, I'll be a happy camper. :)
Why couldn't he just pick up a sword? Jesus Man!
I wear pants.
Like most (all?) other mentions of D&D, there was no mention here of Dave Arneson. Remember him? :-)
He was the co-author of the original three D&D books. And Blackmoor, which I thought was a waste
of $5...
The story I heard was that Gygax was a major prick and cheated Arneson, then changed the name to AD&D.
Then, of course, he published the monster handbook, player handbook, and the DM guide. Does
anyone remember what REALLY happened back then?
(Yes, I remember Hargrave, too
A dingo ate my sig...
EXCELLENT!
---
Bill Woessner
National Instruments
Quantum linguistics: Until you looked, this message was in Spanish.
I think the rational for making Dwarves and Elves classes in the blue book was to simplify things. Dwarves and Elves, I guess, just had the same basic abilities all the time, rather than being a factor which would work into modifying character classes abilities. I don't know how they worked in the upper level D&D books because I only got the blue book (and later the red book sets after my brother wrote all over my blue book) and then moved straight into the AD&D books with the cool, demonic looking covers (that was before TSR became PC). I remember being infuriated when people would say that it was a devil on the cover of the Dungeon Masters guide, and I would exasperatedly try to explain to them it was an Efreet ("Look, see, there's the City of Brass on the back cover.") but no one would ever listen....
Actually, I think the girl the Efreet was holding was wearing one of those and +5(AC 0) Chainmail Bikini's of Cleavage you were talking about...
All the creatures will die, And all the things will be broken. That's the law of samurai. (Jubai, 1605)
(Personally, my favourite AD&D memories were of seriously strange things. I came up with Duodimension Others, which turns anything two dimensional. I had a pad of A4 boulders, which came in handy, especially with antimagical creatures. Another fond memory was the pump-action Wand of Wonder, with an automatic setting.)
It's a small world and it smells funny; I'd buy another if it wasn't for the money; Take back what I paid (SoM)
80s culture revival is already here. Or perhaps I'm so engulfed in "underground" culture I've lost perspective of the world from the average person's perspective.
I can drop some band names that are considered the "new New Wave" and what not.
As far as movies, there's been quite a few. Fantasy movies were actually kind of an 80s thing (Dark Crystal, The Labyrinth, brain fart (two I'm thinking of were recently on the Sci-Fi channel), etc. and fantasy horror like Hell Raiser, A Nightmare on Elm Street, etc.)...although the stories can be rooted in times before the 80s (usually not based on actual stories, but themes, plots, and characters of similar historical originas.)
I don't see a revival of 80s-likeTV shows...since I don't see how that can be done. Unless it's purely nostalgicish, like that 70s show. The 70s revival was actually a few years ago...luckily the show turned out to be pretty good (I HATE popular 70s culture, but I really like this show.)
Old video game systems and games are also being (and have been) collected. Not sure how high the demand will get, doubt very high even if 80s "revival" became huge.
I read about this in my newspaper this morning, and kinda thought it was odd having a 6-foot 4-inch tall elf King|Lord|Baron|Leader|whatever...but it'd be nice if they made this movie the way that the X-Files movie and the Star Trek movies were made...so you can watch it even if you don't have much knowledge of the game (or, in the X-Files/Star Trek case, the TV series). I think that a well-done mass appeal would be great, but I won't hold my breath.
**(this may be a duplicate post, since it timed-out, then I had to go back and hit submit again..sorry)
Dan
I'm agnostic/atheist (don't want to get into explaining my stance there), but I think your anger/distrust is aimed at the wrong target. Although I'm no fan of organized religion whatsoever, that's NOT what should be one's concern. Having the world full of mindless, complacent atheists, isn't going to make it any better.
I don't know if one can blame the religion on EVERY bad thing a Christian or group has participated in...it's often their own outside desires, possibly having no relation to their religious beliefs, possibly they try to justify it with a passage or two from the Bible. But it's not usually the case of a person completly changing their minds based on what the yare told in the Bible...the Bible can be used for justification in many areas because of it's vagueness, and often poor translations (and biased/prejudiced authors).
(Personally, my favourite AD&D memories were of seriously strange things. I came up with Duodimension Others, which turns anything two dimensional. I had a pad of A4 boulders, which came in handy, especially with antimagical creatures. Another fond memory was the pump-action Wand of Wonder, with an automatic setting. Lastly, there was the modified Unseen Servent, which could cast 3 spells a day - one to generate another Unseen Servent, one to Create Tower, and one to Create Astral Gateway. Anyone spell "Infinite Loop"?)
It's a small world and it smells funny; I'd buy another if it wasn't for the money; Take back what I paid (SoM)
Being a former AD&D player, I think this movie could have potential, especially with the latest special effects out now. However, what I'm afraid of is even if they try to stay true to the D&D rules, it may not come out as many hardcore D&D fans expect.
I will definitely see this movie when it comes out, but I will expect the worst. Bad acting, actors non-fitting to the movie, and worst of all, changes from the actual books that will make this movie a flop.
Every movie to date (that I can recall) where a director takes an idea from book and make it a movie is not true to the book. I feel bad to say that I believe this movie will only be a slew of eyecandy and nothing more.
They should've made this movie a couple years ago, when I still played AD&D. I would've had more appreciation for this idea.
Does anyone else have a bad feeling about this?
I like AD&D and fantasy novels primarily because they allow me to use my imagination. While I was blown away by the Matrix, I don't think this film will have the same effect. I'd imagine that my concept of a transforming or protecting type spell is quite different from the film makers.
When I used to play D&D, what mattered to me was that it was part of a greater social context, not a "who can cast the best spell" kind of thing. I wonder whether the film will be able to capture the interaction between the characters that made playing so much fun.
Post-Matrix... I hope the director doesn't go for a wachowski (sp?) clone. While a full on acrobatic/martial arts fantasy battle would be cool, it could so easily look very, very cheesy. And remember, we're going to be inundated by Matrix clones over the next year or so. (I have a bad feeling about X-Men degenerating into something like this)
Ah well, I hope the director really surprises me. Deep down I want this film to make me drool like a 1 month old baby...
----- Documentation is worth it just to be able to answer all your mail with 'RTFM' - Alan Cox.
Hey! As a "fantasy" film, Mortal Kombat doesn't rank. But as entertainment? Good sound track. Good choreography. More plot than a Bruce Lee film, or at least not so many or so long dull/boring spots. Plot? Thin, but I've seen far far worse. Acting? Not top rank, but not as bad as its reputation's become. Compare the acting with many popular prime time shows (Space'1999 comes to mind -- ouch), even Shatner's been knocked about -- not StarTrek, try TJ Hooker. Even StarTrek:NextGeneration had a hideously horrible 1st season. It wasn't until AB -- After Beard -- that the writing finally picked up. I'm not saying Mortal Kombat is a great film of the ages. But it was certainly entertaining. Not as good as Sixth Sense, or Unforgiven, or The Matrix, but quite enjoyable. WARNING: This only holds true for Mortal Kombat. Viewers of Mortal Kombat 2 may experience nausea, abdominal cramps, dizziness or an urge to choke the living sh*t out of a Hollywood studio producer. MK2 should only be shown to Highlander 2: The Sickening viewers, as a way to wean the viewer from utter dreck to partial dreck, as a 1st step on the road to recovery, sanity and healthy film watching. You have been warned...
