Yup - cheaper than Lindows is on the shelf and probably about the same per copy for schools or OEM's. It kind of dispells the "1/4th of your computer cost is MS software" myth for the majority of people who buy OEM. Although most of this is speculation, so take it with a bucket of salt, I've heard that Dell doesn't pay a whole lot more than this.
I think this is why MS PR has continually said that they aren't going to compete on price. They really don't have to.
Banning handguns is not the answer. Rifles are just as easy to operate. It's about gun safety, and good parenting. I think this crap happens in the US so often because parents in the US aren't parents at all, they're people with careers who thought it'd be cute to have kids. They're completely apathetic towards the effort and sacrifices that must be made in order to raise kids.
I don't own a gun of any sort, nor do I ever plan to. However, I believe strongly in the balance of powers and unfortunately agree that guns are a necessary evil to keep that balance between a government and their citizens. Study Australia's history after they dissarmed their citizens. For example, you can't even buy GTA because the government has stifled free speech through draconian censorship.
Donations to non profit organizations (which make up an extremely small percentage of marketshare) is very different than flooding the market by underselling your product at the retail or OEM level.
Remember, Microsoft is a monopoly. They play by different rules.
Right, but/. doesn't make up those rules, the DOJ does. Yes, MS is a monopoly, but that doesn't mean that they should be crippled as a business. IANAL, but I highly doubt that this behavior would be considered antitrust.
Re:Web Applications Suck
on
Java vs .NET
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· Score: 1
I love web applications. There are however many kludges that I hope go away over time (OK, I'm being hopeful).
Many of the kludges are at least hidden by ASP.NET. You can code in a virtually event driven model which simulates the behavior of client side code. ASP.NET is nowhere near perfect (it's a 1.1 product), but in the 6 years of web application development that I've done I'd have to say I finally feal like I'm using a real language on a real development platform instead of kludging scripts together.
C#, the CLI, the IL, and part of the Base Class Libraries are ECMA, and are pending ISO certification. This is huge. This means that Microsoft could rewrite.NET and make it completely closed, but that we could keep it going based on standards.
While the JCP is a public process, it's meaningless from a license standpoint. Sun can close the JCP tommorrow. They can also stop selling Java licenses and force everyone to use their JVM.
You are right that System.Web, System.Drawing (most of the GUI libs), and other value added class libraries are not standard. So use GTK+ instead of System.Drawing (for example). Or use Mono's ASP.NET instead of MS's. Or use Perl.NET with Apache for your Web Applications.
.NET/Win2K3 runs on Alphas, Itaniums, and other larger CPU's, and many (not all) applications scale better (cheaper, easier) with a server farm. Top traffic websites have been cost effectively running Windows for years. I'm not saying that it's better than unix, or better than mainframes, but Windows scaleability has not been a limiting factor for quite some time.
No, you'll ask them to send it in an unecrypted form. These document protection features are generally used for Intranet and some Extranet uses. You'll be able to read Office2003 file formats with OO just fine.
But the RIAA is not law enforcement, and that's one of the biggest issues. This is a critical difference. Just read about what happened to that guitar company in 2000 when the BSA came nocking at it's door. Do you really want private organizations to have the right to search a seizure? If so, welcome to the United Corporations of America.
You implemented the analogy improperly. An ISP provides you a service of using their bandwidth for your purposes (FTP, Webspace, etc.). You have to pay them for this, or have some sort of licensing agreement. Some licesnses even let you resell the space. Making your own product to work with MSN Messenger is the same thing. You're using their bandwidth in that regard for your product. Trillian is the best example, in which they even charge their customers for their product in which a substantial value is coming from MSN Messenger.
Requiring a license is not blocking. That's like saying that an ISP is blocking you from using their bandwidth because you aren't a licensed user. You use their system, you pay for it. What's different about MSN Messenger?
Now, MS is closing off their service (so it appears...).
Not at all... they are forcing compliance to a newer version to keep support costs down, and for security purposes. Furthermore, if you read the original article then you would see the quotes from the MS rep who said that they are "very interested" in working with 3rd parties, just that they need to formalize it. They may incur some sort of fee, but MS never demanded AOL to give away access to their network for free, they just wanted to come to some sort of reasonable arrangement. MSN IM is open to those who don't freeload off of it. Heck, currently Trillian profits off of it w/o sending MS a dime.
And what's wrong with this? The OS's GUI is important. It's not about making the most minimal UI work on the most minimal hardware, it's about making the best UI possible with reasonable hardware requirements. By 2005 (Longhorn anticipated release) the required "GPU" will probably cost $15 for an OEM to install in a machine. Furthermore, this takes load off the CPU.
I trust you don't actually run your own business with lots of staff?
I trust that my staff is not allowed to install their own software.
