"Well, I am a Muslim, and there is a rule that says we are allowed to eat pork during certain desperate situation, to save our life, for example. However, the decision by these researchers to use pigs in the first place, was not made during during desperate times."
Well, I suppose from the viewpoint of the researchers -- but that burden should fall on the researchers alone, and not on a terminally ill patient.
"And I don't buy that argument about pigs' physiology being closer to human being than other animals. I think there's a conspiracy to undermine our beliefs and make us seems like backward, unprogressive, unreasonable, fanatic etc. because we don't want to accept pig organs as transplant."
Pig organs are about the right size and shape, plus they breed and mature fast. More importantly, they are one of the few domesticated farm animals that meets that criteria. A big reason it has to be a farm animal is that it blunts potential animal rights arguements, because we slaughter them for food anyway.
I don't know, maybe there are alternatives amount the other food animals, goats or sheep might be the right size, but I just don't know enough about their physiology to say.
Scientists create Vegetarian Organ Transplant!
on
Pigs with Human Genes
·
· Score: 5, Funny
Besides, I'm a vegetarian.
Newsflash --
In other news today, scientists have created an artificial tofu-based organ, utilizing genetically engineered soybeans. The resulting organs are said to be whitish in color, and quote -- "rather soft and squishy, but low in fat and cholesterol free."
However, not all are pleased with the development. Vegetable rights activists have condemned the move as a violation of leguminous rights, pointing out that the modifications could inflict pain and suffering to the bushy crops, while Environmentalists and Anti-GMO protestors brought up the danger that the genetically engineered plants could spread out of control, leading to giant mutant soybeans roaming the streets, ravishing our daughters, and voting republican.
Other critics have more practical concerns. Said one scientist, "We haven't fully researched the possibility that vegitransplantation may introduce foreign viruses into the human population. My god, what would happen if the soybean leaf-spot virus were to break into the human population? What's more, the synthetic organs are bland and tasteless."
The research team countered, however, that most humans don't have leaves. "Besides, the organs will adsorb flavors from whoever they're transplanted into."
It is unknown when the organs will be suitable for use in humans. However, scientists believe they are already suitable for use in Spicy Ma-po Bean Curd and Buddha Delight Combo #6, pending approval by the FDA and Ming's Peking Imperial Inn.
"Essentially, what these guys did was find a way to add a gene into a pig by messing with the sperm. This technique can't be used for removing genes, and can't replace genes. They can only add genes."
Even if you can't replace genes with this method, you may be able to do the functional equivalent. For instance, add the new gene, and then add a gene which counteracts the original (antisense, targeted ribozyme, RNA silencing, etc.). So it's entirely possible that you could knock out or replace the marker proteins and sugar-producing pathways. There are an awful lot of them, of course -- but no one ever claimed this would be easy.
"Cell morphology/DNA. Pig DNA is not human DNA. Pig cells are not human cells. Pig cells expressing "human genes" are closer, but when these cells replicate, when you get a virus, when something goes wrong.. what's gonna fix it? "
An obvious observation, of course pig!=human. As for the rest of this, you're a little fuzzy on just what exactly your concerns are. Now, "when these cells replicate", I imagine they should in the course of normal tissue repair and turnover. Are you referring to the possibility that cells will migrate out of the transplant (resulting in microchimerism)? Such a thing could cause some rejection problems, but that's really a minor case compared to the big rejection problem of the whole organ. I would be more concerned about the possibility of porcine immune cells hitching a ride with the organ -- that's a real concern (Note: There shouldn't be enough to cause any sort of GVHD, it's more of problem with increasing rejection risks). There are ways to deplete immune cells, though, I think some of them have been tried (in human organ transplants).
As for the virus, I will assume you mean the problems of introducing possible porcine viruses. For most viruses, you can raise the animals in isolation, and then screen them before/during/after. However, there is one exception -- Porcine Endogenous Retrovirus (PERV -- yes, that's the acronym). I believe it's present in the genome of just about all pigs. It's been a topic of a great deal of research, and for a time it caused an FDA ban of all xenografting trials (since lifted). Although PERV doesn't seem to be able to spread in humans, I imagine that if we could knock out a dozen other genes from the pig genome, we could probably knock out the viral sequence too.