OK, I'm now entering Valhalla.... :) :) :)) :))
First I hear about Z80 processors making a "comeback" which makes me pine over the lost days of yore playing Zork,
Then for my BDay I get Baldur's Gate... excellent
Then I hear about Middle-Earth going to produce an online Game based on M.E.R.P. just getting better
Then I hear the Followup regarding a Movie about LoTR WOW!, can this get any better???
Yes It Does... This Movie should prove to be an Excellent waste of time/money for me (note.. use of the word Excellent is deliberately being overused to show what a child of the 80's I am
Now I guess It's time to dust off the costumes and dice, get ahold of the old gang, do a massive campaigning weekend.
Oh can it be any better for an old Gamer/Geek
(BTW I STILL have my 1st edition Greyhawk and Blackmoor books from 1981...Not to mention a bunch of other books... Now If I can only find them
Happy Happy
Joy,Joy
-- Life: Hate the Game... Love the cereal
Of course, they could just be going with the 6-second combat round from the Player's Option books.
Also, higher level fighters get more than one attack per round :P
Of course, they could just be going with the 6-second combat round from the Player's Option books. :P
Now wait a sec. Noldor elves *do* have pointy ears, as do dark elves.
(Anyone have the Silmarillian handy to back me up, here??)
IIRC, the high elves (Firstborn, Noldor, whathaveyou) were given stature, robustness, and, yes, pointy ears. Feanor and his house had them, however, after the (dammit! What was the official name for it?!?) kinstrife, these qualities were lost as his tribe interbred with Man.
Ug. Time to re-read Tolkien again (for the bazillionth time).
censorship is a form of noise, which actively seeks to drown out content with silence - Crash Culligan
So, will they be incorporating the crit hit tables as well? And the 10d6 max fireball damage that any decent 8-9th level Fighter can shrug off?
I will admit, this is an interesting tidbit considering that Hasbro(?) purchased WotC who, in turn, owns D&D.
Weird.
-Vel
P.S. New Tolkien movie on the way too...
Oh, was that you? Sorry about that, but don't steal gold from a fighter mage with eyes that change color ;-)
Bad things often happen to good people,
It is up to them to see that they remain good.
TSR was bought by WotC, which in turn was recently bought by Hasbro, inc.
Hasbro is the Proctor and Gamble of gaming. I just can't wait for D&D Monopoly.
+&x
After all, all D&D players are Satanists or so the radical religious zealots would have us believe. I wonder what these same folks think of Unix and Linux with it's spawning daemons, zombies, magic cookies, and the like?
"There is no surer way to ruin a good discussion than to contaminate it with the facts."
Some anonymous coward dun said about Deedlit an' Pirotess:
It's funny you should mention Record of Lodoss War in relation to this thread. :)
Not many people know the anime "Record of Lodoss War" is actually based off of a Japanese RPG of the same name. So the story goes, the creator of the game spent some time overseas in the States and was introduced to one of the early versions of Dungeons and Dragons; he enjoyed it so much that when he went back to Japan he created a fantasy roleplaying game that was roughly based on D&D (enough is different TSR/WoTC/Hasbro/whatever won't be suing them anytime soon--if they did, they'd also have to sue FASA for Earthdawn :).
Apparently the Lodoss War game became quite popular in Japan, seeing as it was the first pencil-and-paper RPG sold there...obviously popular enough that several anime series have been done off it.
So, then, Record of Lodoss War is, in a roundabout way, a Dungeons and Dragons anime. :)
-Windigo The Feral (NYAR!)
Frater219 dun said:
*chuckle* What's funny...nearly everyone I game with (I'll state now my gaming circle tends to be comprised entirely of otaku; those of us who have seen Vision of Escaflowne are very hard at work addicting those few of us who haven't :) is quite convinced that Slayers in general is based off someone's D&D or Lodoss War game that went terribly, terribly wrong. :) (Yes, I mention the latter because Record of Lodoss War was based off a Japanese roleplaying game of the same name that was directly inspired by D&D. See previous post. :)
We are especially inclined to think Slayers is based off of D&D/Lodoss games gone horribly wrong because, for some reason, EVERY roleplay game we're in--especially D&D or anything involving human and/or elven mages--WILL eventually devolve into something bearing a remarkable resemblance to a Slayers episode. (Example--in a Shadowrun game I am in, one of the mages cast Accident to cause a delay for us to get to someone we were supposed to capture...the Accident spell ended up causing an airplane to crash into a bus full of nuns and schoolchildren, causing a traffic jam that pretty much caused all traffic in Tacoma to stop...I am not mentioning the name of the mage who did this, because the person who played her WILL probably hunt me down and kill me. :)
The Slayers reference is also especially funny to me for another reason. My husband was creating a half-elven paladin for a D&D game we're in...he was planning to base the character off Folken in Escaflowne (for those who have not yet seen it--and you are poor, poor, POOR deprived children and must correct this Right Now, and no, you don't have to hunt for fandubs; you can go right down the local Suncoast or Anime Nation and get it--Folken is a rather dark badass).
He rolls the dice. What he ended up with bears FAR, FAR more of a resemblance to none other than Gourry Gabriev (blonde, strong as an ox, and has the rough Int of an ox too...Str: 25. Int: 9). :)
I guess it could've been worse, though...he could've ended up with Dilandau... :)
-Windigo The Feral (NYAR!)
Hey... I got laid more in my teens than I do now. *sigh*
Actually, my first two girlfriends were both D&D players. The first introduced me to the game, then left for college. I met the second some time thereafter when she joined our group.
Ah, memories...
--
A host is a host from coast to coast...
A host is a host from coast to coast...
Unless it's down, or slow, or fails to POST!
This thing sounds like it may be an attempt to rip off the LotR movie. To me at least, the party looks a lot like the LotR crew, with a couple of omissions and substitutions.
Let's see...
Let's leave off Merry and Pippin (just so the rip-off won't be blatantly obvious). Replace the remaining hobbits with thieves (since thar ain't no hobbits in D&D).
We have:
Two thieves: standing in for the hobbits Frodo and Samwise.
One mage: Gandalf.
One elf: Legolas.
One dwarf: Gimli.
One ranger: Aragorn.
Sound familiar?
I'm willing to bet the Lord of the Rings movie will be better, but I'll probably go to see this one anyway -- if for no other reason than to take part in the ensuing geekfest.
Hrm, I think The 13th Warrior looks pretty good. Michael Crichton, despite spending too long on the played out ER, is a frist rate director.
Then there's The Lord Of The Rings Movie comming out god knows when, but it looks excellent. According to Imladris They are considering casting Uma Thurman as Eowyn and Cate Blanchett as Galadriel (yummy).
I think we'll start seeing high quality Fantasy Movies due to the successes of syndicated TV shows such as Xena... What has been missing in the past was high quality CGI and money. You need the computer generated images for the special effects, and the money to spend on A Movie actors and directors.
...and I had all four sets of Basic series books, although I seem to remember the Master and Immortal sets being more important for campaigning (But the concept of a planet as an NPC class was awesome).
:)
I suppose they did simplify, but that's missing a huge point: the different races have civilizations of their own, hence their own classes,etc...but it leads me to one more thing I'd like to see in an AD&D movie:
A dwarven thief fumbling around trying to pick a lock.
_____________________
Tolkien on the other hand had no such balance issues to contend with, as he was not creating a game but a fictional universe :)
So TSR didn't want to go ahead with anything but a quality product! HA! HA! HA!
.. "oh you do that game like they show in the cartoons on Saturday morning Kids Hour. grin."
Obviously they weren't thinking of quality product when they authorised that D&D cartoon a few years ago.