Don't get me wrong, the BSA needs to go down as with the laws that support it. And you can bet that there's a ton of people at MS who are pissed off at how aggressive the BSA was in this case. But even the CEO of this company doesn't get how users surfing ebay and using paint programs during work hours has nothing to do with Open Source software - from Windows to Netware to Linux you have the ability to centrally administer these types of things.
We would encourage those third parties to contact us to work out agreements by which they can continue to have their customers access our network.
AOL, MSN, Yahoo, etc. all have the rights to keep their networks up to date, and even keep them completely closed if they want. They are spending big bucks on R&D, servers, and network connectivity to provide these services. Trillian on the other hand charges for it's client and doesn't give a dime to the respective networks in which it profits. MSN sounds willing to get an agreement with the likes of Trillian, but I'm sure it would involve some sort of a fee to help offset the costs of providing the service.
But is it really the computer that's winning? It's one thing if all we do is give a computer the rules of Chess, and then see how it does. However, the computer is being told how to think and what to compute by humans. The computer is just automating (via opening/closing/midgame books, brute force, etc.) a human created algorithm. All that the computer has over the human is the speed of number crunching.
I'm estimating that you have 150-200 servers (depending on what RH package you get). If those servers aren't generating revenue, or supporting a business unit that generates revenue, it's time to downsize your datacenter. $350K sounds like a lot of money, but it's all relative to revenue. If it's only 2% of last quarters revenue, then why would you consider making a huge IT change just to save a few bucks. Again, if $350K is really a lot of money for your business to be spending on OS upgrades, than maybe it's time to downsize that datacenter because it's not generating the revenue to justify it's existance.
It looks bad... almost like saying windows isn't up to the task.
Obviously you don't understand what Akamai does. Akamai is the premier global content distribution company. Almost everyone who's anyone uses them on the net. MS isn't sticking Windows behind some Linux proxy because Windows isn't up to the task. They are distributing content through a major network that has geo-routing capabilities with datacenters all over the world. It's irrelevant whethor or not Akami runs Linux.
Slashdot Mirror
Aren't parents smart enough to understand what the game contents are for a game named "Grand Theft Auto"?
Yup - cheaper than Lindows is on the shelf and probably about the same per copy for schools or OEM's. It kind of dispells the "1/4th of your computer cost is MS software" myth for the majority of people who buy OEM. Although most of this is speculation, so take it with a bucket of salt, I've heard that Dell doesn't pay a whole lot more than this.
I think this is why MS PR has continually said that they aren't going to compete on price. They really don't have to.
well put. No one wants to admit that there's flaws in our implementation of capitolism, it's much easier to blame India.
Banning handguns is not the answer. Rifles are just as easy to operate. It's about gun safety, and good parenting. I think this crap happens in the US so often because parents in the US aren't parents at all, they're people with careers who thought it'd be cute to have kids. They're completely apathetic towards the effort and sacrifices that must be made in order to raise kids.
I don't own a gun of any sort, nor do I ever plan to. However, I believe strongly in the balance of powers and unfortunately agree that guns are a necessary evil to keep that balance between a government and their citizens. Study Australia's history after they dissarmed their citizens. For example, you can't even buy GTA because the government has stifled free speech through draconian censorship.
Donations to non profit organizations (which make up an extremely small percentage of marketshare) is very different than flooding the market by underselling your product at the retail or OEM level.
Remember, Microsoft is a monopoly. They play by different rules.
/. doesn't make up those rules, the DOJ does. Yes, MS is a monopoly, but that doesn't mean that they should be crippled as a business. IANAL, but I highly doubt that this behavior would be considered antitrust.
Right, but
I love web applications. There are however many kludges that I hope go away over time (OK, I'm being hopeful).
Many of the kludges are at least hidden by ASP.NET. You can code in a virtually event driven model which simulates the behavior of client side code. ASP.NET is nowhere near perfect (it's a 1.1 product), but in the 6 years of web application development that I've done I'd have to say I finally feal like I'm using a real language on a real development platform instead of kludging scripts together.
C#, the CLI, the IL, and part of the Base Class Libraries are ECMA, and are pending ISO certification. This is huge. This means that Microsoft could rewrite .NET and make it completely closed, but that we could keep it going based on standards.
While the JCP is a public process, it's meaningless from a license standpoint. Sun can close the JCP tommorrow. They can also stop selling Java licenses and force everyone to use their JVM.
You are right that System.Web, System.Drawing (most of the GUI libs), and other value added class libraries are not standard. So use GTK+ instead of System.Drawing (for example). Or use Mono's ASP.NET instead of MS's. Or use Perl.NET with Apache for your Web Applications.
.NET/Win2K3 runs on Alphas, Itaniums, and other larger CPU's, and many (not all) applications scale better (cheaper, easier) with a server farm. Top traffic websites have been cost effectively running Windows for years. I'm not saying that it's better than unix, or better than mainframes, but Windows scaleability has not been a limiting factor for quite some time.