"How do we know what will happen?"
How about finding out by the empirical method?
"So tell me, how is this really news? The headline should have read "Scientists develop new but limited method for gene implantation." It's been done."
I'll agree with you here, it's another case of an attention-grabbing sensational headline.
Pigs are not kosher, and Jewish or Moslems would not be able to benefit from these advances. That's alienting 1/5 of the planet right there from being able to benefit from this.
IANAJ (first time I've ever used that particular acronym!), but I believe there is a doctrine which states that the importance of a human life far outweighs any of the kosher requirements -- for instance, it would be okay to eat pork if you were starving and that was the last item of food you had left. I imagine that a pig organ transplant would fall into the same classification.
As for muslims, IANAM;), and I don't have a clue to boot.
Is it really that hard make? I don't mind it to be heavier or more expensive - the reliability (no moving parts) and noise level are much more important in a lot of cases (pun intended:)
Silicone Acoustics carries a 300 watt fanless PSU from TKPower. However, although the power output is standard ATX, the unit itself is not standard ATX sized, so the case will have to be modified for installation. There's a guide with instructions and pictures on the site for how this is done.
"Autism is caused by mercury (thimerosal) in vaccines [mercola.com]."
If this were true, in the future we should see a sharp drop in Autism cases, in children born right around now. The FDA passed down an instruction to reduce the use of thimerosal a while ago, and most manufacturers have either reformulated, or are in the process of reformulating to use other preservatives (a few never used thimerosal to begin with).
"The nice thing about Nickel-63 is that the decay produces beta rays (high-energy electrons) and nothing else. This could be shielded by a thick sheet of plywood, or a thin sheet of lead. Most radioisotopes aren't nearly as friendly (there is usually gamma emission as the decay product sheds excess energy, which is difficult to shield against). [ObDisclaimer: I'm assuming that the lead also blocks the x-rays produced as the high-energy electrons smack into the shielding.]"
The proportion of secondary X-rays (bremsstrahlung) generated by beta particles of a give energy is proportional to the atomic number of the adsorbing material -- so your best bet would be to use both, with the plywood facing the emitter and the lead on the outside.
My experience is in the biological sciences, which use a lot of beta emitters for radiolabeling. We used commercially made beta shielding available from scientific supply places (VWR, Fisher, etc.), and they were all made of a plastic such as acrylic. I don't think I ever saw any heavy lead shielding anywhere in our labs.
"...you couldn't pay anyone enough to do a commercial like that. They are paid actors, and nothing more. They may even hate the product they are selling."
Are you suggesting that Bob Dole doesn't actually use Viagra?
Here's a conspiracy theory for you. What if the companies are getting wise to the fact that users intentionally "crash" their drives every 2.5 years to get a new drive for "free".
...it'll give us a chance to perform some disk- warranty checks (a couple of whacks with a rubber panel-beating mallet that leaves no marks just before the end of the warranty period.) You'd be surprised how many disks fail the tests requiring a free replacement.
-- BOFH, 1998
"How does one look "American"? Do you mean look "white"? Or do you mean "not Chinese"? Seems like a bad generalization."
Maybe it is, but it's not necessarily inaccurate. I've often heard my relatives use the description American to describe someone white. Or more accurately, I should say not ethnically Chinese (with the presumption of probably caucasian), since that's the context it's usually presented in -- like, "Oh, is your new friend Chinese or American?".
My general feeling is that in these cases, they are using "American" as if it were both a nationality and an ethnicity. I suppose it might be natural for older folks, who came from a time and place when the world was not so small, and such things were usually one and the same.
"Tear free onions are nice, but fart free beans would be the greatest invention since sliced bread! People would line up to buy those."
A number of decades ago, there was an attempt to do exactly that, using traditional breeding methods to reduce the content of gas-producing raffinose and other oligosaccharides. The attempt was successful only up to a point -- apparently, a minimum amount of sugars were required by the seed, since when the concentration dropped too low, they stopped germinating. You could still propagate the plants by cloning, but this was impractical use in agriculture for a commodity crop like beans.