As a role-game-player all I ever got was
--- This meme is memory intensive
Grunts, by M Gentley
would make a funny movie too. features such gems as: They're not history, they're FIELDRATIONS!
//rdj
No one can understand the truth until he drinks of coffee's frothy goodness.
--Sheikh Abd-Al-Kadir, 1587
But not before marriage.
No one can understand the truth until he drinks of coffee's frothy goodness.
--Sheikh Abd-Al-Kadir, 1587
This is just great...when the movie comes out, I am sure that since there will a large number of "geeks" at the movie, I am confident that there will be people there to monitor our reactions for some evil purpose. I advise everyone to boycot this movie or at least not to see it untill you can grab it off the net. The same thing happened at the opening day of TPM, but everyone called me paranoid! Ha!
...that they will stay true to the game's background and not make stuff up like what happened to the now-deceased Kindred:The Embraced 90210-spoof.
Apathy is a lesser known virtue.
While I think a movie that is well done may be cool, I see little if any point to actually doing a movie on this. Syndicated Television has been inundated with hour-long action / adventure shows with a band of adventurers in a fantasy setting. :)
Hercules, Xena, Sinbad, Robin Hood, Conan, heck, even Mystic Warriors of Tyr-na-Nog. All of these shows have reasonable special effects, though the acting and plots may occasionally leave something to be desired. But that's to be expected...it is syndicated TV after all
Anyways, the above shows have been in the public's eye for quite some time, and the D&D movie will need to compete against those preconcieved ideas. So they are either going to have to bust out the special effects in ways that we haven't seen before (and we've seen a lot of beasties on TV) or make the story that much more epic and sweeping (more along the lines of Braveheart).
My biggest concern is this: with a few exceptions, most of the TSR D&D novels have been the fantasy equivalent of a Harleguin romance or Mack Bolan: Executioner book: quick, formulaic pablum. Anything that they put out is really goiong to have to fight against this tendency to get over with the general movie-going public.
I think Hasbro -> WotC -> TSR might be better served by going the episodic TV route as well. A rotating cast of characters, with interweaving plot-lines, may actually serve them well in the long run.
--sugarman--
Then there's the D&D Tolkienian treatment, which is based on an amalgamation of "the Hobbit", "the Lord of the Rings" and a jumble of greek and norse mythologies. Anything the D&D writers couldn't figure out (like elf heights or actual lifespans, since they apparently skipped "the Silmarillion") they simply made up based on their imaginations.
The result is a good game that's inspired countless computer/console clones, but I have serious doubts as to how well it'll survive a big-screen treatment. Good games make for terrible drama. (I didn't care at all for the whole Dragonlance series..ick) I'm afraid it'll wind up looking like a sorry parody of "the Lord of the Rings".
But hopefully we're behind that whole "D&D is the work of satan!" hysteria, inspired in part by "60 Minutes" hack journalism.
Ita erat quando hic adveni.
I personally think it'd be really neat to have a movie that's different. Otherwise, we could just go watch Conan again or something.
:)
Imagine if the characters all had little HP meters floating beside them....
Actually, this is starting to remind me of this TV show I saw a while ago with fake Mortal Kombat-esque fighting where the fighters actually did have HP bars at the top of the TV screen. Forget what it was called.
So when do they make the film version of Bored of the Rings? :->
Semi-seriously though, this is a work dying to have Terry Gilliam direct it!
"Scoff not at the Great White Wizard, for I have many powers! Here, pick a card, any card..."
- Goodgulf Greyteeth
I would be that you're a programmer now, right? If not you should be, that kind of attention to detail is what makes great software.
:-)
LOL Actually an embedded systems designer, so yeah I guess programming is part of the job.
Wow...they can do a series of movies for each of:
Dragon Lance
Forgotten Realms
Ravenloft
Dark Sun
-generic ad&d-
They could even use Dungeon Master magazine scenerios to make a tv show out of. Cool.
It's 10 PM. Do you know if you're un-American?
The DM makes the final decision on those things. A DM may very well decide that a theif will not progress significantly without experience pickpocketing. Some of the things you list do make sense. A more experienced soldier probably could fall from a greater height without dying than an unexperienced one, although this should probably have more to do with dexterity, not experience. I would say robin hood was more of a fighter who stole, than a theif. He didn't go around picking pockets for a living.
Some things are really flawed. Like the magic system. And abilities not improving. And humans only being able to be one class at a time.
It's 10 PM. Do you know if you're un-American?
Quite frankly...the Good Reverend makes a fine point. Most of the war mongers that run the armed forces in the US are indeed christians. So....how's that bashing anybody? Besides, in anyone deserves a little persecution...I'd wager it's the Xtians. Bring on the apocalypse...MF!
Don't forget the first step
TSR squeezes out Gary Gygax.
It's funny, being an European I use the metric system and I thought that 6' was too short for an Elf (I was basing their usual height on Tolkien) and that was because that actor was too short that he was standing up when in fact it was because he was too tall. Funny isn't it?
How much meters does 6' do? 1,90 or something like that?
"The obvious mathematical breakthrough would be development of an easy way to factor large prime numbers." Bill Gates,
I have to agree with this (Look at Willow, UGH!)
What was wrong with Willow?
I may be wrong on this (If I was at home with my trusty bookshelf of AD&D manuals within reach, I could confirm...) but I think the big confusion over the height of elves in the D&D universe is that in the Forgotten Realms and Dragonlance worlds (made by TSR, based off of D&D), Elves are as tall or taller than humans. Yet in the original D&D manuals and books (as well as the AD&D rulebooks, I imagine) they list elven height as being generally much shorter than humans.
A lot of readers of "D&D fiction" , ie, Dragonlance and FR (yes, there are more worlds than that, but they are the most popular 2 D&D universes) think of the elves from these works of fiction (and the numerous and beautiful artwork that can be found for them) when they think of elves.
I'm pretty sure thats where the confusion over the height of elves comes in. Does anyone have any manuals handy they can check out to confirm? (I'll have to investigate after my workday ends.....)
And I dont know about other AD&D fans, but I'm really looking forward to seeing the AD&D 3rd edition rulebooks comeout, I'm interested to see how they revise the rules-sets this time around. Especially since NeverWinter Nights will be using this ruleset.
--
Chris Warden
Do not meddle in the affairs of Wizards for you are Crunchy and taste good with Ketchup.
Uhhh...no. Elves are short...about 4-5 feet tall on average.
The feel of a typical D&D game is different from most other fantasy games, and very different from any fantasy books published before 1980. Think about how magic items are used and how some classes are limited in which ones they can use and even carry. Can you think of a way to realistically portray the initiative system in a movie? (You're surprised - for 10 seconds you do absolutely nothing while this guy runs up to you and hits you and (rolling a 1 for damage) nicks you on the pinky.) (Is it 10 seconds? How long is a round, anyway?)
Things I would like to see portrayed in a movie:
10. Portable hole
9. Hammer of Thunderbolts (with a Gauntlet and Girdle)
8. Sphere of Annihilation
7. Hand and Eye of Vecna
6. Any of the Cthulhu mythos gods from the original 'Deities and Demigods'
5. A 17th level monk falling 1 mile and taking no damage (I meant to do that!)
4. Prismatic Sphere
3. Vecna coming back for his missing parts
2. Breaking a Staff of the Magi in half
1. Two Words: Meteor Swarm
This could be really cool. Take all the best parts from: The Sword and the Sorcerer; Hawk the Slayer; Fineous Fingers; Old Sinbad movies; Dragonslayer; Excalibur; Krull; Willow; (and many others). Mix in some of the latest special effects and you could have a really bitchin' movie.