Heck, I'd be happy with $7.95. You remember, the cost of Tapes - those things that cost MORE to manufacture than CD's!
I'll have to upgrade.
No, you'll ask them to send it in an unecrypted form. These document protection features are generally used for Intranet and some Extranet uses. You'll be able to read Office2003 file formats with OO just fine.
I allready rode the 64bit train to DEC Alphaville and back...
and all I got was this lousy 80bit shirt!
But the RIAA is not law enforcement, and that's one of the biggest issues. This is a critical difference. Just read about what happened to that guitar company in 2000 when the BSA came nocking at it's door. Do you really want private organizations to have the right to search a seizure? If so, welcome to the United Corporations of America.
You implemented the analogy improperly. An ISP provides you a service of using their bandwidth for your purposes (FTP, Webspace, etc.). You have to pay them for this, or have some sort of licensing agreement. Some licesnses even let you resell the space. Making your own product to work with MSN Messenger is the same thing. You're using their bandwidth in that regard for your product. Trillian is the best example, in which they even charge their customers for their product in which a substantial value is coming from MSN Messenger.
But people who release their clients under the evil GPL may have trouble opening a dialog with Microsoft.
That's why Trillian (and anyone even THINKING GPL) should use the LGPL. The LGPL allows the protecting of legitimate IP.
Heck, currently Trillian profits off of it w/o sending MS a dime.
I've always doubted that.
It's simple. Triallan charges for their product. Part of their product includes a service provided by MSN.
Requiring a license is not blocking. That's like saying that an ISP is blocking you from using their bandwidth because you aren't a licensed user. You use their system, you pay for it. What's different about MSN Messenger?
Now, MS is closing off their service (so it appears...).
Not at all... they are forcing compliance to a newer version to keep support costs down, and for security purposes. Furthermore, if you read the original article then you would see the quotes from the MS rep who said that they are "very interested" in working with 3rd parties, just that they need to formalize it. They may incur some sort of fee, but MS never demanded AOL to give away access to their network for free, they just wanted to come to some sort of reasonable arrangement. MSN IM is open to those who don't freeload off of it. Heck, currently Trillian profits off of it w/o sending MS a dime.
And what's wrong with this? The OS's GUI is important. It's not about making the most minimal UI work on the most minimal hardware, it's about making the best UI possible with reasonable hardware requirements. By 2005 (Longhorn anticipated release) the required "GPU" will probably cost $15 for an OEM to install in a machine. Furthermore, this takes load off the CPU.
I trust you don't actually run your own business with lots of staff?
I trust that my staff is not allowed to install their own software.
Don't get me wrong, the BSA needs to go down as with the laws that support it. And you can bet that there's a ton of people at MS who are pissed off at how aggressive the BSA was in this case. But even the CEO of this company doesn't get how users surfing ebay and using paint programs during work hours has nothing to do with Open Source software - from Windows to Netware to Linux you have the ability to centrally administer these types of things.
From the article:
We would encourage those third parties to contact us to work out agreements by which they can continue to have their customers access our network.
AOL, MSN, Yahoo, etc. all have the rights to keep their networks up to date, and even keep them completely closed if they want. They are spending big bucks on R&D, servers, and network connectivity to provide these services. Trillian on the other hand charges for it's client and doesn't give a dime to the respective networks in which it profits. MSN sounds willing to get an agreement with the likes of Trillian, but I'm sure it would involve some sort of a fee to help offset the costs of providing the service.
But is it really the computer that's winning? It's one thing if all we do is give a computer the rules of Chess, and then see how it does. However, the computer is being told how to think and what to compute by humans. The computer is just automating (via opening/closing/midgame books, brute force, etc.) a human created algorithm. All that the computer has over the human is the speed of number crunching.
I'm estimating that you have 150-200 servers (depending on what RH package you get). If those servers aren't generating revenue, or supporting a business unit that generates revenue, it's time to downsize your datacenter. $350K sounds like a lot of money, but it's all relative to revenue. If it's only 2% of last quarters revenue, then why would you consider making a huge IT change just to save a few bucks. Again, if $350K is really a lot of money for your business to be spending on OS upgrades, than maybe it's time to downsize that datacenter because it's not generating the revenue to justify it's existance.
It looks bad ... almost like saying windows isn't up to the task.
Obviously you don't understand what Akamai does. Akamai is the premier global content distribution company. Almost everyone who's anyone uses them on the net. MS isn't sticking Windows behind some Linux proxy because Windows isn't up to the task. They are distributing content through a major network that has geo-routing capabilities with datacenters all over the world. It's irrelevant whethor or not Akami runs Linux.
I doubt microsoft had a problem with bandwidth.
Ya, they're only one of the top most hit websites on the Internet.
Every security update from Microsoft means the Windows guys are running around updating.
No, it means they run a network-wide update script.