I've been thinking that with modern genetic engineering techniques it may be possible -- perhaps include an enzyme (like the galactosidase in Beano) that would break down the sugar, either before maturation, or during soaking before cooking. Another approach might be to replace the sugar-producing pathways to use another carbohydrate digestible by humans. The first would probably be easiest from an engineering standpoint (one single gene with proper regulation might do it), while the second might be much harder -- the longest functional pathway introduction I've heard of is the three-step one in golden rice, and that took years of work.
"what ended up working was some kind of beetle juice (no, I am not kidding, this was what the doctor said it was)"
Cantharidin. It's a blistering agent, extracted from (what else) the blister beetle.
BTW, cantharidin is also the substance known as "Spanish Fly". Although I do not recommend that anyone try drinking wart remover, as this substance is highly toxic when taken internally.
"The basic idea is to tape over the warts and suffocate them"
Since common warts are caused by a virus, it seems unlikely that you could literally "suffocate" it.
I'm guessing that a possible mode of action is that, by irritating the area, the duct tape is setting up a mild, local inflammation. Most warts eventually go away spontaneously, when the immune system recgnizes the virus, and a bit of inflammation would speed this process up. A number of existing anti-wart agents are believed to work this way.
"Relatively recently it was discovered that the malaria parasite contains a small, relict chloroplast"
This particular organelle is also called an apicoplast. Anyway -- one potentially interesting side effect of this development.
There are quite a few third world nations that have trouble affording current anti-malarials (even when discounted or generically manufacturered). A lot of these chloroplast-targeting herbicides are relatively simple molecules, and are already manufactured in bulk quantities for very low prices (compared to medicines). If some of the current chloroplast-targeting herbicides are suitable as-is, then not only do we have a whole new class of drugs -- but some of them could be really cheap.
Of course, if you want to manufacture them in an FDA-licensed, cGMP facility, that will jack up the price. But agricultural-quality material could be had for a few cents per treatment.
"...the experience can be phychologically very uncomfortable. If you are the least bit squeamish about people playing with your eyeballs with scary tools and having your head and eyes locked into one position for a duration, then forget it."
If this is a problem, you can get a prescription for a tranquilizer. I've been prescripted them for dental procedures before (though not for eye surgery), and it works quite well.
And upon conversion to ASCII, the following pops up in the Human genetic code:
"!!!seineew era stsinoitaerC"
Re:What Edison would say if alive today...
on
Engineer in a Box?
·
· Score: 1
"Although the site [hfmgv.org]doesn't mention it, the Henry Ford Museum has on exhibit a test tube purportedly containing Thomas Edison's last breath."
This is somewhat OT, but there's a fantasy/speculative fiction book called "Expiration Date" by Tim Powers which centers around the last breath of Thomas Edison contained in the tube you mentioned. A boy accidentally inhales the contents of the tube, which turn out to contain the ghost of Edison. An interesting and imaginative book, although it gets a little weak towards the end.
In the Anime OAV Macross Plus, the General Galaxy YF-21 Prototype piloted by Guld Bowman used a variable wing geometry as part of it's design, a feature also incorporated in the production VF-22 Sturmvogel appearing in Macross 7. Of course, the mechanism is different in that (besides being fictional), a shape-memory alloy was used to allow the wing to change shape.
The legitimate region 2 DVDs can be had for around $50-60 from import DVD sites like cdjapan.co.jp -- and it has English subtitles.
The only issue (besides the region) is the color balance, which has a slight reddish tint which some people find annoying. Interestingly enough, according to Nausicaa.net, this was done deliberately so that it would look right when played on plasma or lcd screens.
"I wonder if this company will make an "Anti-tanning" pill, that will make your skin whiter?"
Such things already exist. Examples include the skin bleaches Hydroquinone and Kojic Acid. Medically, they're used to treat pigmentation disorders, old age spots, hyperpigmented scars, etc.
Not surprisingly, skin bleaches have also has been used in some parts of the world for cosmetic purposes -- not a recommended use, since they can have serious side effects.
There's an article on SilentPC Review where they reduce a 1 GHz Athlon at 1.79V to 600 MHz at 1.17V, dropping the power consumption from 49to 13.8 watts. Link..
They also have plenty of information about quite power supplies, hard drives, heatsinks, etc.