Hope they get a good script.
If you want to see a Dungeons-&-Dragons-like show with some actual plot and no Yoda-oid floating deus-ex-machina, may I recommend the anime series Slayers?
... same thing), magic shops, trolls, dragons, dragon gods ... what else do you want? :)
Wizards, fighters, goblins, incantations, elves, demons (well, mazoku
Well now I'm Thorougly disgusted with Sierra...
First they trash "The Realm" which was my introduction to graphical online adventure gaming
I checked it out for a year, then trashed it after I heard they sold it out to WON and Conan (the lead programmer) had a bunch of problems with the new management.
(But I WAS able to get it to run on Wine)
Now this?
I used to troll through the discussion groups at middle-earth.com and thought that it was going to be a wonderful game, especially after they were taking consideration from tolkien-philes like myself to help with the game design.
Oh well, another great idea shot to shit.
At least Neverwinter Nights is still in production, and I believe they are still planning on porting it directly to Linux
At least I hope this will remain true
-- Life: Hate the Game... Love the cereal
Except for one problem: D&D doesn't have a movie to stand on that was already good. Sure, it has a crowd of roleplaying fans, but any group can tell you you need more than this. Look at Star Trek. It was having a hard time getting outside audiences (besides fans) to see the movies until the last one. And that was killing Paramount. Everyone loves Star Wars. Star Wars already had 3 very good movies behind it, so as one person said (here on /. I believe), it wouldn't matter if it was George Lucas's butt for 2 hours, it was still going to break records. This message is WAY off topic, but I just had to say something.
ap
Anyone else remember Jem? Jerrica, Kimber, Aja, Shana, Rhea, Rio, Roxy, Stormer, Pizzaz, Jetta, Mink, Rapture, and even an Eric Raymond (no relation to GNU). Now a Jem movie has more potential than a D&D movie, IMO.
great, so does this mean that the audience will become the stereotypical satan worshipping antisocial nerd, or will they become the other percentage that have ever played/involved themself with D&D which is the role of the bored player who can barely stay awake because of a lousy DM telling the story (or lousy movie telling a story...)?
Large print giveth, and the small print taketh away
Ahhh, a classic. Remember this one, with Tom Hanks as the kid who goes crazy playing D&D and runs around the subways of New York? I remember that live D&D in the fields around our school became big after that (hey, we didn't have many caves to play in, just really tall swamp grass). And who was that kid who whined about only being into computers because he wanted to write videogames? I distinctly remember walking from my room to my parents' room, where they were watching the same thing, and saying "SEE!?!"
www.HearMySoulSpeak.com
Whoah, what game have YOU been playing?! I find that most modules (these days anyway) practically over-use ambush to either give the monsters a fighting chance or an even more insane advantage (depending on party and monster strength).
So definitly scratch that part about the party always going first. Beyond this, if you're not using party initiative things can get all mixed up as foolish players get in eachother's lines of fire and areas of effect.
AD&D can get pretty damn tough if you you have the right GM and use ALL the rules (encumberance anyone?) If that's not enough, crank the difficulty up another notch by playing in Dark Sun (even though it's not printed anymore).
Of course if you're going to do these things you might as well just play Paranoia...
You've obviously never tried to properly played 'proper'. An incredible roll doesn't mean you sat there and 'took it'. It means you managed to survive by some chance of fate.. You managed to duck a behind a rock, etc..etc..
-- I'm the root of all that's evil, but you can call me cookie..
Details over at Steve Jackson Games in the December 6th, 1996 entry of the Illuminator. Perhaps one of the funniest AD&D references I've seen (the funniest being a column about old-time RPGs vs. the newer ones).
-S. Louie
"I may be Love's bitch, but at least I'm man enough to admit it."
Personally, I'd much rather like to see a good Shadowrun movie, and I think that if a D&D and Shadowrun movie were both made and of equal quality, the SR movie would fare better at the box-office - just because there's more of a market for futuristic, sci-fi type movies.
I mean, who wouldn't want to see a team of Runners head into Chicago, or raid some corp's headquarters? And there's just more of that "Whoa, that was cool!" factor, IMO - I'd love to see a well-done monofilament whip action sequence.
But that's just my opinion. I'm sure the D&D movie will make decent money from the geek segment, but probably not do well enough at the box office to change pre-concieved notions or start a new Hollywood trend.
Tort
It's not impossible to do good fantasy in film -- just very, very difficult. The better Disney animated pictures come immediately to mind -- I'm thinking of Snow White, Beauty and the Beast, the Little Mermaid here -- as does "Ladyhawke" of a number of years ago. These two, however, are quite unusual. Ladyhawke didn't rely on huge, impressive special effects -- just a few camera tricks to suggest the human-to-hawk and human-to-wolf transformations. And of course animation is a genre well suited to fantasy, because if you can imagine it and draw it, you can put it into a movie.
I also think it's difficult to do science fiction well in film, or at least it historically has been. Most of the reason is that producers and studios tend to equate "science fiction" with zap guns and flying saucers -- the kind of science fiction real SF fans deride as "sci-fi." In the best SF and fantasy movies, as in all movies (and indeed, all literature) the characters come first. That doesn't mean a movie with cardboard characters, predictable plots and dumbed-down dialogue can't be fun to watch -- it just means it isn't good SF.
This is the first I've heard of a D&D movie, but if I were to guess I would say it will probably rank right up there with "Masters of the Universe" and "Mortal Kombat", evoking Dorothy Parker's immortal phrase, "it fills a much-needed void in the genre."
--
Someone you trust is one of us.
The whole first Dragonlance trilogy, the Icewind Dale Trilogy from Forgotten Realms, etc. Basically anything from R.A. Salvatore with Drizzt and friends in it would be cool as well. I'd love to see Drizzt vs. Artemis Entreri on the big screen.. hell, even on video if it was done right. :-) Get some ninjas or something for good sword play.
A 10th level fighter gets hit with same, but his experience allows him to twist aside or whatever and takes less damage.
This makes sense right up to the point that a 1st level fighter falling off a 100' cliff dies and leaves a mess, whereas your 10th level fighter dusts himself off and continues on his way. If you can explain how experience trumps gravity, I'll be impressed.
Bottom line: D&D wasn't made to make sense, it was made to have fun with. Which I think it's managed quite admirably.
. . .(for those who have not yet seen
,and avoids ultrahype and all that it contains (ie. heavy merchandising before the movie is even released!)
it--and you are poor, poor, POOR deprived children and must correct this Right Now, and no, you don't have to hunt
for fandubs; you can go right down the local Suncoast or Anime Nation and get it--. . .
Or go to your local Anime convention. I'd suggest
Otakon, Katsucon, or A-con for all the East Coast folks.
As for Slayers, yes I agree that Slayers is D&D gone horrible, totally wrong in a cheesy, fun rollacoaster kind of fashion. Definitely worth the time.
Lodoss Wars always comes across as something too stereotypical for words. While it is visually stunning, its substance lacks a little to make it interesting fantasy fare.
That's what this new D&D movie could become. A cheesy, stereotypical romp through D&D geekland that everyone will want to see and then be horribly disappointed.
This movie could be a new cult hit if it shows some depth/forethought in the script
Also, avoiding heavy special effects might actually be a good move. A majority of fantasy films had neither the technology nor the budget for high class special effects, but have done well in staying power. For example, LadyHawke, Conan etc.
As an 80's-90's gamer, I wouldn't mind seeing a Dragonlance/Forgotten Realms movie. Let's see how the D&D one does.
Personally, I'd like to see Arnie come back and do a final Conan movie. The one where he would become king by his own hand. He's old enough now to do the part realistically. Conan wouldn't need to hack and slash, use an army. >;->
Give a human a brain and he'll swear he's the center of the Matrix
And a Fantasy Game at that.
Gotta use yer Imagination.
Our heroes will have no skills.
An unprotected thief can take the full force of dragon fire face first and leave if the dice roll right.
Warriors can take dozens of full-on full-force sword hits before they finally succumb to a lack of HPs, but he still won't bleed.
etc.
Such 'issues' are easily resolved by clever and thoughtful gamers and DM's alike.
Player's start out as Talented Normals, with a Certain Special Something that marks them for a life of adventure. Clever DM's give or help players create plausible backgrounds for characters, which in turn help to justify their chosen path (magic user, fighter, etc).
When a warrior with a lot of HP takes only a few points from an attacker with a three and a half foot bastard sword, it is clearly due to the fact that the damage was minimized by skillful defensive movement on the part of the one who was attacked.
When a Thief (via a good dice roll) survives a blast-furnace attack of Dragon's Breath, it is due to a clever bit of side-stepping, hiding or distraction.
The game was never designed to accurately reflect Reality. You can get that at the local Mall.
**>>BELCH
You could maybe make an interesting spoof fantasy based on a D&D universe, with characters (over) acting as though controlled by badly socialized geeks, hordes of insensate orcs attacking at every turn, and improbable bad stuff suddenly happening when the characters look like they're succeeding.
AWESOME idea!
**>>BELCH
You are right, it doesn't make sense... but if you want to stretch it, the fall doesn't kill the 10th fighter because of a combination of extreme luck, and his deities looking kindly upon him, both due to experience and represented by hit points... Like I said, it's a stretch, hehe.
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well, hasbro bought tsr, your right but they didnt buy it to get money off of d&d yes it will be an added bonus, but the ral reason was to buy the new craze, pokemon the producres will rape d&d if anyone does, not hasbro
"There is no there, there." ---William Gibson, on Cyberspace
The fact that pretty much every single group felt the need to so heavily butcher the AD&D rules to make them palatable is evidence for how bad they were. Hence, as to the subject at hand, a movie that was *actually* trying to model the AD&D system properly would be laughable. A movie that does the same thing most gaming groups did, and throws away all the self-contradictory stupid rules, could be rather fun.
Don't label something "offtopic" unless you know the topic well enough to tell what's on topic.
while extremely entertaining, this would make a crappy movie....
w ives]-[Dungeons_and_Dragons].mp3
http://www.deadalewives.com/sound/[The_Dead_Ale
Need a Catering Connection
WARNING: plot spoilers
Site at UpcomingMovies.com
But I can't imagine why anyone would bother making a movie out of D&D. I mean, other than to cash in on the name.
D&D isn't exactly the stuff high-quality fantasy. It doesn't encourage interesting drama or require much in the way of imagination by the DM (at least, since they started selling those damn pre-made "modules").
You could maybe make an interesting spoof fantasy based on a D&D universe, with characters (over) acting as though controlled by badly socialized geeks, hordes of insensate orcs attacking at every turn, and improbable bad stuff suddenly happening when the characters look like they're succeeding.
Stefan
* Well, no, not really. But carved wooden dice would probably have been better than the crappy brittle plastic dice TSR sold back then.
--
Chris Warden
Do not meddle in the affairs of Wizards for you are crunchy and taste good with Ketchup.
Boy, anyone who claims to have read LotR and claims his elves have pointy ears must be a completely careless reader. Ears, or rather pointy ears, are never mentioned. If there had been pointy ears, don't you think that someone would have said something along the lines of "hey! look! that guy's ears look funny!", at least once? JRRT makes perfectly clear that elves and humans look a lot alike, except that elves tend to be taller, more lithe, better looking, less easily tired, don't have to sleep, do not grow old or suffer from disease, have better eyesight, more intelligent, more wise, more powerful and capable in learning the magical arts, etc. Not a pointy ear anywhere, however. Of course JRRT was basing his elves on the original elves of Germanic mythology, who were not little, pointy eared cutesy inventions of Victorian fantasy, but rather very human like, but very powerful and terrifying, supernatural beings. Anyone remember reading L. Sprauge de Camp's "Lest Darkness Fall" where the American archeology professor, knocked back in time to 6th century Rome, contracts a cold and has to beat off all kinds of medical quackery, including his Vandal bodyguard's attempts to cure him of "elfshot"?
I would be that you're a programmer now, right? If not you should be, that kind of attention to detail is what makes great software.
Gary Gygax gave this explaination (or a similar one) in the 1st ed. DMG... Say a fist level fighter gets hit with 8 damage from a sword.. it runs him through and he dies. A 10th level fighter gets hit with same, but his experience allows him to twist aside or whatever and takes less damage. He can't actually sustain MORE damage, but his skill etc.. is reflected on his increased hit points. Also, most rules allow that if a person is immobilized (i.e. on a headsman's block) a hit is automatically fatal (unless the headsman rolls a 1!).
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Ever seen the Record of Lodoss War series. It's almost straight D&D right down to the racial hatreds. The only change is in the setting. It's anime, but i still consider it to be a movie.
Non gratis rodentus anus
I'm not sure what they mean by "sticking to the rules". If they mean that the characters will have the same skill sets and limitations they had in the game, and the creatures stats will be taken from the game as well, then this might be good. If they go with a sample storyline, or try to make it too much like the way the games were *supposed* to go, it could be very very bad. Maybe it was just me, but did anyone really play by the "rules"? I was under the impression that the rules were there as kind of a guideline system. In every rpg we ever played, we always twisted and bent and revised the rules we felt were unfair or took away from the fun aspect of the game. Granted, there were players that came and went over the years that wanted to play strictly by the book, but they were usually a bit anal-retentive and didn't really understand that the enjoyment of the game came from the interaction among the players. We found that our best adventuring was when we just played it fast and loose and kept the story moving. Combat wasn't even the biggest thrill, it was figuring out puzzles, and if the guy in the back of the party was actually a doppelganger now, or even just the petty infighting that went on between player characters. The role playing made the game, not arguing if the target number was really a 6 when the GM said it was 10.
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Basic D&D has dragons immune to their breath weapon types. It also says the Red has fire, green has (Chlorine?) gas and Gold has fire & gas.
I don't know about 1st ed. But I'm sure the basic agrees with the "Gold dragon kick" rout theory.
-Vel
(diving for cover)
Definitely. My roommate picked up the DVD set, it's rather well done. "Dragons" were like too big to animate, they're like part of the background (which is also a statement to their stature)
:)
But, Lodoss War would have been far better if the "lead character" wasn't an idiot. "Parn! Come back!"
I probably got his name wrong too, but I think it was Parn.
__________________________
In any case, I doubt very much that that being "true to the AD&D rules" is meant to extend down to the level of individual die rolls. I read that claim as meaning that the characters should be recognizable as something that might crop up in an actual AD&D game; that is, the spells would be actual AD&D spells, mages would memorize them the way they do in the game, thieves would have the abilities you would expect, and so on.
Actually, I think the main feature that determines AD&D compliance (so to speak) is the magic system. When you think about it, swinging a sword looks the same no matter what the mechanics for resolving it are. Presumably that is because it is based on something that one can actually do in real life, and so we have a pretty good idea what should or should not be possible. Magic, on the other hand, differs wildly between game systems, and the restrictions (or lack thereof) placed on magic use can heavily influence the tone of a story.