Slashdot Mirror
"Well, I am a Muslim, and there is a rule that says we are allowed to eat pork during certain desperate situation, to save our life, for example. However, the decision by these researchers to use pigs in the first place, was not made during during desperate times."
Well, I suppose from the viewpoint of the researchers -- but that burden should fall on the researchers alone, and not on a terminally ill patient.
"And I don't buy that argument about pigs' physiology being closer to human being than other animals. I think there's a conspiracy to undermine our beliefs and make us seems like backward, unprogressive, unreasonable, fanatic etc. because we don't want to accept pig organs as transplant."
Pig organs are about the right size and shape, plus they breed and mature fast. More importantly, they are one of the few domesticated farm animals that meets that criteria. A big reason it has to be a farm animal is that it blunts potential animal rights arguements, because we slaughter them for food anyway.
I don't know, maybe there are alternatives amount the other food animals, goats or sheep might be the right size, but I just don't know enough about their physiology to say.
Besides, I'm a vegetarian.
Newsflash --
In other news today, scientists have created an artificial tofu-based organ, utilizing genetically engineered soybeans. The resulting organs are said to be whitish in color, and quote -- "rather soft and squishy, but low in fat and cholesterol free."
However, not all are pleased with the development. Vegetable rights activists have condemned the move as a violation of leguminous rights, pointing out that the modifications could inflict pain and suffering to the bushy crops, while Environmentalists and Anti-GMO protestors brought up the danger that the genetically engineered plants could spread out of control, leading to giant mutant soybeans roaming the streets, ravishing our daughters, and voting republican.
Other critics have more practical concerns. Said one scientist, "We haven't fully researched the possibility that vegitransplantation may introduce foreign viruses into the human population. My god, what would happen if the soybean leaf-spot virus were to break into the human population? What's more, the synthetic organs are bland and tasteless."
The research team countered, however, that most humans don't have leaves. "Besides, the organs will adsorb flavors from whoever they're transplanted into."
It is unknown when the organs will be suitable for use in humans. However, scientists believe they are already suitable for use in Spicy Ma-po Bean Curd and Buddha Delight Combo #6, pending approval by the FDA and Ming's Peking Imperial Inn.
--by Jesse Chang
"Essentially, what these guys did was find a way to add a gene into a pig by messing with the sperm. This technique can't be used for removing genes, and can't replace genes. They can only add genes."
Even if you can't replace genes with this method, you may be able to do the functional equivalent. For instance, add the new gene, and then add a gene which counteracts the original (antisense, targeted ribozyme, RNA silencing, etc.). So it's entirely possible that you could knock out or replace the marker proteins and sugar-producing pathways. There are an awful lot of them, of course -- but no one ever claimed this would be easy.
"Cell morphology/DNA. Pig DNA is not human DNA. Pig cells are not human cells. Pig cells expressing "human genes" are closer, but when these cells replicate, when you get a virus, when something goes wrong.. what's gonna fix it? "
An obvious observation, of course pig!=human. As for the rest of this, you're a little fuzzy on just what exactly your concerns are. Now, "when these cells replicate", I imagine they should in the course of normal tissue repair and turnover. Are you referring to the possibility that cells will migrate out of the transplant (resulting in microchimerism)? Such a thing could cause some rejection problems, but that's really a minor case compared to the big rejection problem of the whole organ. I would be more concerned about the possibility of porcine immune cells hitching a ride with the organ -- that's a real concern (Note: There shouldn't be enough to cause any sort of GVHD, it's more of problem with increasing rejection risks). There are ways to deplete immune cells, though, I think some of them have been tried (in human organ transplants).
As for the virus, I will assume you mean the problems of introducing possible porcine viruses. For most viruses, you can raise the animals in isolation, and then screen them before/during/after. However, there is one exception -- Porcine Endogenous Retrovirus (PERV -- yes, that's the acronym). I believe it's present in the genome of just about all pigs. It's been a topic of a great deal of research, and for a time it caused an FDA ban of all xenografting trials (since lifted). Although PERV doesn't seem to be able to spread in humans, I imagine that if we could knock out a dozen other genes from the pig genome, we could probably knock out the viral sequence too.
"How do we know what will happen?"