So, my guess is that they have stressed this going on about the AD&D rules means they have stressed the workings of magic somewhat in the movie. This can be either a good thing or a bad thing. On the one hand, having some hard and fast rules regarding magic can prevent some sorts of plot holes where magic is all-powerful in one scene, but next to useless in another. On the other hand, AD&D magic does have some serious warts. For instance, do we really want to see the mages sitting around for 4 hours every morning memorizing spells? And if the system really does work like AD&D, why doesn't everyone load up with 14 stoneskins before the start of the adventure?
Still, one hopes they will exercise enough discretion to chuck the stuff that doesn't work story-wise. I mean, if we managed to come up with a workable subset of the rules using only enough funds to supply the group with pizza for the evening, surely they can do the same with $30M, right?
-r
But... Who cares? Everyone sitting in the cinema will go, 'Oh, darn, he must've hit a natural 20!' or, 'Good gosh, I never knew a Fireball was so messy... Cool!' or yet again, 'Oh, shit, a Beholder! Do you know how many HP these have?'
In short: it'll be a geek-o-rama. You bet I'm gonna see it. Story? Who cares! I bet the ratio of people who had sex before their 20's will be insanely low in that theatre... :)
And then, Lord of the Rings will come out, and the D&D movie will go down the drain because it won't hold to comparison either on the acting, SFX or story... And the D&D movie will be history.
I'm not surprised they're putting it out this year... If they put it out after LotR, it'll be too late to ever make cash on it. Now, with the LotR hype building up, the timing is perfect.
Keep on... Geekin'!
"There is no surer way to ruin a good discussion than to contaminate it with the facts."
I was in Prague when they were doing filming there. The scenerey is awesome in Prague, very medieval and grandious. Prague is like Disneyland for real, statues everywher - guilded with gold. Castles and towers that have withstood the test of time. Prague is an excellent backdrop for D&D - I know I loved D&D and I get the shivers just thinking of how beautiful and majestic Prague is.
I can't say much for the movie itself. It's unclear whether it will be as good as the scenery around it.
Joseph Elwell.
As far as I know, AD&D elves are always tall (presumably modelled after Tolkein elves). Certainly the two in our current campain are over 6' tall, and I don't recall having short elves in any previous campaigns.
I have to say I'm dreading the movie. I'm one of those that believes is virtually impossible to do fantasy well on film (as opposed to SF, which is easy), and as fantasy goes, AD&D is pretty much at the top of the pile. I'll go and see it anyway, but I'm not expecting much from it. It can't possibly live up to what I see in my mind anyway...
"The invisible and the non-existent look very much alike." -- Delos B. McKown
You know what that means, right? It means we're going to see a movie basically like the "Knights of the Dinner Table" cartoon, except live and for two hours. Auuugggh!
Ok, I had bad expierences w/ D&D - but still, you can actually make a movie out of a game like this? What's next, Chutes & Ladders: The Motion Picture?
Hollywood is running out of ideas...its one thing to be making films about cartoons (Inspector Gadget comes to mind), but *this*??
Not meant to be flamebait...but I'm putting on my asbestos tightie whities just in case.
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TOTALY AWSOME DUDE! Yes, I'm another leftover from the 80s...
I'm gonna love this, my favorite RPG on the silver screen. Hey, maybe they'll make a movie out of Dragonlance, it'll be awsome to see Sturm get killed!
All browsers' default homepage should read: Don't Panic...
It doesn't matter whether this movie will be good or bad. It is guaranteed to pack the D&D people in like sardines (much the same way the uber-suck Star Wars prequel did). All we have to do is set the theaters on fire on opening night to make the world safe for shower-takers.
---
Linux MAPI Server!
http://www.openone.com/software/MailOne/
(Exchange Migration HOWTO coming soon)
Straight out of the 2nd Ed. Player's Handbook:
Elf: 55/50 (male/female) + 1d10, in inches.
So, elven males range from 4'8" to 5'5", and females from 4'3" to 5'.
paranoid.android
Things AD&D models poorly:
You can't have a Robin Hood, since theives suck at all combat including ranged weapons (that never made sense - A thief should be the best class with 'cowardly' weapons like bows and thrown daggars, but he's not.) You can't have the classic power struggles between mages, since mages are nothing more than containers for pre-fab spells with pre-fab effects. (No concept of mana or power). You can't have someone get better at something by being taught, since you know at level 1 exactly what all the abilities you will ever have for the rest of your life are (class), and you can't escape from that box.
Every average person you meet on the street will be wooden and alike in ability, since there is no effective difference between a STR of 10 and an STR of 14 or an INT of 10 and an INT of 14, etc... You have to go into the extremes before your main stats actually make any difference that actually matters in the game.
It will take over 10 blows with an axe to kill a very experienced criminal at an execution.
An experienced soldier can fall from a greater height without dying than an unexperienced one, for some, err, strange reason.
A street urchin who wants to iprove his theiving skills could do so by actually sneaking and picking pockets, but he'd be able to learn these skills faster if he instead went around killing people at random. For some, err, strange reason.
A mage who casts a spell would suddenly forget everything about that spell after he was done. For some, err, strange reason.
Humans run at the same speed as each other.
Humans are incapable of cross-training in multiple disciplines at once, while other races are, for some, err, strange reason.
A thief or assasin who sneaks up on a victim from behind can kill him in one easy blow, unless the victim is well travelled and experienced (in which case quadruple damage from a daggar through the heart still only hurts him enough to make him mad, for some, err, strange reason.)
Well, actually I'll probably end up seeing this movie anyway, since it will either be a good fantasy movie (meaning it totally ignores the AD&D rules), or it will be so oozing with cheese that I'll enjoy it in an MST3K kind of a way. In either case I agree that it will be quite the geek-fest.
Don't label something "offtopic" unless you know the topic well enough to tell what's on topic.
Well, primarily our problem in high school and role-playing was when we formed a Role-playing group and asked for time in the library after hours to play games.. The school administration was fine with this after we put together a proposal stating the educational values of roleplaying. (i.e. a good springboard for developing reading skills, logical thought, mathematics, an interest in mythology, etc..)
BUT then the local holy rollers (not to be confused with the clerics/paladins in my group) started off on the whole satanic side of Role-Playing. Lots of letters to the editors of the local paper ensued, and we humbly responded to them basically defending our point. Would you rather have us venting our adolescent hormonal imbalances and angst in the Real World, or channeling them through our imaginations???
As a few people who posted after this stated, I too am dreading the ramifications by the imaginationally challenged, who are frightened by the powers of their own mind. But As we fought and won our battle over playing games, mayhaps others should do the same... Invite the disbelievers to sit in on the games. The group I DM'd usually spent more time figuring out puzzles and cryptic riddles than hacking and slashing. And they enjoyed it more...
But then again, we ARE still living in the shadow of Geek-Bashing and Video-Games leading to the violence in teenage society.
Remember folks, the MOST dangerous weapon in ANY realm is ignorance, but can also be the easiest to defuse
-- Life: Hate the Game... Love the cereal
Here's an idea.
How about we scrap this movie thing, which'll most likely turn out to be underwhelming and barely keep the interest of even the hardcore old gamer.
Then, we start up the old cartoon again on TV. Now that was quality programming.
... it was faithful to the actions of a *with a nod to KODT* "typical" group of players rather than "the AD&D rules system".