How about finding out by the empirical method?
"So tell me, how is this really news? The headline should have read "Scientists develop new but limited method for gene implantation." It's been done."
I'll agree with you here, it's another case of an attention-grabbing sensational headline.
-Guppy
Pigs are not kosher, and Jewish or Moslems would not be able to benefit from these advances. That's alienting 1/5 of the planet right there from being able to benefit from this.
;), and I don't have a clue to boot.
IANAJ (first time I've ever used that particular acronym!), but I believe there is a doctrine which states that the importance of a human life far outweighs any of the kosher requirements -- for instance, it would be okay to eat pork if you were starving and that was the last item of food you had left. I imagine that a pig organ transplant would fall into the same classification.
As for muslims, IANAM
Is it really that hard make? I don't mind it to be heavier or more expensive - the reliability (no moving parts) and noise level are much more important in a lot of cases (pun intended :)
Silicone Acoustics carries a 300 watt fanless PSU from TKPower. However, although the power output is standard ATX, the unit itself is not standard ATX sized, so the case will have to be modified for installation. There's a guide with instructions and pictures on the site for how this is done.
"Autism is caused by mercury (thimerosal) in vaccines [mercola.com]."
If this were true, in the future we should see a sharp drop in Autism cases, in children born right around now. The FDA passed down an instruction to reduce the use of thimerosal a while ago, and most manufacturers have either reformulated, or are in the process of reformulating to use other preservatives (a few never used thimerosal to begin with).
"The nice thing about Nickel-63 is that the decay produces beta rays (high-energy electrons) and nothing else. This could be shielded by a thick sheet of plywood, or a thin sheet of lead. Most radioisotopes aren't nearly as friendly (there is usually gamma emission as the decay product sheds excess energy, which is difficult to shield against). [ObDisclaimer: I'm assuming that the lead also blocks the x-rays produced as the high-energy electrons smack into the shielding.]"
The proportion of secondary X-rays (bremsstrahlung) generated by beta particles of a give energy is proportional to the atomic number of the adsorbing material -- so your best bet would be to use both, with the plywood facing the emitter and the lead on the outside.
My experience is in the biological sciences, which use a lot of beta emitters for radiolabeling. We used commercially made beta shielding available from scientific supply places (VWR, Fisher, etc.), and they were all made of a plastic such as acrylic. I don't think I ever saw any heavy lead shielding anywhere in our labs.
"...you couldn't pay anyone enough to do a commercial like that. They are paid actors, and nothing more. They may even hate the product they are selling."
Are you suggesting that Bob Dole doesn't actually use Viagra?
"How does one look "American"? Do you mean look "white"? Or do you mean "not Chinese"? Seems like a bad generalization."
Maybe it is, but it's not necessarily inaccurate. I've often heard my relatives use the description American to describe someone white. Or more accurately, I should say not ethnically Chinese (with the presumption of probably caucasian), since that's the context it's usually presented in -- like, "Oh, is your new friend Chinese or American?".
My general feeling is that in these cases, they are using "American" as if it were both a nationality and an ethnicity. I suppose it might be natural for older folks, who came from a time and place when the world was not so small, and such things were usually one and the same.
"Tear free onions are nice, but fart free beans would be the greatest invention since sliced bread! People would line up to buy those."
A number of decades ago, there was an attempt to do exactly that, using traditional breeding methods to reduce the content of gas-producing raffinose and other oligosaccharides. The attempt was successful only up to a point -- apparently, a minimum amount of sugars were required by the seed, since when the concentration dropped too low, they stopped germinating. You could still propagate the plants by cloning, but this was impractical use in agriculture for a commodity crop like beans.
I've been thinking that with modern genetic engineering techniques it may be possible -- perhaps include an enzyme (like the galactosidase in Beano) that would break down the sugar, either before maturation, or during soaking before cooking. Another approach might be to replace the sugar-producing pathways to use another carbohydrate digestible by humans. The first would probably be easiest from an engineering standpoint (one single gene with proper regulation might do it), while the second might be much harder -- the longest functional pathway introduction I've heard of is the three-step one in golden rice, and that took years of work.
"And of course my first thought was, "Wow, wait 'til they start sending up floating-point numbers!"