Just think:
Jay (=
That is correct; Tolkien himself made no mention in LOTR or his background material as to whether his elves' ears were pointed or round. When people say that Middle-Earth elves had pointed ears, they usually make the argument that the word for ear in Elvish is based on the word for leaf:
Las (1)
*lasse 'leaf': Q lasse, N lhass; Q lasselanta 'leaf-fall, autumn', N lhasbelin (*lassekwelene), cf. Q Narquelion [ KWEL ]. Lhasgalen 'Greenleaf' (Gnome name of Laurelin). (Some think this is related to the next and *lasse 'ear'. The Quendian ears were more pointed and leaf-shaped than [human].)
Las (2)
'listen'. N lhaw 'ears' (of one person), old dual *lasu -- whence singular lhewig. Q lar, lasta- 'listen'; lasta 'listening, hearing' -- Lastalaika 'sharp-ears', a name, cf. N Lhathleg. N lhathron 'hearer, listener, eavesdropper' ( *la(n)sro-ndo ) ; lhathro or lhathrando 'listen in, eavesdrop'.
[The Lost Road, 367]
Ok, now that I've frightened everyone.... I'll just... go away....We want endless gardens of data, where the bits can flower, flourish and reproduce. -- Andy Mueller-Maguhn
Coming soon, "Jem and the Holograms: The Movie"! Muhahahaha! Don't laugh, it may just happen.
How are they going to get a movie audience to sit through a 'drama' that boils down to watching the ultra-fat-chick and four guys who've managed to extend puberty into their mid-twenties sit around a big card table while fooling around with painted pewter figures resembling Wizards and Hobbits and stuff?
The drama, I guess, would be the fight over who has to go out and buy more cheese puffs.
Does anyone remember the movie that defined a class of characters in AD&D?
Of course I refer to Arnie's classic unfinished trilogy, Conan. The barbarian class is defined by these movies.
Why is there so much skepticism that a movie couldn't be made according to the rules instead of defining them?
Oh yeah, Holloywood wouldn't allow anything pure and true to be made.
Exciting to relive the old memories though!
Rumor has it this movie is actually Tolkien's Lord of the Rings , which is what D&D was spawned from.
Our heroes will have no skills. Chain mail will ward off arrows better than rigid leather. Rangers can slay dozens of foes in a ten second time period (but only if they're humanoid). An unprotected thief can take the full force of dragon fire face first and leave if the dice roll right. Warriors can take dozens of full-on full-force sword hits before they finally succumb to a lack of HPs, but he still won't bleed.
:-)
And if they also follow the typical and recommended (ala official adventures) economic structures, then we'll have a bizarre economy based on one-ounce gold coins in plentiful supply, dungeons with more gold laying around than all the gold ever mined during the Alaskan gold rush, and these dungeons are always just outside of town. And let's not talk about social structures or I'll have to mentions barons ruling entire kingdoms and kings ruling mere cities.
I'm not sure who DM'd your games, but when I was DM I tried to make it as real as possible while still keeping the fun aspect. I redid most of the prices on weapons, potions, clothing, etc. I emphasized experience and allowed lady luck a fair shake at the dice. Of course, back then, I also tweaked it slightly so that morals had something to do with experience and reward.
Nobody took on a thousand-man Kobold stronghold without serious planning. Tactical manouvres which put more on outsmarting than just brute force attack won more XP. One guy wanted to fuck some wench but he never thought about protection so he got V.D.. Another went as far as to kill a sheep, dry out its intestines and tie a knot in it after that particular session.
I'm talking evil animated wooden dummies for 'head' foes, shoes whose laces always knotted together, a thousand wombats and a bruised watermellon. It all fits together, honest! Languages weren't universal -- my players had to hire translators, who sometimes weren't to be found.
It took months of planning and mini-sessions to have a serious gaming experience. Nobody else in the group liked to DM but planning entire worlds... I loved it. Right down to the last details: the colour of the sand, what 'pumpernickel' meant... And I really do think the others in my group appreciated it, even if it wasn't as easy as other games they'd played.
Actually, I have been disinterested in D&D for roughly 9-10 years now. I played it for something like 7 years (original D&D, not this wussy 'advanced' crap. And we didn't even have a real copy of the game, just an incomplete 3rd generation xerox. Had to make up most of the missing stuff ourselves) but ultimately it was just the same damn fantasy stuff again and again.
I then moved on to Robotech (this was in the late 80's so that was pretty new at the time), Star Wars, some messing around with some obscure stuff (e.g. old copies of Gammaworld) until settling down with GURPS. Generally I play modern-future settings, and it's quite a lot of fun. But has D&D really changed or grown any? Well, nothing that I've seen. So I haven't got high hopes for the movie. A KoDT movie would be much cooler.
Black pudding: it's not just for breakfast anymore. :)
;)... :).
I noticed that "dwarf" and "elf" were listed as characters, where they are races in the game. Elven what? Dwarven what?
Stuff I want to see (we'll have to make this a slashdot topic, and submit it
-- Green Slime (and the Jellies..)
-- Gelatinous Cube ("look, it's a floating necklace...AAAaaaaa")
-- Bugbears. Don't they look vaguely like wookies?
-- Doppelgangers.
-- "16 Charisma... Yeah, I'd do her."
-- Griffons, Chimeras, and Manticores, oh my
-- One character fumbles and stabs another.
-- A "Play your alignment or I'll nuke you" talk from a diety.
Cliche/Stupid things I don't want to see:
-- 2-second cameos of half the Monster Manual.
-- "The ranger sets out to avenge {name of loved one goes here}, who was killed by the evil {specious enemy goes here} clan.
-- Hack,Slash, heal, and repeat. The best games don't require dice for anything.
-- Fighter-woman with +5 Sword of Cleaving, and +5(AC 0) Chainmail Bikini of Cleavage.
-- Anything resembling that stupid "Dungeon Master" Yoda-wannabe from the cartoon.
When I was in school, we did have a couple of weekly campaigns that were good enough to write about, so I think a screenplay from a campaign (or set of campaigns) is possible. I hope the play group(s) get writer credits.
I am much more excited about Neverwinter Nights, though. If you haven't seen them yet, this month's CGW has some screenshots of a prototype, and I like the 3D approach (think Myth).
______________________
I predict that the same four people that went to see the Beastmaster go and see this film. In the UK it goes straight to video.
The cartoon was better.
stty erase ^H
While I don't disagree with you (reality in the rule system for D&D is poor--to say the least). For an example of how a movie could portray the above example see Dragon Slayer.
I want to see adventurers loaded down with the normal compliment of equipment (8 weeks of food, 20 torches, plate mail, a few hundred pounds of gold and silver, half a dozen swords, halberds, pikes, war axes, etc.) in a melee after hiking for a couple of weeks through the forest...
I want to see the Magic User start casting a spell that takes 10 minutes only to have the fight end before he's halfway through.
I want to see a lone experienced adventurer take on a 20 ton Dragon singlehandedly (outfitted as above of course), and win!
I want to see the above adventurer come across a 100 foot cliff, hurl himself off, land, pick himself off, dust himself off and continue on his way (while carrying all the stuff listed above naturally).
D&D the movie, should be a hoot.
"Grab them by the pussy" -- President of the United States of America
D&D FORTRAN
Palladium PASCAL
RQ3 B
StoryTeller QBASIC
D6 Visual Basic
HERO/Fuzion C++, with numerous extentions
GURPS Java
These two being from Lodoss War, of course, which is what this movie would probably like to be. I doubt it'll happen, though. Live action fantasy is hard to do because... well... it's live action and not fantasy. :/
Ummm...
TSR sold to Wizards of the Coast...
Wizards of the Coast sold to Hasbro...
D&D movie announced, due late 2000. Just in time for D&D 3rd Edition.
Can anyone say 'marketing'!
Binky
(who's hopes aren't 'high' for this one)
At least it will make the fight scenes easy to choreagraph! All of the good guys each take one swing, then all of the monsters get to take an attcak, then the higher level fighters will get their extra attacks, if they get any. Then, everyone will wait around for another 40-50 seconds for the round to end. Repeat.
Dana
Height is not the only thing that sets the Tolkien Elves from the D&D ones; pointy ears is another. You can bet the LotR Elves won't have them.
"There is no surer way to ruin a good discussion than to contaminate it with the facts."
I'm not sure how happy I am on the repeated emphasis on how much the movie will be based out of the rulebooks.
Some of the worst fantasy novels out there are the ones transparently drawn from someone's camapign. I'm not saying that there aren't good novels set in the (A)D&D universe or that some of them didn't grow out of the writer's own campaigns (the Dragonlance books fit both those criteria), but that being aware of the mechanics distracts from the story. Good writing can overcome this, but they're not saying what a great story they have to tell - they're saying how much the viewer will recognize from the sourcebooks.
Most of the best role-playing campaigns I've been in (D&D or otherwise) have deviated from the printed material one way or another. A book of rules alone does not make a good game.
Frankly, most RPGs are more fun to play than to watch. The part that needs to translate to the big screen is the story and world, not the stats and die rolls.
-- I'm not evil, I'm
If this is an indication of things to come, then I don't look forward to watching it! Bring on Bilbo and Frodo!
-- PanDuh!
D&D elves were 4'-5'
sheesh.
You probably call halflings "hobbit"s, too.
D&D, and rpgs in general, don't have a set plot... So how do you make a movie out of it? Pick out parts of the world based on the rules of the game and then write the plot? Interesting..
I think I would be more excited about a Dragonlance or Forgotten Realms movie... Those seetings have some stories and characters that I would love to see done (well) on screen.
But how do you make a plot from the Players handbook... I guess you could use the examples from the book...
Scene 1:
Rothgar is pummeled by several orcs to demonstarte pummeling rules.
Scene 2:
Borkfast carefully dons his armor and shoulders his pack to help explain encumbrance...
Who knows... I'll go see it as soon as it comes out... even if it's dumb as dirt.. Come on, its D&D!!!
/* CDM */
Okay, this is sure to be a huge success, just like the Final Fantasy Movie. There's an obvious trend here, towards movies slavishly following games... So when are we going to have "Angband: The Movie"?
I can see it now:
Our hero, a heroic @ symbol, has against all odds fought his way down to the 40th level of the evil dungeon, with its random maps. After killing countless evil beings such as yellow-capital-T's (Troll Priests) and the malignant capital-D's (Ancient Dragons), holding 23 items, no matter how large, he is ready to challenge the ultimate evil: Level 41!
This would make a perfect series, too. Endless possibilities, *great* special effects, and whatnot. (3D-rendered ASCII! Just like The Matrix!) I can't wait until "Angband II: Level 50 is in sight"!
pb Reply or e-mail; don't vaguely moderate.
Until Courtney "Corey" Solomon proposed his project to TSR, the company had been protective of the D&D name, cautious about promoting a shoddy product to its 12 million fans.
Cautious about promoting a shoddy product? Never stopped TSR before.
As an avid D&D'er, I can't wait to see how this will turn out. Hope to see a good blend of FX and character building, but will settle for just entertaining.
Some days I get the sinking feeling Orwell was an optimist.
Always thought that TSR screwed up the transition from D&D to AD&D. Empire of the Petal Throne was way cooler, and much more suited to the silver screen. Check out the visuals at the Tekumel site.
When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro. [H.S.T.]
Pump action wand of wonder? ooooh... the magical equivalent of a wild wild acid trip, or something... Seriously though, I wonder if the folks at TSR sent an army of retired D&Ders to the stuido to keep the stuff straight. After all, the guy who was producing it DID say he wanted to keep it both un-silly AND keep it close to the rules. I can't wait to see some of the humor they come up with, though. Imagine hollywood types scanning a list of magical equipment and saying: Hey, we should throw one of these babies in the movie! Hmm, maybe you will see a pump-action WoW...
...Can you say "straight to video"?
or try this: Tensor's floating disc + low ceiling + orc = fun!
Perhaps what they did was pull together some beaten up old D&D books and start up a campaign; keeping every little detail, word and evil DM cackle that warned the players they just let loose an uncontrollable (and very active) sphere of annihilation recorded somewhere safe. Then, they took that and put real actors in and turned the campaign into a script... then it would be awesome regardless of actual quality based on humor alone. Also, it would be much better than a group of loser scriptwriters reading the books and wondering what a saving throw is good for, or trying to think of a good reason a gold dragon is immune to fire. There's no reason, it just is!
D&D, and rpgs in general, don't have a set plot... So how do you make a movie out of it? Pick out parts of the world based on the rules of the game and then write the plot? Interesting..
I think I would be more excited about a Dragonlance or Forgotten Realms movie... Those seetings have some stories and characters that I would love to see done (well) on screen.
But how do you make a plot from the Players handbook... I guess you could use the examples from the book...
Scene 1:
Rothgar is pummeled by several orcs to demonstarte pummeling rules.
Scene 2:
Borkfast carefully dons his armor and shoulders his pack to help explain encumbrance...
Who knows... I'll go see it as soon as it comes out... even if it's dumb as dirt.. Come on, its D&D!!!
/* CDM */
Now where'd I put that 11th level thief...
D&D, and rpgs in general, don't have a set plot... So how do you make a movie out of it? Pick out parts of the world based on the rules of the game and then write the plot? Interesting..
I think I would be more excited about a Dragonlance or Forgotten Realms movie... Those seetings have some stories and characters that I would love to see done (well) on screen.
But how do you make a plot from the Players handbook... I guess you could use the examples from the book...
Scene 1:
Rothgar is pummeled by several orcs to demonstarte pummeling rules.
Scene 2:
Borkfast carefully dons his armor and shoulders his pack to help explain encumbrance...
Who knows... I'll go see it as soon as it comes out... even if it's dumb as dirt.. Come on, its D&D!!!
/* CDM */
As long as they throw the right magic items into the movie....
Gota see either a wand of wonder, or deck of many things.
And of course for the climax, someone breaks their Staff of the Magi over their knee.....
Retributive Strike!!
They're going to base this on the rules system? I thought movies were supposed to attempt at least a suspension of disbelief.
Our heroes will have no skills. Chain mail will ward off arrows better than rigid leather. Rangers can slay dozens of foes in a ten second time period (but only if they're humanoid). An unprotected thief can take the full force of dragon fire face first and leave if the dice roll right. Warriors can take dozens of full-on full-force sword hits before they finally succumb to a lack of HPs, but he still won't bleed.
And if they also follow the typical and recommended (ala official adventures) economic structures, then we'll have a bizarre economy based on one-ounce gold coins in plentiful supply, dungeons with more gold laying around than all the gold ever mined during the Alaskan gold rush, and these dungeons are always just outside of town. And let's not talk about social structures or I'll have to mentions barons ruling entire kingdoms and kings ruling mere cities.
I fully understand that "realism" is a filthy word that will get you kicked out of GenCon for uttering it, but at least movies should make some sort of sense.
A Government Is a Body of People, Usually Notably Ungoverned