"In other news, the ESA successfully placed an array of fixed-point numers into geosynchronous orbit..."
"what ended up working was some kind of beetle juice (no, I am not kidding, this was what the doctor said it was)"
Cantharidin. It's a blistering agent, extracted from (what else) the blister beetle.
BTW, cantharidin is also the substance known as "Spanish Fly". Although I do not recommend that anyone try drinking wart remover, as this substance is highly toxic when taken internally.
"The basic idea is to tape over the warts and suffocate them"
Since common warts are caused by a virus, it seems unlikely that you could literally "suffocate" it.
I'm guessing that a possible mode of action is that, by irritating the area, the duct tape is setting up a mild, local inflammation. Most warts eventually go away spontaneously, when the immune system recgnizes the virus, and a bit of inflammation would speed this process up. A number of existing anti-wart agents are believed to work this way.
>>Young Korean needs food...badly.
>Young Korean is Ab-OUT to die...
Young Korean, your life force is running out!
"Relatively recently it was discovered that the malaria parasite contains a small, relict chloroplast"
This particular organelle is also called an apicoplast. Anyway -- one potentially interesting side effect of this development.
There are quite a few third world nations that have trouble affording current anti-malarials (even when discounted or generically manufacturered). A lot of these chloroplast-targeting herbicides are relatively simple molecules, and are already manufactured in bulk quantities for very low prices (compared to medicines). If some of the current chloroplast-targeting herbicides are suitable as-is, then not only do we have a whole new class of drugs -- but some of them could be really cheap.
Of course, if you want to manufacture them in an FDA-licensed, cGMP facility, that will jack up the price. But agricultural-quality material could be had for a few cents per treatment.
"A simpsons movie? That's unpossible!"
Why not? It'd be a perfectly cromulent film.
"...the experience can be phychologically very uncomfortable. If you are the least bit squeamish about people playing with your eyeballs with scary tools and having your head and eyes locked into one position for a duration, then forget it."
If this is a problem, you can get a prescription for a tranquilizer. I've been prescripted them for dental procedures before (though not for eye surgery), and it works quite well.
And upon conversion to ASCII, the following pops up in the Human genetic code:
"!!!seineew era stsinoitaerC"
"Although the site [hfmgv.org]doesn't mention it, the Henry Ford Museum has on exhibit a test tube purportedly containing Thomas Edison's last breath."
This is somewhat OT, but there's a fantasy/speculative fiction book called "Expiration Date" by Tim Powers which centers around the last breath of Thomas Edison contained in the tube you mentioned. A boy accidentally inhales the contents of the tube, which turn out to contain the ghost of Edison. An interesting and imaginative book, although it gets a little weak towards the end.
In the Anime OAV Macross Plus, the General Galaxy YF-21 Prototype piloted by Guld Bowman used a variable wing geometry as part of it's design, a feature also incorporated in the production VF-22 Sturmvogel appearing in Macross 7. Of course, the mechanism is different in that (besides being fictional), a shape-memory alloy was used to allow the wing to change shape.
The legitimate region 2 DVDs can be had for around $50-60 from import DVD sites like cdjapan.co.jp -- and it has English subtitles.
The only issue (besides the region) is the color balance, which has a slight reddish tint which some people find annoying. Interestingly enough, according to Nausicaa.net, this was done deliberately so that it would look right when played on plasma or lcd screens.
"I wonder if this company will make an "Anti-tanning" pill, that will make your skin whiter?"
Such things already exist. Examples include the skin bleaches Hydroquinone and Kojic Acid. Medically, they're used to treat pigmentation disorders, old age spots, hyperpigmented scars, etc.
Not surprisingly, skin bleaches have also has been used in some parts of the world for cosmetic purposes -- not a recommended use, since they can have serious side effects.
There's an article on SilentPC Review where they reduce a 1 GHz Athlon at 1.79V to 600 MHz at 1.17V, dropping the power consumption from 49to 13.8 watts. Link..
They also have plenty of information about quite power supplies, hard drives, heatsinks, etc.
"They need to know if they should build the Death Star or not!"
I'm guessing not -- the ability to destroy a planet is insignificant when compared to the power of the Force.